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Transcript for 20-07-2014, 1236 lines:

00:27:37 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 179 @ 0.002875 = 0.5146 BTC [+]

00:28:38 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 179 @ 0.00288 = 0.5155 BTC [+]

01:28:50 BingoBoingo: !up nubbins`

01:30:20 nubbins`: sorry, gone agzin

01:30:22 nubbins`: *again

01:30:32 nubbins`: print sale was a smashing success, gonna get drunk

01:39:19 BingoBoingo: %d

01:39:20 atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 687182.56 Est. Next Diff: 535172.17 in 1988 blocks (#42336) Est. % Change: -22.12

01:53:49 benkay: <mircea_popescu> for a coupla hours there it looked like the whole damned charade'll have to be taken down and redone. // mpex?

02:07:26 BingoBoingo: !up hanbot

02:08:30 hanbot: danke. so preet bharara finally lost a case http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/business/Rengan-Rajaratnam-case-shows-limits-of-insider-trading-laws.html?_r=0

02:08:32 assbot: Log In - The New York Times

02:15:35 asciilifeform: hanbot: preet bharara!

02:16:02 asciilifeform: hanbot: the american roland freisler

02:19:06 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: why would i wish for the gadget if i had a machining setup. (could then make one just like it.)

02:20:24 asciilifeform: mpex modem << as i recall, reliability of net connection is not an issue at mpex

02:29:09 kakobrekla: asciilifeform having one thing machined once is not same as having the machine at home

02:30:07 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: sure. i could have parts machined. but, on top of being a miser, i'm rather impatient.

02:30:50 kakobrekla: impatient. < off the shelf thing is your best bet then.

02:30:58 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: see 'miser' part.

02:31:20 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: off-the-shelf variant of the whole shebang is 50k or so.

02:32:27 kakobrekla: well im getting mixed readings here - the offer in otc was 2btc? which is 1k or something?

02:32:29 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: (of what? pick'n'placer & paste depositor combo robot)

02:32:52 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: 2btc offer for complete xyz frame and analogue components.

02:33:03 asciilifeform: afaik, this is not available as a standalone product anywhere.

02:33:05 kakobrekla: something like what im building should be 15-25k - this is custom made.

02:33:27 kakobrekla: at least that was the estimate that a company here gave me.

02:33:32 kakobrekla: years ago though.

02:35:51 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: just need to move a steel tube around inside a 50cm cube to 0.1mm.

02:36:03 asciilifeform: (steps)

02:36:21 kakobrekla: 0.1 is not much to ask as far as i know.

02:37:24 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: the funny part is, surplus lab robots (like the one i used to program) can be had for < $1k. but they're gigantic.

02:37:52 asciilifeform: !up hanbot

02:39:00 kakobrekla: cheap

02:39:28 asciilifeform: cheap. but it has to stand somewhere. and be moved there.

02:39:28 kakobrekla: iirc i paid about 5k back them for my stuff.

02:39:49 kakobrekla: back then*

02:40:25 *: hanbot wonders how big an ideal robot is

02:40:36 asciilifeform: hanbot: ideal for what ?

02:41:12 asciilifeform: hanbot: for my particular case, a cube of 50cm edge would suffice.

02:41:32 hanbot: well exactly. something bound by accidental inhalation on the lower end and hernias on the higher

02:41:58 kakobrekla: Z axis of 50 is most problematic parameter :)

02:41:58 asciilifeform: hanbot: naturally depends on the size and quantity of objects being moved.

02:42:39 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: actually a 'z' of 5cm or so would suffice.

02:42:54 kakobrekla: mostly - Z is a small fraction of X or Y

02:42:57 kakobrekla: yeah.

02:44:15 asciilifeform: hanbot: my old machine - http://media.molboxllc.com/minion-ios.mp4

02:44:24 asciilifeform: hanbot: about the size of a compact car.

02:45:20 asciilifeform: well, not mine. belonged to usa.

02:49:48 hanbot: looks pretty hefty

02:50:09 asciilifeform: it was.

02:54:58 BingoBoingo: Interesting change of pace https://atc.waroflife.com/gow/13/

02:54:59 assbot: Game 13 - Death 2563 Life 7437 Year 738 - War of Life

02:55:29 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: Theodore Y. Ts'o doesn't comprehend what random means << 'random' is simply a non-scientific qualifier. like 'big'.

02:59:14 decimation: how relevant the senate is: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9249837/U.S._Senator_blasts_Microsoft_s_H_1B_push_as_it_lays_off_18_000_workers

02:59:14 assbot: U.S. Senator blasts Microsoft's H-1B push as it lays off 18,000 workers - Computerworld

02:59:38 decimation: But the senator's attack on "three of our greatest masters of the universe," and "super billionaires," was clearly primed by Microsoft's announcement, also on Thursday, that it was laying off18,000 employees. "What did we see in the newspaper today?" said Sessions, "News from Microsoft. Was it that they are having to raise wages to try to get enough good, quality engineers to do the work? Are they expanding or are they hiring? No,

02:59:39 decimation: that is not what the news was, unfortunately. Not at all."

03:02:43 asciilifeform: decimation: if the indians graduating from u.s. schools agreed to live 10 to a room in a dormitory, instead of 250k/yr in chumper town (see http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-04-2014#606968) they might get hired in place of the imported coolies.

03:02:44 assbot: #bitcoin-assets log

03:03:25 decimation: indeed. and the question of banning the import of said coolies is off the table of course

03:03:38 BingoBoingo: %tslb

03:03:40 atcbot: 1 hour 17 minutes and 57 seconds

03:04:16 asciilifeform: decimation: why should microshit (or anybody else) subsidize the real estate racket?

03:04:21 decimation: the irony being that the very many who can make such policy (a senator) is whining about what bill gates says in the newspaper

03:05:06 decimation: yeah that's the underlying driver. bezzle -> real estate values -> suddenly life is unaffordable for the peasants

03:08:03 asciilifeform: decimation: if you think a senator - or entire senate - can ban the use of coolies - i've a bridge to sell.

03:08:21 asciilifeform: !up hanbot

03:09:05 asciilifeform: the real estate mafia would dearly love such a ban - but even they cannot make it happen.

03:10:17 decimation: one would think that the voters would be against the dilution of their own power

03:10:24 asciilifeform: lol.

03:10:30 decimation: but this is a case of the deer kneeling in front of the hunter

03:12:36 asciilifeform: i for one don't give even a basic fuck whether microshit employees can live in mansions - or in specially-constructed oubliettes with a terminal in the lid and a hole for shit in the bottom.

03:13:20 decimation: there were plenty of the early ones who cashed in on bezzle money - real estate prices are not cheap around bellingham

03:14:10 asciilifeform: pyramids happen.

03:14:29 decimation: according to mircea's theory, the us voter want to emulate their soviet brothers - turn themselves into the third world gulag so that they can be a somebody

03:15:13 asciilifeform: since mp seems to be on a bit of a dan mocsny kick, let's channel herr mocsny:

03:15:14 asciilifeform: 'I don?t have to write that I want millions of chickens to be brutally murdered. I can buy all the dead chickens I want at the grocery. When advocating a policy that requires violence for its implementation, it is rarely necessary to advocate the violence. Once people agree to implement the policy, the necessary violence will be forthcoming.'

03:15:44 asciilifeform: the idiots want to 'matter.' the gulag will be forthcoming. no one needs to ask for it.

03:15:58 decimation: even if they are technically free to do otherwise, they are not free.

03:24:19 decimation: "they are not free" << I mean that they lack the will to do otherwise, making their "rights" and "freedoms" as useful as toliet graffiti

03:24:41 decimation: http://fraudsters.com/2012/in-re-philosophy-freedom-of-scientific-information/#footnote_0_44044 "You probably know of it through the ulterior, bastardized, middle-class morality of ?no politics at the dinner table?. In practice, people were gathered around the table because they had business together, and the bourgeois do not wish to have higher considerations possibly interfere with their stuffing of the gullet, so they adapted an old

03:24:43 assbot: In re “Philosophy : Freedom of scientific information” pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

03:24:43 decimation: rule for new needs"

03:26:05 decimation: ie as long as the peasants are fat, dumb & happy they don't give a shit what the remote lords might wish, even if on paper the peasants are in charge

03:42:10 mircea_popescu: benkay yeah.

03:42:34 mircea_popescu: hanbot:

03:42:34 mircea_popescu: danke. so preet bharara finally lost a case http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/business/Rengan-Rajaratnam-case-shows-limits-of-insider-trading-laws.html << fucking douches. no, it shows the limits of the fucking corrupt us government.

03:42:37 assbot: Log In - The New York Times

03:43:13 mircea_popescu: this "we got the courts rigged so you gotta say you did what we say you did and then go to siberia" bs only goes as far as it goes.

03:44:07 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: mpex modem << as i recall, reliability of net connection is not an issue at mpex << so far that's the part that works best.

03:45:34 mircea_popescu: hanbot:well exactly. something bound by accidental inhalation on the lower end and hernias on the higher << i agree. half meter cube, ideal robot.

03:46:27 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: Theodore Y. Ts'o doesn't comprehend what random means << 'random' is simply a non-scientific qualifier. like 'big'. << looking forward to reading medicine treatises in similar terms. something tells me teh colonies will soon deliver.

03:48:08 decimation: why would usg bother with the minor part of the little brother anyway

03:50:41 artifexd: []bot appears to be down. I'm out of the country. Can't fix it until I get back next week. Sorry folks.

03:53:53 mircea_popescu: artifexd aite

03:53:55 mircea_popescu: decimation hm ?

03:55:17 decimation: the rengan rajaratnam dude

03:55:35 decimation: "It seems unlikely that he?d have been hired at Galleon were he not Raj Rajaratnam?s brother. Even then, his older brother demoted him several times and he made less money there than some secretaries."

03:55:36 dub: !isitdown mpex.co

03:56:53 mircea_popescu: it's down.

03:57:25 mircea_popescu: "That seems to have been the end of the courtship. (Mr. Palecek died from an infection in 2010.)" << the rate at which these people die of preventable causes is ridiculous. seriously, work for supposedly the masters of the country, best paid job, corridors of power, die of "an infection" ?

03:58:34 decimation: yeah that was amusing too

03:58:40 decimation: I guess they ran out of nailguns

03:59:16 benkay: <asciilifeform> <hanbot> well exactly. something bound by accidental inhalation on the lower end and hernias on the higher // 6-8 axis arm on an actuated sphere. hernias not an issue, follows one around.

04:00:52 decimation: mircea this insider trading thing is relevant to your post I linked above. information doesn't want to be free, but who gets to decide if it is secret?

04:01:32 Vexual: those that have it

04:01:38 mircea_popescu: that problem is a lot worse than anyone wants to admit.

04:01:46 benkay: mircea_popescu: well keep la serenissima posted

04:01:57 mircea_popescu: there's simply no logical way to reconcile the naive want for "fairness" with the practicality of trade.

04:02:14 mircea_popescu: "insider trading" is what trading is. irrespective of what people who don't trade wish to think trading is.

04:02:47 mircea_popescu: much like you know, trying to prosecute "buggery" because people who don't have sex don't want to think of sex in terms of "all holes, dp and your girlfriend". as if.

04:03:42 decimation: yeah what is trading without "insider" knowledge? trades based on an account's report and a brochure?

04:03:51 hanbot: is there a logical way to reconcile the naive want for "fairness" with -anything-?

04:03:53 decimation: I can't imagine a way to be more ignorant about a business and its prospects

04:04:00 mircea_popescu: benkay so far fighting with the obscurity of free and open source software, which is this endless bundle fifty million lines long that nobody ever read, in spite of you know, how "open source" etc.

04:04:50 mircea_popescu: decimation now granted, what the indians are doing in the us finance (btw, have you noticed how few 3rd generation americans are involved in anything worth the mention ?) is nothing short of scandalous

04:05:20 mircea_popescu: however, the solution is emphatically NOT to try and prosecute them, because this just drives the specific behaviours enshrined in indian culture that cause the mess.

04:05:43 mircea_popescu: the solution is to open the whole thing, let the market drive it down to zero, then you won't care someone made fifty bucks or w/e.

04:05:55 decimation: and note that Mr. Bharara is also one of them...

04:06:14 mircea_popescu: yeah. it's that whole "italian mobster turned policeman to clean up ny" story all over again

04:06:26 mircea_popescu: (which was the same cca 1890, except then it was irish criminal etc)

04:06:44 decimation: in my undergrad it was assumed knowledge that the indians got together to "strategize" on exam-taking

04:07:24 decimation: in India, it would probably be expected for a Brahmin C-suite guy to tell a fellow Brahmin trader what is going on

04:07:32 benkay: mircea_popescu: that nobody ever read // it's p lulzy people still buy that

04:07:46 mircea_popescu: what, you mean ?

04:08:55 benkay: see: openssl

04:09:21 benkay: jaspersoft

04:09:24 benkay: puppet

04:12:20 benkay: mircea_popescu: die of "an infection" ? // i prefer the interpretation where the us is always on the verge of horrific viral outbreaks due to decades of antibacterial abuse

04:12:36 decimation: 'don't talk politics around the table (so we can just eat)' -> 'don't question the code(so we can just use it)'

04:14:19 mike_c: any audiophiles around here? my headphones of 15 years finally bit the dust.

04:14:35 decimation: benkay I think you mean bacterial outbreaks. They are already happening: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/superbug-stalked-nih-hospital-last-year-killing-six/2012/08/22/5be18b1a-ec66-11e1-9ddc-340d5efb1e9c_story.html

04:14:36 assbot: Superbug stalked NIH hospital last year, killing six - The Washington Post

04:14:59 Vexual: micey: buy speakers

04:15:13 mike_c: not so good for the office.

