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Transcript for 05-03-2015, 1311 lines:

00:04:03 mircea_popescu: ding

00:04:17 mircea_popescu: ha!

00:14:19 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041299 o.O

00:14:19 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 11:11:30; fluffypony: "I think FriedCat is not a real name. Does anyone know about FriedCat's real identity ?"

00:15:01 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041297 sad that it had to turn into http://fraudsters.com/2013/the-analysis-of-a-failure-asicminer/

00:15:01 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 11:11:21; fluffypony: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=974058.msg10633083#msg10633083

00:15:01 assbot: The analysis of a failure : Asicminer pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1BJ9zHy )

00:15:50 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041314 << nice c man!

00:15:50 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 12:30:34; cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/leaked-emails-detail-inner-workings-of-josh-garzas-scams/

00:16:09 mircea_popescu: "Garza deliberately mislead" << misled.

00:18:18 cazalla: mircea_popescu, fixed

00:18:39 mircea_popescu: so nice to see qntra redo the bitbet history with this gaw scam

00:18:53 mircea_popescu: back in 2012 all the rage were "bfl miners"

00:21:13 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041360 << lawl!

00:21:13 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 13:57:22; mod6: i've never seen this before.

00:21:47 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041381 << sounds legit.

00:21:47 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 14:04:18; jurov: so i propose to go on to .. release early, release often

00:23:49 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041397 <<< these homos...

00:23:49 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 14:19:27; jurov: i am just not placing any expectations to any piece of software anymore

00:25:04 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041403 << i guess i lose for being vague!

00:25:04 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 14:26:17; Pierre_Rochard: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041323 < thanks for the tip, I’ll set up a euro bank account when I’m in france this summer

00:26:05 Pierre_Rochard: mircea_popescu: you lose due to recency bias! I’ll extend the thanks to you regardless haha

00:26:18 mircea_popescu: lol

00:29:46 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041414 << here's the long story : traditionally, "int" means a word, and word means a register size, which is machine dependent (was 8 bit, then 16, then 32 and now is 64). because historically the register was inconvenient for human use, the notion of "long int" was born, as a dword (two words) or qword (four). because historically the register was inconvenient for memor

00:29:46 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 14:34:51; PeterL: why in c is a long int the same size as int?

00:29:46 mircea_popescu: y usage, the notion of short int was created, sometimes as small as a byte (8 bits).

00:30:09 mircea_popescu: both of these are becoming obsolete as ram is cheap and 64 bits plentiful. so in the future, int will just mean "integer number" and that's that,

00:37:17 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041474 hehehehehe

00:37:17 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 18:24:10; sjsqd: do you know if anyone from the previous foundation is aware of it?

00:37:42 mircea_popescu: yeah, inasmuch as gavin tiptoes around my lunch hour, i would propose they're painfully aware of it, yes.

00:38:56 mircea_popescu: dude it's so great to come to logs after a nice meal and find all sorts of gems like these.

00:39:12 mircea_popescu: i vote #b-a best afternoon show in town.

00:40:59 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041509 << ironically enough, the client the OTHERS work on is different from bitcoin core.

00:40:59 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 18:29:13; sjsqd: but I assume the client you work on is different to bitcoin core?

00:52:39 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 40 @ 0.042 = 1.68 BTC [+] {3}

00:53:46 scoopbot: New post on fraudsters by Mircea Popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2015/socialism-saved-for-later-lolz/

00:54:41 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 166 @ 0.012 = 1.992 BTC [+]

01:00:03 BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats

01:00:08 gribble: Current Blocks: 346213 | Current Difficulty: 4.668437631686029E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 346751 | Next Difficulty In: 538 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 20 hours, 13 minutes, and 42 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 47691297024.3 | Estimated Percent Change: 2.15687

01:01:13 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041515 << technically foundation wasn't born yet. so no, it's better custodianship of the bitcoin codebase than the fake foundation has been displaying.

01:01:13 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 18:29:42; asciilifeform: sjsqd: starting point was phoundation's release circa 2012

01:01:49 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 202 @ 0.012 = 2.424 BTC [+] {2}

01:02:58 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041549 << omfg the insanities

01:02:58 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 18:38:01; sjsqd: you basically earn based upon your proportion of page views

01:05:29 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041571 << https://blockchain.info/address/16crkmdoaK6Tq8NP3FVK7Uxq5Dwdicb3c3

01:05:29 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 18:41:39; sjsqd: even with hundreds of thousands of page views I only ever made about 70 USD over 2-3 years

01:05:31 assbot: Bitcoin Address 16crkmdoaK6Tq8NP3FVK7Uxq5Dwdicb3c3 ... ( http://bit.ly/1DWOPLI )

01:06:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11300 @ 0.00037681 = 4.258 BTC [+]

01:11:48 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: what is that fraudsters address?

01:12:15 mircea_popescu: yea

01:19:00 BingoBoingo: !up ryan-c

01:28:45 ben_vulpes: ryan-c: do i know you?

01:29:23 ryan-c: ben_vulpes: I don't think so. I'm not Ryan X Charles.

01:30:08 BingoBoingo: That's always good to hear. The world needs less javascript.

01:30:15 ryan-c: lol

01:30:29 ben_vulpes: nah, another ryan c.

01:30:35 ryan-c: when all you have is a hammer...

01:31:01 ryan-c: ben_vulpes: https://keybase.io/ryanc is me

01:31:03 assbot: Ryan Castellucci (ryanc) | Keybase ... ( http://bit.ly/1DWTBcg )

01:31:03 BingoBoingo: You just end up poorly reimplementing Common Lisp or Ada

01:31:05 mircea_popescu: how many ryan-c are there ? :D

01:32:27 ryan-c: mircea_popescu: probably at least 50,000 in the US

01:32:35 mircea_popescu: thinking about it... yeah.

01:32:39 BingoBoingo: ryan-c: You know keyservers exist in a much more user friendly form than that abomination make by the okcupid people

01:33:30 ryan-c: BingoBoingo: My gpg keys are in pgp.mit.edu and sks-keyservers as well.

01:33:38 BingoBoingo: Ah

01:37:46 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i curious about the no-recourse mortgages as well. lender returns payment stream, keeps asset?

01:38:52 mircea_popescu: lender returns nothing at all.

01:40:01 ben_vulpes: so borrower defaults, lender gets house and payments.

01:40:16 ben_vulpes: oop! limited recourse i mean.

01:40:40 mircea_popescu: let's work a model. suppose i own 85`000 square footage of marble flooring, used for running a harem. suppose i come to the conclusion my harem doesn't attract good / numerous enough cuntage. suppose i decide this is because there's no belly dancing happening. suppose i go to a belly dancer in city and say, listen, i'll loan you 10k golden pistoons if you start a belly dancing school on my marlbe acreage.

01:41:03 mircea_popescu: this is the sort of thing. the professional has no interest in leaving their current place just because i want to relocate them, and the situation isn't feudal, where i just order them moved.

01:41:14 mircea_popescu: now, if the school goes well and makes money im getting my pistoons back.

01:41:26 mircea_popescu: if not, fuck me and my stupid "palace" with no running water up on a mountain in the desert.

01:41:37 mircea_popescu: belly dancer expert walks and i'm more than welcome to repay myself.

01:42:28 ben_vulpes: i think i get it.

01:43:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13100 @ 0.00038032 = 4.9822 BTC [+] {2}

01:44:15 mircea_popescu: the idea being that contracts (of the old sort) are flexible and useful, just as long as the chumps grok that there is no such thing as "a standard contract".

01:47:29 mircea_popescu: and as to limited recourse, it can be limited whatever way. generally it is, "lend me this money to buy this house, i pay you so and so, and if i don't you keep the house."

01:48:13 mircea_popescu: which is the very definition of mortgage (a topic of not little historical interest, because it's one of the rare cases where we can observe biological evolution at work in what's supposed to be fleshless abstractions)

01:48:48 mircea_popescu: there's a lot of similarity between how prokaryotes ended up with mitochondria and how commerce ended up with the mortgage.

01:50:05 BingoBoingo: !up ryan-c

01:56:30 BingoBoingo: !up felipelalli

02:07:18 felipelalli: good night BingoBoingo!

02:07:25 BingoBoingo: later

02:07:53 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 46 @ 0.04499913 = 2.07 BTC [+] {2}

02:14:16 mike_c: the first trade after that debacle is a buy?

02:24:11 mircea_popescu: !up dragosb

02:24:50 felipelalli: About coinbr.com, what happens if my account stay negative "forever"? I will be in debt or it shall be forgiven?

02:26:07 dragosb: Hello Mircea ! I read a article on your blog about How to be a good poker player, and I was pondering do you play on-line or live?

02:26:14 scoopbot: New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/aspiring-bitcoin-journalist-arrested-for-recruiting-for-isis/

02:26:47 mircea_popescu: dragosb i play very little these days. i mostly played live, and mostly pre-consumer internet.

02:27:36 mircea_popescu: incidentally, on that score : as mike_c correctly pointed out a week or so ago, headsup is actually a broken game now, courtesy of teh damned computers.

02:29:41 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: long story : traditionally, "int" means a word... << obtain, from purely historical interest, if you don't already own it, k&r 1st ed. good tour of the weirdo word (and byte!) sizes on the archs of the day. predecessor 'B' was 'typeless' (all things are machine-word width) and this was not uncommon then

02:30:07 mircea_popescu: indeed.

02:30:17 mircea_popescu: kinda how a mpcomputer would work , for that matter.

02:30:20 mircea_popescu: wtf type bs.

02:30:32 mircea_popescu: just say how many lengths of chord you want to hang yourself with.

02:30:52 *: asciilifeform goes further than mircea_popescu, dispenses with 'machine word' concept. want bits, say how many.

02:30:58 asciilifeform: we know how to build serial ALUs.

02:31:10 mircea_popescu: heh

02:31:19 mircea_popescu: yeah. that's further than i'd go.

02:31:53 mircea_popescu: (nttawwi)

02:32:18 []bot: Bet placed: 5.03285372 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 22(Y):78(N) by coin, 21(Y):79(N) by weight. Total bet: 66.0688022 BTC. Current weight: 73,586.

02:33:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5480 @ 0.00038199 = 2.0933 BTC [+] {2}

02:34:27 asciilifeform: http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/dmr/chist.html << for classicists/aficionados only

02:34:28 assbot: Chistory ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlJcub )

02:35:22 mircea_popescu: o hey dmr

02:35:38 asciilifeform: of course, who else

02:36:18 *: asciilifeform isn't yet aware of any secondary/tertiary derpologists having suckerfished on to this subject - but who knows

02:38:13 asciilifeform: http://www.e-reading.link/bookreader.php/138815/Expert_C_Programming:_Deep_C_Secrets.pdf << l33t w4r3z. have this in dead tree, it's one of the most riotously entertaining books on any kind of programming whatsoever, imho

02:38:18 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlJDV8 )

02:38:18 thestringpuller: RIP dmr, mah nigga.

02:38:40 asciilifeform: i heartily recomment 'deep c' even to folks who despise c and hardly program at all in anything

02:39:04 thestringpuller: ada isn't so bad. dunno why people are complaining...

02:40:17 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: folks are used to their sawed-off shotguns, balk at slightly heavier, longer 'thompson'

02:40:20 BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: You only say that becasue you are going through practice where Ruby forces still more bondage and discipline upon you

02:40:42 *: BingoBoingo kinda wants Mosin, has never lost to itself

02:41:07 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: phun phact: to ru folks, 'sawed-off' - 'обрез' - means precisely a cut-off mosin

02:41:15 asciilifeform: rather than shotgun

02:41:21 BingoBoingo: lol

02:41:48 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: http://www.nakop.ru/index.php?app=core&module=attach§ion=attach&attach_rel_module=post&attach_id=160390 << it

02:41:49 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlK1TK )

02:42:13 BingoBoingo: Mosin also at $150/piece also solves http://fraudsters.com/2015/strategy-for-the-antisocial-struggle/ for body/vehicle armor

02:42:14 assbot: Strategy for the antisocial struggle. pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlK5Tn )

02:42:46 asciilifeform: http://www.admemo.ru/arms-mosin-rifle/mosin-obrez.jpg << also it

02:42:47 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlKbdI )

02:42:51 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: What of the wrist of who fires that

02:43:24 asciilifeform: what of the ears

02:44:03 BingoBoingo: Ears are guarenteed to fail on a long enough timeline, visit nursing home if you have pretenses otherwise.

02:44:17 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: incidentally, mosin is for some reason extremely common in usa

02:44:20 asciilifeform: like, 100 usd

02:44:32 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Isn't it beautiful?

02:44:35 asciilifeform: comes, iirc, in a gigantic block of 'cosmoline' but otherwise virginal

02:44:48 asciilifeform: complete with trihedral bayonet

02:44:49 BingoBoingo: The best deer rifle in history is the cheapest.

02:45:08 asciilifeform: you'll be using ancient ru corrosive primers though.

02:45:10 asciilifeform: and no chrome

02:45:28 asciilifeform: hope you like scrubbing

02:45:58 BingoBoingo: Bolt action so cleaning... More popular "deer" rifle is sks, still corrosive primers, much less range, still moar cleaning

02:46:25 asciilifeform: 'sks' iirc takes modern (7,62x39) rounds

02:46:37 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo not so sure it does, no.

02:46:43 mircea_popescu: i doubt mosin pierces kevlar.

02:47:11 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yes sks, you also get diminished charge behind bullet for no less cleaning

02:47:31 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: full-sized rifle cartridge, one of the 'hottest' still made (7,62x54r)

02:47:38 mircea_popescu: even so.

02:47:38 asciilifeform: (mosin, that is)

02:47:42 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Equivalent to US .30-06 caliber. Beats any man wearable armour

02:47:49 mircea_popescu: is it ?

02:47:52 BingoBoingo: yes

02:47:55 asciilifeform: bad formulation

02:47:56 *: mircea_popescu defers.

02:48:00 asciilifeform: all depends on range, angle of impact

02:48:05 asciilifeform: basics here

02:48:15 mircea_popescu: in any case im notsure you'd want a plain bolt action for that purpose.

02:48:38 mircea_popescu: more like a "tough as nails, swiss made SKS". like the mac10 maybe.

02:48:43 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Well, not for the whole club, but if you have people designated to hit marks at a distance...

02:48:56 mircea_popescu: ...then they' dwant a modern sniper rifle.

02:49:15 *: mircea_popescu has never actually seen a mosin used in practice. ever. anywhere.

