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Transcript for 06-09-2015, 1170 lines:

00:14:24 mircea_popescu: first!

00:15:02 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263375 << this is a good idea.

00:15:02 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 18:09:28; punkman: so I mutilated Veh, it now saves its cache to disk so it doesn't have to redo it all each time it's invoked

00:26:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30763 @ 0.00071824 = 22.0952 BTC [-]

00:27:19 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263340 << the proposition that the library of alexandria has anything to do with a bunch of bronze-age derps is ridoinculous. that event was a clear cut case of the elites of one culture wiping the elites of another culture it had defeated. this happens to be right and proper. the solving of the indian problem is nothing of the kind, but simply the elites of a culture wip

00:27:19 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 15:36:29; funkenstein_: I'm also not going to celebrate the destruction of the library of Alexandria because "people".

00:27:19 mircea_popescu: ing out a subhuman population. not quite monkey enough to be cute in a zoo, not quite human enough to be part of the world. uncanny valley all the way.

00:28:34 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263372 << o.O

00:28:34 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 18:08:43; lksakeye: Yo this is isaackl. For the record, I returned dear leader his 1 btc, one month before he accused me of theft. (https://blockchain.info/address/1Bum3oXxbCLUg54snyL6rmBz7vRBuPUr6G, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-06-2015#1172722)

00:30:12 mircea_popescu: i can't believe this shit. dude srsly that's not how bitcoin works wtf. you can't just send btc back to originating addresses.

00:30:35 kakobrekla: yeah you cant do what bitbet does!

00:31:10 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla huh ?

00:31:22 mircea_popescu: !up Bingo_VACAY

00:31:38 mircea_popescu: how's the vaca y, Bingo_VACAY ?

00:32:34 Bingo_VACAY: Not bad

00:32:36 kakobrekla: theres this http://i.imgur.com/URxC0bN.png

00:32:37 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NivCLD )

00:32:55 kakobrekla: "to originating address" :p

00:32:59 mircea_popescu: it's an option omfg.

00:33:15 kakobrekla: and its not even selected duh

00:33:21 Bingo_VACAY: Juriv seriously consider raising coinbr fees

00:33:55 mircea_popescu: "i don't want this email so i'll just send it back to its sender".

00:33:59 mircea_popescu: what even works like this

00:35:41 mircea_popescu: http://codebeautify.org/jsonviewer/636e02 << this incidentally is very nice because most of those signatures were verified f2f and are consequently signed. pretty strong cornerstone.

00:35:42 assbot: vit ... ( http://bit.ly/1g204uV )

00:37:28 mircea_popescu: !up Bingo_VACAY

00:37:50 mircea_popescu: did your gf cook you this system, Bingo_VACAY ?

00:37:57 Bingo_VACAY: Jurov seriously fees too low for ling time

00:38:19 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263392 << no. amusingly enough, everything else is, specifically email. but the ml itself seems fine.

00:38:19 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 19:04:10; jurov: in the half of the logs... now the ml is busted too?

00:38:29 thestringpuller: !up Bingo_VACAY

00:39:09 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263407 << he can use it.

00:39:09 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 19:22:45; ascii_modem: i won't ever use this.

00:39:14 Bingo_VACAY: Mircea_popescu nope fighting off planetary predators all weekend

00:39:57 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263417 << the internet's premiere export product!

00:39:57 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 19:57:49; btcdrak: <3 that was a pretty good score considering all the armchair lawyers who came out of the woodwork telling me I was wrong...

00:40:56 mircea_popescu: "bruce_fenton 4 points 10 hours ago We've tried hard to invite others in, just like I just invited you."

00:41:15 mircea_popescu: myeah. the problem being that most people have more sense than to lend their reputation to propping up the space's chief scam club.

00:41:49 Bingo_VACAY: I would personally like to tie the rope for bruce

00:41:53 mircea_popescu: the bitcoin foundation has no fucking future. i say this from the same fucking throne i said mtgox has no fucking future ; and bfl has no fucking future ; and so on and so forth. it does not.

00:42:07 mircea_popescu: buncha twerps, always on the same script.

00:42:10 mircea_popescu: !up ascii_modem

00:43:24 ascii_modem: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263484 << the beauty of 'v' is that folks can use cobol on win98 if they like...

00:43:24 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 00:39:09; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263407 << he can use it.

00:43:37 mircea_popescu: quite

00:44:04 mircea_popescu: moreover, saving stuff to disk is not IN ITSELF a bad thing.

00:44:20 mircea_popescu: you're making the jump and presuming nonsensical usage, which may be a fair assumption in general, but not necessary here.

00:44:36 ascii_modem: no but imho 'sig correct' is bad to cache.

00:44:37 mircea_popescu: if he hangs himself by the ears with a rope made out of state, that's his problem. but saving the thing is not that yet.

00:44:56 mircea_popescu: why ? wouldn't you want to know if it was at some point and is not now ?

00:45:01 ascii_modem: today correct, tomorrow - gammarayed.

00:45:06 Bingo_VACAY: Last night fucking white planets tried to block my clock from hot black athletic spoon, #whiteprivilege

00:45:21 mircea_popescu: sponn ?!

00:45:25 thestringpuller: poon

00:45:46 ascii_modem: i will know because my sigs get checked every fscking time.

00:46:01 Bingo_VACAY: Poon Fuck this toy piece of shit

00:46:21 ascii_modem: which?

00:46:27 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8150 @ 0.00072378 = 5.8988 BTC [+]

00:46:42 mircea_popescu: Bingo_VACAY laid an iegg

00:47:00 Bingo_VACAY: Advil. This touch queen turd

00:47:14 Bingo_VACAY: Hate

00:47:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26526 @ 0.00072931 = 19.3457 BTC [+] {3}

00:47:38 thestringpuller: Autocomplete in irc world.

00:47:51 thestringpuller: Bingo_VACAY: you didn't bring a laptop with you?

00:48:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9484 @ 0.00073461 = 6.967 BTC [+]

00:48:35 Bingo_VACAY: No Gunderson to confers to actual computer

00:49:02 Bingo_VACAY: Omar hate

00:50:01 Bingo_VACAY: Kismet lives

00:50:22 Bingo_VACAY: In a pretend lunix

00:51:17 Bingo_VACAY: How was lunix an autistic correctly wird

00:52:22 Bingo_VACAY: I hate programming niggers

00:53:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30000 @ 0.00073461 = 22.0383 BTC [+] {3}

00:59:32 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://fraudsters.com/2015/on-how-the-factored-4096-rsa-keys-story-was-handled-and-what-it-means-to-you/#selection-455.0-455.29 ftr.

00:59:33 assbot: On how the factored 4096 RSA keys story was handled, and what it means to you. on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1VFXivr )

01:13:45 mircea_popescu: and in other news, http://40.media.tumblr.com/357c14b90c5d73edafc9b4ea3e736345/tumblr_nohe1p4cbF1utuotio1_1280.jpg

01:13:46 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KxUhvp )

01:14:34 pete_dushenski: ^how unrelated to florian ;/

01:15:04 trinque: /b ben_vulpes

01:15:09 trinque: lol. whoops

01:15:21 ben_vulpes: hey boss

01:17:19 thestringpuller: and that's the last time I click on a link from mircea_popescu

01:17:33 pete_dushenski: bluffer.

01:17:44 mircea_popescu: it's not clicking if you do it slowly.

01:19:08 pete_dushenski: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3222893/Indestructible-Water-bear-bug-survive-space-revolutionise-computing.html << mkay. these 'scientists' also need to starve.

01:19:09 assbot: 'Water bear' bug that can survive in space could revolutionise computing | Daily Mail Online ... ( http://bit.ly/1VFXWcm )

01:19:53 mircea_popescu: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3jnadz/093_lost_btc_in_transaction_fee_bitfury/ << probably the best lulz reddit has to offer.

01:19:54 assbot: 0.93 Lost btc in transaction fee, BitFury? : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1VFXXgx )

01:20:03 mircea_popescu: !up VariaVarietatis

01:20:39 pete_dushenski: "Thanks for not setting a reasonable restriction on transaction fees blockchain.info!" << "it's all your fault i'm a flaming maroon!"

01:21:04 mircea_popescu: the whole thing it's such an elaborate cake of fail...

01:21:29 mircea_popescu: "his bitcoins". how many ? less than one.

01:22:26 VariaVarietatis: mircea_popescu Need some webhosting and a domain are you still selling hosting?

01:22:51 mircea_popescu: not to teh public, no.

01:23:45 VariaVarietatis: If not you, How can I get this from the people in the wot?

01:23:59 VariaVarietatis: also need to buy some bitcoins to pay for it.

01:24:12 thestringpuller: hard problems require hard forks!

01:42:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10766 @ 0.00072709 = 7.8279 BTC [-]

01:48:23 VariaVarietatis: If not out of the wot could someone recommend a good webhost?

02:01:23 ben_vulpes: state

02:01:24 ben_vulpes: STATE

02:01:42 ben_vulpes: GLOBAL STATE

02:02:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18400 @ 0.00072677 = 13.3726 BTC [-]

02:02:56 mats: ??

02:04:19 thestringpuller: ben_vulpes: "What is Javascript?"

02:11:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27450 @ 0.00073108 = 20.0681 BTC [+] {3}

02:18:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25685 @ 0.00072446 = 18.6078 BTC [-] {3}

02:26:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36000 @ 0.0007346 = 26.4456 BTC [+] {5}

02:32:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23400 @ 0.00073513 = 17.202 BTC [+]

02:35:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27500 @ 0.00072223 = 19.8613 BTC [-] {4}

02:39:04 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263525 << ahahahahaha.

02:39:04 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 00:59:32; mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://fraudsters.com/2015/on-how-the-factored-4096-rsa-keys-story-was-handled-and-what-it-means-to-you/#selection-455.0-455.29 ftr.

02:43:24 asciilifeform: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3jnadz/093_lost_btc_in_transaction_fee_bitfury/cuqtdev << tr0l0l0l

02:43:26 assbot: tetrahydrocannabilol comments on 0.93 Lost btc in transaction fee, BitFury? ... ( http://bit.ly/1VG0BTm )

02:50:33 funkenstein_: Good evening lords and ladies.

02:50:41 funkenstein_: do you like apple juice? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlcQ6bl9uBE

02:50:42 assbot: Who's Not a Lady - DJO - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1VG0VkX )

02:51:20 funkenstein_: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263457 <-- wai wut? since when did we start calling puritan rejects who couldn't get laid "the elite"

02:51:20 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 00:27:19; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-09-2015#1263340 << the proposition that the library of alexandria has anything to do with a bunch of bronze-age derps is ridoinculous. that event was a clear cut case of the elites of one culture wiping the elites of another culture it had defeated. this happens to be right and proper. the solving of the indian problem is nothing of the kind, but simply the elit

02:52:07 funkenstein_: there was no indian problem. There was a somebody gave retards weapons and they appear to be killing everything in sight problem.

02:53:37 funkenstein_: And for the record, your participation in an open dialog here, more in the tradition of the indian men of knowledge than the authoritarian oxbridge academics, does not make me think of you as monkeys

02:55:41 thestringpuller: good evening funkenstein_

03:00:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32100 @ 0.00071782 = 23.042 BTC [-]

03:06:07 funkenstein_: thank you kind sir *tips hat*

03:09:42 thestringpuller: you listening to any funk this evening?

03:09:50 thestringpuller: i might jam out to some parliment

03:16:45 thestringpuller: ;;later tell funkenstein_ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noqMfTRKNlo << this reminds me of you. Dr. Funkenstein

03:16:45 gribble: The operation succeeded.

03:18:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11211 @ 0.00071734 = 8.0421 BTC [-] {3}

03:27:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12900 @ 0.0007158 = 9.2338 BTC [-]

03:46:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6389 @ 0.0007158 = 4.5732 BTC [-]

03:47:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 121761 @ 0.00073437 = 89.4176 BTC [+] {9}

04:03:22 funkenstein_: thestringpuller, that's the real deal :)

04:03:35 funkenstein_: like bitcoin, you can't fake the funk

04:04:31 *: asciilifeform saw deal for purchase of certain lab instrument fall through for the third time in that many years.

04:06:25 funkenstein_: thestringpuller, a show of new school crew George tours with these days : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tk9j00wyVQ

04:06:26 assbot: George Clinton Parliment Funkadelic NAMM 2015 - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1EJ4Ysm )

04:06:29 *: asciilifeform is, contrary to pete_dushenski's lsd trip picture, very poor.

04:07:16 funkenstein_: asciilifeform, still can't afford that chip fab?

04:07:29 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: not chip fab, either

04:08:31 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: you want dr. moreau's island for electronics...

04:10:29 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: my 'island' is an unheated, uncooled, wooden hut.

04:11:55 thestringpuller: when you say "my 'island'" are you talking of hypothetical super scientist island with no budget? or current laboratory?

04:12:04 asciilifeform: current.

04:12:20 asciilifeform: godforsaken hole.

04:14:41 funkenstein_: how's the air quality down there?

04:14:50 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: worst imaginable.

04:15:05 funkenstein_: O.o

04:15:33 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ since they did the killing.