04:15:18 Vexual: fuck the offic

04:15:22 mike_c: or for sleeping babies.

04:15:26 decimation: my sennheiser HD280's studio monitors work very well

04:15:35 Vexual: er.. what decimation said

04:16:04 mike_c: although i agree with the office. my office neighbors annoy me often enough.

04:16:19 decimation: do you want to attenuate the surrounding noise?

04:16:34 mike_c: nah

04:16:48 mike_c: i mean, i don't need cancelling. i don't want to hear surrounding noise.

04:16:59 decimation: I find earbuds and the like extremely uncomfroatble, you aren't going to get better quality than bigass headphones

04:17:06 hanbot: mike_c imo etymotic earphones rule all.

04:17:21 decimation: hanbot did you get them custom fit

04:17:36 hanbot: decimation nope

04:18:14 mike_c: are those buds? i'm looking more for over-ear.

04:18:31 decimation: yeah those are earbuds that block sound

04:18:33 hanbot: buds, yeah.

04:18:37 decimation: better than any headphone will

04:19:17 decimation: I'm a sennheiser fanboi, but I'm sure there are other quality headphones out there. examine the spec sheet

04:19:25 cazalla: i love my m50s

04:19:45 mike_c: cazalla: ath m50?

04:19:51 cazalla: m50s

04:20:27 cazalla: m50 has coiled cable which i don't like, m50s does not

04:20:55 mike_c: that just personal preference? my dead ones had coiled and i kinda did like that.

04:21:29 cazalla: yeah, makes no difference to audio afaik

04:21:32 mircea_popescu: hanbot no, not as such. the traditional way is for the naive to train their submission, as practiced in say india.

04:21:49 mike_c: cool. thanks for the suggestions.

04:21:54 mircea_popescu: <decimation> 'don't talk politics around the table (so we can just eat)' -> 'don't question the code(so we can just use it)' << ;/

04:22:01 mircea_popescu: cause fuck you if you have uncommon needs, right ?

04:22:14 mircea_popescu: the whole fucking point of code is to make the world more like salem cca 1700 now ;/

04:22:46 mircea_popescu: mike_c mice don't actually attack babies. you're thinking rats.

04:23:04 mike_c: lol, what?

04:23:06 mircea_popescu: o nm, earphones lol. i misread.

04:23:26 mircea_popescu: Vexual got me i swear!

04:23:48 Vexual: it's mouses

04:24:08 mike_c: now rats to attack office neighbors.. that would be an idea.

04:24:25 mircea_popescu: specially-constructed oubliettes with a terminal in the lid and a hole for shit in the bottom. <<< ahaha ok.

04:24:41 mircea_popescu: mike_c armored battlerats! with a terminal upside the head!

04:24:50 dub: my dj1200 are not that comfortable for long but they are hard to kill

04:25:04 dub: long periods

04:25:08 mike_c: definitely need comfort for hours.

04:25:23 Vexual: are those insertable or over ear dub?

04:26:24 dub: http://turntablelab.com/products/technics-rp-dj1200-headphones-black-deadstock

04:26:25 assbot: Technics: RP-DJ1200 Headphones - Black (Deadstock) — TurntableLab.com

04:26:35 mike_c: fucking amazon needs to take btc already. i bought some fiverr shit the other day with btc and it was so smooth. kind of changed my opinion on using btc for random purchases.

04:26:46 dub: good for lugging around

04:27:54 decimation: man the spec sheets for headphones suck

04:28:04 dub: the ear pad rubber is perishing on mine which is quite astounding considering how briefly every other set I've owned has survive

04:28:07 dub: d

04:28:35 mike_c: my sony mdr's ear pad rubber lasted about 5 years on average

04:28:53 mircea_popescu: apparently i'm getting a fucking fever.

04:29:17 mircea_popescu: mike_c they dun wanna end up with a bunch of terrorist bux

04:29:29 Vexual: kill it with half a bottle of red and go to sleep

04:29:31 decimation: or insider bux

04:29:47 mike_c: terrorist bux are as green as everybody elses.

04:30:03 mike_c: wait, is that a saying in other countries? your money probably isn't green.

04:30:30 dub: its usually a mix

04:30:30 Vexual: 100's are

04:30:49 dub: murican folding is fucking retarded in that aspect

04:31:01 dub: every note looks the same

04:31:14 decimation: well and worthless $1 are still bills

04:31:17 mike_c: i can't stand bills of different size. such a pain to roll.

04:32:01 dub: lol

04:32:23 dub: bitches don't know about mike_c's pimp roll

04:32:30 mike_c: it's phat

04:33:48 mircea_popescu: mike_c makes it quite impossible to get the wrong change.

04:34:06 mike_c: paying attention fixes that problem too

04:35:22 mircea_popescu: once you get the bitches you have no attention to spare.

04:35:34 mike_c: hehe. that's why i stick with one.

04:35:39 dub: 3rd world money tends to either be shit quality or stay in circulation long enough to wear any markings off

04:35:46 mircea_popescu: so basically the equal size bills are anti-slut.

04:35:55 mircea_popescu: DOWN WITH AMERICA

04:36:53 mike_c: no way. ben lawsky is going to make america the center of btc bizness

04:37:16 decimation: I would like to see the basis of his regulation

04:37:25 decimation: like, how is bitcoin different than plain speech?

04:37:48 decimation: if it isn't different, how is it legal for the government to regulate it, state or federal?

04:38:25 Vexual: afik aust was the first to deploy polymer banknotes

04:38:32 mike_c: idk.. ever since 9/11 the goverment just regulates whatever the fuck it wants.

04:38:38 decimation: if there's an exception for "game" currencies, how does one demonstrate that bitcoin is demonstrably different than a "game" currency?

04:38:45 decimation: lol more like ever since lincoln

04:38:45 mircea_popescu: decimation you don't need basis for regulation.

04:38:55 mircea_popescu: that's why regulation is taking over legislation as a normative process.

04:39:14 Vexual: fucking giuliani

04:39:39 mircea_popescu: decimation anyway, one doesn't "demonstrate". one claims, and prays nobody calls the bluff.

04:39:56 mircea_popescu: which is why the 100% conviction-through-plea-bargain system is so important.

04:40:49 mike_c: this doesn't work quite as well with companies. Lyft is testing this in NYC by blatantly ignoring all their regulations and fighting the state in court.

04:41:01 mike_c: results TBD

04:41:35 mircea_popescu: but anyway. the 2012 peg in the eye of the beast has been holding out splendidly well. they're trying to enact this difference between game currencies and bitcoin, and who knows, maybe it'll work. who;s to say that's the last peg fraudsters go.

04:41:37 mircea_popescu: got*

04:42:06 mircea_popescu: mike_c it exactly.

04:43:16 *: dub got some good news today

04:43:37 dub: won a 17 year olf legal battle

04:43:43 dub: old*

04:43:50 mike_c: nice. congrats.

04:43:57 dub: bad news is $200k legal bill

04:44:13 decimation: the layers upon layers of outlandish claims fossilize into a hardened mess - nothing can change the status quo - until the whole thing fractures and breaks in a massive earthquake

04:44:25 decimation: ie fragile, not robust or anti-fragile

04:44:56 mircea_popescu: dub divorce ?

04:45:21 Vexual: Go Around!

04:45:22 dub: no

04:45:58 Vexual: er that was for the fossilized mass, not dubs divorce

04:46:01 mircea_popescu: anyway, one of the comparatively more important btc valuations is, "cost incurred by the usg litigating per btc available to defendant".

04:46:18 mircea_popescu: definitely more important than derpstamp or w/e. and this is pretty hefty as we sit now.

04:46:52 mike_c: cazalla: m50x has detachable cable and you get coiled and straight. everybody wins.

04:47:42 decimation: mircea: the usg tends to maximally claim & minimally deliver

04:48:41 decimation: if bitcoin goes up another one or two orders of magnitude in dollar value, it will be that much worse for the usg to do anything

04:49:46 Vexual: mike_c get rabbit fur bads for extra boss

04:50:31 decimation: my sennheisers have detachable cables too, although the oem cable was crap - conductors broke after awhile

04:50:32 mike_c: they actually have velvet ones. http://www.amazon.com/ATH-M50-PADS-Velvet-pads-ATH-M50-headphones/dp/B00GTR2ICQ

04:50:33 assbot: Amazon.com: ATH-M50-PADS - One Pair Black Velvet ear pads for ATH-M20x, ATH-M30x, ATH-M40x, ATH-M50, ATH-M50s, ATH-M50RD, ATH-M50WH, ATH-M50x, ATH-M50xBL, ATH-M50xWH: Electronics

04:51:02 decimation: according to their spec sheet, the ath m50's only go down to 15 hz, the sennehiser hd280's go down to 8 Hz

04:51:15 decimation: that's going to be more audible than whatever the top frequency in the ultrasonic band is

04:52:23 mike_c: hm. ath has lower impedance.

04:52:32 decimation: human hearing being a logrithmically spaced filter bank and all

04:52:43 decimation: impedance is a matter of what you are connecting with

04:53:08 mike_c: yeah. won't matter for computer.

04:53:19 mike_c: could matter for phone?

04:53:34 mike_c: probably not.

04:53:35 decimation: my guess is no

04:53:52 decimation: impedance actually varies with frequency, which no one gives a spec for

04:54:11 decimation: in a basic sense, impedance mismatch will just lower the effective power delivered to the headphones

04:54:15 decimation: so turn them up, etc

04:54:33 mike_c: right, phone can only deliver so much though. but probably enough for either.

04:55:00 decimation: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4388969?start=195&tstart=0

04:55:02 assbot: iPhone 5 headphone volume too low | Apple Support Communities

04:55:17 decimation: "The issue as I understand it is that the output impedance of the iPhone 5 is around 3.7 ohms whereas the older phones and iPods are around 5.5 ohms. What is not clear is whether this has been changed by software or by hardware. There are reports that this is an issue in the EU region only. Yet some folk in the USA are also complaining."

04:55:30 decimation: so either headphone is going to have an impedance mismatch

04:55:57 decimation: because apple has neither the room on their board or the inclination to deliver studio quality audio

04:57:04 decimation: if you think about it, headphones that block surrounding audio will increase the effective signal/noise ratio delivered to your ears

04:58:14 mike_c: decisions..

04:58:28 Vexual: just buy the 50s you wally

04:58:58 decimation: I suspect the average listening would be unable to differentiate most of these headphones in a blind test

04:59:08 decimation: s/listening/listener

04:59:35 Vexual: get the velvet, and if you get too stoned you can hide in the curtains

04:59:54 mike_c: yeah.. sennheiser doesn't have velvet.

05:00:01 decimation: if you are going to use them for 8 hours per day in the office, comfort is probably more important than audio quality

05:00:17 mike_c: it is, but that is difficult to know before trying for 8 hours

05:01:28 decimation: indeed, I guess the solution is buy one and sell it on craigslist if it sucks

05:01:41 Vexual: for $120 try a fresh set

05:01:45 mike_c: yes. or return it.

05:01:48 dub: the solution is dont work in an office

05:02:00 mike_c: i like working in an office. fewer distractions.

05:02:54 decimation: I find comfortable headphones with classical music encourage focus

05:03:22 mike_c: i find the same with electronic music. di.fm ftw.

05:03:36 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFVdTw4PwE0

05:04:49 dub: boombox with gangster rap tbh

05:04:59 mike_c: whatever works

05:05:12 Vexual: ghetto blaster is best

05:11:55 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQM1-NSVGjg

05:17:48 dub: heh, famous actor lives across road, pulling into my drive earlier I see another actor getting a box of beer out of his car and going inside

05:18:05 dub: they're now playing what looks like GTA5 on his huge ass tv

05:18:31 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KL9mRus19o

05:19:05 Vexual: lets go around with a bottle of glen fiddich

05:21:44 Vexual: pitch mp's idea, wich is way better than his last

05:22:37 cazalla: mike_c, didn't know they had an m50x, i still think i'd go the m50s due to no coil and i would likely lose the cable if i could detach it anyway

05:23:18 dub: fresh out of glenfiddich but I'm now sipping a glenrothes, good suggestion

05:24:07 cazalla: Vexual, i think aus was first, i still have some of the first abo polymer notes around somewhere

05:25:09 mike_c: cazalla: m50s is cheaper too, just b/c it isn't 'current year model'. sound is supposed to be the same.

05:25:24 cazalla: you can get the m50s for around $100 on special sometimes

05:26:58 Vexual: d'you keep your rabbit skins cazalla?

05:27:13 cazalla: no but i should

05:28:03 cazalla: mike_c, only thing i dislike about m50s is the soundstage is a little too small for fps gaming, i switch to my speakers when gaming but they aren't gaming headphones to begin with so isn't a big issue

05:29:27 mike_c: yeah, not a problem for me

05:30:56 mike_c: ok, i'm off to buy something and hit the sack. thanks for the help.

05:31:52 Vexual: beats by dre:buy

05:32:24 cazalla: Vexual, kill yourself

05:32:55 Vexual: i was joking about what mike hunt bought dick nob

05:34:21 cazalla: beats give you +10 swag, that's about it

05:37:43 cazalla: hey Vexual, you know the aussie victims of the MH17 crash, my old primary school teacher was on it

05:38:32 Vexual: yes i heard that

05:38:51 Vexual: was it some year 4 hex?

