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Transcript for 14-02-2015, 1273 lines:

00:00:11 cazalla: feb is on track to be another record month

00:04:04 mircea_popescu: o srsly ?

00:04:05 mircea_popescu: coolness

00:05:24 *: mircea_popescu makes a note that should anyone wish to "see studies" supporting the proposition of http://fraudsters.com/2014/how-to-deal-with-pseudoscience/ (ie, that *EVERYTHING* published in English is junk, and to be discarded out of hand), I intend to use http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2006/10/jama_deludes.html

00:05:25 assbot: How to deal with pseudoscience ? pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1CpB87s )

00:05:26 assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: What Political Propaganda Looks Like ... ( http://bit.ly/1CpB9s2 )

00:05:36 mircea_popescu: absolutely perfect example of the pseudoscientific nature of American "science".

00:05:59 asciilifeform: http://www.ada95.ch/index.php?page=morris << unrelated lulz

00:06:00 assbot: Ada95.ch - morris ... ( http://bit.ly/1CpBeMc )

00:07:27 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform minor nitpick : all these people that never ever head foreman'd a construction yard shjould stfu about "tools". the tools used to build a skyscraper are, by and large, cheaper, more worn versions of the expensive DIY crap.

00:07:52 mircea_popescu: exactly like how the rifles used to fight actual wars are nothing like the crazy-shit-stick-on-all-sides "amateur" rifles.

00:09:24 mircea_popescu: and unrelatedly, http://pretendyoure.xyz

00:09:44 mircea_popescu: shit it's dead.

00:10:25 mircea_popescu: "4. if you have the intellectual and physical capacity to single-handedly deal with your program, it's a toy " <<< sheeit alf, what nao ?

00:13:33 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [RENT] 145 @ 0.01199999 = 1.74 BTC [+]

00:20:24 BingoBoingo: punkman: if we replace openssl with libressl or whatever, how do we verify all the buggy data generated by 7 different openssl versions? << For the time being... empirically. There a set with six year's worth a data to test against by syncing.

00:25:46 mike_c: those qntra spikes are important though. 1% of the flash traffic sticks around and becomes regular reader

00:27:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17950 @ 0.00042605 = 7.6476 BTC [-]

00:29:21 mircea_popescu: but the spikes are never 100x the averae traffic. usually 10-15x

00:29:29 mircea_popescu: so using your numbers... they're actually unimportant.

00:31:28 mircea_popescu: in other news, firefox spontaneously combusts unattended on a 4 day old system. and they call this software.

00:32:17 BingoBoingo: !up whaack

00:32:18 mike_c: RENT just passed one year

00:32:33 BingoBoingo: whaack> can i have an up! por favor << He said please

00:32:45 whaack: i did indeed

00:33:02 mike_c: ben_vulpes: RENT is on big bull run

00:36:25 mircea_popescu: !t h rent

00:36:26 assbot: [HAVELOCK:RENT] 1D: 0.00935000 / 0.01054944 / 0.01200000 (2246 shares, 23.69404349 BTC), 7D: 0.00851001 / 0.01030218 / 0.01200000 (2730 shares, 28.12494993 BTC), 30D: 0.00505000 / 0.00827112 / 0.01200000 (7238 shares, 59.86634509 BTC)

00:36:53 mircea_popescu: what was it back around 700 usd/ btc ? like 3 ish ?

00:36:56 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2985 @ 0.00075004 = 2.2389 BTC [-] {7}

00:37:15 mike_c: floated around 0045 for a long time

00:37:21 whaack: how / where can I find more bitcoin stock markets like MPex?

00:37:38 mike_c: nowhere

00:37:45 whaack: no smaller ones?

00:39:00 BingoBoingo: not if you are comparing like things

00:40:24 mike_c: try this one: https://btct.co/

00:40:26 assbot: BTC-TC: BTC Trading Corp ... ( http://bit.ly/1DpWm6H )

00:41:20 kakobrekla: > They were called Virtual Currencies, now many prefer to call them Digital Currency or Crypto Currency.

00:41:21 kakobrekla: lol

00:41:50 kakobrekla: helluva argument

00:42:53 mike_c: "The site broke new ground for security in the space, integrating Yubikey and Google Authenticator"

00:43:09 whaack: lmfao

00:43:53 mike_c: !gettrust assbot burnside

00:43:53 assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user burnside: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 2 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/assbot/burnside | http://w.b-a.link/user/burnside

00:44:51 kakobrekla: whaack https://bitfunder.com < also still up

00:44:52 assbot: BitFunder.Com - Join the crowd, every BIT helps! ... ( http://bit.ly/1yz3Fm9 )

00:46:00 mircea_popescu: and of course once that crashes it brings down the networking stack, which on ubuntu can NOT actually be restarted, mostly because it fucks up dbus and everything else.

00:46:27 mircea_popescu: in other words : i have nfi why we care so much about systemd, in fact linux has been fucked over for years now, by completely unrelated crapolade like ubunbtu.

00:47:25 whaack: how many people in here have read the bitcoin core code? would anyone here consider to know it well?

00:47:27 mircea_popescu: !isup glbse.com

00:48:39 BingoBoingo: whaack: I had to chop mine up these past few days. It's C++ you search the text and nuke shit that you dun like.

00:50:25 mircea_popescu: whaack do yourselv a favour and read the logs for an actual result, rather than !imperative all over the place and a) not get anything except for b) marking yourself for termination.

00:50:43 BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> in other words : i have nfi why we care so much about systemd, in fact linux has been fucked over for years now, by completely unrelated crapolade like ubunbtu. << It's a twin story. Pain and Dis-Able

00:51:14 mircea_popescu: there still is no substitute for homework. "socializing" not only fails to substitute, but actually has serious counterindications.

00:51:24 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo heh i guess itis.

00:52:21 whaack: fair enough

00:54:55 BingoBoingo: Dis-Able was first born. Disable spend many years in the shadows ruining sound and making daemon no one wanted. Pain came into the world with a bang out of Africa, promised ease at the cost of nothing working as expectabru. Two years ago they each decided to play the other's part and now systemd is loud while ubuntu silent becomes the quiet daemon that breaks apps in the background.

00:55:42 mircea_popescu: you should go into impressionism, this is chilling.

00:57:08 mircea_popescu: http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2006/10/how_to_get_rich_in_psychiatry.html << there's little quite as endearing as the misty excitement of a noob stockpicker.

00:57:09 assbot: The Last Psychiatrist: How To Get Rich In Psychiatry (update on stocks) ... ( http://bit.ly/1DpY4oC )

01:10:57 BingoBoingo: n00b stockpicker me from freshman year of college really should have held those Sun shares through to the buyout instead of playing the hi-lo game

01:11:36 mircea_popescu: nene

01:12:19 BingoBoingo: I bought at $3.80-ish Oracle bought at $16 ish

01:12:40 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ...sheeit alf, what nao << not my fault if the poor sod contracted 'brainwater' and can't hold systems in his head

01:13:09 mircea_popescu: lol

01:13:48 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: brings down the networking stack... fucks up dbus and everything else... nfi why we care so much about systemd, in fact linux has been fucked over for years now << you will find that the ubuntu 'stack' that can 'go down' consists almost wholly of poetteringisms

01:14:15 asciilifeform: 'dbus' is unofficially but quite thoroughly a poetteringism, for instance

01:14:55 asciilifeform: other observation is that 'ubuntu' (with the above atrocities and many others) is no more 'linux' than wintel 'is what a computer is'

01:15:32 mircea_popescu: which is why i said.

01:15:59 mircea_popescu: it's like syphilis patient getting really excited about a phase 3 lesion on his nose.

01:16:12 mircea_popescu: dude... srsly missed the boat on that whole health thing.

01:16:27 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what possessed you to set up the experiment described earlier?

01:16:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7523 @ 0.00042605 = 3.2052 BTC [-]

01:16:36 mircea_popescu: not my machine.

01:16:43 mircea_popescu: "hey mp, wtf happened to my laptop ?"

01:17:06 mircea_popescu: what am i going to do now, corner time on knees ?

01:18:15 mircea_popescu: not about to do that. girl's 19, and more importantly ITS REALLY NOT HER GOD DAMNED FAULT.

01:36:37 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: gurl enlisted with ubuntu machine? or forcibly deloused of winblows upon induction ?

01:36:52 mircea_popescu: latter.

01:36:59 asciilifeform: aha, guessed as much.

01:37:03 mircea_popescu: not precisely inducted either. it's a process.

01:39:05 mircea_popescu: - - [13/Feb/2015:17:04:50 -0500] "GET /2013/what-is-art/%22%7C%22--%22%7C%22--%22%7C%22--%22%7C%22--%22%7C%22--%22 HTTP/1.1" 404 28932 "http://fraudsters.com/2013/what-is-art/\"|\"--\"|\"--\"|\"--\"|\"--\"|\"--\"" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1; .NET CLR 2.0.50727)"

01:39:23 mircea_popescu: for my curiosity, what is this supposed to even be ? like a sql injection ?

01:44:49 BingoBoingo: That would be my guess

01:47:16 mircea_popescu: and what, "enough" similar magic units to "do the job" ? looks like people try to hack like psychs try to medicate.

01:47:31 mircea_popescu: "hey, --\" didn't do anything on it's own, but what if you add another ?!?!

01:50:28 BingoBoingo: Could also be they might have been trying to trigger a resource intensive search?

01:52:38 mircea_popescu: mebbe i guess.

01:52:43 mircea_popescu: http://31.media.tumblr.com/7be0f7b7783c8a86fc50a08c5cf2ca70/tumblr_ne2ak2Mm1u1tatbbfo1_400.gif

01:52:46 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yzgzRi )

01:53:15 BingoBoingo: I'm just watching the blocks sync and thinking to the history I and verifying as it passed. Solidly in the S.Dice era nao

01:53:25 mircea_popescu: it's fascinating innit!

01:54:23 BingoBoingo: It's soothing.

01:55:50 BingoBoingo: After smashing my head these past few days through the painful part of the learing process... The software is now working for me instead of I for it.

01:55:50 mircea_popescu: "A similar example is the often cited myth that diagnosis of bipolar disorder is frequently missed. A survey found that 69% of patients were actually misdiagnosed, most often as having regular depression. An average of 4 physicians were consulted ?prior to receiving the correct diagnosis.? But who is to say what is the correct diagnosis, when the diagnosis is based on vague and overlapping descriptions (and not

01:55:51 mircea_popescu: on objective pathology?) You can look at this the other way, and say only 1 out of 5 psychiatrists felt it was bipolar disorder, while the other 80% thought it was depression. So it pays to have the last word. Bipolar disorder is ?frequently missed? not because it exists and doctors miss it, but because it is defined in a way which allows it, by 80% of doctors, to be legitimately called something else. The onl

01:55:51 mircea_popescu: y way to say the diagnosis was correct or incorrect, in the absence of objective pathology, is to say that the treatment they received for ?bipolar disorder? from the fifth doctor was better (read: safer or more efficacious) than the treatment they received from the first four. This is not evident. "

01:55:55 mircea_popescu: fucking gold, this.

01:56:42 mircea_popescu: this, incidentally, is EXACTLY the mechanism through which "80% of rapes are unreported".

01:57:08 mircea_popescu: out of five women that weren't raped, only one runs into idiots spouting insane troll logic that convinces her she retroactively was.

01:58:22 BingoBoingo: Re: bipolar - no one complains about feeling manic until the police get involved. Plenty of people spend lots of money of coffee and bolivian marching poweder trying to come close.

01:58:38 asciilifeform: ^

01:58:55 mircea_popescu: which, by proxy, is in point of fact a measure of the social influence / discoursive relevance of the insane trolls in question, and so yes it is a legitimate measure for them to target.

01:59:03 asciilifeform: just like it's not priapism till the fun is over and gangrene starts

01:59:22 mircea_popescu: but this from a machiavellian "how do we become more powerful" troll logic perspective, and spcifically not from a "helping raped women" or "helpiong women" perspective.

02:00:35 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo actually in functional family arrangements manic episodes are usually the modern parlance equivalent of what used to be "senile aggitation", ie, granpa keeps grabbing jane's ass.

02:00:38 mircea_popescu: -> thorazine.

02:01:41 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i think BingoBoingo was referring to the american usage - artist (or compulsive bathroom cleaner, see the old 'meth' thread) who stays awake for two weeks straight on 'manic episode' etc

02:01:54 BingoBoingo: ^ That definition

02:01:58 mircea_popescu: oh

02:02:09 asciilifeform: except he is didn't need to take the dope

02:02:12 BingoBoingo: American clinical definition

02:02:14 mircea_popescu: that's not what mania is, clinically, is it ?!

02:02:22 mircea_popescu: jesus that place is nuts.

02:02:33 asciilifeform: iirc dsm4,5 - yes

02:03:20 mircea_popescu: if anyone told engel that they can have manic episodes lasting over 24 hours now he'd have caned them.

02:03:28 BingoBoingo: dsm 3,4,5

02:03:34 BingoBoingo: probably earlier

02:03:50 mircea_popescu: (the psych, not the anarchist)

02:05:14 BingoBoingo: What can I say, the brokeness of English systemically effect domains people purport to be actual

02:06:16 BingoBoingo: 208378, took much of the off because I wasn't there to restart it while sleeping.

02:06:32 asciilifeform: what is BingoBoingo running, again ?

02:06:35 mircea_popescu: i think if i close my eyes and push on them really really hard i can almost sorta see the logic of this transformation.

02:06:46 *: asciilifeform was off in meatspace with people, missed quite a bit

02:06:49 mircea_popescu: it's brainwater.

02:07:39 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: 0.7.2 -qt on OpenBSD with some patches applied as they can be (i.e. scrolling reading and fingers rather than patch utility)

02:07:59 asciilifeform: neato

02:08:01 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Executable was finally birthed this morning

02:08:04 asciilifeform: but why 0.7.2 ?

02:08:59 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: To see if it can be done. And what is the latest that still takes more of the sane patches. (entire leveldb series is out because making that build would be too much hell)

02:09:38 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: that probably is the latest, yes.

02:09:39 BingoBoingo: -qt just so there's more flags and libs to play with to plumb te differences between the platforms

02:09:42 asciilifeform: unrelated,

02:10:06 asciilifeform: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/13233 << picture the sex applications of this suddenly inexpensive trabambourghini

02:10:10 assbot: FLiR Dev Kit - KIT-13233 - SparkFun Electronics ... ( http://bit.ly/1yzjSI2 )

02:11:30 asciilifeform: ^ microbolometer. http://www.pureengineering.com/projects/lepton << original vendor

02:11:31 assbot: Lepton - PureEngineering ... ( http://bit.ly/1yzk8GV )

02:11:43 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Build did not require the OSsuX ifdefs, but had to kill one linux ifdef and switch a boost lib called for another.

02:12:00 BingoBoingo: Beast utilizes both CPU cores

02:17:18 BingoBoingo: So far all crashes have come from malloc enforcing limits on its memory usage (512 MB by default) now giving it a go with moar ram.

02:17:41 asciilifeform: ^ wai wat, BingoBoingo has a custom malloc() replacement ?