04:16:19 funkenstein_: aha

04:16:30 *: mircea_popescu can imagine some pretty bad air quality.

04:16:54 asciilifeform: picture 'worst possible without being near-term lethal' and you have it.

04:17:02 mircea_popescu: in other news, went on a lark to this "power dc" ac/dc tribute band in some "rock bar" here.

04:17:04 thestringpuller: funkenstein_: The mothership has arrived.

04:17:53 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: l0l, i distinctly recall seeing an ad for precisely this during one of our walks in the city

04:18:01 mircea_popescu: you should have seen this thing. a space too small to keep a woman with her sister ; 5 dollar drinks ; buncha teenaged derps dressed like pizza delivery boys, backpacks i compris. which ius why nobody had a drink.

04:18:18 mircea_popescu: the band was ohio high bad.

04:18:28 mircea_popescu: and it had nothing to do with rock whatsoever.

04:18:45 funkenstein_: lol, ouch

04:19:09 mircea_popescu: basically, argentinian : tribute band that is not a band and no tribute, in a bar that sells no drinks to some kids that are there because they got out of the rain.

04:19:21 *: funkenstein_ guesses it was also ear-damagingly loud

04:19:38 mircea_popescu: and then funkenstein_ wants to tell me about the intrinsic worth of all bipedal mouthbreathers.

04:19:40 mircea_popescu: i ain't buying it.

04:19:48 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ no, probably on account of electricity being too expensive.

04:21:34 funkenstein_: this is not my point any more than yours is to defend usgtronic idiocy

04:21:40 mircea_popescu: go on

04:24:17 funkenstein_: most all literate europeans, including cortez, wrote of "economic prosperity beyond any we have seen", "paradise", "wisdom". Hardly just mouthbreathing.

04:24:45 mircea_popescu: you talking north america or central america ?

04:25:08 funkenstein_: well Corez wasn't very far North afaik

04:25:30 mircea_popescu: so then why do you conflate the two. the people i was talking about when i said iron age were the various twerps the usians killed.

04:25:42 mircea_popescu: the various people the spanyards killed are some other discussion.

04:25:54 asciilifeform: what iron.

04:25:58 funkenstein_: Iroquois nation sure seemed more advanced from my reading than say, washcorp

04:26:07 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform im bewing generous.

04:26:21 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ a lot of talk about that. point of fact is, subsistence hunters with bow and arrow.

04:26:50 mircea_popescu: nobody is against the study of political, philosophycal, astronautical or any other knowledge defeated tribe had.

04:26:58 mircea_popescu: we are however against hteir continued physical existence.

04:27:21 funkenstein_: why?

04:27:34 mircea_popescu: because their massacre makes the scant remaining life valuable,

04:27:44 funkenstein_: are we against the physical existence of monkeys?

04:27:44 mircea_popescu: allowing the common man some semblance of freedom and import for a short interval.

04:27:56 mircea_popescu: why do you think the immigrants slaughtered the indians instead of persay teaching them to farm ?

04:28:10 funkenstein_: you mean instead of learning from them how to farm

04:28:15 mircea_popescu: no.

04:28:28 asciilifeform: one reason was that agriculture is subjectively hell.

04:28:37 asciilifeform: and folks faced with something like an actual choice, did not choose it.

04:28:44 funkenstein_: well not to the folks who knew how to do it

04:28:47 asciilifeform: any more than you and i choose to put hand in a bear trap

04:29:01 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: to anyone. the resulting population density is hell.

04:29:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6900 @ 0.00071457 = 4.9305 BTC [-]

04:29:12 *: mircea_popescu adds "teenaged californians that know how to clean toilets" to his shopping list.

04:29:20 mircea_popescu: im sure they'll enjoy it on account of "knowing how to do it"

04:29:52 funkenstein_: yes, knowing a useful skill and performing it is enjoyable, sometimes referred to as satori 24

04:30:00 mircea_popescu: this is a pipe dream.

04:30:05 mircea_popescu: some skills are enjoyable. others are not.

04:30:30 mircea_popescu: i am a very good arithmetician, at that.

04:30:46 funkenstein_: lol good point there

04:30:57 funkenstein_: but never enjoy some nice arithmetic?

04:31:06 mircea_popescu: yes, of the subset of skills that are enjoyable, one enjoys more the ones that are useful and he's any good at

04:31:16 mircea_popescu: but that's besides the point. being a skilled politician is never enjoyable.

04:32:03 funkenstein_: at any rate, agriculture is a great example of "whoops - shoulda asked the locals where the keys to safe are before we needlessly removed their tongues"

04:32:43 mircea_popescu: i don't see it.

04:32:49 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: the white man knew 'the keys' - 'have 99.99% of you die and you too can be subsistence hunters'

04:32:53 funkenstein_: modern genetic engineering and rapid desertificatoin techniques have never reached indian levels

04:33:03 mircea_popescu: eh get out.

04:33:13 funkenstein_: go, make a new maize

04:33:18 funkenstein_: explain how it was done

04:33:22 mircea_popescu: the indians died of starvation, mostly.

04:33:25 funkenstein_: ditto the potatoe

04:33:27 funkenstein_: nonsense

04:33:31 mircea_popescu: there weren't enough of them to populate california.

04:33:39 funkenstein_: the invading barbarians died of starvation

04:33:50 funkenstein_: california was quite populated

04:34:09 funkenstein_: as was modern detroit, look now

04:34:34 asciilifeform: for fucks sake,

04:34:36 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=31-01-2015#999195

04:34:36 assbot: Logged on 31-01-2015 01:09:34; asciilifeform: 'Every nationalist is haunted by the belief that the past can be altered. He spends part of his time in a fantasy world in which things happen as they should ? in which, for example, the Spanish Armada was a success or the Russian Revolution was crushed in 1918 ? and he will transfer fragments of this world to the history books whenever possible. Much of the propagandist writing of our time amounts to

04:35:00 mircea_popescu: i think that fits.

04:35:07 ben_vulpes: disease also wiped out huge numbers!

04:35:21 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes yes. the sort of disease that kills the hungry.

04:35:50 ben_vulpes: what, the hungry existed until the diseases arrived to wipe them out?

04:36:29 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: elementarily, there was nothing magic about the 'red man' which kept him from breeding, like everybody else, to just short of over the carrying capacity of his lands

04:36:48 asciilifeform: it simply did not happen to be very high

04:37:05 asciilifeform: so the lsd aficionados get illusion of 'in harmony with enviro'

04:37:06 asciilifeform: or whatnot

04:37:28 ben_vulpes: lol simply means nature comes by and wallops population numbers once in a while

04:37:55 mircea_popescu: in point of fact as the white man put pressure on the indians, they started crossing boundries in desperate search of food. this was very successful at preventing organised resistance - idiots too busy fighting each other.

04:37:58 asciilifeform: in reality, say the place today called california could have supported 50,000 healthy stone age folk, or 100,000 barely-alive ripe-for-smallpox.

04:38:00 mircea_popescu: so much for political superiority.

04:38:05 asciilifeform: it will house 110,000.

04:38:46 funkenstein_: i'm not claiming magic red men, i am claiming mentally ill - and markedly stupid - invaders

04:38:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform call it californy like they did :D

04:39:14 ben_vulpes: hm!

04:39:26 funkenstein_: i'm also claiming great denial and lack of reading of relevant historical documents

04:39:32 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ like ?

04:40:16 funkenstein_: e.g. scalping laws of every US state rewarding people for presenting american corpses

04:40:27 mircea_popescu: so ?

04:40:28 funkenstein_: meeting notes from Denver

04:40:43 mircea_popescu: "meeting notes from Denver" ?!

04:40:54 mircea_popescu: you mean the protocols of the learned elves of denver ?

04:41:14 funkenstein_: explicit doctrines of idiocy from there for hundreds of years - must kill kill because - dumb dumb we are

04:41:59 mircea_popescu: mno.

04:42:06 mircea_popescu: must kill because can.

04:42:29 funkenstein_: then starve you will

04:42:34 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: the 'magical wisdom of harmony with mother earth' thing won't fly. but my personal favourite crackpottery re: the indians, and one which has at least a pinch of actual historical support, is that they had to be bugsprayed to keep agricultural white man from defecting.

04:42:36 funkenstein_: in a dead wasteland

04:42:58 mircea_popescu: eh get out.

04:43:39 funkenstein_: kill because can? start with own family, then all plants and animals, finally self.

04:44:04 mircea_popescu: no dude. start with the monkeys. d'oh.

04:44:30 funkenstein_: monkeys are fine with me, leave them there -- can eat them later if shit gets rough

04:44:40 mircea_popescu: you're acting like elementary points don't somehow magically exist. that pretense doesn't do anything.

04:44:54 mircea_popescu: obviously the white guys killed the red guys. the red guys sucked.

04:45:36 funkenstein_: all of us will die, therefore we suck

04:45:47 funkenstein_: how about lets try to learn from past mistakes

04:45:50 mircea_popescu: quite.

04:46:02 asciilifeform: incidentally, i notice that aficionados of crying for the indians for some odd reason cry preferentially for the ones clobbered earlier and more thoroughly, leaving not so much as a wet spot (e.g., arawak) vs the later ones who learned horse and rifle and gave white man a run for his money

04:46:20 funkenstein_: thems what die will be the lucky ones

04:46:24 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform obviously. those showed some sign of sense.

04:46:35 funkenstein_: i cry for the descendents of the fucktards who still bear the scars of mental illness

04:46:47 mircea_popescu: you don't get to go around putting labels on things you know.

04:46:50 funkenstein_: i cry for mircea_popescu who lives in a society which grew up with no wise elders

04:46:54 mircea_popescu: i did ?!

04:47:00 funkenstein_: *now lives

04:47:13 mircea_popescu: dude if your idea of wise elders is some twerps who worship the failures...

04:47:22 funkenstein_: ??

04:48:32 mircea_popescu: last fucking thing i want to see are some elders harping on about how great the iron age man was. srsly.

04:48:33 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: can you describe one of the 'wise men' and his wisdom in terms that any of us might apprehend ?

04:48:35 mircea_popescu: it's not even ridiculous.

04:48:50 asciilifeform: 'it was wisdomy and truthy damnit' doesn't cut it.

04:49:00 funkenstein_: asciilifeform, when I read your excellent blog I am often reminded of the aztec word "tonal"

04:49:03 gabriel_laddel: funkenstein_: life is ruff, here, have a blanket.

04:49:17 funkenstein_: that ideal model existing in our mind of objects describing the world around us

04:49:22 *: mircea_popescu wants to introduce http://fraudsters.com/2011/hai-sa-facem-un-exercitiu/#selection-271.1-281.68

04:49:25 assbot: Hai sa facem un exercitiu on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1NVtlGi )

04:49:27 funkenstein_: gabriel_laddel, lol

04:49:38 mircea_popescu: "they had cars at the time this fuckwit was living in the dirt. do you understand ? some african monkey thinking they unveiled the sikrits of the universe AT THE SAME TIME as people doing the cern cyclotron is necessarily and by that very fact an idiot.

04:49:39 mircea_popescu: humanity is a thrown curve. what's ok in 700bc is not ok in 2000ad."

04:49:46 mircea_popescu: if i want to worship some iron age primitives, i got the greeks

04:49:56 mircea_popescu: i do not need nor care to mention some schmucks 5000 years late to the party.

04:50:05 mircea_popescu: not anymore than i care for tornatore's shepherd.

04:50:17 funkenstein_: the largest city in the world in 1500 was Tenochtitlan

04:50:20 mircea_popescu: fuck him, retarded sicilian rediscovering the intellectual products of sheep herding in 1940

04:50:28 mircea_popescu: again with mexico ?

04:51:25 funkenstein_: "They had cars" - we worship retarded usans now?

04:52:00 mircea_popescu: ...

04:52:34 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: what did your neolithic folks ~demonstrably~ have, that, e.g., i, want but do not have?

04:52:44 mircea_popescu: what's this mezclado of everything. we talk north american indians you derp about early mexico city, i discuss tech you derp about consumers... different things yo.

04:52:50 funkenstein_: asciilifeform, remember the bar here is set for - is it worth your while to go slit a throat of somebody not bother you

04:52:53 asciilifeform: (note that this is not a null set, but i don't expect to hear any correct answer just now)

04:53:30 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: the 'not bothered' part is also demonstrably false.

04:53:40 asciilifeform: esp. in north a.

04:53:54 funkenstein_: asciilifeform, what did -your- neolithic folks demonstrably have that I want now?

04:54:08 mircea_popescu: eh russia wasn't even inhabited then.

04:54:13 mircea_popescu: tech didn't really allow for it.

04:55:03 funkenstein_: mexico city is in north america afaik

04:55:40 asciilifeform: what's next, moscow is in europe !

04:55:48 asciilifeform: technicalities.

04:55:50 mircea_popescu: anyway, to take that myth away : tenochtitlan had a populatiuon of 2 or 300k. in any case under 500k.

04:55:58 mircea_popescu: fucking ur, at the time of its beheading, was ten times that.