05:39:15 cazalla: well, he made me write lines

05:39:50 cazalla: had to do em again as taping 2 pencils together to write 2x was too obvious

05:41:08 cazalla: dunno if being asploded was warranted punishment for him though

05:41:28 Vexual: yeah its harsh

05:41:58 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y6ihWvymwg

05:42:51 cazalla: not my cup of tea

05:43:06 Vexual: sams or the music?

05:43:23 cazalla: music

05:43:37 Vexual: im not a big fan of sams

05:45:40 Vexual: commericail airlines flew over iraq and afghanistan for the last 10 years, this might be a proper war

05:51:05 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8WLYzA0lCs

05:51:58 cazalla: multipass

05:55:26 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEPTlhBmwRg

06:01:36 benkay: <decimation> benkay I think you mean bacterial outbreaks. They are already happening: // yup. been drinking all day.

06:03:19 BingoBoingo: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=667460.msg7930421#msg7930421

06:03:19 assbot: Phinnaeus Gage aka ~Bruno Kucinskas - DEBT PAID 7/19/2014

06:04:34 Vexual: ben10: 2 beers?

06:05:29 benkay: uh

06:05:37 benkay: gosh lost count boss

06:05:47 Vexual: yep. 2

06:06:09 Vexual: dou so digital it hurts

06:07:18 benkay: Vexual: pm

06:08:54 Vexual: aight maybe 12

06:09:25 benkay: a few yeah

06:09:35 Vexual: it happens

06:21:19 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ui2NJ3dXpeY

06:40:08 Vexual: ;;ud having a lend

06:40:09 gribble: http://fr.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=having%20a%20lend | An Australian term meaning to be lying to a person for one's own amusement. " He said she had an STI" "He's only having a lend of you". de ZStardust 13 février  ...

06:41:11 mircea_popescu: !s infinite number of arms

06:41:12 assbot: 1 results for 'infinite number of arms' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=infinite+number+of+arms

06:58:45 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://fraudsters.com/2014/big-numbers-random-numbers-and-whos-got-your-number/

06:58:46 assbot: Big numbers, random numbers and who’s got your number ? pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

07:00:34 Vexual: d'you pay .15 for 3 tits?

07:01:23 mircea_popescu: lol

07:02:39 Vexual: i dtill think a cell phne cam is an excellent source of entropy

07:03:24 Vexual: but, poison is the thing more than reverse anything

07:03:28 mircea_popescu: there's no free entropy lunch.

07:04:38 Vexual: excellent aritlce

07:06:06 mircea_popescu: glad you liked it.

07:11:09 Vexual: i might even understand it tomorrow; this water is giving me heartburn

07:12:53 Vexual: no i think i get it

07:16:01 mircea_popescu: !up ceger

07:17:20 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 327 @ 0.0028813 = 0.9422 BTC [+] {3}

07:21:24 penguirker: New blog post: http://fraudsters.com/2014/big-numbers-random-numbers-and-whos-got-your-number/

07:22:46 jurov: yes, good article

07:23:24 jurov: next time i see someone reading from bones or coffee stain imma pester them whether they have tested past output for enough entropy

07:24:05 Vexual: entropy is irrelevantr oto these soothsaysers

07:24:33 Vexual: ask em something else

07:24:36 jurov: i daresay otherwise

07:24:52 jurov: they certainly seem to need some randomness source

07:24:58 Vexual: say away dear lamb

07:25:23 jurov: without it, their output could be too predictable

07:25:46 jurov: what would expose them to potential problem

07:29:59 *: jurov imagines soothsayer's ad "We use FIPS-compliant oracles"

07:36:53 fluffypony: mircea_popescu: you've seen Total Recall, no?

07:37:47 Vexual: dies the new one have 3 titites?

07:37:57 fluffypony: yes

07:38:10 fluffypony: personally I prefer the old one, but at least they kept that bit in for continuity :-P

07:38:14 Vexual: will watch

07:38:43 mircea_popescu: fluffypony the one film schwarzy made that was trying to not be hack and slash ?

07:39:08 mircea_popescu: jurov generally their whole claim is butressed on such past history.

07:39:32 fluffypony: mircea_popescu: yes, otherwise known as "that movie that came out when I was 8 or 9 years old that I wasn't allowed to watch because it had a chick with 3 tits in it"

07:39:42 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.SELL] 76 @ 0.012999 = 0.9879 BTC [+]

07:40:02 fluffypony: but that I watched a couple of years later anyway when one of my school friends got it on VHS

07:40:03 mircea_popescu: which is why the warning came to be on financial products, that "past performance is no indication of future success". the fortune teller makes two spurious claims, one that his arbitrariety is systematic, the other that he has a good historical record.

07:40:28 mircea_popescu: the latter is easier to disprove, but the former easily sticks with people, who then form the spurious belief that everything is systematic

07:40:36 mircea_popescu: hence conspiracy theorists, forum investors etc.

07:40:47 mircea_popescu: fluffypony i was allowed to watch it.

07:40:52 mircea_popescu: being a yurpean rocks i guess.

07:41:10 Vexual: yeah buy you wer like 14

07:41:29 Vexual: you woulda been mean then

07:41:36 fluffypony: my parents let me watch all measure of stuff, but Total Recall was bad because they didn't want an 8 year old believing that girls had 3 boobs

07:41:59 mircea_popescu: i was allowed to watch pasolini's fucking decameron

07:45:29 Vexual: most 8 year olds prolly have livelank now

07:45:37 mircea_popescu: anyway, the baby-in-belly was the more disturbing part i thought

07:46:11 Vexual: tru dat

07:46:50 Vexual: is he in the new one ?

07:49:19 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oMQ4ZFdH5c

07:51:54 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 901 @ 0.00288522 = 2.5996 BTC [-] {3}

08:02:39 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJ5KlZNh1WA

08:10:09 BingoBoingo: !up ceger

08:23:25 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 310 @ 0.00289631 = 0.8979 BTC [+] {3}

08:25:58 fluffypony: http://i.imgur.com/omUhB6F.png

08:26:26 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Naf5uJYGoiU

08:27:33 Vexual: more cowbell

08:30:46 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHDYfoRYcqQ

08:31:22 Vexual: fluffypony, your iris dna assay is in, you're 5% negroif

08:32:47 Vexual: you are also 20% gold

08:33:54 fluffypony: lol

08:33:57 mircea_popescu: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/BenfordsLaw.html random link of the day

08:33:57 assbot: Benford's Law -- from Wolfram MathWorld

08:34:09 mircea_popescu: in a randomly selected lit of numbers, 30% will start with 1.

08:34:35 mircea_popescu: it's close to 50% if you take atomic weights

08:35:11 mircea_popescu: !up ChesterMolester

08:35:22 ChesterMolester: lold

08:35:33 ChesterMolester: sup mircea

08:35:57 ChesterMolester: Come visit USA, we’ll go for pizza ;)

08:37:19 fluffypony: I think he's on the no fly list

08:37:26 ChesterMolester: lold

08:37:59 fluffypony: NICE TRY SEC SPY

08:39:25 Vexual: baloney!

08:40:02 mircea_popescu: ChesterMolester who're you again ?

08:40:11 ChesterMolester: Hasbro / JoshG

08:40:23 ChesterMolester: I came for the woman and stayed for the coin

08:40:33 mircea_popescu: lol mkay.

08:41:13 mircea_popescu: anyway, had enough us for a decade or two.

08:41:26 mircea_popescu: maybe i visit after the fall. play fallout in new reno irl or some4thing.

08:41:44 fluffypony: Josh Groban?

08:43:48 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pl3vxEudif8

08:47:30 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnZzNToI1tE

08:56:06 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5IhZod5Dso

09:21:43 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcXNPI-IPPM too soon?

09:35:19 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j8feWhVfj1Y

09:45:42 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eh44QPT1mPE

09:56:09 fluffypony: tres cool: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZPs7knvs7M

09:56:10 assbot: Real Life Holodeck with an Oculus Rift - Computerphile - YouTube

09:58:18 Vexual: are you getting one?

09:59:44 fluffypony: an Oculus Rift, or the entire research lab they have?

09:59:45 fluffypony: :-P

10:00:59 xmj: Hi world.

10:01:28 fluffypony: morning xmj

10:02:19 Vexual: a rift or 2

10:02:56 fluffypony: Vexual: yes definitely, hopefully when it's finally released they'll have the motion sickness stuff fixed etc.

10:03:02 fluffypony: the redirected walking stuff is amazing

10:03:02 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

10:03:06 xmj: when will oculus move its Rift to Google Glass dimensions (ie tiny) ?

10:06:13 fluffypony: Valve is working on a display that can fit in tiny dimensions - it beams the image straight on to your eyes

10:06:24 fluffypony: so it doesn't need big LCD screens

10:07:26 Vexual: does chinny get seasick?

10:09:55 xmj: interesting

10:10:24 xmj: is valve still scheduled to release a steambox that'll eventually make 2014/2015/whenever they release it/ the year of linux on the "desktop" ? :)

10:11:27 dub: WORD

10:11:28 Vexual: buy a few devkits and leave that dog fuck voin alone

10:11:40 Vexual: you'll make mor emoney

10:11:52 xmj: wwwwhat?

10:12:48 fluffypony: Vexual: no not at all, but I would imagine I'll use it with friends who may get motion sickness

10:13:10 dub: administer weed

10:13:30 dub: motion sickness instafix

10:13:53 Vexual: yeah weed

10:14:19 xmj: still not legal here :|

10:14:44 dub: quaint

10:14:50 Vexual: tell the judge its for virtual reality

10:15:37 xmj: motion sickness ===> medical purposes

10:15:46 Vexual: mel de mere

10:16:51 Vexual: take a unit into court and a fat bifter

10:17:42 Vexual: ;;ud bifter

10:17:42 gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bifter | Bifter. A slang term given to the lumps of rock found on ski slopes that need to be "De-Bifterd" in order to remove them. "Watch out James, there's a bifter on the ...

10:25:15 Vexual: benkay: never again? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FH-q0I1fJY

10:34:31 Vexual: fluffy are you making aircool racks to datatabk specs?

10:35:17 Vexual: r3box?

10:36:03 fluffypony: not to spec, just standard 19" size

10:36:17 fluffypony: but smaller than a standard rack since it doesn't need all the extra fluff on the sides and back

10:38:47 Vexual: if datatank get sucessuful they will be dumping hardware onto hobbyists on a regular basis

10:46:32 Vexual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdsTUfDTEhQ

11:17:16 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.171 = 1.71 BTC [-] {4}

11:26:37 Vexual: mmm cutlets

11:49:59 cazalla: gee le happy merchant meme gets /r/bitcoin up in arms

12:20:13 FabianB: !mpexstatus

12:20:26 FabianB: $mpexstatus

12:20:29 empyex: FabianB: Proxies: ".. running a final swathe of test-all-the-edge-cases .. mpex should be back this weekend. also fabian is pretty cool." MPEx-Status: Error reaching trade engine (change: $proxies <newlist>)

12:30:56 chetty: http://www.engadget.com/2014/07/18/this-bacteria-eats-nothing-but-electricity-to-survive/

12:30:57 assbot: This bacteria eats nothing but electricity to survive

12:56:54 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 759 @ 0.00280204 = 2.1267 BTC [-] {7}

13:10:57 thickasthieves: <+cazalla> i love my m50s /// mike_c those are the best in that price range imo

13:14:03 thickasthieves: mike_c for even more value for the price, and less heavy: http://www.amazon.com/JVC-Head-band-Headphones-HA-S500-Z-Gunmetallic/dp/B008FWB9XW these won't block outside noise as much though

13:14:05 assbot: Amazon.com: JVC Victor Head-band Portable Headphones | HA-S500-Z Gunmetallic (Japanese Import): Electronics

13:15:03 thickasthieves: mike_c dont get the velvet m50 pads!

13:16:22 thickasthieves: the headphones really weren't designed for the velvet pads and the sound becomes obviously worse to any ear

13:18:37 thickasthieves: I use the JVCs for going on walks and such, and the ATs for making music and while flying

13:18:55 thickasthieves: I have more expensive ones and i dont really like them as much

13:40:37 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 2679 @ 0.00290035 = 7.77 BTC [+] {8}

13:42:39 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 290 @ 0.00291924 = 0.8466 BTC [+] {3}

13:53:07 thickasthieves: coindesk is teaching TA now? http://www.coindesk.com/trend-spotting-identify-trends-bitcoin-price-charts/

13:53:07 assbot: Trend Spotting: How to Identify Trends in Bitcoin Price Charts

13:57:31 thickasthieves: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2b6edt/btc_guild_has_posted_the_following_notice_in/

13:57:32 assbot: BTC Guild has posted the following notice in reaction to NYDFS proposal : Bitcoin

13:58:04 thickasthieves: "Since there is no way anybody will mine on a pool with those requirements, it means that any pool in the US will be forced to shut down, or operate illegally and hope they're ignored."

14:11:49 thestringpuller: dude what the fuck is even going on? All bitcoin companies are gonna vacate the US

14:14:20 thestringpuller: ;;search bitlicense

14:14:20 gribble: There were no matching configuration variables.

14:22:48 pankkake: http://www.coindesk.com/9-biggest-screwups-bitcoin-history/

14:22:48 assbot: The 9 Biggest Screwups in Bitcoin History

14:22:51 pankkake: !search bitlicense

14:22:52 assbot: 7 results for 'bitlicense' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=bitlicense

14:24:35 thestringpuller: ugh, I guess I'm moving to France.

