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Transcript for 13-03-2015, 1509 lines:

00:01:57 danielpbarron: only to barely glance what was inside once open? << i confidently walked through security at the new york marathon (post boston bombing) without having my backpack checked; had a stainless steel 64 oz bottle inside

00:02:48 *: jurov at first read stainless steel 64 oz blade inside

00:03:37 danielpbarron: everyone else queued up with their bag in hand, arms outstretched

00:04:09 danielpbarron: i walked right up to the guy with the wand, he waved it around and let me through

00:04:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14000 @ 0.00033617 = 4.7064 BTC [+]

00:07:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47362 @ 0.00032865 = 15.5655 BTC [-]

00:08:08 danielpbarron: !up Transisto

00:08:20 danielpbarron: !up ohhahh

00:12:36 jurov: also, while code may be encased in acrylate, it's easy victim for future C compilers hyperoptimizations

00:16:53 mircea_popescu: <jurov> in short, we're standing on the shoulders of monkeys << quite.

00:17:11 mircea_popescu: !up cuwirebeard

00:19:06 mircea_popescu: ;;google "Satoshi Dice couldn't merge tx's anyway because bitcoind is written by monkeys"

00:19:07 gribble: Inputs.io hacked – 4100 BTC stolen | Hacker News: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6687795; How would you make an extra ,000 in a month? :: Kopywriting Kourse: http://kopywritingkourse.com/10000-in-a-month/; Is Louisiana's Oil-Blocking Sand Berm Project Doomed? - 80beats ...: http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/06/25/is-louisianas-oil-blocking-sand-berm- (1 more message)

00:19:19 mircea_popescu: gtfo google. there's exactly one source on the whole internet.

00:27:52 ben_vulpes: decimation, asciilifeform, mod6, mircea_popescu, et al: what does it mean for openssl to load files in from disk as discussed last night? is it compiling .txts into machine code? loading precompiled stuff?

00:28:08 ben_vulpes: cazalla: i don't know a transisto, no.

00:28:38 decimation: ben_vulpes: usually libdl is used to load a binary library *after* the program has launched

00:29:11 decimation: a common scenario is when you want to load 'binary plugins'

00:29:30 decimation: which themselves are compiled .so files

00:29:31 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data.

00:30:12 ben_vulpes: heh

00:30:13 mircea_popescu: "oh but it works"

00:30:52 ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data. << i would like to hear the seasoned lispers take on this

00:31:01 mircea_popescu: "After messing around with this code for about a month I decided to write this up for the tubes in the hope that I can save some souls. I have come to the conclusion that OpenSSL is equivalent to monkeys throwing feces at the wall. It is, bar none, the worst library I have ever worked with. I can not believe that the internet is running on such a ridiculous complex and gratuitously stupid piece of code. Since circa 199

00:31:01 mircea_popescu: 8 the whole world has been trusting their secure communications to this impenetrable morass that calls itself the "OpenSSL" project. I bet that the doctors that work on that shitshow can not prescribe anything useful either!"

00:31:07 mircea_popescu: maybe this guy should be in here.

00:31:10 decimation: http://www.mail-archive.com/openssl-dev@openssl.org/msg05003.html < "Support for hardware acceleration is on its way that will use DSOs, this is so that the library and applications can have acceleration support but still run on platforms that don't have the acceleration drivers. Eg. you could even build applications that *can* support hardware acceleration using platforms without the hardware/drivers."

00:31:11 assbot: Re: Why is dso a part of openssl? ... ( http://bit.ly/1BAJits )

00:31:37 decimation: so what he's saying is that they put the libdl stuff in there so that you could load a binary driver for custom hardware

00:31:44 mircea_popescu: lol, conformal guy. kay.

00:31:44 decimation: without recompiling the openssl library

00:32:33 trinque: that module loading thing is like they almost knew the thing should be broken into small pieces, but not quite

00:33:12 decimation: what it comes down to is that distribution 'vendors' wanna ship you binaries

00:33:15 cazalla: ben_vulpes, ah you mentioned him in the logs so i thought otherwise

00:33:30 trinque: decimation: here attach this mystery device to your bloodstream

00:33:33 trinque: you'll be fine

00:33:36 decimation: hehe

00:33:44 ben_vulpes: cazalla: i hm what when?

00:33:50 ben_vulpes: !s transisto from ben_vulpes

00:33:51 assbot: 0 results for 'transisto from ben_vulpes' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=transisto+from+ben_vulpes

00:34:10 cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-06-2014#698249

00:34:10 assbot: Logged on 02-06-2014 01:23:02; benkay: !up Transisto

00:36:45 mircea_popescu: #ifndef OPENSSL_NO_STDIO

00:36:46 mircea_popescu: * Load CA certs from a file into a ::STACK. Note that it is somewhat misnamed;

00:36:46 mircea_popescu: * it doesn't really have anything to do with clients (except that a common use

00:36:46 mircea_popescu: * for a stack of CAs is to send it to the client). Actually, it doesn't have

00:36:46 mircea_popescu: * much to do with CAs, either, since it will load any old cert.

00:36:50 mircea_popescu: * \param file the file containing one or more certs.

00:36:52 mircea_popescu: * \return a ::STACK containing the certs.

00:36:54 mircea_popescu: */

00:36:56 mircea_popescu: STACK_OF(X509_NAME) *SSL_load_client_CA_file(const char *file)

00:37:00 mircea_popescu: ahaha epic. no fucking wonder bitcoin-proto works on open-ssl

00:37:43 decimation: re: full auto < yeah us mil agrees, the ar-15 (m16) isn't made with full auto anymore, only 3-round burst. even this is almost never used. There is a place for full auto, and it is on a machine gun that is heavy enough to fire at full auto without completely losing accuracy

00:37:58 decimation: mircea_popescu: openssl has weird re-implementations of all kinds of crazy shit

00:38:08 mircea_popescu: decimation that, exactly. emplaced, basically.

00:38:33 decimation: yeah, crew served or mounted on a vehicle

00:41:11 cazalla: ben_vulpes, nothing untoward, his name just popped up in a trailer for a video and i searched logs here but few hits

00:43:34 ben_vulpes: ahmkay.

00:54:24 mircea_popescu: http://41.media.tumblr.com/29d64bd0a3aa3757ca989ff98bf618ca/tumblr_mowkmf8aaE1r0qabqo1_1280.jpg

00:54:25 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1x0iyUI )

00:54:39 decimation: re: asciilifeform on a boat < wash dc is famous for having a 'marina' on the potomac where one can live for the price of a boat and a few $k per year

00:55:21 decimation: re: italians < especially southern italians. northern ones tend to be a bit more germanic

00:57:00 decimation: asciilifeform: wow they even placed your shield? neat

00:57:00 mircea_popescu: yeah, the southerners are too disorganised to even be corrupt properly

00:57:08 mircea_popescu: need a berlusconi or something to show them how it'd sone

00:57:34 decimation: of course, note that nearly all 'italian americans' come from southern italy

01:00:59 BingoBoingo: Midwest "Italian Americans" are the worst

01:22:14 Adlai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1050906 < having the evaluator|compiler available at compil|evaluation time vs asking it to (eval (read (http-request "wack")))

01:22:14 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 00:30:52; ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data. << i would like to hear the seasoned lispers take on this

01:24:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16100 @ 0.00032594 = 5.2476 BTC [-]

01:27:05 danielpbarron: !up Bagels7

01:35:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33050 @ 0.00033617 = 11.1104 BTC [+]

01:46:47 asciilifeform: decimation: wow they even placed your shield? neat << it's a part, like the others, with footprint & centroid coordinates, etc. i'd be rather pissed if it were missing

01:50:03 mircea_popescu: what, "we did most of the job" not good enough for ya ?!

01:50:17 mircea_popescu: in this day and age things aren't as they used to be, yo!

01:58:44 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20350 @ 0.00032473 = 6.6083 BTC [-] {2}

02:06:42 asciilifeform: "we did most of the job" << these folks even offer a 'test' service but i can't really make use of it for these parts

02:07:07 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: what airport is best? or does it matter?

02:07:54 asciilifeform: ( for folks who missed wtf thread was about - http://www.loper-os.org/pub/mf3_compare.jpg )

02:08:02 mircea_popescu: generally everyone flies through ezeiza, but it doesn't matter.

02:08:45 decimation: asciilifeform: how did you get prices for your bom?

02:08:53 decimation: their 'house parts' list is small

02:09:07 asciilifeform: decimation: most of the parts aren't house

02:09:15 asciilifeform: they charge extra for the kitting

02:09:18 decimation: do they take ie digikey?

02:09:26 asciilifeform: takes most anything

02:09:36 asciilifeform: but adds days (they wait for order to come)

02:09:44 decimation: ah. so they order on your behalf?

02:09:46 asciilifeform: aha

02:09:55 mod6: <+jurov> mod6 sorry, dns problem, fixed << ahh, awesome. not a problem. Thanks!

02:09:59 asciilifeform: they outsource the boards too - took most of the time, it appears

02:10:06 asciilifeform: guessing it's somewhere slow - therefore american

02:10:11 decimation: cool. well, I'm glad it worked out for you. I suspect that this is probably being subsidized by bezzlars

02:10:27 asciilifeform: actually i've yet to plug them in...

02:10:36 asciilifeform: so won't say for certain that 'worked out' yet.

02:10:39 decimation: hehe true

02:10:54 decimation: actually now is the time to find prototyping services in europe or ru

02:11:02 decimation: with the strong dollar

02:11:21 asciilifeform: it is very easy to find manufacturing service. but mostly impossible to find one that does onesies economically

02:12:45 decimation: I wonder if they have heavy automation or cheap labor?

02:13:18 asciilifeform: claims the former

02:13:27 decimation: I'm dubious

02:13:34 decimation: someone has to load your custom parts

02:15:51 asciilifeform: decimation: there's exactly 1 through-hole part

02:15:53 asciilifeform: 3 pads

02:16:01 asciilifeform: everything else is pick'n'place-able

02:16:11 PeterL: asciilifeform:the concept is meant to address an earlier thread - 'pashtun can make ak but rounds are still from izhevsk' << how about caseless rounds?

02:16:25 decimation: right, but how could it possibly be economical to load two parts into a pick n' place

02:16:37 decimation: might as well use your 'waldo'

02:20:05 asciilifeform: PeterL: dimensional tolerances

02:20:14 asciilifeform: PeterL: even worse problem

02:20:19 mircea_popescu: btw re computers and looms thread a coupla months back, i somehow forgot to mention the jacquard loom specifically.

02:20:25 mircea_popescu: the damned thing had cards. in 1801

02:20:57 decimation: asciilifeform: somewhat before babbage

02:21:31 asciilifeform: unit 1 is a dud

02:21:39 decimation: shucks

02:21:46 mod6: jurov: still doesn't seem to be working.

02:23:10 asciilifeform: unit 2 is a dud.

02:23:12 asciilifeform: motherfuckers.

02:23:29 mircea_popescu: aww.

02:23:31 decimation: sucks. is it a board issue?

02:23:34 mod6: asciilifeform: this is the device you ordered?

02:23:50 asciilifeform: i haven't the faintest clue

02:24:02 asciilifeform: it's an analogue circuit, will presumably find out

02:24:27 thestringpuller: http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2015/03/12/bitbeat-bitcoin-coder-garzik-signs-deal-to-deploy-bitsats-in-space/

02:26:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29950 @ 0.00032688 = 9.7901 BTC [+]

02:26:36 mircea_popescu: this should be interesting.

02:27:22 mircea_popescu: $1 million for one BitSat,

02:27:27 mircea_popescu: this does not sound rightsomehow

02:28:04 decimation: everyone and his mom in sillycon valley wants to loft a satellite constellation

02:28:20 decimation: what are they gonna use for the uplink/downlink frequencies? access equipment?

02:28:54 mircea_popescu: simpler problem : leaving aside the "Ever and ever" bs, even if you plan for 10 years you need tbs of hdd and gbs of ram. in space.

02:28:56 mircea_popescu: which means, shielded.

02:29:19 mircea_popescu: you're already talking half a ton of gear here. i didn't hear of aerospace material going for $200 / kg yet.

02:29:24 mircea_popescu: less than good tuna ? srsly ?

02:29:24 decimation: the attitude in the sillycon valley space complex these days is that you can just launch some more sats

02:29:47 Adlai: nah the blockchain will be in storj

02:29:53 mircea_popescu: lmao

02:30:02 decimation: also, it's not quite as big an issue since they are below the van allen belts

02:30:05 mircea_popescu: so wild pr piece, rly.

02:30:14 decimation: but it also means that the sats won't stay up very long

02:30:27 mircea_popescu: well which is ? ever and ever or $1mn / year ?

02:30:40 asciilifeform: moreover,

02:30:41 decimation: yeah $1 mn sounds too cheap

02:30:46 asciilifeform: not a single one of the rng submodules works.

02:30:51 mircea_popescu: i'm half tempted to do a "basics of satellites" like the hollywood and the corn one. however...

02:31:05 mircea_popescu: i suspect there are more experienced aerospace minds here. how about you do it instead ?

02:31:21 asciilifeform: !s reducing space mission cost

02:31:22 assbot: 2 results for 'reducing space mission cost' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=reducing+space+mission+cost

02:31:23 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform shoulda ordered icecream :D

02:31:34 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aha i'll bring ice cream to confIII

02:31:36 asciilifeform: l0l

02:31:47 mircea_popescu: btw... the icecream in this country... it can not be described.

02:32:06 mircea_popescu: it stands with the finest italian handmade gelateria in the same relation as this later beast stands with budweiser

02:32:35 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-09-2014#831933

02:32:35 assbot: Logged on 17-09-2014 02:27:20; decimation: herr walker believes this could be scaled: http://www.fourmilab.ch/documents/rocketaday.html << the nazis paid $13k 1945 dollars per V2

02:32:36 *: asciilifeform is floored by the sheer retardation. gave those idiots the simplest circuit in the world, as test

02:33:08 decimation: asciilifeform: they aren't gonna last very long if they can't deliver working circuits

02:33:21 asciilifeform: took'em almost a month, too

02:35:02 *: asciilifeform is not inclined to believe that it was accidental

02:35:16 wangxinxi: Have you guys heard of hedgy.co?

02:36:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform why not ?

02:39:41 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: both modules in both rng boards 100% dead

02:39:47 asciilifeform: without any visual signs of defect

02:40:02 asciilifeform: no visibly misaligned parts, no shorts

02:40:03 mircea_popescu: incompetence is the parsimonious explanation

02:40:11 decimation: asciilifeform: did you order these with all parts populated?

02:40:15 asciilifeform: decimation: yes

02:40:27 asciilifeform: decimation: these are ordinary rngs, as seen at conference II

02:40:31 asciilifeform: 100% analogue

02:40:39 decimation: can't imagine it's that complex

02:40:41 asciilifeform: it isn't

02:40:53 decimation: sounds like a bad board to me

02:40:58 asciilifeform: two bad boards

02:41:04 asciilifeform: in entirely invisible way

02:41:13 decimation: which implies their turdware manged your design I suspec

02:41:22 asciilifeform: again, not in any way detectable to naked eye

02:41:31 asciilifeform: about to manually probe the components under microscope

02:41:43 asciilifeform: but conclusive test would involve desoldering them

02:42:08 BingoBoingo: Maybe the wrong shade of blue for the PCB is problematic?

02:42:13 decimation: heh

02:42:26 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: no

02:42:51 *: asciilifeform was gonna order mainboard from these folks, to have in time for C III

02:42:57 asciilifeform: now going empty.

02:43:59 BingoBoingo: How do these fuckers expect to do a business off of 1-off boards when a two board order offers two dead boards

02:44:06 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i'll tell you how

02:44:13 asciilifeform: notice a sucker just paid'em 75 usd.

02:44:16 asciilifeform: me, that is

02:44:19 asciilifeform: because no alternative.

02:44:27 asciilifeform: it's exactly like the apple thread

02:44:40 decimation: presumably they will make you two more if it's their fault

02:45:39 asciilifeform: in another month

02:45:46 asciilifeform: and how the fuck do i prove whose fault

02:45:53 asciilifeform: and the game can be kept going as long as they like

02:46:56 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: can't you make them an offer they can't refuse?

02:49:02 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: if i could offer anyone anything, would not be having muppet problems

02:49:09 ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> btw... the icecream in this country... it can not be described. << so i expect: helado primo, vino tinto, y carne gargantua.