04:56:06 mircea_popescu: china had dozens of settlements larger

04:56:19 mircea_popescu: rome had been a million for nine or ten centuries by that point

04:57:16 mircea_popescu: but yes, it was by far the largest affair in the new world. because the new world sucked.

04:59:40 mircea_popescu: moscow is in europe ?

04:59:50 asciilifeform: and chicken, is a bird !

04:59:55 ben_vulpes: (asciilifeform, what did your neolithic folks demonstrably have that you want but do not have?)

05:00:21 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: see earlier discussion re: agriculture being a hell

05:00:31 mircea_popescu: they didn't have sleep ad lib you know.

05:00:38 asciilifeform: sure they did.

05:00:50 mircea_popescu: they just had a retarded female-centric social system which fell over at the slightest provocation. like every other case in history.

05:00:58 asciilifeform: eh we got that now.

05:01:04 mircea_popescu: not quite yet.

05:01:06 mircea_popescu: going that way tho

05:02:00 gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform: is there anything in particular DERIVE has that maxima does not? I read a presentation on the matter, which had some nice specifics (inequality support) but am curious why you fondly remember the former rather than the latter.

05:02:15 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: it has being 200KB.

05:02:16 mircea_popescu: maxima existed then ?

05:02:23 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: maxima existed in 1970s

05:02:30 asciilifeform: called then 'macsyma'

05:02:40 mircea_popescu: and i could run this on what ?

05:02:45 mircea_popescu: in 1993

05:03:07 asciilifeform: which 'this'

05:03:09 asciilifeform: macsyma?

05:03:10 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the current distributive runs on standard common lisp.

05:03:12 mircea_popescu: ya

05:03:24 mircea_popescu: and i could have had standard common lisp on what ?

05:03:38 gabriel_laddel: symbolics box...

05:03:47 mircea_popescu: i could have had a symbolics box ?

05:03:48 mircea_popescu: shit.

05:04:08 asciilifeform: in '93? 1) symbolics 2) sun 3) vax 4) a few others

05:04:12 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform why didnt you get a symbolics box yo! then you could have fondly remembered maxima instead of derive!

05:04:34 mircea_popescu: my copy came on disk 2 of "crime wave"

05:04:41 asciilifeform: there also was 'xlisp' for msdos, which was ~nearly~ commonlisp.

05:04:44 asciilifeform: i used it.

05:04:51 mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgDJ6EH-CBI this

05:04:52 assbot: Crime Wave DOS Longplay (1/4) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1NVugXr )

05:05:12 mircea_popescu: god i loved that stupid scroller

05:06:37 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: l0l, what was it doing there

05:06:44 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 120865 @ 0.00073053 = 88.2955 BTC [+] {8}

05:06:51 mircea_popescu: the idea was you had to fill all disks.

05:07:01 asciilifeform: ah, human warez

05:07:04 mircea_popescu: aha

05:07:06 asciilifeform: then makes total sense!

05:07:48 mircea_popescu: check it out btw, almost like topless daughter of president

05:09:40 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: coming back to the earlier point, it is ~unfathomably valuable~ to ~know that you know all the knobs and what they do~

05:09:51 asciilifeform: this means fits-in-head.

05:10:15 asciilifeform: it is even conceivable that the guts would have fit in your head, had they been exposed

05:10:22 asciilifeform: but the interface of 'derive' certainly did.

05:10:33 asciilifeform: try that with a modern symbolic maths package.

05:11:05 gabriel_laddel: Yeah, I failed at that a while back.

05:11:13 asciilifeform: this totality - there is no substitute for it.

05:11:19 gabriel_laddel: Maxima is neato, but the ALGOL interface to all the goodies sucks.

05:11:22 mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel come to think about it, you probably want derive source for your masamune thing

05:11:35 asciilifeform: it means that when something does not work as expected, you can immediately rule out 'unknown knob'

05:12:16 gabriel_laddel: mircea_popescu: already downloaded it ;-) but will probably stick with Macsyma.

05:12:37 asciilifeform: no sourceball for 'derive' was ever publicly discovered.

05:13:06 gabriel_laddel: erm let me unpack derive.zip and see wtf is in here then

05:13:16 *: mircea_popescu wonders if funkenstain got butthurt

05:13:53 gabriel_laddel: nvm - I've just got a bunch of DERIVE files, no sources.

05:14:55 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: the thing itself lives in one exe.

05:15:11 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: came with a buncha generated crud, for illustrative purposes

05:15:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27287 @ 0.00071457 = 19.4985 BTC [-]

05:15:54 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: said exe contains (in my copy) a bitwise-unchanged copy of 'mulisp-87' and a savelispanddie image of derive's engine appended after.

05:16:02 funkenstein_: sorry about that, network problems

05:16:59 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: http://maben.homeip.net/static/s100/software/microsoft/LISP/MuLisp.pdf << manual. (very grainy scan.)

05:17:04 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NVuWMj )

05:17:14 asciilifeform: (and yes, mircosoft bought the thing, long ago, before there even was winblowz)

05:20:35 funkenstein_: moar winblows because: can

05:23:32 funkenstein_: well i must thank you for reminding me of the extent of damage due to idiocy and mental illness which has occured in the past

05:24:07 funkenstein_: I will renew efforts with greater motivation

05:24:08 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: consider link to the documents mentioned earlier ?

05:24:44 funkenstein_: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=05-09-2015#1263439

05:24:44 assbot: Logged on 05-09-2015 23:03:16; funkenstein_: For more on that Guatemala story grep for "1986": http://www.skeptic.ca/American_Holocaust.htm

05:32:19 asciilifeform: funkenstein_: no, these - http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263618

05:32:19 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 04:24:17; funkenstein_: most all literate europeans, including cortez, wrote of "economic prosperity beyond any we have seen", "paradise", "wisdom". Hardly just mouthbreathing.

05:33:23 asciilifeform: funkenstein_ will also likely enjoy the mega-classic http://www.ditext.com/diamond/mistake.html

05:33:25 assbot: The Worst Mistake in the History of the Human Race ... ( http://bit.ly/1NVw0zM )

05:33:40 *: asciilifeform bbl.

05:34:15 funkenstein_: aha, of guns germs and steel fame

05:37:47 funkenstein_: Stannard's scholarship is remarkable. 60 pages of references, in documents he turned up in one of his volume.

05:38:46 funkenstein_: It may be possible for a person to know something about history of the America's without reading him, but surely the responsibility is on the person to so demonstrate.the

05:42:29 funkenstein_: Cortes: "Besides those things which I have already mentioned, they sell in the market everything else to be found in this land, but they are so many and so varied that because of their great number and because I cannot remember many of them nor do I know what they are called I shall not mention them"

05:43:22 gabriel_laddel: !up refferedbyloper

05:43:42 gabriel_laddel: spelling?

05:43:53 funkenstein_: "never seen in all my days what so rejoiced my heart, as these things. For I saw among them amazing artistic objects, and I marveled over the subtle ingenuity of the men in these distant lands. Indeed, I cannot say enough about the things that were brought before me"

05:43:53 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

05:50:27 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9970 @ 0.00073157 = 7.2938 BTC [+] {3}

05:55:42 funkenstein_: good night gents, my apologies for the not so lighthearted topics

06:00:37 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9928 @ 0.00073663 = 7.3133 BTC [+]

06:14:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00073687 = 16.2111 BTC [+] {3}

06:27:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00073705 = 3.3904 BTC [+]

06:44:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52100 @ 0.00073314 = 38.1966 BTC [-] {4}

06:59:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18000 @ 0.00072908 = 13.1234 BTC [-]

07:00:50 mircea_popescu: ;;gentime 1000

07:00:52 gribble: The average time to generate a block at 1000.0 Mhps, given difficulty of 56957648455.0, is 7757 years, 16 weeks, 6 days, 6 hours, 23 minutes, and 24 seconds

07:01:05 mircea_popescu: ;;gentime 1000000000

07:01:05 gribble: The average time to generate a block at 1000000000.0 Mhps, given difficulty of 56957648455.0, is 2 days, 19 hours, 57 minutes, and 14 seconds

07:02:30 mircea_popescu: ;;gentime 11325.648148148

07:02:31 gribble: The average time to generate a block at 11325.6481481 Mhps, given difficulty of 56957648455.0, is 684 years, 48 weeks, 4 days, 23 hours, 47 minutes, and 44 seconds

07:06:47 mircea_popescu: ;;gentime 56628240.74

07:06:48 gribble: The average time to generate a block at 56628240.74 Mhps, given difficulty of 56957648455.0, is 7 weeks, 1 day, 0 hours, and 17 seconds

07:07:26 mircea_popescu: ;;gentime 113256481.48

07:07:27 gribble: The average time to generate a block at 113256481.48 Mhps, given difficulty of 56957648455.0, is 3 weeks, 4 days, 0 hours, and 8 seconds

07:08:54 punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/COF0DivVEAArStP.jpg:large

07:08:54 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1VGkwBA )

07:11:33 punkman: guess that was wordplay, because the app is for muslims https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/ipray-prayer-times-qibla-compass/id288054534

07:11:34 assbot: iPray: Prayer Times & Qibla Compass on the App Store on iTunes ... ( http://bit.ly/1VGkI3G )

07:14:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20554 @ 0.00072767 = 14.9565 BTC [-] {2}

07:15:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5265 @ 0.00071456 = 3.7622 BTC [-]

07:28:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16724 @ 0.00071456 = 11.9503 BTC [-]

07:29:43 punkman: http://i.imgur.com/snA9iAP.png

07:29:44 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1VGmbXQ )

07:33:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21100 @ 0.0007352 = 15.5127 BTC [+] {3}

07:35:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2526 @ 0.00071456 = 1.805 BTC [-]

07:48:06 deedbot-: [fraudsters] Sneak Peak Screenshots and The Future Golden Goose - http://fraudsters.com/2015/sneak-peak-screenshots-and-the-future-golden-goose/

07:54:42 mircea_popescu: the gentlemen investors as well as the armchair financiers may find the 2nd part of ^ interesting

07:55:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22600 @ 0.00071416 = 16.14 BTC [-] {2}

07:55:43 punkman: do you have to milk the goose daily?

07:55:54 mircea_popescu: yea

07:59:14 gabriel_laddel: !

07:59:17 gabriel_laddel: wow

08:04:53 cazalla: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLxE8k6QtUE

08:04:54 assbot: Police officers go through transgender training - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1i5gswA )

08:05:03 mircea_popescu: lmao

08:20:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3650 @ 0.00071807 = 2.621 BTC [+]

08:32:35 gabriel_laddel: !up VariaVarietatis

08:38:05 punkman: https://instagram.com/tokyofashion/

08:38:07 assbot: Harajuku Japan (@tokyofashion) • Instagram photos and videos ... ( http://bit.ly/1VGsZER )

08:40:51 punkman: every time I end up on instagram, I can't believe all the pictures are 640pixels and people use it

08:46:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6950 @ 0.00073704 = 5.1224 BTC [+] {2}

08:51:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8050 @ 0.00073705 = 5.9333 BTC [+]

08:58:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14800 @ 0.00073705 = 10.9083 BTC [+]

09:07:57 punkman: http://eugeniekitchen.com/brick-toast/ sunday breakfast suggestion

09:07:59 assbot: Brick Toast Recipe - Shibuya Honey Toast - Japanese Shokudo - Eugenie Kitchen ... ( http://bit.ly/1i5jQHY )

09:10:44 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00073638 = 4.271 BTC [-]

10:08:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13900 @ 0.00073139 = 10.1663 BTC [-]

10:19:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6850 @ 0.00073743 = 5.0514 BTC [+] {4}

10:32:04 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12193 @ 0.00073192 = 8.9243 BTC [-]

10:46:18 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3050 @ 0.00073618 = 2.2453 BTC [+] {3}

10:53:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8470 @ 0.00072533 = 6.1435 BTC [-] {2}

11:01:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9100 @ 0.00071969 = 6.5492 BTC [-]

11:02:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8250 @ 0.00071969 = 5.9374 BTC [-]

11:03:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8900 @ 0.00071343 = 6.3495 BTC [-] {4}

11:18:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17200 @ 0.00071307 = 12.2648 BTC [-] {3}

11:28:54 shinohai: Thanks AVG, deleting bitcoin nau: https://i.imgur.com/snA9iAP.png

11:28:55 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Xx9ArP )

11:43:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1930 @ 0.00071978 = 1.3892 BTC [+]

11:51:25 shinohai: !up vextor

11:52:07 vextor: hello, a week ago I reported that Phuctor is broken when new keys are submitted

11:52:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3244 @ 0.00072836 = 2.3628 BTC [+]

11:52:24 vextor: mircea_popescu noted that the bignum arithmetic often hobbled the machine, and to wait a few hours

11:52:43 vextor: I did so, and also noted the Phuctor statistics. the number of keys to process was gradually going down

11:53:04 vextor: over the course of the week, the number of Moduli Waiting for Test has now decreased to 601

11:53:11 vextor: but it has been stuck on this figure for several days

11:53:19 shinohai: ;;ticker

11:53:20 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 240.69, Best ask: 240.79, Bid-ask spread: 0.10000, Last trade: 240.72, 24 hour volume: 25432.59040205, 24 hour low: 231.0, 24 hour high: 248.48, 24 hour vwap: None

11:53:30 vextor: I assume that when the number of moduli to test reaches 0, then key submission will work again?