14:25:32 pankkake: lol

14:26:28 pankkake: http://fraudsters.com/2013/the-future-of-bitcoin-regulation/

14:26:29 assbot: The future of Bitcoin regulation pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

14:57:46 nubbins`: hi

15:06:01 asciilifeform: re: headphones << can't decide which i like more. 'qc20i' or firing range earplugs.

15:06:29 asciilifeform: qc20i works slightly better, and ear gets less tired, but it did cost ~250x more.

15:06:54 *: asciilifeform uses headphones mainly to 'turn off hearing' to improve concentration.

15:06:59 *: nubbins` was about to ask

15:07:15 nubbins`: muffs would be the ideal solution

15:07:31 nubbins`: airport workers use -90dB ones

15:07:32 asciilifeform: muffs >> ick. pressure, sweat.

15:07:35 *: nubbins` nods

15:07:36 nubbins`: true

15:08:18 nubbins`: there's also these earplugs that some drummers use, they mold to fit your outer ear like an old-school hearing aid

15:08:22 *: asciilifeform owns these muffs, can't even picture trying to think in them

15:08:45 nubbins`: although they're more geared towards muting w/ a flat frequency curve than blocking out all sound

15:08:55 asciilifeform: nubbins`: had those as a student. also pressure.

15:08:58 nubbins`: ah

15:09:14 nubbins`: pascale uses the standard orange squeezey ~30dB ones

15:09:21 nubbins`: not great for your canals

15:09:57 nubbins`: you ever try white/pink noise?

15:10:24 asciilifeform: nubbins`: as a matter of fact, i'm surrounded by it (fans.) it's precisely what i'm trying to be rid of.

15:10:31 nubbins`: ah, heh.

15:11:00 nubbins`: standalone (speakers rather than earphones) noise cancellation system?

15:11:16 nubbins`: iirc some high-end car manufacturer did this with the sound system

15:11:49 nubbins`: http://imgur.com/cGbQfBd

15:11:49 assbot: imgur: the simple image sharer

15:11:56 asciilifeform: nubbins`: this only works (for some modest value of 'work') in a car

15:12:24 asciilifeform: where the noise is something like a point source, plenty of soft fabric to cancel echos, etc.

15:12:34 nubbins`: i suppose individual room configurations would make it tough to pull off in a general sense

15:13:01 nubbins`: you could always build a soundproof room and put the fans outside it

15:13:27 asciilifeform: with infinite money, sure.

15:13:58 nubbins`: not prohibitively expensive. musicians do it all the time

15:14:57 nubbins`: i have a friend who can play drums in his bedroom with the door closed and you can barely make out the beat

15:15:58 nubbins`: starting point: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul00/articles/faqacoustic.htm

15:15:59 assbot: Soundproofing & Acoustic Treatment

15:16:02 asciilifeform: nubbins`: we also have climate here. without forced air cooling, machines will die (of humidity) even before the owner succumbs.

15:16:17 asciilifeform: so one would also need to come up with a silent air conditioner.

15:16:32 nubbins`: dem conflicting requirements

15:19:23 nubbins`: we have climate of a different sort here, to the point where i can't recall ever seeing an air conditioning unit in a private home. at the risk of asking a silly question, could one have the unit outside the room and vent the cool air in?

15:19:42 nubbins`: (isn't this roughly what an air exchanger does?)

15:20:04 asciilifeform: nubbins`: this is SOP here. air conditioner for whole house. compressor and its hot coil are outdoors, heat exchanger and gigantic fan inside.

15:20:40 asciilifeform: air is ducted to each room

15:20:50 nubbins`: right, yeah, sounds familiar

15:21:09 nubbins`: and it's the actual noise of the air being ducted in that you're trying to eliminate?

15:21:13 asciilifeform: (the very shoddiest dwellings still have window air conditioners)

15:21:45 nubbins`: $500k home here *might* have an air conditioner :D

15:21:47 asciilifeform: nubbins`: i would, in principle, care, if it were possible to eliminate all other fan noise

15:23:45 asciilifeform: nubbins`: i've thought about building something like the 'cockpits' flight simulator players are fond of. chair with display in a 'canopy.' but it would need its own cooling setup...

15:24:13 nubbins`: nod

15:24:49 nubbins`: liquid cooling system built into chair ;D

15:26:27 asciilifeform: the hot air one exhales still has to go somewhere.

15:27:26 asciilifeform: i don't really see all of this as adding up to a solvable engineering problem, but catch myself thinking about it now and then anyway.

15:32:27 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 60 @ 0.01384796 = 0.8309 BTC [-] {9}

15:32:56 kakobrekla: * asciilifeform uses headphones mainly to 'turn off hearing' to improve concentration. < you wear those cause model m, admit it!

15:33:43 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: actually i never had any problems with one-off noise (e.g. keys). because when i'm thinking i scarcely touch the keys.

15:34:29 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 140 @ 0.01306014 = 1.8284 BTC [-] {7}

15:36:00 kakobrekla: aha

15:37:32 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 817 @ 0.00299998 = 2.451 BTC [+] {3}

15:40:27 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: '...died from an infection in 2010... << the rate at which these people die of preventable causes is ridiculous' << quite likely, that fellow really died of - sleep deprivation. compromised immune system. and yes, one wouldn't expect an actual 'master of the universe' to succumb to sleep deprivation. senior bureaucrats, on the other hand - sure.

15:46:36 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2014/big-numbers-random-numbers-and-whos-got-your-number/ << 'random-looking number' is reminiscent of the 'miasma theory' of disease causation. in fact, much of what presently passes for 'seekoority' is quite like miasma epidemiology. crock of shit, resulting not only from inability, but from unwillingness to to even contemplate cause-effect.

15:46:37 assbot: Big numbers, random numbers and who’s got your number ? pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

15:48:43 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 66 @ 0.01281244 = 0.8456 BTC [-] {6}

15:51:46 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 280 @ 0.003 = 0.84 BTC [+] {2}

15:54:49 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 64 @ 0.01250032 = 0.8 BTC [-] {8}

15:59:55 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] [PAID] 1.79153408 BTC to 12`352 shares, 14504 satoshi per share

16:00:56 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] [PAID] 25.04673864 BTC to 1`149`988 shares, 2178 satoshi per share

16:09:24 xmj: so, FACTA has an impact on my european union bank

16:09:29 xmj: even if i don't deal with US through it.

16:09:31 xmj: wtf?

16:16:37 nubbins`: !s greenhouse

16:16:37 assbot: 4 results for 'greenhouse' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=greenhouse

16:16:47 nubbins`: http://www.vice.com/read/greenhouse-app-hannah-ewens-nick-rubin-201?utm_source=vicefbus

16:16:48 assbot: This Kid Made an App That Exposes Sellout Politicians | VICE United States

16:16:49 nubbins`: my sides

16:17:06 nubbins`: (clickbait headline but amusing nonetheless)

16:23:50 xmj: fluffypony: are you aware of anyone pushing Cloud as a Service?

16:25:02 fluffypony: Rackspace is, I think

16:25:42 xmj: oh, i mean the four-letter-marketing-combination

16:26:03 xmj: AWS/Rackspace/etc do the whole CaaS thing anyway

16:26:17 fluffypony: ah ok, no not offhand

16:27:02 xmj: I want to see how far you can push verbal boundaries into bulshytt territory. think Virtual Cloud, Virtual Enterprise Cloud Management, blabla

16:27:08 *: xmj chuckles

16:42:21 fluffypony: Virtual Cloud Enterprise Single-Sign On Management as a Service

16:42:28 fluffypony: VCESSOMaaS

16:42:49 xmj: I love that.

16:43:12 xmj: this will do for 300th tweet. thank you fluffypony

16:44:07 xmj: fluffypony: https://twitter.com/xmjEE/status/490899909839966208

16:44:51 fluffypony: lol

16:48:38 xmj: the profile page on twitter

16:48:43 xmj: is that your wife?

16:54:22 mircea_popescu: !up Basquiat_

16:56:22 mircea_popescu: pankkake https://blog.flameeyes.eu/2014/07/libressl-is-taking-a-beating-and-that-s-good << all i see is more of the same, "fucktards are butthurt, how dares anyone upset the statu quo"

16:56:23 assbot: LibreSSL is taking a beating, and that's good | Flameeyes's Weblog

16:57:17 asciilifeform: 'ubuntu: turns out is actually windows vista with a few custom themes.'

16:57:28 mircea_popescu: i have no idea who fucking asked amazon fanboi there to pass his judgement on de raadt, but i can state for teh records it wasn't me.

16:58:09 asciilifeform: anyone here knows de raadt in person?

16:59:33 asciilifeform: linked from above - the old, familiar http://www.entropykey.co.uk << still sold out, no date for next shipment (1 year + now!)

16:59:33 assbot: Simtec Electronics Entropy Key: USB True Random Number Generator

17:00:03 kakobrekla: how about never.

17:00:22 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: i suppose they keep the site up, for old time's sake

17:00:26 mircea_popescu: the better news here is that while i tried to sleep my cold off people actually got to the bottom of the whole gpg snag. hallelujah.

17:04:11 kakobrekla: any guesses why they stopped making them?

17:04:22 thestringpuller: ;;calc .25 * 400

17:04:22 gribble: 100

17:07:15 mircea_popescu: not enough dough in it ?

17:07:16 asciilifeform: kakobrekla: why they stopped making them << ft meade's shipments of diddled ARM micros held up. budget blown on coke.

17:13:31 chetty: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/07/air-force-research-how-to-use-social-media-to-control-people-like-drones/

17:13:32 assbot: Air Force research: How to use social media to control people like drones | Ars Technica

17:20:29 xmj: fluffypony: ping

17:20:49 fluffypony: oh sorry missed that

17:20:50 fluffypony: yes it is

17:21:16 xmj: I see.

17:21:19 xmj: fluffypony: awesome :)

17:22:12 fluffypony: :)

17:23:00 mircea_popescu: chetty gotta love how the sm people keep pumping out more articles about how essential sm is.

17:23:28 mircea_popescu: it'd read "cern laboratory using social media to collide large hadrons" if the movie of the week were about the cern

17:27:09 mircea_popescu: speaking of which, dear intelligent people stuck on reddit&co - this is you : http://fraudsters.com/2014/i-wasnt-going-to-actually-post-this-but/

17:27:11 assbot: I wasn’t going to actually post this, but… pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

17:27:39 mircea_popescu: you've bought into the entire sm swag just like other generations have bought in the shit offered for their consumption. guess what : the fact that you all get it only hides the fact that it's shit from you yourselves,

17:28:00 mircea_popescu: not from anyone else. and it doesn't even do such a good job of hiding it from you yourselves on a long enough timeline.

17:28:51 mircea_popescu: it's still shit, in the manner the local fair in lexington, kentucky, even if called "the flaming man", is still a very poor approximation of the actual burning man.

17:29:28 chetty: social media seems to do a really good job of killing social

17:29:31 mircea_popescu: and even if parents would much prefer their 17 yo rebelious teenager goes to the flaming man instead of the burning man, and even if they give the car with a full tank of gasoline and two small bottles of ginger ale for the former and punish the latter,

17:29:55 mircea_popescu: fucking lexington is still a joke, and you're going to be a joke for going there. not just in my eyes, which whatever, who cares, but in your own 60yo eyes. and that burns.

17:30:16 mircea_popescu: /done ranting.

17:34:39 mircea_popescu: social media, fucking chewing gum. what is it ? it's not social, nor is it media. it's not a food, not a liquid, basically a stationery bike for you jaw.

17:36:39 chetty: seems more like a cattle prod

17:40:11 chetty: feliz dia del amigo

17:41:39 mircea_popescu: o wow that exists ?

17:42:07 mircea_popescu: is it the day of the married man's secret homosexual friend ? like "jour de la chere amie" would be in france ?

17:49:08 benkay: ;;ud having a lend

17:49:09 gribble: http://fr.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=having%20a%20lend | An Australian term meaning to be lying to a person for one's own amusement. " He said she had an STI" "He's only having a lend of you". de ZStardust 13 février  ...

17:49:32 benkay: ;;later tell vexual no lend, but doubtful that it'd be serial.

17:49:33 gribble: The operation succeeded.

17:57:14 benkay: <mircea_popescu> maybe i visit after the fall. play fallout in new reno irl or some4thing. // empire collapse when

17:57:42 chetty: seems to be a sort of generic friends day, can't walk down street without hearing it today

17:58:49 mircea_popescu: these people can make a feast out of anything.

17:59:01 mircea_popescu: samba si! trabajo no!

17:59:15 benkay: my kind of country i tell you

17:59:34 mircea_popescu: lol

18:02:40 benkay: <fluffypony> an Oculus Rift, or the entire research lab they have? // i can't wait for the full-wraparound displays with lots and lots of pixels

18:02:53 benkay: no more monitors, headsets only

18:04:15 benkay: <thestringpuller> ugh, I guess I'm moving to France. // oh ffs really?

18:07:47 chetty: http://www.coindesk.com/chinese-exchange-okcoin-launch-usd-deposits-withdrawals/

18:07:47 assbot: Chinese Exchange OKCoin Launches USD Deposits and Withdrawals

18:08:02 chetty: The company does not plan to register for money transmission licenses in the US immediately

18:17:54 mircea_popescu: i thot china made btc illegal.

18:26:11 Oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/enlist/

18:26:12 assbot: Enlist!

18:29:51 mircea_popescu: all these people derping about "quantum-computing-strong hashes" and whatnot are starting to get on my motherfucking nerves. yo idiots! are you aware that every rng out there actually uses some sort of quantum noise ? WHAT THE FUCK ARE HASHES GOING TO DO WHEN I KNOW ALL THE SEEDS!