02:49:22 asciilifeform: so on first glance, their 470k resistors (0805 size) are actually 200k

02:49:27 asciilifeform: though they have the correct printing

02:49:42 asciilifeform: and that's just one piece.

02:49:56 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: i meant. you know "come to an understanding" if fuck ups occur?

02:50:04 thestringpuller: you're russian!

02:50:18 BingoBoingo: Prolly time to get some Chinese sweatshop workers into your shed with that H1B visa deal

02:52:00 thestringpuller: lol those poor chinese workers. dunno if asciilifeform is as benevolent of slave driver as mircea_popescu

02:56:26 asciilifeform: 470 and 200

02:56:29 asciilifeform: (not k)

02:56:54 asciilifeform: incidentally, 'house parts'

02:59:28 danielpbarron: !up NewLiberty

02:59:43 decimation: lol they put 200 on the 470k pads?

02:59:53 asciilifeform: no

03:00:08 asciilifeform: their 470 (not k) resistors are marked correctly (470) but have resistance of 200.

03:00:14 asciilifeform: and that is -only one- problem

03:00:22 asciilifeform: i have not even bothered to look at the rest of it

03:00:29 asciilifeform: this was not part of the deal

03:01:02 ben_vulpes: they're more efficient

03:01:13 ben_vulpes: you didn't need to burn that current anyways

03:01:27 ben_vulpes: it's like i tell the boys

03:01:52 ben_vulpes: "look, we're ording from a taco shop. the tacos cost a dollar fifty a pop. they're not going to be pleased with crazy custom orders, so cut it out.

03:01:53 ben_vulpes: "

03:02:15 ben_vulpes: extra cilantro get out of here

03:02:31 decimation: ben_vulpes: yeah except in this case, the taco stand bills itself as a custom taco stand

03:02:52 ben_vulpes: sure

03:03:04 ben_vulpes: and their tacos are clocking in at .75 per, to extend the metaphor.

03:03:09 ben_vulpes: outrageous claims are outrageous.

03:03:30 asciilifeform: it isn't even about the money as such

03:03:53 asciilifeform: i would have gladly paid 4x more if guaranteed working.

03:03:59 asciilifeform: as in - hard guarantee

03:04:06 asciilifeform: as in, i get a head on a stake if doesn't work

03:04:14 ben_vulpes: glhf. not happening.

03:04:18 danielpbarron: i guess there's an obvious reason as to why they can't do whatever tests you are doing before they ship the things

03:04:18 asciilifeform: that's the idea here

03:04:24 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: http://www.quickmeme.com/img/32/32b4229145de0a2c1171b9b5757f25dfaa1bbf7b9be0b687be4dd5aec76a34d6.jpg

03:04:26 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: obvious idea is obvious

03:04:35 danielpbarron: it's intentional :<

03:04:39 decimation: testing boards is a whole other layer of complexity

03:04:53 ben_vulpes: shouldn't be, really.

03:04:55 decimation: could be done, but not over mass production of one-offs

03:04:58 asciilifeform: however, no one cancelled physics

03:05:05 ben_vulpes: no, it should be easy, decimation.

03:05:08 asciilifeform: testing that board corresponds to given gerber mask is trivial

03:05:16 asciilifeform: testing that parts have their marked values - also trivial

03:05:23 asciilifeform: testing that they are actually attached - harder, but also doable

03:05:24 decimation: yeah good point

03:05:28 asciilifeform: they do not need to know what it does!

03:05:44 decimation: I'm surprised the pick n place doesn't auto test passives actually

03:05:58 asciilifeform: decimation: rubber suction cup, typically

03:06:12 ben_vulpes: the tooling investment to make this feasible for every board sent through a given shop is non trivial though, ibid for customer education.

03:06:18 asciilifeform: decimation: interestingly, in the old days, they were brass, and shaped in such a way that -did- test

03:06:28 asciilifeform: some of the german machines from the '80s, when computer sucked, did this

03:06:35 asciilifeform: i even had opportunity to buy one

03:06:38 asciilifeform: for a few $k

03:06:41 asciilifeform: but no place to put it

03:06:44 asciilifeform: so passed it up

03:07:01 asciilifeform: fella even reserve-engineered the controle console, wrote own proggy, would have thrown in the source

03:07:27 asciilifeform: but i had no climate-controlled space where it could fit.

03:07:30 decimation: yeah, failing to insert proper part in the tube is electronics manufacturing 101 error

03:07:38 asciilifeform: decimation: again, that was NOT what happened

03:07:42 asciilifeform: the fucker is marked 470.

03:07:44 asciilifeform: marked.

03:07:46 ben_vulpes: during my days in the wafer biz the shop for whom i slaved had a high-res testing machine that could test arbitrary board designs

03:07:46 decimation: heh

03:07:56 decimation: so you suspect that they bought shitass chinese parts?

03:08:02 asciilifeform: i have no idea where they got them

03:08:14 asciilifeform: and for all i know the rest of the board also has no correspondence whatsoever to marked values

03:08:17 ben_vulpes: the only reasonable conclusion is that someone at the nsa is gaslighting alf

03:08:20 decimation: ben_vulpes: sure, for arbitrary $$$ can be done

03:08:22 cazalla: poor shrem, 2 years ago paraded around as the bitcoin millionaire kid, but today relegated to begging for $10 so as not to eat the prison food http://charlieshrem.com/so-im-going-to-prison/

03:08:23 assbot: So, I’m going to prison. Reflections from Bitcoins’ first felon | Charlie Shrem ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9S3sT )

03:09:48 cazalla: "I will need the support of everyone while inside, and I would appreciate it so much. Even $10 would go along way. There are a few days to send me money."

03:10:45 decimation: asciilifeform should send him some smoked sprat

03:10:58 asciilifeform: idiot does not deserve one sprat

03:11:02 decimation: heh

03:11:21 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: there is a reason why i am building own conveyor

03:11:29 asciilifeform: but it isn't happening in time for c3

03:11:40 asciilifeform: and the motherfuckers knew that, of course.

03:11:48 decimation: noisy chump falls into the noisy usg chumpatron, news at 11

03:11:56 ben_vulpes: news at 11

03:12:25 ben_vulpes: hey noisy chump what travel bezzle are you using to procure tickets to con3?

03:12:28 *: asciilifeform also chumped, out of 75 bux. did not really expect the thing to work

03:12:37 *: asciilifeform grinds in gears

03:12:41 decimation: asciilifeform: it appears you can RMA the thing

03:12:47 decimation: might as well turn the chumpatron wheel

03:12:54 asciilifeform: decimation: aha lol sure. these are going in my butterfly collection.

03:13:01 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: lessee

03:13:42 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: 'copa airlines'

03:13:55 ben_vulpes: purchased direct?

03:13:56 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: and 'aerolineas argentinas'

03:13:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51108 @ 0.00033045 = 16.8886 BTC [+] {3}

03:14:12 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: nah through 'orbitz'

03:14:19 decimation: re: argentinean aviation: http://www.miamiherald.com/entertainment/celebrities/article13640420.html

03:14:21 assbot: Crew was filming when helicopters crashed in Argentina | Miami Herald Miami Herald ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SnYQ )

03:15:43 ben_vulpes: so i just received my new passport

03:16:06 ben_vulpes: i'll admit to shitting more than a single brix over its issuance, given my presence here and name change froofraw.

03:16:20 decimation: ben_vulpes, asciilifeform: http://www.faa.gov/about/initiatives/iasa/ < usg says that ar civil aviation bureaucracy is rated "1"

03:16:23 assbot: International Aviation Safety Assessment (IASA) Program ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SvaB )

03:16:24 ben_vulpes: fuckers declined to send me back my court papers and expired passport.

03:16:43 decimation: ben_vulpes: I think you can pay to expedite

03:17:04 ben_vulpes: despite! claims all over forms that supporting docs will be returned with issued passport.

03:17:07 ben_vulpes: decimation: i'm aware.

03:17:20 ben_vulpes: that part was unnecessary, and risks putting one in the 'extra scrutiny' bin as i see it.

03:17:23 ben_vulpes: anyways

03:17:25 ben_vulpes: i have the *passport*

03:17:28 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051059 << likeliest explanation

03:17:28 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 02:41:13; decimation: which implies their turdware manged your design I suspec

03:17:31 ben_vulpes: but my *other* documents.

03:17:42 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: no you see, the lizard shitgnomes got to it

03:17:52 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: again, there is no detectable trace of a mistake in their procedure or in the physical board

03:18:06 decimation: ben_vulpes: did your passport come with 'rfid condom'?

03:18:18 thestringpuller: LOLOL

03:18:18 ben_vulpes: lol no plain book

03:18:21 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there is at least one part where all four instances differ by a factor of ~2 from the marked value.

03:18:30 asciilifeform: MARKED value

03:18:33 decimation: ben_vulpes: the state dept faq claims they issue one with each

03:18:34 thestringpuller: decimation: i thought all passports had RFID chips in them

03:18:37 asciilifeform: on the thing itself

03:18:40 ben_vulpes: decimation: by 'condom' i assume you mean faraday cage?

03:18:44 decimation: yes

03:18:47 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well... the cutout of the two boards sounds like a great blogpost.

03:18:53 mircea_popescu: write the whole story, send them a link.

03:19:02 decimation: 'metallized' paper bag

03:19:07 ben_vulpes: decimation: lol no.

03:19:13 ben_vulpes: std us mail envelope

03:19:25 mircea_popescu: decimation what's an ungrounded faraday cage supposed to do again ?

03:19:34 mircea_popescu: or do these new passprots come with a rail contact ?

03:19:35 decimation: like so http://www.idstronghold.com/

03:19:36 assbot: RFID Wallet | Identity Stronghold | Credit Card Sleeve ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SDqG )

03:19:39 ben_vulpes: ssn and passport number no doubt lifted en route

03:19:47 decimation: it's not a true faraday cage, but it will attenuate

03:20:10 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: what l33t deelz did you find? the best i'm offered is ~1.3k rt

03:20:56 thestringpuller: someone finds a 900 rt from US that'd be dope

03:21:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56800 @ 0.00034124 = 19.3824 BTC [+] {2}

03:21:06 thestringpuller: as long as I don't have to sit between two fat people

03:21:40 ben_vulpes: do any of you know anything about relational schema design? i'm derping on a thing and would like to run an early early early schema draft by someone who actually understands relational dbs.

03:21:50 ben_vulpes: trinque's already helped with it, but i'm looking for more eyes

03:21:55 decimation: actually I think the new 'chip n pin' implementation for credit cards in the us is rf-id based

03:22:00 decimation: so you gotta buy a stack of these

03:22:54 ben_vulpes: (project is relational modeling of blockchain, for the curious)

03:23:21 ben_vulpes: (it'll be done in two weeks, i swear)

03:23:50 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes ibidem actually means "in the same place". if you mean idem (ie, the same) say idem!

03:24:16 ben_vulpes: !

03:24:31 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-01-2015#991265 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-01-2015#991268

03:24:31 assbot: Logged on 25-01-2015 06:52:34; asciilifeform: chain of pointers << tree.

03:24:31 assbot: Logged on 25-01-2015 06:53:07; asciilifeform: (satoshi did not go in for book-learning, it seems, esp. re: data structures, but that doesn't mean that we have to forget school)

03:25:42 ben_vulpes: right.

03:25:56 ben_vulpes: i want it in a database, though.

03:26:34 ben_vulpes: the storage on disk is a thing of import, no doubt.

03:26:48 ben_vulpes: but a *queryable* blockchain is something else entirely.

03:26:51 mircea_popescu: incidentally, i wonder if one could make a filesystem specifically for blockchain storage.

03:26:53 decimation: yeah I don't have enough database design experience to comment on that

03:27:05 mircea_popescu: there's absolutely no doubt this will be the largest usecase for harddrives going forward

03:27:29 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i grow more and more tempted every day to use postgres as a filesystem.

03:27:30 mircea_popescu: and as they become obsolete in the future, ppl not wanting to upgrade their bitcoin archives will provide hdds with one of those ada or lisp-esque eternal lives.

03:27:56 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: filesystem specifically for blockchain storage << i spoke of this, right here in #b-a

03:28:02 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes im not informed enough to guess, but maybe a "best of both words" hybrid could thrive.

03:28:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30100 @ 0.0003485 = 10.4899 BTC [+] {2}

03:28:13 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform either i missed it or forgot it!

03:28:17 ben_vulpes: lol no i

03:28:17 asciilifeform: 'That is very strange indeed. All of the house parts we currently carry are supplied by Digikey and Mouser, and are name-brand parts. At this moment, we only stock and only order parts from US vendors who are authorized vendors for the components we purchase. (This is why our BoM tool will often list parts as unavailable, even if they can be found at non-US or non-authorized dealers.)

03:28:18 asciilifeform: I will have our reels of 470 Ohm resistors verified first thing in the morning. I'd like to send you a return label in the morning to send the boards back, so that we can review the work on the boards and verify and replace any parts which are not testing at their required values. Additionally, this step would help us to determine what has gone wrong in the assembly and why your components are not operating within specificati

03:28:18 asciilifeform: on to prevent any future issues. If you are able to provide us a test procedure, we will be happy to use that to verify the boards before sending them back to you.'

03:28:19 ben_vulpes: nor* i

03:28:23 asciilifeform: ^ macrofab inc.

03:28:27 NewLiberty: ben_vulpes: "Gweedo" did quite a bit of RDBM crunching of the block chain for a project of his, he had many failures and learned much

03:28:44 decimation: asciilifeform: well at least they replied promptly

03:28:56 ben_vulpes: NewLiberty: who now?

03:28:56 asciilifeform: 'I will ship them back, but I needed working sample units -this week-.

03:28:56 asciilifeform: Not a month from now.

03:28:56 asciilifeform: And now I don't have them.

03:28:56 asciilifeform: And was going to order another, much larger, device made at your shop,

03:28:56 asciilifeform: but now find it very hard to believe that it will work to spec, before

03:28:57 asciilifeform: the deadline.' -- me

03:28:58 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform they sound very nice you know ? i'd send them the boards an' detail.

03:29:12 mircea_popescu: omg stop being so petulant eh!

03:29:19 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: if you're spending 75 dollars, you didn't need them at all sheesh

03:29:42 ben_vulpes: you're not siemens, you don't swing 500m in legal fees every quarter, you don't get to go over the bills with a fine toothed comb etc

03:29:52 *: mircea_popescu makes mental note : if alf spends time anticipating a nice itam and then doesn't get it, alf gets very pissy!

03:30:07 asciilifeform: now mostly pissed at self for falling for this nonsense

03:30:14 ben_vulpes: happy to spend thousands on worthless arcana tho :P

03:30:19 mircea_popescu: NewLiberty what ever happened to that guy ? still around ?

03:30:21 mircea_popescu: !up NewLiberty

03:30:23 ben_vulpes: !up NewLiberty

03:30:29 NewLiberty: Yes, he is still around

03:30:31 asciilifeform: no one can offer this particular good for the advertised price.

03:30:43 NewLiberty: Not so much on BCT, more on CryptoCrypt

03:30:49 asciilifeform: wondered what was the catch - turns out, this.

03:30:54 mod6: <+mircea_popescu> incidentally, i wonder if one could make a filesystem specifically for blockchain storage. << i definately wanna discuss this.

03:30:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform seriously, send them the things, gotta help em. they're new.

03:31:02 asciilifeform: funnily, if it were a digital device (e.g., the mainboard) it'd have probably worked

03:31:06 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i will

03:31:14 mircea_popescu: mod6 if you write a spec or something ima read it, for whatever good that's gonna do

03:31:25 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform cool.

03:31:37 NewLiberty: He was doing a rdbs project with open API for folks that want cloud nodes but didn't want to run them.

03:31:42 *: decimation was hoping to send them some analog designs, was waiting to see what happened to ascii after he entered the chumpatron

03:32:15 NewLiberty: sort of like chain.com but open

03:32:23 mod6: mircea_popescu: ok thanks!

03:32:38 asciilifeform: on the flip side, all the folks who laughed at me for slowly grunting to build own p&p fab, can begin to consider stopping laughing now...

03:33:18 NewLiberty: His latest project though was for a bitcoin webcam company, pretty girls and such

03:33:19 decimation: I think the 'waldo' device is a great idea for building small prototypes

03:35:33 NewLiberty: https://goseemybits.com/

03:35:34 assbot: GoSeeMyBits.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9TAzf )

03:37:12 NewLiberty: I was an rdb wonk but my expertise is a decade or so stale.