11:53:44 vextor: if there's anything I can do to help new submissions work again, please let me know

11:53:50 vextor: submissions are, naturally, still broken

11:54:00 vextor: I'll be watching the logs in case my services are needed

11:54:00 shinohai: I think phuctor is down, but will have to ask asciilifeform when he gets here

11:54:07 vextor: thanks to shinohai for the voice

11:55:09 shinohai: m'kay

12:18:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13476 @ 0.00072836 = 9.8154 BTC [+]

12:25:05 ben_vulpes: ;;later tell vextor phuctor has had mains plugs pulled on it several times recenty, and alf's attitude (i believe) is that the thing shoudn't run if its going to have its memory ripped out every time it warms up. remember, it keeps the running product in memory. mircea_popescu's attitude is that "software should be less friable than the hardware upon which it runs". asciilifeform is trying to find the shitgnome responsble for

12:25:05 ben_vulpes: mains-currenting his box, and so i think phuctor is in limbo for the moment.

12:25:05 gribble: The operation succeeded.

12:25:09 ben_vulpes: !s friable

12:25:10 assbot: 1 results for 'friable' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=friable

12:54:58 shinohai: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/COOJXnjUEAMqi9x.png

12:54:59 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NjjvOC )

13:40:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74900 @ 0.00071388 = 53.4696 BTC [+] {5}

14:08:19 ben_vulpes: ;;later tell bingoboingo you'd appreciate the local gravity distortion in the 24-hour cafe this morning

14:08:19 gribble: The operation succeeded.

14:13:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17400 @ 0.0007321 = 12.7385 BTC [+] {4}

14:25:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13000 @ 0.00071378 = 9.2791 BTC [-]

14:39:51 thestringpuller: ben_vulpes: what's that mean?

14:41:49 thestringpuller: ;;ls

14:41:49 gribble: What do you think I am, a shell?

14:43:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00073198 = 6.9538 BTC [+] {3}

14:44:10 ben_vulpes: ;;later tell asciilifeform `for i in $(shasum -a 512 patches/* | awk '{print $1}'); do python v.py patches o $1; done` returns "No origin found." for all patches. i've not successfully run 'origin' yet.

14:44:11 gribble: The operation succeeded.

14:44:51 ben_vulpes: ^^ from a vanilla vdemo tar, unless i'm horribly mistaken.

14:45:48 ben_vulpes: thestringpuller: dat beetus

14:57:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4979 @ 0.00073383 = 3.6537 BTC [+]

15:34:01 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11217 @ 0.00073018 = 8.1904 BTC [-] {2}

15:40:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13751 @ 0.00073569 = 10.1165 BTC [+] {3}

15:43:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17600 @ 0.00073604 = 12.9543 BTC [+] {2}

15:50:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6388 @ 0.00073604 = 4.7018 BTC [+] {2}

15:51:18 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10389 @ 0.00073774 = 7.6644 BTC [+]

15:52:13 asciilifeform: ;;later tell ben_vulpes what were you trying to do ?! 'o' takes a ~tree file's hash~ as argument, and tells you ~which patch~ produced it. looks like you were giving it a patch's hash ??

15:52:13 gribble: The operation succeeded.

15:53:11 ben_vulpes: aha, yes I was

15:53:59 ben_vulpes: so that'd be the hash of a "pressing"?

15:55:40 asciilifeform: of a particular file in a pressing (or found elsewhere, aha)

15:56:01 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: see also http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=01-09-2015#1258188

15:56:01 assbot: Logged on 01-09-2015 04:21:27; asciilifeform: it is mainly because my disk is littered with 1,001 copies of therealbitcoin tree

15:57:20 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263914 << i've been thinking about this ever since the last thread, and so far i have not come up with any way to make the thing RELIABLY survive the treatment it is getting

15:57:20 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 12:25:05; ben_vulpes: ;;later tell vextor phuctor has had mains plugs pulled on it several times recenty, and alf's attitude (i believe) is that the thing shoudn't run if its going to have its memory ripped out every time it warms up. remember, it keeps the running product in memory. mircea_popescu's attitude is that "software should be less friable than the hardware upon which it runs". asciilifeform is trying to find the sh

15:57:46 asciilifeform: (undetectable bit rot is MUCH WORSE than the idling it does right now)

15:58:30 asciilifeform: thing is, flipping ONE FUCKING BIT in an already-baked product of moduli renders the whole shebang - and however long it took to produce - UNDETECTABLY worthless.

16:01:30 asciilifeform: the thing really needs to run on a colo box.

16:01:36 asciilifeform: with internal battery.

16:03:47 asciilifeform: i will also take this chance to point out that the node on dulap has been rendered useless by all of this - trails by 30-100 blocks AT ALL TIMES

16:07:45 asciilifeform: this means that at present time there is EXACTLY ONE reliable public therealbitcoin node - zoolag.

16:08:03 asciilifeform: i am still waiting to hear from anybody having set up another.

16:09:05 kakobrekla: id like to tho

16:09:19 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: what's keeping ya ?

16:09:47 kakobrekla: id like to throw* one on that mini arm computer cloud at some point

16:10:05 kakobrekla: they just sliced prices down, assuming not popular

16:10:15 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: use the cross-compilator instructions from my pogotron recipe

16:10:23 kakobrekla: currently out of time.

16:11:43 asciilifeform: everybody's out of time, aha

16:12:32 asciilifeform: i will note, for anyone relying on zoolag to transmit time-sensitive things, that it is on a fucking home fiber

16:12:38 asciilifeform: and could go down literally any time.

16:14:00 kakobrekla: i got a second mircorserver that will be another home node (amd, ecc, raid) that is on my bench waiting to be assembled for a couple of weeks now.

16:14:41 kakobrekla: but, no time.

16:15:47 kakobrekla: will get better soon.

16:16:03 thestringpuller: reading a paper on cryptosocialism...

16:19:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4671 @ 0.00073014 = 3.4105 BTC [-]

16:30:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2268 @ 0.00072538 = 1.6452 BTC [-]

16:39:45 ben_vulpes: *sigh*

16:39:54 ben_vulpes: what are best practices with the mailing list again?

16:43:05 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=04-09-2015#1262921

16:43:05 assbot: Logged on 04-09-2015 23:54:25; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: here's how i do it: 1) clearsigned (asciiarmoured) body. 2) attachment 3) signature (asciiarmoured, detached) of attachment, having the filename attach.foo.sig for every attach.foo

16:44:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4467 @ 0.00073045 = 3.2629 BTC [+]

16:47:44 ben_vulpes: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-September/000165.html << achtung, asciilifeform

16:47:46 assbot: [BTC-dev] V. (ver. 99K) ... ( http://bit.ly/1VHbxQN )

16:48:26 trinque: ;;later tell funkenstein_ If only Cortes hadn't destroyed the Mesoamerican time machine, you could travel back and set everything right.

16:48:27 gribble: The operation succeeded.

16:50:37 asciilifeform: neato ben_vulpes

16:50:40 asciilifeform: i will read this.

16:50:48 trinque: This preoccupation with what should've happened misses the process by which things *actually happen* by a wide berth.

16:51:52 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: it is only of middling nifty-ness.

16:51:59 ben_vulpes: HA

16:52:56 ben_vulpes: i of course neglected the test incantations.

16:54:00 ben_vulpes: `python -m unittest test_v'

16:54:34 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: why on earth did you put in that horror with the nested if-thens ?

16:54:56 asciilifeform: 'cause now if i wanna add a new command, there are THREE FUCKING PLACES to put it in instead of 2

16:54:58 asciilifeform: what gives.

16:55:47 asciilifeform: what was the point of this mutilation.

16:56:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16317 @ 0.00073045 = 11.9188 BTC [+]

16:56:40 ben_vulpes: eradication of global state and testability.

16:56:53 asciilifeform: dafuq is your problem with global state

16:57:10 ben_vulpes: you mean untestable spaghetti?

16:57:44 asciilifeform: it is only 'spaghetti' if there are localisms in the global state. as it was, all of it was relevant to the whole proggy.

16:57:54 ben_vulpes: in all honesty, it is a relic of testing from before i had the args objects mocked out.

16:58:22 ben_vulpes: and that is strictly untrue.

16:58:31 ben_vulpes: c_wot, for instance, has no business knowing about all sorts of things in args.

16:59:13 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes is right about c_wot

16:59:32 ben_vulpes: i /abhor/ functions that take the whole environment as their input arguments.

16:59:33 asciilifeform: but the patch dir arg is necessary !

17:00:05 asciilifeform: let's say it weren't. then ' ./v.py w ' prints wot ? but this is broken. because what if 'w' is my patch dir, and i simply forgot to include the second arg.

17:00:37 asciilifeform: ergo all invocations of my 'v' took the patchdir arg as first arg.

17:00:58 ben_vulpes: i've not touched the arg parsing itself.

17:02:01 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: what were your objections to 'banners' and 'desc' ?

17:02:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17900 @ 0.00072663 = 13.0067 BTC [-] {3}

17:02:50 ben_vulpes: i don't think i understand their use well enough to complain in detail.

17:03:04 asciilifeform: banners is simply a table of what was signed by whom.

17:03:33 ben_vulpes: i know what it is, silly. just not the places where it's used. yet.

17:03:34 asciilifeform: desc is a table of where a file (represented by its sha512) was born.

17:04:32 ben_vulpes: but looky here. you've written a thing that more-or-less must be tested as a whole, and i'm trying to push for testing the bits.

17:05:49 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: btw i find it interesting that nobody has yet noticed that 1) broken chains 2) orphaned subchains of any length whatsoever --- do not work

17:05:59 ben_vulpes: and this is why the global state drives me up a wall. because i cannot import one of these functions from the script and then run it without setting up a global environment for it. it's difficult to reason about the code lacks locality.

17:06:00 asciilifeform: and their presence prevents anything else from working.

17:06:19 ben_vulpes: yes, i have only written 'happy path' tests.

17:06:37 ben_vulpes: and no, i have not yet ginned up the tree-fuzzer.

17:06:37 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: try producing a patch that forks off, e.g., rel1, and see what i mean.

17:06:53 ben_vulpes: hm.

17:07:14 asciilifeform: right now it has no notion of patches that cannot coexist with one another.

17:07:16 ben_vulpes: (because the code lacks locality)

17:08:18 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: add it back into the todos :P

17:08:38 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: i was hoping it would be obvious to anyone who actually tried to use the thing.

17:08:59 punkman: asciilifeform: I just noticed this earlier when I looked at press, will apply every single patch up to HEAD

17:09:06 ben_vulpes: that'd be trying to break the thing.

17:09:23 asciilifeform: punkman: correct. the thing has no concept of orphaned chains as of yet.

17:10:04 asciilifeform: punkman: i decided, rather than let the thing sit sadly for another month while i get this necessary thing to work, to release instead

17:10:48 asciilifeform: perhaps ben_vulpes et al will finish the job.

17:11:01 punkman: asciilifeform: I only thought about it for 5 min but it seems like the solution to this would be a bit complex

17:11:09 asciilifeform: punkman: it would, yes

17:11:18 asciilifeform: punkman: need a smarter toposort

17:11:38 asciilifeform: (iirc the correct term for the thing remaining to be done is 'topological traversal')

17:12:21 punkman: I think I might hook it up to graphviz for visualization

17:12:38 asciilifeform: punkman: i did a rough version of just that, a few days ago

17:12:55 asciilifeform: punkman: i decided not to post it, because the result sucks

17:13:00 asciilifeform: it needs to be *clickable*

17:13:08 asciilifeform: and graphviz doesn't give this.

17:16:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12378 @ 0.00072529 = 8.9776 BTC [-] {3}

17:17:01 ben_vulpes: time to manually generate some svgs, eh?

17:17:21 asciilifeform: svg sucks.

17:17:40 asciilifeform: and graphviz sucks.

17:17:54 asciilifeform: i was not able to find how to enforce level stepping in it.

17:18:19 asciilifeform: (that is, all 'generations' of patch family tree should occupy a level, strictly)

17:29:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14450 @ 0.00073773 = 10.6602 BTC [+] {2}

17:35:16 asciilifeform: unrelatedly,

17:35:24 asciilifeform: is the otc order book thing entirely stone dead ?

17:35:40 asciilifeform: has anyone here ever actually managed to buy, something other than coin or fiat, there /

17:35:41 asciilifeform: ?

17:36:11 ben_vulpes: mnope.

17:36:22 asciilifeform: this is kinda a continuation of the ancient 'ebay' thread.

17:36:22 ben_vulpes: but the dream of distributed marketplaces is alive in #otc.