18:34:48 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: to be fair, the machine (as described originally by r. feynman) doesn't divine history a la asimov's 'chronoscope', but merely computes certain classes of function unusually cheaply.

18:35:00 mircea_popescu: and you know this how ?

18:35:16 mircea_popescu: the rules as they are preclude its existence. that may not mean it can't exist,

18:35:32 mircea_popescu: but it does mean that IF it were to exist, we can't say anything about what it can't do./

18:35:33 BingoBoingo: http://www.theonion.com/articles/openminded-man-grimly-realizes-how-much-life-hes-w,19273/

18:35:35 assbot: Open-Minded Man Grimly Realizes How Much Life He's Wasted Listening To Bullshit | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

18:35:48 chetty: quantum = magic (at least vocabulary wise)

18:35:58 asciilifeform: let's put it slightly differently. if it's also a chronoscope, this cannot be readily inferred from feynman's hypothetical.

18:36:18 mircea_popescu: but feynman's hypothetical is not wholly self-contained.

18:36:21 mircea_popescu: if it were, we could build it.

18:36:36 mircea_popescu: so, i can argue that yes, it is just as readily inferred as anything else.

18:36:43 asciilifeform: i sorta get the flavour here. perpetuum mobile, were it build, could perhaps also cure baldness.

18:36:48 mircea_popescu: why not ?

18:37:05 mircea_popescu: the day false evaluates to true, you're nine feet tall

18:37:08 mircea_popescu: should you wish to be.

18:37:14 mircea_popescu: simply because 5 is the new 9.

18:37:45 asciilifeform: (setq #f #t) << actually evaluated this in a 'lisp' i wrote as a schoolboy. mega-lol.

18:38:06 mircea_popescu: moreover, you trying to sell my king a device to harden the fortress against perpetuum mobile which relies on the 1st law of thermo will get me to advise him to hang you.

18:38:08 mircea_popescu: because srsly.

18:38:10 asciilifeform: later found that in the original fortran, one could assign... to a constant.

18:38:20 mircea_popescu: yup, the old story of 4.

18:38:33 BingoBoingo: BitPay doubles down on marketing to Joe Six Pack http://coinfire.cf/2014/07/20/bitcoin-symbol-appear-bobby-dodd-stadium/

18:38:34 assbot: Bitcoin Symbol to Appear on Bobby Dodd Stadium - Coin Fire

18:38:48 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo where's that one ?

18:39:19 asciilifeform: it's a good job that f-students can't actually break mathematics.

18:39:27 mircea_popescu: srsly.

18:39:35 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: That one's some regional school. Probably sponsored because it is close not BitPay's Atlanta HQ.

18:39:56 mircea_popescu: this is the package maintainer's path to divinity : prevent all the f-students, masquerading as women-interest, "general public" interest etfuckingc from breaking math.

18:40:22 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo this is starting to look so much like classic doctom bubble burnage...

18:40:33 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 6 @ 0.17100833 = 1.026 BTC [+] {2}

18:41:20 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: For sure. With one of these discovering how much was spent will be a hard problem unless they just let the number slip.

18:41:33 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 9 @ 0.16494445 = 1.4845 BTC [-] {4}

18:42:52 mircea_popescu: thanks to all the inflation, they're safe : they didn't have that much to spend anyway. i doubt anything under 1bn even registers anymore, especially after the great successes of govt contractors in the mideast.

18:43:55 BingoBoingo: Also not there aren't very many "Halliburton Stadiums" because the contractors that abide know lean years are possible

18:44:12 mircea_popescu: more like, because hb count'd give less of a shit.

18:44:28 mircea_popescu: it's a mpex sort of corp, not a hot topic sort of corp.

18:44:36 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 5002 @ 0.00309973 = 15.5048 BTC [+] {8}

18:45:10 BingoBoingo: Right, or an AT&T or another sophisticated herder of consumer cattle

18:45:26 BingoBoingo: Also guide to ripping on Jews as a good libertard http://this-is-not-jewish.tumblr.com/post/34344324495/how-to-criticize-israel-without-being-anti-semitic

18:45:27 assbot: This Is Not Jewish (How to Criticize Israel Without Being Anti-Semitic)

18:45:37 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 300 @ 0.00309966 = 0.9299 BTC [-] {2}

18:49:16 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: http://youtu.be/rR56uNg2XQs?t=2m43s << finally found the ancient cartoon with the schooltard who zaps all of history so he doesn't have to pass exam.

18:49:17 assbot: ( 2) () - YouTube

18:50:56 Pierre_Rochard: I wouldn’t describe GT as a “regional school”: http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2012-13/subject-ranking/subject/engineering-and-IT

18:50:56 assbot: Top 50 engineering & technology universities - Times Higher Education

18:54:50 BingoBoingo: Pierre_Rochard: It seems that list strengthens the case of it as a regional school when it comes to Athletics.

18:56:17 Pierre_Rochard: Eh, they are in NCAA Division I.

18:56:26 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform omfg, it's got BEK! pankkake you sly dog.

18:56:32 Pierre_Rochard: BingoBoingo: here’s what “regional” generally means: http://www.usnews.com/education/best-colleges/articles/2013/09/09/frequently-asked-questions-2014-best-colleges-rankings#11

18:56:33 assbot: Frequently Asked Questions: 2014 Best Colleges Rankings - US News

18:57:06 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: bek ?

18:57:08 mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard so basically it's the georgia tech stadium ?

18:57:18 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform bek! 2:48

18:57:32 Pierre_Rochard: mircea_popescu: yup, seats 55k http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Dodd_Stadium_at_Historic_Grant_Field

18:57:33 assbot: Bobby Dodd Stadium - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

18:57:47 mircea_popescu: aha.

18:58:06 BingoBoingo: Rather small for a college football stadium

18:58:25 asciilifeform: 'век' == 'century'

18:58:31 Pierre_Rochard: BingoBoingo: agreed, my alma mater seated 100k.

18:58:38 Pierre_Rochard: seats*

19:00:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform shhh :p

19:00:53 BingoBoingo: Pierre_Rochard: Regionalness is an attribute that can feature differently on Aspects of a University. Consider a school in the opposite situation, Texas Tech. National University in athletics and very regional school academically.

19:01:19 mircea_popescu: http://this-is-not-jewish.tumblr.com/post/34344324495/how-to-criticize-israel-without-being-anti-semitic <<< ahahah, "don't use what happens to be the largest, oldest and generally speaking most important european meme, because it may butthurt jooz"

19:01:19 assbot: This Is Not Jewish (How to Criticize Israel Without Being Anti-Semitic)

19:01:52 mircea_popescu: this is the most preposterous shit i ever read. hey, fifty million jewish people ? about a billion people happen to not give a shit. this is how it should be.

19:02:05 Pierre_Rochard: BingoBoingo: agreed

19:02:11 mircea_popescu: ima end up persecuting fucking jews as the initiators of this "vocal minority trying to opress majority" meme.

19:02:43 Pierre_Rochard: BingoBoingo: I guess we’re just using different definitions of “regional”, the one that’s “bachelor + master” is more commonly used

19:03:13 mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard i originally thought it's a highschool/municipal sort of stadium for some reason.

19:04:09 mircea_popescu: "Don?t call Jews you agree with ?the good Jews.? Imposing your values on another group is not okay. Tokenizing is not okay. Appointing yourself the judge of what other groups can or should believe is not okay." << omfg. this is about as offensive as it gets.

19:04:23 Namworld: So I have this cat I just adopted. He's always following me around and tend to lay down at my feet. Won't let me sleep, walking on me and trying to get under the sheets. So I close the door to the bedroom. Then shortly later, I hear the cat and look. He's inside the room playing. I think wtf, must have slipt back in while I was closing the door. I go put him out, close the door, go back

19:04:23 Namworld: to bed. Noises in the room. I look, he's back in the room.

19:04:25 mircea_popescu: appointing yourself the judge of all fucking creation is the point of life.

19:04:32 BingoBoingo: Pierre_Rochard: There's a lot of small shit schools getting on the doctoral train trying to escape their regional labels, so it is best not to use bachelor+masters as a measure. That and there are Bachelors (sometimes + masters) schools that are better candidates for escaping regionalness than some shitholes like Ohio State.

19:04:49 mircea_popescu: Namworld got a hole in your roof ?

19:04:56 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 796 @ 0.00309999 = 2.4676 BTC [-] {2}

19:05:13 Pierre_Rochard: BingoBoingo: I agree, “national research university” has gotten diluted.

19:05:18 asciilifeform: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hU6RpNugTfg

19:05:19 assbot: (At the Back Desk) episode 2, English subs - YouTube

19:05:22 asciilifeform: ^ english subs

19:05:24 asciilifeform: for aficionados

19:05:32 Namworld: Basement appartment.

19:05:57 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 173 @ 0.0031539 = 0.5456 BTC [+] {2}

19:06:38 mircea_popescu: "Don?t depict the Magen David (Star of David) as an equivalent to the Nazi swastika. The Magen David represents all Jews?not just Israelis, not just people who are violent against Palestinians, ALL JEWS. When you do this, you are painting all Jews as violent, genocidal racists. DON?T." << and for that matter, the swastika represented all germans, not just the ones involved in homicide.

19:06:54 mircea_popescu: so you know... stop misrepresenting the swastika as something bad just to serve your need to scapegoat imagery.

19:06:56 Namworld: So I wonder what kind of sorcery this is. Then I notice a service panel to pipes slightly opened. That fucker was opening the cabinet under the sink, crawled into the walls with the pipes and made it's way to the room.

19:07:14 mircea_popescu: Namworld ahahah i think that's a keeper :)

19:07:59 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 225 @ 0.00315393 = 0.7096 BTC [+]

19:08:59 Namworld: Well definitly. That cat would chew a door to get to me. Can hear it scratching doors to follow me. That plus always laying at my feet. It's more like a dog.

19:09:11 mircea_popescu: so treat it well and be happy.

19:09:15 mircea_popescu: maybe one day a woman does the same.

19:17:21 Namworld: All I need now is to find it a name, eh.

19:24:14 mircea_popescu: you could call it brock.

19:24:26 mircea_popescu: on the strength of the similarity in behaviour.

19:24:43 BingoBoingo: Lol sneaking into bedrooms

19:24:59 assbot: Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/0SSCNR5.txt )

19:24:59 BingoBoingo: !b 3

19:25:38 Namworld: Who?

19:26:16 BingoBoingo: The FOundation guy

19:26:55 asciilifeform: sounds like the ideal cat. deserves a respectable name.

19:28:20 BingoBoingo: OMG BUllet point #2 https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BtAmSI5CQAA4AY7.jpg

19:29:51 mircea_popescu: decentralized key generation ?

19:29:59 mircea_popescu: what's this, a way to reduce key entropy to breakable levels ?

19:30:25 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: probably some crackpot m-of-n scheme again

19:35:35 mircea_popescu: "have a 4096 rsa key made out of 8 parts! it may not be as strong as the proper key, but that's good : if you forget your passphrase you can break the key and retreive your stuff!"

19:35:45 asciilifeform: lol

19:36:00 mircea_popescu: "also only terrorists would do this unauthorisedly."

19:36:26 mircea_popescu: "and it's illegal to not let us do illegal shit when we want to anyway, so."

19:38:28 BingoBoingo: ;;calc 4096/8

19:38:29 gribble: 512

19:38:41 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: this isn't how it works.

19:39:16 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: if you know ~1 in 4 bits, you can trivially break.

19:41:19 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well, it COULD be designed as a concatenation somehow, thus actually retaining 500ish bits. maybe.

19:41:40 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: It's hard to predict derpitecture

19:41:59 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: there are published recipes for this. see 'multi-party computation' literature.

19:42:29 mircea_popescu: yeah just dun know how far i'd trust it.

19:42:40 asciilifeform: but there is virtually never any good reason to attempt it.

19:43:28 asciilifeform: for one thing, in most cases a plaintext exists, and who can know where and in how many copies.

19:46:24 BingoBoingo: http://insanecoding.blogspot.com/2014/06/memory-management-in-c-and-auto.html?showComment=1404216537390#c910627546852979802

19:46:24 assbot: Insane Coding: Memory management in C and auto allocating sprintf() - asprintf()

19:48:17 BingoBoingo: !up Duffer1

19:49:15 decimation: I was thinking about the "poisoned soup" model of determining the "randomness" of some numbers

19:49:34 decimation: it seems to me that if you had an infinitely large pot, you could tell whether the numbers were random or not

19:49:50 decimation: any source of finite entropy would eventually exhaust

19:49:56 asciilifeform: decimation: if you had an infinitely large pot, you could tip it over and drown the enemy.

19:50:13 decimation: heh yeah my point is of academic interest only

19:50:35 thickasthieves: "The U.S. government is rapidly expanding the number of names it accepts for inclusion on its terrorist watch list, with more than 1.5 million added in the last five years, according to numbers divulged by the government in a civil lawsuit."

19:50:44 decimation: although, the first practical test of any source of random numbers is to get a large quantity of them and see if there are any repeats

19:50:56 asciilifeform: decimation: the real lesson (which always seemed rather obvious to me, but what the hell) is that the numbers are uninteresting except in so far as they shed light on the mechanics of the source

19:51:40 decimation: indeed, and some of source must shine through with a mechanical generator

19:55:41 decimation: re: headphone "muffs": I used these sometimes in the office: http://support.radioshack.com/support_electronics/doc67/67054.htm (330-1198)

19:55:41 assbot: Racing Scanners: Frequently Asked Questions and Listening Tips

19:55:53 decimation: but after about 3 hours it feels like you have your head in a vise

19:55:56 benkay: <Oglafbot> http://oglaf.com/enlist/ // WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS

19:55:57 assbot: Enlist!