02:18:15 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: No OpenBSD has this stuff built in. Changing process Ram limits happens in login.conf

02:18:23 BingoBoingo: I just changed a line

02:18:25 asciilifeform: ah ordinary quota.

02:18:58 BingoBoingo: I dunno why I've been keeping the BSD stuff to toy and appliance uses for so long.

02:19:16 *: asciilifeform had a freebsd desktop for many years

02:19:23 BingoBoingo: Next to social engineering inertia has to be the second biggest threat out there.

02:20:39 BingoBoingo: I'm loving everything off by default and useful manpages.

02:21:21 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: everything off by default << not quite true. try building 'xorg' followed by 'emacs' and see end up with dbus, other horrors

02:21:42 asciilifeform: ^ assuming this was a recent openbsd

02:22:08 BingoBoingo: 5.6

02:22:21 asciilifeform: ^ was the one where i observed this

02:22:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10900 @ 0.00042639 = 4.6477 BTC [+]

02:23:00 BingoBoingo: I'm leting DBUS live for now, doesn't seem to do much other than die a lot

02:24:46 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it lets in various 'fun' like letting everything running on machine send arbitrary commands to virtually any gtk app (e.g., 'xchat')

02:24:47 BingoBoingo: From what I understand commercial shop Mtier which does a lot of their ports does "OpenBSD with Gnome and support contracts" as golden toilet product.

02:24:58 BingoBoingo: Ah

02:26:19 BingoBoingo: !up rucoi

02:26:37 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I am liking though that the xserver is not running as root

02:34:49 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the sex applications of this suddenly inexpensive >> uh what, predict ovulation ?

02:35:00 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: target selector ?

02:35:04 mircea_popescu: hm ?

02:35:36 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-04-2014#634660 << related

02:35:36 assbot: Logged on 22-04-2014 12:51:23; asciilifeform: phun phact: as a student, i once seriously planned to build a pocket gas chromatographer, to pick up gurlz. how!? to do this - exercise for alert reader.

02:36:10 mircea_popescu: ...

02:37:03 *: asciilifeform is out of his depth, does not know if wunderwaffen based on arousal monitoring via far ir thermovisor is a plausible thing

02:37:29 mircea_popescu: well... in the sense bitcoind debugging via cpu ekg is a viable strategy.

02:37:43 asciilifeform: presumably would be used for selection narrowing in target-rich environment

02:38:18 mircea_popescu: if you think you can beat the primate brain with your electonic contraptions i have a rule based expert system to sell you.

02:39:01 mircea_popescu: you'll probably do pretty ok picking up the ecstasy-peaking chicks in a rave, i'll grant you that.

02:39:14 mircea_popescu: whether they hear anything you're saying or not tho is up for debate.

02:39:32 asciilifeform: this'd be more of a prosthetic version of some folks' ability to 'read body signs' of arousal/lack thereof

02:39:36 asciilifeform: at short (sword) range

02:40:04 mircea_popescu: temperature is a very poor variable tho. you'll just end up with a lot of flu.

02:40:10 asciilifeform: not of whole body!

02:40:20 asciilifeform: nobody needs that

02:40:25 mircea_popescu: candida infections.

02:40:26 asciilifeform: (except ebola scanner)

02:40:37 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: actually - precedent

02:40:54 asciilifeform: for a short time in 1980s, liquid crystal thermo-indicator shirts were fashionable in usa

02:40:56 asciilifeform: even pants

02:41:00 asciilifeform: but were phased out, guess why

02:41:09 asciilifeform: (and it had nothing to do with infections)

02:41:09 mircea_popescu: they didn't work ?

02:41:19 asciilifeform: nope, precisely the fact that -did- work..

02:42:14 mircea_popescu: i dunno, leuco jewelry was more or less popular in ro, ever since the 80s

02:42:31 mircea_popescu: it remains in use by basically the same demo : slightly insecure 16 yo chicks that'll go into psychology.

02:43:46 mircea_popescu: maybe you're right and the deep reason is that it gives away more than peoplewant to.

02:43:55 asciilifeform: http://www.blogadilla.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/hypercolor-products.jpg

02:43:57 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/173Xwbq )

02:44:22 mircea_popescu: lol. the sign of a healthy nubile female.

02:44:24 asciilifeform: ^ took surprisingly long to dredge up

02:44:28 mircea_popescu: her cunt's always warm

02:44:41 asciilifeform: always warm << one would presumably be looking for the deltas.

02:44:46 asciilifeform: rather than absolute value

02:45:22 []bot: Bet placed: 1.05761 BTC for No on "Bitcoin to drop under $100 before April" http://bitbet.us/bet/1108/ Odds: 14(Y):86(N) by coin, 16(Y):84(N) by weight. Total bet: 13.93457636 BTC. Current weight: 55,392.

02:45:26 asciilifeform: now, mircea_popescu does not need this instrument, eagle does not need a glider

02:45:32 asciilifeform: but some folks might find a use.

02:45:39 mircea_popescu: well, so who does ? the snail ?

02:45:52 mircea_popescu: snail with glider just set itserlf up for trauimatic failure.

02:46:09 asciilifeform: 'if man was meant to fly... given wings' - ?

02:46:33 mircea_popescu: not exactly, more like, "if god had meant me to gamble 10k dollars in this casino, he'd have given me 10k dollars"

02:47:13 asciilifeform: lol

02:47:34 mircea_popescu: let's indulge this fiction for the sake of potential literature. so you pick a target this way, and somehow it works out and now it's morning and she's in bed.

02:47:47 mircea_popescu: do you skip to where the machine got abandoned and read her again ?

02:48:03 BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> not exactly, more like, "if god had meant me to gamble 10k dollars in this casino, he'd have given me 10k dollars" << Nah, he'd just make the credit officer in the cage a bit wet on the brain

02:48:05 mircea_popescu: if you end up in a divorce ten years later, do you take the machine to court ?

02:48:14 asciilifeform: actually i suspect that the fun would stop very soon after strapping on (presumably it would have to be worn at waist level! disguised as a fly button?!)

02:48:30 mircea_popescu: see, this is setting yourself up for failure.

02:48:34 asciilifeform: walk into $targetrichenvironment and discover soon - no targets

02:48:37 mircea_popescu: if i had this machinery, you know how i'd use it ?

02:48:41 mircea_popescu: ID SHOW IT TO THE WOMAN

02:48:41 asciilifeform: not for $user at least

02:48:58 mircea_popescu: why the fuck disguise it. the mentality that cunt's the enemy is principally what keeps geeks in an onansitic state.

02:49:33 asciilifeform: SHOW IT TO THE WOMAN << lol, mircea_popescu must have spoken with asciilifeform's $pet re: how they met

02:49:36 mircea_popescu: you go like, "Hey, guess why I'm talking to you ?"

02:49:42 mircea_popescu: lol ?

02:49:54 mircea_popescu: <mircea_popescu> let's indulge this fiction for the sake of potential literature. << I PREDICTED!

02:49:56 mircea_popescu: now let's hear it.

02:50:19 *: asciilifeform did not actually carry out this experiment! but was setting up for a variation on the theme, and this got out in his social circle

02:52:00 *: asciilifeform suffers from a peculiarly obscene perversion: has a hard time taking an interest in gurlz detectably stupider than him

02:52:13 *: asciilifeform thus had many strange plans, as a young man, for how to narrow the set

02:52:58 mircea_popescu: this is insanity. you want a girl that can be smart, not a girl that can't be stupid, for some arbitrary levels of either. just like you seek a horse that can run quickly, not a horse that is never still.

02:53:07 asciilifeform: this is not an interesting story per se except in the form of advice to young folks like BingoBoingo - don't do it!

02:53:31 mircea_popescu: bb is young ?!

02:53:36 asciilifeform: iirc

02:53:45 BingoBoingo: 27 or 28 years young

02:53:58 BingoBoingo: Fuck 28

02:54:44 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: how to tell if horse can-run-quickly without seeing it run ?

02:54:55 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: yes, you can eliminate horse with missing leg

02:54:59 asciilifeform: or one that's been shot

02:55:10 BingoBoingo: https://imgur.com/cGqdtO3 << desktop atm

02:55:11 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1B99rSq )

02:55:13 asciilifeform: but doesn't tell whether can run. only that isn't out of the race yet.

02:55:42 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: ugh what is that

02:56:01 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: xfce, still cleansing/purging toolset

02:59:00 BingoBoingo: Background is Memorial Union at Mizzou, built in the days every public uni campus in USia was built in memorian falen soldiers of the franz fredinand police action against germany

03:16:35 thestringpuller: mod6: it stopped responding to get_info or at least it looks like it's hanging

03:33:35 thestringpuller: damn this shit grinds to a halt as the blocks get bigger.

03:33:46 asciilifeform: which 'this'

03:33:55 thestringpuller:

03:34:03 thestringpuller: with openssl 0.9something

03:34:15 thestringpuller: Bitcoin***

03:34:20 asciilifeform: classical or orphanage-burning ?

03:34:37 thestringpuller: i don't grok :(

03:34:59 asciilifeform: thestringpuller: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-January/000038.html

03:34:59 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Kfln4D )

03:35:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7375 @ 0.00042782 = 3.1552 BTC [+] {2}

03:38:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5625 @ 0.00043311 = 2.4362 BTC [+]

03:41:31 *: BingoBoingo not burning bastards, also has not come the slightest bit close to the old RAM limit since implementing new one.

03:43:08 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: its classic

03:43:38 thestringpuller: i used mod6 's script to do download/compilation

03:44:27 *: asciilifeform is not at all interested in running infinitely-memcancerous bitcoind nor can recommend it to others. but also cannot recommend the experimental patch.

03:44:54 *: asciilifeform will show the next attempt at a proper fix reasonably soon.

03:44:54 cazalla: incase scoopbot isn't working http://qntra.net/2015/02/excoin-exchange-to-shut-down-amid-claims-of-theft/

03:44:54 assbot: Excoin Exchange To Shut Down Amid Claims Of Theft | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyATYG )

03:47:20 asciilifeform: 'The altcoin exchange Excoin has announced that it will soon shut down after alleging that an attacker was able to withdraw all the bitcoins from the exchange. With a trading engine written in Go, Excoin launched what was predominantly a Blackcoin exchange...' << in other news, some animal stole the heap of shit a fox deposited in my yard.

03:47:51 asciilifeform: or wait, they had btc too ?

03:48:11 cazalla: along with some shitty altcoins

03:48:28 asciilifeform: '...featured a proof of reserve page which reassured members...' << how does a www page 'prove reserve' ?

03:48:31 asciilifeform: should we even ask.

03:48:42 cazalla: their claims, not mine!

03:48:55 asciilifeform: just astonishing that 2011 never ends

03:50:02 BingoBoingo: !up herbijudlestoids

03:50:40 Adlai: "We noticed the hot wallets dwindling but assuming it was members moving their funds off site during the DDOS, we loaded all the cold balances onto the site so that users would not have withdrawals interrupted during our periods of up time."

03:51:13 *: Adlai despairs of ever writing fiction... the truth beats anything he can dream up himself

03:51:19 mircea_popescu: oooo!

03:52:14 mircea_popescu: "Remember how in May, 2005, the American Psychiatric Association endorsed same sex marriage? And you applauded the moral fortitude and progressive instinct of this august body? Well, instead of debating whether there should or should not be same-sex marriage, perhaps we should ask what modern psychiatry could possibly contribute to this discussion. The answer is nothing.

03:52:14 mircea_popescu: You can't get away with pat answers, such as psychiatrists see the psychiatric ramifications of discrimination or being unable to marry. There are psychiatric ramifications of bankruptcy, and war, but no one felt compelled to write a policy statement on it (and thank God.)

03:52:14 mircea_popescu: And no, there isn't a difference between bankruptcy and gay marriage-- not to psychiatry. That's the point. These are social problems about which modern psychiatry is definitionally ignorant. The APA did not endorse polygamy. What's the difference? If homosexuality is not a psychiatric disorder, than there is no more reason to be more for or against it than there is for any other kind of marriage. The APA is no better

03:52:19 mircea_popescu: suited to answering these questions than, say, the NFL.

03:52:21 mircea_popescu: What if the NFL came out against antidepressants in children? This is a perfectly valid analogy, because neither the NFL nor psychiatry have special knowledge that make their statements anything more than opinions. What do psychiatrists know about same-sex marriage that the quarterback for the Patriots doesn?t? Don?t laugh?I?m serious. What?s the answer?

03:52:26 mircea_popescu: Medicine, or the APA, can legitimately express a policy only if the policy was grounded in science or logic. Perhaps the APA cares to release this intriguing scientific data? (While it is at it, perhaps it can also release the data supporting the use of half of the medications currently favored by APA Guidelines?) But this seems pretty much business as usual for the APA. Rather than work on its own serious failings,

03:52:31 mircea_popescu: it involves itself in social policy."

03:52:33 mircea_popescu: best.quote.ever.

03:52:41 mircea_popescu: this, incidentally, is why no us pseudoscientific body can be taken seriously to any purpose. especially not to the purpose it supposedly serves.

03:52:50 mircea_popescu: this includes the IETF as well as it includes the AMA.

03:54:46 mircea_popescu: can't be arsed to fix the thing, can be arsed to ban evade. very fucking smart.

03:56:02 BingoBoingo: bitcoin-qt is seriously just chilling now. was getting killed by malloc every half hour and now isn't even touching the line that killed it earlier.

03:56:35 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: sad thing is, idiots denied apa/ietf/international association of bloodletting & phlogiston - will reinvent them..

03:57:20 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the "trading" fo shitty altcoins for inexisting bitcoin is the most important part of the altcoin pumping scams.

03:57:38 mircea_popescu: wow herbijudlestoids in da house ?

03:58:09 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: You actually here?

03:58:23 BingoBoingo: I saw his join, but he's quiet if he's here

03:58:35 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not particularly sad. the point ios for us to know syphilitic whore is syphilitic, not for her to not get laid anymore.

03:58:45 mircea_popescu: this isn't about "every fuckhead's precious"

03:59:36 mircea_popescu: this is about me going "gtfo" to tim swanson while he derps about how "normal debates work".

03:59:43 herbijudlestoids: im here

03:59:45 herbijudlestoids: huelolelo

03:59:45 asciilifeform: thought this was about annihilated scientific fields

03:59:49 asciilifeform: or stillborn ones

04:00:12 mircea_popescu: hey

04:00:19 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform yes, but in the wot, not in the world.

04:00:24 mircea_popescu: the world can rot.

04:00:39 herbijudlestoids: hows everyone

04:01:03 mircea_popescu: great.

04:01:06 herbijudlestoids: i came to check yall behaving

04:01:21 mircea_popescu: did your burn rate finally catch up with the funding ?

04:01:32 herbijudlestoids: nope, we are doin really well

04:01:38 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: It's been how long now, a year almost since your last visit?

04:01:41 herbijudlestoids: and, not funding :), actual paying customers

04:01:49 mircea_popescu: o.O impossibri

04:01:54 asciilifeform: what does herbijudlestoids sell, again?

04:01:58 herbijudlestoids: clouds

04:02:15 asciilifeform: ?

