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Transcript for 24-06-2015, 1042 lines:

00:00:48 asciilifeform: mats: there were experiments with standard cell libs & ocr. sadly i haven't any links handy

00:01:00 asciilifeform: mats: the physical part of the process is the real bitch

00:01:58 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-06-2015#1173706 << nope. just ran across it by chance

00:01:58 assbot: Logged on 23-06-2015 22:38:48; mats: asciilifeform: friend of yours?

00:02:31 mats: when you've got a chance, i'd like a look at some of those links

00:03:46 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-06-2015#1173698 << wtf is that. for a sec i thought it had to do with bitcoin nodes, but turns out it's some random turd, l0l

00:03:46 assbot: Logged on 23-06-2015 22:27:30; ben_vulpes: so jasmine-node installed globally across a user's system isn't accessible from /within/ the node environment

00:07:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28150 @ 0.00040375 = 11.3656 BTC [+]

00:08:04 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Nukeman looks like a solid computer

00:11:13 asciilifeform: ;;later tell mircea_popescu do we have a seed yet ?

00:11:13 gribble: The operation succeeded.

00:12:42 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=23-06-2015#1173727 << the folks dragged into the star chamber thus far, afaik, are not 'the brightest bulbs'

00:12:42 assbot: Logged on 23-06-2015 23:47:40; pete_dushenski: does anyone ever not sign the papers ?

00:13:53 asciilifeform: but, for example, bernard von nothaus.

00:14:15 asciilifeform: http://www.forbes.com/sites/georgeleef/2015/06/22/dont-count-on-the-supreme-court-for-vigilance-in-defending-your-second-amendment-rights << him

00:14:16 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LsKc1Z )

00:14:20 mod6: ok gcc 4.5.4 is built... trying...

00:14:24 asciilifeform: wrong link, oops

00:14:53 asciilifeform: or hm, there isn't a link.

00:14:56 asciilifeform: site is br0k3n

00:15:06 asciilifeform: http://www.forbes.com/sites/georgeleef/2014/12/09/protecting-us-from-a-terrorist-who-made-pure-silver-coins-the-bernard-von-nothaus-case

00:15:07 assbot: Protecting Us From A 'Terrorist' Who Made Pure Silver Coins: The Bernard von NotHaus Case - Forbes ... ( http://bit.ly/1LsKgyG )

00:15:12 asciilifeform: ^ there.

00:20:10 mod6: 4.5.4 failed to build just as the others did: http://dpaste.com/0P88CGV.txt

00:20:12 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1deInH4 )

00:20:24 mod6: guess like we're gonna have to get this patch to work

00:20:36 *: mod6 creates new AMI with updated stage3

00:20:58 asciilifeform: ... /net.cpp:240: warning: gethostbyname is obsolescent, use getnameinfo() instead. << this is pre-dnsnuke, aha ?

00:21:10 mod6: yah

00:21:36 mod6: this is just v0.5.3.1-RELEASE + { Gentoo Sanity Patches }

00:21:44 asciilifeform: with uclibc ?

00:21:46 mod6: yeah

00:21:51 mod6: and PIE

00:21:59 asciilifeform: iirc uclibc only supports pthread after a certain version

00:22:46 asciilifeform: didja try the 'recompile with -fPIC' thing ?

00:22:52 mod6: well, i tried v4.9.2 and that didn't work either.

00:23:15 mod6: and ben didn't like the idea of using anything >4.8.4

00:23:44 mod6: and old version such as 3.4.6-r2 dones't work because no "hardening" such as PIE

00:23:57 asciilifeform: speaking of uclibc here, rather than gcc

00:24:07 mod6: yeah, weeks ago I did try to recompile with -fPIC

00:24:11 mod6: didn't help anything.

00:24:15 asciilifeform: what was the output ?

00:24:19 mod6: we're still dealing with this error.

00:24:25 mod6: i dunno, i dont have it handy.

00:24:36 mod6: i can add -fPIC in there quick and try again though

00:24:39 asciilifeform: plz

00:25:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62700 @ 0.0003984 = 24.9797 BTC [-] {3}

00:26:07 mod6: ok with you if i just do like:

00:26:08 mod6: HARDENING+=-fPIE -pie -fPIC

00:26:23 mod6: ?

00:26:27 asciilifeform: sure

00:26:29 mod6: ok

00:28:06 mod6: ok comiling

00:28:10 mod6: *compiling

00:28:19 mod6: last i recall i did this, i got the exact same message...

00:28:26 mod6: maybe im wrong about that.

00:28:52 mod6: well, and it was with gcc 4.8.4, not 4.5.4 (as it is now)

00:29:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33235 @ 0.00040225 = 13.3688 BTC [+]

00:30:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 191300 @ 0.00039514 = 75.5903 BTC [-] {3}

00:31:20 mod6: yeah exact same message, but i don't see the -fPIC flag in there... maybe im not adding that in there correctly?

00:31:41 asciilifeform: mod6: post makefile ?

00:32:38 mod6: http://dpaste.com/3TDSFV0.txt

00:32:39 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1deJoyS )

00:32:43 mod6: ok sure, will post makefile

00:33:23 asciilifeform: and it's uclibc that has to be recompiled with that flag

00:33:25 asciilifeform: not bitcoin

00:34:34 mod6: ohh.

00:34:36 mod6: http://dpaste.com/0M22TV6.txt

00:34:37 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1deJAOt )

00:34:45 mod6: makefile (for bitcoin ^)

00:35:04 asciilifeform: now try rebuilding uclibc with it...

00:35:30 mod6: ok.

00:35:50 mod6: trinque: any idea how to do that? (recompile uclibc with a specific flag?)

00:36:06 asciilifeform: slip it in its makefile

00:36:16 trinque: sounds like ebuild munging

00:36:24 asciilifeform: !up thestringpuller

00:36:36 trinque: mod6: could patch the Makefile using that patches mechanism

00:37:08 asciilifeform: in cases like this, i build the old-fashioned way and only then screw with ebuilds

00:37:28 mod6: hmm.

00:37:36 asciilifeform: (esp. considering that we will eventually 'vendor' - to use ben_vulpes's terminology - uclibc)

00:37:37 mod6: i usually do that too.

00:37:42 trinque: yeah, makes sense

00:37:48 thestringpuller: thx asciilifeform i accidentally msg'd you instead of assbot

00:38:36 thestringpuller: asciilifeform: been watching this dumb netflix show "Orange is the new black" the russian mobster woman says a lot of the same stuff you do.

00:38:42 asciilifeform: l0l wut

00:40:14 thestringpuller: well for instance she was talking about valentina tereshkova, and said something like, "She's petitioning putin to go to mars, cause the russians, they stay focused"

00:40:27 *: asciilifeform does not remember saying this

00:41:10 thestringpuller: i guess it's more of a "vibe" kinda thing. the "doesn't fuck around staying focused" kinda vibe.

00:41:24 thestringpuller: anti-chumpatron is the only term i can think of

00:42:23 asciilifeform: ;;later tell mats http://cmosfold.blogspot.com/2013/01/ftdi-ft232rl.html << possibly also of interest

00:42:24 assbot: CMOSfold: FTDI FT232RL ... ( http://bit.ly/1deKkmW )

00:42:24 gribble: The operation succeeded.

00:42:42 asciilifeform: ^ also re: the old 'real asic or not' threads

00:44:55 mod6: trinque: you think what i'm looking for (at least the ebuilds for uclibc) are in here? /usr/portage/sys-libs/uclibc?

00:45:19 trinque: that's where the ebuilds are

00:45:31 trinque: the build-stuff is in /var/tmp/portage

00:45:49 trinque: there's probably a flag to have it dump out the goods there, but not build

00:46:07 trinque: if not you could maybe start the build then kill it, then go there and hax

00:47:06 mod6: huh, how do i even figure out what version of uclibc I'm using?

00:47:24 trinque: mod6: equery tells you that, I think, and lots of other useful stuff

00:48:05 mod6: ok we'll take this back to pm

00:52:50 mod6: ok found it: libuClibc-0.9.33.2.so

01:01:01 mod6: think something like this will work?

01:01:03 mod6: http://dpaste.com/3PD6REN.txt

01:01:04 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1deNbMx )

01:01:59 mod6: asciilifeform: ^

01:07:02 asciilifeform: ok...

01:07:04 asciilifeform: result?

01:08:51 mod6: it's building now...

01:09:35 mod6: (uclibc)

01:10:05 BingoBoingo: Apparently Luke-Jr has a node version census thing which unlike bitnodes.io isn't limiting itself completely to Hearniated nodes http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/charts/software.html

01:10:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1K9cZGR )

01:14:46 mod6: asciilifeform: uClibc built & completed install.

01:14:49 mod6: rebuilding btc

01:15:41 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: for some reason i don't see the total count...

01:15:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40000 @ 0.00040187 = 16.0748 BTC [+]

01:19:13 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: yeah. not the best tool but seems like a less shitty effort to show version strings offered by things purporting to be bitcoin nodes

01:19:53 mod6: i got the same error as before asciilifeform. maybe i screwed something up.

01:19:56 mod6: i'll try again

01:26:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93900 @ 0.00039489 = 37.0802 BTC [-] {2}

01:39:20 mod6: well, so here's the deal. I can't get it to compile "by hand". meaning, that if i extract the 2 bzip'd files for uclibc: uClibc-0.9.33.2.tar.bz2 & uClibc-0.9.33.2-patches.tar.bz2 and then patch the former with the latter with something like this: for i in `ls ../patch/*.patch | sort` ; do patch -p1 < ../patch/$i ; done

01:39:34 mod6: it patches cleanly, and then I add -fPIC to the makefile as shown before.

01:39:40 mod6: but then it doesn't compile.

01:40:26 mod6: if I add a simple patch file for the -fPIC to /etc/portage/patches/sys-lib/<patchfile> and then emerge uclibc, then it builds, but the outcome is the same of the bitcoind compilation

01:40:55 asciilifeform: mod6: post the build log from 'doesn't compile' ?

01:41:01 mod6: sure.

01:41:17 mod6: gotta re-run it. just a sc.

01:42:38 mod6: oh and during a "manual" build, it pops up with a ncurses config screen, i just used the defaults.

01:43:05 mod6: although one thing in there allows for usage of arc4random (a note for later maybe) but i left it unselected.

01:47:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59600 @ 0.00040547 = 24.166 BTC [+] {2}

01:47:32 mod6: http://thebitcoin.foundation/uclibc-build.log

01:47:33 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1J3wdMH )

02:01:41 mod6: in the menuconfig, this is selected by default:

02:01:41 mod6: [*] Generate only Position Independent Code (PIC) (NEW)

02:02:04 mod6: this is what the help screen says for this option ^^

02:02:05 mod6: http://dpaste.com/122HAQP.txt

02:02:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1IcX8av )

02:03:49 mod6: uClibc-0.9.33.2 # grep "DOPIC" .config

02:03:49 mod6: DOPIC=y

02:05:54 mod6: anyway, ran it again, same error. and it looks to me that PIC should be compiled in by default.