17:36:30 asciilifeform: dream ahahaha lol

17:36:40 ben_vulpes: ahaha look at all of these python tabs i can close now

17:37:55 asciilifeform: this is also a continuation of http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=03-09-2015#1260662

17:37:55 assbot: Logged on 03-09-2015 02:08:18; mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> the other interesting thing is that the market is segmented in such a way that anyone who doesn't want mcfood ends up paying for ~all~ the alt-crackpotteries, not merely the logical ones << this is a very valid point, and the one spot where alf's ideas re meta-lizzards sound most persuasive. i do not believe the market is gerrymandered as it is by accident.

17:38:06 asciilifeform: say i wanna buy an xxxxxtron but don't have $10k.

17:38:18 asciilifeform: it is often possible if i can avoid paying the 'newness tax'

17:38:30 asciilifeform: because i sure as fuck don't ~need~ 'support'

17:38:37 asciilifeform: and i can do without 'warranty' and 'returns'

17:39:02 asciilifeform: and i don't give a flying fuck if the thing has parts made of baby bones and panda fur

17:39:08 asciilifeform: by slave labour in namibia

17:39:38 ben_vulpes: hear hear

17:39:45 ben_vulpes: in other news, i'm off to a baby shower

17:40:01 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: don't throw it out with the bathwater

17:43:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4200 @ 0.00073774 = 3.0985 BTC [+]

18:00:00 asciilifeform: ;;buy 1 "TAIG 2027ER with original vise, and with controller of any make." at 6 BTC

18:00:01 gribble: Error: For identification purposes, you must be identified via GPG to use the order book.

18:01:41 asciilifeform: ;;gpg eauth asciilifeform

18:01:41 gribble: Request successful for user asciilifeform, hostmask asciilifeform!~asciilife@unaffiliated/asciilifeform. Get your encrypted OTP from http://bitcoin-otc.com/otps/B98228A001ABFFC7

18:02:19 asciilifeform: ;;gpg everify freenode:#bitcoin-otc:58850f1a13a4e710af8dc3a896a0d761067daf11abe9fddc336a23aa

18:02:20 gribble: You are now authenticated for user asciilifeform with key B98228A001ABFFC7

18:02:24 asciilifeform: ;;buy 1 "TAIG 2027ER with original vise, and with controller of any make." at 6 BTC

18:02:24 gribble: Order id 22472 created.

18:07:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7000 @ 0.00073326 = 5.1328 BTC [-]

18:07:46 ag3nt_zer0: good morning https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIiYlHS0F0Y

18:07:47 assbot: George Harrison - I Dig Love - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1g3XdBA )

18:09:16 asciilifeform: ;;later tell pete_dushenski take me to the parallel lsd universe where i'm rich !

18:09:17 gribble: The operation succeeded.

18:10:00 asciilifeform: ;;later tell ben_vulpes you would probably gain from rewriting 'v' from scratch, rather than using mine

18:10:00 gribble: The operation succeeded.

18:10:12 ag3nt_zer0: http://www.studiesincomparativereligion.com/Public/articles/The_Contradiction_of_Relativism-by_Frithjof_Schuon.aspx

18:10:14 assbot: "The Contradiction of Relativism" - an essay by Frithjof Schuon ... ( http://bit.ly/1O6FDuy )

18:10:49 asciilifeform: ag3nt_zer0: can you give me a good reason to read this ?

18:11:07 ag3nt_zer0: good morning asciilifeform

18:11:12 ag3nt_zer0: and how are you this sunday?

18:11:12 asciilifeform: 'morning ag3nt_zer0

18:11:31 asciilifeform: short on time.

18:11:40 ag3nt_zer0: have you ever read anything on schuon?

18:11:46 ag3nt_zer0: by schuon

18:11:46 asciilifeform: nope.

18:12:03 ag3nt_zer0: well, imo he is entirely worth reading

18:12:08 ag3nt_zer0: a good reason?

18:12:27 ag3nt_zer0: other than that, no

18:14:27 ag3nt_zer0: also the truth is refreshing, no?

18:14:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2700 @ 0.00072861 = 1.9672 BTC [-]

18:15:01 asciilifeform: snr too low for me.

18:15:54 ag3nt_zer0: and I suppose, for me, that there are minds I quite respect in this room, yours among them, and would hope to hear any thoughts...

18:17:27 ag3nt_zer0: snr = so no reason? :)

18:17:32 asciilifeform: signal/noise ratio

18:17:56 ag3nt_zer0: yeah

18:18:05 ag3nt_zer0: lots of folks seem to have that issue

18:21:05 *: asciilifeform is experimenting with avoiding activities with low snr.

18:21:46 jurov: truth has low snr

18:22:01 asciilifeform: mno.

18:22:07 ag3nt_zer0: if its in a bob marley song maybe

18:24:01 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: politely telling me to take my patches and go home?

18:24:25 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: not really. just that you are wasting brain cycles on puzzling out the peculiarities of my proggy

18:24:43 asciilifeform: could almost certainly come up with a cleaner one if you just took the algo and wrote own

18:25:44 ag3nt_zer0: asciilifeform: I am pretty sure I ended up at http://cluborlov.blogspot.com due to you referencing the unspell project... do you have any more leads on smart blogs for geopolitics/economics etc?

18:25:46 assbot: ClubOrlov ... ( http://bit.ly/1g3YR6b )

18:25:54 ben_vulpes: and just as certainly leave you complaining that things never get done unless you do them yourself.

18:29:19 ag3nt_zer0: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJzJmUGx5oM

18:29:20 assbot: Beck - Cycle + Morning - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1O6Gv2s )

18:30:15 *: trinque spends weeks on a song in Renoise to find it wont export WAVs

18:30:19 trinque: ACK, MOTHERLAAAAND

18:32:23 ag3nt_zer0: trinque: you write music? cool!

18:32:34 ag3nt_zer0: published any tracks

18:32:35 ag3nt_zer0: ?

18:33:15 trinque: nah, if I ever get this one to export maybe I'll throw on the www

18:33:31 trinque: but I'm solidly in the hobbyist category

18:33:46 trinque: this might be the first one I'm at all pleased with

18:39:51 ag3nt_zer0: on another topic, I wonder is there anything a programming illiterate, or super noob relative to the experience level in here, can do to make himself useful to the ongoing labors of this group?

18:41:35 kakobrekla: lets turn this around, what _can_ you do?

18:41:38 jurov: ag3nt_zer0: there's qntra, for example

18:41:48 BingoBoingo: ^

18:42:10 deedbot-: [Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] Mommy bloggers unite! - http://www.contravex.com/2015/09/06/mommy-bloggers-unite/

18:46:25 trinque: ag3nt_zer0: should you wanna take care of that literacy, I've got a chick going through that interactive SICP, seems to be working out for her

18:46:34 trinque: she also made it through mod6's gentoo guide

18:46:42 ag3nt_zer0: kakobrekla: well I used to think I was a decent wordsmith until I stumbled onto fraudsters contravex and loperos haha... but yeah perhaps qntra is something to aspire to contribute to...

18:47:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15400 @ 0.00073773 = 11.361 BTC [+] {3}

18:47:40 trinque: ag3nt_zer0: heh, ego solvent, this place is, eh?

18:47:59 ag3nt_zer0: sure at times

18:48:04 trinque: but better to know yourself and improve

18:48:06 ag3nt_zer0: anything worth its salt is usually

18:52:14 ag3nt_zer0: trinque: thanks looking at SICP

19:08:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16405 @ 0.00073099 = 11.9919 BTC [-] {3}

19:25:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19450 @ 0.0007378 = 14.3502 BTC [+] {3}

19:32:07 BingoBoingo: !up andychase

19:32:35 andychase: Hey BingoBoingo! Copying&Pasting my email now:

19:32:44 andychase: I read your article called "Chain Fork Reveals BIP Process Broken" and I was wondering what your thoughts might be on my recent [BIP/Draft] Committee-based BIP Acceptance Process proposal.

19:32:48 andychase: Although to be honest I had a hard time understanding fully what you were talking about in regards to the flaws in the BIP process. Was it just that the Core Devs hadn't really talked to the miners or understood what was going on?

19:32:52 andychase: -Andy

19:33:36 BingoBoingo: https://gist.github.com/andychase/dddb83c294295879308b << This proposal?

19:33:37 assbot: [BIP/Draft] Committee-based BIP Acceptance Process [Dev] · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZNMPO )

19:33:52 andychase: Yeah, that's the one

19:34:18 BingoBoingo: Honestly it is really too late for further BIPs to really be considered at all

19:35:19 andychase: Hm, what do you mean? There's quite a few being considered right now and all the time.

19:37:02 BingoBoingo: Sure, but the least controversial one (BIP 66) still created a huge shitshow when it was triggered.

19:38:56 mats: how do you define stake anyway

19:39:01 andychase: Well BIP66 fixed a consensus fork for miners running 32-Bit and 64-Bit computers, the shitshow happened because miners weren't validating blocks

19:39:15 andychase: @mats: For which segment?

19:40:25 BingoBoingo: andychase: But the fix in BIP 66 was the least controversial thing in the world and it was a very difficult change because Bitcoin is an actual consensus system.

19:41:13 mats: 'stake in the Bitcoin ecosystem' seems written specifically not to mean anything useful

19:41:14 BingoBoingo: If the BIP to enforce stricter signature encoding standards nearly failed, how is any other BIP to succeed now?

19:41:24 andychase: @mats: For miners it means hashpower

19:41:34 andychase: @mats: Users it means userbase

19:41:43 andychase: @mats: Merchants it means economic activity

19:42:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14800 @ 0.00072986 = 10.8019 BTC [-] {2}

19:42:09 mats: how about: sign an address with 145,830 coins and maybe you actually have a stake

19:42:24 andychase: That's "vote by how much money you have"

19:42:37 andychase: but for merchants that might work, if they'd be up to reaching into their cold wallets

19:43:06 andychase: @bingoboingo: The BIP66 change was easy to "fix", just upgrade your clients and make sure a majority is upgrading before activating

19:43:15 asciilifeform: upgrade ahahahahahaha lol

19:43:22 asciilifeform: andychase: we piss on the 'core devs' here.

19:43:30 asciilifeform: and their idiot client.

19:44:00 shinohai: That statement caused me to eject beer from my nose ....

19:44:15 shinohai: "upgrade"

19:44:20 mats: how many 'oops' hard forks are we up to now? three?

19:44:42 andychase: I think you guys know what I meant :) You can upgrade your btcd client the same way to recieve the BIP66 changes

19:44:57 BingoBoingo: mats: Do the several BIP 66 forks all count as one, or do we have to go back and count them all

19:45:16 mats: eye of the beholder and all that

19:45:21 BingoBoingo: ANd seriously what the fuck is an "upgrade"

19:45:50 andychase: raise (something) to a higher standard, in particular improve (equipment or machinery) by adding or replacing components.

19:45:58 asciilifeform: andychase: therealbitcoin.org -- ~20kloc and shrinking.

19:46:37 andychase: yeah so in your case an upgrade would be replacing components, raising the satoshi client to a higher standard

19:47:01 asciilifeform: andychase: this pointedly does not include adding any subcomponent where gavin, hearn, & co had any say in making.

19:47:44 BingoBoingo: andychase: http://thebitcoin.foundation/

19:47:46 assbot: ..::[ The Bitcoin Foundation ]::.. ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZPY9X )

19:47:59 asciilifeform: andychase: see also http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000115.html

19:48:00 assbot: [BTC-dev] bip66 resolution criteria (corrected) ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZPZdW )

19:48:17 asciilifeform: take them 'upgrades' and stow'em.

19:48:31 asciilifeform: direct inquiries as to ~where~ to stow'em, to mircea_popescu et al.

19:48:42 asciilifeform: iirc he has some good illustrated diagrams.

19:49:44 shinohai: Speak of teh devil ...

19:49:46 andychase: I feel like we've gone a bit off topic a bit. I'd love to hear your opinions on a system for reviewing and indicating full approval on changes to the Bitcoin protocol

19:49:56 andychase: currently the system is the core devs decide

19:50:07 mats: core devs don't decide anything.

19:50:12 mircea_popescu: and how's myfavourite cult this fine morning ?

19:50:28 andychase: well for bips, they decide, and other clients like btcd take their bips into consideration

19:51:18 andychase: I'd like to take that kind of system and move it up so a community like this one can make their opinion validated as part of the process for improving bitcoin

19:51:40 mircea_popescu: you'd what ?

19:51:43 shinohai: "make their opinion validated"

19:52:18 andychase: Basically make your opinion matter by proving that you aren't sock puppet accounts and are actually unique and valuable memebers of the Bitcoin ecosystem

19:52:21 shinohai: I have been so worried all this time that our opinion would never be validated.

19:52:33 andychase: opinion matter more*

19:52:51 asciilifeform: komyoooonitiiiii111111!

19:53:00 shinohai: I think WoT proves we are each unique and valuable members of the community

19:53:09 *: asciilifeform maxed dosimeter, off to meatspace for rest of the day

19:53:55 andychase: If that's true then great, I'd like to take that form of validation and put it into a formal process that can be used for approving or rejecting changes to Bitcoin

19:53:55 mircea_popescu: who are you exactly andychase ?