02:49:35 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Mac10's caliber is recognized now as sub pistol, .380 ACP isn't beating a single sheet of kevlar

02:49:41 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: largely a third-world (afghanistan, africa) item currently, afaik

02:50:06 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo it's all in the filling. they make dup double strength cartridges now.

02:50:10 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: moder sniper rifle has bullets of similar power to mosin, simply smaller case

02:50:25 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo nah, much better barrel. accuracy is a thing.

02:50:58 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Sure, but at the point barrels make a difference operator makes a far greater difference

02:51:27 mircea_popescu: by the time you're shooting policemen you're not going to save on the rifle. those suckers cost thje enemy like 1.5-3 mn a pop.

02:51:32 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there's a beautiful treatise, 'art of the sniper' ('искусство снайпера') - ru of course - highly recommended if aficionado or even mild interest in the history. describes precisely what modern designers changed

02:51:42 asciilifeform: (by one potapov)

02:52:04 mircea_popescu: you know i suspect potapov is like the ru mil pythagoras.

02:52:10 mircea_popescu: everything seems to be written by one potapov

02:52:26 asciilifeform: yer thinking bourbaki mebbe

02:52:28 BingoBoingo: USia claimed its own for a bt in the Hathcock guy

02:52:33 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform same idea.

02:52:36 asciilifeform: aha

02:53:17 BingoBoingo: Hathcock's narrative though included using light machine guns as bolt action rifle because US lacked adequate sniper rifle for 'Nam

02:53:36 asciilifeform: americans took the whole 'golden sniper toilet' thing almost to logical conclusion, with microprocessorized wind&elevation calculators, bullets turned on lathes (!), etc

02:54:19 asciilifeform: ru school of thought took, unsurprisingly, opposite tack

02:54:53 asciilifeform: (simple weapons, but highly skilled professionals)

02:55:47 *: asciilifeform is an armchair general and recommends that aficionados seek out the primary sources.

02:56:05 BingoBoingo: USia's hotness this past decade has been taking M-14's and converting to "designated marksmen rifles"

02:56:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8950 @ 0.00038309 = 3.4287 BTC [+]

02:56:41 BingoBoingo: M-14's original service life of course having been... lacking

02:56:48 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: correct if i've my dod-speak mixed up, but 'designated marksman' is not a sniper - he engages only within visual contact distance

02:57:02 asciilifeform: (naked eye)

02:57:37 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yes. His range extends to visual past what assualt rifle can not reliably hit fatally, but still visual

02:57:39 asciilifeform: the term, iirc, refers to the one man in a platoon who was actually taught any marksmanship and is expected to aim

02:57:55 asciilifeform: the rest 'hosedown'

02:57:56 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Russian equivalent for role is Dragunov

02:58:07 BingoBoingo: tool, not person

02:58:25 asciilifeform: by some accounts, ^ has a barrel resource of 800 (!) rounds

02:59:12 asciilifeform: enlarged ak-like thing that takes mosin rounds

02:59:16 BingoBoingo: Basic requirements for such tool are full power rifle round and semi auto action

02:59:55 BingoBoingo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragunov_Sniper_Rifle

02:59:57 assbot: Dragunov sniper rifle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlMcXo )

03:01:13 BingoBoingo: In contemporary USian deployments designated marksmen carries M-14 with a plastic stock and has specialization like the machine gunner

03:05:58 BingoBoingo: Mosin's great virtue for USian civilian is that it costs roughly 1/10th anything equivalent from domestic manufacterer

03:07:03 asciilifeform: does any u.s. arms co. even offer anything without plastic, aluminum, or worse ?

03:07:11 asciilifeform: as in, anywhere in the thing

03:07:41 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Sure for 4 digit numer of USD

03:07:50 asciilifeform: probably 5

03:08:05 asciilifeform: (iirc all the m-whatever things are Al but for the barrel)

03:08:09 BingoBoingo: Nah, 5 exists, 4 though is the sweet spot.

03:12:10 mircea_popescu: what's wrong with al.

03:12:17 mircea_popescu: properly alloyed it does beat steel.

03:12:29 asciilifeform: iirc we had the 'can you club with it' thread

03:14:54 BingoBoingo: ;;google M1A

03:14:54 gribble: M1A™ Tactical Rifle | Top Semi Automatic Firearms | Buy M1A: http://www.springfield-armory.com/m1a-series/; M1A rifle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1A_rifle; M1A for Sale - Buy Springfield M1A Rifle Online at GunBroker.com: http://www.gunbroker.com/M1A/Browse.aspx?Keywords=M1A

03:15:07 BingoBoingo: ^ civilian version of M-14 conversion

03:17:01 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 400 @ 0.0045519 = 1.8208 BTC [+] {2}

03:17:08 *: asciilifeform struggles to recall the traditional term for the kind of technowankery where folks buy 'pro' tools without any place to use or relevant skill

03:17:31 asciilifeform: 'prosumer' ?

03:17:47 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Yes. For me it was called "Freshman Year"

03:18:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14450 @ 0.00038309 = 5.5357 BTC [+]

03:20:50 asciilifeform: 'According to neighbors and a man who hired the teen to write for his Web site, the Osbourn Park student was quiet in person but exceptionally intelligent ? authoring articles on complicated science and technology topics.' (wa. p.) << mega-l0l

03:21:00 asciilifeform: if this is 'intelligent', what's retardation look like ?

03:21:50 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/author/scott-fargo/ << Actual retardation from a subhuman creature that pretends to the title of mammal

03:21:50 assbot: Scott Fargo, Author at CryptoCoinsNews ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlOJAF )

03:22:08 asciilifeform: http://time.com/3732867/etsy-files-for-handcrafted-ipo << another l0l

03:22:10 assbot: Etsy Files for Handcrafted IPO - TIME ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlOLIV )

03:22:14 asciilifeform: handcrafted! (tm)

03:22:29 asciilifeform: 'A few years ago, Etsy lifted some of its stricter sales requirements, including a ban on sellers using certain manufacturing techniques and hiring staff...'

03:22:37 asciilifeform: woodcollector!

03:22:41 decimation: re: no recourse mortgages < banks hate these, but you can get them

03:22:57 decimation: one semi-popular scam to run in the us is to buy a house with your "IRA"

03:23:01 asciilifeform: decimation: presumably for considerably higher upfront cost

03:23:05 decimation: aye

03:23:06 asciilifeform: or who the hell would get the other kind

03:23:27 decimation: well, functionally in the us nearly all mortgages are 30 year fixed loans

03:23:35 decimation: who nobody purchases except for usg

03:24:11 decimation: it's all a game of who can pass the liability to usg the most directly

03:24:37 BingoBoingo: If fiat world could have played nicely, I'd happily be retired in a condo in an "interesting" neighborhood by now, but...

03:24:42 decimation: at any rate, you can purchase a house with your retirement account, and a no-recourse mortgage is used for that

03:25:01 decimation: the irs says you can't live in it until you retire, but you can rent it out

03:25:27 BingoBoingo: !up jitenm

03:25:38 decimation: there's a small cottage industry > http://www.iralending.com/

03:25:39 assbot: Self Directed IRA Non-Recourse Loans: Contact NASB Today! ... ( http://bit.ly/1GlP4Ua )

03:25:40 BingoBoingo: Hello jitenm

03:25:52 jitenm: howdy folkses

03:25:58 BingoBoingo: Not bad

03:30:15 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 250 @ 0.00463785 = 1.1595 BTC [-] {2}

03:31:17 BingoBoingo: https://twitter.com/BBoingo/status/573324531525287937

03:31:18 assbot: /Radomysisky /3DPConfidential The guy likened you to a rapist simply because you speak with passion on the topic of politics and technology.

03:33:32 mircea_popescu: !up Liberza

03:33:44 Liberza: !down syndrome

03:34:03 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: who is 3DPConfidential ?

03:34:17 asciilifeform: and who is Radomysisky

03:35:07 mircea_popescu: <decimation> it's all a game of who can pass the liability to usg the most directly <<< quite.

03:35:20 mircea_popescu: !up HubertCumberdale

03:36:04 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I have no Idea

03:36:12 BingoBoingo: !up Vexual

03:36:12 mircea_popescu: isn't cody wilson the guy with that blog, what was it called

03:36:17 mircea_popescu: ;;google site:fraudsters.com cody wilson

03:36:17 gribble: No matches found.

03:36:20 mircea_popescu: hm.

03:36:29 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: '3d printed gun' fella

03:36:38 mircea_popescu: oh oh

03:36:49 asciilifeform: who the others are - no idea

03:36:54 BingoBoingo: ;;google site:qntra.net cody wilson

03:36:55 gribble: Cody Wilson: "The Bitcoin Community Has Sold Out" | Qntra.net: http://qntra.net/2014/11/cody-wilson-the-bitcoin-community-has-sold-out/; Stripe Breaks Up With Cody Wilson | Qntra.net: http://qntra.net/2014/11/stripe-breaks-up-with-cody-wilson/; Cody R Wilson Announces Candidacy for Vessenes' Bitcoin ...: http://qntra.net/2014/11/cody-r-wilson-announces-candidacy-for-vessenes- (1 more message)

03:38:12 asciilifeform: '...We have plenty of assassination markets now...' << lol, he said this?!

03:38:32 asciilifeform: does 'market' mean something other than it did when i learned engl.?

03:39:06 asciilifeform: i.e., it no longer means 'where you go to trade money for $goodies' but just 'place you go to dump excess money'

03:39:20 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Market means the same. At best I assume Cody is an agent...

03:40:15 mircea_popescu: lol bitcoin community has sold out.

03:40:22 mircea_popescu: whai such much lulz everywhere today!

03:40:24 asciilifeform: agent must have a purpose

03:40:34 asciilifeform: what kind of 'sin' is he meant to tempt 'sinners' into?

03:40:57 mircea_popescu: ya srsly.

03:40:57 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I suspect is is merely a broad net to collect information on malcontents

03:41:02 mircea_popescu: not every derpage's agency.

03:42:11 asciilifeform: one could make two or three mental leaps and suppose that his work is for getting ammo banned by usg quicker

03:42:39 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Maybe not, but having your product obstructed by every domestic shipping company... maybe?

03:42:53 asciilifeform: or at the very least, to provide the justification-furniture when the bans are rolled out

03:42:54 BingoBoingo: Indicator, maybe not a perfect one

03:43:02 mircea_popescu: tbh, that is the only logical end game : US of Best Korea, where everything is banned not because they can't afford anything, but for Ideological Reasons. Honest.

03:43:18 mircea_popescu: i used to know poor people like that. all the things they couldn't afford, they didn't do not because they couldn't afford them

03:43:20 mircea_popescu: but for Other Reasons.

03:43:24 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: we already have this. in slow motion

03:43:30 mircea_popescu: pretty much yeh

03:44:19 Liberza: so, asicminer is dead because friedcat has been kidnapped by mongolians.

03:44:26 Liberza: interesting

03:44:37 mircea_popescu: so basically... either water the plantville farm all day, or else go talk to tlp's intensive pilling unit, or worse!

03:44:47 mircea_popescu: Liberza is this cnn ?

03:44:48 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo, ben_vulpes: incidentally, bullet would be a perfect 'killer app' for electrolytic machining. low mass, touchy geometry

03:44:58 mircea_popescu: this is a good point.

03:45:08 mircea_popescu: also perfectly metallic.

03:45:10 asciilifeform: aha

03:45:15 mircea_popescu: yeah, this is happening.

03:45:27 asciilifeform: ditto shell

03:45:30 mircea_popescu: yup

03:45:43 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Only if electrolytic machining apparatus is refined. Otherwise plastermolds

03:45:46 mircea_popescu: mebbe electrolytic finishing.

03:45:56 mircea_popescu: have them machined grossly then electrofined.

03:46:13 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: this needs only the most trivial form of electrolytic machining - with ready-made cavity

03:46:39 Vexual: build the spin in

03:47:15 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: have them machined grossly then electrofined << nonono - whole point is to make'em in a cup in kitchen, jungle conditions

03:47:35 asciilifeform: the concept is meant to address an earlier thread - 'pashtun can make ak but rounds are still from izhevsk'

03:47:35 mircea_popescu: does this cup mine copper ?

03:47:53 asciilifeform: copper can be had virtually anywhere short of antarctica

03:47:59 asciilifeform: in one form or another

03:48:03 mircea_popescu: can be had, how ?

03:48:09 mircea_popescu: as bars ? why not be had as "X profile"

03:48:13 mircea_popescu: where X is gross machined bullet.

03:48:14 asciilifeform: as pipes

03:48:24 mircea_popescu: oh i c what you mean.

03:48:27 asciilifeform: a metre of pipe - 500 rounds

03:48:57 mircea_popescu: lol alf's crazy gnome lab. "insert pipe here, piss in this funnel and point this end towards enemy".

03:49:12 Vexual: yeah and he claims hes not a hipster

03:49:25 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform btw, you ever seen la zizanie ?

03:49:28 asciilifeform: nein

03:49:37 mircea_popescu: excellent antique french movie.

03:49:53 mircea_popescu: listen, do this : pirate it, sit the girl down one fine evening after a delicious repast, watch this thing.

03:49:57 mircea_popescu: guaranteed entertainment .

03:50:00 *: asciilifeform found, puts on list

03:50:05 asciilifeform: definitely relevant

03:50:25 mircea_popescu: if there's a way to show the cultural superiority of the 4th republic, this film in this context is it.

03:51:22 asciilifeform: briefly back to the bullet thread: the most interesting thing about the suggested method is that any material can be used, so long as it conducts and behaves reasonably well as aqueous ion

03:51:29 asciilifeform: even, e.g., tungsten

03:51:37 asciilifeform: whatever's at hand

03:51:47 mircea_popescu: depleted uranium!

03:51:57 mircea_popescu: best fucking bullets, srsly. no one lives.

03:52:01 asciilifeform: if that's what's in your cellar - then yes

03:52:33 mircea_popescu: metallic arsenic bullets. an assassin's dream come true

03:52:43 asciilifeform: (who has du in his cellar? anyone with a boat or airplane graveyard)

03:52:51 asciilifeform: keels, aileron counterweights

03:53:11 mircea_popescu: for that matter : sodium bullets encased in very thin metal : just thick enough to carry it through the air. once it fractures on impact, sodium released.

03:53:29 asciilifeform: the 'glass bullet' is as nearly as old as the detective story genre.

03:53:33 mircea_popescu: aye

03:53:55 BingoBoingo: Rubidium

03:53:56 asciilifeform: (not much seen in reality, due to shockwaves, but doesn't keep aficionados from trying)

03:54:22 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform such trials particularly suited to electroprocess.

03:54:30 asciilifeform: aha

03:54:32 mircea_popescu: breathe new life into an entire literary field!

