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Transcript for 10-01-2016, 1101 lines:

00:03:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6358 @ 0.00048937 = 3.1114 BTC [+] {2}

00:10:01 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8854 @ 0.00048946 = 4.3337 BTC [+] {2}

00:23:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6302 @ 0.00049115 = 3.0952 BTC [+] {3}

01:05:56 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5579 @ 0.00049351 = 2.7533 BTC [+] {2}

01:06:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9621 @ 0.00049732 = 4.7847 BTC [+] {2}

01:07:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9258 @ 0.00049323 = 4.5663 BTC [-] {2}

01:37:34 deedbot-: [fraudsters] The big day. - http://fraudsters.com/2016/the-big-day/

01:52:21 ben_vulpes: trinque: is there a reason verify.mk uses `SHA512' instead of `sha512'?

01:52:38 *: ben_vulpes reads, nm

02:04:47 trinque: ben_vulpes: that's one of the knobs

02:06:45 *: ben_vulpes twiddles

02:07:46 ben_vulpes: i already ripped the -s flag off the boost download, 'cuz i'm impatient and curious.

02:19:26 ben_vulpes: trinque: build/Makefile:16 `tar xvf' -> `tar xvzf` << any reason i shouldn't do this?

02:19:46 ben_vulpes: without, tar complains that the file uses gzip and that one must provide the `z' flag.

02:21:08 trinque: ben_vulpes: a verbosity knob might be nice

02:21:24 ben_vulpes: i'm talking about the gzip flag.

02:22:10 trinque: ben_vulpes │ i already ripped the -s flag off the boost download, 'cuz i'm impatient and curious. <<

02:22:22 trinque: but yeah I'll add that to the tar cmd

02:22:41 ben_vulpes: aha.

02:23:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3700 @ 0.00048471 = 1.7934 BTC [-] {2}

02:24:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4639 @ 0.00048471 = 2.2486 BTC [-]

02:26:14 ben_vulpes: trinque: fired your makefiles on obsd yet?

02:30:01 trinque: yeah, buildroot is very unhappy.

02:30:29 trinque: understandably so, as I understand that thing to be linux specific

02:30:45 ben_vulpes: that'd be it then.

02:31:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9300 @ 0.00048406 = 4.5018 BTC [-] {4}

02:31:51 trinque: at least pulling the deps/shit works with make SHA512=sha512

02:32:47 trinque: ben_vulpes: and in fact if the buildroot step were stuck inside Makefile.rotor, it'd be trivial to have a Makefile.openbsd aside it

02:33:06 trinque: then it'd be make BUILDER=openbsd SHA512=sha512

02:34:47 trinque: V setup works fine on openbsd

02:35:30 trinque: yep, I'm moving buildroot, makes total sense

02:36:20 ben_vulpes: cool.

02:36:52 ben_vulpes: neat stuff, dood.

02:38:48 ben_vulpes: gotcha, okay, starting to see how this all fits together.

02:39:36 trinque: ben_vulpes │ neat stuff, dood. << ty

02:44:33 ben_vulpes: ping me when you have new makefiles, i'm going to remap keys and engage in other weeding-type activities on this machine

02:44:58 trinque: ben_vulpes: I'll probably not throw another onto the mailing list before fixing the boost build

02:45:10 trinque: maybe tomorrow

02:45:52 ben_vulpes: fix << meaning address the failed targets?

02:46:20 trinque: yeah

02:46:47 trinque: || true << abominable

02:48:17 ben_vulpes: hail satan

03:08:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5170 @ 0.0004879 = 2.5224 BTC [+] {2}

03:21:26 punkman: http://kotaku.com/5784314/the-nintendo-theyve-tried-to-forget-gambling-gangsters-and-love-hotels

03:21:27 assbot: The Nintendo They've Tried to Forget: Gambling, Gangsters, and Love Hotels ... ( http://bit.ly/1OHuCQY )

03:25:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8900 @ 0.0004936 = 4.393 BTC [+] {4}

03:32:23 mircea_popescu: ahaha what the fuck "or true"

03:32:38 mircea_popescu: !up saifedean

03:33:00 mircea_popescu: but yeh, nice script you got there trinque

03:33:06 saifedean: good evening, everyone!

03:33:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40799 @ 0.00048201 = 19.6655 BTC [-] {6}

03:34:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5500 @ 0.00047927 = 2.636 BTC [-]

03:35:23 mircea_popescu: how goes lebanon ?

03:36:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2900 @ 0.00047485 = 1.3771 BTC [-]

03:37:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9400 @ 0.00047463 = 4.4615 BTC [-] {3}

03:38:15 saifedean: lebanon is as it always is, mundanely on the precipice of exploding

03:38:45 saifedean: people hating each other and religious wars escalating everywhere... but... you know... the party must go on

03:39:22 saifedean: unfortunately i'm not there for the next few months, moved to Windsor, Ontario, of all fucking places, the exact opposite of Lebanon if ever there was one

03:39:56 mircea_popescu: lol

03:40:23 mircea_popescu: who the fuck lives in ontario for the winter and in damascus for the civil war.

03:41:35 saifedean: haha, well-put

03:42:19 saifedean: well, the wife is due to deliver our first child in the next month or so, and we decided to come give birth here where my in-laws are, ensuring the girl gets the Canadian passport

03:43:49 saifedean: it's not the most exciting place in the world, but it's across the river from detroit, which stands as a constant reminded that shit could be worse

03:43:56 mircea_popescu: i can see it.

03:44:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21950 @ 0.00047254 = 10.3723 BTC [-] {6}

03:45:33 saifedean: this place is so deadly boring it's unreal, but at least it's not a terribly cold winter, and I'm getting plenty of reading done... Also, it's not like you need much excitement to add to your life when you're expecting

03:46:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6750 @ 0.00047125 = 3.1809 BTC [-] {3}

03:46:43 mircea_popescu: well... the woman's expecting. you're just reading.

03:47:40 saifedean: well, not quite, there's a surprisingly large amount of stuff to do, learn, and decide if you choose not to hand over the entire process to the medical bezzle

03:47:49 mircea_popescu: o, that.

03:49:01 saifedean: this has been an enormously edifying experience... most important lesson learned is that handing over a pregnant woman to a hospital and obgyn is fucking nuts

03:49:38 saifedean: the bezzle has completely destroyed people's conception of what birth is

03:50:17 saifedean: it's treated like an emergency like a car crash, when it's a natural process like sex

03:50:44 mircea_popescu: and the internet has ruined people's idea of what makes good storytelling. don't summarize, be specific.

03:50:58 saifedean: trying to give birth in hospital makes as much sense as trying to have sex there

03:51:11 mircea_popescu: you never banged in a hosptial ?

03:51:17 mircea_popescu: dead people make me horny.

03:52:59 saifedean: essentially: if a woman is left on her own in a comfortable setting with the father, her body will do all the work and pop the baby out painlessly and even pleasurably, the baby comes out healthy and looks for the tit to feed, it stays connected to the umbilical chord and placenta for a few days, the placenta empties all the nutrients and blood into the baby, and the baby grows healthy

03:53:31 saifedean: all the complications of birth come precisely from the medical bezzle trying to barge in on this natural process to make a buck, basically

03:53:54 mircea_popescu: look into "health" circumcision sometime.

03:54:17 mircea_popescu: but anyway. natural birth has a huge following in the states. almost unknown in yurp.

03:54:56 saifedean: they'll whisk her in an ambulance and freak the shit out of her, causing her vagina to contract just when it needs to expand. this then necessitates painful pushing, which usually doesn't work, necessitating cutting up and stitching, the baby comes out bloody and bruised and the woman can't breastfeed for hours, which will then destroy the baby's ability to latch properly

03:55:24 saifedean: and most brutally, the fucking doctor wanting to go home quickly means he'll cut the umbilical chord immediately, suffocating the child and depriving him of about a third of his blood

03:56:24 saifedean: this for me is the difference between the barbarian and civilized humans today: the civilized have the time and choice to wait on the placenta to empty into the baby. The barbarians are told by the doctor the placenta should be cut immediately

03:56:32 mircea_popescu: who the fuck goes to the maternity ward in an ambulance ?!

03:56:57 saifedean: people with insurance, that's who

03:57:06 mircea_popescu: no way. srsly ?!

03:57:09 saifedean: "you don't wanna take chances with your baby's health"

03:57:11 mircea_popescu: there can't be enough fucking ambulances.

03:57:25 saifedean: the stuff you learn will blow your mind

03:59:09 saifedean: also, the post-birth interventions they do in the medical bezzle are astonishing... within an hour or so, the baby wil have had a vaccine against Hepatitis B, which I guess makes sense if you intend to pimp the child out in the first week. they'll give them an eye drop to protect against the possibility of the mom having chlamydia, regardless of whether she has it or not, thus destroying the child's vision for a few days..

03:59:52 saifedean: and then, the coup de grace, they give him a little sugar in the first hour to drug him and stop him crying from being separated from his mom while they do all the bezzle they wanna do

04:00:01 mircea_popescu: o yeah, the whole first day vaccination business is both novel and outrageous.

04:00:35 saifedean: all of which is not just unnecessary, but actively harmful. the child needs absolutely nothing in their first hours except their mom's milk. They need nothing for the first 6 months except her milk and sunshine

04:00:55 mircea_popescu: not all kids actually want to eat immediately.

04:01:36 saifedean: but the interventionist bezzle logic we have all come to know and love from economics is applied with vigor at birth, producing mentally, physically and emotionally stunted idiots ready for the modern world's demands

04:02:03 saifedean: breastfeeding in the first hour is essential for the child and for the mom's breasts, it's part of the birth process

04:02:36 mircea_popescu: not all women actually can breastfeed altogether.

04:02:47 saifedean: the child should learn to latch onto the tit before anything else. In the fucking bezzle they give them the pacifier before the tit, and then they'll never latch properly... which happily enough creates endless business for Gerber and other peddlers of poison

04:02:58 asciilifeform: !up saifedean

04:03:07 mircea_popescu: !gettrust assbot saifedean

04:03:07 assbot: saifedean is not registered in WoT.

04:03:08 saifedean: if she can get pregnant, she can breastfeed, it's all part of the same package

04:03:24 mircea_popescu: heh if only. if you can get it up, you can make her come, too ?

04:03:47 saifedean: the problems of breastfeeding all come from the mom not being given the child to breastfeed immediately

04:04:37 saifedean: inaccurate analogy, since she's another human. but if her body can carry a baby for 9 months, and if she eats well and takes care of herself, she will get milk

04:05:16 saifedean: she could fuck it all up of course, but it takes deliberate human fuckery to stop her breastfeeding

04:05:31 mircea_popescu: it's a body, anything in it can not work.

04:05:35 saifedean: and of course, a big, big part of this is diet, what the mom eats before, during, and after pregnancy

04:06:19 mircea_popescu: or whether she has a tyroid condition. or cystic ovaries. or or or.

04:06:20 saifedean: if you can get your dick up, you can fuck with it. Doesn't mean you will... you could still fuck it up.

04:06:54 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 556 @ 0.0042 = 2.3352 BTC [+]

04:07:30 saifedean: she's got to actively fuck it up for her to not breastfeed... look at all real world examples, and you find a woman who ate shit, or who had a caesarian and didn't bother try breastfeeding for a few days, or as is usually the case, a woman who just can't be bothered and came up wiht a story

04:07:49 mircea_popescu: looky, i appreciate the youthful activist and half-doctor approach, but srsly, talk to an actual clinician. it doesn't always work. it sucks that it doesn't, it's maybe overreported, it's often just fancies in the woman's head, but not always. sometimes it dun work.

04:07:50 saifedean: of course the medical bezzle is always happy to oblige with "conditions"

04:08:46 saifedean: appreciate the faith in your clinician, but don't listen to those guys if you're having a child of your own, they're not in it for your benefit, they have med school loans to pay

04:09:07 saifedean: and they can't pay them if they deviate from the script...

04:09:25 trinque: I'll give it a coupla drops of truth in a bucket of rhetoric

04:09:26 saifedean: do you also talk to an economist phd to get your perspective on Bitcoin?

04:09:48 mircea_popescu: heh, i knew doctors with half century's experience before money was even fucking invented, you kidding me ?

04:10:31 saifedean: I'd recommend you folks check out this book: http://www.amazon.ca/Nourishing-Traditions-Book-Baby-Child/dp/0982338317

04:10:32 assbot: The Nourishing Traditions Book of Baby & Child Care: Sally Fallon Morell, Thomas S. Cowan: 9780982338315: Books - Amazon.ca ... ( http://bit.ly/1OHxoWD )

04:10:33 mircea_popescu: and yes i talk to economists. as it happens the brightest mind in banking alive today is from my old country.

04:10:58 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 298 @ 0.00645 = 1.9221 BTC [+]

04:11:30 mircea_popescu: isnt that the chick at war with the fda over the whole raw milk thing ?

04:11:32 saifedean: you'll find it in pdf online if you look; reading it is a far better use of your time than arguing!

04:11:42 saifedean: among many other wars, yes!

04:11:52 mircea_popescu: here's a fun fact : you can buy raw milk in romania from a fucking machine.

04:12:00 saifedean: are you familiar with Weston Price?

04:12:01 mircea_popescu: ~euro a liter.

04:12:06 mircea_popescu: not particularly.

04:12:13 saifedean: That muthafucka knew his shit

04:12:27 mircea_popescu: anyway, all these nitwits that aren't from cattle country don't know wtf milk is, even.

04:12:33 mircea_popescu: they do a lot of diary in lebanon don't they ?

04:12:33 saifedean: it's a travesty that he's been completely forgotten... he's basically the Mises of nutrition

04:12:41 saifedean: yeah they do

04:12:48 asciilifeform: phun phakt: the 'antivax' hippie folk won in usa west coast. where there are now pandemics of crippling nasties (rubella, etc) last seen in 1940s

04:12:53 mircea_popescu: yeah. "o my god raw milk". herp.