03:43:47 mircea_popescu: that is good right ? past decade all gunk ?

03:50:18 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: When you grow more shiva hands may I suggest a hobby? Photograph pine trees. Contemplate which one when converted to stake best matches each shitgnomism.

03:52:08 decimation: BingoBoingo: asciilifeform need only drive a few hours south to see the perfect stake-pine, the loblolly https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinus_taeda

03:52:09 assbot: Pinus taeda - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9USue )

03:53:29 decimation: for mounting the convicted at the appropriate height pour encourager les autres

03:55:49 mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtZ6hjiJmTU

03:55:51 assbot: Frank Zappa - Broken Hearts are for Assholes (Live) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9Vdgm )

03:57:29 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051148 << a whole team.

03:57:29 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 03:08:17; ben_vulpes: the only reasonable conclusion is that someone at the nsa is gaslighting alf

03:58:40 decimation: apparently the police shot some bum the wash dc subway http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/shooting-in-metro-system-dc-police-say/2015/03/12/8f3abf6e-c921-11e4-b2a1-bed1aaea2816_story.html

03:58:41 assbot: Metro Transit Police fatally shoot man in Potomac Avenue station’s tunnel - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9VwI6 )

04:00:13 decimation: maybe they were angry that some bum shot some cops in ferguson

04:01:52 mircea_popescu: dead mouffat chick looks so very french.

04:06:06 decimation: to die for reality tv...

04:08:53 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/fuckkuppy.jpg

04:08:57 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ddfmab )

04:09:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20061 @ 0.0003237 = 6.4937 BTC [-] {2}

04:13:38 asciilifeform: fuckkuppy.jpg << mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes, whoever else cares - R6, R16

04:14:00 asciilifeform: under enough magnification to show that marking is correct

04:14:05 asciilifeform: also sent to vendor

04:14:45 asciilifeform: left hand, right hand - one board each

04:14:52 mircea_popescu: is placing usually that approximative ?

04:15:09 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: placing is usually fairly exact, but they tend to float during reflow a bit

04:15:13 mircea_popescu: these look artisan handcarved

04:15:18 asciilifeform: so long as they don't float off the pads - no problem

04:15:22 mircea_popescu: aha

04:15:29 asciilifeform: mine look quite like this

04:15:41 mircea_popescu: ic.

04:15:42 asciilifeform: except that my R is light-blue and japanese

04:15:49 asciilifeform: and theirs... from mars ?

04:16:08 asciilifeform: and this is one part. 'won't eat whole egg to see how rotten'

04:16:34 asciilifeform: the other Rs that can be measured without removal are correct

04:16:44 asciilifeform: the Cs cannot be measured accurately in-circuit

04:19:02 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18600 @ 0.00035075 = 6.524 BTC [+]

04:20:08 asciilifeform: 'Two Secret Service agents suspected of being under the influence while striking a White House security barricade drove through an active bomb investigation and directly beside the suspicious package, according to current and former government officials familiar with the incident.'

04:22:37 mircea_popescu: you gotta know how to partaaay

04:22:47 asciilifeform: ( http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/secret-service-agents-disrupted-bomb-investigation-at-white-house/2015/03/12/0eb74590-c8c4-11e4-aa1a-86135599fb0f_story.html )

04:22:48 assbot: Secret Service agents disrupted bomb investigation at White House - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1DdiaEj )

04:29:12 trinque: +mircea_popescu | ben_vulpes im not informed enough to guess, but maybe a "best of both words" hybrid could thrive. << BeFS comes to mind; filesystem with relational features

04:29:44 ben_vulpes: fuckuppy.jpg << asciilifeform ah i've found your problem they put the resistors on backwards on one of the boards

04:29:52 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: l0l

04:30:01 asciilifeform: 'danger, 1,000,000 ohms!'

04:30:58 trinque: I think (but am less familiar with) reiserfs has the same sort of metadata querying

04:31:31 trinque: this fs/db hybrid has been talked about for a damn long time

04:31:53 trinque: ben_vulpes: familiar with postgresql's large objects?

04:31:54 ben_vulpes: trinque: terrorist teknologees!

04:32:09 ben_vulpes: trinque: 'large objects' << no, tell me more

04:32:09 trinque: heh, and wife-killer tainted tech too!

04:32:32 trinque: ben_vulpes: these guys http://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.4/static/largeobjects.html

04:32:33 assbot: PostgreSQL: Documentation: 9.4: Large Objects ... ( http://bit.ly/1Gy6fyz )

04:33:13 trinque: say you want to put your big-ass mkv movies in postgres along with their metadata

04:33:15 trinque: you totally can

04:33:29 *: asciilifeform runs reiserfs

04:33:30 trinque: and it doesn't slow down your queries, as the big shit is stored elsewhere of course and made reference to

04:33:47 *: asciilifeform has no plans to stop

04:34:15 ben_vulpes: this postgres as fs idea may actually have legs

04:34:25 decimation: ben_vulpes: postgres will make a decent fs

04:34:30 asciilifeform: ugh

04:34:52 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: your objections to things suffer from the "boy who cried wolf" problem

04:35:09 trinque: ben_vulpes: http://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.4/static/lo-interfaces.html#LO-OPEN

04:35:10 assbot: PostgreSQL: Documentation: 9.4: Client Interfaces ... ( http://bit.ly/1Gy6EB2 )

04:35:18 decimation: it'll be slow and cumbersome, but would work

04:35:24 trinque: pretty much like using fopen and whatnot

04:35:31 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: lol i didn't even say why

04:35:43 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: but as it happens - it's another mega-c-turd

04:35:47 asciilifeform: with eons of crud to wade through

04:35:57 decimation: it's probably better than oracle my sql

04:35:57 ben_vulpes: eventually boy who cries wolf is ignored, even when wolf is coming

04:36:13 ben_vulpes: particularly then.

04:36:14 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: feel free to ignore.

04:36:20 ben_vulpes: particularly when woods are full of wolves.

04:36:27 decimation: ben_vulpes: the new hotness these days is some kind of nosql running on a cluster

04:36:33 trinque: decimation: fuck that shit

04:36:43 trinque: nosql is the same hipsterism that gets us nodejs

04:36:49 ben_vulpes: i'll have no truck with unstructured languages that don't support querying

04:37:05 decimation: like mongodb

04:37:32 trinque: decimation: as those monstrosities "improve" they tend towards what rdbms has done forever

04:37:41 trinque: and invariably worse than what came before

04:37:45 asciilifeform: in principle any existing db gizmo that can be coaxed into using a single file for the store, is quite ready to be planted down on raw disk

04:37:57 asciilifeform: except that if said disk is mechanical, you will get impedance mismatches

04:38:06 decimation: they are perfectly fine if you really just want to store gobs of unstructured shit

04:38:11 decimation: but in reality you want structure

04:38:15 trinque: decimation: I don't believe that unstr... yeah that

04:38:17 asciilifeform: and if ssd, will get impedance mismatches during write if your db isn't tuned to match the cache

04:38:17 ben_vulpes: ^^

04:38:20 trinque: hahaha

04:38:25 ben_vulpes: <decimation> but in reality you want structure << this

04:38:43 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: should i be concerned with these pure performance issues?

04:38:56 ben_vulpes: i want data i can query with a 'sane' language

04:39:20 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: possibly. what's your application ?

04:39:30 decimation: ben_vulpes: it strikes me that a relational db is a bit 'heavy' for storing the blockchain tree

04:39:53 trinque: decimation: depends on what questions interest you

04:39:54 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: applying software to business problems.

04:40:02 ben_vulpes: not pure "fast as fuck" compute problems.

04:40:10 trinque: or more importantly, whether you know those questions exhaustively in advance

04:40:12 trinque: (you don't)

04:40:30 asciilifeform: in all seriousness, 'associative computing : a programming paradigm for massively parallel computers' (j., potter, 1992)

04:40:44 asciilifeform: for folks who liked the 'twirl/twinkle' thread

04:40:54 ben_vulpes: <decimation> ben_vulpes: it strikes me that a relational db is a bit 'heavy' for storing the blockchain tree << i want to say "select * from outputs where output.spent_transaction is null;"

04:40:59 asciilifeform: and eldrich db-like processors

04:41:08 asciilifeform: where you can 'ask each word' about something

04:41:49 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: for some reason i thought you were still speaking re: the blockchain!

04:42:17 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: blockchain queries are a business logic concern!

04:42:20 asciilifeform: (rather than db as used in your traditional $business)

04:42:40 ben_vulpes: i really have no interest in optimized for min storage or max whatever the fuck

04:43:04 ben_vulpes: optimal for me is always going to be somewhere around "gives me leverage on data"

04:43:08 trinque: how else do you ask a computer an actual question?

04:43:11 ben_vulpes: if slow, i guess fine.

04:43:16 ben_vulpes: if bulky, idem.

04:44:16 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: i see where i went wrong vis-a-vis ibid/idem now.

04:44:22 ben_vulpes: trinque: smokes?

04:44:39 trinque: ben_vulpes: I'm about to pass out mang

04:44:46 ben_vulpes: one last smoke

04:44:51 ben_vulpes: then i will as well

04:45:25 trinque: where you at? I wont smoke but I could walk

04:45:35 ben_vulpes: righto, let's stroll through the cemetary

04:45:47 trinque: it is decided

04:45:50 ben_vulpes: 's no recoleta, but it serves my needs adequately

04:46:07 ben_vulpes: see you shortly

04:48:53 ben_vulpes: sweet dreams unicodecoporeality

04:53:29 decimation: lol

05:08:24 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all

05:08:31 gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 293.87, vol: 7683.36495602 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 290.5, vol: 6236.83744 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 293.89, vol: 26183.16444898 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 292.459568, vol: 143740.74800000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 290.03538, vol: 6.67481305 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 296.7279, vol: 78.47301072 | Volume-weighted last average: 292.657401452

05:09:11 asciilifeform: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-YqsTjmiifFk/UsH1OWSRt9I/AAAAAAAAIJM/o4k7Wr_o8Uk/s1600/German+soldier+lighting+his+cigarette+with+a+flamethrower,+1940s.jpg

05:09:12 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NRkDr9 )

05:17:58 asciilifeform: http://rarehistoricalphotos.com/russian-spy-laughing-execution-finland-1942 << also lulz

05:17:59 assbot: Russian spy laughing through his execution in Finland, 1942 ... ( http://bit.ly/1NRlUOR )

05:44:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35300 @ 0.00035789 = 12.6335 BTC [+] {2}

05:59:22 mircea_popescu: <asciilifeform> 'danger, 1,000,000 ohms!' << i forget, what's the resistence of 1mm of air ? like 1mn was it ?

06:01:39 mircea_popescu: since we're doing rare shit : chick taking it in the ass http://40.media.tumblr.com/3a485bfec08126b605d4b84253043305/tumblr_n8mvzyCxQC1td0p2ho1_500.jpg

06:01:40 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbKerN )

06:01:50 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: very low once ionized

06:03:24 decimation: http://chemistry.about.com/od/moleculescompounds/a/Table-Of-Electrical-Resistivity-And-Conductivity.htm < 1.3e16 to 3.3e16 ohms per meter

06:03:25 assbot: Table of Electrical Resistivity and Conductivity ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbKsPs )

06:03:26 mircea_popescu: 4 x 10^13 ohm meters ios what im seeing

06:03:36 mircea_popescu: so actually more like 40bn per mm.

06:03:54 asciilifeform: ~3kV/mm

06:03:57 asciilifeform: iirc

06:04:01 mircea_popescu: aha. yeah

06:04:16 asciilifeform: at stp

06:04:19 mircea_popescu: course that's slightly different a measure

06:04:39 asciilifeform: good illustration for student is the toy 'jacob's ladder'

06:04:43 mircea_popescu: that's "piercing plate condenser" etc

06:04:44 asciilifeform: as seen in movie 'frankenstein'

06:04:57 decimation: aye, breakdown voltage greatly reduced once there is plasma

06:05:17 asciilifeform: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/library/pa-hrrg1/figure-02-jacobs-ladder.jpg

06:05:19 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbKEyi )

06:05:42 asciilifeform: https://hackadaycom.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/double-helix-jacobs-ladder.jpg << helical

06:05:43 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbKIhx )

06:05:55 decimation: ^ same reason you can bounce radio waves off of metor trails through the upper atmosphere

06:07:07 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051328 << i entertain no illusion of having invented it, that's fo sho.

06:07:07 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 04:31:31; trinque: this fs/db hybrid has been talked about for a damn long time

06:07:55 asciilifeform: i (and $maxint other people) did it on 'commodore 64' floppy disks

06:08:21 asciilifeform: normally when storage is scarce (or data set is huge) one cannot afford the waste of 'file system' that is not the same as the organization for the set

06:08:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49850 @ 0.00036181 = 18.0362 BTC [+]

06:09:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform what i had in mind tho, was more specficially "for blockchain only".

06:09:12 mircea_popescu: as in, trivially : make the sectors the size of a block

06:09:12 asciilifeform: well yes, that was the ancient thread

06:09:23 decimation: http://www.spaceweatherradio.com/ < listen to live meteor 'pings' (distant transmitter made audible via meteor trails)

06:09:24 assbot: Space Weather Radio: News and information about sunspots, solar flares and meteor showers ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbL2gd )

06:09:28 mircea_popescu: make, perhaps, the storage plan a tree

06:09:29 mircea_popescu: erc

06:10:07 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-10-2014#867720

06:10:07 assbot: Logged on 10-10-2014 17:08:55; asciilifeform: (easiest solution: forget file system in the 1st place, just use raw block device. and then you don't even need msdos for anything.)

06:10:34 mircea_popescu: right. in which line : since all hdds come reflashable anyway, how hard would it be to rape a ssd like we're raping the pogo, i wonder ?

06:10:46 mircea_popescu: throw out its own blob, put in ours, make blockchain hdd.

06:10:58 decimation: eh? why bother?

06:11:04 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: trivial given that fr meade did all the heavy lifting and helpfully 'published' result

06:11:05 mircea_popescu: control of hw.

06:11:10 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ikr?

06:11:17 mircea_popescu: all this anti-tero stuff helping the real teros.

06:11:24 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050201

06:11:24 assbot: Logged on 12-03-2015 16:56:15; asciilifeform: https://securelist.com/files/2015/02/Equation_group_questions_and_answers.pdf << pp. 32,33 have hashes.

06:11:30 decimation: so you want to talk to the db over the sata bus?

06:11:37 decimation: it would be hilarious to do so

06:11:41 mircea_popescu: decimation why ?

06:11:54 decimation: not saying it's a bad idea, just amusing

06:12:04 asciilifeform: gnarly though

06:12:12 asciilifeform: running various pieces on various chips

06:12:14 decimation: I guess I don't see much point, considering that even having a sata bus implies you have a computer

06:12:17 decimation: so why bother

06:12:21 mircea_popescu: i want, in this order a) a fully b-a computing stack for bitcoin ; b) utter disrespect for antecessors made manifest.

06:12:40 decimation: I can see why you would want to ensure the security of your drive, but that's a seperate matter

06:12:51 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: so we mount raw 'nand' from different vendors

06:12:55 mircea_popescu: as far as i'm concerned, breaking any ansi standard is a net gain.

06:12:59 asciilifeform: pref. from mutually-hostile nations

06:13:04 mircea_popescu: sure.

06:13:09 asciilifeform: tandemed with 74xxx

06:13:20 decimation: asciilifeform: yeah, might as well produce a pci-e card under s.nsa label

06:13:21 asciilifeform: i have all of this planned out.

06:13:26 decimation: with a pile of nand chips

06:13:32 mircea_popescu: then this discussion will suffice :D

06:13:58 asciilifeform: except that meanwhile i'm relying on, apparently, the profoundly retarded, to assemble b04rdz

06:14:04 mircea_popescu: lol. don't we all.

06:14:10 decimation: actually you could just use plain serial rs-232 bus

06:14:11 asciilifeform: there is no avoiding the final solution to it

06:14:15 decimation: not like you need high bandwidth anyway

06:14:35 asciilifeform: decimation: so long as it keeps up with blocks, theoretically

06:14:37 mircea_popescu: anyway, just to add : the people who have come before us have embedded into the very history of computing such burning, enraged contempt for us, that really damnatio is too good a fate.

06:14:49 asciilifeform: but in practice, gadget that takes years to synch, is not very useful

06:15:05 mircea_popescu: i don't think there's many fields outside of perhaps psychology where "practitioners" have for so long acted with such intense disregard for posterity.