19:56:43 BingoBoingo: benkay: Twas I. It is a manual bot.

19:56:54 benkay: hahaha excellent

19:57:57 Oglafbot: Hello benkay

19:58:14 benkay: i don't watch nicks/joins/parts

19:58:34 benkay: i've not customized this irc client to both show those things but not display notifications for them

19:58:45 BingoBoingo: benkay: For a thing that updates weekly it seems the optimum haw to handle feed generation

19:58:46 decimation: what proxy bot do you guys use generally?

19:59:25 benkay: curse of emacs - it can behave any way you want it to, provided you put the time in to make it so.

19:59:52 benkay: decimation: emacs running on a vps, mosh for flaky mobile connections

20:00:08 decimation: interesting, you use ERC to host proxy?

20:02:52 mircea_popescu: so it turns out that ssh specifies ports with -p, but scp specifies ports with -P and -p is something else entirely.

20:02:59 mircea_popescu: that's half an hour i'm never getting back.

20:03:05 mircea_popescu: !up sheldonthomas

20:03:24 sheldonthomas: just swinging by wondering why mpex.co is down

20:03:43 sheldonthomas: or is it just some tacit geoip blocking

20:03:44 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas you can start here http://fraudsters.com/2014/mpex-status-update/

20:03:45 assbot: MPEx status update pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

20:03:50 fluffypony: the owner was arrested and deported to Argentina

20:04:01 sheldonthomas: sheesh you can’t be serious

20:04:15 fluffypony: I believe they're about to start waterboarding him

20:04:20 fluffypony: the Argentinians are rough

20:04:26 mircea_popescu: fluffypony teaboarding actually.

20:04:32 fluffypony: werd

20:04:34 mircea_popescu: im so fucking full of camomille i could burst.

20:04:35 decimation: yeah I've been hit by that ssh/scp thing many times, enraging

20:04:44 mircea_popescu: decimation just... why the fuck you know ? WHY!11

20:04:55 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 1000 @ 0.00300504 = 3.005 BTC [-] {5}

20:05:06 decimation: turn the screwdriver clockwise screw turns, turn it counterclockwise and it explodes

20:05:11 mircea_popescu: <decimation> any source of finite entropy would eventually exhaust << this breaks physics.

20:05:53 mircea_popescu: one of the core (if unknown) principles underscoring all creation is that the qty of entropy in a system remains the same if it's cut in half.

20:05:59 mircea_popescu: it may not be as accessible now, but it's there.

20:06:13 mircea_popescu: this is fundamentally why reductive (and most not-so-reductive) physicalism does not work.

20:06:22 mircea_popescu: and about as close as one can get to physically proving divinity.

20:06:37 decimation: indeed, it makes determinism persuasive

20:07:04 mircea_popescu: no, the contrary. in the quest to make determinism infeasible, it requires some sort of entropy reservoir outside-the-world.

20:07:18 mircea_popescu: basically god is just this very large dice assemblage in non-space, feeding all the quarks dicerolls.

20:07:18 sheldonthomas: six drives are bricked huh

20:07:52 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas anyway, that was then. meanwhile a lot of progress'been made (notices of which scattered all over the log), and we're coming out of da woods.

20:07:55 mircea_popescu: !s mpex

20:07:56 assbot: 24646 results for 'mpex' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=mpex

20:08:38 sheldonthomas: what’s to be expected when you finish the migration? everything back in place, accounts and the like?

20:08:38 BingoBoingo: http://coinfire.cf/2014/07/20/will-regulations-shutdown-pools/

20:08:40 assbot: Will Regulations Shutdown Pools? - Coin Fire

20:08:50 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas yes.

20:09:19 mircea_popescu: new mpex key, but otherwise nothing much.

20:11:18 decimation: I guess I was picturing "determinism" as "God sets the outcome of the quark-dicerolls in the way He sees fit"

20:11:24 sheldonthomas: disappointing, albeit understandable

20:11:32 mircea_popescu: <thickasthieves> "The U.S. government is rapidly expanding the number of names it accepts for inclusion on its terrorist watch list, with more than 1.5 million added in the last five years, according to numbers divulged by the government in a civil lawsuit." << hey asciilifeform look at that! what was gulag, 50mn ?

20:12:34 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas what's disappointing you mean ?

20:12:50 mircea_popescu: decimation a ok, then yes, pure determinism.

20:12:59 sheldonthomas: this downtime

20:13:14 mircea_popescu: obviously if one applied the same standards to quarks as it does to bitcoins, one could never trust the fucking quark. obviously quark-nsa is behind it.

20:13:21 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas ah. yes.

20:13:38 mircea_popescu: i have this impression your name's familiar, any idea whence ?

20:15:03 sheldonthomas: not really. i occasionally linger on assets. maybe we met back at the bruce wager bitcoin conference. i sat in the 2nd row

20:15:09 sheldonthomas: *wagner

20:17:04 fluffypony: third seat from the left?

20:17:17 fluffypony: with the bushy hair and the moustache?

20:17:30 decimation: re: scp/ssh user interface << Herr Moldbug's rant on this topic is apropos: http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2009/07/wolfram-alpha-and-hubristic-user.html "The error is that control interfaces must not be intelligent. Briefly, intelligent user interfaces should be limited to applications in which the user does not expect to control the behavior of the product. If the product is used as a tool, its interface should be as

20:17:33 assbot: Unqualified Reservations: Wolfram Alpha and hubristic user interfaces

20:17:33 decimation: unintelligent as possible. Stupid is predictable; predictable is learnable; learnable is usable."

20:18:47 decimation: I would note that Mr. Wolfram & co. are slowly migrating Mathmatica to be "pay us to use Wolfram Alpha in the cloud"

20:18:48 mircea_popescu: sheldonthomas got a wot acct ?

20:20:33 sheldonthomas: i’ve lost my fucking wot identity more times than i like to admit

20:21:08 mthreat: it's ok, your other identity will admit it for you

20:21:11 mircea_popescu: not so smart.

20:21:13 mircea_popescu: lmao

20:21:51 sheldonthomas: i know man. i had reviews from trades in 2011 with people like justmoon and then i lost that harddrive and thus that wot identity

20:22:12 sheldonthomas: mthreat so true

20:22:25 nubbins`: protip: offsite backups

20:26:23 fluffypony: or the Usagi Backup System

20:27:33 thestringpuller: yes usagi still has investors

20:27:39 thestringpuller: funny how that works

20:30:18 nubbins`: some guy who bought a print off me yesterday now wants to use it for his band's next album cover

20:30:55 benkay: ;;gettrust xanthyos

20:30:55 gribble: Currently authenticated from hostmask xanthyos!~xanthyos@d-206-53-92-136.cpe.metrocast.net. Trust relationship from user benkay to user xanthyos: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. Graph: http://b-otc.com/stg?source=benkay&dest=xanthyos | WoT data: http://b-otc.com/vrd?nick=xanthyos | Rated since: Tue May 13 21:36:26 2014

20:31:04 BingoBoingo: http://www.internetnews.me/2014/07/19/domain-registry-america-suspended-icann/

20:31:04 assbot: Domain Registry Of America Suspended By ICANN

20:31:29 xanthyos: benkay: i'm a friend of danielpbarron 's

20:31:51 benkay: so i read

20:32:50 mircea_popescu: !up xanthyos

20:33:31 nubbins`: !up sheldonthomas

20:35:33 mircea_popescu: jesus what passes for process in the us these days.

20:35:36 mircea_popescu: Q : "ie. mining your competitors? data to send unsolicited and misleading marketing messages isn?t allowed, so if you didn?t breach this clause how exactly did you send those notices?"

20:35:45 mircea_popescu: A : "none of your fucking business. door's that way."

20:36:44 thickasthieves: <@assbot> Domain Registry Of America Suspended By ICANN --- fuk ya!

20:37:37 thickasthieves: all the data they needed was public

20:38:01 thickasthieves: clients always asking me what the deal is when they get DRA letters

20:38:18 thestringpuller: nubbins`: so are you gonna sell him the album cover rights?

20:38:20 thestringpuller: lol

20:38:56 mircea_popescu: "I actually have been thrilled to see that finally there is movement to replace the straight access to /dev/random and /dev/urandom: Ted's patch to implement a getrandom() system call that can be made compatible with OpenBSD's own getentropy() in user space. And even more I'm happy to see that at least one of the OpenBSD/LibreSSL developers pitching in to help shape the interface.

20:38:56 mircea_popescu: Dropping out the egd support made me puzzled for a moment, but then I realized that there is no point in using egd to feed the randomness to the process, you just need to feed entropy to the kernel, and let the process get it normally. I have had, unfortunately, quite a bit of experience with entropy-generating daemons, and I wonder if this might be the right time to suggest getting a new multi-source daemon out." << a

20:38:57 mircea_popescu: sciilifeform do you read this thing like i do, ie, a nsa-sponsored attempt to survive the "everyone has cardano rng on board" apocalypse by making good entropy sources still circumventable ?

20:38:59 thickasthieves: maybe DRA can move on to Namecoin

20:39:10 mircea_popescu: o look, irc breaks names huh. asciilifeform ^

20:41:14 nubbins`: thestringpuller: blonde-dyed mullet kid with a skateboard making 40 tapes for his band

20:41:20 nubbins`: absolutely :D

20:42:24 thickasthieves: lol, so my wife has been buying these cat litter coupons on ebay for mos, free box, any size

20:42:32 thickasthieves: she just learned it's a fraud

20:42:38 BingoBoingo: do you read this thing like i do, ie, a nsa-sponsored attempt to survive the "everyone has cardano rng on board" apocalypse by making good entropy sources still circumventable ? << I read either that or some kernel afficianado who would buy a unix pacemaker

20:43:01 thickasthieves: we mustve gone through like 50 boxes

20:43:30 nubbins`: ha

20:43:31 thickasthieves: she;s all embarassed

20:44:30 fluffypony: it's a scam as in you get no boxes?

20:44:33 mircea_popescu: thickasthieves i don't follow, so did the coupons yield boxes or not ?

20:45:34 thickasthieves: yes

20:45:50 thickasthieves: grcoery clerks just dont klnow its a fraud yet

20:47:12 BingoBoingo: OMG USG Side channel attack on TaT via Ebay-Wife interaction

20:47:33 mircea_popescu: uh

20:47:51 mircea_popescu: so wait, basically your wife used some paper altcoin to defraud grocery chains ?

20:48:51 fluffypony: can I buy shares in this scam?

20:48:57 BingoBoingo: That's what I'm reading

20:49:39 mircea_popescu: decimation here's more. sha1 is implemented as "sha1sum". sha256 however is implemented as "sha256". then sha512 is... "sha512sum"

20:49:41 mircea_popescu: fuckwits.

20:50:10 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nsa 'expellas furca, tamen usque recurret.'

20:51:03 asciilifeform: who expects people to jump into the biodiesel fermenter on their own will.

20:53:36 BingoBoingo: Some dude wants to turn Linux into System/z http://www.enterprisestorageforum.com/storage-management/resource-management-and-control-a-straw-proposal-for-linux.html

20:53:55 BingoBoingo: Or sell System/z systems

20:54:19 benkay: can one do merged-mining on a premined coin?

20:54:38 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: lol at trying to rationally monitor or quota resources on x86 box.

20:56:07 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I haven't read the comments yet, but I wonder how many read it as a proposal for linux developments as opposed to IBM advertorial

20:56:13 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: nsa-sponsored attempt to survive << they won't really worry until wintel stops being a thing.

20:56:27 mircea_popescu: !s parachute

20:56:28 assbot: 50 results for 'parachute' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=parachute

20:56:33 asciilifeform: lol

20:56:36 mircea_popescu: :D

20:56:57 mircea_popescu: dude this entire bitcoin-assets system with its tools is turning me into a fucking singularity, im like brain on steroids.

20:57:00 mircea_popescu: fucking love it.

20:57:19 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu didn't have 'grep' before ?

21:00:35 mircea_popescu: convenience is half the tool.

21:01:03 BingoBoingo: %d

21:01:05 atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 687182.56 Est. Next Diff: 632330.36 in 1859 blocks (#42336) Est. % Change: -7.98

21:10:54 BingoBoingo: !up moiety

21:11:27 moiety: you beat me :] thanks

21:11:47 moiety: brought you something BB http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJCDa5fAWYc

21:11:47 assbot: Can a Thumbcat - Play Checkers? - YouTube

21:12:44 BingoBoingo: aw

21:17:05 moiety: :D i thought it was so funny

21:20:31 mircea_popescu: !up Fairlay

21:21:30 Fairlay: just wanted to apologize for user posting links to Fairlay on Bitbet

21:22:47 mircea_popescu: i don't imagine anyone really cares.

21:22:58 Fairlay: googled for Fairlay and found it in this history here

21:23:05 mircea_popescu: !s fairlay

21:23:06 assbot: 4 results for 'fairlay' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=fairlay

21:23:24 Fairlay: ok - than sorry again and goodbye

21:24:26 mircea_popescu: Fairlay you know, it may be a good idea to get in the wot.

21:26:21 Fairlay: I guess we are addressing more the new user that have never heard of WOT - since the old seems to be happy with bitbet

21:26:34 mircea_popescu: no but i mean for you personally.

21:26:42 mircea_popescu: as it is right now, you could be absolutely anyone.