04:13:27 saifedean: Weston Price traveled the world for decades observing different cultures and their foods and examining the link with health and degeneration... pretty startling stuff

04:14:09 saifedean: raw milk is not that interesting an issue, ignore it

04:14:27 saifedean: but do read Weston Price's Nutrition and Physical Degeneration

04:14:50 saifedean: the internet has that somewhere, too

04:15:42 mircea_popescu: it's pretty funny. "science!!1"

04:16:57 saifedean: weren't you the one who wrote a post about how dumb it is to be hostile to things you do not know about?

04:17:10 mircea_popescu: seems likely. which one ?

04:17:52 asciilifeform: there is a surprisingly rich set of literature in... alchemy

04:18:16 saifedean: can't remember the post, but it stuck with me and has saved me plenty of time by always ignoring arguments from people hostile to things they don't know... mainly bitcoin and health, funnily enough

04:18:23 mircea_popescu: anyway, i was discussing whether raw milk is interesting or not. it's interesting, to me, because lol.

04:19:04 saifedean: yes asciilifeform, there is, by the sort of people who invented basically all the science and knowledge that got us out of swimming in our own shit in the jungle!

04:19:31 mircea_popescu: wait...

04:19:35 saifedean: i've never had raw milk, don't know a source i can trust in lebanon, and it's illegal to buy it here in Ontario!

04:19:45 mircea_popescu: what, seriously ?!

04:19:54 mircea_popescu: you ever milked a cow ?

04:20:09 saifedean: Isaac Newton was an alchemist primarily, physics and chemistry were the languages he used to speak to the plebs

04:20:18 saifedean: nope, never milked a cow...

04:20:28 mircea_popescu: and you call yourself a lebanonesian ?!

04:20:53 mircea_popescu: anyway. i milked a cow. prolly can still do it.

04:20:54 asciilifeform: saifedean: aha. but for some reason i have yet to meet a practicing physicist who read newton's alchemical works.

04:20:54 saifedean: i ain't even lebanonesian, bro. I'm actually palestinian

04:21:07 mircea_popescu: ah right that explains it!

04:21:45 *: asciilifeform worked for a palestinian fella for many years

04:22:21 saifedean: it's sad that your physicist friends havent read alchemists, but i'm gonna go ahead and guess that's sad for them, not for the alchemists... here's a list of actual aclhemists, imagine where you'd be without their contributions to your life!

04:22:30 saifedean: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alchemists

04:22:31 assbot: List of alchemists - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1OHy6TE )

04:22:43 mircea_popescu: honestly, to me all this sorta stuff, much like the "eu legislation" on "contaminated animal productS" ie, edible cheese, is a case of derpy dudes thinking chickens come out of the supermarket.

04:22:50 asciilifeform: saifedean: 'civilization begins with distillation' (tm) (r) (falkner) aha

04:23:06 asciilifeform: but where the hell is my philosopher's stone.

04:23:17 mircea_popescu: and i certainly aren't about to read some anglo derps on how and what to eat.

04:23:23 mircea_popescu: for one thing, i still have latin.

04:23:27 saifedean: ah, if only they sold that on amazon ascii

04:23:36 mircea_popescu: for another... what the fuck, i didn't grow up in a hole.

04:24:28 mircea_popescu: to quote disraeli, "who are you people again ?"

04:24:48 saifedean: lol

04:25:48 saifedean: the problem with this sort of debate is that i've lived the life of the cake-munching sugar-addled modern nutrition believing fatty, and i've tried the opposite... which makes this conversation difficult

04:27:02 saifedean: latin, after all, came from a sedentary agricultural society of grain-addicted fatties... you wanna look at pre-agricultural societies to see how to really be well-fed

04:27:23 saifedean: unfortunately those people don't write, but fortunately, some people who do write have studied them... like weston price

04:27:36 mircea_popescu: right.

04:27:41 saifedean: who, in his defense, was not even american... he was my ontario homeboy

04:28:01 mircea_popescu: you've tried the opposite but never suckled off a cow.

04:28:16 mircea_popescu: what makes the discussion difficult is the significant chasm between what'd you want and what actrually is there.

04:28:27 saifedean: no, but i've had raw liver, which is much better :)

04:28:53 mircea_popescu: "i never had x but had y which is much better" is what you said to me ? how the fuck'd you know!

04:30:11 saifedean: look, i'd love to try good raw milk, and if you can hook a brother up, let me know... but, you know, it ain't the be all end all of human knowledge

04:30:15 punkman: /me is considering kokorec leftovers for breakfast

04:30:33 mircea_popescu: alright... ever had woman milk ?

04:30:41 saifedean: yes, my mother's

04:30:49 mircea_popescu: not your mother's. as an adult!

04:30:56 saifedean: did the job, im alive and healthy

04:31:09 saifedean: but no, not as an adult

04:31:12 mircea_popescu: sigh

04:31:20 mircea_popescu: dude... cows, ok, i can see, they don't grow everywhere.

04:31:26 mircea_popescu: but women are literally ubiquitous.

04:31:31 mircea_popescu: less reading more suckling ok ?

04:32:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30251 @ 0.00047288 = 14.3051 BTC [+] {2}

04:32:23 saifedean: punkman is a man after my heart... kokorec is fucking good, whereabouts are you? turkey?

04:32:31 mircea_popescu: practically.

04:32:54 mircea_popescu: morea eyalet

04:33:06 punkman: saifedean: greece

04:33:10 saifedean: what's your deal with milk mircea?

04:33:39 punkman: grandma always boiled the raw milk, I'm sticking with that

04:33:40 mircea_popescu: !up saifedean

04:34:29 mircea_popescu: wow check it out, it was its own province, girit

04:35:12 mircea_popescu: saifedean my deal ? whole thing started from it neh

04:36:20 saifedean: milk's essential for kids, for at least a year, but i'm honestly not convinced grown-ups should even be drinking it, weston price be damned

04:36:44 punkman: I like Candia better https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Candia

04:36:45 assbot: Kingdom of Candia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1Pl99K4 )

04:36:51 saifedean: animal fats and meat is all a man needs

04:38:11 mircea_popescu: eh how'd you know. at least that dude has the excuse of a lot of bad dinners all over.

04:38:21 saifedean: the last two months i've basically eaten nothing but fatty meat, never been healthier

04:39:33 mircea_popescu: you should be an alchemist and write great books on theoretical physics.

04:40:21 mircea_popescu: for my part, for the past two weeks i've only been slapping butts with my left hand and i've never been taller.

04:40:28 saifedean: gotta finish popping babies and feeding them properly first, then focus on econ, then alchemy... theoretical physics does not interest me much

04:40:31 trinque: !b 4

04:40:33 assbot: Last 4 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3NTMCM8.txt )

04:41:12 asciilifeform: saifedean would get on well with funkenstein, i think.

04:41:33 mircea_popescu: my money says they'd find a point of principle to disagree on and not be on speaking terms.

04:41:58 asciilifeform: and hey also orlov.

04:42:09 saifedean: who's funkenstein and does he paleo?

04:42:13 danielpbarron: mircea_popescu> here's a fun fact : you can buy raw milk in romania << same here in Connecticut, the one state in all of the ussa that permits sale outside of a farm

04:42:57 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron technically this was on a farm. the way they sorted it out was that the farm rented 20 sqft from the supermarket, plopped a machine down there. serviced it daily, there's a resident tech that does analytics.

04:43:27 danielpbarron: ah, I can go buy it raw from the store shelf

04:43:48 mircea_popescu: it doesn't keep unrefrigerated, does it.

04:44:28 danielpbarron: i haven't tried to keep it out of the fridge, but it seems to age more gracefully in general

04:44:46 mircea_popescu: certainly can make your own curds.

04:44:51 saifedean: daniel, i didn't know that, might pop across the border next time I'm in NYC to see what it's like

04:44:54 danielpbarron: instead of turning rancid it just turns sour

04:45:13 danielpbarron: saifedean, not many stores sell it; not even whole foods last i checked

04:45:19 mircea_popescu: http://www.joiana.ro/ro/reteaua-de-dozatoare-automate-de-lapte-timisoara << check it out, that;s actually the thing.\

04:45:20 assbot: Joiana | JOIANA Timișoara ... ( http://bit.ly/1OHzEgz )

04:47:23 saifedean: criminals, all these people, they'd go to jail in the good ole US of A

04:47:28 punkman: I just realized if you try to vocalize TMSR you end up with something close to "timisoara"

04:47:40 asciilifeform: punkman: l0l just now realized ?

04:47:48 mircea_popescu: punkman and another insider joke falls slain by your attentive read!

04:48:03 punkman: asciilifeform: ikr looks obvious now

04:48:19 asciilifeform: btw timisoara absolutely ruled, imho

04:49:07 mircea_popescu: you just liked the gypsy twists.

04:49:34 mircea_popescu: fucking village, doesn't even have a tiny and cramped bdsm club

04:50:12 asciilifeform: it reminded me of home planet.

04:50:22 asciilifeform: climate was exactly right. my eternal allergy stopped, even.

04:50:45 mircea_popescu: well it was the better part of the year.

04:54:49 saifedean: ladies and gentlement i present you my first witness and exhibit A... the great paleo convert Bitstein of Texas, prayers and blessings be upon him

04:56:17 bitstein: mircea_popescu: eh how'd you know << http://activenocarber.myfreeforum.org/ftopic22-0-0-asc-.php http://highsteaks.com/carnivores-creed/vilhjalmur-stefansson/the-fat-of-the-land-not-by-bread-alone/ http://www.slideshare.net/ancestralhealth/miki-ben-dor-ahs13-slides

04:56:19 assbot: Active No-Carber Forums :: Bear's Words Of Wisdom ... ( http://bit.ly/1Plar7S )

04:56:21 assbot: The Fat of the Land / Not By Bread Alone – Vilhjalmur Stefansson ... ( http://bit.ly/1Plaroc )

04:56:22 assbot: Miki Ben-Dor — Interdisciplinary Reconstruction of the Paleolithic Di… ... ( http://bit.ly/1Plarol )

04:56:54 mircea_popescu: o.O

04:57:48 saifedean: yeah it really isn't just me who's into all this weirdness :D

04:58:30 asciilifeform: ;;later tell gabriel_laddel https://secure.flickr.com/photos/obra/sets/72157635353286814

04:58:32 assbot: Space Cadet Keyboard | Flickr - Photo Sharing! ... ( http://bit.ly/1PlayAj )

04:58:32 gribble: The operation succeeded.

05:02:41 bitstein: http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/food/vegetables/

05:02:42 assbot: Vegetables - Diagnosis:Diet ... ( http://bit.ly/1PlaYqf )

05:03:00 bitstein: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKLCp4rIBIM

05:03:01 assbot: AHS12 Miki Ben Dor — Man The Fat Hunter: Animal Fat Shortage as a Driver of Human Evolution - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1PlaZdL )

05:03:33 asciilifeform: 'eat right, exercise, be the healthiest corpse at the cemetary'

05:04:00 bitstein: asciilifeform: what's the other option?

05:04:38 asciilifeform: !up saifedean

05:05:22 saifedean: asciilifeform: the point is to join the cemetary at the same time as the high school class 30 years your junior

05:05:46 mircea_popescu: so that what ?

05:05:47 asciilifeform: l0l good luck with that.

05:06:04 saifedean: the best way to defeat your enemies is to write their obituaries yourself

05:06:32 mircea_popescu: eh. you keep approaching a multivariate problem with a good feeling about having found the right single variable this time.

05:06:33 punkman: why spent time on and believe in either modern- or paleo- nutrition science?

05:06:43 saifedean: while your friends will be shitting their pants in retirement homes on diabetes medication, you'll be out there living life like a normal human

05:07:25 saifedean: i dont know punkman, why look either side when you cross the road?

05:07:26 mircea_popescu: there is no such thing as a normal human.

05:07:34 asciilifeform: ^

05:07:39 saifedean: the road is a multivariate problem, after all

05:07:55 punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CA4o_mQWYAAksUR.png

05:07:55 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1PlbvbX )

05:08:22 saifedean: lol thanks, Ezra Klein

05:08:51 mircea_popescu: it looks like the letter șm.

05:09:01 saifedean: orly? no normal human? i guess diabetes at 40 sounds grand, then

05:09:13 bitstein: mircea_popescu: eat nothing but super fatty meat (80:20 fat:protein by calories) for 30 days. you'll feel good too.

05:09:28 bitstein: you're in argentina, one of the cheapest places on earth to run such an experiment

05:09:44 mircea_popescu: yeah, because that's my criteria o.O

05:09:45 asciilifeform: isn't this how polar explorers contracted protein poisoning?

05:09:45 bitstein: ribeyes are what, $4 USD a pound?

05:10:06 saifedean: the criteria unfortunately is not money, it's cake!

05:10:08 bitstein: asciilifeform: rabbit starvation is because of a lack of fat

05:12:59 trinque: bitstein: strange how your teeth don't look much like the teeth of an animal that makes this its business.

05:13:22 bitstein: Yea, I have these good for nothing canines and incisors.

05:13:34 *: trinque yawns

05:13:38 bitstein: My molars certainly don't look like those of herbivores.

05:13:43 mircea_popescu: the chief merit of the human body is that it's so incredibly tolerant, it'll carry forward all sorts of bizarre notions of the inhabitant.

05:14:05 bitstein: mircea_popescu: yea, like that it can handle lots of sugar and insulin

05:14:20 mircea_popescu: can handle all sorta things.

05:14:24 saifedean: yes, your body is amazingly tolerant you can choose to live your life walking on your hands and using tools with your legs... but you do not have to

05:14:24 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

05:15:22 saifedean: and if you spent your entire life walking on your hands... it will sound crazy when someone tells you these hands would do a better job on a keyboard than feet!