06:15:25 mircea_popescu: the casual perusal of openssl that earlier article triggered has crystallized this point in my head.

06:15:31 decimation: mircea_popescu: just like (nearly?) everyone who opens a bitcoin exchange succumbs to the temptation to run 'fractional'

06:15:42 decimation: every hardware vendor succumbs to the temptation to pwn its audience

06:15:46 asciilifeform: http://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3141310154691952@naggum.no.html

06:15:46 assbot: Re: Is LISP dying? - Naggum cll archive ... ( http://bit.ly/1CbLHOJ )

06:15:48 mircea_popescu: i dunno about that.

06:15:50 asciilifeform: ^ oblig. naggum

06:16:05 asciilifeform: try to appreciate the difficulty, historically, of getting the bloody things to work at all.

06:16:15 asciilifeform: from this boojum came the other sorrows.

06:16:15 mircea_popescu: i will appreciate nothing.

06:16:53 asciilifeform: it is important to understand why apparently-intelligent folks ate up the crap

06:17:03 asciilifeform: because originally the thing working at all - was impressive.

06:17:26 mircea_popescu: this is like "originbally, the bridge standing at all was impressive"

06:17:29 mircea_popescu: srsly ? when, this.

06:17:44 asciilifeform: dark age.

06:17:47 asciilifeform: like now.

06:17:57 mircea_popescu: the idea that you ~must~ code, whether it works or not, no matter what, is scandalous.

06:18:06 mircea_popescu: i don't code. principally because i can't be arsed to do a good job of it.

06:18:12 asciilifeform: sorta like 'must build bridge, even if out of corpses'

06:18:27 mircea_popescu: pfff.

06:18:34 mircea_popescu: there were no bridges in "dark age"

06:18:49 mircea_popescu: the bridge and engineering are co-generated

06:19:16 decimation: re: ~must code~ : historically there has been great profit in it, working or no

06:19:37 mircea_popescu: this is no argument in this discussion, tho. historically there has been great profit in all sorts of dumb shit.

06:21:09 mircea_popescu: really, find me a piece of code written with a clear contrite consideration of "people will read this tomorrow"

06:21:27 mircea_popescu: in the manner people write fucking books. or at least did, before the great usian likbez pogrom

06:21:34 asciilifeform: knuth tried to convince folks to 'literate programming'

06:21:40 asciilifeform: (look it up, it was a try.)

06:21:47 mircea_popescu: so he did. i recall reading it and not understanding what he meant at the time

06:21:55 asciilifeform: this is approximately what he meant.

06:21:55 mircea_popescu: no, i actually read knuth like i read buffett.

06:22:02 mircea_popescu: i generally manage to identify the actual experts in fields.

06:22:12 asciilifeform: there we go

06:22:16 mircea_popescu: feynman, etc.

06:22:26 asciilifeform: mccarthy also understood the unfolding disaster

06:22:30 mircea_popescu: they're, contrary to what the "consumers have come to expect" like to pretend, very easy to find

06:22:31 asciilifeform: and likewise dijkstra

06:22:36 asciilifeform: very easy.

06:22:38 asciilifeform: to find.

06:22:40 mircea_popescu: "the thick book nobody ever borrows", generally.

06:23:06 asciilifeform: the very same. can go to uni library, and they're stuck together. like the volumes of lenin (true story. i unstuck'em)

06:23:28 asciilifeform: compulsively pulled on one, they all came out

06:23:32 mircea_popescu: hegel was the same way, in the cluj universitarian library. supposedly the european expert in hegel resided there.

06:27:22 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: notice how all of the surviving sage works are by theorists.

06:27:28 asciilifeform: it is interesting to consider why.

06:27:43 asciilifeform: aside from 'the spartan speaks with his sword'

06:27:51 mircea_popescu: now /that/ is very dark ages. not that many practical moralists in 1200

06:28:22 mircea_popescu: for that matter, not that many economists in soviet russia.

06:28:35 mircea_popescu: the *actual* kind, i mean

06:29:40 asciilifeform: more humble observation here, that making anything physical+original whatsoever on modern industrial base is titanically expensive, demoralizing, or both

06:30:11 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 330 @ 0.01001 = 3.3033 BTC [-] {3}

06:30:12 asciilifeform: or is it that smart folks avoid experimental work because, well, smarter?

06:30:21 asciilifeform: feynman diddled radio as a young man - but quit, note.

06:30:39 mircea_popescu: he broke safes his entire life tho.

06:30:52 asciilifeform: aha, but did not rely on result.

06:30:55 asciilifeform: did - for pleasure.

06:30:56 mircea_popescu: he was actually, in comparative terms, more of a noted expert in the field of safe cracking than in the field of physics

06:31:11 mircea_popescu: mostly because much fewer people did the former

06:32:10 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform writing a book of actual economy in moscow 1960 was equally titanical and demoralizing. or to get back to earth : a book on actual psychopathology in leningrad, bout same time.

06:32:12 mircea_popescu: folks even tried!

06:34:51 gabriel_laddel: Does anyone take issue with me describing the lordship as "the peerage" and #-assets as "earth's premiere commercial forum"?

06:35:04 mircea_popescu: i don't imagine so. and if they did, what of it.

06:35:25 asciilifeform: gabriel_laddel: describe it as world's premier atomic dirigible, if you take pleasure in this

06:36:42 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform btw, is the article of faith that jesus is coming on a great atomic dirigible from the sky to take us to the other planet and smite the unbelievers ?

06:36:46 mircea_popescu: or was that the other cult.

06:36:58 asciilifeform: arse rocket

06:37:11 asciilifeform: was j. smith's version, iirc

06:37:22 asciilifeform: there is actually a children's book with illustrations, yes

06:37:30 gabriel_laddel: asciilifeform, mircea_popescu: If people were to take issue with this perhaps I'm missing information (and thus need to learn xyz). I'm going to do as I please either way, but prefer to be accurate.

06:37:39 mircea_popescu: Fartse - The World's Premiere Gravity Well Degravitizer.

06:37:42 asciilifeform: (al schwartz linked to it at one point, long ago)

06:37:51 mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel makes sense.

06:37:52 asciilifeform: degravitizer << sign me up, lol

06:38:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's sorta like a howitzer.

06:38:34 *: asciilifeform wonders if there is a single p&p robot or reflow line in all of .ar

06:39:00 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you don't understand. argentina is trying to support a romania-level living standard on the basis of... soy exports.

06:39:13 mircea_popescu: they used to export carne vacuna, but then failed to meet their quotas and lost the contracts.

06:39:15 asciilifeform: hey that's not so different from what i'm doing here on small scale

06:39:31 mircea_popescu: meanwhile romania is exporting nuclear technology, weaponry, high tech mechanics etc.

06:40:15 gabriel_laddel: ben_vulpes: regarding "code as data" common lisp has the var *read-eval* you can bind to nil if you're processing code as data.

06:40:24 mircea_popescu: they don't have a drydock. or a car factory. or a truck factory. or a plane factory.

06:40:27 mircea_popescu: they don't even make bullets.

06:40:34 asciilifeform: i thought bullets were the one thing

06:40:45 asciilifeform: that .ar still remembered how to make

06:41:12 gabriel_laddel: also, pretty trivial to flatten some sexprs and check that only kosher symbols in it.

06:41:13 mircea_popescu: mnope. brazil took that over too.

06:41:43 asciilifeform: !s chicken also wants to live

06:41:44 assbot: 1 results for 'chicken also wants to live' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=chicken+also+wants+to+live

06:41:57 mircea_popescu: if china (and to some degree russia an' italy) stop propping them, argentina goes to meet cuba on its way to chad.

06:42:27 gabriel_laddel: *are contained within it.

06:42:39 mircea_popescu: on the positive side however : this is the closest you can get to china commercially without getting close to them in a political sense.

06:43:01 asciilifeform: i promise that i'd find this very interesting if had actual capital base...

06:43:24 *: asciilifeform tallies up value of organs

06:43:55 mircea_popescu: lol

06:46:16 mircea_popescu: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FaSinPat << a fine example.

06:46:18 assbot: FaSinPat - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1Cb6W1G )

06:46:21 asciilifeform: meanwhile fiat world put 120megabux to organize liquishit pumped from one cistern to another 10,000 times.

06:46:21 mircea_popescu: ceramic tile factory.

06:52:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75600 @ 0.00035356 = 26.7291 BTC [-] {2}

07:15:56 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23900 @ 0.00032335 = 7.7281 BTC [-]

07:25:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00032335 = 4.9149 BTC [-]

08:26:19 mats: https://soundcloud.com/san-fermin-1/emily

08:26:21 assbot: "Emily by San Fermin - Hear the world’s sounds" ... ( http://bit.ly/1BzKmyW )

08:27:06 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 114 @ 0.01001 = 1.1411 BTC [-]

08:30:53 mats: hm, won't be long til USD is worth more than EUR

08:32:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34500 @ 0.00032322 = 11.1511 BTC [-]

08:33:08 mats: " Strategists at Deutsche Bank expect the euro to fall to the $0.90 mark against the dollar by the end of 2016 and keep falling over the next 12 months to end 2017 at $0.85."

08:34:50 mircea_popescu: clearly the "sanctions against russia" are working.

08:38:14 fluffypony: http://i.imgur.com/AXThMpA.jpg

08:38:15 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1BzMcjn )

08:39:08 mircea_popescu: lol is that srs ?

08:52:50 davout: fluffypony: lol

08:53:07 fluffypony: mircea_popescu: no it's a joke

08:53:21 fluffypony: about as serious as the NO GO ZONES in Paris

08:53:30 mircea_popescu: wait those aren't srs either ?!

08:53:56 fluffypony: sadface emoticon

08:57:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73137 @ 0.00032285 = 23.6123 BTC [-] {2}

09:54:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55927 @ 0.00032227 = 18.0236 BTC [-] {2}

10:49:09 []bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before April" http://bitbet.us/bet/1123/ Odds: 9(Y):91(N) by coin, 10(Y):90(N) by weight. Total bet: 29.65000237 BTC. Current weight: 45,525.

11:08:52 []bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for Yes on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 18(Y):82(N) by coin, 18(Y):82(N) by weight. Total bet: 60.35220426 BTC. Current weight: 95,319.

11:30:06 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45293 @ 0.00032158 = 14.5653 BTC [-]

11:56:56 kakobrekla: http://xkcd.com/1497/

11:56:57 assbot: xkcd: New Products ... ( http://bit.ly/1FicAQq )

11:57:47 kakobrekla: seems helpful.

12:32:06 cazalla: so i goes on the whaleclub teamspeak on account i'm drunk..

12:32:19 cazalla: a) can't get their version of !up to speak

12:33:18 cazalla: b) some random cunt is talking about launching an altcoin whereby he "destroys an oz of gold on webcam" as proof of burn for creation of his altcoin

12:33:38 cazalla: c) such whales talking about the joys of flipping bitcents for gift cards

12:34:36 cazalla: worse, TaT masquerades as bitcoinassets on it and is a mod to boot

12:38:38 kakobrekla: O_O

12:43:45 nubbins`: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=978088.msg10756505#msg10756505

12:43:46 assbot: Is someone monitoring large parts of the network? (evidence+firwall rules) ... ( http://bit.ly/1GziFGf )

12:43:47 nubbins`: dem whitelists

12:44:54 cazalla: saw that earlier

12:46:25 cazalla: bitnodes pop up with similar shit pinging the network

12:47:06 cazalla: nubbins`, u evar gonna make posters again? i saw the last edition was fetching a decent price on bitcointalk

12:47:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14120 @ 0.00032882 = 4.6429 BTC [+]

12:47:59 cazalla: i did not mention this due to criticism of mancave.. but as i sat in my recently acquired mancave, i thought it would be a suitable spot (have relocated back to shared computer/craft room on account autumn is here and mancave is too fucking cold)

12:48:11 nubbins`: cazalla i thought about a "how to spot scams" poster or similar

12:48:35 nubbins`: if you want one of the last edition, TECSHARE probably is dying to get rid of his

12:49:21 kakobrekla: i think i still have 4 of them posters

12:49:43 cazalla: you guys criticise the mancave but seriously, when the missus and the kid push you out of the masterbedroom due to lack of sleep and then push you out the kids room which was turned into makeshift computer room but needs it back because apparently a pig pen isn't big enough for him now, you might appreciate the man cave aka cold ass garage

12:49:47 kakobrekla: if anyone is interested i guess i could part em.

12:50:37 cazalla: kakobrekla, i'm drunk, i talk shit when drunk, sorta how i make bitbet's and forget to bet on my own bets

12:50:56 cazalla: so even if i was intersted, sober cazalla might not be as willing to pay a premium

12:52:04 cazalla: felt a little bad about that as i was trying to talk BingoBoingo into a bet over the bali nine executions to come on account i think they'll go free

12:52:23 cazalla: so settled on using bitbet for it but.. alcohol and fucked it all up

12:53:09 nubbins`: cazalla you are not sleeping in the garage

12:53:40 cazalla: and i am stuck using fucking electrum since then because for some reason, since bitcoin-qt 0.10.0 came out, my old 0.8.3, 0.8.6 throws errors and i can't fully sync and even lame attempt to try 0.10.0 falls flat.. i think maybe memory is fucked though unrelated, memtest86 throws a bunch of errors

12:53:56 cazalla: nubbins`, i was, but i took the bed back into the kids room

12:53:59 nubbins`: atta boy

12:54:26 nubbins`: closest thing i have to a mancave is a FULLY FUNCTIONING AND FULLY APPOINTED SILKSCREEN PRINTING STUDIO IN MY BASEMENT

12:54:34 cazalla: garage is not that bad tbh, reminds me of when i had my own place by the beach, no woman, no kids

12:54:46 nubbins`: THAT I CAN SMOKE DOPE IN BECAUSE IT HAS EXHAUST FANS

12:55:03 nubbins`: shoulda snipped your tubes hey

12:55:25 cazalla: not reary

12:55:31 cazalla: she's a good woman, he's a good kid

12:55:52 gabriel_laddel: cazalla: "you guys criticise the mancave but seriously, when the missus" << !s beat her

12:55:58 cazalla: i just prefer the autism sanctuary of living by onesself

12:56:02 nubbins`: heh.

12:56:06 nubbins`: i understand

12:56:15 nubbins`: have done it both ways

12:56:16 cazalla: gabriel_laddel you can't do that in this country

12:56:23 nubbins`: when living alone, i ended up spending most of my time at other's houses

12:56:57 cazalla: the big mistake i made was getting a woman pregnant prior to living with her.. things were all fine and dandy while i had my own place and could fuck her and send her home after the fact

12:57:23 gabriel_laddel: ;; google site: www.fraudsters.com "pack your bags women we're going to"

12:57:24 gribble: Pack Your Bags We're Going On A Guilt Trip Magnet by ... - Etsy: https://www.etsy.com/listing/62005262/pack-your-bags-were-going-on-a-guilt; Series 2 Episode 01 – The Bad Fish Paradigm | Big Bang Theory ...: https://bigbangtrans.wordpress.com/series-2-episode-01-the-bad-fish-paradigm/; You're gonna have to learn that variety speak pe fraudsters - Un blog ...: (1 more message)

12:57:59 cazalla: i could leave her in a heart beat, but not my son

12:58:32 gabriel_laddel: ;; google site: fraudsters.com "you're taking the kids"

12:58:33 gribble: Because most people are idiots, in spite of never manning ... - fraudsters: http://fraudsters.com/2013/because-most-people-are-idiots-in-spite-of-never-manning-up-and-admitting-to-it/; Let's pretend... pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: http://fraudsters.com/lets-pretend; Money, fucking and lying pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.: http://fraudsters.com/2014/money-fucking- (1 more message)

12:58:58 cazalla: hey, i long ago admitted i am an idiot

12:59:12 gabriel_laddel: Note that I dont necessarily endorse MP's viewpoint but it is rather well developed.