02:06:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 125900 @ 0.00039446 = 49.6625 BTC [-] {2}

02:21:04 mod6: and I can confirm that the ebuild has DOPIC=y in it's default .config: http://dpaste.com/1GB0GFK.txt

02:21:05 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1e2BYPY )

02:35:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 96350 @ 0.0004091 = 39.4168 BTC [+] {2}

02:46:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 169828 @ 0.00041106 = 69.8095 BTC [+] {2}

02:49:18 asciilifeform: https://chloe.re/2015/06/20/a-month-with-badonions << lulzy. but for some reason author did not consider the possibility that isps snort downstream from known tor exits

02:49:19 assbot: A month with BADONIONS ... ( http://bit.ly/1HehAXH )

02:51:45 asciilifeform: mod6: thus far i'm stumped. will probably have to replicate your entire setup to get to the bottom of this (assuming you haven't yet)

02:54:46 mod6: i havent yet.

02:55:06 mod6: tomorrow i'm going to create a new gentoo AMI with the stage3 from 20150610

02:55:22 mod6: then i can start over i guess.

02:57:20 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform coupla days is apparently like two weeks. blockchain's about 1/4 there tho

02:57:52 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: should revv up just in time for somebody to finally make sense of the static build thing, lol

02:58:02 mircea_popescu: yeh

02:58:18 mircea_popescu: anyway, i wanted to use perhaps the oldest chain still in continuous existence

02:58:27 mircea_popescu: so it's a little like parking in an elevator.

02:58:28 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: what did you use for a node anyway

02:58:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 159535 @ 0.00041611 = 66.3841 BTC [+] {2}

02:58:59 mircea_popescu: this comes from an actual node.

02:59:36 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: well yes, but what's in there? mircea_popescu's pdp-11 port ?

02:59:50 mircea_popescu: i dun think i ever said anything about that.

02:59:59 asciilifeform: ok so it.

03:00:01 asciilifeform: l0l

03:00:18 asciilifeform: it'll be an honour, to sync from that!

03:00:34 mircea_popescu: yeah, kinda why i'm bothering. this is the mother of them all.

03:00:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54900 @ 0.00041704 = 22.8955 BTC [+] {3}

03:01:06 *: asciilifeform wonders how mircea_popescubitcoind compares with therealbitcoin_asciilifeform

03:01:28 mircea_popescu: i just watched giant

03:01:37 mircea_popescu: it's a movie about old texas families

03:01:47 mircea_popescu: eventually people get old, so they sit around an' compare.

03:01:52 asciilifeform: aha

03:02:00 *: asciilifeform used to work with a buncha those

03:02:46 asciilifeform: 'my diffraction structures...' 'nah, ~my~ neutronograms...' etc

03:03:24 mircea_popescu: lol

03:03:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.00041584 = 2.495 BTC [-]

03:06:10 mircea_popescu: <assbot> Logged on 23-06-2015 23:47:40; pete_dushenski: does anyone ever not sign the papers ? <<< nobody you'd ever hear about.

03:06:23 mircea_popescu: kinda like asking whether any "movie star" is ever not under contract.

03:06:31 mircea_popescu: how the fuck would she be a movie star if she weren't ?

03:06:45 asciilifeform: von nothaus ?

03:07:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 88350 @ 0.00041836 = 36.9621 BTC [+]

03:09:47 asciilifeform: (sf twist! mircea_popescu's bitcoind is therealbitcoin 1.000, transmitted backwards in time!!1111!!1)

03:10:26 mircea_popescu: tachyon man i'm tachyon man

03:10:33 mircea_popescu: i can walk backwards faster than you can

03:10:36 mircea_popescu: IN TIME!

03:10:36 asciilifeform: 'doing the things the tachyon can!'

03:31:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18581 @ 0.00041568 = 7.7238 BTC [-] {2}

03:40:48 BingoBoingo: http://www.dezeen.com/2015/06/23/comments-update-architecture-sexism-alvaro-siza-manhattan-cornell-tech-campus-selgascano-serpentine-pavilion/

03:40:50 assbot: This week's reader comments on Dezeen ... ( http://bit.ly/1GoJYCq )

03:45:24 mats: https://www.trustwave.com/Resources/SpiderLabs-Blog/Attacking-Ruby-Gem-Security-with-CVE-2015-3900/

03:45:26 assbot: Attacking Ruby Gem Security with CVE-2015-3900 ... ( http://bit.ly/1fzi4NJ )

03:56:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 78650 @ 0.00041514 = 32.6508 BTC [-]

04:03:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80506 @ 0.00041514 = 33.4213 BTC [-]

04:10:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70329 @ 0.00040621 = 28.5683 BTC [-]

04:18:55 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31500 @ 0.00040657 = 12.807 BTC [+]

04:22:59 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 84800 @ 0.00040408 = 34.266 BTC [-] {2}

04:50:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52500 @ 0.00039714 = 20.8499 BTC [-] {2}

05:18:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75300 @ 0.00039377 = 29.6509 BTC [-]

05:28:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 106950 @ 0.00040878 = 43.719 BTC [+] {2}

05:34:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 75300 @ 0.00040534 = 30.5221 BTC [-]

06:00:17 phf: hello, i had some free time so i built bitcoind with patches up to "ver 5_4" on os x 10.8

06:00:30 phf: it's doing all the right things, i.e. wouldn't connect until explicitly given addnode, discurding bastard blocks, hovering at 62mb. block count 129821 right now

06:00:41 phf: can anyone confirm that this looks like a complete list of patches to date http://paste.lisp.org/display/150429? (afaik those marked as U have been rejected on ml)

06:00:42 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LAxifh )

06:13:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40965 @ 0.00040534 = 16.6048 BTC [-]

06:15:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 59850 @ 0.00041015 = 24.5475 BTC [+] {4}

06:19:14 BingoBoingo: Oh phuctor passed a million moduli http://nosuchlabs.com/stats

06:33:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49300 @ 0.0004008 = 19.7594 BTC [-] {2}

06:34:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41800 @ 0.00039344 = 16.4458 BTC [-]

06:34:20 BingoBoingo: phf: It doesn't look wrong

06:50:27 BingoBoingo: Commenters need to step the game up http://qntra.net/2015/04/obama-orders-war-on-computing-and-bitcoin-with-new-emergency-order-full-text/#comment-28596

06:50:28 assbot: Obama Orders War On Computing And Bitcoin With New "Emergency" Order (Full Text) | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1Gygv8r )

06:51:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58332 @ 0.00041271 = 24.0742 BTC [+]

06:58:19 BingoBoingo: http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/former-white-house-chef-walter-scheib-drowned-accidental-death-autopsy-n380636

06:58:20 assbot: Former White House Chef Walter Scheib Drowned in Accidental Death: Autopsy - NBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1GygRMj )

06:58:26 BingoBoingo: ^ For the nailgun chronicles

07:06:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116900 @ 0.0003968 = 46.3859 BTC [-] {3}

07:14:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112850 @ 0.00041425 = 46.7481 BTC [+] {2}

07:25:59 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10400 @ 0.00041737 = 4.3406 BTC [+]

07:46:15 punkman: http://1g1uem2nc4jy1gzhn943ro0gz50.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/retention_graph_average.png

07:46:16 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1FAqQj7 )

07:46:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 164850 @ 0.0003948 = 65.0828 BTC [-] {2}

07:56:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 244489 @ 0.00041601 = 101.7099 BTC [+] {4}

08:17:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 120900 @ 0.00040884 = 49.4288 BTC [-]

08:24:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61100 @ 0.00042029 = 25.6797 BTC [+] {2}

08:31:34 cazalla: looks like google has shitcanned confederate flags https://www.google.com.au/webhp?&gfe_rd=cr&ei=rGqKVbPaEcf98wedmIHwDg#q=confederate+flag&tbm=shop

08:31:35 assbot: Google ... ( http://bit.ly/1KbZCr7 )

09:01:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41750 @ 0.00041219 = 17.2089 BTC [-]

09:06:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24000 @ 0.00041835 = 10.0404 BTC [+]

09:48:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 83249 @ 0.00041835 = 34.8272 BTC [+]

10:07:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69200 @ 0.00041305 = 28.5831 BTC [-] {3}

10:14:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 154900 @ 0.000423 = 65.5227 BTC [+] {4}

10:18:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 103400 @ 0.00042664 = 44.1146 BTC [+] {2}

10:45:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47900 @ 0.00041344 = 19.8038 BTC [-]

10:49:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 148074 @ 0.00041362 = 61.2464 BTC [+] {2}

10:52:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51447 @ 0.0004274 = 21.9884 BTC [+] {2}

10:53:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 190603 @ 0.00042824 = 81.6238 BTC [+]

10:54:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38438 @ 0.00042824 = 16.4607 BTC [+]

11:11:14 cazalla: BingoBoingo, looks like they finally had the coins made one of your articles mentiond a few months back http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/11694838/Islamic-State-mints-its-own-Islamic-Dinar-coins.html

11:11:15 assbot: Islamic State mints its own 'Islamic Dinar' coins - Telegraph ... ( http://bit.ly/1SJsZCJ )

11:14:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52500 @ 0.00042676 = 22.4049 BTC [-]

11:22:33 mircea_popescu: <BingoBoingo> Oh phuctor passed a million moduli http://nosuchlabs.com/stats << age, cave, tace!

11:22:53 mircea_popescu: 500mn digits worth of P too.

11:26:46 jurov: did anyone with phuctored key write to you?

11:27:33 mircea_popescu: at least a coupla wrote to me to derp, back during the slashdot censorship days

11:28:43 mircea_popescu: punkman1 i'm frankly surprised at the hefty chunk left in the 90 days range. i think that graph is bogus, and the real graph is a lot more like f'(x) = f(x)^3.something, where we take probabilities as from 0 to 1.

11:29:41 mircea_popescu: cazalla aww i was looking for a "as BingoBoingo said...". shame on 'em.

11:32:37 mircea_popescu: and what a shitty design.

11:33:03 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 107860 @ 0.00042756 = 46.1166 BTC [+] {2}

11:34:04 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45682 @ 0.00042853 = 19.5761 BTC [+] {2}

11:35:23 mircea_popescu: "Councillor Karen Danczuk, wife of Labour MP for Rochdale, Simon, has been tweeting selfies that show her cleavage. The 31-year-old councillor for Kingsway, who also runs a deli with her husband, has uploaded photos of her cleavage in a bikini and another of her bare legs."

11:35:41 mircea_popescu: o noes, the bare legs of some rural wench. england prevails!

11:39:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 223000 @ 0.00041603 = 92.7747 BTC [-] {3}

11:43:15 mircea_popescu: "With its subversive political allegory - including a terrorist as the leading man - and clear-cut leftist sensibilities, V for Vendetta is the kind of movie that the conservative right will have a field day with."

11:43:18 mircea_popescu: ahahaha WUT.

11:43:34 mircea_popescu: check it out, idiots imagine everything that happens is by idiots, about idiots, for idiots.

11:43:44 mircea_popescu: such a novel development.

11:47:21 mircea_popescu: more on point, http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2010/11/kevin-deanna-england-prevails/

11:47:24 assbot: England Prevails | The Occidental Observer - White Identity, Interests, and Culture ... ( http://bit.ly/1Kckoqx )

11:47:31 mircea_popescu: "The problem, of course, is that this is also the United Kingdom in the world we live in right now."

11:47:56 mircea_popescu: nazi[onal] socialism being, of course, just another socialism.

11:56:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 102900 @ 0.00041892 = 43.1069 BTC [+]

12:01:46 cazalla: so where are the pics?