05:17:22 asciilifeform: dietary crackpottery is interesting psychiatrically. and fundamentally works - in the eating just about ANYTHING, even gravel, is healthier than subsisting on american petro-garbage

05:17:28 mircea_popescu: come to think about it... you've never had a proper argentine porterhouse steak have you

05:17:51 asciilifeform: but notice how no one is hyping the (very demonstrable) health benefits of... sleeping ad libitum

05:17:58 asciilifeform: because it is NOT ACCESSIBLE to people in general

05:18:02 saifedean: lamb > beef any day

05:18:03 mircea_popescu: yes they are.

05:18:16 mircea_popescu: you don't spend enough time with the chicks >1.80 alfie.

05:18:34 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they only live on atomic dirigible

05:18:37 asciilifeform: so how would i.

05:18:37 bitstein: asciilifeform: that's my argument against vegetarianism

05:19:04 asciilifeform: i'm not even >180

05:19:07 mircea_popescu: every slut out there knows, that she can either sleep enough or age prematurely. ask 'em.

05:20:28 mircea_popescu: from an anthropologist's pov, this entire "paleo" thing is pretty much a bunch of boys wanting to be as annoying as the vegans but not ready to embrace metrosexualism or w/e it's called.

05:20:53 asciilifeform: 'stupidity with flipped sign bit'

05:20:55 mircea_popescu: you know, like the xtians have "their own" xtian rock, and the boring kids have their own "straight edge" punk which is all about punk if you live in wichita.

05:20:56 mircea_popescu: and so on.

05:21:31 mircea_popescu: contrary to what everyone thinks, multiculturalism has its advantages.

05:21:38 saifedean: that's very profound coming from someone whose only real problem with trying paleo is their addiction to cake :D

05:21:52 saifedean: fucking cake

05:21:52 bitstein: mircea_popescu: my problem with "paleo" is it doesn't take itself seriously. paleo people eat so many foods that are only a few thousand years old. just look to their favorite veggies like broccoli, kale, cauliflower... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brassica_oleracea

05:21:52 assbot: Brassica oleracea - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1PlcXuL )

05:22:10 saifedean: fuck broccoli, kale, and cauliflower

05:22:12 mircea_popescu: you know, since im on okcupid about 10 derpy chicks a day go "o, i know why you're not married, you're AFRAID of it!!1"

05:22:26 mircea_popescu: yeah, totally, something;s stupid because i'm not good enough for it, i'll buy that.

05:22:37 saifedean: they're an improvement over bread and pasta, but they're not what's gonna make you strong and healthy

05:22:55 asciilifeform: 'coward is a fella who refuses to take a suicidal risk for somebody else's benefit' (tm) (r) (ilkka kokkarinen)

05:23:01 mircea_popescu: lol

05:23:16 mircea_popescu: there's nothing wrong with pasta. just don't eat too much of it.

05:23:33 saifedean: there's nothing wrong with cyanide, too, by that logic

05:24:00 mircea_popescu: eh get out. plutonium, why not. BLACK HOLE!11

05:24:10 *: asciilifeform finds it interesting how well dietary crackpottery fits with the ancient tradition of 'salvation by rejecting flesh pleasures'

05:24:18 mircea_popescu: it does dunnit.

05:24:20 saifedean: but that's not how it works. grains are fucking poison, and the more you eat, the more you kill yourself. there is no "too much", any quantity is bad. if you can get over your sugar addiction enough to cut it all out, you'd be far healthier

05:24:23 asciilifeform: hair shirt.

05:24:40 mircea_popescu: dude, the more you eat anything the more you kill yourself. go vacuseal your carcass already.

05:24:42 bitstein: asciilifeform: what are you talking about? my entire diet is composed of flesh pleasures.

05:24:49 mircea_popescu: also the more babies your women have the older you get. and so on.

05:25:01 asciilifeform: bitstein: keep telling yourself that.

05:25:14 saifedean: lol you guys are addicted to the sugar rush and insulin spike... try to get over that addiction for a month, then try pasta and see how it feels

05:25:16 bitstein: whoosh

05:25:21 saifedean: it's fucking shit

05:25:27 mircea_popescu: eh get out.

05:25:35 mircea_popescu: for one thing, i actually lived on a hunter's diet.

05:25:36 saifedean: it tastes like shit and it makes you feel like shit and it kills you slowly.

05:25:48 mircea_popescu: sigh.

05:25:54 saifedean: and what did you do about CAKE o.0

05:26:00 mircea_popescu: nothing ?

05:26:17 saifedean: now quit meat for a month and get back to it, and it'll be the best day of your life when you have your first steak in a month

05:26:57 *: asciilifeform did this as a student, got violently ill

05:26:59 mircea_popescu: dude gets caught talking out of his ass - for the third time in an evening only, so i guess that's not so bad - switches seamlessly to more of the same.

05:27:02 mircea_popescu: how about... you know.

05:27:31 danielpbarron: mircea_popescu> you know, like the xtians have "their own" xtian rock << or rap http://www.atruechurch.info/atruechurchrap.html

05:27:33 assbot: A True Church - ATrueChurch.info Rap ... ( http://bit.ly/1PWSd1c )

05:27:43 mircea_popescu: ahahahah rap too ?!

05:28:01 asciilifeform: i shit thee not: there is rap in ru.

05:28:06 punkman: saifedean: it's peculiar that every time you visit you want to have the same discussion

05:28:25 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron it's a pity they didn't put any copyright notices opn that page. for one thing, copyright doesn't work without a notice, and for the other - someone could steal their muzak!

05:28:53 trinque: punkman: fun to be the bearer of secret knowledge

05:28:54 danielpbarron: i think there is a copyright notice

05:28:59 bitstein: punkman: it's peculiar that people are so nihilistic about nutrition, a fundamental aspect of being alive and being human

05:28:59 mircea_popescu: :p

05:29:15 asciilifeform: bitstein: about cure-alls

05:29:22 asciilifeform: and hair shirts.

05:29:28 mircea_popescu: bitstein being disinterested in innovation as to a fundamental part of one's culture does not have anything to see with "being nihilistic about nutrition"

05:29:28 bitstein: who said anything about a cure-all?

05:29:31 trinque: and one neat trick they dun want u to kno

05:30:15 mircea_popescu: go talk to israeli jews about you know, your solution to their geopolitical problems.

05:30:31 mircea_popescu: "dudes, if you only took left turns while driving for three months everything would be fixed!"

05:30:49 asciilifeform: and aha don't forget to mention their 'favourite' recommendation, 'go live in antarctica'

05:31:21 mircea_popescu: but ... i'm addicted to taking the bitchez on nude walks!

05:31:45 saifedean: the most amusingly funny aspect of this is that you folk sound exactly like my economist colleagues dismissing bitcoin... you don't know anything about it, but you can make up enough strawmen and groupthink to feel better about dismissing it

05:31:56 mircea_popescu: ...

05:32:16 mircea_popescu: iirc you're the guy that upon examination turned out to be bereft of experience in the matter.

05:32:18 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3756 @ 0.00049747 = 1.8685 BTC [+] {2}

05:32:35 saifedean: what examination?! which strawman was that?

05:32:54 mircea_popescu: eh enough of the crap

05:32:57 mircea_popescu: !down saifedean

05:33:06 mircea_popescu: strawman bearers are not to bring up strawmen.

05:33:16 asciilifeform: and wtf happened to his wot rating ?!

05:33:26 asciilifeform: where'd it go

05:33:51 mircea_popescu: he had one ?

05:34:17 asciilifeform: i must have hallucinated ?

05:34:58 mircea_popescu: !s rate saifedean

05:34:59 assbot: 1 results for 'rate saifedean' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=rate+saifedean

05:35:18 mircea_popescu: odd.

05:38:35 deedbot-: [Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski » Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski] Tesla’s factory… in 2086. - http://www.contravex.com/2016/01/09/teslas-factory-in-2086/

05:39:10 bitstein: mircea_popescu: next: !down cake

05:39:27 bitstein: !up fatty meat

05:47:02 mircea_popescu: weird.

05:49:01 mircea_popescu: actually kinda reminds me of the story of that guy, the anesthesiologist.

05:49:02 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: just who /is/ the 'brightest mind in banking alive today'?

05:49:16 mircea_popescu: !s isarescu

05:49:17 assbot: 3 results for 'isarescu' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=isarescu

05:49:43 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: the one who was really rather talented but sold it all for western trinkets ?

05:50:00 mircea_popescu: yeah, this bizarre monomania sorta thing.

05:51:24 pete_dushenski: so turns out transcript work is not for the faint of heart.

05:51:50 ben_vulpes: pandemic, asciilifeform? /pandemic/?

05:52:22 pete_dushenski: and all i was doing was copying subtitles, and i was still floored by the volume

05:52:39 pete_dushenski: anyways, glad to see bitbet payouts finally worked their way through the grinder

05:52:49 pete_dushenski: wd all

05:52:55 ben_vulpes: any idea what your wpm was, pete_dushenski?

05:53:27 pete_dushenski: ben_vulpes: too slow to leave the film running

05:53:35 pete_dushenski: many a stop and start were needed

05:53:51 ben_vulpes: sounds like you need some pedals like trinque

05:54:17 punkman: pro transcriptionists do use pedals

05:54:36 pete_dushenski: thankfully, youtubes pause with the spacebar, so the mouse wasn't needed

05:55:33 *: pete_dushenski reaches for cognac all the same

05:55:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7450 @ 0.0004974 = 3.7056 BTC [-]

05:56:00 ben_vulpes: saifedean, funkenstein_, and DiabloD3 - the list of dietary nutters grows...

05:57:08 pete_dushenski: who was that last guy again ?

05:57:21 pete_dushenski: ;;seen diablod3

05:57:21 gribble: diablod3 was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 year, 16 weeks, 4 days, 4 hours, 7 minutes, and 59 seconds ago: <DiabloD3> its a work in progress

06:00:02 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364863 << saif couldn't figure out pgpwin iirc

06:00:02 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 05:33:16; asciilifeform: and wtf happened to his wot rating ?!

06:01:49 mircea_popescu: win ?!

06:01:57 mircea_popescu: now there's a worthy cause, de-win one's diet.

06:02:01 ben_vulpes: a winrar is he

06:03:12 ben_vulpes: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364834 << remember tiberius?

06:03:12 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 05:26:59; mircea_popescu: dude gets caught talking out of his ass - for the third time in an evening only, so i guess that's not so bad - switches seamlessly to more of the same.

06:03:16 ben_vulpes: rip tiberius

06:03:27 mircea_popescu: anyway, diablo-d3 is a guy that did some work on one of the earliest independent miners (ie, gpu based not cpu based like the origian client), then followed up with a lulzy explosion at tardstalk over his plan to collect 1mn btc which "the community" owed him, and then use it to build some fantastic datacenter-cum-powerplant altogether reminescent of http://fraudsters.com/2010/moment-de-visare/

06:03:28 assbot: Moment de visare on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZdE3sU )

06:03:52 pete_dushenski: lolk

06:04:13 mircea_popescu: after that didn't happen he had a moment of butthurt, then moved on to dealing in partnering up with usagi and giving away with both hands the few k's of btcs he did somehow collect (at the time btc was like 2 bux) in exchange for ridiculously valued worthless paper,

06:04:19 mircea_popescu: after which he pretty much disappeared.

06:05:07 ben_vulpes: anyways it's not cake at issue, it's kakolate ice cream

06:05:20 pete_dushenski: !gettrust diablod3

06:05:20 assbot: diablod3 is not registered in WoT.

06:05:24 mircea_popescu: actually... iirc he did manage to get some asicminer shares at some point, which for a period were deemed worthless, but which then came up once they delivered and made his investors whole, or maybe close to it, or at least so he claimed at the time.

06:05:28 mircea_popescu: altogether not impossible.

06:05:33 pete_dushenski: !gettrust usagi

06:05:34 assbot: Trust relationship from user pete_dushenski to user usagi: Level 1: -5, Level 2: -5 via 5 connections. | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/trust/?from=pete_dushenski&to=usagi | http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/usagi/

06:08:26 mircea_popescu: anyway, for the people following the nutrition discussion along at home : the average human needs something to the tune of 2k calories a day to sit around and derp on social media. a little more if he actually moves. the sources of these calories can be protein, fat or sweets, there is nothing else. protein and sweets count at about 4 calories/gram, fat at about 7. the liver has a fixed capacity to process proteins, at

06:08:26 mircea_popescu: about 150-200 grams a day. there is similarly a fixed capacity to process fats. these also go through the liver, but mostly the bile is the limiting factor there. meanwhile sweets go through the pancreatic-centered insulin mechanism.

06:08:55 mircea_popescu: it should be obvious that one wants a mix of these three sources in their diet. (starches, such as breads etc, are all sweets for thid discussion, so is alcohol).

06:09:54 mircea_popescu: the limits are that on one hand you certainly can not have no fat and live ; and on the other the brain burns glucose exclusively. it is about 20 times more difficult to make it out of fat than it is to just rectify sugars, but the body'll do it if it has to.

06:11:34 mircea_popescu: similarly it'll adapt to anything within reason, and as far as it can help it, beyond any reason. it's only job is to keep you going and it takes it more seriously than you'll ever take anything as long as you live.

06:14:04 mircea_popescu: that said, the only certainty is that one day it'll fail to bring you back to homeostasis, and that's that.

06:16:39 ben_vulpes: stay in your performance envelope, hotshot.

06:16:53 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-01-2016#1364239 << "The odds of winning are 1 in 292.2 million. So the expected value of a ticket is $800*1/292.2=$2.73. A ticket only costs $2 so that’s a positive expected value purchase! We do have to make a few adjustments, however. The $800 million is paid out over 30 years while the $2 is paid out today."

06:16:53 assbot: Logged on 09-01-2016 18:52:52; BingoBoingo: Anyone want an Illinois lottery powerball ticket for tonight's 900 million dollar drawing, for the potential collection lulz?

06:16:53 mircea_popescu: pretty much.

