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Transcript for 29-03-2015, 1048 lines:

00:09:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 50700 @ 0.00027849 = 14.1194 BTC [-]

00:15:01 nubbins`: "By default this override file is named local.mk and located in the top directory of the Buildroot source tree, but a different location can be specified through the BR2_PACKAGE_OVERRIDE_FILE configuration option."

00:15:18 nubbins`: lies, no such file exists!

00:16:44 trinque: "...on 400th target..."

00:16:59 trinque: boost is the fire swamp

00:16:59 asciilifeform: nubbins`: could wait till i post this, you know

00:17:29 asciilifeform: i'm in the process of slicing out all of the actually relevant changes

00:24:02 nubbins`: heh. i'm actually just trying to feed in my own tar right now

00:24:24 nubbins`: practice, if nothing else

00:24:34 trinque: "...failed updating 3 targets..." BOOOOOOST.

00:25:15 nubbins`: ^ <+nubbins`> practice, if nothing else

00:25:51 nubbins`: tbh a fair percentage of my programming knowledge comes from hunting down stupid compile errors

00:25:59 nubbins`: like on the order of 80%+

00:26:02 trinque: eh I know the drill

00:26:09 trinque: boost is absurdly complex tho

00:26:36 trinque: I used it long ago working on a parental controls thing at a shartup

00:26:38 nubbins`: in fairness, the work behind presenting you a bash prompt is absurdly complex 8)

00:26:48 nubbins`: a shartup :0

00:26:50 trinque: an ass hair, the same from a perspective

00:27:00 trinque: nubbins`: oh yeah, big time

00:27:07 trinque: ruby on rails, and wads o boost c++

00:32:06 nubbins`: phun joke for people who work in offices: wander over to helpdesk and say "man, i found this usb stick in the parking lot and now my computer's acting /crazy/"

00:32:27 trinque: heh!

00:33:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 95371 @ 0.00027418 = 26.1488 BTC [-] {4}

00:34:21 mod6: <+jurov> my mom was using "husqvarna" << they make my favorite chainsaws / best chainsaws imho

00:45:00 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 324150 @ 0.00028134 = 91.1964 BTC [+] {4}

00:48:31 trinque: hm, boost wants bzip2 even though it's been instructed to not use that

00:49:17 trinque: that's about all the monkey-football time I have for today

00:58:41 mircea_popescu: your instructions have no power here.

01:02:05 mircea_popescu: in other news, pot makes one fat. proof inside : http://40.media.tumblr.com/45312d5667ec719da8582897f6e78cd4/tumblr_mj7tt10qNE1s78jo7o1_500.jpg

01:02:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1I6yIw6 )

01:05:35 nubbins`: i was fat before pot

01:06:56 mircea_popescu: lol

01:09:22 trinque: gotta eat before you smoke!

01:09:41 trinque: man that chick... I bet she smells bad; they always do

01:15:33 asciilifeform: who's they

01:23:09 cazalla: while i await danielpbarron's response, anyone want to suggest why the pogo flashes green after following his guide after a reboot?

01:23:34 asciilifeform: cazalla: iirc that's the default left by uboot

01:24:25 cazalla: oh i forgot to mention, can no longer ssh to it or anything

01:32:18 asciilifeform: cazalla: serial port?

01:32:40 ben_vulpes: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/28/technology/ellen-pao-kleiner-perkins-case-decision.html?_r=0

01:32:42 assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1NpFvTg )

01:33:18 trinque: asciilifeform: "stoner chicks"

01:33:31 asciilifeform: trinque: why would that be

01:33:33 ben_vulpes: tl;dr: kleiner perkins wins, modern french revolutionaries proclaim great victory

01:33:42 ben_vulpes: "at least the cause has been moved forwards!"

01:34:10 ben_vulpes: i had a massive change of heart at lunch today

01:34:21 *: asciilifeform read that earlier today, but had a mindfuck and thought it was about perkin elmer

01:34:23 ben_vulpes: i am officially in favor of every welfare and spending plan in america

01:34:24 cazalla: asciilifeform, something i can pursue next weekend i guess

01:34:39 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: 'heightening the contradictions' ?

01:35:11 ben_vulpes: the more distracted by sexual inequality, gender inequality, income inequality, and the more attention they're paying to the management of the epic bureaucracy so built, the less time and energy will be devoted to the impending conflicts.

01:35:22 ben_vulpes: more along the lines of draining the battery, asciilifeform.

01:35:32 ben_vulpes: universal healthcare? fuck yes!

01:35:39 mircea_popescu: congrats, you are now clinton.