19:54:10 andychase: I'm a freelance software developer from Oregon

19:54:22 andychase: also reddit.com/u/tytyty_ on reddit

19:54:39 andychase: github.com/andychase

19:54:46 shinohai: !gettrust andychase

19:54:46 assbot: andychase is not registered in WoT.

19:55:05 shinohai: https://j.ludost.net/blog/archives/2015/09/05/rfc-2631_fips_186-3_and_openssls_implementation_of_dsa_appear_broken_and_possibly_backdoored/index.html

19:55:06 assbot: RFC-2631, fips 186-3 and openssl's implementation of DSA appear broken (and possibly backdoored) | ___ ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZR59A )

19:55:20 mircea_popescu: andychase https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuvPhAuQFD4

19:55:21 assbot: Griffin Dunne v Dennis Hopper (Search and Destroy, 1995) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1fJ8J5p )

19:55:23 mircea_popescu: !down andychase

19:55:59 mircea_popescu: and thank you mr scorsese.

20:03:04 ag3nt_zer0: "A patent example of the classic contradiction in question here—a contradiction characterizing for the most part all modern thought—is provided by existentialism, which postulates a definition of the world that is impossible if existentialism itself is possible. There are only two alternatives: either objective knowledge—a knowledge that is therefore absolute in its own order—is possible, which proves that existen

20:03:09 ag3nt_zer0: then its own promulgation is impossible since in the existentialist universe there is no room for an objective and unwavering intellection."

20:03:46 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263876 << dude this guy, https://igcdn-photos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/11849818_393733814153193_1214647642_n.jpg https://igcdn-photos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/11849818_393733814153193_1214647642_n.jpg

20:03:46 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 08:38:05; punkman: https://instagram.com/tokyofashion/

20:03:47 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZi80p )

20:03:47 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZi80p )

20:03:50 mircea_popescu: i wanna meet him.

20:04:07 mircea_popescu: hey most intelligent person in japan, that were on tokyofashion thingee, drop a line.

20:04:48 mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 which illiterate murican fail to understand stuff written in french through the age old process of not being able to read it ?

20:06:29 ag3nt_zer0: which? sorry I don't follow... good day btw

20:07:44 mircea_popescu: who said the thing you quoted ?

20:08:17 ag3nt_zer0: Schuon: http://www.studiesincomparativereligion.com/Public/articles/The_Contradiction_of_Relativism-by_Frithjof_Schuon.aspx

20:08:19 assbot: "The Contradiction of Relativism" - an essay by Frithjof Schuon ... ( http://bit.ly/1O6FDuy )

20:08:52 ag3nt_zer0: likely originally in French...

20:08:59 mircea_popescu: well he totally missed it and doesn't even have the excuse of not speaking the language.

20:09:47 ag3nt_zer0: have you ever read him?

20:10:01 mircea_popescu: mno.

20:10:18 mircea_popescu: but the quote you presented disqualifies him from discussing sartre.

20:10:45 ag3nt_zer0: from my perspective, which may or may not matter, he doesn't seem to be one to be lightly dismissed

20:11:01 ag3nt_zer0: he's right up there with evola and guenon

20:11:23 mircea_popescu: for the following reason : existentialism is the first (and the most logically successful) of the "postmodernisms", taken eventually to their extreme lolzitude by lacan and his unselfaware progeny in the us ("radical feminists" and whatnot).

20:11:40 mircea_popescu: what this means in easily digestible terms among software people is that existentialism is a class.

20:12:04 mircea_popescu: this means you can not use symbols such as "contradiction" without havind properly defined an existentialism.contradiction constructor in the very group.

20:12:17 mircea_popescu: lest you come out with garbage.

20:12:24 mircea_popescu: he doesn't seem aware of this.

20:12:58 ag3nt_zer0: hmmm maybe I would do better to not post a quote out of context

20:13:09 mircea_popescu: up to you :)

20:13:20 mircea_popescu: but the behaviour would seem to indicate ~you~ think he's easily dismissed.

20:13:34 ag3nt_zer0: not at all

20:13:46 mircea_popescu: quoting properly is more complicated than it seems.

20:14:40 ag3nt_zer0: my entire reason for posting links to this material is that I find it hard to dismiss - hoping that some of the minds in here might check out the longforms and tell me what they think...

20:14:43 mircea_popescu: anyway, fwiw, i don't readily see a way to construct this "existentialism is fail because its idea of reality precludes itself" into meaningful criticism.

20:14:54 mircea_popescu: this is a uniquely poor strategy.

20:15:17 mircea_popescu: all it can conceivably achieve is form minor dismissals in the minds here that hadn't prior bothered to consider

20:17:53 ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: if frithjof schuon is illiterate then I must be less than a dog

20:18:55 *: mircea_popescu wasn't there, hasn't seen, everyone on internet ~= dog.

20:19:22 mircea_popescu: i'm a perfectly illiterate chinese scholar, for that matter.

20:19:46 mircea_popescu: kinda why like bombama, i abstain from "oh china is self contradictory" emissions.

20:19:55 mircea_popescu: s/like/unlike/

20:23:08 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263914 << well, less is probably a bridge to far. equally might also be. but i do maintain software can't be MUCH MORE friable than the hardware upon it runs. and i dun think alf disagrees with that much either.

20:23:08 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 12:25:05; ben_vulpes: ;;later tell vextor phuctor has had mains plugs pulled on it several times recenty, and alf's attitude (i believe) is that the thing shoudn't run if its going to have its memory ripped out every time it warms up. remember, it keeps the running product in memory. mircea_popescu's attitude is that "software should be less friable than the hardware upon which it runs". asciilifeform is trying to find the sh

20:23:18 mircea_popescu: !up anton_osika

20:27:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20087 @ 0.00072517 = 14.5665 BTC [-] {2}

20:28:16 mircea_popescu: !up anton_osika

20:29:04 anton_osika: Hello guys, I am having issues with phunctor as you might have guessed.

20:29:38 anton_osika: I got my hands cut off so I cannot make signatures; laptop stolen and broken backup. Got any tips for me?

20:29:58 punkman: test backups next time ;)

20:30:01 mircea_popescu: how are these two related ?

20:30:06 shinohai: Use your feet to pull the trigger on the shotgun.

20:30:36 anton_osika: The hands or the two files?

20:30:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29410 @ 0.00073442 = 21.5993 BTC [+] {5}

20:30:56 mircea_popescu: win. https://igcdn-photos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/e15/11353513_870135393073866_1385626694_n.jpg

20:30:57 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZkpsA )

20:31:00 anton_osika: shinohai: Thank you for the tip.

20:33:19 mircea_popescu: anton_osika your poor backup policies and phuctor.

20:33:48 punkman: wants to test new key perhaps?

20:34:26 anton_osika: I do have ultimate respect for the WoT. Hence I want to have a valid keypair for communicating with goodfellas here.

20:35:12 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263949 << absolutely.

20:35:12 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 15:57:46; asciilifeform: (undetectable bit rot is MUCH WORSE than the idling it does right now)

20:35:27 shinohai: You're welcome anton_osika my advice is free on Sundays :D

20:36:02 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263952 << understand, there's no hardware solution to this problem. you may make the probability less, but the only path to certainty is checking.

20:36:02 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 16:01:36; asciilifeform: with internal battery.

20:36:09 *: punkman punkman wants to hear more about defending against bitrot

20:37:32 anton_osika: shinohai: Excellent. Could you also advice me on how to successfully invite mircea_popescu for dinner at my home in Stockholm?

20:38:19 shinohai: I suppose the same way you would ask any gentleman to dinner.

20:38:32 shinohai: Als, the fail is strong in this one:

20:38:35 shinohai: https://github.com/jumacro/Resty/blob/ac145f7551bf1a118169fff37592a09f401e2a74/server/Components/Email.js

20:38:37 assbot: Resty/Email.js at ac145f7551bf1a118169fff37592a09f401e2a74 · jumacro/Resty · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1NWxcTu )

20:41:02 punkman: shinohai, whole commit is peppered with credentials to various systems

20:42:04 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11000 @ 0.00073215 = 8.0537 BTC [-]

20:42:32 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263954 << 188.68.240.159 is also online, running pressed stator.

20:42:32 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 16:07:45; asciilifeform: this means that at present time there is EXACTLY ONE reliable public therealbitcoin node - zoolag.

20:43:21 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263966 << the only solutions is slavegirls.

20:43:21 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 16:14:41; kakobrekla: but, no time.

20:43:30 mircea_popescu: im not even talking one exceptionally well trained gf. that won't cut it.

20:43:41 mircea_popescu: need a dozen, in various stages of coalescence.

20:44:13 punkman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ptOJ33u1bQ

20:44:14 assbot: Hermeto Pascoal - Slaves Mass (1977) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1NWxDgG )

20:45:42 anton_osika: mircea_popescu: I liked your piece on formalised identity based trust system (WoT). Are there any attempts at extending it to our physical existances such as property?

20:48:21 punkman: !rate backyard 9 it makes fruit?

20:48:21 assbot: backyard is not registered in WoT.

20:49:04 shinohai: xD

20:49:27 shinohai: !rate DatAss 1 Because ... dat ass

20:49:27 assbot: DatAss is not registered in WoT.

20:50:10 shinohai: bbl

20:50:12 punkman: well if you own dat ass, it can get in wot

20:52:09 shinohai: I'll have her come register later when I'm done blowing it up.

20:53:13 anton_osika: My situation as of now is that there is nothing to strictly verify a former fingerprint. However I am the unique holder of the name AntonOsika in Sweden, publicly registered with physical address, so you if you are passing by please find me and I would provide generous housing.

20:54:04 punkman: register with new fingerprint, nobody knew the old one anyway

20:57:39 anton_osika: Well I believe mircea_popescu would honor a contract where the couterparty has no competition at identifying himself. It would be pleasant to extend the notion of trust to identity in the physical domain however.

21:01:35 punkman: !up anton_osika

21:03:01 mircea_popescu: anton_osika what part of property do you imagine is physical ?

21:03:38 anton_osika: Land for example.

21:03:48 anton_osika: Not much else.

21:04:10 mircea_popescu: how is your property of land physical.

21:04:13 mircea_popescu: punkman also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6JN0l7A_mE

21:04:14 assbot: Nabucco - Hebrew Slaves Chorus - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1NWzl1E )

21:04:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6800 @ 0.0007251 = 4.9307 BTC [-] {2}

21:08:15 anton_osika: Well ownership is nothing physical but the underlying. What arguably makes land different is that one can lets ones physical embodiment be placed on the land, and this can be recognised / unchallenged by others

21:08:44 mod6: ;;tslb

21:08:53 gribble: Time since last block: 56 minutes and 56 seconds

21:10:03 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263972 << add to that, "never use known file extensions".

21:10:03 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 16:39:54; ben_vulpes: what are best practices with the mailing list again?

21:10:21 mircea_popescu: fucking subtle undebuggable bullshit, "oh we figured out you're using something of ours, here, it's broken now"

21:12:14 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263999 / /me is popcorning along.

21:12:14 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 16:59:13; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes is right about c_wot

21:13:46 anton_osika: punkman: Thanks for the concern about fingerprint. The issue is this: http://pastebin.com/NbPrZS9A

21:13:47 assbot: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 Future Delivery Contract Fo - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1QiQ39M )

21:14:31 mircea_popescu: these fucking idiots. so eulora is based on modifying work by others. those others have done the following thing : the dialogue of a npc is contained in a table. that table has fields. those fields are "reply 1" "reply 2" and so up to 5. why to 5 ?

21:14:40 mircea_popescu: BECAUSE IT IS A RULE OF THE UNIVERSE THAT ALL THINGS HAVE 5 REPLIES!!1

21:14:51 mircea_popescu: this is how you use databases now, by counting the fucking fileds.

21:14:53 thestringpuller: planeshift?

21:15:08 punkman: mircea_popescu: very common with mysql folks

21:15:12 mircea_popescu: field1, field2 and who the fuck was responsible with raping these idiots as 5yo and discarding the bloodied remains in a ditch did a horrible job

21:15:24 mircea_popescu: the same thing is observed not just here, but THROUGHOUT

21:15:40 mircea_popescu: and is not limited to the db. here, have a magic number in code, because THAT IS WHAT CODE IS FOR!11

21:15:47 thestringpuller: Yea Planeshift has a lot of quirks like that.

21:15:51 mircea_popescu: quirks ?

21:15:55 mircea_popescu: these aren't "quirks"

21:16:19 mircea_popescu: these are the unfortunate results downstream of insufficient five year olds being raped to death and discarded in a ditch.

21:16:31 thestringpuller: P. much.

21:17:13 anton_osika: antonosika has to sign a document stating the location of delivery. He however involuntarily lost his hands. So he can't sign documents anymore.

21:17:40 anton_osika: That's why I'm harassing mircea_popescu until I make him smile.

21:18:13 anton_osika: So long. Thanks for the voice until I can become friends with phunctor.

21:19:47 anton_osika: And again, my physical embodiment is openly registered, if you are in the neighbourhood mircea_popescu. And I might not be as dumb as it seems from the backup policies ..

21:20:04 mircea_popescu: im in fucking buenos aires

21:20:06 mircea_popescu: what neighbourhood ?