06:19:32 BingoBoingo: The people who end up on all fats for fuel end up having to feed the brain ketones which works as an anticonvulsant, but for the same reason alcohol does. Unbalance electrical activity in the brain is forced to slow because now burning suboptimal fuel.

06:19:45 BingoBoingo: Which induces a bunch of other changes.

06:20:32 pete_dushenski: in other nyooz, sean penn is a secret agent http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/el-chapo-speaks-20160109

06:20:33 assbot: El Chapo Speaks | Rolling Stone ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZdFgkf )

06:21:03 pete_dushenski: ^el chapo, yes, has since been recaptured

06:21:12 BingoBoingo: Could simulate these changes with benzodiazepine dependence (which is why people who do the Keto thing recreationally start to feel sick when carbs are introduced, ketosis stops and they undergo a drug withdrawal)

06:22:28 mircea_popescu: that also.

06:22:46 *: BingoBoingo apologizes for not being around to say this to the addicts, was at addict story time club poker game doubling my quarters.

06:23:53 BingoBoingo: But yes, when the ketosis people talk about feeling sick when consuming carbs they really are feeling sick. Dope sick, just like a junkie dosed with narcan.

06:24:17 pete_dushenski: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1239608/posts << relevant sean pennery

06:24:19 assbot: SEAN PENN RIPS 'TEAM AMERICA' CREATORS IN ANGRY MEMO ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZdFw2F )

06:30:43 BingoBoingo: !up bitstein

06:33:21 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364538 << this title made me think immediately of nintendo's 'virtual boy'

06:33:21 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 03:21:26; punkman: http://kotaku.com/5784314/the-nintendo-theyve-tried-to-forget-gambling-gangsters-and-love-hotels

06:33:41 pete_dushenski: re: virtual boy, this is why the oculus rift this ~will not~ take off

06:34:00 pete_dushenski: unless you can see people gawking at your new gizmo, how are you going to know what you're cool ?

06:34:29 pete_dushenski: virtual boy was, afaik, a sales disaster

06:35:47 pete_dushenski: though i recall playing with one at the store as a boy, quite an intriguing bit of kit at the time

06:36:00 pete_dushenski: being 21 years ago...

06:36:40 bitstein: I had one when it came out for about 2 hours. We took it back and got a super nintendo.

06:37:20 *: pete_dushenski checks ebay. sees that virtual boy is still dirt cheap. figures that, indeed, thing must have been utter garbage.

06:37:29 *: BingoBoingo also floored by the dairy hate, WHERE ELSE DOES WHEY COME FROM???

06:37:34 pete_dushenski: bitstein: heads up play

06:39:32 pete_dushenski: heya bitstein, you ever figure out what happened to your boy pierre ? seemed like he went off the reservation of late re:

06:39:36 pete_dushenski: 'core devs'

06:39:43 pete_dushenski: and 'unlimited' or some shit

06:40:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7530 @ 0.00048791 = 3.674 BTC [-] {2}

06:44:06 *: BingoBoingo thinks it was mere trolling. He was pushing this 1MB blocksize limit is preserved when blocksize limit removed enitrely because consensus.

06:44:44 pete_dushenski: not impossible

06:45:00 pete_dushenski: the trolling theory, not the 'consensus'

06:46:23 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: The idea is the burden of "consensus" forces the status quo 1MB blocksize to be preserved

06:49:51 bitstein: it's an interesting idea

06:50:11 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364575 << today, sure. 90 years ago, however...

06:50:11 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 03:54:17; mircea_popescu: but anyway. natural birth has a huge following in the states. almost unknown in yurp.

06:50:13 BingoBoingo: ;;later tell saifedean Re: your tweets. I am sorry I can not help you at this time. If however your ketone dependence makes you hit bottom and your life becomes unmanagable, there's probably a group for that.

06:50:13 gribble: The operation succeeded.

06:50:19 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 5.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $1,000 before Jul 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1234/bitcoin-to-top-1-000-before-jul-2016/#b27

06:50:39 pete_dushenski: ^balls o' steel

06:52:12 BingoBoingo: <bitstein> it's an interesting idea << It's how I'm interpreting Pierre's twitter trolling. Anyways it is hard to hold people to what they say on the social media playground of propagandaneering

06:55:58 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364687 << advice for the ages.

06:55:58 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 04:31:31; mircea_popescu: less reading more suckling ok ?

06:58:25 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364713 << quebec is only canadian province, probably because their laws are a little more 'flexible' than the rest. or maybe just because they're not ~complete~ puritanical riris.

06:58:25 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 04:42:13; danielpbarron: mircea_popescu> here's a fun fact : you can buy raw milk in romania << same here in Connecticut, the one state in all of the ussa that permits sale outside of a farm

07:00:17 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364718 << unpasteurised milk is also key for making the best perogy cheese

07:00:17 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 04:44:46; mircea_popescu: certainly can make your own curds.

07:00:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7661 @ 0.00049247 = 3.7728 BTC [+] {2}

07:02:51 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 4.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $700 before Apr 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1236/bitcoin-to-top-700-before-apr-2016/#b26

07:05:31 ben_vulpes: someone has opinions about the curve

07:05:35 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364815 << stoics, ashoka, etc.

07:05:35 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 05:24:10; *: asciilifeform finds it interesting how well dietary crackpottery fits with the ancient tradition of 'salvation by rejecting flesh pleasures'

07:08:34 BingoBoingo: Pythagoreans et al

07:11:02 ben_vulpes: guarding plebs from the madness of irrational numbers!

07:11:20 BingoBoingo: Also weird dietary rules

07:11:42 *: BingoBoingo up on every bet tonight, but powerball

07:13:01 BingoBoingo: Hockey underdog whose trend demanded a bet won, more than doubled my quarters at poker, powerball though... scam

07:13:31 pete_dushenski: !up ith

07:14:28 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all

07:14:34 gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 446.0, vol: 4192.40870118 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 442.744, vol: 4910.58495 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 446.39, vol: 9429.25670172 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 434.8, vol: 3.421 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 446.511617, vol: 44346.65710000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 447.11953, vol: 51.25769428 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 451.0373, vol: 14.33694003 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)

07:14:39 BingoBoingo: ;;more

07:14:39 gribble: 446.166301563

07:15:35 pete_dushenski: ith: you from alberta or bc ?

07:15:45 ith: pete_dushenski: BC

07:16:01 pete_dushenski: coast ?

07:16:24 ith: What year is it? :)

07:16:31 ith: Middle of BC

07:16:38 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Bitcoin to top $800 before Jul 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1233/bitcoin-to-top-800-before-jul-2016/#b24

07:16:40 ith: Though south

07:16:54 BingoBoingo: http://www.returnofkings.com/77188/new-yorkers-can-now-be-fined-250000-for-not-using-loony-pronouns-like-ze-and-hir

07:16:55 assbot: New Yorkers Can Now Be Fined $250,000 For Not Using Loony Gender Pronouns Like “Ze” And “Hir” ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZdJMiw )

07:17:34 pete_dushenski: ith: kelowna ? kamloops ?

07:17:49 ith: pete_dushenski: Vernon

07:18:03 pete_dushenski: ah neat. i have an aunt there.

07:18:22 ith: I think Vernon is an Illuminati support city. Is your aunt a psychopath?

07:18:38 pete_dushenski: hm. y'know now that you mention it

07:18:59 BingoBoingo: Frome the mines, health scamzors getting poor: "Move over, quinoa, kale, and a?a?? 2016?s newest superfood might come in a familiar package (or can). Pulses ? the dried edible seeds of legume plants, which include things like lentils, dried peas, and beans ? are hoping to get their moment in the spotlight, thanks in part to a United Nations campaign to make 2016 the International Year of Pulses."

07:19:35 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo: saw the same 'pulses' suggestion in cbc's article on grocery store inflation

07:20:17 pete_dushenski: ith: so what keeps you busy in vernon ? pretty sleepy little town last i was through

07:21:52 ith: pete_dushenski: I am being held prisoner by the Illuminati and can't escape. All day I try to survive relentlous attacks on my mind from my mother, my father and others who speak to me from the apartment downstairs, and manipulate me by directing messages to me (appearing to be speaking to a caller), in the case of my father, from the living room

07:22:05 ith: I struggle daily to survive and find a way to be free of these people

07:22:27 ith: (on the phone)

07:22:50 pete_dushenski: from mr. reed, who unfortunately doesn't have a comments section with which to correct his lack of 'bahamas' : "I’m going to move to Mexico. I swear I am. Except that I already have. Well, I’m going to move there twice. It’s to get away from Hussein Obama."

07:22:58 BingoBoingo: Have you tired risperidone ith

07:23:05 ith: They have stolen my brain code and use electromagnetic weapons to manipulate me by making it appear that sounds are coming from beneath concrete floors, etc. to try to drive me crazy

07:23:11 pete_dushenski: !down ith

07:23:11 ith: :(

07:25:20 ben_vulpes: haw

07:25:26 ben_vulpes: > brain codes

07:27:33 *: pete_dushenski to his warm bed

07:36:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7342 @ 0.0004891 = 3.591 BTC [-] {2}

07:38:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18383 @ 0.00049046 = 9.0161 BTC [+] {3}

07:39:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25767 @ 0.00050067 = 12.9008 BTC [+] {3}

07:58:12 deedbot-: [Qntra] USG Makes Tired Sheriff Face Of Oregon Operations - http://qntra.net/2016/01/usg-makes-tired-sheriff-face-of-oregon-operations/

07:59:18 BingoBoingo: ^ Good use of picture? yes or no?

08:02:08 BingoBoingo: Research-a-lol "The Associated Press has gone from describing the protesters as a ?militia? to ?armed men? or ?armed ranchers,? saying the word ?militia? confuses its international audience." >> https://www.rt.com/usa/328143-oregon-militia-occupation-land-rights/

08:02:09 assbot: Whose land is it, anyway? Critics, supporters of armed Oregon occupiers agree protest must end — RT USA ... ( http://bit.ly/1mMFHpY )

08:02:40 BingoBoingo: Because oh, militant opposition groups aren't for the United States. They are only for Countries they CIA plants them in.

08:06:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2500 @ 0.00050155 = 1.2539 BTC [+] {3}

08:15:08 BingoBoingo: Same link on Oathers: "A local ?Committee for Safety,? which coordinates with Oath Keepers, has approached the protesters and asked them to leave."

08:32:00 ben_vulpes: trinque: yeah those failed boost targets are a real bitch

09:38:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9112 @ 0.00049793 = 4.5371 BTC [-] {2}

09:46:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2532 @ 0.00049686 = 1.258 BTC [-] {2}

10:25:18 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.06907224 BTC on 'Yes' - Bitcoin to top $600 before Jul 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1232/bitcoin-to-top-600-before-jul-2016/#b14

10:42:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2200 @ 0.00050209 = 1.1046 BTC [+] {2}

11:50:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3130 @ 0.0005021 = 1.5716 BTC [+]

12:29:15 copypaste: will the bitcoin foundation be accepting "segregated witness" into its client?

12:29:31 copypaste: (i mean thebitcoin.foundation, not any fake one)

12:39:19 adlai: copypaste: i don't speak on their behalf, but it's highly doubtful that it'll include such opt-in softforks

12:40:30 copypaste: i think they should make a statement on it if it gets into Bitcoin "Core", since it seems to have wide support (but this support could just be imaginary on my part)

12:40:51 adlai: you must have missed a few fraudsters/qntra articles?

12:40:52 copypaste: i'd be especially curious how the bitcoin foundation would react if more than half of transactions were using it,

12:41:58 copypaste: adlai: does BingoBoingo/qntra speak for the bitcoin foundation?

12:42:02 adlai: eh, proportion of transactions is an unclear measure. proportion of utxos is a clearer one, and you can see that eg p2sh still has quite small market share, despite being adopted by several fiat-btc exchange sites

12:42:52 adlai: no, the foundation issues its own statements, such as: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-December/000184.html

12:42:54 assbot: [BTC-dev] Regarding Transaction Signatures ... ( http://bit.ly/1Y6slVY )

12:43:26 copypaste: right, but i'm pretty sure that script hash transactions are something that has to be opted into, meanwhile "segregated witness" if to work "well" (i.e. for maximum transactions) would have to be invisible to the user, as in on by default

12:43:48 copypaste: so many users might use it without noticing especially if it becomes default in bitcoin core.

12:43:56 copypaste: but you have to take specific steps to send to a script hash

12:45:13 adlai: if you run a full node which has no recognition of segwit, you can still operate normally. segwit is dangerous for a) users of non-full nodes who think they have "SPV security" (whatever that may mean), and b) everybody, if enough utxos use segwit that miner defection becomes a real risk

12:46:17 adlai: copypaste: you may want to read https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-December/012014.html as well, it explains possible failure modes for people who don't recognize softforks such as segwit

12:46:20 assbot: [bitcoin-dev] On the security of softforks ... ( http://bit.ly/1UGNgc0 )

12:47:06 copypaste: thank you, i will

12:47:13 adlai: what happens with segwit is that people who do opt-in, have significantly less security in the face of miner defection

12:47:35 adlai: miner defection can't steal from people who didn't opt-in, although it causes reorganizations and general headless-chicken-panic

12:55:17 adlai: copypaste: also check out http://p2sh.info/ which I like to interpret as the bounties available to defecting miners, should full nodes let them revert each respective soft fork

12:55:18 assbot: Grafana ... ( http://bit.ly/1UGNOhY )

13:15:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14200 @ 0.0005014 = 7.1199 BTC [-] {4}

13:55:51 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364942 << foucault had a point huh.

13:55:51 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 06:34:00; pete_dushenski: unless you can see people gawking at your new gizmo, how are you going to know what you're cool ?

13:58:07 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364961 << ironically enough, in classical ro medicine (ie, pre 1990) ketonic bodies in bloodstream was part of the semiology manual.

13:58:07 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 06:50:13; BingoBoingo: ;;later tell saifedean Re: your tweets. I am sorry I can not help you at this time. If however your ketone dependence makes you hit bottom and your life becomes unmanagable, there's probably a group for that.