03:54:35 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> (who has du in his cellar? anyone with a boat or airplane graveyard) << Anyone in Iowa has too much

03:55:13 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: would need a sabot

03:55:16 asciilifeform: then will work.

03:57:40 asciilifeform: bonus points for the bullet exercise if you can dispense with the 'mold' entirely and form the conical part purely with field gradient in the bath

03:57:47 asciilifeform: out of ordinary rod stock

03:58:16 asciilifeform: sorta a 'solid state electric lathe.'

03:59:02 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform got a link to where you go "omg wtf bbq am i the only one trying to run these shitstacks"

03:59:07 mircea_popescu: in teh logs

03:59:28 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=04-03-2015#1040458

03:59:28 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 04:11:00; assbot: Logged on 03-03-2015 22:23:41; ascii_field: every time i do this, i get the distinct feeling that i'm the only living thing other than the package maintainer/developer who tried to build it

03:59:38 asciilifeform: ^ most recently

03:59:55 mircea_popescu: ty

04:00:10 mircea_popescu: i'm making a sjsqd megapiece, it's great that convo.

04:00:14 asciilifeform: to round off the electrobullet thread, i made this gedankenexperiment up for this just to show what folks like wilson -would- be doing if they were serious

04:00:29 asciilifeform: because much simpler even than what they do

04:00:36 asciilifeform: no need for computer, even.

04:01:12 asciilifeform: '3d printer', for those unfamiliar, is a very costly item. i don't even keep one here, can't justify

04:01:33 decimation: re: wilson < it strikes me that he's just trying to get publicity

04:01:49 asciilifeform: the ultimate publicity is when your shit - works

04:01:53 decimation: he recently posted that fedex banned shipping his 3d milling machines

04:02:04 decimation: obviously, he's selling them as 'death in a box'

04:02:11 decimation: instead of '3d milling machine'

04:02:13 asciilifeform: fedex is, afaik, free to boycott whoever

04:02:19 asciilifeform: it isn't the national post

04:02:28 decimation: sure. and whoever is free to make a press release about it

04:03:09 decimation: so I don't think he's serious. although the idea of milling your own 'm-4gery' out of an '80%' receiver is a neat one

04:03:23 asciilifeform: decimation: it's sop among u.s. small arms aficionados

04:04:03 asciilifeform: decimation: they have this ancient law, where that one part is the only thing that 'counts' as a limited item, and the rest of the weapon can be bought with cash in a shop or even outdoor market

04:04:25 decimation: asciilifeform: yeah, you can even buy the parts to turn your milled receiver into a pistol http://www.bushmaster.com/firearms/pistols.asp

04:04:26 assbot: Bushmaster - Carbon 15 Pistols ... ( http://bit.ly/1BTqBEF )

04:04:28 decimation: as fucktarded as that is

04:04:37 asciilifeform: see the 'saw-off' mosin earlier in thread

04:04:40 asciilifeform: poor ears

04:05:20 decimation: asciilifeform: one thing that bewilders me is why suppressors and subsonic ammo is not popular in the us

04:05:40 decimation: I guess going deaf at the range is an implied rite of manhood

04:05:47 asciilifeform: decimation: this might have to do with the fact that much of what u.s. folks take to the shooting galleries seems to exist for little purpose but to make an impressive 'bang'

04:06:09 asciilifeform: so the suppressors (sop in eu) were banned as something only a 'shady crook' would use

04:06:44 decimation: you can buy them in the us, if they are legal in your state and you submit many forms to usg

04:06:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5600 @ 0.00037791 = 2.1163 BTC [-]

04:07:30 asciilifeform: iirc they're limited to public servants or folks willing to license themselves as 'museums' (complete with fingerprinting, letters of recommendation from mayor, surprise inspections, ... etc)

04:07:51 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 42 @ 0.05173809 = 2.173 BTC [+] {3}

04:07:53 decimation: asciilifeform: yeah I'm not sure what you agree to when you buy one but you definitely need a note from stalin

04:08:52 decimation: I suspect the real reason that usg makes it difficult is because a suppressed small arm has real utility against usg

04:09:14 asciilifeform: how?

04:11:27 mircea_popescu: rather than franceg, say ?

04:13:24 decimation: asciilifeform: the relatively silent firearm can be used to ambush and retreat?

04:13:56 decimation: mircea_popescu: didn't you make the point about how the guns we are allowed to keep are of little threat to usg anyway?

04:13:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5300 @ 0.00037638 = 1.9948 BTC [-] {2}

04:14:23 mircea_popescu: decimation ambush like whom ?

04:17:51 decimation: well, I'm thinking of a more military scenario

04:18:38 *: asciilifeform is an armchair general only, but doesn't see the military advantage of usg against subjects as consisting solely or even largely of superior small arms. what, rebel army won't break the law against modifying trigger of semi weapons to auto? rather, advantage of usg is same as in the time of hammurabi - soldiers are fed by the palace so they needn't 'waste' time on honest work; are resupplied so they needn't look for what

04:19:56 decimation: asciilifeform: it's not even clear that having full auto ar-15's would be much of an advantage at all

04:20:39 asciilifeform: or whatever $machine

04:20:51 decimation: asciilifeform: but I agree with your point. ultimately any resistance to usg is going to be economic

04:20:55 asciilifeform: picture if usg tomorrow said 'we don't care, go buy a cannon if you want, like it's 1780 again'

04:21:01 asciilifeform: how many will buy?

04:21:16 asciilifeform: usg still controls, de-facto, the factory, and can thus set price

04:21:32 decimation: particularly, as you have pointed out, the ammo factory

04:21:37 asciilifeform: by the time you have a desire to buy the cannon instead of 'toyota' - it's generally too late

04:24:26 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=26-11-2014#934786 << relevant thread

04:24:26 assbot: Logged on 26-11-2014 00:46:13; asciilifeform: have to understand, jet fighter is not really a complete machine. it is a tentacle of the larger industrial slave empire which produced and employed it.

04:26:15 decimation: asciilifeform: pounding a wedge between usg and its ability print bezzlars is the proper route of resistance

04:26:29 decimation: that, and finding a way to mill bullets at home :)

04:33:16 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 254 @ 0.00461378 = 1.1719 BTC [+] {5}

04:34:17 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 500 @ 0.00521471 = 2.6074 BTC [+] {4}

04:41:23 decimation: http://www.cnbc.com/id/102477304 < "When it comes to price growth, however, New York topped the list for prime property worldwide, according to Knight Frank. Prices jumped 18 percent in New York in 2014. Aspen, Colorado, ranked second, with prices up 16 percent."

04:41:24 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EhG2qo )

04:41:58 decimation: and the fed is worried about how inflation is too low

04:43:32 mircea_popescu: decimation i had made that point, yes, but the counterpositive is not necessarily true.

04:44:30 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the price thing is amusingly at work in all sorts of ATF stuff.

04:44:46 mircea_popescu: tons of things "legal if you have a license we aren't issuing because we're at liberty to do this."

04:45:41 decimation: some rich 'collectors' in the us obtain the proper notes to get fully automatic machine guns

04:46:29 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 312 @ 0.00463785 = 1.447 BTC [-] {2}

04:46:32 decimation: 50 cal rounds go for like $5

04:46:52 decimation: as you can imagine, only the rich can have such a hobby

04:46:58 mircea_popescu: well, it's not rich per se.

04:47:04 mircea_popescu: only dependants.

04:47:45 mircea_popescu: the buffett-rich, the people who are not merely willing to go on the record stating "i am representative of richness, i couldn't exist outside of usg, therefore usg is EVERYTHING", but actually believe it.

04:48:04 mircea_popescu: lemme dig up relevant quote.

04:49:03 decimation: didn't Carnegie, Rockefeller, et. al. bail out us banks from their personal accounts?

04:50:20 mircea_popescu: "accounts'

04:50:40 mircea_popescu: the j p morgan bailout was essentially a "everyone come to my house!" and then "you will do like so because i say so"

04:50:49 decimation: yeah exactly

04:51:04 decimation: and crassus was said to have wealth equal to the treasury

04:51:10 decimation: now that's 'rich'

04:51:19 mircea_popescu: uh, treasury was never that rich.

04:52:15 asciilifeform: a case like these is simply historians misidentifying who is actually the fella wearing the crown

04:52:17 mircea_popescu: to properly grok how rich the triumvir was : he could afford to pay for ~18 million usians to go fight for tikrit.

04:52:25 asciilifeform: (whether by malfeasance or otherwise)

04:52:45 mircea_popescu: the cost for the 20 measly thousand the dod scrounged together (and who faced exactly the fate of crassus' host) was > 1bn

04:53:18 mircea_popescu: know many dudes with 1trn in loose change knocking around ?

04:53:39 decimation: yeah exactly

04:53:44 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform he was one of the three, nothing is misidentified is it.

04:53:59 decimation: I assume he meant jp morgan

04:54:02 asciilifeform: thiking more of ^

04:54:10 asciilifeform: *thinking

04:54:17 mircea_popescu: oh. well, no. he wore the banking crown, nobody disputed that, and for good reason.

04:54:26 mircea_popescu: but division of labour eh ?

04:55:31 decimation: well, morgan and his other monopoly friends thought they could 'endow' their bailout wealth to usg via the federal reserve

04:55:35 mircea_popescu: a crown in the traditional sense is a very primitive instrument, because it purports (necessarily, but ineffectually) to hold ALL sovereignty. now the poor bearer's stuck deciding how fires are to be put out, how wives are to be kept, etc.

04:55:35 decimation: that didn't work out very well

04:55:52 mircea_popescu: decimation this is entirely counterfactual nonsense that never happened.

04:56:11 mircea_popescu: an' generally, i'd be wary of trusting the current retards' retelling of century old banking history.

04:56:29 mircea_popescu: for one thing, they're too stupid to understand it, for another they don't speak the language, for the third they imagine they have political judgements to make.

04:57:29 decimation: did morgan et al not meet on jekyll island to institute the fed?

04:57:46 mircea_popescu: anyway, i dunno where that wb quote is, somewhere in his 70s brk letters. all poetic about how great paying taxes is because hey, being rich's unfair.

04:58:37 mircea_popescu: decimation afaik he wasn't there.

04:58:46 mircea_popescu: he died iether before or soon after, and had for a while retired.

05:01:34 *: asciilifeform has buffett 'symlinked' mentally with armand hammer. and wonders if there is any logical reason for this

05:01:34 decimation: nevertheless, I take your point that the study of this history is worthwhile

05:01:39 BingoBoingo: decimation: Crassus was the Fire department

05:01:57 mircea_popescu: decimation in particular, the us fed was an attempt to copy germany, at the time extremely effectual.

05:02:05 decimation: although I don't know how one could find a history that isn't wrapped in progressive bullshit

05:02:29 mircea_popescu: it's easy to recast today as some sort of nefariousness, but if regarded properly rather than anchronistically it's just exactly the same as imperial russians trying to copy prussia.

05:02:44 mircea_popescu: at the time, in fact, the us and russia had a shitload in common : inept peripheral immense landmasses.

05:03:01 mircea_popescu: pretty much the same problems, the same solutions, the same obsession of women with french and men with german shit and so on.

05:03:49 mircea_popescu: nobody has made a "Russia and the US in the 1800s : A Tale Of Twin Sisters" monograph to date

05:03:59 asciilifeform: aaactually

05:04:26 mircea_popescu: this merely speaks to the poor quality of english "historians". where's the new york gibbon ?

05:04:44 asciilifeform: plenty of (otherwise uninteresting, believe) sov. tracts re: analogy b/w us slavery & ru serf-keeping

05:04:53 asciilifeform: and the decline of each

05:04:58 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform russian side is a little better represented, but not much.

05:05:22 decimation: the historians who would be worth a shit are probably busy trying to keep their house and eat

05:05:29 mircea_popescu: so did gibbon.

05:05:33 mircea_popescu: he ALSO did the rise and fall.

05:05:40 *: BingoBoingo maybe surprisingly would still be willing to carry a rifle to tikrit in USia's name. Just since USia didn't accept my flirtations last time if they take me this time I want to pick the rifle.

05:05:56 mircea_popescu: life's what happens while people had other plans, an' posteriority remembers what you did BESIDES paying the bills.

05:06:18 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: last i checked usg will enlist just about anyone under fifty or so

05:06:26 BingoBoingo: Sand niggers are still a species of nigger

05:07:01 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: They spotted me the last time with a specific mental defect they refuse to abide

05:08:14 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: tried the private sector ?

05:08:19 mircea_popescu: ^

05:08:21 asciilifeform: (i.e. the twenty thousand)

05:08:30 mircea_popescu: you can probably make decent loot with the various brackwaters.

05:08:45 asciilifeform: though last i heard they're pretty well staffed and get picky

05:08:57 asciilifeform: (preferring folks schooled in the normal army for a tour or three)

05:09:03 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: The fucking local mall turned me down last X-mas season. Not any specific vendor, but all of them.

05:09:39 BingoBoingo: I've a cousin who did some bracjwasser stuff

05:10:04 mircea_popescu: !t m s.qntr

05:10:04 assbot: [MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00027068 / 0.00027314 / 0.000301 (17082 shares, 4.67 BTC), 30D: 0.00021897 / 0.0002619 / 0.000301 (62444 shares, 16.35 BTC)

05:10:07 BingoBoingo: Was bored, but at least he wasn't on a boat which was his greatest fear as a marine

05:10:38 mircea_popescu: !t m s.mpoe

05:10:38 assbot: [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00035809 / 0.00038073 / 0.00040007 (2565886 shares, 976.92 BTC), 7D: 0.00033798 / 0.00039508 / 0.00044462 (26732598 shares, 10,561.55 BTC), 30D: 0.00033798 / 0.00040005 / 0.00048515 (88726595 shares, 35,495.37 BTC)

05:11:41 mircea_popescu: howly shit this is actually possibru o.O

05:13:03 mircea_popescu: god dangit.

05:13:10 decimation: ;;ticker

05:13:11 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 271.49, Best ask: 271.6, Bid-ask spread: 0.11000, Last trade: 271.59, 24 hour volume: 67948.14967978, 24 hour low: 267.0, 24 hour high: 285.99, 24 hour vwap: None

05:13:28 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: qntra shares face scarcity necessarily

05:13:50 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo yeah but still.

05:14:23 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Over time total new s.qntr per month is on a downward trend becasuse refinement

05:14:43 BingoBoingo: Each scam is only worth so many textual bullets

05:14:48 mircea_popescu: yep.

05:14:52 mircea_popescu: not a bad thing that, anywya.

05:15:08 mircea_popescu: more words < better words.