12:59:30 cazalla: coming here day in, day out, reduces that

12:59:31 cazalla: at least, i think

12:59:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22950 @ 0.000327 = 7.5047 BTC [-]

12:59:50 cazalla: and i can't take the kid.. needs a mum as much as he does a father.. i don't go for that single parent shit

13:00:38 cazalla: anyway, i'm drunk, so emotions are amplified, my life is not as bad as i might claim when drunk

13:00:41 gabriel_laddel: regarding this chainalysis.com thing (from the bitcoin talk link above)

13:00:58 gabriel_laddel: "I have a new favorite douchebag profile pic: Enthralling My Fucking Audience. This one is phenomenal; you’ve probably seen it somewhere amongst your fucking friends. It’s where a Very Important Dbag (VIDb) is captivating above-mentioned audience solely through the power of his personal presence. Jesus Christ, the fucking hubris. The fucking insane, idiotic hubris. Examples culled from an eleven-second scrub of

13:00:58 gabriel_laddel: Facebook:"

13:01:00 gabriel_laddel: http://jesuschristsiliconvalley.tumblr.com/post/46537875392/what-your-profile-picture-says-about-you-hint

13:01:01 assbot: Jesus Christ, Silicon Valley | What Your Profile Picture Says About You (Hint:... ... ( http://bit.ly/1DeJeTC )

13:01:20 gabriel_laddel: God, what hateable profile photos and job descriptions.

13:01:27 gabriel_laddel: "devops engineer"

13:01:32 *: gabriel_laddel rages

13:03:09 cazalla: but i will say.. these red pill dickheads on reddit that mourn for a lack of virginal wife to have a family with aka http://i.imgur.com/zEEL7S4.jpg i've had the frigid virginal wife and the whore girlfriend who sucked any dick within arms reach and i will swear black and blue that the whore is far more satisfying despite the 24/7 drama

13:03:11 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GzmxHk )

13:04:03 gabriel_laddel: Seriously, the jew thing...

13:04:20 gabriel_laddel: I'm surprised that methheads have bugs crawl out of their arms rather than jews.

13:04:29 gabriel_laddel: FUCK THEY'RE EVERYWHERE

13:04:57 cazalla: haha yeah, /pol/ got me mixed up with that shit until 23andme suggested i was a traitor to the cuase (if 23andme is to be believed)

13:05:13 gabriel_laddel: pardon?

13:05:37 cazalla: ./pol/ blames jews for everything

13:06:02 gabriel_laddel: yeeeeessss?

13:06:07 cazalla: and at the time (this is prior to #b-a) i thought i could see such things too

13:06:19 cazalla: omg the jews! it's the joos as bitcoinpete would say

13:06:25 gabriel_laddel: "until 23andme suggested i was a traitor to the cause"

13:06:28 gabriel_laddel: ^ this?

13:06:31 cazalla: but then 23andme suggests i have some jew in me

13:06:39 gabriel_laddel: See I told you.

13:06:41 gabriel_laddel: Everywhere.

13:06:44 cazalla: so i was like fuck, better not tell /pol/ that

13:07:10 cazalla: but 23andme also said i have west african negro in me, so sorta cancels the jew out anyway

13:08:35 gabriel_laddel: What I find so lulzy about the whole situation is that if you take the supposed Zionist lit and the /pol/ people 100% seriously it basically reduces to "jews think that others are cattle"

13:08:37 cazalla: anyway, one might argue, and i did try, that /pol/ is a short stop otw to #b-a

13:08:44 gabriel_laddel: others: "mooooo"

13:09:09 cazalla: and i promoted it to /pol/ but i was shut down and accused of being jidf so

13:09:22 gabriel_laddel: ;; ud jidf

13:09:23 gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=jidf | Jidf is an acronym for Jewish Internet Defense Force, an organization, whose job is to spread positive propaganda about Israel. Supporting Isreal on news ...

13:09:29 cazalla: at that point, ya sorta realise ok they really are fucking crazy cause i sure as fuck am not shilling for jidf from the mancave

13:10:04 gabriel_laddel: ;; google messiah's donkey

13:10:04 gribble: The Messiah's Donkey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Messiah's_Donkey; Rav Kook on Bo: Donkey-Holiness: http://ravkooktorah.org/BO_67.htm; Columnist: Israel Would Steal the Messiah's Donkey - The Wire: http://www.thewire.com/global/2011/01/columnist-israel-would-steal-the-messiah-s-donkey/18064/

13:10:52 cazalla: still, i can't help but feel affection for a homogeneous society like japan.. fucking mudslimes and other ethnics have destroyed australia within a generation

13:11:10 gabriel_laddel: nah

13:11:19 cazalla: lefty whitey australian so quick to demand rights for the new australia muslims for some reason

13:11:35 gabriel_laddel: and the "right" (or whatever) was weak enough to allow them to

13:12:06 gabriel_laddel: In other news, some interesting sounds

13:12:08 nubbins`: worth arguing that whitey destroyed ethnic australia

13:12:08 gabriel_laddel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a-IvSUD3YE

13:12:10 assbot: Furries in a Blender - Reach Out [HD] - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1Gzozah )

13:12:55 cazalla: nubbins`, fucking baby boomers eh? (this is who i blame nowadays)

13:13:01 nubbins`: there sure are a lot of them

13:13:57 nubbins`: anyway it's sort of silly to pretend that immigration to australia is the problem

13:14:18 nubbins`: since, cough, every white person in australia is either an immigrant or a recent descendent thereof

13:14:32 gabriel_laddel: Eh, nothing wrong with imperialism

13:14:36 *: nubbins` shrugs

13:14:39 nubbins`: not making the call on that

13:14:51 nubbins`: just "this door should be closed!" right after you walk through it sounds a bit silly

13:14:54 cazalla: yeah my missus constantly reminds me that i am the most racist first generation australian she has met

13:15:07 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: Nonsense.

13:15:25 nubbins`: continue

13:15:33 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: what, you're a "attractive-ist" for only fucking hot gurlz?

13:15:48 nubbins`: no, you're a hedonist

13:15:53 gabriel_laddel: the political position of "they're cattle, we're not" is totally A OK.

13:16:01 cazalla: i don't mind imperialism but it fucked up by not wiping out the abos

13:16:03 nubbins`: and we all know that a society of hedonists is a good society indeed

13:16:27 nubbins`: gabriel_laddel sure, but when COWS start saying it?

13:16:36 gabriel_laddel: move.

13:16:45 nubbins`: i like where i live 8)

13:16:46 gabriel_laddel: let reality branch cut and backtrack.

13:17:02 cazalla: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B_61OnKVEAAtV_v.jpg:large "blockchain university" damn look at that hambeast front and centre

13:17:03 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GzpAzj )

13:17:23 gabriel_laddel: all these "right wing" "conservitive" organizations or whatever are pathetic. I was looking into e.g., the golden dawn earlier tonight...

13:17:25 gabriel_laddel: Ugh.

13:17:30 *: nubbins` nods

13:17:31 gabriel_laddel: or VDARE.

13:17:37 nubbins`: the racist is generally an intellectual dullard

13:17:46 gabriel_laddel: which had a problem with bisexuality

13:17:51 cazalla: gabriel_laddel, ya know why it is attractive to idiot country bumpkins like me though right?

13:18:07 nubbins`: because it lets you ignore yourself as the cause of all your problems?

13:18:10 gabriel_laddel: cazalla: not really

13:18:16 cazalla: nubbins`, clearly part of it

13:18:22 *: nubbins` nods

13:18:23 nubbins`: continue

13:18:53 cazalla: i'm out of wine so not sure if i should lol

13:19:35 gabriel_laddel: heh, for future readers

13:19:41 gabriel_laddel: http://fraudsters.com/2014/hai-sictir-timisoaro/

13:19:41 assbot: Hai sictir, Timisoaro! pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1DeOEOl )

13:19:53 nubbins`: incidentally, the original white inhabitants of this land mass on which i currently am living totally wiped out an entire race of people who had lived here prior

13:20:03 nubbins`: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beothuk

13:20:05 assbot: Beothuk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1DeOKp8 )

13:20:25 cazalla: nubbins`, so what?

13:20:28 gabriel_laddel: "The one thing which Timisoara does consistently and well is failure. In 2007 I attempted to organise an art exhibit, on the terms that I was going to pay, in cash, for everything involved. They didn't manage to do it. Last year, I attempted to support a nascent local party, by paying for a quarter's rent and other expenses (a quarter ton of alcohol, mostly) for a bunch of self-styled neonazi local kids. I pulled th

13:20:28 gabriel_laddel: e plug on that thing three months later, at the end of which they.had.not done.anything. I'm not sure you exactly grok me, it's not that they hadn't round up the town's minorities and set them on fire. It's that they couldn't get together to make some stencils which someone (hopefully, someone else) was perhaps sometime (2015 ?) going to use for some purpose. Somewhere. Whatever."

13:20:31 nubbins`: just makin convo

13:20:48 nubbins`: ("incidentally"!)

13:21:17 nubbins`: gabriel_laddel did you see the picture of the kids he rounded up for the "political party"?

13:21:19 nubbins`: o.O

13:21:23 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: lolyeah

13:21:26 nubbins`: my sides.

13:21:32 nubbins`: "oddly, nothing came of it"

13:22:37 gabriel_laddel: cazalla: I'm still not sure why you want quiet hobbit land fyi

13:22:49 gabriel_laddel: "nothing changes"

13:22:52 gabriel_laddel: fucking shoot me

13:23:08 cazalla: in the world where nothing changes, i don't grow old and die i guess

13:23:35 cazalla: the familiarity of my youth is long gone, this country is run amok full of chinks and muslims

13:23:49 gabriel_laddel: cazalla: do you mind if I ask what books you're reading your son btw?

13:24:14 nubbins`: ahaha

13:24:33 nubbins`: "reading? my son? i ain't no wimminz"

13:24:39 gabriel_laddel: aw come on

13:24:45 *: nubbins` shrugs, gestures

13:25:07 cazalla: gabriel_laddel, beatrix potter, mr men, other assorted books we got as gifts

13:25:37 cazalla: nubbins`, i read to him every day and have done so pretty much since he was born (few days missed here and there)

13:26:06 gabriel_laddel: hey, good for you!

13:27:50 cazalla: nubbins`, pfft, i do all the cooking and cleaning fwiw

13:28:08 nubbins`: BUT THAT'S WOMEN'S WORK CAZALLA

13:28:14 cazalla: not simply because missus is useless for such tasks, but i enjoy cooking and the cleaning provides me with an illusion of control

13:28:14 nubbins`: or something

13:28:24 cazalla: nah, best chefs are men

13:28:37 nubbins`: that was farcical

13:28:40 nubbins`: i love cooking food :/

13:29:12 nubbins`: recently been making lots of korean dishes that i haven't been able to eat since i left there in 2007

13:29:14 nubbins`: or whenever it was

13:29:18 cazalla: anyway, it's difficult to raise a kid right these days

13:29:21 nubbins`: ^

13:29:27 nubbins`: why i don't have any

13:29:44 nubbins`: that and i'm not ready to press my generational reset button

13:30:01 cazalla: you're up against an immense wave of shit made in china, ipads, tv, public education the constant reinforce that should you buck the status quo, you're a bad parent

13:31:00 cazalla: me either nubbins` but "nature finds a way"

13:31:03 nubbins`: heh

13:31:22 nubbins`: teach your kid chinese, no joke

13:31:28 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: uh

13:31:40 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: their language doesn't map to computers all that well

13:31:46 cazalla: nubbins`, i teach him auslan

13:31:49 gabriel_laddel: == fucked

13:32:04 nubbins`: does it map to mouth sounds well? 8)

13:32:53 jurov: teach him latin :D

13:33:03 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: doesn't matter. Let's say that you are a super good people person but can't verify any of what your computer is doing in the future.

13:33:13 gabriel_laddel: you're fucked.

13:33:32 nubbins`: that's the situation i'm in right now

13:33:42 nubbins`: :D

13:33:46 cazalla: by rights i should know another language but zomg the shame of speaking german

13:33:59 nubbins`: the shame!

13:34:08 nubbins`: ersetzen aufladen!

13:34:09 cazalla: fucking idiot father didn't bother

13:34:28 jurov: einpfropfen verboten!

13:34:38 nubbins`: heh

13:34:44 cazalla: and fucking idiot father's father couldn't speak a word of english yet 2 generations after can't speak a word of german

13:35:01 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: the english (or korean!) language maps to computers becuase the characters compose. you'll only have to learn how to talk to a computer instead of a whole new system of language + computers.

13:35:18 cazalla: doesn't matter anyway, my father is/was weak, feminine, useless

13:35:24 nubbins`: gabriel_laddel while you *can* type chinese using simplified chars, i wasn't implying that he learn chinese for computer use

13:35:26 nubbins`: he has english for that.

13:35:42 cazalla: but what else do you get from the youngest in the family

13:35:44 gabriel_laddel: my point is that chinese as is must go away if they want to work with computers

13:36:17 gabriel_laddel: the chinese I know who learn "english for programming" have all sorts of massive misconceptions about computers, language, mathematics etc.

13:36:44 nubbins`: they have misconceptions about mathematics, and it's because their mother tongue is chinese?

13:36:46 nubbins`: o.O

13:37:07 nubbins`: also korean alphabet +1 top kek

13:37:23 nubbins`: learned it on the descent into seoul

13:37:31 nubbins`: 13 fucking vowels!!

13:39:12 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: the language doesn't help. For example, a chinese mathematics undergrad from Peking U. I know thought that using a computer algebra system to do mathematics was "cheating". Person in question had no notion of "playing with mathematics". This is more of a cultural thing, but much of human thought is captured in language.

13:39:35 cazalla: so what is the opinion of the erudites here regaring what polgar did with his daughters? that has sorta been my goal with my son, find one thing for him and push him hard in that direction

13:40:10 gabriel_laddel: By relieving the brain of all unnecessary work, a good notation sets it free to concentrate on more advanced problems, and in effect increases the mental power of the race. -- A.N. Whitehead

13:41:03 gabriel_laddel: See also China's Examination Hell: The Civil Service Examinations of Imperial China

13:41:23 gabriel_laddel: originally recommended by Stanislav

13:41:31 gabriel_laddel: Interesting book.

13:43:56 gabriel_laddel: cazalla: see also John von Neumann and Norbert Wiener: From Mathematics to the Technologies of Life and Death

13:44:23 gabriel_laddel: it has some stuff about polgar's daughters

13:44:25 cazalla: will take a look tmw when of sober mind

13:44:28 nubbins`: cazalla sounds like a great idea unless your kid turns out to be not particularly cut out for that particular thing

13:44:46 cazalla: nubbins`, well if he's not, he can do what i do, but only one way to find out

13:45:23 *: gabriel_laddel I'll note that I hate the perspective of the author in that book but liked the information he had to present.

13:45:25 nubbins`: so what's the one thing you're gonna push him towards

13:46:15 cazalla: nubbins`, no idea yet, he likes to mash on the electric keyboard i have here but then what kid wouldn't?

13:46:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27050 @ 0.00032158 = 8.6987 BTC [-]

13:46:22 nubbins`: nod

13:46:39 gabriel_laddel: the machines in the shop roar so wildly / that i often forget in the roar that I am ; / i am lost in the terrible tumult, / my ego disappears, i am a machine. / i work, and work and word without end; / i am busy, and busy and busy all the time. / for what? and for whom? I know not, I ask not! / how should a machine ever come to think?

13:46:42 cazalla: end up fighting over it while i attempt to play california games while he does his own thing :)

13:46:44 gabriel_laddel: ^ from the above book

13:50:08 nubbins`: but it was too late for all that, the buggers held full control, so all rooms are now hospital. the candy cart of medication wheels behind me, manacled by psychotic chains. lines of divison have been dissolved. this letter is also spoken live in the minds of all others. medication is food. Rx is smoked. food is smoked. all useless as light dripped from bulbs into splashing puddles of light on the floor. vast communities of bulky orderlies.

13:50:08 nubbins`: rowhouses of nurses. all rooms are hospitals now. /// flies spit antipsychotic froth on their tongues & wheel about cheap paint walls. all hospitals are life now.

13:50:14 nubbins`: ^ from a book we published in 2013 ;0

13:50:52 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: !

13:50:59 gabriel_laddel: Fun in the USA

13:51:02 nubbins`: tl;dr schizophrenia isn't as romantic as you think

13:51:09 nubbins`: in fact, "fun" in eastern canada

13:51:14 gabriel_laddel: O

13:52:38 cazalla: i bet the scam poetry.com ran back in the late 90s, early 2000's would work far better today amongst the narcissistic facebook generation of today

13:52:46 cazalla: going to bed anyway, zzz

13:53:07 nubbins`: nite

13:53:16 gabriel_laddel: "Only a man from Budapest can enter a revolving door behind you and exit ahead of you" -- jvn

13:53:17 gabriel_laddel: har

13:54:34 nubbins`: i've thought about release above-quoted tome as an ebook, but it's such a pain

13:54:46 nubbins`: and nobody'd buy it anyway

13:54:53 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: I'd pirate it.