12:02:54 cazalla: http://i4.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article4307576.ece/ALTERNATES/s1227b/Karen-Danczuk.jpg

12:02:55 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1KcmgQc )

12:04:57 cazalla: and another https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CHrrhMDWEAAFx5u.jpg https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CG_NXShXAAA9Hs8.jpg

12:04:58 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GpDe7r )

12:04:59 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GpDe7v )

12:05:04 jurov: anime fangirls would kill for these eyes

12:05:58 cazalla: she appears to be posting more pics in response to that article.. https://twitter.com/KarenDanczuk/media

12:05:59 assbot: Photos et vidéos de Karen Danczuk (@KarenDanczuk) | Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1GpDl2O )

12:07:12 cazalla: mircea_popescu, i forgot to ask.. did the spammer login with the password or hammer login with various passwords until he got in?

12:07:37 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73273 @ 0.00040923 = 29.9855 BTC [-] {2}

12:07:48 mircea_popescu: the latter. there's two different things killing you if you try too many times.

12:08:00 mircea_popescu: from the logs, at some random point he just shows up, logs in and fills my buffers.

12:08:12 mircea_popescu: jurov right huh.

12:08:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146077 @ 0.00040723 = 59.4869 BTC [-] {2}

12:28:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48600 @ 0.00041171 = 20.0091 BTC [+]

12:32:45 funkenstein_: https://mrtalented.wordpress.com/

12:32:46 assbot: Mr. Talented | ???????? America has taught Me that each Human being has 36,000 days to do something extraordinary. In less than 2,000 days, I've independently launched a start-up, wrote a book, obtained celebrity contacts & most importantly reached YOU. Here's my business card: MrTalented.org 30-sec ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgcObW )

12:33:27 funkenstein_: blogger claims feelings matter, doesn't know travel or whores exist, kills self

12:39:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 140122 @ 0.00041511 = 58.166 BTC [+] {2}

12:39:28 cazalla: "Everyday people hurt my feelings and its not fair. " lol k

12:40:16 mircea_popescu: nuts.

12:40:28 mircea_popescu: mr talented is now my an hero.

12:42:17 cazalla: damn, he was 0 for 1500 with asian women

12:46:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38074 @ 0.00040388 = 15.3773 BTC [-] {2}

12:47:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 90961 @ 0.00040165 = 36.5345 BTC [-]

13:04:59 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174018 << he did speak of wanting wife, not whores..

13:04:59 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 12:33:27; funkenstein_: blogger claims feelings matter, doesn't know travel or whores exist, kills self

13:06:07 funkenstein_: asciilifform, good point

13:07:46 funkenstein_: despite his inability to adjust strategy, he has 1) identified a common stupidity 2) taken action

13:08:03 asciilifeform: wai wut

13:08:59 funkenstein_: i grasp at straws here this morning

13:09:56 asciilifeform: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/man-wanted-attacks-asian-women-found-hanging-reports-article-1.2267393 << claims - him

13:09:57 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgkPxJ )

13:13:53 funkenstein_: Next time, Teach English in Guangzhou

13:14:14 asciilifeform: http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/brooklyn/wrongly-convicted-inmate-spend-1-weekend-prison-article-1.2248022 << other lulz from same fishwrap

13:14:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GpMPuT )

13:18:09 asciilifeform: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/police-japan-seize-shoes-sold-upskirt-cameras-article-1.1950476

13:18:09 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgmSSn )

13:21:45 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform whores make the only sort of wife worth having tho.

13:22:24 asciilifeform: apparently mr elevator did not think so..

13:23:08 mircea_popescu: what did he know.

13:23:24 *: asciilifeform tries to find example of similar hanging in the literature, but can only recall the 1890s electromechanical contraption built in new york prison by one fella, for his own (official!) hanging

13:27:28 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174034 << idk if this is still a thing. (who wants to 'marry the u.s. passport' today?)

13:27:28 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 13:13:53; funkenstein_: Next time, Teach English in Guangzhou

13:27:40 asciilifeform: or perhaps he didn't care for ~that~ kind of whore either

13:28:24 mircea_popescu: wife not being much of a whore is a little like husband not being much of a soldier.

13:29:45 asciilifeform: how's that work

13:30:19 mircea_popescu: !up Eulorian

13:30:21 mircea_popescu: hello there.

13:30:28 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform which part ?

13:30:40 asciilifeform: 'not much of a whore like not much of a soldier'

13:31:16 mircea_popescu: they're both a sort of selflessness.

13:31:22 mircea_popescu: selfish people don't marry well.

13:31:32 Eulorian: good

13:31:53 Eulorian: in spanish please

13:32:01 mircea_popescu: habla espanol ?

13:32:04 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1173979 << probably time to throw it back into phuctoring gear soon. i was gonna wait for 1M submissions.

13:32:04 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 11:22:33; mircea_popescu: <BingoBoingo> Oh phuctor passed a million moduli http://nosuchlabs.com/stats << age, cave, tace!

13:32:26 Eulorian: si

13:32:28 asciilifeform: 292336/1298527 presently (sks set, walking backwards from end)

13:32:40 mircea_popescu: yo tambien, un poco.

13:32:52 Eulorian: entre porque me llamo la atencion un titulo en la web

13:33:00 mircea_popescu: aha ?

13:33:02 Eulorian: que decia bitcoin y mmorpg

13:33:17 mircea_popescu: ah, si, Eulora.

13:33:23 Eulorian: pero veo que el juego es para linux o estoy errado

13:33:32 mircea_popescu: ay windows tambien.

13:33:50 mircea_popescu: http://explo.yt/post/2015/06/05/Eulora-for-Windows <

13:33:51 assbot: Eulora 0.1.0 for Windows - serialized delusions ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgqYd8 )

13:34:08 Eulorian: donde puedo entrar porque entre a una web que solo tenia archivos tar.gz

13:34:16 Eulorian: que creo q son extensiones linux

13:34:29 Eulorian: a bien

13:34:50 Eulorian: y popescu quien eres?

13:34:54 Eulorian: es tuyo el juego?

13:34:56 mircea_popescu: yo ?

13:35:01 Eulorian: si

13:35:03 mircea_popescu: ;;google mircea popescu

13:35:04 gribble: fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu.: http://fraudsters.com/; Romanian Bitcoin baron 'stumps up $20k to keep OpenBSD's lights ...: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/01/20/openbsd_bailed_out/; MPEx - Bitcoin Wiki: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/MPEx

13:35:07 mircea_popescu: ^ ver aya

13:35:30 Eulorian: ok gracias

13:35:39 mircea_popescu: np

13:38:13 kakobrekla: nemos problemos?

13:38:23 mircea_popescu: hahaha nemos.

13:38:48 mircea_popescu: dja mean "no mas" = not any more, or do you mean nema, as in, none ? :D

13:39:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 146018 @ 0.00041443 = 60.5142 BTC [+] {3}

13:39:14 kakobrekla: nfi

13:39:25 mircea_popescu: ;;google Nema Problema

13:39:26 gribble: Croatian Phrases - Nema Problema - Croatia Report: http://www.croatiareport.com/crophrases2.html; Nema problema (1984) - IMDb: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0180867/; Nema problema (1984 film) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nema_problema_(1984_film)

13:39:43 mircea_popescu: anyway, funny how slavic spanish is. i suppose it's due to them both starting with s.

13:39:53 kakobrekla: lol

13:40:32 mircea_popescu: which is a small amount of con-fusion.

13:46:11 punkman: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9771219 "They value "the right technical decision" over human relationships and it doesn't seem to occur to them that the right outcome might be the one that makes someone else happy, or is the most diplomatic, even if it isn't "technically right"."

13:46:12 assbot: Ask HN: Do you work with dogmatic, stubborn developers/sysadmins? Are YOU one? | Hacker News ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ni42er )

13:46:26 punkman: maybe if you stopped breaking things they'd like you

13:47:17 mircea_popescu: ^

13:48:13 mircea_popescu: this reads to me exactly like http://fraudsters.com/2014/the-definitive-tract-on-sociopathy/#selection-101.300-101.317

13:48:14 assbot: The definitive tract on sociopathy on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1HguqVk )

13:49:14 mircea_popescu: anyone who values "personal relationships" / "people themselves" / whatever other feel good idiotarianism over "abstract rules" / "technical" / blabla is ipso facto an idiot.

13:49:39 mircea_popescu: the entire trade is predicated on "in the contest between what's right and what's pleasant - i pick the pleasant"

13:50:52 mircea_popescu: and when the fuck did "hacker" news turn into pink collar support group already. if you don't like working with the people that make the things you like to use, go webcam.

13:51:12 mircea_popescu: and complain about how the speed of light is unfair and the camera view should be less made out of straight lines.

13:54:59 jurov: yes, for example chetty should stubborny say that eulora codebase stinks and she must redo it completely?

13:55:45 midnightmagic: looks like a high-quality HN trollpost

13:56:01 mats: usual hn fare...

13:56:32 jurov: i got an impression mp reels against something different that the OP

13:56:56 mircea_popescu: jurov haha ask chetty sometime how many times this redo completely already happened :D

13:57:17 midnightmagic: lol look at his post history. dude's a deliberate troll man

13:57:24 mircea_popescu: i think the loot code was rewritten fully about four times. this doesn't count all the times it got partially rewritten.

13:57:46 mircea_popescu: midnightmagic you know that theory that past a certain level of stupidity the two are indistinguishable yes ?

13:59:04 mircea_popescu: what she means when she says things like " she did not really know this part/the client thing in that much detail" is simply that well... she didn't have to rewrite it three-four times yet

13:59:18 punkman: I don't see this deliberate trolling you mention

13:59:22 midnightmagic: The other markers of stupidity are absent; his grammar is nearly perfect, and the observations are ironic and deeply philosophical -- *as troll posts*.

13:59:55 *: mircea_popescu is too meh over the entire ycombinator kaboodle to go look at hn.

14:01:14 punkman: https://www.nsa.gov/public_info/news_information/2015/NSA_Farmers_Market.shtml

14:01:15 assbot: 2015 News and Information - NSA's Farmers Market ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgwP2i )

14:03:28 mircea_popescu: in other news : http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m8k9jflVbH1rcqfsko1_1280.jpg

14:03:30 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgxqkD )

14:03:34 mircea_popescu: sunglasses in the bath!

14:04:41 mircea_popescu: punkman ahaha someone should just replace the pics with pot and stuff, then republish it.

14:05:03 punkman: I see your sunglasses and raise you a monkey https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIRBn3qUYAAsoLc.jpg

14:05:04 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgxTmO )

14:07:21 mircea_popescu: haha what's that on the monkey's shoulder

14:10:58 midnightmagic: sunglasses in the bath would work better if there was actual sunlight which made the sunglasses a requirement

14:12:54 mircea_popescu: or if there wasn't steam, which is the bane of every glasses wearer.

14:13:37 punkman: dude sucks at tying rope too

14:13:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91014 @ 0.00041185 = 37.4841 BTC [-]

14:15:52 mircea_popescu: finally, smoking in a steamy room also sucks. both because wet tobacco and because the steam-smoke mixture is like... ew.

14:16:15 mircea_popescu: basically, he is very bad at everything he attempts, and attempts a lot of things at the same time.

14:16:20 mircea_popescu: he should be a web developer.

14:16:36 punkman: probably is

14:16:54 mircea_popescu: looks more like an internet marketard to me.

14:17:02 punkman: same thing, no?

14:17:10 mircea_popescu: shit.

14:31:04 punkman: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/24/russian-troll-factory-sued-underpayment-labour-violations-vladimir-putin

14:31:05 assbot: Russian 'troll factory' sued for underpayment and labour violations | World news | The Guardian ... ( http://bit.ly/1HgEPQO )

14:34:52 mircea_popescu: oic. shame on them for hiring locally. there are some washington "civil servants" married to "entrepreneurs" that'd eagerly sell russia on the same process gavincoin used!