05:15:25 BingoBoingo: And if it wasn't for Moxenslit I wouls have been 1400 less words last month, but eulogy

05:16:08 []bot: Bet created: "Qntra to the moon" http://bitbet.us/bet/1127/

05:20:34 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: But if brackwasser wants my hands they cn knock on my door as the FBI and Treasury department did.

05:21:09 BingoBoingo: Maybe they can actually hold together ling enough to submit a bid.

05:21:27 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: lol, right after i get conscripted to nsa sharashka

05:21:51 asciilifeform: and ben_vulpes - to the ministry of wunderwaffen rocketeers

05:22:19 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Your plague is high standards. So long as their only demand is I shoot brown people, then I and them will be fine.

05:22:27 BingoBoingo: !up Vexual

05:22:48 BingoBoingo: Vexual: I am way too drunk atm for PM's

05:23:04 mircea_popescu: Vexual you know, iranians are white.

05:23:07 mircea_popescu: and the chicks are pretty.

05:23:09 asciilifeform: ^

05:23:21 BingoBoingo: Iranians could totally get the dick.

05:23:38 mircea_popescu: i think they stole more circassians than the dutch stole africans.

05:23:45 mircea_popescu: were at it for far longer, that's for sure.

05:25:04 *: asciilifeform refrains from going into deep tangent re: how iran may well have joined euro camp rather than descending into strange if it hadn't been spat upon as 'eastern monkeys' when tried

05:25:05 BingoBoingo: As a USian I have to assume ISIS must be bad, and therefore Obumer sucks for not letting me take potshots at them.

05:25:43 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Iran has always been more ready then the turks

05:26:00 asciilifeform: see, for instance, the story regarding the composition of their not-quite-national-anthem 'ey iran' - sorta their equiv. of 'america the beautiful'

05:26:54 decimation: asciilifeform: I thought iran went apeshit because of the british and us meddling

05:26:55 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: i was nearly disowned from marching band at one time for insisting on continuance to Star Spangled Banner's 3rd verse

05:27:25 decimation: BingoBoingo: should have sang the 'La Marseillaise'

05:28:17 BingoBoingo: decimation: I am not of Jurov's interface preferences

05:28:29 asciilifeform: lol

05:28:42 cazalla: damn, you piss heads are tempting me to drink now

05:28:47 asciilifeform: would american schoolboys even recognize it ?

05:29:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16300 @ 0.00037373 = 6.0918 BTC [-] {2}

05:29:27 BingoBoingo: Seriouly though if USia offered me a mosin in exchange for 45 minutes at the ISIS border bleaching browns... I'd take that

05:29:43 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: They would not

05:29:50 decimation: BingoBoingo: this is roughly why usg is still in business

05:30:05 decimation: rivers of meat are still ready to serve

05:30:13 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo dreamt all his life of an infantry career? mud, guts, the works ?

05:30:20 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: They would recognize te sovient national anthem though given a picture of sean connery

05:30:37 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041914 << lol this dood's something else. who the fuck was banned, even ?!

05:30:37 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 19:37:51; danielpbarron: yeah, prepare to be hated and banned

05:30:51 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: And yet it was my temporal lobes that betrayed me

05:31:28 mircea_popescu: anyway, this ssd kid is abso-fucking-lutely endearing.

05:31:36 mircea_popescu: anyone even know who he is ?

05:31:43 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Has #b-a actually banned ever?

05:31:56 mircea_popescu: well join/part spam, yeah

05:32:00 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: best I can tell they were anb honest n00b

05:32:06 mircea_popescu: but that gets undone on a "hey, i fixed it!"

05:32:18 asciilifeform: peculiarly radiation-damaged n00b

05:32:26 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo pity they never reg'd now it'll be damned hard to make the link.

05:32:45 asciilifeform: too many limbs of one type, too few - of other, wrong directions attached

05:32:51 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i read almost the whole thing, i fail to see anything to indicate anything wrong with him.

05:33:05 BingoBoingo: sjsqd: is still welcome to my ear. Maybe I misse dsome other subject

05:33:39 BingoBoingo: ;;later tell sjsqd You are a crisis nao

05:33:40 gribble: The operation succeeded.

05:33:45 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nothing malicious about the poor bugger, just the fact of having all of the traditional misconceptions ('i'll use my phone', 'let's try the Cloud', etc.)

05:33:55 mircea_popescu: kinda funny, yeah.

05:34:02 decimation: asciilifeform: how did you find that 'new lamer' guy? incoming links?

05:34:06 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: That, plus their poor timing

05:34:09 asciilifeform: decimation: machine logs

05:34:10 mircea_popescu: but children are born thus. the infrastructure if you wish. the pulmonary shunt.

05:34:13 mircea_popescu: it serves a purpose

05:34:53 BingoBoingo: Last year...

05:35:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9950 @ 0.00037056 = 3.6871 BTC [-] {2}

05:35:38 decimation: asciilifeform: I feel sorry for the poor guy, his heart is in the right place but he has no idea what kind of elephant he is trying to eat

05:35:46 cazalla: BingoBoingo, what ya drinking, vodka?

05:36:11 mircea_popescu: aww and all the hate he's getting.

05:36:16 mircea_popescu: mats whay so mean dood!

05:36:20 BingoBoingo: decimation: The solution is not shooting him yet, but giving him a historical cadaver to explore

05:36:26 asciilifeform: dubai (his claimed home) is an interesting place. haven't had to go there myself yet, but have a friend who regularly visits. has stories

05:36:52 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform at some point in the 90s knew a whole bunch of chicks who technically lived there

05:37:08 mircea_popescu: came back home "to study" 9 months in the year, hung out with husband over summer.

05:37:14 BingoBoingo: cazalla: Yes. Not vodka really. Just plain grain alcohol... and time... and dreams... of USia giving me brown people as a target...

05:37:37 cazalla: BingoBoingo, believe it or not, i've yet to imbibe this month but you're encouraging.. so

05:37:50 decimation: the arabs import everything, food, women, work

05:38:41 asciilifeform: the one thing i've always wondered about dubai is what the owners actually -do- (vs have others do)

05:39:01 asciilifeform: but iirc the prophet never forbade coke

05:39:11 decimation: asciilifeform: if they are gentlemen scholars they don't seem to publish in english

05:39:22 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform apparently they're very insecure people, spend a lot of time wondering.

05:39:56 BingoBoingo: http://www.startribune.com/lifestyle/health/294758231.html

05:39:58 assbot: Minnesota college tragedies: Drunk, frozen and underage | Star Tribune ... ( http://bit.ly/18Sg5B2 )

05:40:12 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041934 o.O didn't know petey's fluent in russians.

05:40:12 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 19:43:17; pete_dushenski: now that it's a bit quieter in here: http://www.contravex.com/2015/03/04/kerckhoffs-history-and-principles-of-military-cryptography-translated-and-adnotated/

05:40:16 decimation: asciilifeform: http://gulfnews.com/news/gulf/uae/emergencies/fire-in-a-dubai-building-disrupts-dubai-metro-operations-1.1216376

05:40:17 assbot: Fire in a Dubai building disrupts Dubai Metro operations | GulfNews.com ... ( http://bit.ly/18Sg9Rh )

05:40:32 mircea_popescu: a nm, french version

05:42:14 decimation: asciilifeform: video of the fire. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9djyhXo_k50

05:42:16 assbot: Tallest Residential Building on Fire - Dubai - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/18Sgvax )

05:42:28 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041954 << aaaaahahahahaha

05:42:28 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 19:53:30; assbot: I just realized /hashtag/golang?src=hash's "go get" falls back to HTTP when HTTPS fails ☹ /hashtag/RussianRouletteSoftwareDistribution?src=hash /hashtag/CurlPipeSudoBash?src=hash /hashtag/yolo?src=hash /E_I_T

05:42:33 mircea_popescu: holy shit who does these things

05:43:11 danielpbarron: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1042688 << i meant banned from whatever venues he came from if he starts writing about b-a

05:43:11 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 05:30:37; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041914 << lol this dood's something else. who the fuck was banned, even ?!

05:43:25 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041957 << there's http://minigame.bz/eulora/binaries/ but otherwise the idea is for wikis etc to be community maintained.

05:43:25 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 19:56:49; PeterL: does Eulora have an official website?

05:43:26 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/18SgCTx )

05:43:38 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron oh. yeah, i guess so.

05:44:19 mircea_popescu: artifexd ^ i would hope you won't have that problem ? :D

05:45:15 *: asciilifeform mumbles something regarding nonexistence of kitchens with single cockroaches

05:45:57 *: BingoBoingo wonders why USG won't consider cost effective ISIS solutions

05:45:57 asciilifeform: ^ subject to the standard 'unexpected hanging theorem' disclaimer

05:46:23 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1041988 << quite.

05:46:23 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 20:11:02; asciilifeform: PeterL: but you'll find that much of what programmers actually object to in ada is precisely the good parts

05:46:30 danielpbarron: the reason i didn't clarify at the time was that i kinda hope he does go and write a LTBarticle about this place and get himself banned from "the community"

05:46:56 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron i think it's at breaking point, that "community"

05:47:03 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: That is neither a problem nor a lack therof

05:47:11 danielpbarron: right

05:47:16 mircea_popescu: treason's only a hanging offence originally. soon enough...

05:47:25 danielpbarron: it would be good for him to get ejected from their midst

05:47:36 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: So your disagreement relatred ratings

05:47:41 mircea_popescu: i kinda expect ejection in droves during the year.

05:47:42 danielpbarron: don't take my word for it, sort of thing

05:47:57 asciilifeform: it's at breaking point << it's been carrying on a happy 'life' of the undead zombie for quite some time, rotting, culturing maggots & worms, throwing chunks of flesh at bystanders

05:48:08 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform notrly, no.

05:48:26 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: Contrast the case of 'Rozal'

05:49:23 danielpbarron: i gave rozal -10 for being a self described liar, and some others got a -1 or -2 for striking me as sketchy..

05:49:31 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's alive for the purpose of usg stooges being able to 'talk about bitcoin' without mentioning #b-a ever

05:50:09 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1042001 << such lovely, srsly.

05:50:09 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 20:13:24; asciilifeform: there is even a 'rationale' document (also book) ready to argue with you

05:50:24 decimation: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-04/how-a-25-year-old-investor-spurred-lumber-liquidators-plunge < apparently the new investing hotness is to short a company and then throw it into the usg woodchipper

05:50:25 assbot: How a 25-Year-Old Sparked Lumber Liquidators’ Stock Plunge - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/18l0LLQ )

05:50:30 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's 100% free online, too

05:50:33 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i think your view of what is after all a natural process is too informed by categorical logic.

05:51:03 asciilifeform: (common lisp has a standard-cum-rationale and it isn't quite as deliciously readable)

05:51:06 mircea_popescu: real objects can of course never be categorically anything.

05:51:07 asciilifeform: but similar

05:52:14 asciilifeform: too informed by categorical logic... real objects can of course never be categorically anything << guilty. professional disease.

05:52:28 mircea_popescu: nttawwi.

05:52:33 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: You initially gave him a small negative rating out of dislike and it was described as such. I hung him for fabricating allegations of theft.

05:52:49 danielpbarron: what is the point of -10 if not for also having access to the other integers between it and 0

05:54:04 asciilifeform: am i alone in using wot as was originally taught, 'level of confidence that this key represents person who is what they wish to believe us they are' ?

05:54:05 mircea_popescu: holy shit 2k lines that aren't your own are hard as fucking coffin nails

05:54:16 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: For the dark mark. He got -10 for most grevious crime

05:54:27 asciilifeform: *what they wish us to believe they are

05:54:29 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes. wot is "level of confidence i have a complete picture of this person"

05:55:04 BingoBoingo: ;;rated Rozal

05:55:05 gribble: You rated user Rozal on Mon Jan 19 12:09:29 2015, with a rating of -10, and supplied these additional notes: Fabricated theft allegations http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/Rozal_allegation Confessed http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-01-2015#983318 Full Indictment http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/Rozal_Indictment.

05:55:13 *: mircea_popescu insists on http://fraudsters.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/

05:55:14 assbot: What the WoT is for, how it works and how to use it. pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/18l11un )

05:55:22 asciilifeform: ^^ aha that one

05:55:44 mircea_popescu: uh. speaking of which... anyone could explain wtf https://www.pinterest.com/ethanrana/httpfraudsterscom2014what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works/ is ?!

05:55:47 assbot: http://fraudsters.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/ on Pinterest | 100 Pins ... ( http://bit.ly/18l12yp )

05:56:09 asciilifeform: spamatron

05:56:15 mircea_popescu: but... why an url ?!

05:56:34 asciilifeform: 'seo'

05:56:58 asciilifeform: particularly in the case of certain demented browsers that pipe url bar contents into search engine under certain conditions

05:57:04 mircea_popescu: hm

05:57:44 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: consider - how did you even discover that page

05:57:54 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-03-2015#1042034 hawahahahahaha

05:57:54 assbot: Logged on 04-03-2015 21:15:54; bitstein: This is pretty lulzy: https://github.com/jonasnick/eth-neg-value-tx

05:58:12 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i had no idea fraudsters is THAT googled.

05:58:36 asciilifeform: eth-neg << do you wonder why it was disclosed for bounty? rather than being used to shoot the thing in the head

05:58:46 asciilifeform: as it quite certainly could have been

05:59:39 mircea_popescu: because the thing is worthless ?

05:59:40 asciilifeform: (my hypothesis, simple: because eth. isn't alive and cannot be killed by shooting in the head. like 'redphone' and 'silent circle')

06:00:10 asciilifeform: 1000 'fatal' bugs will be found, if it carries on long enough, and will make no difference.

06:00:38 scoopbot: New post on fraudsters by Mircea Popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2015/a-sjsqd-walks-into-a-pub/

06:02:30 artifexd: gossipd status: http://i.minus.com/ibaDjk7AeIcvxv.gif

06:02:35 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/18SjtM5 )

06:07:02 BingoBoingo: PeterL I would much prefer to read an article than to listen to some guy talking. << And this is how the world ends. Not with a whimper, but with a 7.62x54R bang

06:08:04 *: asciilifeform thought it ends with the 'schpokk' of nailgun

06:09:54 mircea_popescu: artifexd lolk took 3 passes but bwahahaha

06:11:44 artifexd: I'm pretty heads down on it so 1) I am falling very behind on logs and 2) I'm not hanging out in here

06:12:00 mircea_popescu: makes sense.

06:12:10 artifexd: But, I do get pinged if my name shows up and I don't want y'all to think it has been forgotten.