13:59:08 mircea_popescu: mostly because type 1 diabetes

13:59:37 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13625 @ 0.00050276 = 6.8501 BTC [+] {5}

14:07:34 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364995 << ahahaha what the everloving fuck.

14:07:34 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 07:16:55; assbot: New Yorkers Can Now Be Fined $250,000 For Not Using Loony Gender Pronouns Like “Ze” And “Hir” ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZdJMiw )

14:08:26 mircea_popescu: "Apologists for this kind of SJW fascism will contend that the $250,000 fine is not mandatory and is a maximum, as if it somehow eliminates the farce of the laws? new interpretation." << you know, consensus will enforce the lower limit.

14:08:27 mircea_popescu: hurr durr.

14:09:23 mircea_popescu: everyone still living in new york must now use "Blasioisanidiotmarriedtoadisgustingnigger" as my preferred gender pronoun. failure to do so "more than a couple of times" means you gotta self-report yourself to city hall. bring your fine with you.

14:12:01 mircea_popescu: anyway, all the lulz aside, someone point out to the guy that the guidance is for employers and other "covered entitites", and his "quarelling couple in a bar" chosen example is entirely nonsensical. what the fuck is with these idiots, nobody went to school that speaks english ? a fucking generation of kelly bundys out there for the love of christ.

14:16:06 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365019 << not bad.

14:16:06 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 07:59:18; BingoBoingo: ^ Good use of picture? yes or no?

14:16:29 mircea_popescu: "who normally presides over a force of local force of six," nevertheless.

14:16:49 mircea_popescu: lemme re-do this entire thing for ya.

14:17:52 mircea_popescu: " Harney County Sheriff David Ward, who normally presides over a force of local force of six, is the public face of the combined government effort lead by Federal forces." becomes "Harney County Sheriff David Ward, who normally presides over a force of locally forced six is now the public face of the combined government effort lead by Federal Force IV."

14:17:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3350 @ 0.00050385 = 1.6879 BTC [+]

14:19:01 mircea_popescu: and add a ((Mark to be pronounced "Carl" not "four")) on that IV

14:32:17 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu never sleeps

14:32:32 mircea_popescu: i sleep through representatives.

14:36:53 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365021 << hahaha check it out! blockstream and whoever else have reached consensus!!11

14:36:53 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 08:02:09; assbot: Whose land is it, anyway? Critics, supporters of armed Oregon occupiers agree protest must end — RT USA ... ( http://bit.ly/1mMFHpY )

14:36:54 mircea_popescu: idiots.

14:38:17 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365037 see http://thebitcoin.foundation/charter.html

14:38:17 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 12:41:58; copypaste: adlai: does BingoBoingo/qntra speak for the bitcoin foundation?

14:38:17 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/22TK2I1 )

14:38:24 mircea_popescu: lot of other good stuff on that site.

14:39:43 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365042 << they may use it up until they run into http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=05-01-2016#1360917

14:39:43 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 12:43:48; copypaste: so many users might use it without noticing especially if it becomes default in bitcoin core.

14:39:43 assbot: Logged on 05-01-2016 19:28:40; mircea_ahoy: direct any complaints as to "why my txn has been waiting for x days" to anyone and everyone who is running non-conformant bitcoin implementations. starting with the pools.

14:40:32 mircea_popescu: seeing how exactly 100% of bitcoin businesses are run by people here, it'll be a funny dispute between you know, the actual bitcoin people and all the derps sitting at the edges and opining about how things should be.

14:44:52 thestringpuller: that's what's irking me about the softfork nuclear option

14:45:30 thestringpuller: aka http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2015-December/012073.html

14:46:13 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365036 << like they, and everyone else in the indistinct usg hydra, reacts every single time this happens, as it does weekly by now : http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-06-2014#700916

14:46:13 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 12:40:52; copypaste: i'd be especially curious how the bitcoin foundation would react if more than half of transactions were using it,

14:46:13 assbot: Logged on 04-06-2014 00:08:26; asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the buggers' traditional defense is to pretend that the event was a non-event - or, if this is impractical, to continue living in an imaginary world where they 'scooped' the story first, and all of the 'unsanctioned' discussion never happened.

14:47:18 thestringpuller: "An interesting consequence of this design is that, since all mapped blocks are empty, old clients will never see transactions confirming." << there are proposed soft forks which will essentially fork other nodes off the network.

14:47:48 shinohai: thestringpuller: any luck with your node?

14:47:52 mircea_popescu: thestringpuller there is fundamentally nothing wrong with people using the permanence nature of the blockchain to enshrine data relevant to them in it. we do it already, with deedbot.

14:48:30 mircea_popescu: you could say that there is something fundamentally wrong with the fraudulent nature of their claims - because no, they're not moving bitcoin back and forth, but mere derivative tokens - but then again, to get the muppets to follow along and get out of actual human beings' way, you usually have to lie to them.

14:48:44 mircea_popescu: i am glad these dudes are here to do the lying so i don't have to, and with that... good riddance.

14:49:08 mircea_popescu: if all the coffee buying "with bitcoin", all five of the yearly instances, moves on a deedbot-like thing or simply goes away it makes exactly 0 difference.

14:50:00 thestringpuller: this is fine as long as my future trb node can witness transactions being confirmed that it broadcasted.

14:50:20 thestringpuller: if I broadcast tx and have to use block explorer or god forbid "upgrade" to see it confirm, then I take issue

14:51:00 mircea_popescu: i'm sure it will.

14:51:27 thestringpuller: shinohai: i gave mod6 access to my box for further diagnostics

14:51:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8880 @ 0.00050098 = 4.4487 BTC [-] {4}

14:52:09 thestringpuller: imo this is why TRB Foundation is so important. it not only decrufts the shitty code but acts as defenders of the blockchain

14:52:09 shinohai: Oh awesum. zzzzzzzzztook me a little longer to get a VM up than I thought, I'm in the process of upgrading to new lappy.

14:52:14 mircea_popescu: this said, it has to be pointed out that the one thing all these derps have in common is - that they can not afford to pay for the hardware that is required to run their software they've "contributed". (and re this, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=04-01-2016#1360176 is apropos.) in this sense the economic freestanding value of their "contributions" is null.

14:52:14 assbot: Logged on 04-01-2016 15:58:10; mircea_popescu: THEY however, with their needs to compensate for absent intelligence through the deployment of computing hardware, DO need the shit to "improve".

14:52:48 mircea_popescu: their projective ability to control the future is also absent, for this reason. consequently, it is not in any sense inconceivable that a situation will come to pass where the maintenance of their derpage requires resources nobody wishes to expend.

14:53:08 mircea_popescu: if that happens, all the "Soft forks" get reverted on the spot, and all the "hard work" and "contributions" go to the same place windows nt codebase went.

14:53:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8450 @ 0.00049702 = 4.1998 BTC [-] {2}

14:53:32 thestringpuller: yes. and as I told my mom "We can't have nice things cause there are stupid people who ruin it for everyone", i think bitcoin solves this problem effectively, but must stay ever vigilant

14:53:32 mircea_popescu: clearly whether this happens or not is purely a matter of accident, which is to say a matter of time - all the pr derps can do exactly nothing to influence it any way

14:53:55 mircea_popescu: so in this sense, "contributing" to bitcoin outside of b-a / tmsr is a pure and objectively declared waste of time.

14:54:10 thestringpuller: ^- this exactly.

14:54:22 mircea_popescu: nevertheless, 0/0 is still an undefined value - inasmuch as their time and effort is actually worthless then it can not be argued that they should stop what they're currentlyu doing.

14:54:26 mircea_popescu: so... all is well.

14:54:34 thestringpuller: and all will be well.

14:54:59 thestringpuller: shinohai: you are going to run the VM on the laptop?

14:55:17 thestringpuller: i think the issue is with my machine architecture.

15:00:47 shinohai: thestringpuller: yup, was going to try and emulate that CPU you showed me. Not sure abt the rest of the architecture tho :/

15:04:30 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365044 << no, not "everyone".

15:04:30 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 12:45:13; adlai: if you run a full node which has no recognition of segwit, you can still operate normally. segwit is dangerous for a) users of non-full nodes who think they have "SPV security" (whatever that may mean), and b) everybody, if enough utxos use segwit that miner defection becomes a real risk

15:04:59 mircea_popescu: miner defection from any and all non-trb approved soft forks is a ~GUARANTEE~ in the future. just a question of when.

15:05:36 mircea_popescu: and if anyone imagines the "you wouldn't be willing to hurt innocents" is going to hold worth one stitch, please kindly review the history of accidental payments to bitbet and all that.

15:06:06 mircea_popescu: if a billion people starve because their thousands of btc got stolen by greedy miners who saw an opportunity to revert a soft fork and took it - i'll cheer them on. that's a billion idiots less, and an absolutely ideal end state.

15:07:12 mircea_popescu: actually, come to think of it...

15:07:34 thestringpuller: http://qntra.net/2015/01/the-hard-fork-missile-crisis/#comment-7033 << ultimately it's a resource war TMSR definitely has upperhand here

15:07:51 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo wrote about that in his Qntra piece.

15:11:49 mircea_popescu: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/0Y29GH1.txt

15:11:50 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1UGWqFl )

15:11:51 deedbot-: accepted: 1

15:17:25 kakobrekla: how are the bb payouts going btw ?

15:18:13 mircea_popescu: bout 60% done by now.

15:18:18 mircea_popescu: expect to finish today.

15:19:42 kakobrekla: great, good to hear angry emails will end soon

15:19:51 mircea_popescu: sorry bout that.

15:20:12 kakobrekla: shit happens

15:20:13 mircea_popescu: how many did you get ?

15:20:28 kakobrekla: a few every day

15:21:35 kakobrekla: the funniest was "pls hurry im traveling and out of cash"

15:21:40 kakobrekla: great planning there.

15:21:42 mircea_popescu: bejoysus

15:21:51 mircea_popescu: what if you know, the bet went the other way.

15:21:58 kakobrekla: mhm

15:22:28 mircea_popescu: i wonder how many people arguing absurdities on bet resolutions like it happens now and again are actually you know, stranded in an airport somewhere and got nothing better to do until the battery runs out.

15:22:40 kakobrekla: lol

15:22:53 kakobrekla: its a percentage.

15:37:34 mircea_popescu: but in other news, http://41.media.tumblr.com/ac8c70f43411f20b384d6706e6ccb8a7/tumblr_ni0h5ywctv1twb3ixo1_1280.jpg

15:37:35 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1UGYVHT )

15:43:30 mircea_popescu: oh check that out, queergender consensus is slowly coallescing that apple fails in 2016.

15:48:01 mircea_popescu: and in random old shit, http://www.bytecollector.com/the_digital_group.htm

15:48:03 assbot: The Digital Group ... ( http://bit.ly/1UGZPnG )

15:48:14 copypaste: i understand. thank you guys. i can't believe so called coredevs are supporting something which has such obvious problem as defecting miners dumping all transactions that follow the new rules. wtf.

15:48:30 copypaste: and then collecting all the fees. lol

15:49:20 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365147 << wai wut ?!

15:49:20 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 15:43:30; mircea_popescu: oh check that out, queergender consensus is slowly coallescing that apple fails in 2016.

15:49:35 copypaste: so people going along with soft forks are literally just throwing their coins into a blackhole which will be opened whenever miners defect, which is a gaurantee as more muppets follow along with the softfork the potential gain from defecting rises

15:49:48 copypaste: how can the "core" devs not see the obvious flaw in this stupidplan?

15:50:09 mircea_popescu: they are doing exactly the same thing they do with their every waking move : banking on the ultimately doomed proposition that "this ledge will hold".

15:50:18 mircea_popescu: what do they do when they pay taxes ? put money in 401k ?

15:50:25 mircea_popescu: same thing. it's what it is. it's what they get.

15:50:42 mircea_popescu: whence would come such a sudden and complete change for the masses ? there is no such thing.

15:50:54 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform for srs. ask around!

15:51:04 asciilifeform: ask who? the trees? the grass ?

15:51:09 copypaste: but are the core developers really the "masses"?

15:51:19 copypaste: there aren't many of them, and they're supposed to be intelligent

15:51:50 mircea_popescu: intelligence has little to do with it, as it happens.

15:52:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7500 @ 0.00049702 = 3.7277 BTC [-]

15:54:00 mircea_popescu: in fact... "there aren't many of them, and they're supposed to be intelligent" is not unlike saying "this cow doesn't belong in the pen, it gives a lot of milk which is rare". whether it goes in the pen or puts the would-be farmer in the pen strictly depends on how willing to http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=shoot+cop the cow finds itself.

15:54:01 assbot: 8 results for 'shoot cop' - #bitcoin-assets search

15:56:08 copypaste: i see. it's all about mindset, and their mindset is all wrong.

15:56:18 mircea_popescu: quite.

15:56:50 mircea_popescu: in other words, intelligence is no bar against stupidity. they may be as intelligent as you wish, but certainly dumb as rocks. and so...

16:00:38 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365154 << amusingly enough, asciilifeform has been saying (in general terms) that this is the inexorable future for the river of meat since 4eva.

16:00:38 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 15:49:35; copypaste: so people going along with soft forks are literally just throwing their coins into a blackhole which will be opened whenever miners defect, which is a gaurantee as more muppets follow along with the softfork the potential gain from defecting rises

16:02:14 copypaste: the funny thing is, to hear them describe it (luke jr, wuille, antonopolous, and so on) "segwit" (cute name) has no problems whatsoever and softforks are perfectly safe so everyone should start throwing their coins into segwit transactions so as to make the overall "capacity" of the network go up

16:02:41 copypaste: i haven't seen one mention of the miner defection problem anywhere but b-a

16:02:49 copypaste: even though it's such an obvious flaw ...

16:03:14 mircea_popescu: and then they get hits called on their stupid heads and "nobody" understands why.