14:35:05 mircea_popescu: worked so well, too. and it wasn't even too expensive!

14:40:07 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 173210 @ 0.00040944 = 70.9191 BTC [-] {3}

14:41:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 165000 @ 0.00041609 = 68.6549 BTC [+] {2}

14:44:05 jurov: that would require more middlemen, with money leaking out at every step

14:45:22 mircea_popescu: heh.

14:47:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116150 @ 0.00040347 = 46.863 BTC [-] {2}

14:47:20 jurov: joint american/russian embezzlement force.. now that's something to behold

14:48:35 jurov: !mpif

14:48:36 assbot: BtcAlpha.com F.MPIF Tracker estimated NAV per share: 0.00021444 B (Total: 426.05 B). Delta: 0.09 B. Last trade for F.MPIF on MPEX was at 0.000207 BTC [+]

14:53:18 jurov: ;;calc 0.0002144/1.05

14:53:18 gribble: 0.00020419047619

14:53:28 jurov: ;;calc 0.0002144/1.01

14:53:29 gribble: 0.000212277227723

14:53:50 jurov: ;;calc 0.0002144*1.01

14:53:50 gribble: 0.000216544

14:55:28 jurov: ;;calc 0.0002144*1.05

14:55:29 gribble: 0.00022512

15:10:25 punkman: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CIQhLaxWsAAkwoq.jpg

15:10:26 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNfqnc )

15:12:40 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99900 @ 0.00040165 = 40.1248 BTC [-]

15:13:16 shinohai: When you forget to hire a proofreader ....

15:14:12 jurov: more like proofthinker

15:14:15 punkman: http://rt.com/news/269314-anti-russian-propaganda-netherlands/

15:14:16 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNfval )

15:18:14 thestringpuller: https://xkcd.com/1270/

15:20:08 jurov: pedophile lobby spreading anti russian propaganda, news at 11

15:24:03 mircea_popescu: not terribly inaccurate a drawing, either.

15:27:10 kakobrekla: https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/10358559_10153439794977372_1199518205687241080_n.jpg?oh=29b7b6afd2418d30e96a3bc4be7b211b&oe=562E871B

15:27:10 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNfNhw )

15:33:22 thestringpuller: mircea_popescu: re redditards doing math part 2 >> http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3ay0j6/block_size_userbase_size_1_mb_275000_users/

15:35:08 mircea_popescu: they're welcome to it.

15:37:13 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169689 any suggestions for 'starter' isolation transformers ?

15:37:13 assbot: Logged on 20-06-2015 18:17:10; asciilifeform: (yet another reason to run on a double-converter 'ups' or at least an isolator transformer!)

15:37:33 pete_dushenski: i can't tell them apart and some are $100, some $300

15:37:43 lobbes: 'Also in order to have all 7 billion people use the blockchain directly' << hehe good one

15:37:53 pete_dushenski: and the double-converters ups are all $1k+ !!1

15:39:26 mircea_popescu: lotta metal in em

15:39:32 pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: and any thoughts on mitigating this concern http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169693 are also welcome

15:39:32 assbot: Logged on 20-06-2015 18:18:35; asciilifeform: did i write here re: how a keyboard (esp. a decent 1980s 'ps/2' one) can be 'heard' from across the street ?

15:39:59 pete_dushenski: assuming 'model m' falls into the aforementioned camp

15:40:33 kakobrekla: it does

15:40:36 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: no doubt they're worth it

15:40:53 mircea_popescu: we had some arguments re kbds, came to not much.

15:40:57 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: but seems like overkill for home desktop

15:41:10 mircea_popescu: tho i suspect the cheapo plastic bump kbds are a little quieter than the model ms

15:41:48 pete_dushenski: audibly quieter, perhaps not electromagnetically ?

15:42:20 kakobrekla: neg

15:42:22 mircea_popescu: i meant the latter.

15:42:39 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla oh, not at all ?

15:42:46 mircea_popescu: a well, there goes the irony.

15:43:04 kakobrekla: no, the usb is quiet(er)

15:43:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91600 @ 0.00040165 = 36.7911 BTC [-]

15:43:26 mircea_popescu: than ps2 ? lower voltage ?

15:45:17 kakobrekla: pete_dushenski https://www.blackhat.com/presentations/bh-usa-09/BARISANI/BHUSA09-Barisani-Keystrokes-SLIDES.pdf

15:45:21 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNg7gb )

15:45:49 pete_dushenski: kakobrekla: cheers

15:49:24 kakobrekla: perhaps a ps2 isolatior or batter powered kboard

15:49:33 kakobrekla: battery

15:49:54 pete_dushenski: what about effect of basic ps2-usb converter ?

15:50:32 pete_dushenski: kakobrekla: or is that what you mean by 'ps2 isolator' ?

15:51:39 kakobrekla: if its made properly it should be good afaik but dont take my word for it

15:51:40 scoopbot_revived: Ok, so what is Eulora disrupting ? http://fraudsters.com/2015/ok-so-what-is-eulora-disrupting/

15:52:19 mircea_popescu: i doubt battery powered antenna is any weaker than mains powered antenna

15:52:23 pete_dushenski: ^heh i was thinking about this eulora question, time to test my answers against the back page !

15:52:32 kakobrekla: pete_dushenski the leak is happening via gnd, so if gnd is directly connected to usb gnd, i think the leak continiues

15:52:36 mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski haha jit.

15:53:02 pete_dushenski: kakobrekla: right..

15:53:30 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: lol the window was probably a few weeks. tops.

15:54:11 kakobrekla: i havent tried but it not impossible a different cable would fix this

15:55:08 kakobrekla: at least to a some degree

15:55:16 kakobrekla: dunno, not the expert.

15:55:48 pete_dushenski: kakobrekla: nor am i, i appreciate the input.

15:55:59 pete_dushenski: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Hammond-Isolation-Transformer-171F-110V/111690504230?_trksid=p2050601.c100085.m2372&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140211132617%26meid%3Dd0028792a72c431aaa20fa7e8b9c16fb%26pid%3D100085%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D271849441378%26clkid%3D7089658866830618468&_qi=RTM2067268 << made in canuckistan

15:56:01 assbot: Hammond Isolation Transformer 171F 110V | eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNgmrA )

15:57:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 85518 @ 0.00041396 = 35.401 BTC [+]

15:58:32 kakobrekla: pete_dushenski just wait for ascii to piss on my suggestions.

15:59:07 pete_dushenski: such is the risk of conversing where experts can see you.

15:59:47 pete_dushenski: i'm sure he'll take a megaton dump on that little canadian ebay toy

16:05:42 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1173976 << look like the result of one of those souvenir penny-pressing machines at zoos, museums, etc.

16:05:42 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 11:11:14; cazalla: BingoBoingo, looks like they finally had the coins made one of your articles mentiond a few months back http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/islamic-state/11694838/Islamic-State-mints-its-own-Islamic-Dinar-coins.html

16:06:10 pete_dushenski: eg http://www.pennymachinesusa.com/Products.html

16:06:12 assbot: Penny Machines USA Products ... ( http://bit.ly/1TNgCqv )

16:06:38 pete_dushenski: lulzy thing is that these machines still exist in canada even though 'penny' was phased out last year

16:06:55 pete_dushenski: because inflation !

16:07:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 179400 @ 0.00040162 = 72.0506 BTC [-] {2}

16:11:01 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu: 'And this is what I cal disruptive.' <<

16:11:34 pete_dushenski: !up ascii_field

16:13:06 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174168 << i had a 'Sola EPC 210-60.' then replaced with gigantic doublecoverter ups, 'liebert'

16:13:06 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 15:37:13; pete_dushenski: asciilifeform: re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=20-06-2015#1169689 any suggestions for 'starter' isolation transformers ?

16:13:48 pete_dushenski: eg http://www.ebay.ca/itm/SOLA-EPC-210-60-ELECTRONIC-POWER-CONDITIONER-120V-AC-1000VA-B463951-/291262820966?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43d09df266

16:13:49 assbot: Sola EPC 210 60 Electronic Power Conditioner 120V AC 1000VA B463951 | eBay ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgs2l6 )

16:13:49 ascii_field: if getting the latter, find a secondhand unit with missing or rotten battery, replace by yourself (100 to 200 usd, assemble the pack manually)

16:14:03 ascii_field: ^ it

16:14:35 pete_dushenski: ascii_field: thoughts on the 'hammond' unit linked above ?

16:15:09 pete_dushenski: that sola's $155 just to ship :(

16:15:19 jurov: well... sure it does not have blown output? can it be returned if so?

16:15:33 ascii_field: pete_dushenski: the hammond thing looks like just isolator, not stabilizer

16:15:36 ascii_field: (no gigantic caps)

16:15:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23750 @ 0.00041396 = 9.8316 BTC [+]

16:15:45 ascii_field: why did you want this again ?

16:16:25 pete_dushenski: so that meta-lisard-nsa doesn't read my keystrokes through the mains ?

16:16:39 ascii_field: pete_dushenski: they're reading them from black van, cheaper atm

16:16:44 jurov: (i have replaced battery in my cheapo ups, tested it with 40W bulb... in shock watched the visible jitter, and it put out ~160V instead of 220)

16:16:59 ascii_field: ^ l0l

16:17:31 pete_dushenski: ascii_field: and what about tmrw, when this moment has come and gone ?

16:18:54 *: pete_dushenski wants to plan ahead, prepare for future, build warchest.

16:19:25 *: ascii_field always thought 'warchest' meant gigantic bag of money (or, at least, ammo)

16:19:54 pete_dushenski: that's 'treasurechest'

16:20:29 pete_dushenski: and it's for one-eyed pirates with x-marked maps

16:27:33 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174181 << they aren't.

16:27:33 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 15:41:10; mircea_popescu: tho i suspect the cheapo plastic bump kbds are a little quieter than the model ms

16:27:44 ascii_field: it's the scan matrix that is 'heard'

16:27:51 ascii_field: 100% same in all pc keyboards.

16:29:43 punkman: how would you mitigate that?

16:30:23 ascii_field: punkman: there is no 'off the shelf' consumer appliance that will do a lick of good here.

16:30:37 ascii_field: you could make own keyboard using fiber strain gauges, for instance.

16:30:59 punkman: that sounds like a pita

16:31:14 ascii_field: if want 'not pita' - surrender now.

16:31:24 ascii_field: surrender is the ultimate 'user friendly' (2nd only to death)

16:32:43 BingoBoingo: Muh Oppression as a 'Dukes of Hazard' fan

16:32:59 BingoBoingo: White Fandom matters

16:33:38 ascii_field: wai wat

16:34:44 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174201 << in the linked article, yes. in old thread of mine, i was describing conventional radio leak

16:34:44 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 15:52:32; kakobrekla: pete_dushenski the leak is happening via gnd, so if gnd is directly connected to usb gnd, i think the leak continiues

16:35:12 ascii_field: (linked article also describes optical snooping using mechanical vibration & reflections of sunlight etc)

16:35:58 ascii_field: i will describe what is probably the cheapest way to make a 'stealth keyboard' . but no one will like it.

16:36:10 kakobrekla: rf from ps2 cable ?

16:36:12 pete_dushenski: laser keyboard !