06:12:22 mircea_popescu: got pinged because of the go http debacle

06:12:28 mircea_popescu: two lines up from where you were pinged

06:13:15 asciilifeform: not that widget, as specced, uses http/s for anything

06:13:16 artifexd: While interesting, that doesn't affect gossipd because I'm using lower level networking.

06:13:28 asciilifeform: but it is precisely the kind of thing one gets when using turdlangs

06:13:48 asciilifeform: esp. ones where 'omg111!!11 rich libraries, they do everything'

06:14:01 danielpbarron: Funny how not long it takes the Christian to start a holy war upon the poor Arab! << LOL, I honestly didn't even consider his ethnicity; I have a /stab alias for when people annoy me

06:14:03 mircea_popescu: i enjoy opportunities to poke at people

06:14:14 mircea_popescu: lol

06:15:54 artifexd: Oh, actually that is complaining about one of the golang tools. And it would be dangerous if you had a MITM that could swap out code inflight and were importing external code directly.

06:17:01 mircea_popescu: aha

06:17:04 *: BingoBoingo farts

06:17:36 BingoBoingo: artifexd: Golang seems to have a lot of those holes

06:21:15 *: BingoBoingo adires tedu as guy aho makes bullshit mor menory safe, questions... the rest pf the corpus

06:25:17 decimation: asciilifeform: I assume you saw the sudden freakout over hilariously weak crypto implemented by spec in SSL?

06:34:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10200 @ 0.00037132 = 3.7875 BTC [+]

06:38:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37650 @ 0.00037062 = 13.9538 BTC [-] {2}

06:47:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3058 @ 0.00037051 = 1.133 BTC [-]

07:03:44 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12300 @ 0.00037035 = 4.5553 BTC [-] {2}

07:05:18 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell pete_dushenski http://www.contravex.com/2015/03/04/kerckhoffs-history-and-principles-of-military-cryptography-translated-and-adnotated/#footnote_2_2919 << belive it or not that'd actually be ecdsa rather than simple transposition.

07:05:20 assbot: Kerckhoffs’ history and principles of military cryptography, translated and adnotated. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1zMWtU8 )

07:05:20 gribble: The operation succeeded.

07:10:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7923 @ 0.00038223 = 3.0284 BTC [+] {2}

07:33:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15350 @ 0.00037275 = 5.7217 BTC [-] {2}

07:41:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10850 @ 0.00036892 = 4.0028 BTC [-] {2}

07:47:50 punkman: http://www.wired.com/2012/11/zeta-radio/

07:47:52 assbot: Mexican Cartels Enslave Engineers to Build Radio Network | WIRED ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoFXzD )

07:49:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31726 @ 0.00038373 = 12.1742 BTC [+] {3}

08:03:36 punkman: http://metatalk.metafilter.com/23626/Sixteen-Years

08:03:39 assbot: Sixteen Years | MetaTalk ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoI5Yk )

08:04:02 punkman: when did they throw away the old cozy design...

08:06:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5500 @ 0.00037403 = 2.0572 BTC [-]

08:08:26 punkman: ;;ticker

08:08:27 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 272.63, Best ask: 272.7, Bid-ask spread: 0.07000, Last trade: 272.7, 24 hour volume: 64140.20713433, 24 hour low: 267.0, 24 hour high: 285.99, 24 hour vwap: None

08:08:42 punkman: gribble doesn't like buttstamp anymore?

08:12:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00038422 = 1.5369 BTC [+]

08:15:00 cazalla: http://www.digitalcurrencycouncil.com/uncategorized/join-us-on-march-8th-for-bitcoin-womens-day/

08:15:04 assbot: Join Us on March 8th for Bitcoin Women's Day - Digital Currency Council ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoJT3p )

08:16:46 punkman: lulz http://www.internationalwomensday.com/theme.asp

08:16:47 assbot: INTERNATIONAL WOMEN'S DAY 2015 Theme: Make It Happen ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoK7HN )

08:19:18 cazalla: punkman, i've made my contribution, have you? https://twitter.com/captaincazalla/status/573396933793857536

08:19:19 assbot: Bitcoin needs more women! To that end, women can earn their first 0.1 BTC right here! http://t.co/jkfTtJ6tS3 /hashtag/MakeItHappen?src=hash /hashtag/BitcoinWomensDay?src=hash

08:20:32 punkman: cazalla, I will contribute by only using purple sex toys on the girl

08:20:49 punkman: it's the color of equality

08:27:11 punkman: http://image.dhgate.com/albu_925764541_00/1.0x0.jpg

08:27:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoLFSm )

08:33:25 cazalla: that's a real thing lol?

08:36:14 punkman: scary looking bird http://bongashop.com/media/catalog/product/cache/5/image/bfe434d3359b3a2b8d266fbb8472c53a/A/N/ANPS14.jpg

08:36:15 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EoMTgc )

08:51:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22300 @ 0.00037403 = 8.3409 BTC [-]

08:57:31 mircea_popescu: cazalla what's "women's day" got to do with "digital currency" w/e the shit that means.

08:59:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6575 @ 0.00037706 = 2.4792 BTC [+]

08:59:54 cazalla: mircea_popescu, seems an opportunity for them to stick their dcc branded shit next to an even bigger shittier brand, that being international wimminz day

09:00:10 mircea_popescu: totally this is the way to success.

09:00:32 mircea_popescu: keep keeping the magic buttons next to other magic buttons so the magic keeps infusing from one to the other and multiplying and shit.

09:00:53 mircea_popescu: soon enough they'll have enough mana stored up to resurect zig ziggler

09:01:04 mircea_popescu: and bring about three apocalypses for the low low price of 19.95

09:01:13 mircea_popescu: but wait! there's more!

09:01:31 mircea_popescu: if you apocalypse now you also get this free set of dragonbane absolutely free!

09:01:38 mircea_popescu: (retail value of 49.95)

09:01:56 cazalla: that's some steak knife

09:02:01 mircea_popescu: PLUS! if you only use purple toys on the girl you get a bactericide cream for the vajayjay ABSOLUTELY FREE

09:04:59 mircea_popescu: "While Amin's articles, author profile at Coin Brief and twitter account have since been deleted, a copy of his author archive at Coin Brief remains available via Google cache and is mirrored here."

09:05:13 mircea_popescu: why the fuck would people do this. doesn't it stand to reason it's interesting now ? why delete it ?

09:05:44 mircea_popescu: lol twitter murdered bryce weiner ? ahaha

09:06:17 cazalla: i know eh, his site has been mentioned in the wapo, cnn.. and he goes and deletes it lol

09:06:22 cazalla: the guys content that is, not the site itself

09:08:06 mircea_popescu: weird.

09:08:35 mircea_popescu: anyway, since this is such a big deal (!?), anyone know of some of these isis reddit users ?

09:08:49 mircea_popescu: we could have a script to changetip them fiddy satoshi till the cows come home

09:09:14 mircea_popescu: or whatever, the bruhaha makes me want to send usd to isis now. how do i go about it ?

09:09:20 mircea_popescu: preferably using coinbase.

09:09:47 cazalla: nope, but i'd laugh if they began to include a QR code in their head chop videos

09:10:01 cazalla: donate x amount of BTC to see this guy go free by such and such date

09:10:30 mircea_popescu: totally.

09:10:36 mircea_popescu: they could have a "vote how the guy dies".

09:10:58 mircea_popescu: <10 btc, beheaded. < 100 btc, stabbed in esophagus. etc.

09:11:37 cazalla: perhaps a custom video for the largest changetipper

09:11:52 mircea_popescu: 100 btc guy goes free (o oops, a DIFFERENT group got him just as he was leaving our compound)

09:12:03 cazalla: lol

09:12:18 mircea_popescu: anyway, the recently failed megaoffensive on tikrit produced from what i hear a good few thousands prisoners

09:12:36 mircea_popescu: no better time to turn usg agents into camwhores.

09:12:46 mircea_popescu: the eventual fate of everyone working for that thing anyway, why wait.

09:13:36 mircea_popescu: "pay $50 to watch pvt 1st class joshua cooper learn to give oral pleasure to Berg, the great dane"

09:13:49 cazalla: i believe the aussie pm send 300 soliders to join the fight these past few days

09:14:26 cazalla: sent*.. i'm not even drinking yet speak the engrish

09:15:41 cazalla: i'm not so sure the great dane shit would be that popular

09:16:05 mircea_popescu: well whatcha gonna do, gayness is not allowed i think ?

09:16:27 cazalla: i dunno, the egyptian pilot who got toasty'd was quite popular

09:16:36 fluffypony: [11:05:44] <+mircea_popescu> lol twitter murdered bryce weiner ? ahaha <- lol, anyone know what the story is?

09:16:40 cazalla: 3D!

09:16:47 mircea_popescu: anyway, if isis had any sense they'd just steal the liveshow format. what's that thing called where they put x guys in a house ?

09:16:53 mircea_popescu: except do it right, give them knives.

09:16:57 cazalla: he change tipped an alleged isis twitter account fluffypony lol

09:17:02 mircea_popescu: fluffypony top story on qntra atm

09:17:03 fluffypony: hah hah

09:17:09 cazalla: mircea_popescu, big brother

09:17:09 *: fluffypony checks

09:17:15 mircea_popescu: cazalla tya that.

09:17:35 mircea_popescu: anyway, if there's an official isis accounts list somewhere, i'm totally game to send them whatever 0.0050 cents or w/e changetip does.

09:18:01 cazalla: there probably is somewhere

09:19:06 cazalla: can't say i'm keen to be the first aussie bitcoiner nailed to the cross for simply mentioning bitcoin and ISIS in the same sentence though..

09:21:10 cazalla: the cops already shut down an arterial road a few suburbs over this afternoon because some guy dared shoot annoying birds with an air rifle

09:21:32 cazalla: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/police-close-roads-gunman-in-toorak-road-south-yarra-20150305-13wcev.html

09:21:34 assbot: Police close roads, gunman in Toorak Road, South Yarra ... ( http://bit.ly/1zZQIU8 )

09:28:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19550 @ 0.00037462 = 7.3238 BTC [-] {3}

09:31:58 mircea_popescu: nuts.

09:32:14 mircea_popescu: the very idea that police may even close roads...

09:32:24 mircea_popescu: this is rebellion outright.

09:37:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4350 @ 0.00037578 = 1.6346 BTC [+] {3}

09:53:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24100 @ 0.0003875 = 9.3388 BTC [+] {3}

09:58:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15661 @ 0.00036807 = 5.7643 BTC [-] {2}

10:07:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8750 @ 0.00038973 = 3.4101 BTC [+]

10:21:59 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13500 @ 0.00036786 = 4.9661 BTC [-] {2}

10:23:37 mircea_popescu: !up sjsqd

10:23:38 mircea_popescu: yes.

10:28:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8817 @ 0.00038973 = 3.4362 BTC [+]

10:28:31 cazalla: sjsqd, ya back!

10:44:21 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 30 @ 0.04232399 = 1.2697 BTC [-] {4}

10:44:22 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 105 @ 0.012 = 1.26 BTC [+]

10:44:23 sjsqd: sorry afk have to visit family

10:49:56 mircea_popescu: o.O havelock returns ?

10:50:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11800 @ 0.00038874 = 4.5871 BTC [-] {3}

10:53:56 cazalla: saw a few trades earlier

10:57:38 cazalla: !up sjsqd

10:57:42 cazalla: btw sjsqd, are you indian?

10:58:35 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 50 @ 0.0421 = 2.105 BTC [-]

10:58:52 mircea_popescu: Because it is endangered and endemic to the area, development projects have been restricted to preserve its habitat. For example, the Dickey-Lincoln dam, a $227 million hydroelectric project proposed on the upper Saint John River in 1974, was deauthorized by Congress in 1986 after years of study, because the dam would have flooded 88,000 acres (360 km2) of Maine forest and severely reduced the lousewort's habitat. Some

10:58:53 mircea_popescu: criticized ending the dam project to protect the lousewort; Time magazine called the idea "downright silly" in 1977. While thought extinct at the time the dam was proposed, it was rediscovered in 1976 by C.D. Richards while doing surveys to determine the environmental impact of the dam.

10:58:53 mircea_popescu: epic.

10:59:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11450 @ 0.00036464 = 4.1751 BTC [-] {2}

11:10:06 adlai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=05-03-2015#1042884 << they don't want your usary scrip, isiscoin uses PoAu

11:10:06 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 09:09:14; mircea_popescu: or whatever, the bruhaha makes me want to send usd to isis now. how do i go about it ?

11:18:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4500 @ 0.00038482 = 1.7317 BTC [+]

11:47:57 chetty: http://www.coindesk.com/russian-politician-us-bitcoin-finance-terrorism/

11:47:57 assbot: Russian Lawmaker: Bitcoin is a CIA Conspiracy ... ( http://bit.ly/1Fd7rXE )

12:12:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14000 @ 0.00039692 = 5.5569 BTC [+] {2}

12:17:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16166 @ 0.00039865 = 6.4446 BTC [+] {3}

12:26:01 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11000 @ 0.00038238 = 4.2062 BTC [-] {3}

12:42:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6450 @ 0.00038032 = 2.4531 BTC [-]

12:45:59 punkman: mircea_popescu: criticized ending the dam project to protect the lousewort; << who the fuck cares about the lousewort

12:47:00 punkman: flooding a nice forest probably not the best idea, but their argument rests on lousewort?!

12:47:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4050 @ 0.00039941 = 1.6176 BTC [+]

12:54:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12850 @ 0.00038032 = 4.8871 BTC [-]

13:03:38 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 67 @ 0.04152686 = 2.7823 BTC [-] {3}

13:05:42 danielpbarron: height=252240 vs height=199051 (usb3: height=234650)

13:08:53 []bot: Bet placed: 15.19171 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 18(Y):82(N) by coin, 18(Y):82(N) by weight. Total bet: 81.3105122 BTC. Current weight: 72,803.

13:26:05 danielpbarron: !up irdial

13:27:01 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 73 @ 0.04116602 = 3.0051 BTC [-] {3}

13:30:04 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 90 @ 0.012 = 1.08 BTC [+]

13:30:16 dignork: nice idea: https://zyan.scripts.mit.edu/blog/rate-limiting-anonymous-accounts/

13:30:17 assbot: rate-limiting anonymous accounts | discrete blogarithm ... ( http://bit.ly/1DPuaH5 )

13:37:11 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 47 @ 0.04101 = 1.9275 BTC [-]

13:40:21 punkman: unload that AM1 while havelol is still up!