16:03:16 mircea_popescu: guess.

16:04:18 mircea_popescu: i dunno if you were around for / recall this, but after i singlehandedly nixed the original "block expansion" almost a year ago to the day, they spent A FUCKING YEAR

16:04:37 mircea_popescu: pretending that a) didn't happen and then latter that b) if it happened it didn't matter and then even later that c) they did it anyway by themselves!!1

16:04:58 mircea_popescu: much to the amusement of everyone in the know.

16:05:00 copypaste: lol, which caused the xtcoin scam

16:06:18 copypaste: so that's why at first they were all in support of raising the blocksize, but then they all turned against gavin

16:06:21 copypaste: MP strikes again

16:06:29 mircea_popescu: there is something fundamentally wrong with people, intelligent or otherwise, who can't simply come out and say "mp said no, so it can't be done". just like there's something fundamentally wrong with people who can't simply come out and say "i tried pissing upwind and staying dry - it doesn't work".

16:16:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8316 @ 0.00049769 = 4.1388 BTC [+]

16:19:45 funkenstein_: good morning coin collectors

16:22:10 asciilifeform: achtung panzerz! brief scheduled outage on zoolag, starting now.

16:23:01 mircea_popescu: hola mr dwarf. how goes ?

16:23:20 funkenstein_: good good, thank you :)

16:24:07 funkenstein_: ascii is right I sympathize with saifedean and recommend a video "the business of being born"

16:24:40 funkenstein_: but I imagine I should hold off on exposing you to further of my dietary nuttery

16:25:58 mircea_popescu: i dun think the part about how limiting excessive medical procedurizing is the core of sane medicine was at all controversial.

16:26:13 mircea_popescu: heck, it's actually one of the oldest ideas in western thought.

16:28:27 funkenstein_: mircea_popsescu, your comment about Cauchy-Schwarz has led me on some wild goose chases

16:31:01 mircea_popescu: it's a basic tool for resolving certain problems in analysis.

16:31:06 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12000 @ 0.00049769 = 5.9723 BTC [+]

16:32:01 mircea_popescu: i dunno why the muricans don't recognize b's merits. he did the integral expansion which is the actual reason it's even useful.

16:33:16 BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> and add a ((Mark to be pronounced "Carl" not "four")) on that IV << fixed

16:33:26 mircea_popescu: haha cool!

16:34:56 oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/upcycling/

16:34:56 assbot: Upcycling ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDvd63 )

16:37:19 mircea_popescu: ajhahaha excellent.

16:38:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29573 @ 0.00048742 = 14.4145 BTC [-] {9}

16:39:48 mircea_popescu: from earlier link : "System Details

16:39:48 mircea_popescu: This was the "Cadillac of computers". In 1975, when this system was introduced, Altair system owners were flipping switches for hours just to watch lights blink on the front panel of their systems. Digital Group system owners were throwing a power switch and loading an operating system in less than 20 seconds. The cassette interface, standard with DG systems, loaded programs at 1100 baud. At the time, this was nearly f

16:39:48 mircea_popescu: our times the speed possible with any other manufacturers tape systems, and ten times faster than paper tape -- the only method available at the time for loading Micro Soft BASIC onto the Altair system. Of course, to even do that on an Altair, you had to buy a paper tape reader and an interface. Usually an ASR-33 Teletype and an SIO card. ($$$) By contrast, Digital Group systems included a video and cassette interface

16:39:50 mircea_popescu: and a keyboard as standard equipment with all of their systems."

16:40:16 mircea_popescu: that lisp company isn't the only thing to have sunk irrespective of immense tech advantages in the history of computing.

16:40:53 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: pretty much whole 'history of computing' is a story of ascendant charlatans peddling garbage while burying actual thinking folk selling to thinking folk

16:41:03 mircea_popescu: aha

16:41:11 BingoBoingo: <thestringpuller> mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo wrote about that in his Qntra piece. << this one http://qntra.net/2015/12/the-false-dilemma-of-xt-versus-blockstream/#fn3-4718 It's cruel to point people to "BingoBoingo's Qntra Piece" without specifying which one, and as time goes on it will only become more cruel.

16:41:12 assbot: The False Dilemma of XT Versus Blockstream | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDvW78 )

16:41:45 asciilifeform: but as in mircea_popescu's essay re: 'can't separate industry from maggotry', the era ~prior to that~ looked like univac and there was a market for mebbe 50 of them.

16:41:46 asciilifeform: globally.

16:41:58 mircea_popescu: " As the tape was read, the screen would fill with the HEX or OCTAL page high address of the byte being loaded, testing the memory content for correctly loaded data as each byte was saved."

16:42:03 mircea_popescu: clearly very poor ux.

16:42:18 mircea_popescu: (where "ux" means "making the user feel smart")

16:45:11 mircea_popescu: "Digital Group also offered a very wide range of hardware accessories. If it was available to computer users at the time, it was available to DG system owners, and usually first. A users group of the time reported (and I confirmed in conversation with Dr. Suding) that within two weeks of the release of the Zilog Z80 chip samples, Dr. Suding had finalized the design for the Digital Group Z80 processor card, and had work

16:45:11 mircea_popescu: ing systems on display at computer shows. Besting the closest competitor by weeks if not months. Contrast that with the common practice of the day, of running ads for a concept product, then using the money from the customer orders to develop the advertised hardware."

16:48:54 mircea_popescu: and of course, alf's favourite part, "Popular until the very end, Digital Group failed in August of 1979 due to management and parts supplier troubles, not a lack of customer interest or product orders. Co-founder Dr. Robert Suding recalled that at the time of the bankruptcy, DG had thousands of product information requests and orders waiting to be filled."

16:49:08 asciilifeform: entirely typical.

16:49:32 asciilifeform: we don't actually know, afaik, how to make computers without maggotry.

16:51:27 mircea_popescu: fwiw, i credit the "bad management" part a lot.

16:51:54 mircea_popescu: it is bad management not to do a large number of various things that appear counter-intuitive to "intelligent" people. especially to the "civilised" metastasis thereof.

16:52:01 mircea_popescu: !s stalin's kittens

16:52:01 assbot: 0 results for 'stalin's kittens' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=stalin%27s+kittens

16:52:15 asciilifeform: 'when i am gone, they will strangle the lot of you like kittens'

16:53:18 mircea_popescu: "blind as newborn kittens"

16:55:17 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 2.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Dow Jones Industrial Average (^DJI) to drop below 14,000 before 31 March 2016 - http://bitbet.us/bet/1214/dow-jones-industrial-average-dji-to-drop-below/#b13

17:01:47 pete_dushenski: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/you-cant-trust-what-you-read-about-nutrition/ << heh. apt given last night's conversations.

17:01:49 assbot: You Can’t Trust What You Read About Nutrition | FiveThirtyEight ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDy6Us )

17:02:20 mircea_popescu: http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/867/695/946.jpg

17:02:21 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDybHH )

17:02:23 pete_dushenski: "So we’re left with our original question: What is a healthy diet? We know the basics — we need sufficient calories and protein to keep our bodies alive. We need nutrients like vitamin C and iron. Beyond that, we may be overthinking it"

17:02:39 pete_dushenski: "The takeaway, Archer said, is that our bodies are adaptable and pretty good at telling us what we need, if we can learn to listen."

17:03:10 pete_dushenski: obligatory : http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1364921

17:03:10 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 06:11:34; mircea_popescu: similarly it'll adapt to anything within reason, and as far as it can help it, beyond any reason. it's only job is to keep you going and it takes it more seriously than you'll ever take anything as long as you live.

17:04:09 mircea_popescu: heh check it out, consensus!

17:05:07 pete_dushenski: with a fellow 'computationalist', no less

17:05:10 pete_dushenski: "Edward Archer, a computational physiologist at the University of Alabama’s Nutrition Obesity Research Center in Birmingham"

17:07:45 mircea_popescu: anyway, im in full agreement with the fellow on the "listen to body" angle. if one can shut up the stupid going on in his head long enough, absolutely amazing feats can be accomplished, such as knowing when to eat and what.

17:07:45 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

17:09:41 pete_dushenski: quite

17:09:44 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365031 <--> http://fraudsters.com/2015/theres-a-one-bitcoin-reward-for-the-death-of-pieter-wuille-details-below/

17:09:44 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 12:29:15; copypaste: will the bitcoin foundation be accepting "segregated witness" into its client?

17:09:45 assbot: There's a one Bitcoin reward for the death of Pieter Wuille. Details below. on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1lxiG9S )

17:11:03 copypaste: pete_dushenski: you never seem online at an opportune time for me to tell you this. i think that you should develop your own style instead of copying MP's for contravex. contravex is a cheap knockoff at best to fraudsters. no one can surmount the original, i wouldn't dare even try writing in MP\s signature style.

17:11:08 copypaste: just some food for thought :)

17:11:47 pete_dushenski: lol there's always ;;later tell

17:12:15 pete_dushenski: anyways, i'll copy (and paste) whom i please kthx

17:12:16 copypaste: oh right, i forgot that command. i don't chat here often

17:14:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4600 @ 0.00048412 = 2.227 BTC [-] {2}

17:16:38 mircea_popescu: http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/867/697/1d8.jpg

17:16:40 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDzSoo )

17:17:05 mircea_popescu: http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/867/696/eaf.jpg fucking epic.

17:17:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDzWVi )

17:17:19 mircea_popescu: barbie i too can be a computer ideas woman!!1

17:18:06 pete_dushenski: is that comic supposed to be... real ?

17:18:12 *: pete_dushenski hopes it's satire

17:18:48 mircea_popescu: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/barbie-i-can-be-a-computer-engineer-parodies

17:18:50 assbot: Barbie: I Can Be a Computer Engineer Parodies | Know Your Meme ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDAaM5 )

17:19:05 pete_dushenski: phew

17:21:30 pete_dushenski: "Someone is betting $40,026 on the life of a 73-year-old lottery winner in Michigan. That amount was the highest bid Thursday in an online auction for a lottery prize that pays $1,000 a month, before taxes. But here's the hitch: The money is paid only as long as Donald Magett stays alive."

17:21:49 pete_dushenski: ^that winner'd better hope he's not drinking the tap water

17:22:13 asciilifeform: achtung panzers: zoolag is back online.

17:22:23 pete_dushenski: watch donald be dropped off weekly cases of bottled water.

17:22:28 pete_dushenski: !s michigan water

17:22:29 assbot: 0 results for 'michigan water' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=michigan+water

17:22:47 pete_dushenski: it was flint that had the lead poisoning wasn't it ?

17:23:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13494 @ 0.00048373 = 6.5275 BTC [-] {2}

17:30:51 funkenstein_: http://www.kingmaker.net/deaddoctorstxt.html#start <-- not blanket endorsement but worth the read re: nutrition

17:30:53 assbot: Dead Doctors Don't Lie by Dr. Joel Wallach ... ( http://bit.ly/1JDBBtT )

17:35:54 funkenstein_: "You can prevent, totally prevent, cardio myopathy for ten cents a day. And if we don't do it, we are malignant dumb, I like to call it. Malignant dumb if you don't take in ten cents a day of Selenium. It's a waste of your life. It's one of those landmines that you can avoid.

17:36:43 funkenstein_: "The medical treatment of choice for cardio myopathy is a heart transplant, costs $750,000. I want you to think about that. They get the heart free from a donor, they get the blood free for the surgery from the relatives. They use $2.50 of suture material, and they charge you $750,000 for that procedure. Now 6 months ago in LA when they had the earthquake, they were putting people in jail for 60 and 90 days for price-gouging, for se

17:36:44 funkenstein_: lling these terrified people a gallon of water for $4.00. They put them in jail for price-gouging, for selling them a gallon of water for four bucks.

17:39:32 shinohai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365260 <<< Laughably, the BarbieOS webpage redirects now - listed for sale

17:39:32 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 17:18:48; mircea_popescu: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/barbie-i-can-be-a-computer-engineer-parodies

17:39:50 shinohai: Guess I'll have to compile trb on tinkerbell linux now

17:40:38 pete_dushenski: heh

17:41:23 mircea_popescu: eh that's rank nonsense. "they" have to spend twenty fucking years training to be doing this, and "they" aren't joe blow from the gun fair.

17:43:36 pete_dushenski: waterboy is more than welcome to open his own heart transplant clinic, undercut the competition. go. do.

17:43:55 asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: where, in antarctica ?

17:44:12 asciilifeform: operating penguins ?

17:44:15 pete_dushenski: doesn't matter where

17:44:25 asciilifeform: does matter, because jail.

17:44:48 pete_dushenski: omg do it in your basement. make it a seekrit.

17:44:53 mircea_popescu: you're not about to tell me that you want random derp to be competing for heart transplant customers on the basis of marketing

17:44:54 mircea_popescu: do you ?!

17:45:06 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: the point is the skills, not the location

17:45:23 asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: and after the first corpse ?

17:45:31 mircea_popescu: no bro he got mad skills from watching the nature channel. just like all the other tardstalk ceobusinessmen

17:45:53 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: then other idiots learn that 750k isn't such a bad deal ?

17:46:09 asciilifeform: learn how ?

17:46:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00048936 = 4.5021 BTC [+] {2}

17:46:21 asciilifeform: at the hanging ?

17:47:03 pete_dushenski: second patient knew the first

17:47:11 pete_dushenski: fatties with bad hearts are all bffs

17:50:18 mircea_popescu: getting back to sanity, selenium is an essential micronutrient and not that hard to get. eat moar beats.

17:50:32 pete_dushenski: copypaste: furthermore, how'd you know that i wasn't an acultured asshole before reading fraudsters ? not that i deny the influence, but that's not entirely the point. the point is... how'd you know ? maybe being "mean" (or however you'd describe mp's style) is a cause of hanging around b-a, and not an effect, y'know ?