04:02:23 herbijudlestoids: openstack based IaaS clouds

04:02:27 asciilifeform: aha timesharing

04:02:30 herbijudlestoids: ye

04:02:32 BingoBoingo: !b 3

04:02:33 assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0F1P1B4.txt )

04:03:21 herbijudlestoids: we doin good

04:03:25 herbijudlestoids: its very stressful

04:03:36 herbijudlestoids: i work a lot :(

04:03:40 mircea_popescu: i don't get it, there's literally an ocean of providers of this stuff.

04:03:52 mircea_popescu: you telling me you can actually eke a living in such a market ?

04:03:55 decimation: digital ocean?

04:04:02 herbijudlestoids: yup, we offer expertise for big providers

04:04:03 mircea_popescu: decimation on top of that lol

04:04:08 herbijudlestoids: we dont compete in the race to bottom

04:04:21 herbijudlestoids: so there is no herbicloud

04:04:28 mircea_popescu: this is a noble goal, but a little like pron studios claiming the same.

04:04:30 mircea_popescu: not up to you.

04:04:32 decimation: asciilifeform: did you see my link about continued sparc production

04:04:34 Namworld: Damn, I need to use gpg to log in here now? Gribble not enough anymore?

04:04:43 mircea_popescu: Namworld assbot forket wot.

04:04:46 herbijudlestoids: the big providers pay us lots of money to make their clouds gud

04:04:52 mircea_popescu: it's a much better implementation anyway

04:04:53 asciilifeform: decimation: 7000 sold/yr is not 'continued production' on the planet i live in

04:04:54 herbijudlestoids: because, it seems, most people not good at it

04:05:03 asciilifeform: decimation: it's inventory liquidation

04:05:05 decimation: asciilifeform: aye, it's highly amusing

04:05:10 herbijudlestoids: turns out large scale distributed systems are hard

04:05:10 mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids that part i can see. so more like ops consulting for iaas ppl ?

04:05:12 decimation: no, they claim to still be doing r&d

04:05:26 decimation: apparently they have some chip with 16 cores at 8 'threads' each

04:05:26 asciilifeform: decimation: they can claim whatever they like

04:05:29 herbijudlestoids: mircea_popescu: yeah. but we also develop IP as we go around that ops stuff

04:05:36 mircea_popescu: aha.

04:05:39 herbijudlestoids: deployment tools, config mgmt, automated service discovery etc

04:05:50 asciilifeform: decimation: calculate what each unit would have to cost, approximately, for the vendor to stand any chance of breaking even

04:05:54 herbijudlestoids: we r pretty gud

04:06:02 mircea_popescu: yeah, so what's the plan, sell to microshit for 100mn in a year or two once they decide to beef up that biz ?

04:06:03 decimation: asciilifeform: yeah and then compare to similar pile of arm chips

04:06:10 herbijudlestoids: im in charge of ops, but my counterpart is in charge of the dev stuff

04:06:42 herbijudlestoids: actually, in one sense it is *TOO* big, and i got tired of working on it all day, so for hobby i now admin my own freebsd server with jails

04:06:46 herbijudlestoids: just like the gud old days

04:06:49 decimation: asciilifeform: the only possibility is that usg is buying vanity products

04:07:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17641 @ 0.00042605 = 7.5159 BTC [-]

04:07:27 asciilifeform: decimation: there was a scandal that broke not long ago, where it came out that usg is single-handedly keeping a number of fabs (mostly rad-hard stuff) in business

04:07:44 asciilifeform: decimation: their competitors are now whining, 'we want too!111!!!11'

04:07:48 decimation: that's actually suspiciously smart

04:07:51 decimation: of course they are

04:07:52 BingoBoingo: <Namworld> Damn, I need to use gpg to log in here now? Gribble not enough anymore? << Gribble was down too long and nanotube's vacation was long enough for people to worry about abduction

04:08:18 decimation: the problem with keeping things alive on bezzlars is that there's always a runt who will squeal if not on the tit

04:08:23 asciilifeform: decimation: you can probably guess that they didn't do it because 'smart', but because eternal contracts signed, likely, five or six presidents ago

04:08:25 Namworld: okay

04:08:44 decimation: asciilifeform: well, some elder thought it was smart

04:09:10 mircea_popescu: Namworld http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot

04:09:11 assbot: irc_bots:assbot [bitcoin assets wiki] ... ( http://bit.ly/1BqStij )

04:09:11 herbijudlestoids: so.

04:09:15 herbijudlestoids: tell me guise.

04:09:20 asciilifeform: phun phact: radhard ic is quite arguably obsolete - similar effect can be had using tandems

04:09:20 herbijudlestoids: wut happen?

04:09:24 asciilifeform: but this is a hatephact

04:09:34 BingoBoingo: Also with lead box

04:09:46 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: who pays for launching the lead ?

04:09:57 decimation: asciilifeform: well, there are loads of silly-con valley satellite 'startups' that are launching plain arm chips into leo

04:10:09 mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids tons of things. qntra.net took over the business of bitcoin news. gavin has been shot in the head, foundation's over, bitcoin "development" past 0.5.x is being considered for deletion

04:10:14 herbijudlestoids: TFW the USD spazzes out and causes bitcoin to drop from >1000 to <150

04:10:18 asciilifeform: decimation: difference is that those ^ don't actually need to work

04:10:23 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Toilet pays. If volume and not weight is the concern though Osmium box.

04:10:24 decimation: but leo is child's play compared to van allen belts & beyond

04:10:26 asciilifeform: decimation: the orbital nukes - do.

04:10:32 decimation: asciilifeform: aye

04:10:58 herbijudlestoids: yea i did read some rants from you on fraudsters about that mircea_popescu

04:11:12 herbijudlestoids: i dunno what qntra is

04:11:24 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: If you want to play around with the foundation's builds on FreeBSD they'd probably welcome it

04:11:25 mircea_popescu: http://qntra.net/2015/02/there-is-nothing-new-in-the-world-except-for-the-history-you-didnt-know/

04:11:26 assbot: There is nothing new in the world. Except for the history you didn't know. | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyFWIv )

04:12:01 herbijudlestoids: BingoBoingo: how stupid large is the blockchain right now? a billion gigabytes?

04:12:13 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: In the 30GB's

04:12:26 decimation: asciilifeform: it kind of surprised me that usg allowed ibm to sell their fab actually

04:12:43 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: You have jails you can build variations and see if they sync

04:12:50 asciilifeform: decimation: hence you can infer - real owner has not changed.

04:12:55 asciilifeform: decimation: could not change.

04:13:02 decimation: aye

04:13:28 herbijudlestoids: yeah, being QA for the bitcoin foundation sounds fun...

04:13:33 *: herbijudlestoids gets right on that :/

04:13:38 mircea_popescu: decimation if you review the us foreign policy, it can't escape your notice that the us is playing exactly the role of one of the classical woman in love : will pretend like she's a priss to all comers, except there's one she will literally eat the shit from.

04:13:51 decimation: I'm sure that there were 'conditions' on the 'sale' (what do you call it when you give money to someone in exchange for impoverishing you?

04:13:55 mircea_popescu: his name's china, and the us can't even mention what he asks of her. let alone consider what to say.

04:13:57 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: http://thebitcoin.foundation/ ben_vulpes and mod6 run the thing

04:13:58 assbot: ..::[ The Bitcoin Foundation ]::.. ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyGpur )

04:14:23 herbijudlestoids: oh, is this the fork foundation?

04:14:30 BingoBoingo: Yeah

04:14:32 mircea_popescu: no, this is the nonfork foundation.

04:14:32 herbijudlestoids: confusing

04:14:38 asciilifeform: herbijudlestoids: this is the actual foundation

04:14:43 mircea_popescu: there's also a scam foundation, but w/e.

04:14:44 herbijudlestoids: lol right in -assets land

04:14:46 herbijudlestoids: yeah

04:14:48 asciilifeform: herbijudlestoids: there is also a phoundation pushing crock'o'shit

04:14:48 asciilifeform: aha

04:14:52 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu inb4

04:14:56 mircea_popescu: lol

04:15:08 decimation: mircea_popescu: perhaps usg is desperate for china to become big enough so that usg can surrender to it

04:15:09 mircea_popescu: but i mean this quite literally. scam foundation tried to push a bitcoin fork.

04:15:11 mircea_popescu: which attempt failed.

04:15:26 thestringpuller: they are still pushing that fork on some level

04:15:35 BingoBoingo: herbijudlestoids: I dare you to try a makefile for 0.9.3 on FreeBSD that doesn't lean on the linux emulation layer

04:15:39 thestringpuller: trying to push upgrades

04:15:51 mircea_popescu: decimation i think it's just perverse masochism. self hating liberal white people finally found an empire of nationalistic chinese froggies that despise foreigners.

04:15:54 mircea_popescu: match made in heaven.

04:16:02 asciilifeform: herbijudlestoids: the basic idea, if i dare suggest that there is one, is a pedigreed 0.5.3 and a sequence of man-readable patches, signed by folks known to one another.

04:16:26 herbijudlestoids: 0.5.3 being the last version that -assets finds acceptable?

04:16:33 decimation: mircea_popescu: maybe if we give them everything they will accept our love?

04:16:40 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: imho time spent on 0.9.x other than mining for zoological data (mutilations, fixes) is wasted

04:16:43 mircea_popescu: i think it was more like the first. 6.something prolly.

04:17:12 mircea_popescu: decimation that'd be cvounterproductive. more like, give everything, maybe then they'll finally take out the whip.

04:17:18 herbijudlestoids: hey you guys know i had an idea

04:17:23 herbijudlestoids: for a quick-and-dirty-cardano

04:17:28 herbijudlestoids: or whatever that thing was called

04:17:31 asciilifeform: a brick on a rope.

04:17:32 BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> BingoBoingo: imho time spent on 0.9.x other than mining for zoological data (mutilations, fixes) is wasted << Indeed shit just doesn't work there as pete_dush discovered

04:17:33 asciilifeform: very quick

04:17:40 asciilifeform: dirty if you drag it on the ground first

04:17:53 asciilifeform: we already had herbijudlestoids's idea, see.

04:18:00 mircea_popescu: lolwut

04:18:01 herbijudlestoids: odroid + touchscreen + linux + seahorse

04:18:13 asciilifeform: how about a vax and a vt100.

04:18:16 asciilifeform: why even.

04:18:23 *: asciilifeform head-desks

04:18:23 herbijudlestoids: the benefit of this is that you can encrypt messages too

04:18:34 mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids there's tons of quick and dirty cardanos out there already.

04:18:39 mircea_popescu: the point of this place is cleanliness.

04:18:47 BingoBoingo: Can encrypt from anything. Decrypt and signing are the hard problems

04:19:12 decimation: asciilifeform: it would be amusing if someone were to make an electro-mechanical RSA machine

04:19:22 decimation: like the enigma & "tunny" machines

04:19:24 asciilifeform: decimation: laugh, but i actually considered this.

04:19:38 asciilifeform: decimation: also considered the nearly equally impractical ttl logic variant.

04:19:40 herbijudlestoids: i mean, this device, it can handle decrypt/sign in the same way as cardano, but also add the ability for the user to write and encrypt a message with their key using the touchscreen

04:19:43 decimation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz_cipher < tunny

04:19:45 assbot: Lorenz cipher - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsI9iE )

04:19:47 herbijudlestoids: nvm :)

04:20:07 BingoBoingo: Encrypt merely requires pub key.

04:20:19 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform if nubbins` weren't such a noob, he'd have laser etched a mechanical rsa by now

04:20:23 BingoBoingo: Encrypt from dirty machine and burn it until cleansed

04:20:24 decimation: yeah it would be very difficult to implement without some kind of state machine

04:20:32 asciilifeform: decimation: vernam (otp, xor) is trivial - mechanically or otherwise

04:20:43 asciilifeform: !up herbijudlestoids

04:20:47 herbijudlestoids: lol :(

04:20:57 herbijudlestoids: assbot hate me

04:21:00 decimation: asciilifeform: aye, that would have its uses too

04:21:13 herbijudlestoids: the thing that worries me about the cardano is upgrades

04:21:21 herbijudlestoids: what if i want to patch it

04:21:22 *: asciilifeform wishes he had a bitcent for every 'here's how you can make a quick cardano' letter

04:21:24 herbijudlestoids: or whatever

04:21:27 decimation: why on earth would it need to be upgraded?

04:21:44 asciilifeform: herbijudlestoids: what if you want to patch your hypothalamus ?

04:21:51 herbijudlestoids: to add support for new ciphers or something? i dunno

04:22:16 mircea_popescu: you don't patch it, you burn it and get a new one.

04:22:20 herbijudlestoids: if its software based i could theoretically use the same device to interact with other encryption toolsets like nacl or whatever

04:22:21 asciilifeform: ^

04:22:21 decimation: re: china > https://tiananmenstremendousachievements.wordpress.com/2014/05/02/china-destroyed-control-chip-of-japanese-spy-satellite-with-secret-weapon/ < lulzy translated chinese military propaganda blog

04:22:23 assbot: China Destroyed Control Chip of Japanese Spy Satellite with Secret Weapon | Tiananmen's Tremendous Achievements ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyHSAS )

04:22:26 asciilifeform: burn, new

04:22:56 asciilifeform: herbijudlestoids: if 'software-based' is what you want, i don't get it, you already own a computer ?

04:23:08 asciilifeform: why even interested in the subject then

04:23:22 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> herbijudlestoids: what if you want to patch your hypothalamus ? << Don't remember if I did this or not.

04:23:32 herbijudlestoids: i want it to be software based, but handheld battery powered, airgapped, single function, etc

04:23:39 mircea_popescu: so buy a laptop

04:23:56 asciilifeform: laptop, palmtop (can get ms-dos!) etc

04:24:22 herbijudlestoids: yeah, im just proposing exactly that except with smaller formfactor hardware and a GUI shell that just runs seahorse or whatever

04:24:27 mircea_popescu: 10 yo laptops are basically the value of the rare metals in them. 20 bux.

04:24:37 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-12-2013#415970

04:24:37 assbot: Logged on 10-12-2013 19:28:23; asciilifeform: what you're probably thinking of (or what you will think of, if you think long enough) is: secure terminal. complete with keyboard and display.

04:24:49 herbijudlestoids: or you could buy a brand new odroid for $35

04:25:04 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform> laptop, palmtop (can get ms-dos!) etc << Sharp Zarus

04:25:05 mircea_popescu: or that.

04:25:43 asciilifeform: ^ no proper rng in any of the machines discussed here

04:25:44 mircea_popescu: if you can trust their closed stack turd.

04:25:48 asciilifeform: and ^

04:26:15 asciilifeform: decimation: let's play with the satellite thing

04:26:20 decimation: herbijudlestoids: if you read the logs, you discover several explanations for why what you desire doesn't exist

04:26:33 asciilifeform: decimation: service ceiling of the j20 is, according strictly to rumour, 18km.

04:26:34 herbijudlestoids: well, some of the odroids i know have a hw RNG, but i dont know how adequate it is

04:26:46 asciilifeform: decimation: let's assume that the thing was flying at the ceiling

04:27:29 asciilifeform: let's also assume that the sat was in leo.