13:54:58 nubbins`: you probably wouldn't

13:55:21 nubbins`: at least one person would have to find and purchase it for that to happen :P

13:57:04 nubbins`: hm, i have some posters from the release here somewhere

13:58:02 nubbins`: http://imgur.com/a/CKzEK

13:58:03 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1xk2OX6 )

13:59:55 gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: is the guy an actual lunatic or just a deviant his "family & friends" decided to reformat (in your estimation).

14:00:42 nubbins`: close friend of mine. has been in the bughouse at least a half dozen times

14:01:03 nubbins`: but y'know. sensible, intelligent guy, great writer

14:01:49 nubbins`: generally writes about his own life experiences, occasionally embellished

14:03:10 nubbins`: that book in particular is confusing, depressing, and ultimately without resolution or catharsis

14:03:21 nubbins`: which actually precisely parallels living with schizophrenia

14:03:25 nubbins`: so...

14:03:44 gabriel_laddel: I see.

14:03:52 nubbins`: it's a lesson disguised as a novel 8)

14:09:43 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46355 @ 0.00032155 = 14.9055 BTC [-] {2}

14:11:50 thestringpuller: ;;ticker

14:11:51 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 292.8, Best ask: 292.83, Bid-ask spread: 0.03000, Last trade: 292.88, 24 hour volume: 44039.14305288, 24 hour low: 286.0, 24 hour high: 298.8, 24 hour vwap: None

14:13:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11061 @ 0.00032086 = 3.549 BTC [-]

14:22:34 jurov: http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/12/us-bitcoin-ibm-idUSKBN0M82KB20150312

14:22:36 assbot: Exclusive: IBM looking at adopting bitcoin technology for major currencies | Reuters ... ( http://bit.ly/1L6JNDi )

14:23:58 jurov: "We are at a tipping point right now. It's making a lot more sense for some type of digital cash in the system, that not only saves our government money, but also is a lot more convenient and secure for individuals to use," the source said.

14:26:18 jurov: they failed to make _anything_ secure. butbut "blockchain technology!!!1"

14:26:48 jurov: !up CheckDavid

14:27:04 jurov: !up felipelalli

14:27:22 jurov: !up mike_c

14:35:56 BingoBoingo: various gnomings http://www.tedunangst.com/flak/post/invented-by-openbsd

14:35:57 assbot: invented by openbsd ... ( http://bit.ly/1FYj7Ou )

14:39:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 138056 @ 0.00032044 = 44.2387 BTC [-] {2}

14:48:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7380 @ 0.000327 = 2.4133 BTC [+]

15:02:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20300 @ 0.00032913 = 6.6813 BTC [+]

15:17:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64400 @ 0.00032618 = 21.006 BTC [-] {3}

15:20:40 thestringpuller: chainalysis.com

15:20:50 thestringpuller: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=978088.msg10756505#msg10756505

15:21:48 thestringpuller: https://i.imgflip.com/is9v9.jpg << horse drawn gasenwagen

15:22:58 nubbins`: heh

15:24:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31150 @ 0.00032913 = 10.2524 BTC [+]

15:31:17 nubbins`: http://i.imgur.com/iYL6DBr.jpg

15:31:19 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1NT07qa )

15:31:20 nubbins`: 'merkuh

15:42:12 danielpbarron: height=273710 vs height=207965

15:57:56 BingoBoingo: !up bearmarket

15:58:00 BingoBoingo: Hello bearmarket

16:13:35 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: i'm nearly cured of wanting anything whatsoever to do with netbsd now.

16:14:30 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: When they people forked out OpenBSD, seems they kept the wrong people

16:20:14 Burrmarket: ohh thanks for the verify

16:23:22 ben_vulpes: cazalla, gabriel_laddel: it's totarry the jooz.

16:25:43 ben_vulpes: <gabriel_laddel> [13:15] the political position of "they're cattle, we're not" is totally A OK. << and furthermore, the #b-a creed

16:27:30 ben_vulpes: <cazalla> [13:29] you're up against an immense wave of shit made in china, ipads, tv, public education the constant reinforce that should you buck the status quo, you're a bad parent << jesus shit if you go *with* the status quo you're a bad parent

16:27:54 ben_vulpes: "yes it's entirely a good idea to lock everyone from ages 8-18 up with each other and nobody else, that won't promptly lead to all sorts of pathologies."

16:32:43 ben_vulpes: !s secret service agents

16:32:44 assbot: 11 results for 'secret service agents' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=secret+service+agents

16:33:03 ben_vulpes: tres lulz

16:33:26 danielpbarron: nearly cured of wanting anything whatsoever to do with netbsd << what does this mean for pogo?

16:34:19 danielpbarron: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=31-01-2015#999245 << how hard would it be to resolve this?

16:34:19 assbot: Logged on 31-01-2015 01:43:22; asciilifeform: danielpbarron: iirc, openbsd will not see the nand flash on the 'pogo.'

16:34:30 danielpbarron: because I agree, I do not like netbsd

16:35:50 *: danielpbarron dreams of pine trees

16:37:00 ben_vulpes: i had my first relational algebra dream two nights ago

16:37:14 trinque: ^LOL

16:37:33 trinque: also good morning, all

16:38:34 trinque: ben_vulpes: did the perfect schema float down from the heavens?

16:39:03 ben_vulpes: trinque: i'm no mircea_popescu, i have to tweak and derp and derp and tweak

16:39:10 ben_vulpes: until the jews start crawling out of my skin

16:41:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 120940 @ 0.00031883 = 38.5593 BTC [-] {3}

16:47:46 mod6: ;;later tell jurov The mailing list is still snarffing messages. The dns fix didn't seem to help.

16:47:46 gribble: The operation succeeded.

16:48:19 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: it wasn't just the nand

16:48:27 asciilifeform: (netbsd doesn't support the nand either)

16:48:40 asciilifeform: i started work on a driver but there's no time.

16:49:46 asciilifeform: what does this mean for pogo? << it means that one of you will have to come up with an os

16:52:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29189 @ 0.00032525 = 9.4937 BTC [+]

16:53:11 nubbins`: even using the sd card for os isn't an unbearable extra burden

16:53:29 asciilifeform: nubbins`: mmno.

16:54:42 vhost-: >+ben_vulpes | i had my first relational algebra dream two nights ago

16:54:45 vhost-: haha

16:58:01 nubbins`: n/m catching up on logs

17:00:04 mod6: <+asciilifeform> i started work on a driver but there's no time. << I'm pretty much in the same boat but it kinda sounds fun to write. I hate pdf's but I found this that sort of defines what I think the issue is here. Can you confirm ascii? http://chewiefs.sed.hu/sites/chewiefs.sed.hu/files/NetBSD_Flash_subsystem_final_nopagenum.pdf

17:00:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1b85OBv )

17:02:13 danielpbarron: even using the sd card for os << not necessary; the whole thing can go on the same hard drive as the blockchain

17:02:42 danielpbarron: when that static build of bitcoind is ready, i'll try to compile it for pogo and see if it runs on debian

17:02:50 danielpbarron: at least debian doesn't have all that systemd crap

17:02:57 nubbins`: gabriel_laddel:Does anyone take issue with me describing the lordship as "the peerage" and #-assets as "earth's premiere commercial forum"? <<< ...

17:03:53 nubbins`: cazalla:worse, TaT masquerades as bitcoinassets on it and is a mod to boot <<< ...

17:04:39 danielpbarron: i am chatting from debian-on-a-pogo -- it's very nice, and if anyone wants such a machine I highly recommend it

17:05:15 danielpbarron: the blue model is perfect for this purpose, just add SD card of any size

17:06:13 thestringpuller: cazalla: ah so that's where TaT went to.

17:08:25 thestringpuller: any qntra editors awake?

17:09:33 davout: danielpbarron: "at least debian doesn't have all that systemd crap" <<< i was under the impression it was coming to debian too

17:10:34 danielpbarron: from what i can tell, it isn't there yet

17:12:11 davout: yea, what i understood too, coming nonetheless

17:15:14 trinque: !up stunna

17:15:55 nubbins`: danielpbarron mine's serving files

17:16:00 danielpbarron: You are blocked from following @0xabad1dea and viewing @0xabad1dea's Tweets. Learn more << the list grows :D

17:23:35 danielpbarron: Unable to promote this Tweet -- This Tweet violates Twitter's policy on ad content. Please review our Ads Policy.

17:32:38 danielpbarron: !up Bagels7

17:36:04 danielpbarron: !up Transisto

17:39:08 danielpbarron: (NOTE: OpenBSD can not be re-exported from the US once it has entered the US. Because of this, take care NOT to get the distribution from an FTP server in the US if you are outside of Canada and the US.)

17:54:30 ben_vulpes: this is the most unbelievably gorgeous spring i've ever seen here

17:57:06 ben_vulpes: warm

17:57:08 ben_vulpes: no rain

17:57:10 ben_vulpes: lots of sun

17:57:25 ben_vulpes: but the planet's not choking under human smog or anything

18:08:37 danielpbarron: http://www.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/man.cgi/OpenBSD-current/man1/signify.1 << apparently openbsd has its own tool for creating and verifying signatures

18:08:38 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EbqBLm )

18:13:21 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: They use that for code/binaries, because GPG is GPL and in their distribution it is license unacceptable by their standards

18:20:34 danielpbarron: everything i learn about openbsd makes me like it more than before

18:23:18 thestringpuller: coinbase blog runs on node.js

18:23:20 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: The signify thing depends on libsodium for however good it is along with probably other things

18:25:55 kakobrekla: <danielpbarron> (NOTE: OpenBSD can not be re-exported from the US once it has entered the US. < im sure you are familiar with 'pgpi scanning project'

18:27:09 mircea_popescu: lmao @weirdus

18:27:24 asciilifeform: the whole thing can go on the same hard drive as the blockchain << NO. must be able to insert brand new drive in brand new unit and have it format. or replacement drive.

18:27:51 asciilifeform: at least debian doesn't have all that systemd crap << do you have a fully-source-based cross-compilator build of debian? if not, it's worthless.

18:28:23 asciilifeform: and yes, systemd is coming to debian

18:28:30 asciilifeform: thing's dead.

18:29:12 danielpbarron: i am trying to come up with solutions that I myself might be capable of achieving; I'm not aware of anyone else who is working on this thing

18:29:36 danielpbarron: looks like gentoo might work on it

18:29:43 danielpbarron: http://dev.gentoo.org/~armin76/arm/sheevaplug/install.xml

18:29:44 assbot: Gentoo Linux Documentation -- Gentoo on the Marvell SheevaPlug ... ( http://bit.ly/1EbvhRw )

18:30:24 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: i spent quite a bit of time simply trying to get a vanilla linux kernel made with 'buildroot' (built for this very purpose - routers) to boot on pogo.

18:30:27 asciilifeform: to no avail

18:30:33 asciilifeform: someone else might have better luck

18:30:45 asciilifeform: but that was originally how i ended up trying netbsd

18:31:56 asciilifeform: ('buildroot' builds cross compiler in the process of building, like netbsd does. it also builds minimal userlands with known contents suitable for read-only media. this is the part that is very tricky to achieve by hand)

18:32:01 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9663 @ 0.00032215 = 3.1129 BTC [-]

18:34:33 mats: http://www.flightradar24.com/data/airplanes/n829bm/#5bd0cd7

18:34:34 assbot: N829BM - Private - Aircraft info and flight history - Flightradar24 ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ebwmsz )

18:35:54 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform so what's the situation here, can't get an os for pogo ?

18:36:04 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can, with effort

18:36:31 asciilifeform: two leads: 1) port whatever's in netbsd to openbsd to get it going on pogo

18:36:33 mircea_popescu: so the breakdown is that you know how and he doesn't an' you're not telling him ?

18:36:54 asciilifeform: 2) find out why buildroot's kernel doesn't run on pogo

18:37:25 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: lol, i think i made the handful of useful things i've discovered on the subject public on the listserv

18:37:39 asciilifeform: if i mentioned something here that wasn't included - please wake me up

18:37:39 davout: mats: nice!

18:37:46 mircea_popescu: so then it's more like, "can't get an os for pogo, we like to believe it can be done nevertheless" ?

18:38:00 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform im jus' trying to get where we're at.

18:38:28 asciilifeform: i have a very impoverished (no nand yet) netbsd on mine

18:38:46 asciilifeform: but BingoBoingo's discovery has somewhat ruined my appetite for netbsd..

18:39:06 davout: asciilifeform: what was that?

18:39:23 asciilifeform: davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051876

18:39:23 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 14:35:56; BingoBoingo: various gnomings http://www.tedunangst.com/flak/post/invented-by-openbsd

18:39:28 davout: ty

18:39:36 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if that's where it's at, danielpbarron has a point. gotta get it running, somehow.

18:40:36 danielpbarron: technically i have two of them "running" -- albeit with very nasty "through the mud" shortcuts

18:40:45 asciilifeform: if going to eat the meat regardless of from what animal - may as well run bitcoin on the stock linux that comes with that thing

18:40:57 asciilifeform: it'll run...

18:40:57 danielpbarron: one is half-way to being synced with the network

18:41:15 mircea_popescu: well, not regardless of what animal, but unless someone shoots a unicorn it will not be unicorn meat.

18:42:32 asciilifeform: in other news, i shipped the junk back to macrofab

18:42:56 asciilifeform: they promised to measure their stock of R's, but so far heard nothing

18:43:18 asciilifeform: i'm beginning to suspect that most of what's in the electronics stores now has these 'magical' components of essentially random values

18:43:30 asciilifeform: for digital circuit, the consequences are not immediately apparent

18:44:14 mircea_popescu: you may be on to something there.

18:44:23 asciilifeform: i very much hope that i'm not

18:44:26 mircea_popescu: may account for all those cases of the zombie device.

18:44:33 asciilifeform: or that i'm on to something that isn't this

18:44:41 mircea_popescu: (mystically breaks, sent for repairs, returns fixed, breaks again, etc)

18:44:44 asciilifeform: because this is just Sad

18:45:16 asciilifeform: and how on earth would it stay undiscovered until this

18:45:29 mircea_popescu: jobsworth.

18:45:41 asciilifeform: telling me that no one anywhere built an analogue whateverthefuck?

18:45:45 asciilifeform: what of all the ham radio folks

18:45:58 mircea_popescu: out of the millions of redditards generously employed to do tech support, millions are in "tech support stories" talking about how idiot customers are

18:46:06 mircea_popescu: 0 actually engage in hunting for bugs like this.

18:46:22 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the ham radio folks use older gear maybe ?

18:46:29 asciilifeform: they build new stuff

18:46:38 mircea_popescu: maybe out of old stuff they have in garage ?

18:46:39 asciilifeform: the software-defined-radio thing going for past few yrs, for example

18:47:25 mircea_popescu: there's a definite age gap. kids born pre 1990 are more different from kids born after than slave owners from slaves in the deep south cca 1790

18:47:29 asciilifeform: http://ad7zj.net/kd7lmo/ground_gnuradio.html << example

18:47:30 assbot: KD7LMO - GNU Radio ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ebz6WY )

18:48:16 asciilifeform: incidentally, one more piece of data - i traced the empty board (included with the two populated units) - there were no mask defects

18:48:21 asciilifeform: (these would turn up in all 3)

18:48:30 mircea_popescu: well, one way to find out, of course, would be to get some new laptops/handhelds and measure their resistors.

18:49:03 mircea_popescu: can be done easy enough and undestructively, just turn the machine off and pop its cover

18:49:08 asciilifeform: if anyone owns a pair of 'hot tweezer' (soldering iron for removing smd parts) - go ahead

18:49:17 asciilifeform: not everything is meaningfully measurable in-circuit

18:49:17 mircea_popescu: do they even have to be removed ?

18:49:22 mircea_popescu: resistors tho ?

18:49:28 asciilifeform: because you cannot force the current of measurement to flow -only- through the resistor

18:49:44 asciilifeform: i was able to do it for r6 and r16 in own box because knew how it was arranged

18:49:50 mircea_popescu: yes hon, but you didn't get 207.5 parts for a 210 part

18:49:54 mircea_popescu: you got 400k or some shit

18:50:04 asciilifeform: i got ~200 for 470

18:50:06 asciilifeform: (ohm)

18:50:13 mircea_popescu: now that'd be measured in circuit

18:50:16 asciilifeform: and hell knows what else for the parts that could not be measured

18:50:34 asciilifeform: that one was measurable in-circuit due to the way it was connected.