01:35:52 asciilifeform: at the risk of mixing metaphors, the battery is powered by burning the (remaining) furniture.

01:35:54 mircea_popescu: im pretty sure the woman is thinking, and im pretty sure this is what.

01:35:55 ben_vulpes: universal jobs program?

01:35:57 ben_vulpes: go for it!

01:36:11 ben_vulpes: robot horses?

01:36:13 ben_vulpes: why not?

01:36:20 trinque: inverse of "starve the beast"

01:36:22 trinque: gorge til death!

01:36:23 ben_vulpes: jets that fly like shitty helicopters and cost a bezzilion?

01:36:25 trinque: I like it

01:36:25 ben_vulpes: DO IT

01:36:46 ben_vulpes: those remaining fat reserves? eat 'em.

01:36:59 ben_vulpes: dig in and enjoy while it lasts, piggies.

01:37:02 mircea_popescu: there's a reason that story of mine is set at a feast.

01:37:05 mircea_popescu: appetite lacking, but anyway.

01:37:13 asciilifeform: can't speak for ben_vulpes, but no one came and asked me if the jets should be built

01:37:23 asciilifeform: so having a position on the matter feels odd

01:37:35 ben_vulpes: it constrains conversational attack surface

01:37:36 mircea_popescu: get with the social media age alfie.

01:37:56 asciilifeform: l0l mr o polls, 'should grumman get another $tril' ?

01:38:14 mircea_popescu: kickstart it.

01:38:28 trinque: I heard lockheed martin is going to build the enterprise with a fusion reactor

01:38:31 trinque: *upvote*

01:38:31 asciilifeform: suckstarter.

01:38:42 asciilifeform: (as in harley)

01:39:16 mircea_popescu: as in bad lay

01:39:59 asciilifeform: someone, iirc al schwartz, described his sister as 'could suckstart a harley'

01:41:02 mircea_popescu: men reach a certain age where the only way they're fucking anything is if that anything sucks them off first.

01:41:33 mircea_popescu: hence a very cold reception to much younger men's ideas about "couldn't abstain"

01:41:42 mircea_popescu: nigga, say wut ? rape her ? youredoingitwrong.

01:41:47 asciilifeform: in othere news

01:41:49 asciilifeform: we have sata.

01:41:56 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81003 @ 0.0002678 = 21.6926 BTC [-] {3}

01:42:09 mircea_popescu: good news.

01:42:40 asciilifeform: ... aaand

01:42:45 asciilifeform: chucked all the extra crud

01:42:47 asciilifeform: from kernel

01:43:10 mircea_popescu: 3.5 mb/

01:43:36 asciilifeform: not size that matters so much

01:43:42 asciilifeform: but brain footprint

01:44:37 asciilifeform: drive mounts.

01:44:41 asciilifeform: yes, that weird sandisk.

01:44:57 asciilifeform: sd and usb also work.

01:51:10 asciilifeform: boot time, from end of udev pause, is ~3 sec.

01:52:17 mircea_popescu: nioce.

02:02:23 asciilifeform: 927d52a91421ad608ceaf011e56aa91d18f478f81707a8774bc0cbdb146621f5118b35c640b376cdcaef206be98b520802f1f749e387b1b4876d6a6a0d080bd1 turdel-now-with-sata.gz

02:02:59 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/turdel-now-with-sata.gz

02:07:09 decimation: asciilifeform: re: rf quiet pc < the original IBM AT came in a heavy metal case, fully shielded

02:07:30 asciilifeform: shielded but for the keyboard, display..

02:07:33 asciilifeform: power

02:07:48 asciilifeform: 'heavy metal case' is not the same as 'tempest shield' regardless of appearances

02:07:58 asciilifeform: though it beats plastic

02:14:05 decimation: asciilifeform: agreed

02:14:21 decimation: but to get actual tempest shield request spending golden toilet money

02:15:35 decimation: the best approximation one can get as a civilian is to purchase FCC "class B" devices

02:23:43 decimation: golden toilet lcd displays > http://www.apitech.com/product-classes/sst-emcon-tempest-monitors

02:23:44 assbot: SST / EMCON TEMPEST Monitors | API Technologies ... ( http://bit.ly/1yodbKb )

02:36:34 decimation: asciilifeform: http://www.theamphour.com/241-an-interview-with-chuck-peddle-charismatic-chipmaking-coryphaeus/ < chuck peddle claims in the middle of this 2.5 hour podcast that his new 'hybrid DRAM/FLASH ssd drive' contains 11 6502 uC's

02:36:35 assbot: An Interview With Chuck Peddle - Charismatic Chipmaking Coryphaeus | The Amp Hour Electronics Podcast ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoevNa )

02:37:14 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes, mod6, mircea_popescu, danielpbarron, punkman, nubbins`, et al:

02:37:20 asciilifeform: achtung, panzers!