04:27:42 decimation: yeah those seem reasonable

04:27:43 asciilifeform: say, 160km.

04:28:05 decimation: that's pretty low, but okay

04:28:09 mircea_popescu: that was a lengthy intro for "let delta = 150km"

04:28:10 asciilifeform: so, 142km between shooter and victim.

04:28:36 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: our usg readers may have some trouble with arithmetic, let's help'em

04:29:12 asciilifeform: next, inverse-square law...

04:29:39 decimation: well, I assumed that the 'electromagnetic pulse weapon Poacher One' was not mounted on the j-20 aircraft

04:30:02 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you mean, "the angular projection of a 10 metre target 150 km away" ?

04:30:16 asciilifeform: aha

04:31:09 *: BingoBoingo kinda wants a Mig-25

04:31:10 mircea_popescu: ;;calc 3600 / (150000**2*3.1415)

04:31:10 gribble: 5.09310838771e-08

04:31:17 mircea_popescu: half a millionth.

04:31:31 asciilifeform: decimation: true, i have no idea where it was (if existed)

04:31:41 asciilifeform: assumed - on account of article - on plane.

04:31:45 mircea_popescu: s/mil/bil/

04:32:09 decimation: asciilifeform: yeah that would seem silly

04:32:09 asciilifeform: decimation: why? because article claimed 'megawatt for minute'. if on ground, could carry on as long as you like at megawatt

04:32:24 decimation: yeah, I assumed the power would be lulzy for aircraft

04:32:25 asciilifeform: with mircea_popescu's genset trailer

04:32:32 mircea_popescu: a.... megawatt ? rly ?

04:32:43 asciilifeform: supercaps

04:32:46 mircea_popescu: gtfo, do you have ANY IDEA what the air looks like around your megawatt continuous laser ?

04:33:03 mircea_popescu: i can't be the only one that actually fired lasers.

04:33:26 asciilifeform: rayleigh scattering, yes.

04:33:39 asciilifeform: actually is the real limit to laser blaser.

04:33:41 asciilifeform: *blaster

04:33:44 mircea_popescu: how do the intended audience of these articles imagine stuff like plasma is made

04:34:37 mircea_popescu: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0b/Why_is_the_sky_blue.jpg

04:34:39 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyJuL1 )

04:34:40 mircea_popescu: splendid illustration btw

04:35:34 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=12-12-2014#951698 << obligatory. old emp thread

04:35:34 assbot: Logged on 12-12-2014 00:03:19; asciilifeform: chemically-powered emp bomb is one of those weapons that really fails basic physics, for almost any scenario, but the brass can't ever fall out of love with it

04:35:58 mircea_popescu: moreover, iuf you need 1mw to kill a sat chip you have serious mental issues.

04:36:12 mircea_popescu: there's a monty python sketch about missile hunting mosquitoes.

04:36:24 asciilifeform: satellites don't run away, either

04:36:25 *: BingoBoingo imagines bowling with a MIG 25

04:36:36 mircea_popescu: if this satellite is a ton of iron, a megawatt OVER A MINUTE will vaporize it.

04:36:47 asciilifeform: megawatt where.

04:36:48 mircea_popescu: it's 60mJ.

04:36:53 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform on it, supposdely.

04:36:56 asciilifeform: lol

04:37:05 decimation: nah if you want emp, you gotta nuke

04:37:06 asciilifeform: yes, it was thrown in a crucible, sure

04:37:31 BingoBoingo: Set up pins on a salt flat, attach 16lb ball to hardpoint. Fly and release

04:37:53 herbijudlestoids: haha!

04:37:55 herbijudlestoids: :D

04:38:04 BingoBoingo: !up herbijudlestoids

04:38:13 herbijudlestoids: hmm...

04:38:21 herbijudlestoids: i identified with gribble still no voice love

04:39:04 mircea_popescu: assbot. pm it !up

04:39:32 BingoBoingo: scoopbot -fetch

04:39:46 herbijudlestoids: ah.

04:40:08 mircea_popescu: in other news, http://33.media.tumblr.com/25c76cb8b51370dbf92cd1254513184d/tumblr_n54bvj7uDa1tt28juo1_500.gif

04:40:11 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyKv5z )

04:41:06 mod6: thestringpuller: did you get the error message I told you about in getinfo? [ http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-02-2015#1017438 ]

04:41:06 assbot: Logged on 13-02-2015 15:33:22; mod6: youll know that you've hit the bad tx when you see an error in getinfo like this: "errors" : "WARNING: Displayed transactions may not be correct! You may need to upgrade, or other nodes may need to upgrade."

04:41:21 decimation: asciilifeform: http://www.macrofab.net/ << supposedly will make dual layer board with ~50 parts for $57 in two weeks

04:41:21 assbot: MacroFab, Inc. ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyKI8N )

04:41:38 asciilifeform: decimation: qty = ?

04:41:44 decimation: 1

04:41:47 mod6: if so, then yes, you hit the bad tx, and then you need to upgrade to openssl 1.0.1g to pass over it.

04:41:58 asciilifeform: nre cost ?

04:41:59 decimation: but it's not clear if that's marketing spin or not, haven't tried

04:42:14 decimation: I guess it is rolled into the price of the whole thing

04:42:37 decimation: if you use their small selection of 'house parts' they do not charge a 'labor' fee

04:42:49 asciilifeform: ^ not terribly useful in my case

04:42:54 decimation: no, not really

04:43:03 decimation: I might give them a spin to see if they really exist

04:43:27 BingoBoingo: http://www.telegraphindia.com/1060502/asp/frontpage/story_6171245.asp

04:43:30 assbot: The Telegraph - Calcutta : Frontpage ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsKpGP )

04:45:36 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if you are fond of that machine, you can download the mig25 manuals stack...

04:45:47 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Have one somewhere

04:48:20 BingoBoingo: !up Vexual

04:49:57 decimation: asciilifeform: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3w_EWgGQuk < teardown and explanation of how lecroy 100 ghz oscopes work

04:49:58 assbot: Experiments and Teardown of the Teledyne LeCroy LabMaster 10-100zi 100GHz, 240GS/s Oscilloscope - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsL0bn )

04:50:27 asciilifeform: decimation: lol, that thing rejects any 'eagle' board layout i offer it

04:50:30 Vexual: Hi all, herbi.

04:50:36 asciilifeform: decimation: iirc we did that scope here

04:50:46 asciilifeform: !s lecroy

04:50:46 assbot: 0 results for 'lecroy' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=lecroy

04:50:47 decimation: no we did a spectrum analyzer

04:50:49 asciilifeform: aha

04:50:50 decimation: from agilent

04:50:54 decimation: !s agilent

04:50:55 assbot: 23 results for 'agilent' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=agilent

04:51:04 decimation: and it didn't do 100 ghz

04:51:05 asciilifeform: gonna guess that it works the same way my chinese 200mHz one does

04:51:09 asciilifeform: staggered adc

04:51:17 decimation: that's special $1 mil bezzle

04:51:32 asciilifeform: big phat deal, the cost of three tow trucks.

04:51:34 decimation: asciilifeform: yes, but the real sauce is the sample-and-hold asic

04:51:51 Vexual: ascii that snatch sniffer might work just as well without the batteries if you get the thing close enough.

04:51:55 asciilifeform: not even clear to me that it's overpriced

04:52:08 asciilifeform: Vexual: wai wat ?!

04:52:12 decimation: the input coax is more-or-less directly attached to their custome asci

04:52:30 decimation: asciilifeform: no it isn't really, how many do you think they sell? 10? 100?

04:52:45 BingoBoingo: !b 5

04:52:46 assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3CAM71A.txt )

04:53:56 decimation: once you cross into > 10 GHz signals you start having to fork over real $$ for test equipment

04:54:01 herbijudlestoids: hey vex

04:54:09 herbijudlestoids: hey.

04:54:18 herbijudlestoids: wasnt there some command you used to be able to run..

04:54:20 herbijudlestoids: !fap

04:54:27 herbijudlestoids: i dunno..something like that

04:54:31 herbijudlestoids: for porn

04:54:41 herbijudlestoids: i miss that.

04:55:55 mircea_popescu: lol

04:56:15 mircea_popescu: so it pleases me to report that virtually all links from tlp to various learned repositories of articles are dead.

04:56:18 mircea_popescu: it's not been 10 years.

04:56:22 mircea_popescu: the web is fucking useless.

04:57:06 herbijudlestoids: yea wasnt vince cerf saying that as well recently?

04:57:23 herbijudlestoids: and i read a great article on archive.org about similar issue

04:57:25 decimation: mircea_popescu: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2952020/Will-21st-century-lost-history-Father-internet-warns-digital-world-lead-black-hole-knowledge.html

04:57:27 assbot: Print out your photos or risk losing them, warns Google boss | Daily Mail Online ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyO8IK )

04:57:50 decimation: "In centuries to come, future historians looking back on the current era could be confronted by a digital desert comparable with the dark ages - the post-Roman period in Western Europe about which relatively little is known because of the scarcity of written records. "

04:57:57 herbijudlestoids: yeah

04:58:03 herbijudlestoids: that one

04:58:26 mircea_popescu: fucking ridoinculous.

04:58:42 decimation: 'My name is Ozymandias, king of kings: Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!'

04:58:44 mircea_popescu: well, fuck the world, fraudsters will survive. i guess the idea being that "winners write history".

04:59:12 mircea_popescu: herbijudlestoids http://38.media.tumblr.com/4cc8da8a80bcc144e2b7a0a239b5e4f2/tumblr_mt63fprr6m1ssof6ro1_250.gif there you go

04:59:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AyOtuZ )

04:59:42 mircea_popescu: girl put her panties on correctly : over the garter.

04:59:43 herbijudlestoids: mesmerising

05:01:02 herbijudlestoids: i am really enjoying my freebsd hobby project, gives me opportunity to implement so many things that i have let go past because i didnt need it for work

05:01:42 herbijudlestoids: so far: squid, ldap, kerberos, djbdns, postfix, and today i finished setting up nginx and getting "A" score on the qualys ssl test

05:02:21 herbijudlestoids: next: https://github.com/nbs-system/naxsi

05:02:22 assbot: nbs-system/naxsi · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsMrGZ )

05:02:49 ben_vulpes: well that was quite the refactor

05:03:05 ben_vulpes: i went heads down, next thing i know you asshats have crapped out 800 loglines

05:03:08 ben_vulpes: and an herbijudlestoids!

05:03:13 herbijudlestoids: hullo mr fox

05:03:14 ben_vulpes: ;;ident herbijudlestoids

05:03:14 gribble: Nick 'herbijudlestoids', with hostmask 'herbijudlestoids!~sina@c220-239-186-144.randw3.nsw.optusnet.com.au', is not identified.

05:03:28 herbijudlestoids: is so :(

05:03:39 herbijudlestoids: i just identified with you bastard bot

05:04:14 ben_vulpes: !gettrust assbot herbijudlestoids

05:04:14 assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user herbijudlestoids: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/assbot/herbijudlestoids | http://w.b-a.link/user/herbijudlestoids

05:04:31 ben_vulpes: ;;gettrust assbot herbijudlestoids

05:04:32 gribble: WARNING: Currently not authenticated. Trust relationship from user assbot to user herbijudlestoids: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=assbot&dest=herbijudlestoids | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=herbijudlestoids | Rated since: Fri Feb 14 01:33:49 2014

05:04:47 herbijudlestoids: ;;ident herbijudlestoids

05:04:47 gribble: Nick 'herbijudlestoids', with hostmask 'herbijudlestoids!~sina@c220-239-186-144.randw3.nsw.optusnet.com.au', is identified as user 'herbijudlestoids', with GPG key id CA8F764D7A6DC051, key fingerprint 7BFEED118C1BD7FA160C7780CA8F764D7A6DC051, and bitcoin address None

05:04:55 herbijudlestoids: yeah. damn u.

05:05:10 ben_vulpes: ok ok

05:05:43 herbijudlestoids: i guess i should stop using my home computer to connect here and start using this freebsd node

05:05:46 herbijudlestoids: brb.

05:06:09 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=711276 << this you'll appreciate. grep for "Doctor_Why_Bother"

05:06:11 assbot: Does Anyone Read "The Last Psychiatrist"? - Straight Dope Message Board ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsMSAY )

05:08:47 ben_vulpes: !up Vexual

05:10:45 ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> srsly, whoever asked that, read the damn thing << for those blessedly uncontaminated with "c machine" constructs, it's hard to tell where the "c++" leaves off and the "boost" begins. it's clear that it's used in every for loop (c++ doesn't have iteration constructs?!), but the question if you didn't read closely enough was "why bother?" not "should one?"

05:11:29 decimation: mircea_popescu: that's a lulzy exchange. the doctor_why_bother guy is a living example of 'he misses the forest for the tiny sapling'

05:11:46 mircea_popescu: more generally, of dunning-kruger

05:12:00 mircea_popescu: people thinkg that effect only shows up in idiots, and so not in them. which of course is the very point.

05:12:27 mircea_popescu: but in fact, the moderately stupid are just as handicapped understanding why they aren't smarter as very smart people are, understanding THE SAME THING (ie, why they aren't smarter).

05:13:10 ben_vulpes: <Adlai> it's funny/sad how parenting reverses over time << oh this is great news you mean i have to take care of both ends? great.

05:14:25 decimation: it's like watching a cripple trip on a bump, adjacent to which is a sign that says "attention cripples: do not trip on this bump"

05:14:28 mircea_popescu: your average doobie, with a mediocre college degree and an ESL culture mostly geared towards ingested summaries is perfectly unable to decode metaphor or recognise complex enough patterns and fill in the gaps. this to him is frustrating, and the frustration is predictably resolved by lashing out (hey, it's the guy fault for using rferences i have to google and math i don't grok!11). in no way better than a clinical mor

05:14:28 mircea_popescu: on angry at people who can write.

05:15:42 thestringpuller: mod6: ben_vulpes it got past the wedge

05:15:51 mircea_popescu: for that matter, my "which of course is the very point" above is also "not very clear", in the sense that if one isn't particularly bright, the recursion of "what dk says is that people think they're better than they are" is not immediately glob'd into the expression.

05:16:13 mircea_popescu: for that matter, if one doesn't have the culture to know that glob's a verb, the above is also "a very bad argument" .and so on.

05:16:27 asciilifeform: decimation: 'macrofab' << i worked through an entire board.

05:16:33 asciilifeform: decimation: it's a piece of shit

05:16:41 asciilifeform: decimation: loses xy coords for -all- parts

05:16:48 decimation: asciilifeform: lol thanks for jumping on that

05:17:02 decimation: but ascii, it's in 'beta'

05:17:05 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes : take the bright side of life. "not liking kids is not a valid reason to not have any - you'll be stuck with some anyway."

05:17:12 asciilifeform: decimation: and demands weird gerber layers that i haven't got

05:17:19 asciilifeform: what a fucking waste of hour

05:17:28 asciilifeform: cranked through all the parts substitutions crap

05:17:34 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform stop wasting your hours! you're a process man, you belong to s.nsa now!