21:21:03 *: mircea_popescu is still raging over the db thing. who the fuck does this. who the fuck makes labels for items in a database WITH THEIR OWN BAKED IN INDEXES!

21:21:18 mircea_popescu: the moment you go to write "field"+number you should fucking realise YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG.

21:21:25 mircea_popescu: compeletely, utterly wrong from hell.

21:21:56 punkman: mircea_popescu: just curious if this clause "and that ETH trades on a reputable exchange in total value of at least 100 BTC prior to the date of delivery" would be fulfilled by Poloniex, Kraken or any other exchange listed at http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/ethereum/#markets

21:21:56 assbot: Ethereum (ETH) price, charts, and info | Crypto-Currency Market Capitalizations ... ( http://bit.ly/1NWB4nG )

21:22:26 mircea_popescu: punkman where's that clause from ?

21:22:38 punkman: anton_osika's ETH contract

21:23:00 mircea_popescu: link or something ?

21:23:17 punkman: http://pastebin.com/NbPrZS9A

21:23:18 assbot: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 Future Delivery Contract Fo - Pastebin.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1QiQ39M )

21:24:00 mircea_popescu: ah, that. he never fulfilled his obligations under it iirc.

21:24:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6200 @ 0.0007251 = 4.4956 BTC [-]

21:25:12 mircea_popescu: o nm, he actualy did

21:26:03 mircea_popescu: https://blockchain.info/tx/2d1ed3f47a6ec0194d8855eec37c252506203ef7d6f5643bba17f7c244a45b00

21:26:04 assbot: Bitcoin Transaction 2d1ed3f47a6ec0194d8855eec37c252506203ef7d6f5643bba17f7c244a45b00 ... ( http://bit.ly/1NWBhHu )

21:26:48 mircea_popescu: so wait, what happened here is i just profited 3 btc off this guy's backup failure ?!

21:27:26 thestringpuller: "Fellow miners, Some of you receive emails and phone calls from developers. I am not big enough to get that treatment." << LOL. And this is why you side with BIP-101

21:27:29 mircea_popescu: ;;calc 0.00541072 * 15000

21:27:29 gribble: 81.1608

21:28:36 punkman: poor anton

21:28:41 mircea_popescu: that's a valuable laptop.

21:30:00 punkman: should have generated ETH address to put in contract

21:30:45 thestringpuller: http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-venture-capital/ << oh look at that.

21:30:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19850 @ 0.00073529 = 14.5955 BTC [+] {3}

21:32:51 mircea_popescu: punkman at the time you cou;dn't have.

21:34:40 punkman: I think they had published enough code then and they had some stupid application for direct buyers

21:42:32 mircea_popescu: not iirc.

21:42:41 punkman: PSA: print your ascii-armored keys out. don't use a xerox.

21:43:04 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23000 @ 0.00073791 = 16.9719 BTC [+]

21:43:49 mircea_popescu: lol

21:44:13 mircea_popescu: the one point nobody seems to have noticed re that : use mp style fonts (14 point bold) you won't have a problem.

21:44:27 mircea_popescu: use shitass cheapo "businessman" 8 pt thin sans, you're asking to be fucked.

21:47:05 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264012 << why would either work ?!

21:47:05 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 17:05:49; asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: btw i find it interesting that nobody has yet noticed that 1) broken chains 2) orphaned subchains of any length whatsoever --- do not work

21:50:39 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264041 << it's open source right ? that means people can come later and fix it so it works as it should, right ?

21:50:39 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 17:17:54; asciilifeform: i was not able to find how to enforce level stepping in it.

21:50:43 mircea_popescu: SOFTWARE PARADIGM!!11

21:51:33 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264046 << occasionally.

21:51:33 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 17:35:40; asciilifeform: has anyone here ever actually managed to buy, something other than coin or fiat, there /

21:52:00 mircea_popescu: but more of a fleamarket thing than an electronics supply shop thing

21:56:01 BingoBoingo: !up ufoinc__

21:59:23 BingoBoingo: https://archive.is/P4wMn << the butthurt

21:59:24 assbot: amheekin comments on Cookie Monsters!!! ...and other stuff I've baked. ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKDEHh )

21:59:55 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264067 << it occurs to me that if we're going to do this, we might as well do it on assbot otc.

21:59:55 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 18:01:41; asciilifeform: ;;gpg eauth asciilifeform

22:00:04 punkman: mircea_popescu: orphaned is not the right word there, consider that if the last two patches in your V set create two branches, you can't choose a branch. V will try to apply both and doesn't check filehashes during the patching process.

22:00:13 mircea_popescu: moreover, something like this might actually be a perfect solution for my marketplace idea too. i wanna buy all sorts of things like 3d models etc.

22:00:30 mircea_popescu: punkman this dawned on me presently. ouch.

22:01:07 mircea_popescu: btw punkman would you be interested in implementing a otc-marketplace clone ?

22:01:09 ag3nt_zer0: http://www.forbes.com/sites/nealegodfrey/2015/09/06/how-stupid-can-you-be-with-money-ask-lottery-winners/

22:01:10 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKDQGh )

22:01:13 ag3nt_zer0: "Jack Whittaker won $315 million and ten years later, his daughter and granddaughter had both died of drug overdoses, his wife divorced him, and once while in a strip club, he was drugged and robbed of $545,000 in cash"

22:02:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41833 @ 0.00073801 = 30.8732 BTC [+] {3}

22:02:34 mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 to my eyes this is more a failure of western society than of whittaker himself.

22:02:56 mircea_popescu: i can readily believe that most of the problem was, jack fully expected to be able to BUY THINGS FOR HIS MONEY.

22:02:56 ag3nt_zer0: yeah?

22:03:04 mircea_popescu: whereas this is not "how the world works"

22:03:24 mircea_popescu: he can "win" 315 mn, but he sure as fuck may not turn that into 1mn turkeys.

22:04:14 mircea_popescu: the notion that you'd take as much as 500 bucks to a us strip club...

22:04:24 mircea_popescu: seriously, at that level of service they should be paying you to even go.

22:04:36 punkman: mircea_popescu: sure, but can't sysadmin the box it lives on (and don't want to fight ddos other than making application cache better and whatnot)

22:04:43 mircea_popescu: it's more work to be a us strip club customer than to work there.

22:05:21 mircea_popescu: punkman this approach is fundamentally at odds with the "lord over a domain" concept of software development prevalent here.

22:07:39 mircea_popescu: however! it occurs to me this actually would work splendidly with deeds.

22:07:55 ag3nt_zer0: mircea_popescu: what do you mean by this? "he can "win" 315 mn, but he sure as fuck may not turn that into 1mn turkeys."

22:08:05 mircea_popescu: trinque listen, would you consider creating a special deed template, which if satisfied gets taken to amarketplace listing sort-of like otc ? searchable is the important part.

22:08:34 trinque: yeah, that doesn't sound too hard

22:08:44 mircea_popescu: ag3nt_zer0 http://fraudsters.com/2012/lets-dig-a-little-deeper-into-this-entire-deflation-problem/#selection-99.19-103.20

22:08:45 assbot: Let's dig a little deeper into this entire deflation "problem" on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1KUTdAo )

22:08:58 mircea_popescu: trinque one second drawing mockup

22:10:24 trinque: may require freedom-of-speech friendly hosting, depending on what's bought and sold

22:10:41 trinque: currently on McAWS

22:11:21 kakobrekla: speaking of searchable, current deeds are not if im correct?

22:11:30 trinque: correct; haven't done that yet

22:12:00 trinque: so far it's a single page; though this marketplace will likely call for a db

22:12:09 trinque: I will probably still take the flat file approach otherwise; I prefer it

22:14:43 mircea_popescu: trinque http://dpaste.com/3SYPFEM

22:14:44 assbot: dpaste: 3SYPFEM ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKFfNd )

22:16:04 trinque: mircea_popescu: very easy to implement.

22:16:09 mircea_popescu: ikr?

22:16:33 trinque: yeah sounds great. WoT needs a buy/sell board

22:17:03 mircea_popescu: yeah. and i know i do.

22:17:19 trinque: got a recommendation for non-aws hosting?

22:17:28 trinque: I've wanted to move deedbot- off that for a while anyway

22:17:52 mats: https://www.nearlyfreespeech.net

22:17:55 assbot: NearlyFreeSpeech.NET Web Hosting ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKFtnp )

22:18:20 trinque: that'd work once I'm in Houston, as I'm moving my blockchains all onto my own network once there

22:18:24 *: mircea_popescu looks through servers

22:18:29 trinque: I don't suppose they'd offer enough space for one?

22:19:04 trinque: oh, it looks like they in fact do offer a great deal of space

22:19:08 mircea_popescu: trinque im full and before moving i wanna see if jurov actually comes through with something usable

22:19:08 trinque: mats: experience with them?

22:19:18 trinque: mircea_popescu: k

22:19:26 mircea_popescu: but in principle you get free server.

22:20:02 mircea_popescu: once you get the search engine for this, prolly can be applied to deeds too

22:20:10 mircea_popescu: and after that we have a backup in case logs need it

22:20:57 trinque: yep, can be something like categories for particular deeds maybe, this being a "buy/sell"

22:21:02 mircea_popescu: but re the "depending on what's bought and sold", i personally have no qualms whatsoever with negrating into the ground folks who put shit in the board.

22:21:30 mats: trinque: good support, used em a decade ago to host ecommerce sites

22:21:36 trinque: yeah I'd just prefer the 10lb heroin happen on someone else's ass, til I move to the barge

22:21:43 mats: i still hear good things about them on the interwebs so i think they've maintained quality since

22:22:01 trinque: mats: cool

22:22:10 mats: in fact i think alf does?

22:22:39 BingoBoingo: <trinque> yeah I'd just prefer the 10lb heroin happen on someone else's ass, til I move to the barge << Part of the point of a WoT is keeping out people who's publically list such a thing

22:22:46 trinque: indeed.

22:22:48 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: unless you already have dark market connex, you might have to wait for mircea_popescu/trinque's new buy/sell board ;)

22:23:36 trinque: o what trolling have I brought upon meself

22:23:45 mircea_popescu: !rated trinque

22:23:45 assbot: You rated user trinque on 17-Oct-2014, with a rating of 3, and supplied these additional notes: Nice work on the deedbot.

22:23:55 trinque: anyhow, sounds like a great idea; I will start hacking on it in spare cycles

22:24:01 punkman: mircea_popescu: punkman this approach is fundamentally at odds with the "lord over a domain" concept of software development prevalent here. << myeah, last attempt didn't work out too well, and I'd rather make my yearly sysadmining allotment shrink than grow

22:24:03 funkenstein_: asciilifeform, what planet would you prefer to live on?

22:24:21 mircea_popescu: retiring eh ?

22:24:40 punkman: one can aspire

22:24:53 mircea_popescu: yeah, aspies.

22:24:57 funkenstein_: trinque, lol. no, I said no "shouldas". The exercise is to learn from history. But since you mention it, how about alexander the great conquering the new world instead of retarded puritan rejects?

22:25:14 mircea_popescu: what exactly do you like about alex ?

22:25:42 punkman: says "great" on the tin

22:26:07 mircea_popescu: i suspek so, buyt hey, let the man stand on his words.

22:26:08 trinque: !b 3

22:26:09 assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/28WSR5K.txt )

22:26:10 trinque: d'oh

22:26:17 mircea_popescu: lol

22:26:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.0007375 = 9.145 BTC [-] {3}

22:27:19 trinque: funkenstein_: my point was that you are seeing value in people who could not defend themselves. seems to me that's a prerequisite of being valuable in any other way.

22:27:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16800 @ 0.00072673 = 12.2091 BTC [-] {4}

22:29:17 funkenstein_: women and children for example

22:29:23 funkenstein_: programmers in the boxing ring

22:29:25 trinque: or what, if aliens landed, you think they'd want some kind of cultural exchange, rather than to scrape whatever they like out of the earth's crust and ocean, then depart?

22:29:38 mircea_popescu: wait, what ?

22:29:51 mircea_popescu: women and children can't defend themselves ?

22:30:03 mircea_popescu: how come in every fucking conflict it's the men that dioe and the women that survive ?

22:30:22 funkenstein_: well not the conflict we were discussing

22:30:26 mircea_popescu: orly.

22:30:40 trinque: looks from the faces of south americans that some did survive...

22:30:45 mircea_popescu: i suppose the reason mexicans today are short stocky dwarves is that the spanish mutated.

22:30:48 trinque: heh!

22:30:57 funkenstein_: trinque, very important point thank you

22:31:46 mircea_popescu: incidentally /me hates that trait more than any other.

22:31:47 fluffypony: https://i.imgur.com/jwB2ONv.jpg

22:31:48 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKGtb4 )

22:31:55 pete_dushenski: ;;later tell asciilifeform also, 'order id 22472' would indicate that you have more available btc than rothschilds. who's poor now ? (and yes, i understand that no one will ever actually offer you 'taig' via -otc)

22:31:55 gribble: The operation succeeded.