16:36:15 ascii_field: no

16:36:16 ascii_field: no

16:36:32 kakobrekla: rf from switches

16:36:37 kakobrekla: aite

16:36:40 ascii_field: kakobrekla: from scan grid

16:37:24 ascii_field: so, consider a kaleidoscope. copper barrel, like victorian telescopes etc. eyepiece - glass, indium oxide (scavenge from old lcd; electrically conductive)

16:37:41 ascii_field: inside - led matrix 8x8, non-scanned, displays one letter.

16:38:00 ascii_field: device picks where in alphabet to start - at random (trng)

16:38:09 pete_dushenski: https://www.flickr.com/photos/usnationalarchives/sets/72157653877789929/page1 << coupla boys havin a gay ol' time

16:38:11 assbot: Vice President Cheney with President George W. Bush, Part 2 | Flickr - Photo Sharing! ... ( http://bit.ly/1fBvoAW )

16:38:11 ascii_field: user peers in eyepiece, turns wheel

16:38:13 mircea_popescu: why not just have an array of em

16:38:15 ascii_field: when correct letter appears, presses it.

16:38:22 mircea_popescu: and just press the one you like

16:38:29 ascii_field: it is important that nothing can be determined by looking at user!

16:38:30 ascii_field: from outside

16:38:44 ascii_field: because you do not know where in the alphabet it began, each time.

16:38:49 mircea_popescu: how about getting a picture of a whole keyboard rather than a key then

16:39:19 ascii_field: what's the point of having so many pixels

16:39:36 mircea_popescu: so they're enough for everyone

16:39:42 ascii_field: 8x8 non-scanned is practical. beyond that (e.g. graphical lcd) you now have a scanning matrix!

16:39:46 ascii_field: these are rf-noisy.

16:39:55 ascii_field: and hardly fit in telescope.

16:40:04 ascii_field: brass captain's telescope.

16:40:23 kakobrekla: im sure they will come, but would be funny if they will come with the unlikely usb sniffer instead of ps2 while the gang makes noise on ps2. sorta what happened in bosnia > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_F-117A_shootdown

16:40:24 assbot: 1999 F-117A shootdown - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgv9tf )

16:40:26 *: ascii_field ~did warn~ that no one will like this keyboard.

16:40:30 ascii_field: but it is 'secure'

16:40:30 ascii_field: !

16:43:21 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla the part where the serbs were breaking nato codes is never given much airplay.

16:43:40 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

16:43:44 ascii_field: it also would be logical for whatever consumes the sooper s33kr17 text string (e.g., salted password hasher) to actually live in that brass tube.

16:44:32 kakobrekla: mircea_popescu true, id say its more likely nato self leak, but anyway, the radar thing is quite lulzy

16:45:26 ascii_field: phun phakt: detecting 'stealth' airplane is easier today than ever

16:45:32 ascii_field: because of the cell tower shadow it creates

16:47:39 mircea_popescu: "stealth plane" is a dead idea.

16:48:20 ascii_field: still works great for original purpose for which was built (siphon of usg budget to good ol'boys, what did you think it was)

16:48:35 BingoBoingo: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1173963 << Muh culture is being oppressed!

16:48:35 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 08:31:34; cazalla: looks like google has shitcanned confederate flags https://www.google.com.au/webhp?&gfe_rd=cr&ei=rGqKVbPaEcf98wedmIHwDg#q=confederate+flag&tbm=shop

16:49:24 mircea_popescu: ascii_field a magical toothpick works just as well for that purpose.

16:49:55 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: http://skepdic.com/quadro.html << it

16:49:56 assbot: Quadro QRS 250G Detector - the Quadro Tracker - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgwf8v )

16:50:02 ascii_field: (magic toothpick, approximately)

16:50:37 ascii_field: state of the art re: minimality, short of plain old $trillion-in-paper-cash-'missing'-in-iraq sort of siphon

16:51:24 mircea_popescu: pretty good.

16:54:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14800 @ 0.00040827 = 6.0424 BTC [-]

16:55:21 williamdunne: For those that still use Twitter

16:55:27 williamdunne: https://twitter.com/scoopbotrevived

16:55:28 assbot: Scoopbot The Third (@ScoopbotRevived) | Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgwYX6 )

16:55:40 williamdunne: Will publish anything that he posts here on twitter also

17:03:45 scoopbot_revived: ISIS About to Introduce Altcoin into Circulation http://qntra.net/2015/06/isis-about-to-introduce-altcoin-into-circulation/

17:04:50 mircea_popescu: loller

17:08:12 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i don't get this distinction you propose. so "unlike the cryptocurrency Bitcoin, Gold seized immediately preserves its full exchange value.", what's this mean, that people paid less for faux Bitcoin the USMS was pretending to be selling than for faux Bitcoin pirate was pretending to be going to pay them ?

17:08:14 mircea_popescu: no such thing.

17:09:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 127750 @ 0.00040827 = 52.1565 BTC [-]

17:10:46 BingoBoingo: It means that if you seize some bitcoin and send it immediately to herpity derp service they might turp their way into "returning it" out of some misguided notion of ownership. Gotta at least use a solid mixer like BitBet

17:11:06 mats: this is not comprehensible

17:11:11 ascii_field: ^

17:12:02 BingoBoingo: See http://qntra.net/2015/06/coinjar-coo-ryan-zhou-caught-impersonating-dice-sites-developer/ where BTC-E "returned" coins a dice site gave away

17:12:03 assbot: CoinJar COO Ryan Zhou Caught Impersonating Dice Site's Developer | Qntra ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgz4Gt )

17:12:36 BingoBoingo: It isn't an actual property of Bitcoins. It is a failing of the social structuring of the stupid.

17:13:26 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo it makes no sense at all.

17:13:32 BingoBoingo: Mebbe I need to think about this moar

17:13:40 mircea_popescu: someone could steal your gold after you sent it just as well, what's that to do with the gold ?

17:13:52 mircea_popescu: most of the gold the spanish sent to spain ended up in london.

17:14:48 *: BingoBoingo rereads original ISIS article

17:14:51 mircea_popescu: !up ascii_field

17:16:32 BingoBoingo: Ah, I was refering to the need to get the keys or the coins, as in you can't take a laptop "full of Bitcoin" and have seized the coins: "Bitcoin on the other hand demands not only mere physical possession, but actual control of a set of keys necessary to transfer value. While gold is vulnerable to a simple change of possession, Bitcoin requires a more difficult but possible intellectual change of possession."

17:16:46 BingoBoingo: ANd in there is a link to http://www.loper-os.org/?p=1061

17:16:47 assbot: Loper OS » Practical Cryptoanalysis of Elliptic Curve DSA. ... ( http://bit.ly/1dgzFIl )

17:17:28 mircea_popescu: do you basically mean that bitcoin can not be held without tools, whereas gold can, or at least to a higher degree ?

17:17:48 mircea_popescu: this is a very different thing.

17:18:38 ascii_field: pretty easy to 'hold without tools'

17:18:41 ascii_field: brainwallet.

17:25:09 mircea_popescu: yeah, but there's a minimum brain size required.

17:25:18 mircea_popescu: there isn't a minimum hand size required by gold.

17:25:28 ascii_field: on the contrary

17:25:34 ascii_field: gold needs bigger fist than anyone has.

17:25:47 ascii_field: (to hold with same tightness as btc)

17:25:52 mircea_popescu: this is true. nevertheless, bitcoin is very elitist by its nature, which flows from this.

17:26:12 mircea_popescu: ie, it enforces a "must be this tall to ride" limit rather than allowing people to delude themselves about it

17:26:20 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=10-06-2015#1159370

17:26:20 assbot: Logged on 10-06-2015 17:00:45; ascii_field: it is the ultimate 'iq test'

17:28:20 ascii_field: speaking of 'brainwallet', mircea_popescu's picture of usg prison where 'lifetime pension' is probably not long for this world.

17:28:25 BingoBoingo: <mircea_popescu> do you basically mean that bitcoin can not be held without tools, whereas gold can, or at least to a higher degree ? << At the time more physical possession of gold is different from possession of bitcoin

17:28:42 ascii_field: it will be replaced - question of ~when~, not ~if~ - by something like an oubliette with a vending machine

17:28:50 ascii_field: a meal costs, say, 5-10btc

17:29:57 mircea_popescu: hahaha good luck with that.

17:30:25 ascii_field: it won't be for ~every~ schmuck

17:30:32 ascii_field: just for the ones 'too kewl for school'

17:30:33 mircea_popescu: i don't buy from paypal, you expect me to trade with your vending machine ? wtf is this, "free market the way we like it" ?

17:31:05 ascii_field: machine will be marked 'mean - 5btc. skipped arse dilation session - 10.'

17:31:08 ascii_field: or somethinglikethat

17:31:09 mircea_popescu: for the record, that system already exists, for wall street pencildicks.

17:31:23 ascii_field: yeah but this'll be 100% automated

17:31:29 ascii_field: no need for fallible human torturer

17:31:30 mircea_popescu: about half the people currently working there have this episode in their life, "give us all your money and we'll agree to not let you work for x years"

17:31:48 mircea_popescu: it's pretty automated as it is. look through wall street "prosecutions" sometime.

17:32:16 mircea_popescu: the reason there's nothing left there but crooks is precisely that the onl;y deal available is "i try to steal as much as i can, if you catch me you get it and i take a vacation"

17:32:46 ascii_field: today 'vacation', tomorrow - esp. if they suspect you haven't in fact given 'it all' - the vending machine.

17:32:58 ascii_field: this is what being a prisoner ~means~ - you are a plaything for someone else's amusement

17:33:05 ascii_field: to use in laboratory for experiments, if they like.

17:34:15 mircea_popescu: heh. you have a very idealized view of marriage.

17:34:20 mircea_popescu: never works that way in practice.

17:35:23 ascii_field: worked great in cn (jp jailers experimenting with 'what internal organs does this fella ~really~ need' etc)

17:35:27 ascii_field: and in germany

17:36:43 ascii_field: 'vending machine' is inevitable because, unlike torquemada's chambers, it ~can be built by 'pencil dicks'~

17:37:13 ascii_field: like washing machine. throw schmuck in, get btc out, eventually remove dessicated corpse, rinse, repeat.

17:38:18 ascii_field: everybody stands a risk of being taken alive, and ought to be prepared mentally for this device.

17:40:10 mats: voluntold organ harvesting is still an ongoing thing in cn

17:41:05 ascii_field: mats: works great with above setup. optionally jailer doesn't wait for you to starve, a few wks without any signal from vending machine & you go to the harversing table (wide awake naturally)

17:41:15 ascii_field: *harvesting

17:42:17 mats: makes a lot of economic sense. why waste good meat.

17:42:42 ascii_field: aha

17:42:55 ascii_field: but in the future, death in captivity will be mainly about being 'helped to remember' brainwallets.

17:43:28 ascii_field: and only secondarily about meat

17:46:54 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

17:47:15 ascii_field: for famous (or otherwise 'ransomable') folks, machine will have an externally-advertised btc addr

17:47:28 ascii_field: perhaps painted on outside wall of the jail

17:48:13 mats: lol

17:48:53 chetty: ascii_field should write sci-fi

17:49:15 ascii_field: nah, hanbot ought to write this one

17:49:26 ascii_field: prequel to 'shall be delivered' perhaps

17:50:01 ascii_field: i don't have a prayer of doing half as good a job as hanbot on this one.