13:51:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38294 @ 0.00039953 = 15.2996 BTC [+] {4}

13:54:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12356 @ 0.00040014 = 4.9441 BTC [+]

14:01:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13100 @ 0.00038279 = 5.0145 BTC [-] {2}

14:17:51 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 72 @ 0.04101 = 2.9527 BTC [-]

14:31:04 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7600 @ 0.00038654 = 2.9377 BTC [+]

14:35:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24420 @ 0.00037638 = 9.1912 BTC [-] {3}

14:42:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00036735 = 3.8204 BTC [-] {3}

14:43:16 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 250 @ 0.00463785 = 1.1595 BTC [-]

14:48:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6500 @ 0.0003833 = 2.4915 BTC [+] {2}

14:48:45 []bot: Bet placed: 1.02 BTC for Yes on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 19(Y):81(N) by coin, 19(Y):81(N) by weight. Total bet: 82.3305122 BTC. Current weight: 72,680.

15:08:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8132 @ 0.00039406 = 3.2045 BTC [+] {2}

15:27:00 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4550 @ 0.00039342 = 1.7901 BTC [-]

15:40:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20287 @ 0.00040088 = 8.1327 BTC [+] {2}

15:41:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14301 @ 0.00040213 = 5.7509 BTC [+] {2}

15:57:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3250 @ 0.00039095 = 1.2706 BTC [-] {2}

16:17:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11650 @ 0.00039295 = 4.5779 BTC [-]

16:22:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6650 @ 0.00039095 = 2.5998 BTC [-]

16:34:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3805 @ 0.00039095 = 1.4876 BTC [-]

16:41:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8500 @ 0.00038571 = 3.2785 BTC [-]

16:41:15 ben_vulpes: <BingoBoingo> [05:31] mircea_popescu: Has #b-a actually banned ever? << tiberius.

16:42:07 ben_vulpes: <decimation> [05:35] asciilifeform: I feel sorry for the poor guy, his heart is in the right place but he has no idea what kind of elephant he is trying to eat << more like a spittoon

16:51:02 ben_vulpes: http://www.jwz.org/blog/2015/03/google-seems-to-have-broken-email-forwarding/ << moar on google breaking the internet

16:51:03 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1wJESSg )

16:51:44 ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> [05:53] am i alone in using wot as was originally taught, 'level of confidence that this key represents person who is what they wish to believe us they are' ? << would this be the ancient "gpg wot" standard?

16:52:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9050 @ 0.00038571 = 3.4907 BTC [-]

16:54:35 []bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for Yes on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 20(Y):80(N) by coin, 20(Y):80(N) by weight. Total bet: 83.3305122 BTC. Current weight: 72,525.

17:04:55 thestringpuller: ben_vulpes: yea. now we can associate bitcoin trades to a key to associate trust value.

17:06:22 scoopbot: New post on Qntra.net by lobbes: http://qntra.net/2015/03/missouri-secretary-of-state-orders-slaughter-to-pay-civil-penalties/

17:14:57 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: o.O havelock returns ? << we are dealing with undead. it is to be expected...

17:16:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16050 @ 0.00038571 = 6.1906 BTC [-]

17:27:07 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: ... #b-a actually banned ever? << mr spam, mr moarspam, others

17:35:17 adlai: his name was robert paulsen

17:38:33 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: mr. moarspam?

17:39:02 thestringpuller: adlai: that part of the book/movie is creepy as fuck.

17:39:25 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: forgot his nick already. something to do with plague, contagion

17:40:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3150 @ 0.00038571 = 1.215 BTC [-]

17:43:29 BingoBoingo: !b 5

17:43:30 assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0CE5XAG.txt )

17:46:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9975 @ 0.00038192 = 3.8097 BTC [-] {2}

17:49:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13645 @ 0.0003815 = 5.2056 BTC [-]

17:53:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6055 @ 0.00036844 = 2.2309 BTC [-]

17:59:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10431 @ 0.00036356 = 3.7923 BTC [-]

18:09:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13472 @ 0.00038708 = 5.2147 BTC [+]

18:23:39 thestringpuller: http://i.imgur.com/koR75BV.png << what a great typo

18:25:16 adlai: it ain't a cryptoparty if nobody's having fundation

18:31:00 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17700 @ 0.00036751 = 6.5049 BTC [-] {2}

18:44:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7921 @ 0.00037571 = 2.976 BTC [+] {2}

18:45:41 danielpbarron: !up coalbe

18:50:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17950 @ 0.00037611 = 6.7512 BTC [+] {3}

18:50:45 ben_vulpes: !rate coalbe 1 really bad puns

18:50:45 assbot: coalbe is not registered in WoT.

18:50:49 ben_vulpes: coalbe!

18:50:58 ben_vulpes: !h

18:50:58 assbot: http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot

18:51:00 coalbe: :shrug:

18:58:27 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5950 @ 0.00039053 = 2.3237 BTC [+]

19:06:37 ben_vulpes: !gettrust coalbe

19:06:38 assbot: Trust relationship from user ben_vulpes to user coalbe: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/ben_vulpes/coalbe | http://w.b-a.link/user/coalbe

19:06:50 ben_vulpes: !rate coalbe 1 bad puns

19:06:50 assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/e5c6ca4dfbaf370b

19:07:21 ben_vulpes: !v assbot:ben_vulpes.rate.coalbe.1:7963e8bebaef17f239758f67e4784ead88f565b669ba7319af114b55def5638b

19:07:21 assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for coalbe with note: bad puns

19:07:30 ben_vulpes: !down coalbe

19:07:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7750 @ 0.00040228 = 3.1177 BTC [+]

19:07:43 ben_vulpes: now pm assbot thusly: /msg assbot !up

19:08:37 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14394 @ 0.00040129 = 5.7762 BTC [-]

19:09:38 lobbes: !rate BingoBoingo 1 Helped me publish my first qntra article; all-around cool guy

19:09:38 assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/20dfcdc3899a0cc0

19:10:28 lobbes: !v assbot:lobbes.rate.BingoBoingo.1:dddea0c2eacbe967fa5d475c36c3906904f651d7d5baba3f4a06f5eefe7eefa

19:10:28 assbot: Invalid verfication string.

19:11:23 mike_c: looks like you are 1 character short.

19:11:34 mike_c: or a scamzor.

19:11:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14525 @ 0.00036342 = 5.2787 BTC [-] {2}

19:12:01 lobbes: mike_c: you have better eyes than I

19:14:43 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 26 @ 0.04 = 1.04 BTC [-] {2}

19:16:58 *: asciilifeform replaced a ~15 year old fan

19:22:41 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: you must take good care of your things

19:22:55 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: esp. since this was the master ups

19:23:08 asciilifeform: it was getting to the point that i could hear it in other rooms

19:23:25 asciilifeform: (it's a 'double-conversion' monster that runs inverter 100% of the time)

19:24:46 BingoBoingo: Oh, I though maybe this was the sort of fan you replace for insufficient adoration

19:25:14 asciilifeform: l0l

19:25:46 asciilifeform: this was the useful kind.

19:26:02 asciilifeform: that blows.

19:26:37 BingoBoingo: Sometimes other kinds blows as well.

19:26:57 asciilifeform: put a 'pabst' fluid bearing 80mm in there. golden toilet, should last.

19:27:16 cazalla: DigitalCurrency (@DCCCertified) favorited one of your Tweets! <<< bwahaha they don't even follow the links to see what it is, just fav away for tities lol

19:27:37 thestringpuller: cazalla: thousand fly eyes

19:27:43 cazalla: and fuck, i wish it was summer, first week of autumn and the mornings are already cold and dark

19:27:56 asciilifeform: (tip: if anyone else has a 'liebert' ups, and replacing fan, don't throw out old one. you will need to snip&solder the connector.)

19:28:23 thestringpuller: BingoBoingo: you have given me imagery of asciilifeform having a "posse". asciilifeform: "Why are you people following me?" Member of posse: "Oh, we're you're crew. We follow you everywhere."

19:31:53 kakobrekla: tip: if you need a quiet fan, get one 'be quiet' makes

19:32:00 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21532 @ 0.0003621 = 7.7967 BTC [-] {3}

19:32:26 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: iirc, there's exactly one producer of fluid bearings, and everybody else gets them

19:32:33 asciilifeform: some ancient subdivision of sony, iirc

19:32:50 asciilifeform: (fluid bearings used in fans, that is)

19:33:05 kakobrekla: i dont know from the top of my head which one bq uses but i bought 50 high end fans a year+ ago and tested them all

19:33:15 kakobrekla: still got a crate of 'bad' ones.

19:33:20 asciilifeform: 50 of same airflow, measured ?

19:33:31 asciilifeform: because otherwise you're comparing bulldog and rhinoceros

19:34:00 kakobrekla: i was testing for low rpm quietness where noise from bearings is the problem, noting else

19:34:02 asciilifeform: or were you doing a cubometres/decibel thing

19:34:05 *: kakobrekla runs fans at 200rpm

19:34:06 BingoBoingo: Perfectly good occasions exist to compare bulldog and rhinoceros

19:38:57 kakobrekla: checked: "fluid-dynamic bearing with copper core (300.000 operating hours)"

19:39:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6400 @ 0.00038662 = 2.4744 BTC [+]

19:39:23 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: aha, it

19:40:01 asciilifeform: circulating oil in manifold made from sintered cu

19:40:10 kakobrekla: yeah these are great.

19:40:26 asciilifeform: love'em, got at least 7 in just this room

19:41:03 kakobrekla: but then second problem is running them slow enough - which only bq did as far as my tests went

19:41:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7100 @ 0.00038662 = 2.745 BTC [+]

19:41:31 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: can always solder a controller inline with the cord

19:41:46 kakobrekla: thats not the problem

19:41:58 kakobrekla: but the fans have a minimum speed at which they will actually turn

19:42:09 asciilifeform: aha

19:42:14 kakobrekla: pwm fans have this hardcoded so to speak

19:42:17 asciilifeform: you found ones where this was below 200 ?

19:42:26 asciilifeform: or rather, above

19:43:37 kakobrekla: most of them have min way above 200

19:44:25 kakobrekla: most common seems to be around 500 or 600 rpm

19:44:39 kakobrekla: some even higher.

19:46:13 kakobrekla: heres a few of the more interesting pwm ones; http://shrani.si/f/3M/2d/4N2Jzpz2/profiles.png

19:46:15 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1BUCaLP )

19:46:28 kakobrekla: you dont actually see noise here

19:46:35 kakobrekla: but the working curve

19:47:51 asciilifeform: 'power %' << duty cycle ?

19:49:01 kakobrekla: iirc that particular shot is pwm controlled

19:49:20 asciilifeform: incidentally, whatever happened to electrodynamic fans ?

19:49:32 asciilifeform: the kind without moving parts

19:49:34 kakobrekla: http://shrani.si/f/3m/fc/18a8bPy7/1/noctua-nf-p12-both.png

19:49:35 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1M9MJKq )

19:49:41 kakobrekla: here is same fan pwm vs voltage

19:49:50 kakobrekla: pwm on right.

19:50:02 kakobrekla: but not the one i use.

19:51:37 asciilifeform: http://www.inventgeek.com/ionic-wind-pc-cooling << ancient article, re: make your own

19:51:38 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1M9MZci )

19:51:53 asciilifeform: doubles as air filter.

19:53:07 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: ^ definitely no bearing noise. no bearing, no motor...

19:53:14 kakobrekla: hm

19:54:15 kakobrekla: i had one of such 'ionization' clean air gadgets running for some time some years ago

19:54:22 kakobrekla: it made the wall around it all back.

19:54:33 asciilifeform: when configured as 'air cleaner' they tend to piss out ozone

19:54:42 asciilifeform: and yes, make dust stick in random place

19:54:45 kakobrekla: yeah not cool at all.

19:55:05 asciilifeform: but in the shape pictured, the output mesh is grounded

19:55:40 *: asciilifeform has not tried the recipe, but invites anyone who has, to post.

19:56:16 asciilifeform: btw if the wall was black, it was working

19:56:24 kakobrekla: aha.

19:56:37 kakobrekla: still is black :D

19:56:57 asciilifeform: whole point of electrostatic cleaner is to make dust stick to things (in a well-constructed one, the 'thing' is the filter inside)

19:57:53 kakobrekla: but dunno how wanted ozone really is

19:58:00 asciilifeform: generally not very

19:58:27 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00038662 = 3.6729 BTC [+]

20:03:46 BingoBoingo: at least ozone smells good

20:04:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4500 @ 0.00038886 = 1.7499 BTC [+]

20:09:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00039363 = 4.5661 BTC [+] {2}

20:19:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9662 @ 0.00039964 = 3.8613 BTC [+]

20:26:18 jurov: not very healthy for breathing

20:30:20 BingoBoingo: Well, not if you get to much. What harm can the occasional whiff of it do?

20:30:39 jurov: we were talking about kako's ozone generator

20:30:56 jurov: running (presumably) all day

20:30:58 jurov: http://www.epa.gov/iaq/pubs/ozonegen.html

20:30:59 assbot: Ozone Generators that are Sold as Air Cleaners | Indoor Air | US Environmental Protection Agency ... ( http://bit.ly/18mqbsC )

20:31:21 punkman: ozone helps kill odours, so "cleaner" air

20:32:25 jurov: ^ as per above, it does not affect organic molecules. just numbs the smell cells, I guess.

20:33:25 BingoBoingo: Ah

20:36:23 punkman: jurov, ah good to know

20:45:47 BingoBoingo: !up GrandHierophant

20:46:06 cazalla: !up sjsqd

20:46:31 GrandHierophant: !down

20:46:40 GrandHierophant: !down GrandHierophant

20:47:19 punkman: !up GrandHierophant

20:51:19 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 3384 @ 0.012 = 40.608 BTC [+]

20:53:13 jurov: wtf GrandHierophant

20:54:17 scoopbot: New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/14-bidders-34-bids-in-latest-usms-bitcoin-auction/

20:55:05 asciilifeform: cazalla: typo: ullbricht

20:55:12 GrandHierophant: what jurov

20:55:27 asciilifeform: ulbricht rather

20:55:32 cazalla: asciilifeform, it's early :\

20:57:01 asciilifeform: https://www.emptywheel.net/2015/03/02/the-jihadi-john-cover-story << mega-l0l

20:57:06 assbot: The Jihadi John Cover Story | emptywheel ... ( http://bit.ly/1aNPDsW )

20:58:15 asciilifeform: 'British intelligence sources are now claiming that the SIGINT hunt for Emwazi preceded the HUMINT one, and also claiming that a SIGINT clue ? and the related SIGINT trail that clue uncovered ? provided the breakthrough in IDing him. Which is almost certainly bullshit. But notable bullshit, for two reasons. First, because the current story ? that the UK lost Emwazi ? poses really big problems for the dragnet. Because i

20:58:15 asciilifeform: f someone like Emwazi, whom MI5 had been chasing for years, can simply disappear, only to reappear as the man beheading western journalists (though technically, the videos never show him doing so), then it suggests the entire dragnet is least effective when it is most needed. The Express? ill-defined sources appear to want to tell a story about SIGINT succeeded rather then explain how it is that SIGINT failed (at least accor

20:58:15 asciilifeform: ding to the story getting told publicly).'