22:32:22 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264213 << all day. i noticed this guy for 'y-3' hoodie

22:32:22 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 20:03:46; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263876 << dude this guy, https://igcdn-photos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/11849818_393733814153193_1214647642_n.jpg https://igcdn-photos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/t51.2885-15/s640x640/sh0.08/e35/11849818_393733814153193_1214647642_n.jpg

22:33:24 pete_dushenski: y-3 was my favourite clothing brand, once upon a time when i cared about such things. ideal collision of sportiness, haute fashion, japaneseness, and obscure brand cachet

22:33:50 pete_dushenski: i still have a y-3 hoodie and basketball jersey in my closet

22:34:18 pete_dushenski: the y-3 'football cleats' were possibly the coolest shoes i ever owned. easily my all-time faves.

22:34:51 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264110 << by the zing ye shall know the zinger.

22:34:51 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 18:25:54; ben_vulpes: and just as certainly leave you complaining that things never get done unless you do them yourself.

22:35:35 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264122 << kako very much has it. do not ask to ask, just ask. what can you do ?

22:35:35 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 18:41:35; kakobrekla: lets turn this around, what _can_ you do?

22:36:01 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264127 << wedding ?

22:36:01 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 18:46:34; trinque: she also made it through mod6's gentoo guide

22:36:51 funkenstein_: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1263694 <- sorry to be that log reader but I'd like to know wtf this means

22:36:51 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 04:42:06; mircea_popescu: must kill because can.

22:37:03 mircea_popescu: !s if you can you must

22:37:04 assbot: 33 results for 'if you can you must' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=if+you+can+you+must

22:37:07 mircea_popescu: see ?

22:37:24 funkenstein_: so shall I program because I can?

22:37:44 mircea_popescu: see also http://fraudsters.com/2013/the-corn-thing/

22:37:45 assbot: The corn thing on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKGRX2 )

22:37:51 punkman: funkenstein_: inevitably

22:37:59 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ you might misjudge your can on that score.

22:38:09 mircea_popescu: yes, if you actually could, you inescapably would be.

22:38:29 funkenstein_: because I was under the impression you were encouraging us to have direction and intent in our efforts

22:38:44 mircea_popescu: actual rather than putative, tho.

22:38:55 trinque: mircea_popescu: nah, she's got a few screws loose and doesn't see fit to let me handle 'em with a screwdriver

22:38:59 trinque: bad jurisdiction

22:39:01 trinque: :p

22:39:10 mircea_popescu: lol

22:39:15 mircea_popescu: is she getting wotroduced ?

22:39:23 trinque: neh, she can find her own way here if she does

22:39:34 mircea_popescu: what's this your sister or something ?

22:39:39 trinque: nah, ex

22:39:53 mircea_popescu: worse huh :D

22:39:54 *: trinque leaves a trail of productive women behind him

22:40:11 mircea_popescu: why leave ? why not just you know, have them love each other.

22:40:18 mircea_popescu: then you won't be able to leave the house anymore.

22:40:20 mircea_popescu: like kakobrekla

22:40:24 trinque: culturally retarded is why

22:40:24 funkenstein_: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264159 <-- http://coin-vote.com/poll/55e8a33299baadff0a34acb7

22:40:24 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 19:42:24; andychase: That's "vote by how much money you have"

22:40:26 assbot: Coin-Vote ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKH3FZ )

22:40:42 funkenstein_: "built because could"

22:41:35 mircea_popescu: aha.

22:41:58 pete_dushenski: trinque: this same clinton voter girl ?

22:42:06 trinque: nah that's a different one

22:42:26 pete_dushenski: ah, what's this one's cultural retardation then ?

22:43:01 mircea_popescu: what, a woman can'tr vote for clinton if she wants to now ?!

22:43:21 trinque: to summarize, demanding equality while psychologically needing me to set the boundaries

22:43:33 trinque: mircea_popescu: can vote however she likes; that's just a different chick

22:43:46 mircea_popescu: dude if that's your criteria you've excluded a supermajority

22:43:49 mircea_popescu: in the sense of > 100%

22:44:25 mircea_popescu: but anyway, enough of this pestering guy into a discussion of things he didn't particularly care to discuss.

22:44:30 trinque: heh

22:44:44 trinque: I know others that rock my goddamn boat less, and get more done

22:44:49 btcdrak: BIPCBBSRA is now BIP105

22:45:07 btcdrak: funkenstein_

22:45:21 mircea_popescu: i think longer amount of letter numbers is better bips

22:45:26 pete_dushenski: oh more bips ?

22:45:34 pete_dushenski: more 'debates' ?

22:45:39 funkenstein_: aha thanks

22:45:58 funkenstein_: gotta run sorry, i need a dozen like kakobrekla does - have a good weekend y'all

22:45:59 pete_dushenski: 66 v. 100 v. 101 v. 105 v. your mom

22:46:05 funkenstein_: lol

22:46:13 btcdrak: also, the question is sort of bogus. Blocksize does not help bitcoin scale.

22:46:23 pete_dushenski: ya don't say

22:46:31 funkenstein_: good point..

22:46:32 punkman: davout's BIP000 is the only credible choice

22:47:20 btcdrak: the question needs to be something like "What is the best proposal for blocksize" or whatever

22:47:36 mircea_popescu: btcdrak it is always easier to "rainse awareness" and "solve" problems you imagined than doing something useful.

22:47:37 btcdrak: new altcoin idea: zeroblock.

22:49:33 pete_dushenski: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/adidas-yohji-yamamoto-y-3-y3-football-shoes-sneakers-12-uk-/252059365142?hash=item3aafe8af16 << aforementioned dream sneakers, well-loved y-3 'football' shoes.

22:49:34 assbot: Adidas Yohji Yamamoto Y 3 Y3 Football Shoes Sneakers 12 UK | eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKHM9Y )

22:50:02 mircea_popescu: anyway, /me is pretty well amused as to how the color revolution experts got color revolutioned up the ass, so hard their head's spinning.

22:50:27 mircea_popescu: you hear that nuland ? you ain't got the resources to compete. not good enough.

22:51:30 mircea_popescu: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1162575.0;all << in that lulzvein. "the people" now creating proposals for voting mechanisms to score the proposals for blabla.

22:51:33 assbot: Voting for block size increase proposals ... ( http://bit.ly/1JKHTT8 )

22:51:41 punkman: bulldozer was totally the best color

22:52:49 mircea_popescu: the entire decapitation of gavin thing, with its attendant disbelief on the enemy side and misallocation of resources/misinvestment of assets in dead pockets was such a major defeat for the usg, "the tikrit offensive"'s nothing compared.

22:54:13 mircea_popescu: (but yes, i'm sure "if they really wanted to", meta-etc and so forth, things could have been very different bla bla)

22:54:57 pete_dushenski: "next time" (tm)

22:56:07 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-09-2015#1264353 << lel. that's one way to win.

22:56:07 assbot: Logged on 06-09-2015 21:26:48; mircea_popescu: so wait, what happened here is i just profited 3 btc off this guy's backup failure ?!

22:56:31 pete_dushenski: "many ways to skin a cat"

23:01:05 mats: http://as2914.net

23:01:07 assbot: NTT Internet BGP Visualization ... ( http://bit.ly/1iqAhhE )

23:01:19 pete_dushenski: !up refferedbyloper_

23:02:31 pete_dushenski: !up refferedbyloper

23:03:37 mats: why

23:07:59 mircea_popescu: i dunno. oddly the stan brood never talks.

23:09:02 mats: vicious audience

23:09:36 mircea_popescu: i guess sohuh

23:10:06 punkman: what, two people showed up to ask about phuctor not working today

23:11:09 mircea_popescu: i just meant the webirc link he has

23:11:41 mircea_popescu: (i took mine out, because they fucktardedly started using javscript google captcha)

23:12:21 punkman: google captcha: the only captcha that works, and only because google knows everyone

23:12:58 mircea_popescu: works my foot.

23:20:24 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla http://dpaste.com/1AJ9NGR plox

23:20:26 assbot: dpaste: 1AJ9NGR ... ( http://bit.ly/1iqBrtA )

23:20:38 pete_dushenski: "Here in Seattle, where the first stage of a $15-an-hour minimum wage law took effect in April, Ivar’s seafood restaurants switched to an all-inclusive menu. By raising prices 21 percent and ending tipping, Bob C. Donegan, the president and co-owner, calculated he could increase everyone’s wages." << welcome to japan. i guess the pearl harbour invasion stuck after all.

23:20:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18800 @ 0.00072579 = 13.6449 BTC [+] {3}

23:21:54 punkman: what does the all-inclusive menu and no tipping add?

23:22:13 mircea_popescu: nothing. who the fuck eats "all inclusive", waht is this, ivar's school cafeteria ?

23:22:31 pete_dushenski: complete loss of the profit motive for the wait staff

23:24:10 kakobrekla: mircea_popescu done

23:25:01 pete_dushenski: "The No. 1 complaint from customers? The prohibition on tips. So while the menu still states that prices include service, the credit card slips now have a line that reads: “If you INSIST on leaving a tip, write it here.”" << mkay this is the icing on the stupid cake. at least in japan, leaving a tip is tantamount to slapping the server's mother with your flaccid cock.

23:25:25 pete_dushenski: but in the united states of workerdignity, you can't leave a tip. unless you do.

23:26:01 pete_dushenski: and of course, the server will still be tickled pink because that's the ~culture~

23:26:15 pete_dushenski: you're supposed to tip in north america

23:26:51 pete_dushenski: goddam socialists always trying to superimpose utopia and shove a square peg in a round hole

23:26:56 punkman: tipping every single idiot seems quite strange to me

23:27:28 pete_dushenski: you mean every server at every meal ? or kitchen staff ?

23:27:55 pete_dushenski: because i agree that kitchen staff should take their salary and shut up

23:28:19 pete_dushenski: though here, 'tip splitting' is the de facto food insdustry standard

23:28:53 pete_dushenski: the kitchen always gets a cut, so a server might only see 3-4% of a 10% tip, so she won't be too pleased

23:29:10 pete_dushenski: so 15-20% becomes 'acceptable' in their dumb heads

23:29:26 punkman: you do a good job, or maybe your ass looked good, or I just felt like it, you get a tip

23:30:00 pete_dushenski: to the point where i've seen credit card and debit card terminals that ask if you want to tip one of three pre-selected amounts : 15%, 20%, or 25%.

23:30:16 pete_dushenski: i'm pretty sure there are even 20-25-30 ones about, which is lunacy on a stick

23:30:22 punkman: lol

23:32:10 pete_dushenski: nothing irks me quite like holier-than-thou bellboys though, once had one in nyc who flat-out rejected $2. "not enough". because 0>2 in his fucking sandfilled head

23:34:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45593 @ 0.00073787 = 33.6417 BTC [+] {5}

23:39:01 mircea_popescu: usistan not hungry enough.

23:40:57 punkman: http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/09/countries-difficult-visas-travel/403267/?single_page=true

23:40:58 assbot: The Countries Where It's Most Difficult to Get a Visa - The Atlantic ... ( http://bit.ly/1iqColy )

23:41:28 pete_dushenski: in my experience : brazil

23:41:30 pete_dushenski: bbiab

23:42:23 mircea_popescu: https://j.ludost.net/blog/archives/2015/09/05/rfc-2631_fips_186-3_and_openssls_implementation_of_dsa_appear_broken_and_possibly_backdoored/index.html << this probably needs a repost. via shinohai

23:42:24 assbot: RFC-2631, fips 186-3 and openssl's implementation of DSA appear broken (and possibly backdoored) | ___ ... ( http://bit.ly/1JZR59A )

23:46:21 mircea_popescu: ml also interesting for all the misdirection and denial work Peter Gutmann pgut001@cs.auckland.ac.nz sinks into the matter.

23:47:30 mircea_popescu: (cryptlib / gnupg 2.x guy)

23:55:58 shinohai: I would be absolutely miserable working for a place like this: http://thenextweb.com/lifehacks/2015/09/05/what-it-means-to-build-a-culture-of-positivity/

23:55:59 assbot: What it means to build a culture of positivity ... ( http://bit.ly/1iqD5LH )

23:56:10 punkman: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/09/04/mozilla_firefox_bugzilla_leak/

23:56:11 assbot: Hackers spent at least a year spying on Mozilla to discover Firefox security holes – and exploit them • The Register ... ( http://bit.ly/1iqD4HV )

23:56:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13250 @ 0.00072481 = 9.6037 BTC [-] {3}

23:56:28 shinohai: What kind of poppycock is that? Won't hire me if I have been negative online.

23:57:47 punkman: "According to the FAQ, a total of 185 secret bugs leaked. Of those, Mozilla categorizes 53 as "severe vulnerabilities." The oldest of those went unpatched for 335 or more days"

23:58:07 punkman: when do we start making a browser?

23:58:17 shinohai: 335 days O.o

23:58:37 punkman: well yeah they had important "Features" to work on first

23:59:11 shinohai: I'd like a browser that doesn't break every time it updates every 3 days

23:59:58 jurov: coinbr progress report: there's light in the end of tunnel, analysis of last two mixed up orders left