05:17:43 decimation: my understanding is that you are required to manually place the parts

05:17:46 thestringpuller: "blocks" : 164713

05:17:47 decimation: in a 'mechanical turk' fashion

05:17:48 asciilifeform: (for what? rng. small board, nothing secret therein. yes, motherfucker has my gerbers now)

05:17:54 asciilifeform: decimation: semi-automatic turk

05:18:11 ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: it gets worse. some even work for me.

05:18:15 decimation: asciilifeform: did you use eagle?

05:18:19 asciilifeform: aha

05:18:22 decimation: I might try kicad to see what it does

05:18:26 asciilifeform: did try it

05:18:41 asciilifeform: and even took a month last year - learned geda

05:18:41 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes so do mine. but at least a) i actually fuck them and b) i don't take them without a significant prior investment from other people.

05:18:48 decimation: there's another similar vendor https://circuithub.com/ << supposedly they actually deliever

05:18:49 assbot: CircuitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsOfzL )

05:18:58 asciilifeform: geda is great in every way except for being terminally buggy and the fill polygons fell apart

05:19:19 asciilifeform: kikad is unusable on linux (on every box i own) - gui redraw bug

05:19:26 decimation: asciilifeform: I find kicad amusing - when you go to download they have a little description begging not to download the 'old stable' version

05:19:29 asciilifeform: and, even were this fixed, its autorouter is dumb as rocks

05:19:43 ben_vulpes: sage words

05:19:46 ben_vulpes: next career

05:20:11 mircea_popescu: decimation why not ?

05:21:13 asciilifeform: decimation: circuithub << wait, lol!!! >> 'In order to upload your first project, please create or link a Dropbox account.'

05:21:14 decimation: because apparently all their new 'features' are in the new 'unstable testing' version

05:21:15 asciilifeform: wtf ?

05:21:23 decimation: asciilifeform: hehe yeah I wondered when you were to walk into that

05:21:33 decimation: they promise that they won't mistreat your data

05:21:50 asciilifeform: i assume they will all 'mistreat the data'

05:21:56 asciilifeform: but why force user to use turd service ?

05:22:10 decimation: I guess because they can't write an http uploader that works?

05:22:24 *: asciilifeform even more disappointed than expected to be

05:22:44 decimation: asciilifeform, what do you expect from 'hardware startup' chumpatronics?

05:22:55 *: asciilifeform does not expect to find one of these things that works for any reasonable value of 'works', because the economics of it are not, to put it very gently, favourable

05:23:39 decimation: supposedly the macrolabs people 'make the economics work' by queuing up all the jobs onto a giant panel

05:23:47 asciilifeform: i could live, for example, with an outfit that would crap out the board and place just the passives (then i xray the damn thing here. and place the actives personally)

05:23:53 decimation: I'm not sure how they 'make it up on volume' if they have to hand place parts on the whole thing

05:24:02 asciilifeform: but i could also live with a pill that propels me on morning commute by enabling me to fart ponies

05:24:45 decimation: pony-farts would be a fairly good way of navigating the dc traffic jams

05:25:15 decimation: apparently the kicad-pcb.org page is dead

05:25:17 asciilifeform: !s a horse splashes

05:25:17 assbot: 0 results for 'a horse splashes' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=a+horse+splashes

05:25:23 asciilifeform: ;;google a horse splashes

05:25:24 gribble: Haldane, On Being the Right Size: http://irl.cs.ucla.edu/papers/right-size.html; .. a man is broken, a horse splashes - Physics Forums: https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/a-man-is-broken-a-horse-splashes.585757/; On Being The Right Size (Hollywood edition). | The Inverse Square ...: https://inversesquare.wordpress.com/2008/01/25/on-being-the-right-size-hollywood- (1 more message)

05:25:50 asciilifeform: 'You can drop a mouse down a thousand-yard mine shaft; and, on arriving at the bottom, it gets a slight shock and walks away, provided that the ground is fairly soft. A rat is killed, a man is broken, a horse splashes.'

05:26:09 mircea_popescu: ^

05:26:34 mircea_popescu: great quote

05:26:37 asciilifeform: famous essay

05:29:19 asciilifeform: decimation: -everybody- queues the jobs into conveyor-width panels.

05:30:05 asciilifeform: decimation: the boojum lies in the nre costs, typically (largely paste stencils, but not only)

05:30:43 asciilifeform: decimation: also there is no small amount of actual human labour involved in the process.

05:30:56 decimation: I suspect they are using one of those 'ink jet' solder paste printers

05:31:52 asciilifeform: decimation: those trade nre for a vastly higher cost per board

05:32:02 asciilifeform: the nozzles (disposable, golden toilet) clog, etc.

05:32:07 asciilifeform: and crap slowly.

05:32:17 asciilifeform: somebody has to watch it go

05:32:18 asciilifeform: etc.

05:32:55 decimation: asciilifeform: if they are truly able to deliver at the prices they quote on the 'demo', it seems likely that they are 'debt funding'

05:33:10 asciilifeform: who?

05:33:18 decimation: the macrolabs people

05:33:18 asciilifeform: circuithub ?

05:33:20 asciilifeform: ah

05:33:36 asciilifeform: nah, i think i figured it out

05:33:44 asciilifeform: assuming the thing isn't simply a blackhole for money,

05:33:48 asciilifeform: (actually ships something)

05:34:07 asciilifeform: they make up the difference by nickel'n'diming the chump for the 'out of house' parts

05:34:23 ben_vulpes: <herbijudlestoids> [] deployment tools, config mgmt, automated service discovery etc << /me is tres jelly

05:34:24 asciilifeform: e.g., $1.50 to place each 15c resistor they refused to stock

05:34:27 decimation: yes, I couldn't find any mention of the costs of 'non-house' parts

05:34:28 asciilifeform: ^ yes, per unit

05:34:33 asciilifeform: clever chumpamatic

05:34:44 asciilifeform: decimation: you have to crap in an actual project to learn the costs

05:34:45 decimation: nor a catalog of parts that 'can be had for a price'

05:34:59 asciilifeform: it lets you fidget with the selections

05:35:13 decimation: ah, I will upload something and see what I can do

05:35:16 asciilifeform: their selection is, i'd say, rather spotty

05:35:27 asciilifeform: e.g., no 47K 0805 resistor of any grade

05:35:46 decimation: yes their house passive selection is very limited

05:35:56 decimation: and their non-passive even more so

05:35:59 asciilifeform: as for actives, virtually none to be had.

05:36:55 asciilifeform: in short, i am presently at a loss as to what this is good for, how, and why...

05:37:41 decimation: it will be interesting to see if this 'service' continues to exist for a period of time, and if so, how it matures

05:38:00 thestringpuller: decimation: isn't there a super speeder law in VA and MD because people drive so terribly in DC?

05:38:06 asciilifeform: as i understand, it is severely antieconomic and cannot really go anywhere

05:38:37 decimation: thestringpuller: in VA if you are speeding 15 mph over the limit it can be considered 'wreckless'

05:38:57 asciilifeform: that alone would not doom it - consider the world of usg - but the onesie-pcb-assembly business doesn't have the makings of a mass popu-chumpatron

05:39:10 asciilifeform: reckless?

05:41:47 decimation: yeah reckless

05:41:54 decimation: I guess wreckless would be safe driving :)

05:43:12 decimation: asciilifeform: I think they have the nub of a good idea, having all the steps in manufacturing clearly brought out in one spot

05:43:18 decimation: the execution might not be there though

05:43:47 decimation: ah no it's 20 mph in VA http://www.bobbattlelaw.com/faqs/what-is-considered-reckless-driving-speeding-in-virginia.cfm

05:43:48 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsQFOB )

05:44:27 ben_vulpes: i got a reckless driving charge one time.

05:44:50 ben_vulpes: ticket was officially for 60 in a 30.

05:44:55 decimation: ben_vulpes: did they try to send you to jail?

05:44:58 ben_vulpes: iirc, i hit 70.

05:45:22 ben_vulpes: lol in portland?

05:46:01 decimation: you guys have a loud n' proud bisexual governor now

05:47:28 ben_vulpes: there's always something silly happening in the backwaters

05:48:13 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-01-2015#965039 < mircea_popescu apparently amex was too fucktarded to keep costco as a client

05:48:13 assbot: Logged on 04-01-2015 22:07:08; mircea_popescu: decimation: re: costco & amex << I suspect amex gives costco a deal (pays them) to force a large percentage of the upper-crust customer-base to have an amex card in their wallet << pretty much how that racket goes yes.

05:49:23 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=04-01-2015#965039 < mircea_popescu apparently amex was too fucktarded to keep costco as a client http://fortune.com/2015/02/12/amex-costco-dumps-cards/

05:49:23 assbot: Logged on 04-01-2015 22:07:08; mircea_popescu: decimation: re: costco & amex << I suspect amex gives costco a deal (pays them) to force a large percentage of the upper-crust customer-base to have an amex card in their wallet << pretty much how that racket goes yes.

05:49:24 assbot: AmEx shares plunge as Costco dumps its credit cards - Fortune ... ( http://bit.ly/1vsR8R0 )

05:49:36 decimation: sorry for the dup

05:59:20 punkman: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn26968-telescopic-contact-lenses-let-you-zoom-in-on-demand.html

05:59:21 assbot: Telescopic contact lenses let you zoom in on demand - tech - 13 February 2015 - New Scientist ... ( http://bit.ly/1AlAMkB )

06:19:44 punkman: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-02-2015#1017753 << I was more wondering how much cruft we'll need for that.

06:19:44 assbot: Logged on 14-02-2015 00:20:24; BingoBoingo: punkman: if we replace openssl with libressl or whatever, how do we verify all the buggy data generated by 7 different openssl versions? << For the time being... empirically. There a set with six year's worth a data to test against by syncing.

06:20:48 punkman: could just keep the checkpoint stuff though, and not verify all the ecdsa signatures.

06:23:07 punkman: (I'll mention again that if you let VerifySignature run on all tx's, it blows up much sooner than block 168000)

06:24:09 mircea_popescu: decimation ouch, amex kinda set to go out of biz huh.

06:24:48 mircea_popescu: the obvious effect of "keynesian" money pumping is bubbles, but that's not the worst effect.

06:25:27 mircea_popescu: the worst effect is that everything forms monopolies. in a physics intuitive approach, what QE does is basically increase the superficial tension. this forces bubbles to merge.

06:26:04 mircea_popescu: in another perspective, qe is an abdication of monetarty sovereignty. sovereignity is a fixed sum, so it just moves in other parts of the system - monopolies form.

06:27:01 mircea_popescu: but in any case, however you explain it on the "micro" basis : competition and central control are mutually contradictory. much like anabolic and catabolic processes.

06:27:48 decimation: yes, the us today is more-or-less dominated by centralized megabusiness

06:28:15 decimation: because 'must grow big to get a seat at the table where they hand out bezzlars'

06:28:22 punkman: decimation: just the US?

06:28:37 decimation: punkman: aren't you in france?

06:28:53 mircea_popescu: greece.

06:29:11 decimation: the eu has their own version

06:29:13 mircea_popescu: decimation it's not even that, it's just... the *meaning* of money changes.

06:29:37 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Amex is fine. They partnered with Walmart for poor people ATM cards

06:29:56 mircea_popescu: they're getting bought out

06:30:12 decimation: the 'meaning of money' seems to have a scale from 'tool to settle private debts' to 'note from stalin'

06:31:29 asciilifeform: old hat. east india company ran as much on the latter as the former

06:31:42 decimation: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-12/amex-grip-on-wealthy-consumers-seen-slipping-as-rivals-take-bite

06:31:43 assbot: AmEx Grip on Wealthy Consumers Seen Slipping as Rivals Take Bite - Bloomberg Business ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVxGn4 )

06:31:59 decimation: "Chief Executive Officer Ken Chenault, 63, has introduced new products aimed at younger and less-affluent customers as AmEx seeks to broaden its appeal. The lender is working with companies including Uber Technologies Inc. and Apple Inc. to expand mobile payments, and courted Americans who lack access to traditional banks with products like its Bluebird prepaid card, offered at Wal-Mart Stores Inc."

06:32:35 asciilifeform: decimation: this is a pretty standard dynamic of 'leningrad siege, no coal, let's burn the sofa'

06:32:35 decimation: wtf, when did it ever make sense as a creditor to make enemies with those who had money in order to court those who don't?

06:32:54 decimation: yeah it seems that way

06:33:00 asciilifeform: they cash in their 'brand' for chump massification

06:33:47 asciilifeform: (what is the 'added value' of a prepay spamcard with 'amex' logo? solely the psychological tie with 'rich')

06:34:09 decimation: kinda like how 'hp' now brands chumper printer cartridges, instead of quality reliable test equipment

06:35:23 mircea_popescu: https://flpics1.a.ssl.fastly.net/4232/4232146/00050edc-db76-1a9e-3e51-e2d153eb422d_720.jpg

06:35:25 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVy70J )

06:35:53 asciilifeform: decimation: hp's been branding chumpcartridges since '90s

06:36:12 mircea_popescu: decimation the ones who "don't" are more valuable as bezzle access. the ones who "do" really don't.

06:36:22 asciilifeform: that's not the news, but that they stopped doing anything else. like the illusory growth of a corpse's beard

06:36:28 mircea_popescu: ie, boa was "too big to fail" because it held a lot of mortgages of people WHO COULDNT PAY FOR THEM.

06:36:45 mircea_popescu: meanwhile jpm was NOT tbtf, because it held a lot of money from people who had money, so it could you knoiw, just steal that,

06:36:49 mircea_popescu: so it didn't need govt money.

06:37:01 mircea_popescu: it quickly becomes perverse, the game of "let's have government in the market"

06:37:52 decimation: yeah there is no escape

06:37:57 mircea_popescu: by now a "we hold 100mn chumps, who pay us 0, give us usd" is a better revenue source than "we have 1mn people paying us 1k a year each"

06:38:04 mircea_popescu: as proven by, for instance, whatsdumb.

06:38:50 decimation: a dark force dissolves every economic decision into a sjw forum

06:39:14 mircea_popescu: well this is the problem, you know ? once you decide to try nuclear detonations in your livingroom you can no longer have "fresh milk"

06:39:52 asciilifeform: folks stupid enough to try (1) will proceed to (2)

06:39:54 asciilifeform: like clockwork.

06:40:44 BingoBoingo: Strontium makes bones strong and genes novel

06:40:55 mircea_popescu: lol

06:41:09 decimation: !b 8

06:41:10 assbot: Last 8 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1WXXPAE.txt )

06:46:56 BingoBoingo: !up Vexual

06:48:21 mircea_popescu: https://flpics0.a.ssl.fastly.net/1728/1728220/00050ef8-c44d-8b6c-90b3-6472a2bbc7d8_720.jpg << now this is some hardcore lightsabering.

06:48:23 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVzmgn )

06:49:22 Vexual: ;;laserkittens

06:49:22 gribble: ุ ₍˄.͡˳̫.˄₎ ุ ┌━ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ ┄ *pew*

06:57:45 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: isn't it odd that engl. doesn't (afaik) have a word for блат - that other capital that u.s. economy actually runs on today, as discussed above

06:57:55 mircea_popescu: blat ? ahahaha

06:58:00 asciilifeform: (roughly might translate as 'pull' or 'crown concession' but not quite)

06:58:10 mircea_popescu: it's a quite respectable romanian word.