17:50:10 mats: 'donate 4btc to 1Alf153X to rotate asciilifeform's cell over shark pit'

17:50:25 mats: '5btc for quadrant with dogs'

17:50:30 ascii_field: '2btc for snakepit'

17:51:19 ascii_field: ^ this'll be for candidates for 'national 5 minute hate'

17:51:30 ascii_field: infamous 't3rr0r1st4s' etc

17:51:44 mircea_popescu: voluntold lol

17:52:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 417693 @ 0.00040776 = 170.3185 BTC [-] {5}

17:52:37 mircea_popescu: anyway, nothing scifi here, it's more like emofi

17:52:53 mircea_popescu: clarke wrote scifi. orwell wrote emofi. not the same thing at all.

17:53:02 ascii_field: it's like orwell's 'telescreen' thing. inevitable tech

17:53:08 ascii_field: was well-obvious even then.

17:53:31 thestringpuller: didn't tv's exist in 1948?

17:53:40 ascii_field: aha

17:54:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34900 @ 0.00040157 = 14.0148 BTC [-]

17:55:30 ascii_field: incidentally, usg - like the regime portrayed by orwell - spends $maxint on attempts to 'read minds'. not always even laughably stupid - the mri 'has seen this object or not before' trick appears to actually work

17:55:49 ascii_field: and could, in combination with something like the letter wheel described earlier, 'help remember wallet'

17:57:11 ascii_field: (and before someone chimes in with 'so don't use brainwallet' - ~every~ wallet that you can get to, but mr schmuck can't, because you know where you buried it, etc. is in fact a 'brainwallet')

18:02:57 ascii_field: i'd much like to hear a persuasive argument re: why all of the above won't happen.

18:04:27 mats: my memory palace is dark and full of terrors

18:15:30 ascii_field: ben_vulpes, mod6, mircea_popescu, et al: can anyone recall why http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20141218/bitcoin-v0_5_3-rm_checkpoints_41327b9a962e6d27869f4d361d742ab5c7061ede.5.patch didn't make it in ?

18:15:32 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GyQq8Z )

18:16:08 punkman: because it blows up trying to verify all transactions

18:16:21 ascii_field: if it doesn't verify, it didn't happen in bitcoin ?

18:16:55 ascii_field: does the ~genuine~, honest blockchain actually contain blocks that never verified ?

18:17:08 ascii_field: (how?!)

18:17:12 punkman: they verified at some combination of bitcoind and openssl

18:17:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91944 @ 0.00041442 = 38.1034 BTC [+] {2}

18:19:32 jurov: !up ascii_field

18:21:23 ascii_field: http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/0.5.3-todos << probably ought to be either updated or tossed ?

18:21:24 assbot: 0.5.3-todos [bitcoin assets wiki] ... ( http://bit.ly/1I6TYAO )

18:25:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 142985 @ 0.00040156 = 57.4171 BTC [-] {3}

18:31:56 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 190400 @ 0.00041989 = 79.9471 BTC [+] {2}

18:31:57 mod6: ascii_field: re: checkpoints: the patch worked fine to remove checkpoints, but it was tabled for the time being. the main discussion around this was that it could be helpful to hvae checkpoints in there to prevent spamming of blocks from timestamps before a checkpoint.

18:32:44 mod6: at a later time when we have everything setup for a checkpoint configuration file, then we can revisit.

18:32:56 ascii_field: i'm all for having them in there minus the 'skip checks prior to checkpoints' thing

18:33:15 ascii_field: skipping sig verifications ever, for any reason, is braindamaged

18:36:54 mod6: wher is this now?

18:37:16 ascii_field: mod6: the original (in there now) checkpoint code

18:37:34 mod6: the part you're talking about is in main.cpp right?

18:38:17 ascii_field: http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/main.cpp#0936

18:38:18 assbot: Satoshi 0.5.3.1/src/main.cpp ... ( http://bit.ly/1GyS0Ie )

18:39:38 mats: http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/white-americans-are-biggest-terror-threat-u-s-study-n380931

18:39:39 assbot: White Americans Are Biggest Terror Threat in U.S.: Study - NBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1GyS4aS )

18:39:46 punkman: http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/main.cpp#0936 << when I removed the IFs there it blew up before block 150k, wonder if it works for anyone else

18:44:31 mod6: ascii_field: so you're saying you'd like to just git rid of line 939?

18:45:20 ascii_field: aha

18:45:24 ben_vulpes: where does fblock get set?

18:45:40 mod6: where it's called

18:45:50 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=04-02-2015#1005892

18:45:50 assbot: Logged on 04-02-2015 04:26:05; asciilifeform: is the only place where fBlock is true

18:45:55 mod6: check out line 435

18:46:26 mod6: yeah, line 1099 sets it to true.

18:46:51 ben_vulpes: hyu

18:47:00 ben_vulpes: what happens if the blockchain contains invalid blocks?

18:47:15 ben_vulpes: coffins for everyone involved with checkpoints?

18:47:26 ben_vulpes: not that they're not zombies already, but...

18:47:27 ascii_field: they already earned the coffins

18:47:43 ben_vulpes: my point is that they're still walking.

18:48:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 130100 @ 0.00039889 = 51.8956 BTC [-] {3}

18:48:50 ascii_field: at the very least i want to know ~why~ invalid block made it into the chain

18:49:08 ascii_field: and cui bono

18:49:47 ascii_field: and whether it is actually cryptographically invalid, or only protocol-invalid

18:50:02 ascii_field: (i.e. invalid on account of a field that can be corrected today without changing validity of signature)

18:50:21 thestringpuller: !up ascii_field

18:52:09 ascii_field: iirc this got lost in the noise of the great wedge thing at the time

18:52:21 ascii_field: and was forgotten when bdb locks patch discovered

19:01:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 369950 @ 0.00041903 = 155.0201 BTC [+] {5}

19:04:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 153350 @ 0.00042356 = 64.9529 BTC [+] {2}

19:06:51 mod6: So anyway, we'll have to remember this when we revist the Checkpoints issue. My patch will be rejected then, and we'll come up with something that gets rid of line 939 as well as pulling the checkpoints themselves out of checkpoints.cpp and into a separate config file.

19:17:41 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 236211 @ 0.00039808 = 94.0309 BTC [-] {2}

19:22:02 mod6: !up ascii_field

19:32:56 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 169700 @ 0.00039689 = 67.3522 BTC [-] {2}

19:35:01 Naphex: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-7xfBrjSA0

19:35:02 assbot: Bananas, Sardines and Sharks - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1CtGBZl )

20:12:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 173300 @ 0.00041641 = 72.1639 BTC [+]

20:15:50 trinque: http://www.wsj.com/articles/nato-ramps-up-response-to-russia-1435174136 << "Breedlove" ... life imitates art?

20:15:51 assbot: NATO Ramps Up Response to Russia - WSJ ... ( http://bit.ly/1LozQiB )

20:20:43 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 122100 @ 0.00041673 = 50.8827 BTC [+] {2}

20:42:46 mircea_popescu: fluffypony http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?368748-New-Blender-Foundation-Transparency-Blog&p=2892541&highlight=#post2892541

20:42:47 assbot: New Blender Foundation Transparency Blog - Page 16 ... ( http://bit.ly/1LoDZDq )

20:42:53 mircea_popescu: should be interesting.

20:46:01 fluffypony: oh good

20:47:06 jurov: lol

20:47:30 jurov: on slightly related note, we hatched with thestringpuller a scheme for poor USians to take hold of X.EUR

20:47:41 jurov: when it works, we'll let you know

20:48:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44991 @ 0.00039617 = 17.8241 BTC [-] {3}

20:48:19 jurov: (or you can inquire within if impatient)

20:50:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 92200 @ 0.00041363 = 38.1367 BTC [+]

20:52:59 mircea_popescu: i think that's gonna be the bitcoin thing - we're here to surprise you.

20:53:25 mircea_popescu: re rm_checkpoints, iirc mod6 has it.

20:54:20 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes> coffins for everyone involved with checkpoints? << this is necessarily true. bitcoin hardforked once.

20:57:17 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

20:57:19 thestringpuller: secret hardfork?

20:57:42 nubbins`: is testnet still forked?

20:57:50 mircea_popescu: nothing secret about it, satoshi did it.

20:59:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95755 @ 0.000396 = 37.919 BTC [-] {2}

20:59:38 ascii_field: btw any reason not to amputate 'testnet' ?

20:59:52 nubbins`: nah

21:00:02 nubbins`: with no wallet, what's the worst you'd do to it?

21:00:09 nubbins`: relay a tx?

21:00:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23317 @ 0.00039559 = 9.224 BTC [-]

21:00:40 mircea_popescu: the mystery of meat : http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7nmzvFXMC1rvaz2uo1_1280.jpg slut in seethrough outfit looks better than naked.

21:00:42 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LoHeKX )

21:01:14 ascii_field: nubbins`: in point of fact, therealbitcoin includes wallet

21:01:21 mircea_popescu: ascii_field iirc the agreement was that it can go, as it serves no useful purpose nor has for a long time - but not a priority. we're atm working on getting the priorities in AND RUNNING

21:01:41 nubbins`: ascii_field don't mind me 8)

21:01:42 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: no argument

21:02:06 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: other than the observation that shorter -> simpler -> everything is slightly less retarded and easier to make sense of

21:02:18 mircea_popescu: the and running part includes incontrovertibly a step where a page exists online that is substantially identical to http://www.eulorum.org/Installing_Eulora#Ubuntu

21:02:20 assbot: Installing Eulora - Eulorum ... ( http://bit.ly/1LoHwRZ )

21:02:27 mircea_popescu: the "navigate to /bitcoin" pointers y compris.

21:02:32 mircea_popescu: jam - tomorrow. today, this.

21:04:34 thestringpuller: it will be interesting the posts on reddit when you kill gavincoin just like doge mircea_popescu

21:04:54 thestringpuller: i wonder if they'll call you a tyrant

21:05:15 punkman: mircea_popescu: re:blender, why send paypal instead of btc (or even a wire)?

21:05:18 mircea_popescu: i've been a girl before.

21:05:50 nubbins`: hm

21:05:57 mircea_popescu: punkman because a) when i first asked, their idea was "buy a mug" ; b) the link i finally fished out did not include any reference either i or fluffypony found (see it in logs) - they have A DIFFERENT unlinked page for this purpose

21:05:57 nubbins`: thought it was the other way around

21:06:04 mircea_popescu: and c) wire for 50 euro seems iffy, to me.

21:06:28 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 432300 @ 0.00039423 = 170.4256 BTC [-] {5}

21:06:30 mircea_popescu: nubbins` s/girl/called a girl/ mr nubbins bedalins!

21:06:58 nubbins`: nubbins bedalins, is that like amelia bedelia?

21:07:02 mircea_popescu: aye

21:07:05 thestringpuller: they are pushing the blender cloud service pretty hard these days

21:07:40 punkman: what's the cloud service for, rendering?

21:07:59 mircea_popescu: yeah. makes a lot of sense, from what i've seen.

21:08:23 mircea_popescu: anyway - this is what the vanishing 1% intelligent gpu bitcoin miners did with their rigs.

21:08:29 thestringpuller: punkman: no it's like MSDN but for blender revolging around an open source movie

21:08:43 nubbins`: http://i.imgur.com/bmMPEbw.png

21:08:44 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1LoIXA4 )

21:09:09 punkman: thestringpuller: dafuq

21:09:19 nubbins`: it's like adobe CC but for blender?

21:09:26 mircea_popescu: thestringpuller wut ?

21:09:39 thestringpuller: Blender Cloud is a high quality web service in which we share all data of our previous films, all our training videos and files, and a continuous stream of data from the Gooseberry project.