21:26:52 the_real_fairlay: see ?

21:27:00 BingoBoingo: I don't rally think the Fairly comments on Bitbet really hurt BitBet at all http://bitbet.us/bet/519/btc-network-difficulty-to-top-1b-before-2014/#c2048

21:27:00 assbot: BitBet - BTC network difficulty to top 1B before 2014 :: 619.37 B (89%) on Yes, 74.04 B (11%) on No | closed 7 months 1 day ago

21:32:40 FabianB: artifexd: where is []bot btw.?

21:33:48 mircea_popescu: FabianB he said he's travelling and the bot croaked, can't touch till he's back

21:36:28 mircea_popescu: http://www.theonion.com/articles/openminded-man-grimly-realizes-how-much-life-hes-w,19273/ << the end of fucking days, when the parody sites are more truthful than the "serious" networks.

21:36:30 assbot: Open-Minded Man Grimly Realizes How Much Life He's Wasted Listening To Bullshit | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

21:38:13 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell mike_c ding me.

21:38:13 gribble: The operation succeeded.

21:41:41 decimation: yeah I've been burned by "md5sum" suddenly is "md5" on osx

21:44:55 FabianB: mircea_popescu: ah ic, bitcoin taking summer vacation :)

21:51:32 mircea_popescu: lol

21:57:39 benkay: thickasthieves: is atc a merge-mine thing?

21:59:02 dub: ;;isitdown mpex.co

21:59:03 gribble: mpex.co is down

21:59:11 dub: week since the last update

21:59:40 mthreat: mircea_popescu: there's a bitcoin meetup wednesday, at a local bar that accepts btc for drinks: http://www.meetup.com/Bitcoin-Argentina/events/195793132/

21:59:40 assbot: Charla de introduccin a Bitcoin - Meetup Bitcoin Argentina (Buenos Aires)- Meetup

22:00:34 benkay: say hi to diego for me mthreat

22:01:06 mthreat: ok (if I go)

22:01:17 mthreat: i've been meaning to check out that bar

22:01:37 benkay: dunno if he'll remember me, but it'd be cool.

22:01:52 benkay: ;;bcstats

22:01:54 gribble: Current Blocks: 311728 | Current Difficulty: 1.733631697850783E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 312479 | Next Difficulty In: 751 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 4 days, 16 hours, 39 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 19146535925.6 | Estimated Percent Change: 10.44177

22:02:03 benkay: is there a hashpower command?

22:03:02 dub: there was

22:03:06 dub: ;;nethash

22:03:07 gribble: 148187686.346

22:11:35 thickasthieves: <+benkay> thickasthieves: is atc a merge-mine thing? /// no, but i think it could be, and if it is, i might be willing to put some funds towards the dev, but no one wants my money so far

22:15:59 dub: whats atc nethash?

22:16:08 mircea_popescu: benkay who;'s diego ?

22:16:23 mircea_popescu: mthreat possibly, depending on how smoth mpex starts-up

22:16:35 dub: you want to be at least bigger than whatever Luke-Jr can steal before enabling mm

22:17:03 dub: %diff

22:17:05 atcbot: [ATC Diff] Current Diff: 687182.56 Est. Next Diff: 644621.51 in 1847 blocks (#42336) Est. % Change: -6.19

22:19:08 mircea_popescu: mm ?

22:19:11 mircea_popescu: oh.

22:19:21 mircea_popescu: isn't atc merge mined by default ?

22:19:28 dub: no

22:19:48 benkay: thanks dub

22:20:41 asciilifeform: http://yarchive.net/comp/linux/extreme_system_recovery.html#update_5

22:20:42 assbot: Extreme system recovery (Al Viro)

22:20:45 benkay: mircea_popescu: http://www.xinergia.com/home/cvdiego

22:20:46 assbot: Xinergia

22:21:13 benkay: <dub> you want to be at least bigger than whatever Luke-Jr can steal before enabling mm // pardon?

22:22:13 thickasthieves: he means you dont wanna give bigger miners an easy excuse to fork ATC

22:22:20 thickasthieves: (i think)

22:22:37 dub: he (and atm any number of miners) will kill your chain if you turn on merged

22:22:53 dub: rule of thumb, be bigger than eligius

22:23:46 thickasthieves: Eligius Pool Hashrate: 7,879.44 Th/s

22:24:54 benkay: "kill your chain" what do you mean by this?

22:26:00 dub: with iocoin (maybe ix too) he just mined the longest chain and didnt include any transactions

22:26:20 benkay: what

22:26:21 benkay: why

22:26:42 dub: because his goal is/was to stamp out altcoins

22:26:47 thickasthieves: for jesus

22:26:51 dub: ^

22:27:00 mircea_popescu: i don't get how this is supposed to work. so he mines and doesn't include txn

22:27:04 mircea_popescu: other miners do include them

22:27:06 mircea_popescu: where's the problem ?

22:27:23 dub: he has 99% of the network, no other miners get to play

22:27:23 benkay: if you're 95% of a given network...

22:27:35 mircea_popescu: dub 99% of what network ?

22:27:39 mircea_popescu: sha mm ?

22:27:54 dub: he has 8th

22:28:19 mircea_popescu: soooo

22:28:43 mircea_popescu: !s atcbot

22:28:44 assbot: 429 results for 'atcbot' : http://search.bitcoin-assets.com/?q=atcbot

22:29:20 mircea_popescu: %p

22:29:23 atcbot: [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 0.00 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 5152.05 GH/s

22:29:33 mircea_popescu: that's 5th no ?

22:30:04 mircea_popescu: if atc mms the hash will prolly go to 1ph anyway.

22:30:30 dub: you'd need to get 'good' pools on board

22:30:59 mircea_popescu: dub but there's ALREADY 5 th on board, and these are atc dedicated, they're not merge mining.

22:31:14 mircea_popescu: so if you add 8th from elegius that's what, 60% for luke, provided nobody else joins.

22:31:16 mircea_popescu: seems improbably.

22:31:46 dub: you sure? at a glance the diff doesnt look right

22:31:53 mircea_popescu: 03-07-2014 01:50:42 <atcbot> [CoinMiner Hashrate]: 0.02 TH/s [PityThePool Hashrate]: 14243.64 GH/s << this is the peak this month.

22:32:06 dub: is that a chain hopping pool though or atc dedi?

22:32:11 mircea_popescu: well unless mod6 fucked up the math.

22:32:16 mircea_popescu: dub how does this make a diff ?

22:32:26 dub: it might not be on atc right now

22:32:31 mircea_popescu: so ?

22:32:43 mircea_popescu: if it's mm'd it'll certainly be on.

22:33:13 mircea_popescu: anyway, news at eight : luke still irrelevant. big whoop.

22:37:13 mircea_popescu: this situation actually allows a window be thrown into bitcoin, to understand how it works. jesus atc is useful, props tat.

22:37:45 mircea_popescu: so : atc is not driven by "user adoption". it's driven by the fact that i'm buying it. in this context, if "evil" entity decides to just mine all the blocks, nobody gives a shit. so txn aren't included ? whatever.

22:37:52 dub: you dont want to look through that window either

22:37:57 mircea_popescu: that entity can either sell the coins it mines, in which case they end up with me, which is what i want anyway

22:38:07 mircea_popescu: or keep them, in which case it's actually making the coin more valuable.

22:38:23 mircea_popescu: this is the situation o nthe field : one has NO FUCKING CHOICE. this is how bitcoin works, and why it wins out.

22:39:53 mircea_popescu: bitcoin has been enacted by the fiat of a few important people, a few years ago, exactly in the same manner. they weren't THAT important as a % of the world, but that doesn't matter : bitcoin can't be un-enacted by the fiat of much larger entities. it has a cost of x to make and 1mn x aren't enough to undo it.

22:40:18 mircea_popescu: compared to this, user derpage and luser derpage on -dev is about as relevant as fairies in the spring rain.

22:40:56 dub: the scary thing about lukes altbashing was that, at the time tycho and eutheria were cheerleading for him

22:41:15 dub: so right there, a 90% mining cabal

22:41:31 mircea_popescu: what do kids know.

22:42:07 dub: for it was the point where I was closest to losing trust in the system

22:42:35 dub: bitcoin was in the hands of 3 people

22:42:38 mircea_popescu: takes one guy five minutes to give a woman a child.

22:42:46 mircea_popescu: modern science has not yet found a way to shove it back into the womb.

22:42:49 dub: probably still not far off

22:42:57 mircea_popescu: this is the situation here.

22:43:18 mircea_popescu: whatever you may think of the matter, bitcoin was never in the hands of THOSE 3 people.

22:44:31 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: thermodynamics concerns the inevitable, rather the immediate. e.g., the japanese prolonged holdout against gunpowder.

22:44:40 dub: well, if you are presuming some kind of economic principle would come to your rescue, im sorry

22:44:51 dub: you are talking about zealots and morons

22:45:01 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform time has compressed since then. their ability to hold out had a lot to do with the difficulty of seafaring then, and lack of satellites.

22:45:15 mircea_popescu: dub so you think idiocy is extempt from gravity ?

22:45:54 asciilifeform: i imagine everyone who ever cracked a book is familiar with island ecosystems and their doomed flightless birds...

22:46:09 dub: bitcoins single defense from evil miner conspiracy is incentive

22:46:12 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform you mean... the (actual) penguin ?

22:46:15 mircea_popescu: it wasn't on an island.

22:46:24 asciilifeform: such as it. doesn't have to be on an island, strictly speaking.

22:46:40 mircea_popescu: dub more's to it. as i explained to asciilifeform a while ago, it actually makes it impossible to be evil in raport to it.

22:47:00 mircea_popescu: and it has this major make/destroy inequality baked in, to cherry on top.

22:47:02 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=305 << me pontificating on related subject, some years ago

22:47:03 assbot: Loper OS » The Five Types of Technological Standard

22:48:04 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i appreciate consensus scoring under fiat.

22:48:25 dub: penguin is not really flightless per se

22:48:32 mircea_popescu: dub the old one.

22:48:37 asciilifeform: dub: the bird in question is 'true penguin'

22:48:45 asciilifeform: dub: extinct today.

22:51:17 mircea_popescu: anyway, the argument against merge mining atc has more to do with the value of having an actual sha competitor for bitcoin, which may well be very instructive

22:51:28 mircea_popescu: all the various altcoins of any description are scrypt.

22:51:50 asciilifeform: were there no alts prior to 'litecoin' ?

22:52:08 dub: well yeah, because teh sha ones have been eliminated (see above)

22:52:17 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform litecoin is scrypt, and yea iirc was 1st

22:52:34 dub: I dont think it was

22:52:36 mircea_popescu: dub no, just because people are a) poor and b) cluieless, in that order

22:52:37 pankkake: no it was not first, far from it

22:52:46 pankkake: don't listen to litecoiners history rewriting

22:52:53 mircea_popescu: pankkake we're not going to go into solidcoin and all that ?

22:53:04 pankkake: namecoin was there before, and litecoin isn't the first scyrpt before

22:53:12 mircea_popescu: o right you are, namecoin yeah

22:53:15 pankkake: either*

22:53:18 xanthyos: danielpbarron: who is better: dub or dubs?

22:53:23 pankkake: fairbrix tenebrix whatever

22:53:27 pankkake: either way: lies

22:56:20 mircea_popescu: o yeah, darkcoin had a "tenebrix" early run. anyway, aborted all.

22:56:59 BingoBoingo: In between namecoin and the Scrypt pre-mined anscestors of LTC there were a lot of other forgettable alts, many mergemined.

22:57:20 BingoBoingo: If I remember right CoiledCoin was the one Luke killed

22:57:25 mircea_popescu: actually this may be a good thing to do for a blogger : make the altcoin history chart.

22:57:43 mircea_popescu: major reference article, that.

22:57:50 asciilifeform: i distinctly recall seeing just such a chart about a year ago

22:57:56 mircea_popescu: link ?

22:58:00 asciilifeform: complete with fancy graphics, clickable zoom, etc

22:58:27 asciilifeform: http://mapofcoins.com

22:58:27 assbot: Map of coins: the history of cryptocurrencies from bitcoin to dogecoin and more

22:58:35 asciilifeform: ^ no idea if current

22:59:40 mircea_popescu: doesn't load here.

23:00:01 mircea_popescu: "For instance, hundreds of thousands of bacteria can form daisy-chained "wires" an inch or so long, and tap seawater oxygen for energy. Such filaments can hold soil together and conduct electricity about as well as standard copper wire." << wow.

23:00:04 mircea_popescu: le wetware!

23:00:15 BingoBoingo: http://mapofcoins.com/#

23:00:15 assbot: Map of coins: the history of cryptocurrencies from bitcoin to dogecoin and more

23:00:37 mircea_popescu: http://wetwareontologies.tumblr.com/ < btw.

23:00:37 assbot: Wetware Ontologies

23:00:46 decimation: if only you could harness bacteria to grow onto circuit-board test points...

23:03:08 mircea_popescu: decimation the better application seems self-building, self repairing connectivity.

23:03:23 mircea_popescu: who said we want or actually need mesh networks implemented over radio ?

23:03:31 BingoBoingo: http://i.imgur.com/KJOwR4g.png

23:03:32 mircea_popescu: how about the entire fucking ocean floor is a mesh network of bacteria guys

23:03:44 mircea_popescu: and yeah, you can destroy them.

23:03:52 mircea_popescu: go right ahead.

23:04:16 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo omfg holy shit.

23:04:28 mircea_popescu: for all of 2011-2013 i've been strictly ignoring alts, and look at all the time it's saved me!