06:58:15 mircea_popescu: ;;google ce inseamna sa faci un blat ?

06:58:16 gribble: Reţetă blat de pizza | RETETE | prajituri | mancare | BarbatLaCratita: http://www.barbatlacratita.ro/2011/02/reteta-blat-de-pizza.html; Cum se face aluatul de pizza pufos, crocant? | Pofta Buna!: http://pofta-buna.com/cum-se-face-aluatul-de-pizza-pufos-crocant/; Pizza Traditionala Italiana | Retete culinare Laura Adamache: http://www.lauraadamache.ro/2008/07/pizza- (1 more message)

06:58:16 asciilifeform: call it 'fapital' perhaps

06:58:21 asciilifeform: or crapital

06:59:10 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it's more or less universal in the slavic and bordering cultures, afaik. and other orcish nations (cn) have own word that is closely analogous

06:59:35 mircea_popescu: (in romanian it means, literally, the dough part of a pizza or a cake)

06:59:56 asciilifeform: 'guanxi' in cn, iirc

07:00:32 Vexual: Whaa?

07:01:10 Vexual: Ascii you're picking up Chinese?

07:01:57 asciilifeform: Vexual: one unavoidably picks up various things, like the strontium from earlier thread

07:03:52 asciilifeform: http://i.imgur.com/I9Y4Leo.jpg << unrelated vintage lulz

07:03:53 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KVAPU2 )

07:04:29 Vexual: So many dialects in China.

07:04:48 asciilifeform: ^ the incident itself is quite famous, but i somehow escaped knowing that the detailed reversing of the bug was made public

07:06:12 asciilifeform: likewise mentioned is the fact that the bug was deliberately set to overlap with freq. of a local tv station.

07:06:24 asciilifeform: (sacrifice range, gain - the obvious)

07:06:48 Vexual: Lol

07:08:09 asciilifeform: the typewriter case is interesting, from a history of usg point of view, because it appears to be the turning point for nsa

07:08:24 asciilifeform: that is, when their present direction was decided on.

07:08:56 asciilifeform: (turned, that is, from traditional signal-gathering to sabotage, cribbed, yes, from ru)

07:09:24 mircea_popescu: sabotage ? looks more like judy.

07:09:27 mircea_popescu: as in, punch and judy

07:10:00 mircea_popescu: the principal job of the nsa since about the 2010s is to be publicly and outrageously humiliated.

07:10:12 asciilifeform: if there is evidence of usg crafting functioning but diddled parts for a mass-produced machine, slipping'em in, etc. prior to this cribbing, i for one do not know of it

07:10:42 asciilifeform: a 'f-student' who cribs what he sees as 'good idea' becomes immediately obsessed with it

07:10:59 asciilifeform: to the point of utter laughability

07:12:27 asciilifeform: (and yes, 'crypto ag' - nsa shill - sold diddled cipher machines for half a century and (!) counting. not counting shams-by-design here, only surreptitiously-modified products)

07:26:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42250 @ 0.00042369 = 17.9009 BTC [-] {4}

08:10:23 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.09396842 = 1.7854 BTC [-] {4}

08:17:04 cazalla: This, however, is very much the result of choices in the design of the system: anyone may create a bitcoin address at a whim, as long as it is unique. But the Bitcoin Foundation?the organization that has authority over the bitcoin protocol?could change that. Before creating a new address, users could be forced to authenticate with a trusted organization. This organization would securely store information about identities, and this infor

08:17:05 cazalla: mation could be revealed to law-enforcement agencies only when a request for access is legally approved.

08:17:51 cazalla: more lulzy shit at http://www.canadianbusiness.com/blogs-and-comment/two-major-problems-with-bitcoin-and-how-to-solve-them/

08:17:52 assbot: Two major problems with bitcoin, and how to solve them ... ( http://bit.ly/1F96UsK )

08:22:47 ben_vulpes: people may definitively lose interest, eh?

08:22:50 ben_vulpes: mhmsure.

08:39:47 cazalla: http://rt.com/usa/232219-chelsea-manning-hormone-therapy/ what a bunch of fags And from 2001 to 2011, there were 3,177 veterans diagnosed with gender identity disorder according to the Veterans Affairs Department, while overall it is estimated than one in 11,000 male babies and one in 30,000 female babies are born with the disorder, according to the Veterans Health Administration.

08:39:47 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EanNQf )

08:57:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17250 @ 0.00043311 = 7.4711 BTC [+]

09:29:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9400 @ 0.00043311 = 4.0712 BTC [+]

09:55:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3973 @ 0.00043311 = 1.7207 BTC [+]

10:29:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15700 @ 0.00043311 = 6.7998 BTC [+]

10:43:57 BingoBoingo: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=6968077&cid=49051213

10:43:58 assbot: Smart Homes Often Dumb, Never Simple - Slashdot ... ( http://bit.ly/19heGUv )

10:47:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19859 @ 0.00042011 = 8.343 BTC [-] {2}

10:57:40 cazalla: so the telco here has a campaign where they will publish your texts on their billboard above one of their stores.. http://i.imgur.com/yW8gIft.jpg

10:57:41 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/19hg9dt )

11:31:35 BingoBoingo: lol at the billboard

12:20:41 Adlai: ;;later tell mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=07-02-2015#1011801 << how much is "a few", and how open are you to considering more frequent compensation?

12:20:41 assbot: Logged on 07-02-2015 17:57:05; mircea_popescu: nah, first timers get a few % of the profit, and at the end of a whole year.

12:20:41 gribble: The operation succeeded.

12:28:00 BingoBoingo: Adlai: When I was enlisted it was 10% of profit from the first year and negotiable beyond that after having lived a year. Market I traded lost its trade worthiness sooner than the one year though.

12:28:24 Adlai: ty

12:28:52 BingoBoingo: It's posted on fraudsters somewhere

12:29:55 Adlai: one issue i'm thinking about right now is whether this is really the kind of investment mpif is after: the last two days have generated an (unrealized) loss, despite the overall portfolio valuation jumping by ~$50 per bot

12:30:35 BingoBoingo: Well bookeeping is almost certainly going to be BTC denominated

12:30:49 Adlai: right, that's why it's showing up as an unrealized loss, rather than a realized gain

12:31:24 *: Adlai already bookkeeps in btc, but he lets the bot mostly do as it sees fit, which means it travels across the entire range of all-in-btc to all-in-fiat, should the market take it there

12:32:20 Adlai: of course, this behavior is controllable

12:33:43 BingoBoingo: Sync'd up to late January 2013

12:34:26 Adlai: oh lol, you were market making Altcoin, so no wonder it lost tradeability :P

12:35:34 BingoBoingo: Yeah

12:35:35 Adlai: my long-term (years/decades) plan for scalpl, assuming i don't lose interest by then, is commodities, since i'm hoping by that point "forex" becomes a quaint anachronism

12:36:28 Adlai: but meanwhile btc/fiat's volume makes a great sandbox

12:36:54 Adlai: although i guess that's more due to s/ume/atility/

12:38:45 Adlai: "The latter is structured so that no withdrawals are possible at the manager’s initiative" << oh hello, this sounds familiar!

12:41:18 BingoBoingo: Netted a small profit on the RON, and a loss on ATC when the alternative revealed it self to be potentially unbounded costs to keep the thing alive through mining

12:44:20 Adlai: which is why i'm sticking to government-mined altcoins

13:03:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6867 @ 0.0004143 = 2.845 BTC [-]

13:32:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18092 @ 0.0004228 = 7.6493 BTC [+] {2}

14:48:54 danielpbarron: i like amex because they gave me a card without me giving them my slave id number, although i suspect they just looked it up from some database

14:58:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46400 @ 0.00043203 = 20.0462 BTC [+]

15:04:19 BingoBoingo: scoopbot -fetch

15:04:43 thestringpuller: why isn't it working?

15:05:23 BingoBoingo: http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2015/02/14/notes-on-building-bitcoin-qt-on-openbsd/

15:05:24 assbot: Notes on Building Bitcoin-qt on OpenBSD | Bingo Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8IcIm )

15:06:53 thestringpuller: yea scoopbot ain't workibg PeterL

15:11:33 thestringpuller: good morning mircea_popescu

15:11:39 mircea_popescu: hey/

15:12:35 mircea_popescu: this shit's seriously a lot mopre trouble than it's worth.

15:20:52 danielpbarron: so uh.. it comes as little suprise to me that my pogo using a solid state drive is significantly faster than the one using a regular laptop hard drive

15:21:23 mircea_popescu: it just won't last as long.

15:21:47 danielpbarron: i suspected harddrive read/write was the bottleneck back when i was building my first full node

15:24:29 danielpbarron: also, i have sucessully re-installed the OS on one of them multiple times; it is possible to screw up the install and recover from it without any major disassembly required

15:25:01 danielpbarron: you can just put a blank flash drive in the top usb port with an empty directory 'revert' and the thing boots up factory default

15:26:02 danielpbarron: and if it sees such a drive, it won't try to boot from the attached sata drive; so you can then fdisk as needed

15:26:08 mircea_popescu: pretty great find this

15:32:49 mircea_popescu: ;;seen trinque

15:32:50 gribble: trinque was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 18 hours, 58 minutes, and 25 seconds ago: <trinque> mod6: lots of chatter about "can't find -lgcc_s" on teh googles

15:33:15 mircea_popescu: im gonna have to make another div payment set without a deed registrar aren't i.

15:33:24 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell trinque YO! deedbot!

15:33:25 gribble: The operation succeeded.

15:33:31 BingoBoingo: Oh, hearn has his own shadow implementation -XT!!! https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2vveeq/using_mike_hearns_bitcoin_xt_instead_of_bitcoin/

15:33:33 assbot: Using Mike Hearn's Bitcoin XT instead of Bitcoin Core as full node took just a couple of minutes. : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8NZ0y )

15:33:40 mircea_popescu: lol

15:34:15 BingoBoingo: Only advertises offering 2 new unfeatures

15:35:04 mircea_popescu: "It seems to be a way to extend and patch thee Bitcoin network without waiting on slow Bitcoin Core improvements."

15:35:20 mircea_popescu: it seems there's some worms more eager than some others in the government biscuit.

15:35:23 BingoBoingo: ;;later tell ben_vulpes mod6 http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2015/02/14/notes-on-building-bitcoin-qt-on-openbsd/ for when you get to porting maybe some notes might be useful

15:35:24 assbot: Notes on Building Bitcoin-qt on OpenBSD | Bingo Blog ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8OpEk )

15:35:24 gribble: The operation succeeded.

15:37:03 mircea_popescu: cazalla: more lulzy shit at http://www.canadianbusiness.com << all these biogas precursors are in for a rude awakening. at some point they'll discover that while I have the power to make something a problem by calling it a problem, they do not (any more).

15:37:04 assbot: Canadian Business - Your source for market news, investing, technology, economy and Canadian industry ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8ON5G )

15:37:06 mircea_popescu: boy that'll suck.

15:38:20 mircea_popescu: cazalla: http://i.imgur.com/yW8gIft.jpg << ahgahaah wtf!

15:38:20 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8P7kW )

15:46:06 BingoBoingo: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2vveeq/using_mike_hearns_bitcoin_xt_instead_of_bitcoin/colaexv

15:46:08 assbot: ButterNubber comments on Using Mike Hearn's Bitcoin XT instead of Bitcoin Core as full node took just a couple of minutes. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Eba8Z6 )

15:50:15 BingoBoingo: "

15:50:15 BingoBoingo: The point of this project is to provide a full node that has an explicit goal of supporting the needs of SPV app developers, as well as a place to try out more experimental changes in general. Through the course of 2013 I feel that the upstream Bitcoin Core project has become a relatively unpredictable place and I no longer feel sure that we can improve SPV mode or even that they will continue to support it at all. Bitcoin XT will

15:50:15 BingoBoingo: always support SPV wallets." https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/bitcoinj/Y9ZOOmfJHuc

15:50:17 assbot: Google Discussiegroepen ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8RVOV )

15:52:31 mircea_popescu: heh k.

15:53:44 BingoBoingo: Bitcoin Core upredictable, Let's make it more so

15:54:49 mircea_popescu: you don't understand how the world works.

15:56:17 thestringpuller: you are just oppressing my wood chipper rights!

16:03:32 thestringpuller: !l m s.qntr

16:03:32 assbot: Last trade for S.QNTR on MPEX was at 0.00025459 BTC [+]

16:03:41 thestringpuller: !t m s.qntr

16:03:41 assbot: [MPEX:S.QNTR] 1D: 0 / 0 / 0 (0 shares, 0 BTC), 7D: 0.00021897 / 0.00023047 / 0.00026 (22881 shares, 5.27 BTC), 30D: 0.000174 / 0.00022151 / 0.00026 (28655 shares, 6.35 BTC)

16:11:37 BingoBoingo: http://qntra.net/2015/02/psuedonode-proxy-fools-bitcoin-full-node-incentive-program/

16:11:38 assbot: PsuedoNode Proxy Fools Bitcoin Full Node Incentive Program | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1D8WCZ6 )

16:12:07 mircea_popescu: lol awww.

16:12:48 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo invite basil00 over eh.

16:13:13 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Dunno him, thestringpuller wrote that up and sourced it

16:13:46 thestringpuller: all i have is his github and reddit usernames

16:13:58 thestringpuller: i can send him pm in reddit

16:17:04 thestringpuller: sent

16:17:41 mircea_popescu: cool

16:24:45 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: you can just put a blank flash drive in the top usb port with an empty directory 'revert' and the thing boots up factory default << this is not a feature of the machine, but of the modified 'uboot' installed by the script you used.

16:25:12 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: what's more, this is guaranteed not to happen on the final box, because we'll actually use the 128M eeprom for the os.

16:25:26 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: (your setup - doesn't)

16:26:11 danielpbarron: ah, i had a feeling that was the case

16:27:03 danielpbarron: i hope you guys aren't relying solely on me to achieve those ends; a lot of this is totally new territory for me

16:27:30 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: pseudonode << mega-lol! >> 'Otherwise, if PseudoNode can connect to at least some good nodes (default 2), then will PseudoNode will acts just like a normal node and contributes network bandwidth.' << 'contributes bandwidth' !?!?!?

16:27:34 asciilifeform: eats - yes

16:27:39 asciilifeform: contributes ?