02:37:21 asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000074.html

02:37:22 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoeybM )

02:37:31 asciilifeform: 'Presenting... Build your own Pogotron.'

02:37:45 asciilifeform: tested the result, too

02:37:57 asciilifeform: should take about 20 min. on a typical box, to build the WHOLE ORCHESTRA

02:38:00 asciilifeform: incl. compilers.

02:39:49 asciilifeform: ^^^^^^ thing i promised mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-03-2015#1068981

02:39:49 assbot: Logged on 24-03-2015 22:31:11; mircea_popescu: well, how soon can we have it ?

02:39:52 asciilifeform: is here.

02:39:56 decimation: congrats asciilifeform

02:39:59 mircea_popescu: lalala

02:40:04 asciilifeform: gentlemen, start yer enginez

02:40:13 decimation: I need to download one from amazon

02:40:16 trinque: bravo

02:40:48 trinque: asciilifeform: am meeting up with ben_vulpes and other friends tonight, and I'll bring along the pogo

02:40:54 mircea_popescu: ah how splendid.

02:40:57 asciilifeform: the cookbook is brutally terse, if any of it isn't obvious plz ask while i'm awake

02:41:05 mircea_popescu: danielpbarron manual asap!

02:41:09 decimation: asciilifeform: was this run on your gentoo box?

02:41:13 asciilifeform: aha

02:41:19 asciilifeform: it ought to run on any reasonable unix though

02:41:23 asciilifeform: uses nothing local but gcc

02:42:04 mircea_popescu: anyone know like a nude housekeeper service in dc or something ?

02:42:04 trinque: asciilifeform: I tried the crossdev compile of bitcoind and got as far as boost hell regarding bzip2

02:42:08 decimation: ja but does it depend on particular gcc to bootstrap?

02:42:19 asciilifeform: trinque: note that bitcoind is not included in this yet

02:42:23 trinque: but have working cross compilation tooling otherwise, which farts executibles agreeable to the pogo

02:42:26 trinque: yep

02:42:36 asciilifeform: decimation: i only tried it on 4.8.x

02:42:48 asciilifeform: decimation: if you have something unusually archaic, may have problems

02:43:05 decimation: k.

02:43:19 asciilifeform: somebody at least build this plz.

02:43:24 asciilifeform: even if no pogo.

02:43:32 trinque: asciilifeform: ben_vulpes and I shall shortly

02:43:33 asciilifeform: you will get a kernel image (also contains rootfs)

02:43:34 decimation: I'll try on my rhel6 vm

02:43:36 trinque: "hack night"

02:43:37 asciilifeform: neato

02:44:29 asciilifeform: the Gb ethernet, 3Gb/s sata, sd card, usb - work

02:44:40 asciilifeform: have not yet tested led or button.

02:45:18 asciilifeform: i also eliminated all the standard crud that kernel wants to have by default - support for usb hid, mice, keyboards, framebuffers, and anything whatsoever whose purpose i did not know

02:45:19 asciilifeform: gone.

02:45:42 asciilifeform: if i missed something - shoot it, don't hesitate

02:45:59 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33280 @ 0.00027739 = 9.2315 BTC [+]

02:46:06 asciilifeform: one little warning - 'buildroot' is dumb as a rock, you will have to 'make clean all' just about every time

02:46:13 asciilifeform: (every time you change anything)

02:46:35 asciilifeform: doesn't nuke the compiler though, iirc

02:46:45 asciilifeform: a rebuild is about 6 min. on my box.

02:49:53 mircea_popescu: Probably more. << i don't see wut more.

02:49:56 asciilifeform: for those who don't know - 'buildroot' does -not- use your local crossdev tooling, should you have any

02:50:02 asciilifeform: it builds own world.

02:50:10 mircea_popescu: trinque / ben_vulpes hack a uboot module while at it!

02:50:20 asciilifeform: ah and this thing builds uboot

02:50:25 asciilifeform: but i have not tested the one it makes

02:50:29 asciilifeform: i am using the one i made.

02:50:30 trinque: mircea_popescu: what should it do?

02:50:35 mircea_popescu: not necessarily one we'll use, just to get the hang of it

02:50:43 mircea_popescu: it should compile a pogo bitcoind

02:50:43 trinque: I installed uboot on my pogo already

02:50:47 mircea_popescu: nono.