17:51:17 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: beets too

17:51:30 pete_dushenski: beats are by dre

17:51:32 mircea_popescu: aha

17:52:20 pete_dushenski: or maybe 'eating beats' is what dre calls it when his 'cheeks get pounded' or what was it

17:52:40 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=03-01-2016#1359657

17:52:40 assbot: Logged on 03-01-2016 15:23:46; mircea_popescu: thought you were smart. You still dumb. If I want to pound some butt, I could do a woman. I?m a bisexual because I like to get my cheekbones blown out. I like to get pounded in the butt.??

17:53:06 pete_dushenski: 'cheekbones blown out'... now there's a visual.

17:55:40 pete_dushenski: s/acultured/cultured. hm. dunno why that first one sounded right. it's definitely wrong.

17:55:52 pete_dushenski: how ironic

17:58:40 mircea_popescu: you can have acultural or uncultured.

18:00:51 pete_dushenski: and these'd be different or the same ?

18:01:56 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365147 << as usual, about 2-3 years too late

18:01:56 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 15:43:30; mircea_popescu: oh check that out, queergender consensus is slowly coallescing that apple fails in 2016.

18:02:38 pete_dushenski: make that 5. steve died in 2011.

18:03:21 pete_dushenski: "but jobs planned out the next 5 years of products so the company is still in good hands even though he's dead"

18:03:27 pete_dushenski: ya, well, time's up, kiddies

18:03:31 asciilifeform: monopolies don't 'fail' in the way a corner restaurant might.

18:04:06 pete_dushenski: apple will fail like government motors failed

18:04:16 asciilifeform: there were other car makers.

18:04:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6157 @ 0.00048628 = 2.994 BTC [-] {2}

18:04:38 pete_dushenski: there are other ph0ne makers

18:04:48 asciilifeform: there are no other non-microshit pc makers or non-turdroid pnohe makers.

18:04:52 mircea_popescu: apple is a monopoly in the sense qq.com is a monopoly. you... never heard of it.

18:04:58 asciilifeform: it is a motherfucking monopoly.

18:04:58 mircea_popescu: samsung makes cheaper, better tablets.

18:05:02 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-01-2016#1361677

18:05:02 assbot: Logged on 06-01-2016 21:57:20; pete_dushenski: girl who leases $500/mo suv couldn't imagine justifying $800 iph0ne, so... bought $300 chinese thing

18:05:02 asciilifeform: turdroid.

18:05:09 mircea_popescu: nobody asked you, tho.

18:05:14 mircea_popescu: the whole thing is turdoid.

18:05:14 asciilifeform: has mircea_popescu actually used a turdroid ?

18:05:23 mircea_popescu: i have no love for portables.

18:05:46 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: what pc's do you imagine anyone under 60 is buying at this point ?

18:06:20 asciilifeform: !s suspend mode

18:06:21 assbot: 10 results for 'suspend mode' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=suspend+mode

18:06:32 mircea_popescu: i thought we were discussing the fucking ipad.

18:06:38 pete_dushenski: gray-haired men, yes, buy new crapple. that's it. walk into 'apple store' and look who is at 'genius bar'

18:06:43 mircea_popescu: you were talking about some obscure desktop thing apple perhaps still makes ?!

18:06:57 *: pete_dushenski referring to imac

18:07:05 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i work at megacorp that is more or less 100% mb pro

18:07:15 asciilifeform: and not the only such

18:09:33 asciilifeform: 'mac' is, quite monopolistically, the only USABLE-for-development portable unix box presently sold, and the ios boxen - the only non-infested-five-minutes-after-uncrating pocket computers presently sold.

18:10:18 asciilifeform: and yes, jobs is dead, and the hardware is going to shit, i recently spent 4 hours trying to make a deterministic model of what the 'spaces' window manager does with 3 displays active, to no avail

18:10:29 asciilifeform: and the machine is 2 weeks old and already making peculiar grinding noises

18:10:42 asciilifeform: but this does not change the fact of monopoly.

18:11:10 asciilifeform: see obligatory turd, http://www.loper-os.org/?p=132

18:11:12 assbot: Loper OS » Non-Apple’s Mistake ... ( http://bit.ly/1NrLRp9 )

18:11:27 mircea_popescu: nobody gives a flying fuck about making desktops when discussing the apple failure.

18:11:37 mircea_popescu: if it sheds 99.4% oif its market cap and preserves the tiny thing you're interested in,

18:11:46 mircea_popescu: you'll say "nothing happened, as predicted, because monopoly"

18:12:01 mircea_popescu: and the world will say "omfg apple is finished. what a crater."

18:12:15 asciilifeform: actually it would be a very interesting thing if it finally died. somebody might start making actual commercial unix boxes again.

18:12:22 trinque: worth noting here that Google is rumbling about moving into PCs

18:12:23 asciilifeform: ones that work.

18:12:31 asciilifeform: 'nothing grows till the oak hits the ground' or what was it.

18:12:35 mircea_popescu: yeah, after cardano ships.

18:12:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6289 @ 0.00048628 = 3.0582 BTC [-]

18:13:19 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: sadly i have not yet discovered how to make pentium in my kitchen.

18:13:56 mircea_popescu: well... im gonna tell the investors you're working on it nevertheless.

18:14:07 mircea_popescu: and it'll be based on triforce numbers or something.

18:16:16 asciilifeform: l0lz

18:16:17 mircea_popescu: trinque their bid to take over internet infrastructure altogether is apparently a little stalled.

18:16:26 BingoBoingo: funkenstein_: Too much selenium is bad though, makes a person stink. Even thiols can't apporach the stink of selenium compounds

18:17:44 trinque: mircea_popescu: on the hosting side bezos has eaten a lot of it, and as far as what the average derp is staring at when she thinks she's on the internet, facebook

18:17:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3089 @ 0.00048331 = 1.4929 BTC [-] {2}

18:20:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3741 @ 0.00048473 = 1.8134 BTC [+] {2}

18:20:55 BingoBoingo: <trinque> mircea_popescu: on the hosting side bezos has eaten a lot of it, and as far as what the average derp is staring at when she thinks she's on the internet, facebook << For on this try to find the web presence of any 'Murican Militia organization

18:21:07 pete_dushenski: http://news.nationalpost.com/full-comment/tom-kott-get-quebec-out-of-my-married-name << "“There is a new generation of women raised in an equal society who don’t feel threatened by men. For them, taking their husband’s name doesn’t mean living under their husband’s shadow.” Clearly, the dominance of cultural paternalism was replaced by government paternalism in this scheme, and no one has been left b

18:21:09 assbot: Tom Kott: Quebec’s ‘married name’ law is paternalistic and dumb | National Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1K78vOF )

18:21:09 pete_dushenski: etter off — then, or now."

18:21:15 BingoBoingo: Excluding Oathkeepers and other known USG moles

18:21:34 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: in a very meaningful sense, these organizations DO NOT EXIST except in meatspace. because they have no pgp.

18:21:36 asciilifeform: thinkaboutit

18:22:01 asciilifeform: you can't, for instance, 'email isis'

18:22:06 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: OH, some of them have EXTENSIVE facebook presences

18:22:07 asciilifeform: you can only email the usg dept of prison

18:22:19 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: usg front-end

18:22:27 BingoBoingo: But yes, to contact them gotta go through USG dept of prisons

18:22:40 asciilifeform: mno, that only contacts your local preet

18:22:53 asciilifeform: (who may choose to pass on your bits to another idiot if it suits his purposes, sure)

18:22:54 mircea_popescu: trinque yeah, but they were going to bitchslap cox cable & co on the providing side.

18:22:55 BingoBoingo: Via that harvard jew

18:23:08 mircea_popescu: truth be told the connectivity situation of the us is really on par with its stature in the world : african.

18:23:12 trinque: mircea_popescu: that's right, "google fiber"

18:23:21 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: mno, africa has ok connectivity via gsm

18:24:04 pete_dushenski: usa : sub-sub-saharan african internet

18:25:02 pete_dushenski: about antarctica if my geography is correct

18:25:09 mircea_popescu: well, just like africa, so is the us a big... "country".

18:25:21 mircea_popescu: some places got better connectivity than others, but overall...

18:26:04 asciilifeform: outside of major conurbations, usa has approximately same quality of connectivity as... ships at sea

18:26:52 asciilifeform: this is one of the things severely limiting the appeal, from my pov, of 'cheap middle-of-nowhere' locales there

18:27:19 asciilifeform: i've an old chum who moved to wv. he is ever scheming to build a radio tower.

18:27:50 asciilifeform: 'but the house cost 1/5th!11111'

18:28:40 BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> this is one of the things severely limiting the appeal, from my pov, of 'cheap middle-of-nowhere' locales there << Yeah, gotta be near a cable path and all of a sudden house no longer 1/5 but 1/4 or even 1/3

18:29:30 asciilifeform: 'cable path' ~= 25k usd project

18:30:17 asciilifeform: not to mention that if it is a cable tv sort of cable, you are stuck with some of the most abominable isp monopolists in all of usaschwitz

18:30:28 asciilifeform: (e.g., 'comcast')

18:34:00 BingoBoingo: Oh, no I mean the transit cables, but even then no guarentee people will care to tap them >> http://rlc.edu campus runs on poin to point wireless even though near I-57 and massive cables going from Chicago to US South, because no one has will to tap cables

18:34:05 assbot: Rend Lake College - Ina, IL - Home ... ( http://bit.ly/1K79Jth )

18:34:26 BingoBoingo: But if near transit cables with existing tap, internet not too bad

18:34:57 BingoBoingo: Nowhere's ville near cable taps is where you find decent muni fiber in USia

18:46:18 mircea_popescu: ^

18:50:29 BingoBoingo: What you really want for Best USA Internet (TM/R) is suburb 8.5-25 kilowarmbodies 10-30 miles from regional population hub and not too far from inerstate highway path

18:50:56 mircea_popescu: pretty much where i lived back when i did.

18:53:13 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: do you happen to have the link to that classic russian 'chukka' comic handy ? i can't find it in the logs

18:53:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8400 @ 0.00049768 = 4.1805 BTC [+] {2}

18:54:21 BingoBoingo: What you want is a core of people who aren't poor relative to the rest of their USistan region. Once they make the muni-fiber jump the first few years are rough until they get addicted to uptime and buying more cables headed in different directions out of town.

18:55:12 pete_dushenski: friends had a kid (half indian, half lithuanian) who looks 100% 'chukka'

18:58:46 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all

18:58:52 gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 446.84, vol: 4237.85142901 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 443.755, vol: 4583.31028 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 446.38, vol: 13610.32079304 | CampBX BTCUSD last: 434.8, vol: 3.07404244 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 445.392212, vol: 46690.77580000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 447.27368, vol: 36.97002807 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 446.55969, vol: 33.19697639 | Volume-weighted last average: (1 more message)

18:58:56 BingoBoingo: ;;more

18:58:56 gribble: 445.567823496

18:59:03 funkenstein_: <mircea_popescu> apple is a monopoly in the sense qq.com is a monopoly. you... never heard of it. <-- i was surprised to learn recently tencent was a major player in handling the exchange to fiat-bank segment for e.g. btcchina

19:00:16 funkenstein_: though now apparently they go direct without third parties

19:00:18 BingoBoingo: http://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2012/05/15/things_i_wont_work_with_selenophenol

19:00:20 assbot: Things I Won’t Work With: Selenophenol | In the Pipeline ... ( http://bit.ly/1RgHLTz )

19:01:03 funkenstein_: BingoBoingo, for this dwarf the bottleneck is never bandwidth or screenspace. Always my own fucking head.

19:01:24 BingoBoingo: That's how it tends to work

19:02:19 *: BingoBoingo very disappoint there are no cool alternate lines being offered anywhere he can find on the Bama-Clemson game tomorrow. Wants to take Bama -13.5 or -20.5

19:02:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5260 @ 0.00049775 = 2.6182 BTC [+] {2}

19:02:57 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ aha.

19:06:06 pete_dushenski: bbiab

19:14:23 BingoBoingo: May we never forget the bravest Chemistry paper in history http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ja00893a004

19:14:24 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1RgIWCm )

19:18:51 BingoBoingo: ;;later tell PeterL What kind of budget would you need to produce a paper on the sulfur chemistry of FOOF in the name of making the TMSR a contributor to cutting edge science?

19:18:52 gribble: The operation succeeded.

19:24:31 BingoBoingo: Seems like low hanging fruit for TMSR to legitimately contribute to the advancement of the physical sciences

19:26:03 asciilifeform: pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=08-10-2015#1294706

19:26:03 assbot: Logged on 08-10-2015 02:09:29; asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu re: chukcha: canonical: http://www.liveinternet.ru/users/1700710/post74537442 << scroll to pics

19:26:16 asciilifeform: and it's - chukcha

19:26:28 asciilifeform: чукча.

19:34:33 ben_vulpes: heh FOOF

19:34:44 ben_vulpes: that one made an appearance in 'Ignition!' iirc

19:40:02 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: aha. cheers.

19:40:43 pete_dushenski: http://hiero.ru/Akuaku/ChukIMak << the chuckcha comics i was thinking of.

19:40:44 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZeKT1i )

19:41:02 BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: If we are to etch our own silicon we gotta consider all sorts of weird

19:41:47 pete_dushenski: *chukcha

19:44:35 BingoBoingo: look who went complete retard https://archive.is/f8hQk

19:44:36 assbot: Cryptography Guru Announces Anonymous Communications Network Called PrivaTegrity ... ( http://bit.ly/1mNZrtb )

19:45:08 BingoBoingo: "In an interview with Wired, Mr. Chaum revealed that, to prevent cybercrime and other nefarious groups from using their network, the researchers behind this initiative are planning to create a PrivaTegrity Council."

19:45:21 BingoBoingo: "This council will provide access to data about users to law enforcement, but only for those who use the network for criminal activities. This council will have nine members from across the world, and all have to agree to release information about users to any government inquiring for data."

19:46:36 pete_dushenski: never go full retard

19:47:08 BingoBoingo: Just a man, pretending to be a man, pretending to be another man.