21:09:43 thestringpuller: Blender Cloud subscribers can watch the creation progress closely, share this with others, learn from it, and even contribute back to it.

21:09:53 punkman: derp

21:10:14 mircea_popescu: gah

21:10:20 trinque: it's like... facebook, but for blender users, y'see

21:10:21 mircea_popescu: im pretty sure i saw rendering prices etc.

21:10:23 nubbins`: o

21:10:35 nubbins`: so it's like dvd extras

21:10:46 nubbins`: cool, where'd i put my money

21:10:51 nubbins`: ;/

21:11:17 mircea_popescu: https://render.st/

21:11:18 assbot: Blender & V-Ray rendering on a fast Render Farm - Render Street ... ( http://bit.ly/1GIFMQc )

21:11:21 mircea_popescu: apparently that was unrelated.

21:11:26 mircea_popescu: dude...

21:15:15 cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174461 <<< bananas cheap? they were around $15/kg a few years ago down under (on account of storms destroying the banana growing regions and the fact bananas cannot be imported into australia)

21:15:15 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 19:35:01; Naphex: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-7xfBrjSA0

21:15:29 mircea_popescu: o.O ?!

21:15:39 mircea_popescu: dude bananas are like 1 dollar / kg worldwide.

21:17:01 cazalla: about $2.99/kg atm but every few years the storms destroy the plantations and up the price goes

21:18:55 cazalla: that is for cavendish, lady fingers are around $7.50-$10/kg

21:18:55 williamdunne: mircea_popescu: What is the drink you have in your blender picture?

21:19:18 mircea_popescu: ugh

21:19:46 mircea_popescu: that is actually a mexican sundae. except with cognac.

21:22:44 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 98200 @ 0.00041306 = 40.5625 BTC [+]

21:22:58 williamdunne: That sounds pretty nice

21:23:26 nubbins`: "My boss wouldn't accept Bitcoin. I have since quit my job"

21:23:27 williamdunne: On that note:

21:23:28 williamdunne: bitcoin-logo-plainBitcoin

21:23:28 williamdunne: Blender Foundation can receive Bitcoin donations made using the following address:

21:23:28 williamdunne: 17orEh51ab8HoU7g8Ezwcp76jCpeL7PabJ

21:23:39 *: nubbins` weeps as his sides crumble and fall

21:24:04 nubbins`: "My boss wouldn't accept Bitcoin. I have since quit my job, set up a competitor"

21:24:18 nubbins`: your poor boss ;p

21:24:21 williamdunne: Yeah that was about as derpy as it gets

21:24:36 nubbins`: of course the fucking dog dick is a "web designer"

21:25:07 nubbins`: someone should do a browser extension that changes all instances of "boss" in /r/bitcoin to "parents"

21:26:02 mircea_popescu: lol im sure his parents took bitcoin

21:26:27 mircea_popescu: also leaves, bits of their own front yard, inept 6yo drawings on bits of wallpaper etc

21:27:00 williamdunne: In fairness, unemployment rates are sub 10% while the rates of loozers are well over 50%

21:27:01 trinque: "mom you stupid whore! where's my hot pocket?!"

21:27:57 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

21:28:08 thestringpuller: my mom woulda put me in the ground had I spoken like that to her as a kid

21:28:10 ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174561 << wai wat?! we're swallowing usg stats now ?

21:28:10 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 21:27:00; williamdunne: In fairness, unemployment rates are sub 10% while the rates of loozers are well over 50%

21:28:54 williamdunne: ascii_field: nah, but USG stats are what, 4%? I reckon 10% is about right

21:28:55 ascii_field: (usg counts as 'employed' anyone of working age who isn't collecting state-funded 'unemployment pension')

21:29:23 williamdunne: 5.5%

21:29:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 129574 @ 0.00040386 = 52.3298 BTC [-]

21:30:06 nubbins`: out of work and not looking? you're not unemployed.

21:30:16 nubbins`: STATS FTW

21:32:19 trinque: thestringpuller: I'm a firm believer in post-natal abortion rights.

21:36:01 williamdunne: nubbins`: Wouldn't that be fair anyway?

21:36:28 williamdunne: I always thought the stat was meant to reflect those looking for work who can't find it

21:37:06 mircea_popescu: i thought unemployed is "hasn't made 1mn clicks on fb stuff this month"

21:43:12 williamdunne: Thats employed, surely?

21:43:47 mircea_popescu: hm

21:44:03 mircea_popescu: better get the pm request special powers to investigate the content of people clicks

21:44:11 mircea_popescu: otherwise we will never be able to answer this dilemma.

21:45:06 nubbins`: i think that's included in the next omnibus bill

21:45:16 nubbins`: gotta get it going before mulcair gets elected

21:51:07 mircea_popescu: lol

21:51:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 162940 @ 0.00041371 = 67.4099 BTC [+] {3}

21:58:52 lobbes: !up ascii_field

21:59:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47806 @ 0.00039302 = 18.7887 BTC [-]

21:59:24 pete_dushenski: trinque: that's called 'infanticide' and will apparently kill your chances with teh ladies

21:59:45 pete_dushenski: not unlike williamdunne telling them they belong in the kitchen, i suppose

22:00:51 trinque: pete_dushenski: so I hear, yet primate infanticide is most certainly a thing.

22:01:27 pete_dushenski: insect too

22:02:04 pete_dushenski: throughout the animal kingdom, really

22:04:05 williamdunne: ahaha

22:04:17 williamdunne: Yes, infanticide might be slightly better

22:06:32 trinque: I've seen more than a few things published on whether "sudden infant death syndrome" (obviously a questionable concept on its own) is a more palatable "diagnosis" for infanticide

22:09:07 pete_dushenski: trinque that'd make sense y'know

22:09:10 mircea_popescu: !up kenburnes

22:09:46 mircea_popescu: eh from what i've heard, they convicted a buncha women for what actually was bona fide kids dying

22:09:52 mircea_popescu: in here kenburnes

22:10:01 kenburnes: hi

22:10:07 mircea_popescu: how goes.

22:10:16 kenburnes: ok

22:12:40 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu go figure that the courts would find personal responsbility where there is none to counterbalance their continued lenience when it's actually there, as with 'insanity' pleas.

22:13:03 trinque: yeah, I can see how the thing resembles other media-fueled panics

22:13:11 mircea_popescu: i suppose on the surface "sudden infant death" seems insanity, as adults don't do anything like that.

22:13:35 mircea_popescu: nevertheless, spontaneous abortion is a thing, and obviously children inhabit some sort of continuum between that and adulthood, so...

22:13:40 mircea_popescu: who knows, nature's complex enough.

22:16:17 pete_dushenski: and the scope of science such as it exists currently is woefully inadequate to study the matter

22:16:55 mircea_popescu: not that inadequate. iirc it's the leading cause of death in small children in the western world.

22:17:37 pete_dushenski: i can see the epidemiology headline now : "sids linked to living in suburbia"

22:17:43 mircea_popescu: but so far most of the productions on the topic are "smoking is bad and vaccines good mkay"

22:18:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 72900 @ 0.00042345 = 30.8695 BTC [+]

22:19:19 pete_dushenski: trying to control variables in any such sids experiment would require insane amounts of data and coordination

22:19:32 cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174589 <<< they kill other people's kids, not their own though yeah?

22:19:32 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 22:00:51; trinque: pete_dushenski: so I hear, yet primate infanticide is most certainly a thing.

22:20:42 punkman: dunno about humans, but baby goat is delicious

22:21:42 mircea_popescu: baby sheep's even better.

22:22:07 *: mircea_popescu spent his decade or so of acquaintance with indian cuisine eating pretty much nothing but lamb.

22:23:37 BingoBoingo: Goat and lamb both delicious, as are suckling pigs

22:26:18 punkman: kinda hard to distinguish baby goat/lamb after cooking, at least for my taste buds

22:29:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 121839 @ 0.00042345 = 51.5927 BTC [+] {2}

22:30:50 BingoBoingo: punkman: The difference is in the preparation that takes it to that point.

22:30:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30046 @ 0.00042656 = 12.8164 BTC [+]

22:39:48 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo "the later is simply for hire" << two t's

22:49:09 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11950 @ 0.00042656 = 5.0974 BTC [+]

22:58:49 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Fixed

23:04:59 pete_dushenski: cool beans. i'm outie. laters!

23:10:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 41980 @ 0.00042725 = 17.936 BTC [+] {2}

23:11:31 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 281592 @ 0.0004296 = 120.9719 BTC [+] {8}

23:14:59 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-06-2015#1174609 << it was.

23:14:59 assbot: Logged on 24-06-2015 22:17:37; pete_dushenski: i can see the epidemiology headline now : "sids linked to living in suburbia"

23:15:24 asciilifeform: ;;google sarah blaffer hrdy

23:15:25 gribble: Sarah Blaffer Hrdy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarah_Blaffer_Hrdy; Sarah B. Hrdy — Anthropology: http://anthropology.ucdavis.edu/people/sbhrdy; An Interview with Sarah Blaffer Hrdy on Mother Nature - Scientific ...: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/primate-diaries/raising-darwins-consciousness-an-interview-with-sarah-blaffer-hrdy- (1 more message)

23:16:28 asciilifeform: ^ has book, 'mother nature', where the thesis is laid out. recommended.

23:17:48 asciilifeform: http://bradhicks.livejournal.com/328184.html

23:17:53 asciilifeform: ^ mega-review

23:18:30 asciilifeform: ^ i posted it to 'reddit' when the latter was still readable, in '07, and for a while it held, i think, the 'vote' #1 record on that site

23:19:04 phf: so i'm running thermonuked version: at 180k blockcount, i got 44526 bastards, 44007 of which have been eventually accepted with an average 3 minute delay.

23:19:22 phf: bitcoind keeps rerequesting same bastard blocks before there's enough blockchain to accept it, on average i got 3-4 rejections for the same block, with a few worst cases of ~100 rerequests

23:20:08 asciilifeform: phf: read the src. bitcoind never 'requests bastard block', it requests 'next blocks' and ends up with a great many that aren't the precise next block we want

23:20:59 asciilifeform: 'So she gave a preliminary paper on the subject in 1976, suggesting that more research was needed to explain how this behavior could possibly have evolved in primates, only to be interrupted in mid talk by an audience member, a prominent expert in her field. He stood up, tried to stop her from finishing reading her paper, announced that primate females absolutely do not ever murder their own children, and that if she had obser

23:21:00 asciilifeform: ved a primate colony in which primate females were killing their own children, it could only be because of something she had done to them; she must have committed some horrible breach of experimental ethics that so deranged these monkeys that she had driven them insane enough to do something that no monkey had ever done before. He then stormed out of the talk and went directly to the scientific press to denounce her for whatev

23:21:00 asciilifeform: er it was that she had done to that monkey colony, so it probably is a good thing that she was already planning on changing fields, no?'

23:21:02 phf: asciilifeform: that's how i understand it, just poor wording on my part

23:21:49 asciilifeform: phf: so it works precisely as one might expect.

23:22:21 mircea_popescu: phf am i reading what you're saying correctly , "thermonuked more efficient network utilization" ?

23:23:54 ben_vulpes: hi phf!

23:23:57 ben_vulpes: good to see you again.

23:24:30 ben_vulpes: phf: is this on os x?

23:24:35 ben_vulpes: !rated phf

23:24:35 assbot: You rated user phf on 16-Apr-2014, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: lisper..