18:51:09 mircea_popescu: is there some way to connect a resistor in an unpowered, unshorted circuit so that i can't measure it without unmounting it ?

18:51:09 asciilifeform: for example of a trivial case where they cannot:

18:51:15 asciilifeform: wheatstone bridge

18:51:19 *: mircea_popescu takes advantage of b-a to refresh his electronics knowledge :D

18:51:46 asciilifeform: or i suppose not a plain wheatstone bridge, but one connected to something yet else

18:52:07 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform wait, isn't that HOW you measure resistence in the first place ?

18:52:35 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in 1940s and prior - yes

18:52:46 ben_vulpes: 's how i did it in 'skool'.

18:52:53 *: mircea_popescu doesn't think this objection holds much water.

18:54:16 mircea_popescu: but here's a graduating hs class to bridge us over. http://41.media.tumblr.com/892db9f0182fd2b0fc69986349321c7c/tumblr_n7gasyXpPM1s0yaxoo1_1280.jpg

18:54:16 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNsLXG )

18:56:49 ben_vulpes: what is the /context/ for that, man?

18:57:41 mircea_popescu: you don't need context, it's an image.

18:57:49 mircea_popescu: i recall reading here.

18:59:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42300 @ 0.00032653 = 13.8122 BTC [+] {2}

18:59:28 mircea_popescu: !up ColinT

19:02:11 mircea_popescu: hahaha it was just pointed out to me that if you google for pretty much anything to do with btc b-a is probably in the results, and if you click over to images there's definitely some b-a ladies in there.

19:02:33 mircea_popescu: it's like boring boring b-a boring b-a b-a boring etc.

19:15:47 thestringpuller: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2yxsdd/satoshi_on_scaling_the_current_system_where_every/ << lets see how this turns out (bookmarks under "popcorn required")

19:17:24 mircea_popescu: it's kinda incredible to me that the entire intellectual production of the usg crowd is limited to merely rehashing points debunked within a week or two of the "controversy".

19:18:19 mircea_popescu: incidentally, "bbs where every user runs his own nntp server" is a) a better implementation of irc, which is a better implementation of bbs, which is dead tech and b) exactly where gossipd is going.

19:18:33 mircea_popescu: this is obviously a plain requisite for any government-proof system of anything.

19:19:14 mircea_popescu: if you allow "server farms" you also allow the government the power toi know which necks to squeeze, which in practice readily devolves to shrem begging for ten bucks because http://fraudsters.com/2015/heres-what-they-dont-tell-you-when-they-bring-you-those-papers-to-sign/

19:19:15 assbot: Here's what they don't tell you when they bring you those papers to sign pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNwO6k )

19:20:40 mircea_popescu: speaking of which, danielpbarron or someone, mind tweeeting that link in response to say https://twitter.com/CharlieShrem/status/576158948950171648

19:20:42 assbot: So, I’m going to prison. http://t.co/yFWlxcj4JP /hashtag/Bitcoin?src=hash

19:20:45 mircea_popescu: pour encourager les autres.

19:23:20 thestringpuller: from: http://blog.cryptoconsortium.org/contributing-to-the-ccss/ "There are many ways in which you can help contribute to the CryptoCurrency Security Standard. While security experts have an obvious avenue for contributing, the standard also needs help from graphic designers, language translators, and proofreaders too, just to name a few." this is what permissionless innovation looks like in da infancy

19:23:38 thestringpuller: it looks like begging

19:23:38 mircea_popescu: !up shesek

19:24:16 mircea_popescu: thestringpuller this isn't "permissionless innovation", this is "standardization without permission".

19:24:40 mircea_popescu: when they're done doing that they can probably get back to riding their wooden horses or w/e nine year olds do when not monkeying the adults.

19:24:43 thestringpuller: "The CCSS is an open standard, born out of the belief that security should not be the defining feature of your service." << Why?!?!?

19:24:44 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's come to the point where i 'google xxxx' and get... own self having spoken of xxxx five minutes prior

19:25:04 mircea_popescu: win.

19:25:14 mircea_popescu: clearly, google thinks you're narcissistic :D

19:25:19 asciilifeform: l0ltr0n

19:25:23 mircea_popescu: lol

19:25:57 danielpbarron: mind tweeeting that link << done

19:26:06 *: asciilifeform had interesting email exchange with macrofab, where they showed photograph of their bobbin - labeled 'panasonic' - said they tested 50 random units;

19:26:17 asciilifeform: described to them simple test of board. and they promised to try..

19:26:26 asciilifeform: one day these might come back sorta-working

19:26:42 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: re "standardization without permission" << it looks like bastardization. who the fuck says, "Security should not be the defining feature of a service". Does this roughly translate to: "CSS everywhere."

19:26:49 asciilifeform: probably looking rather scorched, as they'll have to desolder the shield frame

19:27:29 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: no broken kneecaps yet? gotta bring them to an "understanding"

19:27:45 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform they tested random units came out the right value ?

19:27:49 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: for the budget, i can't even afford to break self

19:27:56 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: so claimed, yes

19:28:02 mircea_popescu: very odd neh ?

19:28:44 kakobrekla: whats the problem, the inconsistency of resistors ?

19:29:25 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: see log

19:29:43 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/bobbin.jpg << alleged bobbin

19:29:45 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNyBZb )

19:30:06 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla apparently his thing got 400 instead of 200 ohm resistors, but funnily they carried the 200 markings

19:30:14 asciilifeform: opposite

19:30:19 asciilifeform: but yes

19:30:24 asciilifeform: and unknown other problemos

19:30:44 asciilifeform: they also confessed that 8.2k were mounted instead of 10k

19:30:49 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform wow, 5% tolerances ?

19:30:50 asciilifeform: (which was not readily measurable in-circuit)

19:31:05 asciilifeform: 5% is adequate for this device

19:31:19 mircea_popescu: sure, but is it adequate for tianjin co ?

19:31:23 asciilifeform: probably not.

19:32:00 mircea_popescu: weird. "for your convenience, we have packed five half-resistence resistors separately, to bring the average to a 5% tolerance as you required"

19:32:04 mircea_popescu: then they put those in your thing.

19:32:07 mircea_popescu: problem solved.

19:32:07 asciilifeform: aha.

19:32:26 asciilifeform: and funnily enough, they weren't random all-over-the-place

19:32:33 asciilifeform: they were about half.

19:32:51 mircea_popescu: there's like 1k 470 ohm bits exactly, and then 10 items at 230, which make it be +-5% over the batch

19:33:01 kakobrekla: so the 1% ones should be +- 10%

19:33:27 asciilifeform: the 'cleanliness' of the wrong value suggests traditional chinese gnomery

19:33:45 asciilifeform: where they go 'we have two tonnes of Y and only half a tonne of X, let's relabel some Y as X'

19:34:29 mircea_popescu: o.O

19:34:42 mircea_popescu: they still do this ? i thought it was mostly a great leap forward into a brick wall phenoimenon

19:34:49 asciilifeform: !s melamine

19:34:50 assbot: 1 results for 'melamine' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=melamine

19:56:32 ben_vulpes: mod6: aha i see patches!

20:01:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68100 @ 0.00032628 = 22.2197 BTC [-] {2}

20:21:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19950 @ 0.00032698 = 6.5233 BTC [+]

20:22:14 thestringpuller: https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc1867.txt << this paper annoys me

20:23:08 davout: thestringpuller: wai

20:32:39 thestringpuller: cuz there literally is no examples of how to implement the standard for binary

20:35:24 davout: thestringpuller: i'd use firefox to upload some small binary to http://requestb.in

20:35:25 assbot: RequestBin — Collect, inspect and debug HTTP requests and webhooks ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNIXbt )

20:35:33 davout: so you can make your own example

20:35:51 davout: make form, use requestbin as action, *poof*

20:41:21 thestringpuller: davout: this is pretty useful

20:41:32 thestringpuller: looks like I need to set headers to base64 and i should be good

20:41:55 davout: requestbin is neat

20:42:13 davout: "aux bons ouvriers les bons outils"

20:43:06 thestringpuller: That's a good phrase.

20:43:50 davout: yup

20:43:57 thestringpuller: Je travaille dur!

20:44:10 davout: :D

20:44:49 thestringpuller: I was trying to get wireshark to work, but it wants x11 and doesn't seem to work with quartz without poking at it.

20:44:57 thestringpuller: but don't think I need it

20:54:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3900 @ 0.00032215 = 1.2564 BTC [-]

20:54:40 mod6: awe fsck

20:55:12 mod6: jurov: are you here?

20:56:40 mod6: can you delete these duplicates? http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000064.html & http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000065.html ?

20:56:40 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AleRop )

20:56:41 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AleUk0 )

20:57:35 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051612 << how the fuck does one destroy gold ?

20:57:35 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:33:18; cazalla: b) some random cunt is talking about launching an altcoin whereby he "destroys an oz of gold on webcam" as proof of burn for creation of his altcoin

20:57:50 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051614 << lol, wut ?

20:57:50 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:34:36; cazalla: worse, TaT masquerades as bitcoinassets on it and is a mod to boot

20:58:39 asciilifeform: wat ?!

21:00:17 cazalla: i guess he forked #b-a or osmething

21:00:20 Pierre_Rochard: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1052142 < like so: http://imgur.com/Dmby18r

21:00:20 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 20:57:35; mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051612 << how the fuck does one destroy gold ?

21:00:21 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1AlggLA )

21:00:50 mircea_popescu: cazalla can you be specific tho ?

21:00:55 mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard nom!

21:01:31 mircea_popescu: "The Bitcoin protocol, when implemented correctly, has a degree of sybil resistance when it comes to partitioning and double-spend risk as an attacker must get _all_ your connections for those attacks, but this kind of activity can really violate user privacy since privacy attacks don't need to get all your connections; especially for SPV nodes which liberally broadcast their wallet addresses to nodes that they're usin

21:01:31 mircea_popescu: g as servers."

21:01:33 cazalla: mircea_popescu, it's just his username i am referring to

21:01:37 mircea_popescu: heh. gmaxwell actually says this much.

21:01:43 mircea_popescu: "spv wallets - horribru for your privacy."

21:01:49 cazalla: but still, that'd be like me coming here under the name whaleclub

21:01:55 mircea_popescu: cazalla well whatever, he prolly got the username way back.

21:01:56 asciilifeform: wtf is 'whaleclub'

21:02:35 asciilifeform: sybiltron << not only that one. there are others, that've been running for a good long time.

21:02:37 asciilifeform: !s noblis

21:02:38 assbot: 5 results for 'noblis' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=noblis

21:02:49 davout: mircea_popescu: "how the fuck does one destroy gold ?" <<< aqua regia down the toilet

21:03:43 mircea_popescu: davout except now you'll have to add a proof of toilet.

21:03:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ayup.

21:03:59 asciilifeform: there was an ancient thread concerning sinking things in the sea, etc

21:04:07 mircea_popescu: just nothing the power rangers ever felt like discussing, prior.

21:04:16 davout: mircea_popescu: you actually need proof it was gold in the first place anyway

21:04:32 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: read, if you have the stomach, the tardsthread. overall angle seems to be 'use tor now111!!!11!!'

21:05:15 mircea_popescu: "Chainalysis achieves this by doing sophisticated in-depth real-time transaction analysis to determine unique entities within the blockchain. Michael Gr?nager Chief Executive Officer Jan M?ller Chief Technology Officer Jens Hilligs?e DevOps Engineer Kresten Krab Throup Consulting Architect J?rn Larsen Business Advisor"

21:05:18 mircea_popescu: for later.

21:05:30 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform obviously.

21:05:52 davout: they think they're better than everyone with their fancy "o"s

21:07:53 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051627 << nuttin wrong with the man cave.

21:07:53 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:49:43; cazalla: you guys criticise the mancave but seriously, when the missus and the kid push you out of the masterbedroom due to lack of sleep and then push you out the kids room which was turned into makeshift computer room but needs it back because apparently a pig pen isn't big enough for him now, you might appreciate the man cave aka cold ass garage

21:08:22 mircea_popescu: what's wrong is the idea that dependents can push one around in one's own castle.

21:08:32 cazalla: mircea_popescu, cmon, i was drunk and rambling, lets please ignore all that shit from last night lol

21:08:34 mircea_popescu: but obviously this doesn't automatically apply to everyone's living arrangements

21:08:37 mircea_popescu: lol k

21:08:53 scoopbot: New post on fraudsters by Mircea Popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2015/the-huge-language-issue/

21:08:54 mod6: ben_vulpes: ok good deal! i'm about to post the lastest version of the perl build script too -- which should pull v0.0.2 of the static-makefile patch.

21:09:40 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051634 << try the pogo version ?

21:09:40 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:53:40; cazalla: and i am stuck using fucking electrum since then because for some reason, since bitcoin-qt 0.10.0 came out, my old 0.8.3, 0.8.6 throws errors and i can't fully sync and even lame attempt to try 0.10.0 falls flat.. i think maybe memory is fucked though unrelated, memtest86 throws a bunch of errors

21:10:35 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051650 << ahahahaha.

21:10:35 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:56:57; cazalla: the big mistake i made was getting a woman pregnant prior to living with her.. things were all fine and dandy while i had my own place and could fuck her and send her home after the fact

21:10:43 mircea_popescu: said.... everyone ever ?

21:11:00 cazalla: mircea_popescu, they don't sell them locally, i am hopeful i can buy a plug it in and away it goes pogo from here once that is sorted

21:11:03 asciilifeform: where i live, many folks actually use their day jobs as 'man cave'

21:11:16 davout: asciilifeform: that's kind of the point of a day job

21:11:19 davout: :D

21:11:26 asciilifeform: davout: i though the point was to starve more slowly

21:11:29 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051657 << note that mp either.

21:11:29 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 12:59:12; gabriel_laddel: Note that I dont necessarily endorse MP's viewpoint but it is rather well developed.

21:11:57 mircea_popescu: cazalla if you ask danielpbarron nicely he might ship you one.

21:12:29 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform nobody works for money in the west.

21:12:43 asciilifeform: wai wat

21:12:55 *: asciilifeform works for [what passes for] money

21:13:29 asciilifeform: at least it spends a brief moment, like decaying subatomic particle, as 'money'

21:13:42 asciilifeform: producing 'decay daughters' food, rent...

21:13:54 mircea_popescu: http://jesuschristsiliconvalley.tumblr.com/post/46537875392/what-your-profile-picture-says-about-you-hint <<< i don't really get the femmeflame.

21:13:56 assbot: Jesus Christ, Silicon Valley | What Your Profile Picture Says About You (Hint:... ... ( http://bit.ly/1Alj6QP )

21:13:56 asciilifeform: perhaps this ^ is what mircea_popescu meant

21:14:28 mircea_popescu: some profile pics, let it go. not everyone's as socially awkward / sexually repressed as you, to use their feet in etsy shoes / anon ducklings as an avatar.

21:14:55 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform and if tomorrow they swtiched to company scrip, you'd work for that.

21:15:08 mircea_popescu: !up saifedean

21:15:10 asciilifeform: how different would it look from usd

21:15:12 mircea_popescu: get in the wot, you.

21:15:16 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform triangular.

21:15:23 asciilifeform: other than that - quite similar!

21:17:04 asciilifeform: scrip >> obligatory >> 'You load sixteen tons, what do you get? / Another day older and deeper in debt / Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't go / I owe my soul to the company store.'

21:18:44 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051686 << lmao.

21:18:44 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:06:41; gabriel_laddel: Everywhere.

21:18:53 saifedean: hey mp, to get back to your question about lebanon, here's what's interesting about it, beyond the hard money and best food in the world and great wine and beautiful people... less than an hour drive between beautiful sandy Mediterranean beaches and gorgeous ski resorts... it's the Alps on the Riviera

21:19:08 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you know enrico caruso, right ?

21:19:25 asciilifeform: the opera guy ?

21:19:27 asciilifeform: or some other

21:19:28 mircea_popescu: saifedean cool!

21:19:31 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the one.

21:19:36 asciilifeform: sure

21:19:38 saifedean: this weekend, for instance, people have to decide whether they want to ski, swim, or do both... i tell you lebanon is stressful

21:19:38 asciilifeform: why ?

21:19:41 mircea_popescu: now obviously our usian friends wouldn

21:19:56 mircea_popescu: t know, as aptly butch has observed : their names don't mean anything.