19:47:10 mircea_popescu: ahahah what the fuck.

19:47:15 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo word.

19:47:26 pete_dushenski: " and all have to agree to release information about users to any government inquiring for data." << 9/9 multi-sig !

19:47:44 pete_dushenski: one loses key, rest can go home

19:50:39 pete_dushenski: "In short, right now the bitcoin infrastructure is insufficient to support the unbanked. This must and will change. Before we begin, a bit of disclosure: I’ve been researching this for my on project, Freemit, and I’ve been talking talking to startups in this space." << so much talking

19:50:45 pete_dushenski: http://techcrunch.com/2016/01/10/why-bitcoin-cant-help-the-poorest-yet/

19:50:47 assbot: Why Bitcoin Can’t Help The Poorest – Yet | TechCrunch ... ( http://bit.ly/1mO0cT6 )

19:52:16 pete_dushenski: "The bitcoin infrastructure is excellent, secure, and powerful in the abstract. In practice it is useless… but not for long." << try death warrants with paypal.

19:52:26 mircea_popescu: idiots.

19:53:07 ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: i've been thinking a lot about proteins lately

19:53:19 ben_vulpes: silicon is a dead end

19:53:21 mircea_popescu: "since 100% of all bitcoin businesses are in b-a and b-a doesn't like it, you know what ? it is useless!11 nothing ever happened!111 blablabl~!111"

19:53:40 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes and proteins are a long end.

19:53:48 pete_dushenski: https://twitter.com/johnbiggs << author of the above. ftr.

19:53:50 assbot: John Biggs (@johnbiggs) | Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZeLRLe )

19:53:58 ben_vulpes: long end?

19:54:16 *: ben_vulpes is operating under a severe cognition deficit today. weird bugs in the blood.

19:54:26 mircea_popescu: it'll take you forever to find out it doesn't work, sorta thing.

19:55:01 mircea_popescu: "Writer and Maker. Editor for TechCrunch." heh. ever novel ways to say "nobody doing nothing, ignore me please"

19:55:06 BingoBoingo: Not to mention shaping proteins is hard bsns

19:55:46 mircea_popescu: myeah.

19:56:13 ben_vulpes: "monte-carlo 'engineering'"

19:56:50 pete_dushenski: i thought the whole 'maker' thing woulda died when 3d printing didn't put home depot out of business in 12 months flat. guess not eh

19:58:00 pete_dushenski: in other 'how would you know' nyooz, ""Everyone in our pool is making money, because people who aren't making money would not have their machines turned on," BTCC's Lee said."

19:58:18 pete_dushenski: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-01-07/the-return-of-bitcoin-mining

19:58:19 assbot: The Return of Bitcoin Mining - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZeMgNL )

19:58:38 deedbot-: [BitBet Bets Bets] 4.31800000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b62

19:58:53 pete_dushenski: probably the same logic bobby lee used to arrive at the 'must have 2mb blocks' conclusion

20:03:10 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365440 << RIP chaum

20:03:10 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 19:45:08; BingoBoingo: "In an interview with Wired, Mr. Chaum revealed that, to prevent cybercrime and other nefarious groups from using their network, the researchers behind this initiative are planning to create a PrivaTegrity Council."

20:03:31 asciilifeform: what do you suppose they did to him ?

20:05:01 BingoBoingo: No idea

20:06:28 asciilifeform: chaum et al are the flip side of the 'everybody has a day job' crap

20:06:51 asciilifeform: likely, man had a choice between eating and not-quisling

20:06:53 asciilifeform: picked eating.

20:07:18 asciilifeform: and mircea_popescu will probably tell us that he oughta have shot a cop somewhere.

20:07:29 ben_vulpes: stack up

20:07:40 asciilifeform: as if a dead chaum is much good for anything.

20:08:15 asciilifeform: how much good from the dead murdock ?

20:09:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6850 @ 0.00049792 = 3.4108 BTC [+]

20:14:36 *: pete_dushenski for a run

20:15:26 BingoBoingo: Did this Kristov Atlas fellow ever have a presence in either WoT, this is the stupid sort of twitter rambling that demands an ideological negrate https://archive.is/fIuTA

20:15:28 assbot: Kristov Atlas on Twitter: "@bboingo @bboingo @pierre_rochard @rogerkver right, but a firefighter's job presently is to take on physical risk." ... ( http://bit.ly/1ZeNJne )

20:19:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4400 @ 0.00049686 = 2.1862 BTC [-]

20:23:03 danielpbarron: he knows about it; that guy has me blocked even

20:26:08 BingoBoingo: Seriously Obeasts are only a hazard to themselves? Does he even consider the pathogens people who can't clean their ass spread everyday as they go about sitting and leaning on public spaces.

20:36:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8759 @ 0.00049684 = 4.3518 BTC [-] {2}

20:38:29 ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: i'm going to vom

20:39:20 BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes: More than any dietary change, avoiding morbid Obeasts will materially improve your health. Give it a try for 30 day, see the improvement in your life.

20:44:35 ben_vulpes: your reports are from a different universe from that which i inhabit

20:45:07 ben_vulpes: no obeasts on 1400 vertical foot hikes

20:47:50 BingoBoingo: ben_vulpes already build his wizard tower?

20:53:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10100 @ 0.00049573 = 5.0069 BTC [-]

20:55:23 ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo: some day i will roost in the vista house: http://vistahouse.com/

20:55:25 assbot: Friends of Vista House ... ( http://bit.ly/1RE5gnW )

20:56:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3191 @ 0.0004964 = 1.584 BTC [+]

21:03:11 *: BingoBoingo right now just wondering on the holy grail of sealed FeNi batteries which would make wizard tower pissibru

21:05:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15000 @ 0.00050049 = 7.5074 BTC [+] {2}

21:37:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2500 @ 0.00050384 = 1.2596 BTC [+] {2}

22:26:54 punkman: asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365440 << RIP chaum << I don't think this was out of character at all

22:26:54 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 19:45:08; BingoBoingo: "In an interview with Wired, Mr. Chaum revealed that, to prevent cybercrime and other nefarious groups from using their network, the researchers behind this initiative are planning to create a PrivaTegrity Council."

22:40:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7349 @ 0.00050393 = 3.7034 BTC [+] {2}

22:44:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5350 @ 0.00050399 = 2.6963 BTC [+]

22:56:55 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365503 << wai wut ?!

22:56:55 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 22:26:54; punkman: asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365440 << RIP chaum << I don't think this was out of character at all

23:03:10 asciilifeform: soooooo turns out prb doesn't like relaying high-S sigs.

23:03:19 asciilifeform: as of whenever.

23:03:37 asciilifeform: this, i strongly suspect, resolves the mega-mystery.

23:03:45 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes, mod6, other panzerz ^^

23:04:00 thestringpuller: prb?

23:04:05 thestringpuller: !s prb

23:04:05 assbot: 6 results for 'prb' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=prb

23:04:06 asciilifeform: 'powe ranger' bitcoin

23:04:10 thestringpuller: Ah

23:04:22 thestringpuller: yea prb won't relay high-S due to bip-62

23:04:36 thestringpuller: err

23:04:55 thestringpuller: BIP-66

23:05:35 shinohai: https://i.imgur.com/L680STE.jpg

23:05:36 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1PYrRvP )

23:06:10 thestringpuller: Basically all "new" PRB-nodes will refuse to relay high-S tx's to the network. Miners will still mine them though. But interesting that a high-s transaction has high probability to get fellated and malleated by network before being mined.

23:26:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it shouldn't be the case that you're connected exclusively to prb nodes.

23:26:14 mircea_popescu: it should also not be the case that there isn't a trb path between you and miners.

23:26:19 asciilifeform: agreed

23:26:23 mircea_popescu: the contrary situation is aptly known as "isolated"

23:26:23 asciilifeform: but it ~is~ the case

23:26:31 asciilifeform: that there is not a trb path between my nodez and the miners.

23:26:43 thestringpuller: if miner nodes are running prb, they'll isolate too

23:26:50 asciilifeform: that also

23:27:03 asciilifeform: and seems like we have a handy litmus.

23:28:20 mircea_popescu: thestringpuller "running prb" is not being a miner.

23:34:25 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: i was just saying if miners receive tx's to mine via PRB code then it'll isolate

23:34:59 thestringpuller: i dunno if this is case, cause not like miners publicize their nodes (or maybe they do, i'm still investigating)

23:37:02 mircea_popescu: it's complicated and multi-layered and so on because ddos.

23:37:24 mircea_popescu: the dns derps keep going on about how important and bla bla they are - but by comparison they're 13yo's at the beach, making sandcastles.

23:41:12 asciilifeform: incidentally a gossipd which conducts tcp pipes would at least threaten to begin to formalize the hierarchy.

23:41:34 mircea_popescu: myeah

23:44:10 asciilifeform: the one problem might be that mining selects for idiocy

23:44:30 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365479 < can you believe this guy ?!

23:44:30 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 20:07:18; asciilifeform: and mircea_popescu will probably tell us that he oughta have shot a cop somewhere.

23:45:07 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365465 << note that nature has more resources than you, has been trying it for longer than you'll be alive, and STILL hasn't produced organic intelligence.

23:45:07 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 19:56:13; ben_vulpes: "monte-carlo 'engineering'"

23:45:14 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: hey it was what my internal mircea_popescu-coprocessor said to me !

23:45:49 mircea_popescu: lol

23:46:45 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365472 << am i the only guy left that doesn't know who the fuck this was ?

23:46:45 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 20:03:10; asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365440 << RIP chaum

23:47:47 asciilifeform: ;;google david chaum

23:47:48 gribble: David Chaum - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Chaum; David Chaum: http://www.chaum.com/; How DigiCash Blew Everything - Cryptome: https://cryptome.org/jya/digicrash.htm

23:47:57 mircea_popescu: wait, wait, actually ?!

23:48:14 mircea_popescu: hey check that out, zimmerman makes nsa-phone and david chaum makes nsa-gossipd.

23:48:22 mircea_popescu: i am rather flattered, honestly.

23:48:28 asciilifeform: inventor of blind signature, and of undoublespendable-decentralized money as a concept

23:48:40 mircea_popescu: i thought it was just random derp named chaum

23:49:41 asciilifeform: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/16/01/10/1532209/crypto-guru-david-chaums-private-communications-network-comes-with-a-backdoor << nah. ~the~ chaum.

23:49:43 assbot: Crypto Guru David Chaum's Private Communications Network Comes With a Backdoor - Slashdot ... ( http://bit.ly/1mOrJnw )

23:49:43 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365485 << atlas is famous chiefly for his crazy. i dunno that anyone'd take the stuff seriously. think tardstalk's own vexual.

23:49:43 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 20:15:26; BingoBoingo: Did this Kristov Atlas fellow ever have a presence in either WoT, this is the stupid sort of twitter rambling that demands an ideological negrate https://archive.is/fIuTA

23:50:31 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the general lack of personal integrity in the angloworld is quite the sad spectacle, huh.

23:50:39 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: elementary starvation.

23:51:10 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i have no interest in designing molecular structures myself. i am mostly interested in simulating the interactions of easily-procured precursors in lots and lots of sims, varying lots and lots of variables in the sim, in order to crap out eg simple logic gates

23:51:21 ben_vulpes: this is how various novel antibacterials are 'designed'.

23:51:27 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: it is pointedly NOT how

23:51:40 ben_vulpes: some! a tiny fraction.

23:51:45 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes no, i get it, you want maximum skim for minimum upfront work.

23:51:48 mircea_popescu: this is not a novel strategy.

23:51:51 *: asciilifeform used to do just this, for a living, this is very much not a description of how.

23:52:09 asciilifeform: for fuckssake, there is not even a closed-form solution for ONE MOTHERFUCKING LITHIUM ATOM

23:52:24 mircea_popescu: yes but that because bad math more than anything else.

23:52:33 asciilifeform: mno, because n-body problem.

23:52:39 asciilifeform: provable absence of closed form.

23:52:51 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu of all people oughta know this..

23:53:10 mircea_popescu: but not provable that a good heuristic intermediate between "closed form" and "fuck you" is absent for fundamental reasons.

23:53:27 asciilifeform: there are eh-maybe-somewhat-usable heuristics

23:53:29 ben_vulpes: http://astro.temple.edu/~meister/Schafmeister_group_website/Research.html << so, another usgscam?

23:53:31 assbot: Research overview ... ( http://bit.ly/1Zf2EO3 )

23:53:31 asciilifeform: they soak up infinite cpu.

23:53:35 mircea_popescu: because bad math.

23:53:49 mircea_popescu: i don't need it to answer absolutely. i just need it to reduce by a factor of 10^20 rather than by a factor of maybe 10^3

23:53:51 mircea_popescu: that's all.

23:54:13 asciilifeform: in practice, the errors compound and magnify into near-useless soup.

23:54:25 asciilifeform: on state of the art $maxint simulator.

23:54:34 mircea_popescu: this was the exact description of a "bad math" situation htroughout the history of science.

23:54:39 asciilifeform: aha.

23:54:44 mircea_popescu: in particular, it's why calorimetric theory was unverifiable. and so on.

23:55:01 mircea_popescu: so i'm taking an educated guess : it's because bad math.

23:55:25 asciilifeform: also because we don't have computers.

23:55:35 mircea_popescu: computer science is taught by the math dept.

23:55:47 asciilifeform: (simulating 10^20 INDEPENDENT elements on a von neumann box with maybe a dozen cpu is lunacy)

23:57:52 asciilifeform: http://museum.ipsj.or.jp/computer/word/images/0027_02_l.jpg << in other 'nyoooz'

23:58:26 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: has the best PC pr0n.

23:58:53 mircea_popescu: o look it's a nec.

23:59:19 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-01-2016#1365516 << doubles as public-relations-bitcoin. you know, scam.

23:59:19 assbot: Logged on 10-01-2016 23:04:06; asciilifeform: 'powe ranger' bitcoin