23:25:46 phf: asciilifeform: right, no surprises there so far. i thought that maybe as blockchain grows the cumulative delay will increase, but i don't see that happening yet

23:26:27 phf: ben_vulpes: heya! yeah, i quit my previous job, so i have a lot more time for avocation

23:26:36 asciilifeform: phf: out of curiosity, what was the logic behind this hypothesis ?

23:29:15 phf: asciilifeform: a hunch, but also poor understanding of how blocks are requested. i thought that maybe bastards will compete for bandwidth with legitimate blocks

23:29:46 asciilifeform: phf: in the sense that they are uselessly occupying the pipe while they're moving - they do

23:30:14 asciilifeform: but 'bastard' from the perspective of a node is simply any block for which the immediate antecedent is not already on disk

23:30:27 asciilifeform: almost always it is a legit (main chain) block

23:30:43 phf: right

23:31:06 phf: bastard in this case is something that's will eventually be joined onto blockchain

23:31:13 asciilifeform: ... or not

23:31:23 asciilifeform: (in cases of genuine crud blocks)

23:32:05 asciilifeform: understand, the entire sync mechanism as-we-have-it is profoundly retarded

23:32:23 asciilifeform: but there is no especially attractive way of fixing this, presently

23:33:37 asciilifeform: all that can be done is to have a node that 1) syncs, eventually 2) allows others to sync from self 3) doesn't go around writing blank cheques for the system resources of the box it runs on and handing them out to street scum

23:34:21 asciilifeform: it was in the interest of (3) that i amputated the 'orphan tx' cache as well.

23:34:54 asciilifeform: phf: both patches are presently considered 'experimental' and not yet ratified by therealbitcoin.

23:34:58 phf: mircea_popescu: i guess thermonuked is less efficient network utilization, but per asciilifeform better then less efficient memory utilization which was the case pre thermonuke

23:35:21 asciilifeform: it is demonstrably less efficient than if there were a cache

23:35:29 phf: right

23:35:33 mircea_popescu: phf do you intend to publish results of your run anywhere ?

23:35:33 asciilifeform: but we presently lack a non-retarded implementation of such a cache

23:35:45 mircea_popescu: !up execut3

23:35:45 asciilifeform: (this is trickier than it appears, on account of, e.g., memory fragmentation effect)

23:36:16 phf: mircea_popescu: yes, will post here, once i have closer to complete blockchain

23:36:29 mircea_popescu: cool.

23:36:35 mircea_popescu: !rated phf

23:36:35 assbot: You have not rated phf.

23:36:45 mircea_popescu: !rate phf 1 New blood

23:36:46 assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/e5ce49af6a3fe867

23:36:57 phf: asciilifeform: memory fragmentation effect?

23:37:05 asciilifeform: !s fragging

23:37:06 assbot: 17 results for 'fragging' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=fragging

23:37:11 phf: thx

23:37:12 mircea_popescu: !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.phf.1:a15501b9b874c832d39da21bd66e77d5c726136d1695025a7edffba5998423ff

23:37:12 assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for phf with note: New blood

23:37:35 asciilifeform: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=28-05-2015#1147075

23:37:35 assbot: Logged on 28-05-2015 19:48:57; asciilifeform: 2) tiny turds, stored and then reclaimed, lead to fragging

23:37:40 asciilifeform: ^ shortest explanation

23:40:55 mircea_popescu: http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?370981-Blender-s-future-on-Mac-is-in-jepordy-and-we-re-looking-for-support

23:40:56 assbot: Blender's future on Mac is in jepordy and we're looking for support ... ( http://bit.ly/1BBxgmZ )

23:40:59 mircea_popescu: "Mac has never been a viable platform for professional production 3d work"

23:41:15 mircea_popescu: the things one finds on the internet. i thought mac survived principally because graphics shitheads.

23:41:54 ben_vulpes: illustrator != blender

23:42:03 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: mno. that was '90s apple (the actual apple, prior to its death and devourment of corpse by 'next' corp.)

23:42:50 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes nah, apparently the problem is that whatever actual driver support they had, marginal as it was, they're chucking in the new osx

23:43:02 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 113288 @ 0.00042687 = 48.3592 BTC [-] {2}

23:43:04 asciilifeform: today it survives principally because it is the only remaining commercial unix workstation vendor.

23:43:13 ben_vulpes: the graphics shitheads were illustrator users, not blender users.

23:43:13 mircea_popescu: apple wants to be a "mobile platform". because it worked so well for nokia, and for samsung, and for fucking blackberry.

23:43:27 asciilifeform: (why mac survives, i mean. rather than apple corp.)

23:43:28 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: design happens on macs.

23:43:36 ben_vulpes: i went to parsons. i know.

23:43:48 mircea_popescu: well, it can only happen if the damned thing works./

23:43:52 ben_vulpes: i work with the 'agencies'. design happens on macs.

23:43:58 asciilifeform: design of what ?

23:44:00 mircea_popescu: does it ?

23:44:10 ben_vulpes: 'works' means different things for people who use computers vs program them.

23:44:14 mircea_popescu: oris it just the thing chicklets derping on facebook and calling themselves designers favour ?

23:44:17 ben_vulpes: creation of advertisement assets.

23:44:17 mircea_popescu: different things these.

23:44:21 mircea_popescu: mno, works means works.

23:44:32 ben_vulpes: "photoshop runs" means works.

23:44:50 mircea_popescu: but runs as in what ? "can't access the driver, here's a nice welcome box" ?

23:44:59 asciilifeform: 'run commercial apps' + 'not microshit' == 'mac'

23:45:09 asciilifeform: approximately.

23:46:09 asciilifeform: more or less what ben_vulpes said;

23:46:11 mircea_popescu: if you want to process say a shader and it takes you half hour on mac and five minutes on gentoo then by this standard one would i guess say it doesn't work.

23:46:26 asciilifeform: it's a machine for running photoshit without being submerged in boiling cauldron of microshit

23:46:54 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: as far as these folks are concerned, gentoo may as well be a particle accelerator at dubna, ru

23:47:06 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79400 @ 0.00043133 = 34.2476 BTC [+]

23:47:10 mircea_popescu: those folks, whatever they may think, or wish the worlkd to be, still have to eat.

23:47:17 mircea_popescu: eating still comes out of work

23:47:18 mircea_popescu: eos

23:47:19 asciilifeform: aha, they eat via photoshit.

23:47:29 asciilifeform: which runs, yes.

23:48:10 mircea_popescu: apparently it's not going to. i dunno whence this idea comes that something can run magically-like.

23:48:22 asciilifeform: wai wat

23:48:26 mircea_popescu: if they don't have decent driver suport they COULD make some in house abomiation circumvent it all, and so on

23:48:32 mircea_popescu: but it is hardly a viable solution.

23:48:40 asciilifeform: what was the thread about, i'm having trouble telling

23:48:51 asciilifeform: somewhere a mac shipped with an unsupported graphics card ?

23:48:53 mircea_popescu: as the costs to prop it up just keep on growing and eventually tyhe whole "ecosystem" collapses

23:49:01 asciilifeform: (apple does not sell such a thing)

23:49:04 mircea_popescu: apparently they are unable to support opengl properly

23:49:06 mircea_popescu: let alone cuda

23:49:28 asciilifeform: iirc shaders are not part of 'classical' opengl ?

23:49:38 mircea_popescu: supporting "classical" opengl = not working.

23:50:17 asciilifeform: address hate mail to nvidia co. ?

23:50:33 asciilifeform: or whoever apple's current gpu buttbuddy is

23:50:41 mircea_popescu: no, apparently not their fault.

23:50:47 asciilifeform: wai wat

23:51:14 kakobrekla: http://www.techeye.net/news/us-navy-spends-millions-to-stay-low-tech

23:51:15 assbot: US Navy spends millions to stay low-tech | TechEye ... ( http://bit.ly/1BBxESy )

23:51:45 kakobrekla: >The Navy tried to sail away from XP in 2013, but it seemed to hit some headwind with the project as of May this year it still had approximately 100,000 workstations running XP or the other software.

23:51:58 mircea_popescu: looks more like, "neither nvidia nor amd were willing to go into a intel-ms deal with fucking apple, because who the fuck do those assholes think they are and it's about time they figured out a) jobs is deads and b) if he weren't he'd be in jail ; meanwhile apple won't talk to intel or asus etc because they think they're too good to deal with lesser babka, and so they're saying fuck you to the entire modern computing g

23:51:58 mircea_popescu: fx stack"

23:52:03 mircea_popescu: at least that's what i got out of it.

23:52:32 asciilifeform: result will likely be that apple begins shipping arm-macs with their in-house gpu.

23:52:38 mircea_popescu: that will suck.

23:52:53 asciilifeform: (they are already shipping this chip in the pocket comps)

23:52:57 mircea_popescu: and no, i don't believe cook has the guts to even try.

23:53:08 mircea_popescu: they'll just pretend like the poroblem doesn't exist and will go away, like any mcdonalds.

23:53:12 asciilifeform: (how much it sucks is a question for serious apple aficionados, not for me)

23:53:43 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: they don't need much gut here, the chip was designed under herr jobs and exists now

23:54:02 mircea_popescu: the need for guts comes in exactly too sizes :

23:54:06 mircea_popescu: immense and not too much.

23:54:09 mircea_popescu: they're the same size.

23:54:52 mircea_popescu: anyway. jobs could have pulled something like this off, maybe, as an outlier result. mostly, he'd have failed miserably while denying it all along.

23:54:59 mircea_popescu: anyone else they have left there won't even try

23:55:08 asciilifeform: apple's trajectory for years has been to merge 'iphonism' into their entire product line

23:55:13 asciilifeform: this'd be a logical conclusion.

23:55:24 asciilifeform: mac would turn into 'ipad' 'with keyboard.'

23:55:25 mircea_popescu: they'll make excellent gameboys in a decade.

23:56:39 asciilifeform: they could make almost anything and folks will buy so long as it is vaguely computer-like and doesn't run winblows.

23:56:50 asciilifeform: see the point re: 'sole remaining commercial unix ws vendor'

23:57:25 mircea_popescu: what idiots do isn't really in the scope of this discussion.

23:57:33 mircea_popescu: there are people with myspace accounts still.

23:57:43 mircea_popescu: heck, yahoo briefcase apparently had users, when it closed.

23:58:09 asciilifeform: not speaking of these. but of the folks who want a posix box that fits in a rucksack, where, e.g., 'suspend to ram' works, etc

23:58:18 asciilifeform: just ask ben_vulpes...

23:58:23 mircea_popescu: "And that article Richard posted just seems to exist to stroke Apple's ego. I don't think I know a single artist who would choose to buy one of the new Mac Pros for their work, especially considering the premium you pay and their reliance on AMD hardware in a field dominated by nV and CUDA."

23:58:23 mircea_popescu: there.

23:58:45 asciilifeform: ^ must be microshit shill

23:59:09 mircea_popescu: heh

23:59:18 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 109181 @ 0.0004228 = 46.1617 BTC [-] {2}

23:59:19 asciilifeform: thing is, 'not microshit' is a hard criterion for many, many folks

23:59:21 asciilifeform: including myself

23:59:38 mircea_popescu: "The crappy 3D support on Mac OS is in direct conflict with that goal. Furthermore, as a non-Mac OS user, I would kindly request that no disproportionate developer effort be spent on such an inadequate and developer-hostile platform.

23:59:38 mircea_popescu: Sent from my iPad."

23:59:41 mircea_popescu: how about that.