21:00:53 mike_c: i don't quite get this theory that they aren't actually selling the coins.

21:01:00 thestringpuller: RENT is goin hard. Biggest trade I've seen yet.

21:01:10 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo, others: http://www.governmentattic.org/14docs/USNORTHCOM-CONPLAN3502.pdf << gasenwagen

21:01:11 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1aNQqtK )

21:01:23 thestringpuller: mike_c: they don't sell coins. they make you think they are selling coins.

21:01:23 mike_c: There isn't much doubt that they took ulbricht's coins, right?

21:01:28 asciilifeform: (^ very short letter, foia denial)

21:02:00 mike_c: i understand the theory :) I don't get the basis.

21:02:01 thestringpuller: winning bidder says, "Oh i received coins." with gun at head in background from USG suit and tie

21:02:20 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: afaik the only source of this hypothesis is mircea_popescu, who presumably has a clue, but understandably won't reveal source of said clue

21:02:53 thestringpuller: mike_c: price suppression is basis, but maybe there is more strategy to it?

21:02:54 mike_c: seems there ought to be some reasonable blockchain evidence one way or the other. don't we know the ulbricht address in question?

21:03:13 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: "Oh i received coins." with gun at head... << it isn't clear why this would lead to price drops at public exchanges, unless anticipatory sell-offs (which would be brief)

21:03:15 mike_c: price suppression doesn't mean they are selling fake coins, it would be the same if they were selling real coins.

21:04:00 mike_c: asciilifeform: the price suppression comes because when someone wants x thousand coins they have this avenue. where otherwise they would be harder/more expensive to obtain.

21:04:36 asciilifeform: mike_c: i still don't get why somebody buying a parcel of $maxint btc would affect the price on, e.g., 'btc-e'

21:04:42 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: given the FDIC-like insurance scheme enemy is planning, i would think it probably there is some ability to forcefully liquidate funds against trader's wills (at least smaller ones)

21:04:43 asciilifeform: if it doesn't happen there

21:05:55 mike_c: the auctions are siphoning off demand that could otherwise show up on some exchange. and while the exchanges don't move in perfect tandem, they do move close unless something is wrong.

21:06:43 asciilifeform: only siphons off demand unless, e.g., draper, was actually going to buy at public exchanges and then didn't

21:07:00 asciilifeform: this would result in exchange rate failing to to climb, but how would it lead to a drop ?

21:07:14 asciilifeform: *siphons off demand if

21:09:50 mike_c: the price drops as supply exceeds demand (in a macro sense). if you believe that draper, silbert, etc. represented demand, and that the demand would have eventually made its way to the exchanges even if not directly

21:10:33 mike_c: then the absence of that demand would suppress the price. whether this leads to flat, falling, or only "not rising as much" price

21:10:39 asciilifeform: price drops as supply exceeds demand << this is like finding a corpse and declaring 'he died from not breathing'

21:10:55 mike_c: depends on how much other demand there is

21:10:56 asciilifeform: yes, it's rather obvious, but interested in mechanics

21:11:41 danielpbarron: aren't there 3.6k coins found every day that need to find a new home or else a miner can't pay his electricity bill?

21:12:10 mike_c: that depends on who you ask. some will say that miners mine specifically to get nice clean coins and aren't selling to pay bills.

21:12:43 asciilifeform: ^ that was my theory (though quite likely it's a formula obvious to many folks)

21:12:46 danielpbarron: what is a clean coin? i thought there is no taint in bitcoin

21:12:50 mike_c: others say that the big miners don't have to worry about paying electricity bills..

21:13:17 mike_c: as has been more or less proven in here before, the big miners aren't buying KNC/bitmain/whoever rigs.

21:13:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10500 @ 0.00038968 = 4.0916 BTC [-] {2}

21:14:22 BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats

21:14:26 gribble: Current Blocks: 346316 | Current Difficulty: 4.668437631686029E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 346751 | Next Difficulty In: 435 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 13 hours, 34 minutes, and 25 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 47085869256.4 | Estimated Percent Change: 0.86002

21:14:28 asciilifeform: afaik nothing whatsoever is publicly known about the 'big miners' other than approximate hash output.

21:15:04 mike_c: "nothing whatsoever". If hash power goes up by an order of magnitude more than the output of the minig rig manufacturers, something is known.

21:15:12 asciilifeform: other than this.

21:15:30 asciilifeform: alternatively, the output figures are bullshit

21:15:50 mike_c: like KNC is underreporting their sales?

21:16:02 asciilifeform: and one or more quietly produced a great many units which do not publicly exist except for their hash

21:25:15 asciilifeform: ;;ticker

21:25:17 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 270.25, Best ask: 270.46, Bid-ask spread: 0.21000, Last trade: 270.47, 24 hour volume: 55311.03169349, 24 hour low: 262.0, 24 hour high: 275.0, 24 hour vwap: None

21:25:45 asciilifeform: ;;calc 270.25 * 3600

21:25:47 gribble: 972900

21:26:07 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: aren't there 3.6k coins found every day that need to find a new home or else a miner can't pay his electricity bill << ^ quite a bill

21:29:32 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: what is a clean coin? i thought there is no taint in bitcoin << but there is in fiat.

21:29:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13350 @ 0.00038793 = 5.1789 BTC [-]

21:30:11 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: for an american gasenwagen, it is theoretically enough that you moved $int from your bank account to a known btc exchange at some point

21:30:16 danielpbarron: well they aren't paying their electric bills directly in bitcoin.. yet

21:30:37 asciilifeform: where the coins are, the victim will reveal himself when the soldering iron warms up

21:34:06 thestringpuller: moar alf poetry

21:34:16 thestringpuller: the book of alf

21:34:17 jurov: felipelalli: About coinbr.com, what happens if my account stay negative "forever"? << eventually coinbr will ask you to cover the unpaid fees, otherwise some assets get liquidated in, say, 12 months

21:34:39 jurov: i could not be arsed to do it yet

21:37:39 felipelalli: Thank you jurov! :) So, the only way to "pause" the fees when our account is kind of inactive is selling all assets and removing the account? Is it possible to remove an account and keep the assets?

21:38:14 asciilifeform: felipelalli: Is it possible to remove an account and keep the assets << if you bought an mpex account...

21:38:32 felipelalli: asciilifeform: I'd imagine that. :(

21:38:33 mike_c: ;;calc 0.19 * 12 * [ticker --last]

21:38:35 gribble: 636.1428

21:38:37 thestringpuller: mpex account is actually much more expensive than coinbr

21:38:40 mike_c: ;;calc 0.019 * 12 * [ticker --last]

21:38:41 gribble: 63.61428

21:38:43 asciilifeform: naturally

21:38:47 thestringpuller: ;;calc 30 / 0.019

21:38:48 gribble: 1578.94736842

21:38:57 thestringpuller: ;;calc 1578.94 / 12

21:38:57 gribble: 131.578333333

21:39:01 jurov: are these bitcents really such a problem?

21:39:07 thestringpuller: ^- the years it would take to pay off mpex account

21:39:10 thestringpuller: on coinbr

21:39:16 thestringpuller: coinbr is remarkable deal

21:39:17 asciilifeform: jurov: they sure are for me, for example

21:39:38 asciilifeform: it means that the machine isn't fire&forget

21:39:45 asciilifeform: and you have to somehow come up with new btc once in a while

21:39:54 felipelalli: So, it is fun to play in MPEx and CoinBR only if you are really rich! :) Not my case right now, yet.

21:40:01 mike_c: $5 / month is rich?

21:40:08 asciilifeform: felipelalli: congrats on coming to this conclusion quickly and painlessly

21:40:19 asciilifeform: mike_c: yes, rich, if it's 5 in plutonium

21:40:25 jurov: not yet. unpaid fees just accumulate, not even that if you get any dividends

21:40:28 felipelalli: well, if I buy like $10 in assets, if I pay $5 / month I am making a bad deal, right?

21:40:35 mike_c: yes

21:40:49 danielpbarron: lol @ $10 in assets

21:41:12 jurov: it's what you do with fiat assets? to ask broker to manage $10 woth of them?

21:41:17 jurov: *worth

21:41:23 *: asciilifeform doesn't have broker either

21:41:23 thestringpuller: LOL $10 in assets

21:41:24 felipelalli: well! That's why I am saying I cannot play yet! :) I'm investing hard in my business, I can't invest hard in MPEx assets yet right now.

21:41:37 thestringpuller: felipelalli: you're missing out

21:41:58 danielpbarron: you can always make a bitbet bet

21:42:00 thestringpuller: also mpex is probably safest place to store bitcoin

21:42:19 asciilifeform: ^ i never grokked this argument

21:42:26 thestringpuller: ???

21:42:28 asciilifeform: in either case, lose your key, lose the coin

21:42:32 asciilifeform: (which is as it ought to be)

21:42:32 thestringpuller: oh

21:42:44 jurov: anyway i plan the possiblity to loan everything to coinbr, with dividend payments directly to your address

21:42:57 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: well I keep my private key in a back up in a tube up my but

21:42:59 thestringpuller: t

21:43:04 jurov: no fees, but your assets would be available only 30 days after calling or so

21:43:19 jurov: similar like i do for qntra people

21:43:38 jurov: who haven't asked me otherwise

21:44:19 felipelalli: jurov: like a "pause"?

21:44:55 jurov: you can see it as pause

21:44:57 jurov: yes

21:45:19 felipelalli: that would be great. But $5 / mo worth it, I thought it was more expensive, don't know why. I'll continue to pay that even without big investments yet.

21:45:34 *: BingoBoingo doesn't see why jurov shouldn't get paid for "fire and forget" Could be a one time fee much larger than the monthly fee.

21:46:11 mike_c: it *is* fire and forget. he doesn't liquidate you if you have unpaid fees

21:46:15 felipelalli: jurov: maybe a year plan would be nice as well.

21:46:17 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: that would be essentially reselling mpex account at cost, no ?

21:46:59 felipelalli: mike_c: yes. now I think jurov is too much nice. :D

21:47:05 danielpbarron: i'd hate to see things get too user friendly up in here :p

21:47:42 jurov: don't worry, when i finally implement these loans, i'll start nagging

21:47:47 danielpbarron: or else every "homo reddicus" with $10 will end up spamming the orderbook

21:48:29 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Or simply selling access to his proxy for a fixed price option. Maybe in the range of 5-20% of what the mpex account costs, so still an intege BTC price in this hypothetical.

21:48:43 felipelalli: jurov: chasing bad payers? lol

21:48:55 jurov: and it isn't a big sum anyway

21:49:02 jurov: felipelalli: but really, you'd give up your ability to trade online for such "free account"?

21:49:23 felipelalli: danielpbarron: it isn't $ 10, it was just an exaggeration. I guess I have more than $ 100 there.

21:49:29 jurov: you're ok with 30day delay?

21:49:52 mike_c: coinbr glacier :)

21:50:01 jurov: haha

21:50:24 felipelalli: jurov: the point is that I don't want to "trade online", I don't have time for that. I just want to buy MPEx or QNTRA for example and let there, sleeping.

21:50:45 felipelalli: jurov: I'm OK with 60 or 90 days delay.

21:51:01 jurov: orly. even better for me.

21:51:21 thestringpuller: cause he can lend your shares without your permission

21:51:22 thestringpuller: jkjk

21:51:43 jurov: thestringpuller that's exactly what i do have in mind

21:51:59 felipelalli: aahahah, I allow. He can make fractional reserve. If this pay my fee.

21:52:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.00039 = 2.34 BTC [+] {2}

21:53:20 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 100 @ 0.03833099 = 3.8331 BTC [-] {6}

21:57:27 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: if homo redditicus were only a problem because 'spamming the orderbook', that would be another thing. a bot could theoretically 'vacuum up the chump money' and that's that. But - they, as i understand, spam support lines, public fora, and overall poison the atmosphere in ways not outweighed by the pennies they bring in

21:58:28 asciilifeform: (n00bs can read my original article reviewing mpex, containing summary of mircea_popescu's material on above subject - http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1108 )

21:58:30 assbot: Loper OS » A Review of MPEx, the Bitcoin Stock Exchange. ... ( http://bit.ly/1BMeIPc )

21:58:58 *: danielpbarron nods

21:59:01 mike_c: that's the point of coinbr though. they pay jurov for the right to harrass him

21:59:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14200 @ 0.00038225 = 5.428 BTC [-]

21:59:45 mike_c: people call charles schwab, not NYSE, when they have a problem.

22:00:27 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 325 @ 0.0125 = 4.0625 BTC [+] {2}

22:00:28 asciilifeform: i kinda wonder why poor folks are even interested in mpex (or, for that matter, schwab)

22:00:58 mike_c: same reason as havelock. buy a few shares and you feel a part of something big.

22:01:09 asciilifeform: mike_c: religion? ok

22:01:24 BingoBoingo: !b 2

22:01:24 assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0BBSCR8.txt )

22:01:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15463 @ 0.00038225 = 5.9107 BTC [-]

22:02:02 asciilifeform: (i, for instance, wasn't interested at all until invited to write a review, using free demo. which i did. and in the course of said demo, realized that i've not particularly much to -do- with such a thing, on account of having approximately no coin)

22:02:33 asciilifeform: because i don't so much go in for religion

22:03:55 asciilifeform: if you have hundreds, thousands of coin - yes, it is very interesting

22:04:55 danielpbarron: it can be interesting with as little as .. 5 .. 10 coins

22:05:09 asciilifeform: not if your time is worth anything

22:05:38 mike_c: some people enjoy it

22:05:59 asciilifeform: hard to argue with that. there are 'some people' who enjoy just about anything.

22:06:11 mike_c: yeah, some like ada :D

22:06:41 *: asciilifeform is at this moment actively unenjoying the ada

22:06:46 mike_c: there's nothing wrong with taking a few btc and playing around on coinbr as a way to learn more about btc finance world.

22:06:56 asciilifeform: sure

22:07:01 asciilifeform: as amusement park - works.