23:04:32 BingoBoingo: Site isa javascript turd

23:04:34 asciilifeform: 'I want to build machines to do stuff that someone "like us" wouldn't want to do, for any of the several reasons (the job is hard/boring/stinky/whatever). And once I've built them, I want people to be able to use them. Please note this last point. People and other "nature's computers", like animals and fungi, aren't supposed to be "used". In fact, all those systems spend a huge amount of resources to avoid being

23:04:34 asciilifeform: used. Machines aren't supposed to be like that. Machines are supposed to do what you want. Which means that both the designer and the user need to control them.' (one mr. kreinin, with whom i have a number of disagreements, some public, but good point about meatware. -- http://yosefk.com/blog/high-level-cpu-follow-up.html)

23:04:35 assbot: "High-level CPU": follow-up

23:05:39 asciilifeform: motorcycle is considerably less efficient, thermodynamically, than horse - but more popular for, imho, good reason...

23:05:50 mircea_popescu: i dunno asciilifeform, i hear a lot of "please use me hard master" from some of the higher order "nature's computers".

23:05:55 asciilifeform: lol

23:06:14 asciilifeform: nobody cancelled pets

23:06:19 mircea_popescu: anyway. someone "like us" as the author fills that symbol does not belong above ground anyway.

23:06:21 mircea_popescu: fucking hippies.

23:06:43 asciilifeform: afaik he was flaming the hippies

23:07:04 mircea_popescu: gay spat.

23:08:08 mircea_popescu: can anyone explain to me why would latency be ever so slightly more going one way through a wire than coming the oher way ? same identical endpoints.

23:08:47 asciilifeform: the point about 'liveware generally doesn't wanna be used' can only be appreciated by folks who tried to breed industrially useful bacteria (e.g. e. coli secreting a saleable substance) - and the problems in that business

23:09:55 asciilifeform: short version - bacterium isn't a sled dog. he won't work if he doesn't 'want' to. (expressed in actual flesh as the formulation: the ones without the 'work' trait - e.g. secreting dope - tend to outperform their 'useful' peers in reproduction)

23:09:56 mircea_popescu: "the point about women not wanting to be used can only be appreciated by rapists". DOING IT WRONG

23:10:23 dub: re: latency, its probably how you are measuring it

23:10:30 asciilifeform: the problem, in case anyone doesn't know, is presently dealt with through luck and brute force.

23:10:45 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform consider how eminently used e coli are in the intestines of every mammal.

23:10:49 dub: but you'll get all kinds of inconsistency between network stacks, hardware, drivers etc

23:10:55 mircea_popescu: dub same shit tho.

23:11:09 mircea_popescu: same parts, same software.

23:11:11 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: sure. symbionts. now engineer some...

23:11:12 dub: how sure are you?

23:11:23 mircea_popescu: i am sure.

23:11:48 dub: checked every chip?

23:11:49 mircea_popescu: same exact model netcards. same firmware on the netcards.

23:12:24 BigBitz: same cables?

23:12:26 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: describe briefly the geometry of the wire.

23:12:46 BigBitz: could just be the ASIC on the Switchports.

23:12:47 mircea_popescu: a U with a very long bottom ?

23:13:05 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: most obvious explanation is clocks.

23:13:05 BigBitz: or it would be your machine badly timing the latency.

23:13:10 asciilifeform: ^

23:13:15 mircea_popescu: why one or not the other.

23:13:23 BigBitz: clocks have a tendancy to be 'shit'

23:13:30 mircea_popescu: wait. fuck.

23:13:35 BigBitz: silicon/ASICs have a tendncy to be better than 'shit;

23:13:37 mircea_popescu: no two clocks work the same huh.

23:13:40 asciilifeform: typical quartz oscillators are rated to 2%

23:13:46 mircea_popescu: it's equalizing over time. hey asciilifeform ! i just got some entropy!

23:13:50 asciilifeform: they have some - limited - thermal compensation.

23:13:58 BigBitz: yup heat can fuck shit up.

23:14:15 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is actually a traditional means of generating 'hardware entropy' on a pc. i rediscovered it as a kid, thought i 'had something nice'

23:14:25 mircea_popescu: right.

23:14:40 mircea_popescu: well, i built a rng oscillator. go me.

23:14:46 asciilifeform: a traditional pc comes with at least 2 measurable oscillators (cpu crystal and 18hz real time clock)

23:15:19 *: asciilifeform waits for announcement of mpex plant purchasing rhubidium frequency standard

23:15:36 dub: rhubarbium?

23:15:40 mircea_popescu: ahaha

23:15:43 assbot: Last 5 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2XVXK5X.txt )

23:15:43 mircea_popescu: !b 5

23:15:49 asciilifeform: unlike cesium clocks, these are inexpensive - radio stations in the civilized works are required to use them.

23:15:54 asciilifeform: *world

23:16:07 asciilifeform: to prevent frequency walking

23:16:37 asciilifeform: ;;google rubidium clock

23:16:38 gribble: Rubidium standard - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubidium_standard; Atomic clock - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_clock; Accubeat - Technology - Rubidium Atomic Clock Technology: http://www.accubeat.com/apage/17540.php

23:16:53 BigBitz: ah Atomic Clocks.

23:16:56 BigBitz: such accuracy.

23:17:01 BigBitz: many times.

23:17:06 BigBitz: much sync.

23:17:07 BigBitz: WOW

23:17:31 mircea_popescu: btw, did they ever make that rubidium superclock thing ?

23:18:09 BingoBoingo: http://hackaday.com/2013/08/05/turning-a-rubidium-standard-into-a-proper-tool/

23:18:10 assbot: Turning a rubidium standard into a proper tool

23:18:24 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: no idea about 'super', but these are ubiquitous in the radio industry.

23:18:46 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there was some design to make them stable-er than cesium and get rid of the cs standard entirely.

23:19:02 thickasthieves: <+mircea_popescu> so if you add 8th from elegius ///8PH

23:19:48 mircea_popescu: when did that happen.

23:19:59 mircea_popescu: what, elegius is solving blocks now ?!

23:20:46 BingoBoingo: It happens because the idiots buying miners are the same idiots who ever bought miners

23:20:49 asciilifeform: http://www.treasury.gov/resource-center/sanctions/OFAC-Enforcement/Pages/20140716.aspx << loltron. e.g., kalashnikov banned for import in usa.

23:22:35 mircea_popescu: In addition, the following individuals have been added to OFAC's SDN List: BESEDA, Sergey

23:22:49 mircea_popescu: lmao. so let me get this straight, if putin v2.0 decides to visit the us, they'll know ?

23:22:50 mircea_popescu: hao.

23:23:00 thickasthieves: http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/drugresistant-bacteria-sewagetreatment-plants-described-as-giant-mixing-vessels-after-scientists-discover-mutated-microbes-in-british-river-9615850.html

23:23:00 assbot: Drug-resistant bacteria: Sewage-treatment plants described as giant 'mixing vessels' after scientists discover mutated microbes in British river - Environment - The Independent

23:24:03 mircea_popescu: BORODAI, Aleksandr (a.k.a. BORODAI, Alexander); DOB 25 Jul 1972; nationality Russia (individual) [UKRAINE]. <<< aww, no prime minister of donetsk republic ? tsk tsk

23:24:05 mircea_popescu: lmao

23:24:17 assbot: Last 2 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3GRZJRH.txt )

23:24:17 BingoBoingo: !b 2

23:25:26 mircea_popescu: bazalt.ru << click on this, get added to some list or teh other.

23:25:40 BingoBoingo: This Dontesk Republic is basically just like a standard Hollywood sequel to Transndstria i.e. moar explosions

23:26:41 mircea_popescu: mhm

23:26:46 asciilifeform: rubidium clock << about 200 usd on 'ebay' and the like. who wants, can buy.

23:27:18 dub: mircea_popescu: back to your wire, validate your instrumentation first.

23:27:46 asciilifeform: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Supper-Low-JITTER-Clock-11-2896Mhz-Rubidium-Frequency-/180497234806 << mega-lol re: who it is pitched to!

23:27:48 assbot: Supper Low Jitter Clock 11 2896MHz Rubidium Frequency | eBay

23:27:48 BingoBoingo: http://bazalt.ru/en/nonlethal_weapons/ << Today, lethality weapons include weapons which lethality rate does not exceed 25 per cent.

23:27:49 assbot: Nonlethal weapons : en

23:28:20 benkay: <mircea_popescu> how about the entire fucking ocean floor is a mesh network of bacteria guys // okay

23:28:20 asciilifeform: 'put the rubidium oscillator's sine output into the cd player... it will enhance the sound quality greatly.'

23:28:34 asciilifeform: and here i thought the magic green marker was state of the art.

23:28:45 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: http://i467.photobucket.com/albums/rr32/flyingbest/cd.jpg?t=1246632694

23:29:16 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: the inescapable question, is, as before, what one must smoke.

23:30:21 BingoBoingo: I kind of wonder what the ruse it, seems like an overly strong emphasis on CD player much as the headshops emphasize their glass pipes are for tobacco

23:30:39 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: there is an entire 'culture' of audio voodoo.

23:31:33 BingoBoingo: I didn't know it was /this/ bad. I almost would rather believe this is for people building plasma rifles on the down low.

23:33:02 asciilifeform: back to clocks: it is grave mistake to regard a pc clock as a scientific instrument. you can get pretty good thermal stability out of a quartz resonator, using an 'oven' (more or less just like kitchen oven, in miniature - maintain controlled temperature.) but this is never found in a consumer appliance.

23:33:26 BingoBoingo: http://hackaday.com/2014/07/05/the-cheapest-crystal-oven/

23:33:28 assbot: The Cheapest Crystal Oven

23:33:31 BingoBoingo: !up nubbins`

23:33:32 asciilifeform: if you need serious (accurate and precise) timing, must use an instrument built for that purpose.

23:35:02 asciilifeform: 'gps' and similar navigation systems, for example, live and die on atomic clock (and correct for SR!)

23:35:06 dub: these problems almost always compounded by failure closer to the chair

23:35:18 nubbins`: hi

23:35:42 nubbins`: SR/TD correction in GPS sats blew my mind

23:36:04 benkay: hey nubbins` what's with these threaded beers you can't twist the tops off of in bc?

23:36:25 nubbins`: england is closer to bc, but i uh

23:36:29 asciilifeform: nubbins`: try example 'closer to home,' even. last generation of CRT displays had to include sr correction (short tube, less glass, but higher gun voltage - fast electrons.)

23:36:30 dub: had an identical problem brought to me after months of hand wringing by systems teams, 30 minutes later they had data to smack vendor with who later admitted to hidden NIC revisions and supplied new driver

23:36:32 nubbins`: threads mean you can twist 'em off, doesn't it?

23:36:39 nubbins`: *is closer than bc

23:36:49 BingoBoingo: I've long imagined a wrist portable watch with RTG (RTG also heats crystal) I'm resigned to knowing such a device probably wouldn't have the power to offer man readable time without an unacceptable risk of wrist cancer

23:37:06 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i recall reading about that, why teh russians couldn't make good crts. quantum effects.

23:37:26 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: actually i first learned of this when studying the demise of american tv makers.

23:37:33 asciilifeform: japan taught sr to engineers. america - no.

23:37:47 mircea_popescu: pretty much.

23:38:08 mircea_popescu: dub i don't use vendor supplied firmware.

23:38:30 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu bakes own NICs ?

23:38:36 *: asciilifeform impressed

23:38:47 mircea_popescu: it limits a lot of things ;/

23:39:04 *: asciilifeform digs handmade nic out of cigar box, blows off dust

23:40:23 mircea_popescu: anyway, now it's slower in the other direction.

23:40:36 dub: you're missing the point, make your dudes prove the test suite

23:40:49 asciilifeform: oscillator drift.

23:41:07 asciilifeform: unless the magnitude of the skew is more than 10 msec or so

23:41:27 dub: 99% of people who sell themselves as experts at this are probably trying to use 'ping'

23:42:16 mircea_popescu: dub these are draftees lol.

23:42:24 asciilifeform: incidentally, quartz oscillators generally don't come in the GHz range. there's a fairly modest (<100MHz) crystal and a PLL multiplier. which compounds any error...

23:44:06 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's fractions of a ms.

23:44:45 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: handily inside thermal drift range then.

23:46:10 BingoBoingo: Prolly ought to start ordering Rhubidium clocks for next downtime

23:46:45 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo what, and pass the chance to scramble madly for a week ?

23:47:17 asciilifeform: likewise - perhaps there is no need to point this out, but the linux/bsd kernel is also not a scientific instrument.

23:47:22 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Nah, you still scramble madly for a week as you chase cesium precision

23:48:02 asciilifeform: also must recall that machine contains other components with quartz oscillators - and some of these components sit on the bus and can toss interrupts.

23:48:03 BingoBoingo: After that you chase caesous precision because the fans can't slice cheese or something

23:49:00 *: asciilifeform digs for ancient paper regarding maliciously estimating a remote machine's temperature using userspace-observable clock drifts

23:49:32 asciilifeform: ^ if anyone has, please post here.

23:50:40 BingoBoingo: So now there's a paper that helps to explain MPEx and threaten Rassah's usb wallet

23:50:56 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: 'now' << 1990s

23:51:06 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform userpages.umbc.edu/~rfink1/skew/papers/StatisticalFingerprinting03.pdf ?

23:51:17 BingoBoingo: I was born, therefore it is recent

23:51:37 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: not the one i was thinking of, bus similar concept.

23:51:39 asciilifeform: *but