16:28:38 BingoBoingo: no contribution without verification

16:29:29 asciilifeform: the only thing it can do is add delay - and, potentially, diddle (you connect, thinking it was a node, but really this)

16:34:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5949 @ 0.00042807 = 2.5466 BTC [-]

16:38:23 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all

16:38:28 BingoBoingo: ;;bc,stats

16:38:30 gribble: Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 248.64, vol: 16328.91254348 | BTC-E BTCUSD last: 245.993, vol: 16418.1363 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 248.8, vol: 60076.29357212 | BTCChina BTCUSD last: 247.216263, vol: 273739.29310000 | Kraken BTCUSD last: 245.0, vol: 32.86977983 | Bitcoin-Central BTCUSD last: 235.82995, vol: 149.97156036 | Volume-weighted last average: 247.479467217

16:38:32 gribble: Current Blocks: 343467 | Current Difficulty: 4.44554159623438E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 344735 | Next Difficulty In: 1268 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 19 hours, 51 minutes, and 6 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 45854879064.3 | Estimated Percent Change: 3.14801

16:42:44 thestringpuller: scoopbot on da fritz

16:44:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8400 @ 0.0004143 = 3.4801 BTC [-]

16:47:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26388 @ 0.00041305 = 10.8996 BTC [-] {2}

16:48:37 BingoBoingo: http://blog.thinkst.com/p/if-nsa-has-been-hacking-everything-how.html?m=1

16:48:39 assbot: thinkst Thoughts...: If the NSA has been hacking everything, how has nobody seen them coming? ... ( http://bit.ly/1BbnTcG )

16:49:10 asciilifeform: aha, 'nobody.'

16:49:30 kakobrekla: more tracking http://pressreleases.visa.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=215693&p=irol-newsarticlePR&ID=2016148

16:49:31 assbot: Press Release | Visa Corporate | Visa Inc. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bbo2wQ )

16:51:11 asciilifeform: 'and the the word "implant" was almost never used in security circles' << usually called 'bug' (in the 'room is bugged' sense) outside of usg

16:51:20 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: "Thanks, but unfortunately it is already late in my part of the world. Perhaps send any questions via email and I'll try to respond in ~10hours (after sleep). Email: basil@reqrypt.org"

16:54:05 BingoBoingo: thestringpuller: Really, just dropping a plaintext email address in IRC for spamzors to pick up?

16:57:23 thestringpuller: ~_~ never again

17:03:21 Adlai: bitcoin inflation subsidizes the operation of the world's most energy inefficient clock

17:03:35 Adlai: and it's quite imprecise, too

17:04:09 kakobrekla: clock is scam

17:04:18 kakobrekla: time is arbitrary

17:11:58 mircea_popescu: there's no way to express bitcoin in fiat terms. it's not "a clock", because the meaning of "a clock" does not carry in bitcoin. yes it divides time, but differently in fundamental ways.

17:12:20 mircea_popescu: "energy efficiency" is not a bitcoin consideration. all energy used for non-bitcoin stuff is wasted by definition, in the bitcoin paradigm.

17:12:22 mircea_popescu: etc etc.

17:14:33 kakobrekla: somehow i missed this also https://static.slo-tech.com/63610.jpg

17:14:34 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CsAUMU )

17:28:23 mircea_popescu: heh. who even wants these new derpy tvs

17:29:03 mircea_popescu: i suppose the next step is, "participate in derpland has talent with your tv set!" and hopefully that'll relieve us of most of the current imbeciles online.

17:31:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 36119 @ 0.00039193 = 14.1561 BTC [-] {2}

17:41:24 Adlai: mircea_popescu: _all_ energy, or the delta between current mining energy use, and half the planet's total energy expenditure?

17:42:06 Adlai: the economics change once unutilized energy is insufficient to attack the network

17:42:13 mircea_popescu: unrelated datapoints. half energy available \being used to mine bitcoin makes bitcoin safe for humans (safe in the sense of, won't be overrun by the altcoin problem)

17:42:18 *: Adlai suspects; take everything he says with the usual shaker of salt

17:42:23 mircea_popescu: as far as bitcoin is concerned, there's no point to energy other than mining.

17:42:42 Adlai: signing transactions takes a bit of energy, and without fees from signed transactions, there's no point to mining

17:42:53 mircea_popescu: no point in mining FOR HUMANS.

17:42:59 Adlai: ?

17:43:01 mircea_popescu: gotta compartimentalize the povs.

17:43:12 Adlai: ok, i see

17:44:18 Adlai: still, i'm not sure that there's a rational incentive to add energy to mining activity once X% of the planet's energy expenditure is dedicated to mining

17:44:32 Adlai: i guess it would depend on the profitability, which starts getting outside the scope of bitcoin itself

17:46:24 mircea_popescu: is there a rational incentive to continue adding man-hours to women's studies ?

17:46:45 mircea_popescu: rational incentives don't enter into it. as far as derpy social studies types are concerned, all effort available should go into that.

17:47:15 mircea_popescu: the difference is that they enforce this through statal redistribution, which lives out of a hole in public choice theory,

17:47:22 *: Adlai finds himself again bringing up kahneman, who talks about "humans" vs "econs", the latter describing the rational agents of economic theory, which don't actually exist on this planet

17:47:24 mircea_popescu: whereas bitcoin enforces this through the nature of money.

17:47:33 mircea_popescu: which will crumble in contact with the other is kinda obvious.

17:47:45 mircea_popescu: o yes they do. the "humans" don't exist.

17:48:03 Adlai: ?

17:48:10 mircea_popescu: a whiteknight is not a person. it's a manifestation of particular pathologies empowered by particular economic imbalances.

17:48:21 mircea_popescu: these always revert to the mean.

17:48:41 Adlai: i guess we just have different definitions of the word "human". mine is preceded with a huge "only".

17:48:51 mircea_popescu: hm ?

17:49:04 *: Adlai next cites his dog's vet's tatoo, or at least the one he remembers: "humanity is overrated"

17:49:18 mircea_popescu: it's simple : inasmuch as your definition of "human" difers from "econ", it doesn't exist.

17:49:50 mircea_popescu: just like whatever in your definition of "human" differs from human biology is not objective but metaphysical.

17:49:52 Adlai: dunno, it makes perfect sense to me that computers produced by an evolutionary process would be far from perfect

17:49:59 mircea_popescu: sure.

17:50:42 Adlai: so "econs" are these mythical perfectly rational agents, and "humans" are these neurological shitshows full of neuroses and emotions that rarely act rationally. sure, some humans act quite rationally, but they're the exception.

17:51:06 mircea_popescu: if this is how you redefine your humans, i will change "don't exist" to "don't matter".

17:52:29 Adlai: sure. mattering is like driving skill... most datapoints think they're on the opposite side of the curve

17:52:53 mircea_popescu: (ie, "can't carry meaning". just like the foregoing it's also logically necessary, no debate possible. it flows from what you're saying, which is essentially "humans are noise". sure. but noise doesn't really matter. like brownian motion.)

17:54:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23300 @ 0.00040355 = 9.4027 BTC [+]

17:57:13 Adlai: dunno, nature can still matter, even if individual snowflakes in an avalanche or looters in a mob, could be removed without significantly affecting the whole. i choose the mob analogy purposefully, because these effects are rarely (ever?) constructive... construction seems to take either "superhuman" capacity (and effort), or enough time for differential reproductive fitness to do its thing

17:57:39 mircea_popescu: but that "nature" === "econ"

17:58:15 Adlai: <insufficient data for meaningful answer)

17:58:41 mircea_popescu: notrly.

17:58:59 Adlai: i'm not convinced that "nature" as a whole can be considered an "econ"

17:59:00 mircea_popescu: just, 'no particular inclination to gaze upon chtulhu'

17:59:11 mircea_popescu: but review the definitions :)

17:59:37 Adlai: it's definitely something else, not "human" - but does it act in its own rational self interest? i'm not sure the concept of "self interest" is meaningful when you're talking about "nature"

17:59:47 Adlai: cf "the planet is fine, the people are fucked"

18:00:19 Adlai: i won't dispute that nature computes.

18:00:40 mircea_popescu: "the planet is fine, the people are fucked" is what people say when they can't digest the obvious "if you could understand more, you could understand more"

18:01:03 Adlai: do you know the source?

18:01:11 mircea_popescu: the planet is fine. "the people" are fine. you are stupid, and your friends ridiculous.

18:01:28 mircea_popescu: carlin neh ?

18:01:35 Adlai: it's carlin on environmentalism, yes

18:01:38 mircea_popescu: right.

18:01:54 mircea_popescu: he doesn't mean the people = "the people". he means the people = your friends.

18:02:00 Adlai: the tl;dr is that "saving the environment" is silly because the environment exists with or without its "savers", and that the real meaning behind "saving the environment" is "keeping this environment as hospitable as possible to us"

18:02:33 *: Adlai has no friends

18:02:58 mircea_popescu: more like, "saving the environment" is just as silly as any one thing a bunch of useless, stupid and ignorant entities that only exist because nobody ground uncle sam into the ground yet could ever do.

18:03:56 Adlai: and now, for something completely different!

18:04:41 mircea_popescu: think "occupywallstreet" or "feminism" or w/e. "the luxor center for businessmen". these collections don't actually do anything, it's not unlike a coral discussing which way to undulate for saving the whales.

18:04:45 Adlai: when you designed mpex's 'quantum' matching engine, did you consider proposals of the "frequent batch auction" persuasion? i have no stake in this idea, just collecting opinions on it, as i form my own

18:05:03 mircea_popescu: very little about mpex has been publicly discussed.

18:05:37 Adlai: sure, but "frequent batch auction" has been published about a few times

18:05:39 Adlai: http://view.samurajdata.se/psview.php?id=8b6cbe2c&page=1

18:05:40 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mm6i5k )

18:06:07 mircea_popescu: good fer it i guess.

18:06:29 Adlai: the actual paper, if anybody is interested in more than a slideshow, is http://view.samurajdata.se/psview.php?id=271992c2&page=1

18:06:30 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mm6q4B )

18:06:44 Adlai: mircea_popescu: i'll take that as a "haven't heard/cared about it", which is still a datapoint

18:06:59 mircea_popescu: lol kay.

18:07:23 *: Adlai had heard the buzzword, hadn't bothered to actually read about it until now

18:08:00 mircea_popescu: maybe better take it as "this man won't give me for free stuff that people might get if they pay upwards of six figures in fees. my feeble attempts to defeat his defences through 9yo discoursive tactics are probably going to fare about as well as 9yos generally fare against multi million dollar concerns."

18:08:14 Adlai: it's an interesting idea, although i must say that - as i understand it without having read the entire paper - it's too deterministic for my tastes. i kinda like the idea of deliberately random behavior.

18:08:57 Adlai: lol kay.

18:09:40 mircea_popescu: but in other news, https://flpics2.a.ssl.fastly.net/2066/2066340/00050dbb-17e7-9554-ef52-cc5731d655ac_720.jpg

18:09:42 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Esuhdg )

18:11:06 mircea_popescu: !up ruin_dpbs_life

18:11:19 ruin_dpbs_life: danielpbarron: you're a dead man i'm going to fucking do whatever it takes to hurt you

18:11:27 mircea_popescu: ...

18:11:31 ruin_dpbs_life: enjoy going to jail with your terror cel

18:11:39 ruin_dpbs_life: mircea_popescu: you do business wiht dpb i'll get the police in volved

18:11:49 mircea_popescu: aha ?

18:11:56 mircea_popescu: which police is this ?

18:13:18 mircea_popescu: awww he got flooded did he ?!

18:13:24 danielpbarron: !rated xanthyos

18:13:24 assbot: You rated user xanthyos on 08-Oct-2014, with a rating of -5, and supplied these additional notes: met in '04; he depends on government subsidies and will side with the USG in order to maintain his leech lifestyle..

18:14:25 *: Adlai was just discussing death threats yesterday... they are as effective against humans as they are ineffective against superhumans

18:14:48 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell ruin_dpbs_life Guilford, Connecticut << it's probably a decent idea to not go throwing around threats off your home ip.

18:14:48 gribble: The operation succeeded.

18:15:09 danielpbarron: he's also throwing them through his phone number

18:15:19 mircea_popescu: are you two ex lovers or something ?

18:15:23 danielpbarron: hah no

18:15:28 danielpbarron: but we go way back

18:15:33 Adlai: i mean, if he's asking to get the police involved, don't they love responding to death threats?

18:15:53 Adlai: [for police values of "love"]

18:15:58 mircea_popescu: well technically this was more in the vein of horrible maiming and dismemberment threats.

18:16:16 mircea_popescu: lmao he got flooded. imagine the rage.

18:16:22 Adlai: dunno officer, "you're a dead man" seemed quite clear to me

18:16:43 mircea_popescu: o there's that too. well... it's a fair cop...

18:21:11 mircea_popescu: !up benjamindees

18:21:33 benjamindees: it's my understanding that you all are generally in favor of sidechains?

18:21:52 Adlai: yours would be a Miss Understanding.

18:22:34 benjamindees: so you are generally opposed to sidechains?

18:23:01 mircea_popescu: there's really no substitute for reading the logs.

18:23:03 Adlai: no, i feel rather ignorant of them. i understand the technical description in the paper, but haven't given it enough thought to be for or against. i can't speak for other people in this channel.

18:23:25 Adlai: !s sidechains

18:23:26 assbot: 22 results for 'sidechains' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=sidechains

18:23:30 Adlai: benjamindees: ^

18:23:44 benjamindees: I'm asking more from a philosophical perspective.

18:23:54 xanthyos: to all USG people reading this log i am not antistatist or anti FIAT and i will turn states evidence on danielpbarron

18:24:18 xanthyos: i am only in bitcoin as a hobbyist poker player, i love obama

18:24:19 benjamindees: mircea_popescu, ain't nobody got time for that

18:24:32 xanthyos: please rate me down so i can't voice myself in this terrorist room anymore

18:24:35 mircea_popescu: then nobody ain't part of this.

18:24:44 Adlai: benjamindees: i just gave you the shortcut, i believe you misprounounced "thanks"

18:24:48 mircea_popescu: xanthyos but terrorism's nice. plus we have cookies.

18:24:50 xanthyos: i want no affiliation with mircea_popescu the slave holder

18:25:05 mircea_popescu: how about sedition ? are you in favour of sedition ?

18:25:25 mircea_popescu: !s donkeys camels

18:25:26 assbot: 3 results for 'donkeys camels' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=donkeys+camels

18:25:30 xanthyos: /rate xanthyos -1 never voice yourself in assets again

18:25:59 mircea_popescu: benjamindees http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=09-02-2015#1013038 << you could start there.

18:25:59 assbot: Logged on 09-02-2015 00:37:52; mircea_popescu: looky here : growing larger implies growing costs. this is a given. a larger bitcoin will somehow be paid for.

18:26:04 Adlai: !gettrust assbot xanthyos

18:26:05 assbot: Trust relationship from user assbot to user xanthyos: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 2 via 2 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/assbot/xanthyos | http://w.b-a.link/user/xanthyos

18:26:22 mircea_popescu: !rated xanthyos

18:26:22 assbot: You have not rated xanthyos.

18:28:36 Adlai: mircea_popescu: arguably, the main/relevant effect of 'sidechains' to date has been funnelling VC money into subsidizing full nodes... although i guess you don't trust full nodes run by those people... but you don't have to because bitcoin

18:31:40 mircea_popescu: basically, to quote the ancient http://fraudsters.com/2013/bitcoin-prices-bitcoin-inflexibility/ :

18:31:41 assbot: Bitcoin prices, Bitcoin inflexibility pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1EsBPMQ )

18:31:41 mircea_popescu: Yet another one of them is that consumers revolt, entrepreneurs intervene, before the end of 2015 there's about a thousand to a million different Bitcoin forks, each with its ten million-ish monetary base worth about a dollar, on global average. The size of the inter-Bitcoins market, the complexity and confusion ensuing makes pretty much everything unmanageable for the "ordinary person".