22:07:20 danielpbarron: asciilifeform's got a good point though, with such little amounts you aren't going to move the market -- might as well just pretend trade in a txt file

22:07:31 asciilifeform: ^ precisely

22:07:42 asciilifeform: i can - and do - play this game privately on occasion

22:07:43 mike_c: if you have 3 btc, and you just doubled it to 6 in the recent qntra surge, you probably are quite happy with yourself.

22:07:48 asciilifeform: without paying anyone anything

22:08:08 asciilifeform: mike_c: for folks who like to gamble - straight to the dice games

22:08:25 ben_vulpes: "but trading isn't gamblinggggg!"

22:08:28 mike_c: why not gamble on a +EV game?

22:08:39 asciilifeform: for folks who can reliably turn x into 2x - they already have mpex accounts, aren't reading this

22:09:05 ben_vulpes: and how'd you know that, asciilifeform?

22:09:14 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: conjecture.

22:09:31 mike_c: maybe they not only are reading this, they are writing it! :)

22:09:58 mike_c: in reality, nobody can reliably turn x into 2x.

22:10:06 mike_c: at least not more than a couple time

22:10:23 asciilifeform: incidentally, anyone ever try the exercise of writing a 'pefect knowledge' bot that tells you 'what could have been' ?

22:10:44 asciilifeform: as in, the maximum one could have hoped to earn on coinbr in a particular time interval starting with x btc

22:10:56 asciilifeform: (this is actually np-complete, but one can find approximations)

22:11:32 mike_c: this requires non-public knowledge

22:11:38 asciilifeform: how?

22:11:41 mike_c: like what the order book looked like across time

22:11:43 asciilifeform: we're talking about historical data

22:11:59 asciilifeform: mike_c: technically yes

22:12:10 asciilifeform: but again can approximate, roughly, solely with price history, no ?

22:12:30 asciilifeform: folks with a clue - comment, would the result have any useful connection with reality ?

22:12:34 mike_c: depends on liquidity.. maybe for mpoe. even there, not really

22:12:49 mike_c: well, I not only have a clue, i have the order book history :)

22:12:55 asciilifeform: for small enough x, market has full depth at all times, no?

22:13:44 asciilifeform: is depth really a concern for infinitesimal working sum ?

22:14:08 mike_c: infinitesimal, no. but then you're 'perfect knowledge' bot isn't going to make so much anyway

22:14:24 asciilifeform: mike_c: it will give you an x and x', where x' > x

22:14:45 mike_c: mm, not quite. because order book could have been better than price history at times

22:15:15 mike_c: bid climbs up, then down, then sale happens. if you had sold at higher bid you would have done better than 'perfect info' bot

22:15:19 asciilifeform: understand, interested here in 'theoretical best' of what a smart person with almost no funding could achieve

22:15:35 asciilifeform: you would have done better than 'perfect info' bot << impossible by definition

22:15:49 asciilifeform: 'perfect info bot' is this abstract thing. a god.

22:16:01 mike_c: ok, but that's what i'm saying. the god needs non-public info

22:16:37 asciilifeform: even for determining what x' is for x=0.01 btc ?

22:17:28 *: asciilifeform can already picture how - if the 0.01 were enough to 'move between equivalence classes' in the orderbook

22:17:50 *: jurov rolls eyes

22:18:03 mike_c: i'll leave it at this - you will come up with a number that is just as useful with public info as you would with non-public info.

22:18:05 jurov: bitbet is certain to make 7% dividend next month

22:18:16 jurov: to buy it does not need any perfect bot

22:18:26 jurov: but nobody does

22:18:33 mike_c: bitbet dividend = rand()

22:18:36 asciilifeform: i merely suspect that no one, not even a god, could 'get rich' at 'investing' pocket change at mpex

22:18:42 danielpbarron: lol mike_c

22:18:48 jurov: mike_c: have you read the last report?

22:18:49 danielpbarron: sure feels that way

22:19:05 jurov: so, nobody even reads the fkn reports

22:19:07 mike_c: jurov: just a poke at the frequency of dividend mistakes on that asset :)

22:19:08 asciilifeform: (unless someone noticed that he's a god, and gave him a bag of coin for lulz. but that's outside the rules of the gedankenexperiment!)

22:19:12 jurov: and they want to have" perfect bots"

22:20:16 asciilifeform: (unlike 'redditicus' the impossibility doesn't irritate me in the slightest, i have other things in life to play with)

22:22:15 asciilifeform: jurov: bitbet is certain to make 7% dividend next month.. to buy it does not need any perfect bot.. but nobody does << this is because time is worth something

22:22:42 mike_c: well, plus he is incorrect. monthly volume is over 1% of total shares.

22:22:43 asciilifeform: calculate, how much coin would i need to have on hand for it to be worth the effort in getting a coinbr account and making the gears go correctly

22:23:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.BBET] 8051 @ 0.00018861 = 1.5185 BTC [+] {5}

22:24:00 jurov: well. avg s.mpoe dividend is about 100 satoshi

22:24:01 ben_vulpes: more effective to not do it and just buy btc.

22:24:29 jurov: ;;calc 0.2*100000000/100

22:24:30 gribble: 200000

22:24:54 jurov: damn

22:24:56 jurov: ;;calc 0.02*100000000/100

22:24:57 gribble: 20000

22:25:06 jurov: ^ this many shares you need to stay even

22:25:25 jurov: ;;calc 20000* 0.0004

22:25:25 gribble: 8

22:25:27 asciilifeform: there we go.

22:25:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2620 @ 0.00038225 = 1.0015 BTC [-]

22:26:06 asciilifeform: 'The Third Rock From The Sun can hold an atmosphere and your piece of cosmic flotsam can?t.' (from my article)

22:26:31 asciilifeform: gravity works this way, and so do other things.

22:27:16 jurov: nad you'd be fine with 90day delay to access them, too?

22:27:19 jurov: *and

22:27:39 asciilifeform: jurov: nope. i'm not the least bit interested in low-frequency trading

22:27:51 asciilifeform: takes away what little point there is, no?

22:27:58 jurov: and what you are interested in?

22:28:06 asciilifeform: escape rocket

22:28:25 asciilifeform: (but i know that it isn't happening with trading, because i'm not an idiot, so i don't trade)

22:28:32 jurov: well, that's not my business

22:28:46 asciilifeform: didn't mean to imply that it was.

22:29:32 asciilifeform: or that jurov's gizmo doesn't function exactly as printed on crate.

22:30:15 jurov: can you pls explain the issue?

22:30:48 asciilifeform: no issue, just the fact that i personally don't have any jobs for which coinbr is the right tool

22:30:57 asciilifeform: the folks subscribing - presumably have reasons

22:31:06 asciilifeform: i just cannot know what they are.

22:31:36 []bot: Bet placed: 1.5 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 20(Y):80(N) by coin, 19(Y):81(N) by weight. Total bet: 84.8305122 BTC. Current weight: 72,110.

22:31:38 []bot: Bet placed: 2 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before April" http://bitbet.us/bet/1123/ Odds: 9(Y):91(N) by coin, 10(Y):90(N) by weight. Total bet: 28.65000237 BTC. Current weight: 68,632.

22:35:47 jurov: *stunned silence*

22:36:47 jurov: i'm trying to make do under some constraints, which i explained several time here

22:36:53 jurov: *times

22:37:18 asciilifeform: i think i understand how coinbr works, and why

22:37:34 asciilifeform: but i don't know who the users are and what motivates them

22:37:51 jurov: having thousands of chumps pounding on on mpex accounts is just unthinkable, hence the fees.

22:37:58 jurov: *on one mpex account

22:37:58 adlai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1043338 << it is when your strategy works mostly based on depth

22:37:58 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 22:13:44; asciilifeform: is depth really a concern for infinitesimal working sum ?

22:37:58 asciilifeform: aha

22:39:20 *: adlai not sure if he counts as a 'folks with a clue'

22:39:36 asciilifeform: jurov: would you say that the 'thousands of chumps' are using your gizmo instead ?

22:39:52 *: asciilifeform has no idea re: coinbr user stats

22:40:06 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6119 @ 0.00038007 = 2.3256 BTC [-] {2}

22:41:15 jurov: they could be using my gizmo only if it worked as boiler room

22:41:16 *: adlai notes to self to offer asciilifeform a seat on the escape rocket, should the clue ever be proven

22:42:07 asciilifeform: jurov: i think i get what you mean

22:42:26 adlai: specifically, scalpl's purpose is to produce the fastest possible escape rocket for a given (parametrizable) risk tolerance; once that technology is in place, it's just a matter of finding a market for which the maximum speed at your risk tolerance exceeds escape velocity

22:43:34 asciilifeform: adlai: see earlier discussion about what 'carnot efficiency', if you'll allow the analogy, is for scalpl (or any similar machine)

22:43:45 adlai: !s carnot from:asciilifeform

22:43:45 assbot: 4 results for 'carnot from:asciilifeform' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=carnot+from%3Aasciilifeform

22:43:52 asciilifeform: not mentioned by name earlier

22:44:04 asciilifeform: but trying to compare to the well-known thermodynamic optimum for an engine

22:44:28 asciilifeform: adlai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1043325 << thread starting here

22:44:28 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 22:10:23; asciilifeform: incidentally, anyone ever try the exercise of writing a 'pefect knowledge' bot that tells you 'what could have been' ?

22:44:58 adlai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1043164 << coins have moved on the blockchain, although it's trivial to fake this - if you control the coins.

22:44:58 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 21:02:54; mike_c: seems there ought to be some reasonable blockchain evidence one way or the other. don't we know the ulbricht address in question?

22:45:06 jurov: (parametrizable) risk tolerance << and this is solved problem in finance?

22:45:28 adlai: nope, but it's a problem that individuals can tackle for themselves

22:46:03 asciilifeform: it's simply an elementary fact that you can't +ev your way 'from rags to riches' unless you know something other folks don't

22:48:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.BBET] 8000 @ 0.00018125 = 1.45 BTC [+] {2}

22:49:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2683 @ 0.0003914 = 1.0501 BTC [+]

22:49:20 adlai: the 'perfect knowledge' bot - are you using the word 'perfect' to suggest that it knows what _will_ happen?

22:49:38 adlai: because that is pure masturbation

22:51:18 adlai: there's a lot of interesting knowledge in the distribution of expected liquidity events given all other data on the market, but it's far from 'perfect', because it gives you, at best, a precisely calculated distribution of 'past performance'

22:52:44 asciilifeform: adlai: yes, 'knows what will'

22:52:49 asciilifeform: adlai: and no, not pure masturbation

22:52:52 asciilifeform: any more than carnot cycle is

22:53:33 asciilifeform: it tells you (or would, if could be written, but the most you can hope for is an approximation, as the problem - even with all the necessary data - is np-complete) the theoretical maximum that could have been achieved

22:53:39 asciilifeform: against which to measure the actuality.

22:54:02 asciilifeform: sorta like the 'x % kills' (what fraction of the monsters you dealt with) shown at the end of a 'doom' level

22:55:10 punkman: I don't think carnot cycle is a good analogy here

22:56:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12500 @ 0.00037559 = 4.6949 BTC [-] {2}

23:00:34 []bot: Bet placed: 5 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 19(Y):81(N) by coin, 18(Y):82(N) by weight. Total bet: 89.8305122 BTC. Current weight: 72,075.

23:00:51 adlai: calling this 'np-complete' is like calling ftl drive research 'expensive'

23:01:33 adlai: the information isn't just hard to attain, it doesn't exist

23:02:35 adlai: "market will go up" is different from "joe impulse trader will press the button once he sees N flashing numbers", and 'perfect information' requires the latter, which is for all practical purposes, random

23:03:37 adlai: more personally, if perfect information exists, scalpl is truly a wild goose chase; i'm betting my time on perfect information not existing, and there being room for patience to profit off information fuzzyness

23:08:29 adlai: gathering and interpreting actual information is a totally different story, and there's a huge amount of information that most/all human traders totally *ignore*, and that's as mike_c said - past order book movements

23:13:57 thestringpuller: !gettrust friedcat

23:13:57 assbot: friedcat is not registered in WoT.

23:14:25 *: adlai is not surprised

23:15:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9336 @ 0.00038768 = 3.6194 BTC [+] {2}

23:15:42 adlai: asciilifeform: 'x % kills' << this would be a totally meaningless epsilon for any 'perfect information bot' that actually acts on that information

23:27:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11300 @ 0.00039239 = 4.434 BTC [+] {2}

23:28:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22100 @ 0.00040062 = 8.8537 BTC [+] {3}

23:29:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6550 @ 0.00040226 = 2.6348 BTC [+]

23:45:52 cazalla: look like indiana jones' number might be up

23:46:31 cazalla: or han solo depending on your preference

23:51:01 mircea_popescu: what's that mean ?

23:51:35 BingoBoingo: Oh, is Harrison Ford kicking the bucket soon?

23:51:54 cazalla: i hate to link to it, but.. http://www.tmz.com/2015/03/05/harrison-ford-plane-crash-landing-golf-course-santa-monica/

23:51:56 assbot: Harrison Ford -- Plane Crashes ... Actor Seriously Injured | TMZ.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1aOovK8 )

23:52:29 mircea_popescu: o.O

23:52:41 mircea_popescu: cessna nailgun

23:55:13 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1042949 ehehehe

23:55:13 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 11:47:57; assbot: Russian Lawmaker: Bitcoin is a CIA Conspiracy ... ( http://bit.ly/1Fd7rXE )

23:55:22 mircea_popescu: who is this, zhirinovsky ?

23:56:03 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1042955 << their argument rests on some random schmuck who went in the field to "Study" it, introduced some seeds, claimed to have discovered the resulting plants and woe and behold, a redditard mattered!

23:56:03 assbot: Logged on 05-03-2015 12:47:00; punkman: flooding a nice forest probably not the best idea, but their argument rests on lousewort?!

23:56:12 mircea_popescu: i think it's unseemly that they should be further encouraged.

23:56:35 mircea_popescu: the sooner they lose all hope the sooner their children can begin tearing up redditardamerica and building a livable space north of rio grande.

23:57:24 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu aha you're quite right about the scytales. a variable diameter stick is really a fascinating way of graphing cryptographic curves.

23:58:15 mircea_popescu: yup

23:58:29 mircea_popescu: greeks, way ahead of romans and their spawn ONCE AGAIN

23:58:39 mircea_popescu: they had the atomic theory, they had the steam engine, they had the works.

23:59:12 pete_dushenski: atomic theory i knew, but steam engine ?!

23:59:35 mircea_popescu: yup

23:59:36 pete_dushenski: and the romans were empire builders, not philosophers

23:59:59 mircea_popescu: look into hero of alexandria

23:59:59 pete_dushenski: they had philosophers, but that's a different thing