21:20:04 mircea_popescu: however, enrico was italian. any idea what caruso means ?

21:21:15 asciilifeform: ?

21:22:15 mircea_popescu: carusu is the sicilian word for boy. it derives off latin carens (missing) as in, inexperienced.

21:22:32 mircea_popescu: the word is infamous because it denotes the boys working the sulphur mines pre ww1

21:23:01 mircea_popescu: now THAT is a story of "sixteen tons and what do you get". you get to be four foot tall and with adaptive modifications of the spine.

21:23:25 asciilifeform: they had these in britain also, aha

21:23:55 mircea_popescu: "Il Fumo" (pirandello), pretty good.

21:24:47 mircea_popescu: and re latest fraudsters article : someone check the html of a page, whadda ya think ?

21:25:57 mod6: ben_vulpes: here's v0091 of the patching script: http://thebitcoin.foundation/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000066.html

21:25:58 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AllAyI )

21:27:04 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051689 << amusingly enough, they ~are~.

21:27:04 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:08:35; gabriel_laddel: What I find so lulzy about the whole situation is that if you take the supposed Zionist lit and the /pol/ people 100% seriously it basically reduces to "jews think that others are cattle"

21:28:42 mircea_popescu: what really burns them is the football team issue. they don't wish to not be cattle per se. they're just pissed that they were "come to expect" that THEY were the chosen people on account of, why the fuck not eh. and whenever it doesn't work as they "came to expect", it is clearly the case that really it works, but for someone else, so... whoddunit ?!?! (not them!)

21:29:25 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051690 << i have my doubts about that. you gotta do shit here.

21:29:25 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:08:37; cazalla: anyway, one might argue, and i did try, that /pol/ is a short stop otw to #b-a

21:29:51 asciilifeform: wtf is /pol/

21:29:55 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051692 << o noes, look what letting Adlai in has wrought!

21:29:55 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:09:09; cazalla: and i promoted it to /pol/ but i was shut down and accused of being jidf so

21:30:05 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform either reddit or 4chan or some other social media thing, politicas.

21:31:17 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051698 << romania is very ethnically homogenous, and they think the same about the gypsyes. it's patently untrue, but then again they're not thinking it because it'd be true.

21:31:17 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:10:52; cazalla: still, i can't help but feel affection for a homogeneous society like japan.. fucking mudslimes and other ethnics have destroyed australia within a generation

21:31:48 cazalla: c'mon i was rambling after a bottle of wine, i don't want to be reminded of last night!

21:32:10 trinque: ahaha, logs, the curse of the evening drinker

21:32:48 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051719 << that it may be, but you don't seriously intend to tell me the criteria actually is "because we got here yesterday rather than today, and the internationall cattle demarcation line happened this morning"

21:32:48 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:15:53; gabriel_laddel: the political position of "they're cattle, we're not" is totally A OK.

21:33:09 mircea_popescu: poor cazalla lol

21:33:30 davout: cazalla: nobody'll judge you for being a racist alcoholic

21:33:43 davout: :D

21:34:13 *: asciilifeform read mircea_popescu's newest article, with quoted thread; recalls earlier 'counter-economic spacetime anomaly' discussion also

21:34:21 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051721 << any planet of hats is doomed to failure. whatever the hat may be, hedonism no exception.

21:34:21 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:16:03; nubbins`: and we all know that a society of hedonists is a good society indeed

21:34:29 cazalla: davout, hah i know that, but anything i say here while drunk is really just recurring garbage from the last time i was drinking and chatting

21:34:50 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform check out the html declaration :D

21:35:28 mircea_popescu: davout i don't think he's even racist per se, not enough development of some sort of pseudogeneticist crackpottery. he's just angry in a diffuse sense.

21:36:36 davout: you're such an html rebel

21:36:40 mircea_popescu: lol "bitcoin university". best thing that ever happened to any diploma mill : when the webmaster stumbled on tardstalk/redditards den and added "bitcoin" to the name

21:36:47 mircea_popescu: davout i'm also five.

21:36:53 NewLiberty: asciilifeform: Whaleclub is a bunch of non-whales trying to be mini whales by 24hour chatting their trades.

21:37:19 mircea_popescu: NewLiberty you know i'm half tempted to send some girls to talk at them in that breathy voice .

21:37:53 asciilifeform: header << mega-l0l!

21:38:23 NewLiberty: https://www.whaleclub.co/live

21:38:28 asciilifeform: mini-whales!

21:38:34 asciilifeform: where are the mini-elephants ?

21:38:36 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051731 << i thought that was some sort of "awareness raising" anti rape / anti hiv / pro africa or somesuch.

21:38:36 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:17:31; gabriel_laddel: or VDARE.

21:38:39 mircea_popescu: can't remember which

21:38:48 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i think i ate one.

21:39:15 mircea_popescu: http://www.dare.org/ n,

21:39:17 assbot: D.A.R.E. America - Empowering Children to Lead Safe and Healthy Lives ... ( http://bit.ly/1AloXFM )

21:39:40 asciilifeform: ^ a true mega-l0l. this was a required 'course' in the school i went to

21:39:42 asciilifeform: in '90s

21:39:59 asciilifeform: there was actually a policeman guest lecturer, with briefcase of dope

21:40:12 asciilifeform: to make sure everyone can recognize the correct dope when his time comes, i suppose

21:40:29 mircea_popescu: i bet you he had ground sugar.

21:41:05 NewLiberty: The misinformation from d.a.r.e. probably led to more usage overall

21:41:28 trinque: NewLiberty: great way to make sure kids are aware that there are drugs

21:42:01 NewLiberty: yes, though they tended to call everything "narcotics"

21:42:07 davout: inadvertenly teaching them how to tell good from bad product apart

21:42:09 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051735 << no. because it offers a clear avenue of action. this is important. sane people realise shit's broken and want to do something to fix it. RIGHTNOW. any solution that provides them something to do will beat out of the field any solution that does not.

21:42:09 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:18:07; nubbins`: because it lets you ignore yourself as the cause of all your problems?

21:43:11 mircea_popescu: obviously a solution that encourages them to do shit on their own is even better, but generally "solutioners" are do-ocracists in the modlbug sense : they're chiefly tryting to build themselves a "4chan is not your army" army.

21:44:04 mircea_popescu: or i guess that harry potter fanfic writer guy w/e his name was is a better example of the principle, alf dictis.

21:44:45 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051752 << importantly, i did not round them up. that was the extand "party"

21:44:45 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:21:17; nubbins`: gabriel_laddel did you see the picture of the kids he rounded up for the "political party"?

21:45:03 mircea_popescu: they had selected themselves over many years of revolutionary struggle.

21:45:07 mircea_popescu: !up kuzetsa

21:46:05 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051771 << dude, i cook.

21:46:05 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:28:08; nubbins`: BUT THAT'S WOMEN'S WORK CAZALLA

21:46:48 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051792 << that i agree.

21:46:48 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:32:53; jurov: teach him latin :D

21:47:03 mircea_popescu: works better if you know latin in the first place, and i don't really know that many english speakers that do.

21:47:11 trinque: mircea_popescu: same shit in the US among the liber/paultards

21:47:22 trinque: doing is now making noise and nothing ever actually comes of any political gorup

21:47:23 mircea_popescu: which part trinque ?

21:47:25 trinque: *group

21:47:28 mircea_popescu: ah. myeah.

21:47:45 trinque: when I was about 17-21 I was deep in paultardation

21:47:45 mircea_popescu: well, it was instructive for me, and considering how little shit costs these days, i call it cheap enough.

21:48:13 trinque: only things that ever happened were talks, conferences, bullshit sign holding, etc

21:48:38 NewLiberty: What the whaleclub do not realize is that whales are not daytraders, not even mini-whales.

21:48:38 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051794 << no you're not. find a key to trust, trust that, you're just what "good people persons" always were : someone's cleric.

21:48:38 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:33:13; gabriel_laddel: you're fucked.

21:48:56 mircea_popescu: NewLiberty you know that ballas bit on the daytrader ?

21:49:23 NewLiberty: I don't think so, no.

21:50:41 mircea_popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2014/the-psychology-of-the-bagholder/

21:50:41 assbot: The psychology of the bagholder pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Alrgsw )

21:50:49 mircea_popescu: original linked from there.

21:51:25 NewLiberty: ...reading

21:51:57 trinque: mircea_popescu: hm that is precisely the American idea of "made it"

21:52:08 mircea_popescu: right

21:52:09 mircea_popescu: !up mrting

21:52:21 trinque: it's not working for a decade and building an empire; no no, it's "got it all, like it was nothing"

21:52:44 trinque: 21 year old CEO, company valuation of 30 bil

21:52:53 trinque: heh we're fucking children

21:53:39 mircea_popescu: the italian (which is, by the way, the paradigm of the failed state, and whose history the us is quite bound to repeat) term is sprezzatura

21:53:56 mircea_popescu: known since before isabella expelled the jews from spain in 1492, causing them to invent america.

21:54:10 mircea_popescu: (retroactively, the spring of same year)

21:58:00 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051809 << monolinguism is a purely ridiculous intellectual strategy. there's nothing wrong with speaking italian to women and german to horses, charles did it.

21:58:00 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:35:44; gabriel_laddel: my point is that chinese as is must go away if they want to work with computers

22:00:03 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051816 << while much of human thought is in fact captured in language (and i'm too lazy to hunt for the "language is really a shared preprocessor to crutch the supid" threads), nevertheless that is strictly bad schooling. it has nothing to do with the kid, or his language, it'll wash out of him within a coupla years.

22:00:03 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:39:12; gabriel_laddel: nubbins`: the language doesn't help. For example, a chinese mathematics undergrad from Peking U. I know thought that using a computer algebra system to do mathematics was "cheating". Person in question had no notion of "playing with mathematics". This is more of a cultural thing, but much of human thought is captured in language.

22:00:20 mircea_popescu: i saw romanian idiots stuck on the same thing.

22:00:53 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051817 << and how do you plan to find this ?

22:00:53 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:39:35; cazalla: so what is the opinion of the erudites here regaring what polgar did with his daughters? that has sorta been my goal with my son, find one thing for him and push him hard in that direction

22:02:29 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051840 << who the fuck thought that ?!

22:02:29 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 13:51:02; nubbins`: tl;dr schizophrenia isn't as romantic as you think

22:02:58 cazalla: mircea_popescu, by observing what he gravitates towards and encouraging it

22:03:23 mircea_popescu: this is substantially different from the original quote tho.

22:03:28 mircea_popescu: yes, good idea to encourage kids.

22:03:39 cazalla: or at least providing an opportunity for him to intereact with things that my own parents couldn't afford or bother with in regards to me

22:04:08 mircea_popescu: more important to humiliate them, in the limited sense of "here's what i am, and what i do, which you are not and do not because you currently suck. here's how you de-suck"

22:04:08 cazalla: yeah well, i was drunk so :)

22:12:10 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051872 << well... maybe it solves the problem for them so that they have to do no work and can just cash the checks for it magically working.

22:12:10 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 14:26:18; jurov: they failed to make _anything_ secure. butbut "blockchain technology!!!1"

22:12:13 mircea_popescu: that's how bitcoin works, right ?

22:13:06 mircea_popescu: https://i.imgflip.com/is9v9.jpg << ahahaha so very much this.

22:13:07 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNX1lc )

22:14:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28584 @ 0.0003272 = 9.3527 BTC [+] {3}

22:15:38 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051899 << nothing wrong with them spending a good chunk of the day like that, tho.

22:15:38 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 16:27:54; ben_vulpes: "yes it's entirely a good idea to lock everyone from ages 8-18 up with each other and nobody else, that won't promptly lead to all sorts of pathologies."

22:15:41 mircea_popescu: 8 to 10 hours maybe.

22:16:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24500 @ 0.0003286 = 8.0507 BTC [+] {2}

22:16:47 danielpbarron: You are blocked from following @Radomysisky and viewing @Radomysisky's Tweets. Learn more << lolol 2 in one day

22:17:17 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051934 << ahaha

22:17:17 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 17:04:39; danielpbarron: i am chatting from debian-on-a-pogo -- it's very nice, and if anyone wants such a machine I highly recommend it

22:17:29 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron what did you do to this one.

22:17:46 danielpbarron: http://blog.qnology.com/2014/07/hacking-pogoplug-v4-series-4-and-mobile.html << these instructions

22:17:48 assbot: Qui's techNOLOGY Blog: Hacking the Pogoplug v4 (Series 4 and Mobile) with Linux (Debian or Arch) ... ( http://bit.ly/1Alx70K )

22:18:26 danielpbarron: using SD card

22:18:39 danielpbarron: i duplicated the results on the cheaper model as well

22:18:47 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051947 << say wut ? srsly ?

22:18:47 assbot: Logged on 13-03-2015 17:39:08; danielpbarron: (NOTE: OpenBSD can not be re-exported from the US once it has entered the US. Because of this, take care NOT to get the distribution from an FTP server in the US if you are outside of Canada and the US.)

22:19:04 mircea_popescu: who the fuck cares what the usg says, even.

22:19:31 danielpbarron: yeah and it's also against the law for me to take my OpenBSD cd set out of the country; the crypto is too strong or something

22:19:54 danielpbarron: and come to think of it, bingo's laptop might also now be illegal to export

22:20:19 mircea_popescu: heh.

22:20:42 mircea_popescu: http://41.media.tumblr.com/ec311024e2b87ee830afc0fc594e6336/tumblr_njaoogkKpj1sr1f5fo1_1280.jpg << we are this amused.

22:20:43 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GNXPGG )

22:30:36 davout: danielpbarron: the ban on crypto export is still a thing?

22:31:25 danielpbarron: i don't see how it could possibly be enforced in a meaningful way, except to hassle people who are on the badlist

22:31:48 davout: i thought is was dropped altogether a while ago

22:32:01 davout: http://imgur.com/c0A38AW <<< bwhahaha

22:32:02 assbot: A little bio lab humor - GIF on Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1AlzYXx )

22:32:12 danielpbarron: oh idk, i copy pasted that from an OpenBSD README file

22:33:59 davout: wikipedia sez most regulations were dropped, but not all

22:45:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42800 @ 0.00032939 = 14.0979 BTC [+] {2}

23:07:21 BingoBoingo: <danielpbarron> and come to think of it, bingo's laptop might also now be illegal to export << So long as Open Source perfectly reasonable to export.

23:07:44 BingoBoingo: In my limited understanding of these matters.

23:14:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37800 @ 0.00032973 = 12.4638 BTC [+]

23:19:51 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: i am chatting from debian-on-a-pogo... << if danielpbarron (or anyone else) has -built- a linux kernel of whatever description, in such a way that it runs on pogo - please wake me up & show.

23:20:16 asciilifeform: all of the work i'm aware of so far uses the same 2 or 3 binary turds

23:20:49 asciilifeform: presently the only package of -source- i've succeeded in building into a kernel that can be used on pogo - was netbsd.

23:22:13 asciilifeform: (my original vision for the 'pogo' experiment wasn't simply to have a cheapo linux box that runs bitcoind, but to have a box where there are only a few MB of weight -total- -- thus making audit into something like a realistic possibility)

23:22:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.0003261 = 6.5872 BTC [-]

23:22:59 asciilifeform: and at the risk of repeating myself, i'll say why it must boot and run from eeprom

23:23:17 asciilifeform: 1) initialize a new disk without having to use a computer and involving the rotten pc ecosystem in any way

23:23:56 asciilifeform: 2) -and this is the important one- -- imho these need to eventually run from rom. actual rom. or at least eeprom with the write-enable leg snipped & grounded.

23:25:20 asciilifeform: sd card, incidentally, offers no proper means of write protection

23:25:33 asciilifeform: (the lever found on many such cards is not electrically connected to the internal flash!)

23:25:54 asciilifeform: it is a 'polite suggestion' for the system, only.

23:25:59 asciilifeform: why it is built like this, ask hitler not me

23:38:39 davout: asciilifeform: wasn't that the exact same for floppies?

23:41:00 BingoBoingo: davout: Floppies though are purely passive. You need to bring a drive to the disk. SD incorporates the drive.

23:41:34 asciilifeform: davout: yes

23:41:47 asciilifeform: davout: though iirc pc drives would normally respect in hardware

23:50:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42189 @ 0.00032556 = 13.7351 BTC [-] {2}

23:54:51 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform sure, but "eventually".

23:57:22 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 80 @ 0.01449999 = 1.16 BTC [+] {2}