18:31:48 mircea_popescu: it's a bunch of fiat derps refusing to submit.

18:31:58 mircea_popescu: which is fine, they can struggle for as long as they can gather the energy.

18:32:32 Adlai: note that for the "real bitcoin", this just has the effect of further distinguishing it as such, if the current mess didn't do that well enough

18:32:40 mircea_popescu: indeed.

18:33:06 mircea_popescu: good article, that, incidentally, in that it plainly discusses in 2013 things people imagine are "about the future" in 2015.

18:34:11 benjamindees: so, you're saying sidechains are better than alts

18:34:59 mircea_popescu: all screws are better than thumbtacks for the man holding a hammer.

18:35:27 benjamindees: "there are two avenues to pay for it." <-- I disagree with this, by the way. The third avenue is to pay for it with more transactions, since the major costs (mining) are fixed.

18:36:22 mircea_popescu: ...

18:36:49 mircea_popescu: so your avenue to pay for your starbucks is a) give them some of your money ; b) borrow some money to give them or c) buy another soda ?

18:36:54 mircea_popescu: what is this, the cartoons ?

18:37:49 benjamindees: more transactions == growth in transaction volume == more fees, not just higher fees

18:37:54 Adlai: benjamindees: wait, let's back up a bit, if not for your then my sake. what's the point of sidechains? i don't think it's "paying for bitcoin mining"

18:38:36 *: Adlai thinks that federated sidechains are a great idea and cointip, bitbase, changepay, whatever they're called - should be using those, if they want transparency

18:38:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18400 @ 0.00040355 = 7.4253 BTC [+]

18:38:41 benjamindees: Adlai, I'm wondering what you all think about it. I was under the impression you were for the idea.

18:39:10 Adlai: again, federated sidechains - great idea. you want a ledger with centralized control but accessible to the public, that manipulates btc denominated assets? this is how.

18:39:34 benjamindees: I've seen a couple of people say similar things. It seemed natural that if you are for a 1MB limit, you would be for sidechains as an avenue for growth or at least to keep the alts at bay.

18:39:37 Adlai: (granted, it's a lot more work than just asking people to trust you)

18:40:50 Adlai: !s rai stones

18:40:51 assbot: 1 results for 'rai stones' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=rai+stones

18:41:10 mircea_popescu: benjamindees you're completely and utterly misrepresenting the discussion.

18:41:30 benjamindees: feel free to correct me

18:41:33 mircea_popescu: if you're doing this by accident, you'll stfu and go read. if you're doing it deliberately... well... you'll keep at it and we'll have our lulz and move on.

18:41:48 mircea_popescu: i do not correct you, you're not tim fucking swanson. you correct you.

18:42:45 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 1983 @ 0.00077099 = 1.5289 BTC [-]

18:42:46 benjamindees: I've read everything you linked so far. It seems mostly sarcastic, which I don't really follow since I don't read your logs anyways.

18:42:49 Adlai: benjamindees: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rai_stones << money doesn't have to be convenient to be useful, and there are zillions of ways to handle amounts that aren't worth the transaction cost of lugging the whole thing around; some ways are more transparent (like federated sidechains), and others less (like changetip). non-federated sidechains require changing bitcoin itself, so let's see real

18:42:51 assbot: Rai stones - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1FaWU2f )

18:42:52 Adlai: world use of the version that doesn't require a change before we talk about making changes - my 2¢

18:43:24 mircea_popescu: the notion that you may participate without understanding is like... well, what all comedy gold is made out of, i guess.

18:43:50 mircea_popescu: how did you get this idea, that if you don't follow something it's incumbent on me/the school/the world to fix it for you ?

18:43:55 mircea_popescu: go read shit until you get it.

18:44:02 benjamindees: ...

18:44:34 Adlai: think of the sarcasm as a barrier of entry against butthurtion

18:52:33 Adlai: "but the energy, effort and resources which could have been expended on comfortably yielding and productively submitting" << lol

18:52:48 mircea_popescu: myeah.

19:12:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6481 @ 0.00039004 = 2.5278 BTC [-]

19:26:52 mircea_popescu: !up Birdman

19:27:18 Birdman: !down mircea_popescu

19:27:30 Birdman: just kiddin, sup

19:27:34 mircea_popescu: what's this, democracy ?

19:27:38 Birdman: ^

19:39:56 punkman: ruin_dpbs_life: danielpbarron: you're a dead man i'm going to fucking do whatever it takes to hurt you << lolwut

19:44:23 asciilifeform: i go out for just one hour to workshop, and what do you know, we have new surrender-monkeys ?

19:44:25 asciilifeform: how many? two?

19:44:43 punkman: just xanthyos I suppose

19:44:57 punkman: wasn't he the fellow with the broken dick?

19:45:18 asciilifeform: gavinandresen_ has quit (Client Quit) << lol! the real deal?

19:45:37 danielpbarron: punkman, yeh

19:46:33 punkman: danielpbarron: why the hardon for you?

19:46:52 asciilifeform: and did i miss some political wank or other? did they have a public impalement of heretics on the washington monument, and i missed this ?

19:46:55 danielpbarron: he has nothing better to do, and has apparently been obsessing about me

19:47:04 asciilifeform: why the surge of 'i love the fuhrer'

19:47:31 punkman: paranoia about losing benefits?

19:47:42 danielpbarron: yes; he gets checks from the state for being crazy

19:48:05 danielpbarron: he's never worked for a living in his life

19:48:35 asciilifeform: this does not automagically explain publicly creaming one's pants for usg

19:49:00 asciilifeform: plenty of folks get their daily bread from $sponsor while hating with exquisite hate

19:49:01 *: Adlai wonders what such a person's shrink would think if first hearing about bitcoin from such a patient

19:51:05 asciilifeform: related:

19:51:22 asciilifeform: 'The Russian author Eduard Limonov wrote of his experiences with poverty in America. To his joy, he discovered that he could supplement his cash earnings with public assistance. But he also quickly discovered that he had to keep this joy well hidden when showing up to collect his free money. It is a curious fact that in America public assistance is only made available to the miserable and the downtrodden, not to those who are

19:51:22 asciilifeform: in need of some free money but are otherwise perfectly content. Although it is just as possible to be poor and happy in America as anywhere else, here one must make a choice: to avoid any number of unpleasant situations, one must be careful to hide either the fact that one is poor, or the fact that one is happy. If free public money is to be obtained, then only the latter choice remains. It is another curious fact that vast nu

19:51:23 asciilifeform: mbers of Americans, both rich and poor, would regard Limonov's behavior as nothing short of despicable: a foreign author living in America on public assistance while also earning cash! It seems reasonable that the rich should feel that way; if the poor can't be made miserable, then what exactly is the point of being rich?'

19:51:25 danielpbarron: i'm not sure how much of it he sincerely believes, and how much is an attempt to get a rise out of me

19:51:27 asciilifeform: (orlov, who else)

19:51:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46650 @ 0.00038643 = 18.027 BTC [-]

19:56:57 mircea_popescu: * Adlai wonders what such a person's shrink would think if first hearing about bitcoin from such a patient << srsly.

20:03:02 Adlai: my first 'irl friend' who became a holder has remarked that the main (if not only) obstacle to holding is a social one; so anybody who has been marginalized their entire life (in this case, we were discussing religious minorities, but this equally applies to the 'functionally insane') is automatically more receptive than the mean

20:03:48 Adlai: well, ok, not anybody, those that have learned from being marginalized that 'society' isn't necessarily acting on any good reason

20:03:51 asciilifeform: that the main (if not only) obstacle to holding is a social one << wai, wat?! nobody has to know if you have btc

20:04:01 asciilifeform: unlike almost any other activity

20:04:20 Adlai: social, in the sense that you hold fiat because that's what everybody else holds

20:04:55 Adlai: hanging onto cash during times of trouble is rather similar to 'hodl'

20:07:12 *: punkman feels no need to talk about bitcoin with random people or meet local bitcoin holders

20:43:44 cazalla: way to butcher PseudoNode spelling

20:46:37 cazalla: thestringpuller, http://qntra.net/2015/02/new-security-standard-announced-at-devcore/#comment-10413

20:46:38 assbot: New Security Standard Announced at DevCore | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1zDtUbn )

20:48:49 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AMHASH1] 2362 @ 0.00073052 = 1.7255 BTC [-] {10}

21:04:41 cazalla: danielpbarron: he's never worked for a living in his life <<< maybe he can get a job as a postman because he never fails to deliver

21:28:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50750 @ 0.00038329 = 19.452 BTC [-] {2}

22:02:17 trinque: mircea_popescu: btcd chewed up a drive on me; that stream of "adding orphan block" was preceded by an input/output error barf

22:02:43 trinque: redid the thing with the bootstrap torrent on the server, and it's on mid december as of now

22:09:08 assbot: [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 271 @ 0.00395513 = 1.0718 BTC [-]

22:23:04 trinque: kicked it up to a bigger ec2 instance; not exactly a mindboggling increase in the rate of munching blocks

22:33:46 mod6: <+thestringpuller> mod6: ben_vulpes it got past the wedge <+thestringpuller> "blocks" : 164713 << looks to me like you just hit a spot where it was slow, maybe a lot of disconnected blocks. this isn't the "wedge" block we were hitting. tx we had issues with (VerifiySignature) was in block 168,001. It's all in the logs.

22:34:17 thestringpuller: mod6: dyslexia and stuffs. not my best week :(

22:34:32 mod6: If you got past 168,001 without any erros reported in `./bitcoind getinfo` then you should be alright.

22:34:37 mod6: thestringpuller: np

22:34:50 thestringpuller: i don't think it will if its running 0.9.8 ssl

22:35:35 thestringpuller: it's also slow as molasses and they want to increase the size of these blocks?

22:35:51 mod6: well, remember, I've personally gotten past that block probably a dozen times with openssl 0.9.8o with config: v0.5.3 + patches { 1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, & 6 }

22:36:06 thestringpuller: oh whoa!

22:36:10 thestringpuller: it got past it

22:36:29 thestringpuller: 180631

22:36:45 mod6: and recently, TomServo was able to fully sync the blockchain with config: v0.5.3 + patches + { 1, rm_rf_upnp, 2, 3, 4, 6 & 7 } AND with openssl v0.9.8o

22:36:51 mod6: so its totally inconsistant

22:36:57 thestringpuller: "blocks" : 180631

22:37:10 mod6: ok 180631 and no errors, looking good. see, it's inconsistant :)

22:37:12 thestringpuller: $ openssl version

22:37:14 thestringpuller: OpenSSL 0.9.8o 01 Jun 2010

22:37:26 thestringpuller: this is an older box.

22:37:33 mod6: you're on debian 7 right?

22:37:36 thestringpuller: yea

22:37:38 thestringpuller: wheezy

22:37:47 mod6: we're running on squeeze (deb 6)

22:38:02 thestringpuller: Ah. damn that was so long ago ~_~

22:38:03 mod6: you might be the first to be testing on deb7, not sure.

22:39:03 thestringpuller: if it gets current blockheight, i'll open up ports and run this as my full node instead of 0.8 version was tricked in to using.

22:39:39 mod6: thanks for testing. if you put together a pastebin of your findings: `./bitcoind getinfo` `openssl version -a`, etc. that would be helpful for our permutation matrix

22:40:22 thestringpuller: i'll wait until it either hits a wall or gets current.

22:40:31 mod6: ok thats awesome. although, i think what everyone has been running up to now is a dynamically linked version of the output binary. which shouldn't even be availab.e

22:41:01 thestringpuller: i didn't grok that sentence sorry

22:41:05 punkman: I compiled and run up to wedge on deb 7

22:41:17 mod6: when statically linking via the makefile.unix that's included with v0.5.3, I can't even get mine to compile correctly. So, I'll be spending a lot of time probably re-writing the entire makefile

22:41:27 thestringpuller: oh.

22:41:34 thestringpuller: well this is from pl script v 0.0.8?

22:41:38 mod6: what sentence tsp?

22:41:43 mod6: yeah.

22:41:54 thestringpuller: oh dynamically linking vs static

22:41:58 mod6: it'll build, it'll build the `bitcoind` binary dyamically linked.

22:42:10 mod6: which we won't support.

22:42:21 thestringpuller: what's the benefit of static linking?

22:42:33 mod6: for the last 48 hours i've been working on trying to get it to build against static libs.

22:43:08 mod6: it will build all of the necessary things inside of the output binary, instead of leaving that stuff to call out to a seperate place

22:43:43 thestringpuller: okay i see. been a lot longer than I realize before really looking at C/C++ code. (although this i pretty much all boost which I guess alf pointed out)

22:43:48 mod6: makes for a larger output binary (by about 10mb) but is more safe incase someone were to do something nasty with a lib that is dynamically linked

22:44:03 mod6: well, w/e

22:44:27 thestringpuller: they have sentenced me to writing ruby for slave labor

22:45:09 mod6: aight. so yeah, stay tuned. as soon as I get anything working with static libs and static linking of the output object files from the bitcoin source base, I'll give an update.

22:45:22 thestringpuller: do you have specific usecase for inducing the wedge?

22:45:25 mod6: it probably will take a while.

22:45:31 thestringpuller: for if I wanted to test that.

22:45:32 mod6: thestringpuller: no.

22:45:40 mod6: it's inconsistant.

22:45:47 thestringpuller: "non-deterministic" lol

22:46:19 mod6: as you just proved, it'll make it past it sometimes, and sometimes not. im sure there is some sort of reason for this, but we dont know what it is at this time.

22:47:24 thestringpuller: life's great mysteries?

22:48:57 mod6: Naw.

22:49:57 mod6: We'll figure it out at somepoint. I think, for now the important thing is that we have a workaround.

22:50:57 mod6: There's a lot of moving parts in there, and deps. It's hard to put a finger on what exactly it is, right now. Especially since we are all using slightly different environments. Too many variable.s

22:52:08 mod6: Anyway, none of this really matters until we can get a statically linked build.

23:07:02 thestringpuller: cazalla: replied. awaiting moderation.

23:07:46 cazalla: thestringpuller, approved, but shouldn't you be working? :P

23:08:28 thestringpuller: on a saturday?

23:12:17 cazalla: i figured it for friday but look.. sunday morning

23:12:37 thestringpuller: dat time travel.

23:21:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38500 @ 0.00038839 = 14.953 BTC [+] {2}

23:23:48 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: re: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-11-2014#922646 << is this why a lot of the US's rockets blew up during "apollo" or what not?

23:26:29 joecool: need to get trust in -assets, i look like the leader of a splinter faction on here http://cookiechief.com/wotviz/ lol

23:26:30 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1DsOb9z )

23:26:59 joecool: thestringpuller: is that only importing from gribble's wot when a new member joins the -assets wot?

23:28:05 thestringpuller: Nah its a static graph. And I need to redo one of the algorithms to only list those with L2 trust, a few pop up that shouldn't be there.

23:28:32 thestringpuller: eventually i plan to run cron job that pulls data from kako's w.b-a.link api