02:50:54 mircea_popescu: bitcoind as ubut module

02:51:06 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i thought about this

02:51:21 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform aha!

02:51:24 trinque: interesting, I'll have to look into precisely what that'd mean

02:51:30 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it isn't a particularly great substitute for a unix, unfortunately

02:51:32 mircea_popescu: which is why i say trinque :)

02:51:35 trinque: lol

02:51:48 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform huge step forward from all the other people way in the back.

02:51:50 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: missing any kind of i/o scheduler, or, more importantly, task slicer

02:51:57 asciilifeform: (scheduler)

02:52:13 asciilifeform: (bitcoind is threaded)

02:52:14 trinque: yeah we'll look at it

02:52:20 asciilifeform: or dos port would have been simple.

02:52:21 mircea_popescu: bitcoin is, but the pogo is single core neh ?

02:52:25 asciilifeform: aha

02:52:30 mircea_popescu: so then not THAT big of a deal

02:52:38 asciilifeform: this is roughly close in sweat level to an msdos port

02:53:15 trinque: I'm about certain this is beyond the scope of this evening or one six pack of beer

02:53:20 trinque: :D

02:54:03 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform who knows what whiz kidz come up with.

02:54:48 trinque: uboot is basically grub for this thing, yeah?

02:55:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 110920 @ 0.00027739 = 30.7681 BTC [+]

02:55:14 mod6: <+asciilifeform> http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000074.html << congrats on the pogotron, ascii!

02:55:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yogaSI )

02:55:26 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i certainly intend to sit bitcoin down on the metal. on possibly even this machine. but will probably use ada's spark bare metal for it.

02:55:28 asciilifeform: and not today.

02:55:53 asciilifeform: trinque: sorta like grub.

02:55:55 mircea_popescu: wait, ada to compile a c environment ?!

02:55:59 asciilifeform: neh

02:56:04 asciilifeform: for the final solution.

02:56:15 mircea_popescu: yeah well, at the chestnut cafe, that.

02:56:18 asciilifeform: aha.

02:56:41 mircea_popescu: trinque grub doesn't actually prep anything, just runs it

02:56:57 asciilifeform: grub does init surprisingly much

02:57:09 asciilifeform: (iirc it can even set up x64 mode if asked)

02:57:14 trinque: mircea_popescu: this is likely out of my league

02:57:21 asciilifeform: but grub is x86-centric

02:58:02 mircea_popescu: vacuum : http://36.media.tumblr.com/8bdec86fef97623cea1fe3104435453b/tumblr_n9bycls3rl1r5k682o1_1280.jpg

02:58:03 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yogpxl )

02:58:09 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i've never done that much with it.

02:58:13 trinque: when it comes to how it might poke storage, no idea

02:58:35 trinque: is there some way to bolt a program directly to a kernel?

02:58:37 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'menstrual extraction' ?

02:58:57 trinque: seems like you end up with what asciilifeform already has

02:59:08 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i thinbk just plain weird.

02:59:18 mircea_popescu: trinque you could make it a kernel module

02:59:47 *: asciilifeform also considered this

02:59:56 *: asciilifeform did not like the lack of process separation inherent in it

03:00:07 asciilifeform: wedged bitcoind - wedged machine

03:00:33 *: asciilifeform has been thinking about this for a long time.

03:00:44 mircea_popescu: yeah it's not optimal, but he wanted to bolt it.

03:01:05 trinque: I'd have to do some reading before I'm sure what I'd want

03:01:07 mircea_popescu: nevertheless... eventually the only thing bitcoind can be is an os.

03:01:13 asciilifeform: aha.

03:01:31 asciilifeform: i'd go further

03:01:34 asciilifeform: ... a device.

03:01:56 mircea_popescu: i dunno i'd go for that

03:02:02 mircea_popescu: you may have to change it in a warzone.

03:02:27 asciilifeform: easy to swap device, no ?

03:03:07 mircea_popescu: no. because you don't have a fab.

03:03:22 mircea_popescu: making the code carved in stone is imo a bad move.

03:03:30 asciilifeform: i didn't say 'custom ic'

03:03:34 asciilifeform: i said 'device'

03:03:35 trinque: what's the derpiest unix like kernel this thing would build on?

03:03:38 mircea_popescu: then it's an os.

03:03:42 asciilifeform: as in, a box that isn't used for anything else.

03:03:51 mircea_popescu: oh. well that's what it being an os means he ?

03:03:54 asciilifeform: and custom si doesn't imply 'set in stone' necessarily

03:04:07 asciilifeform: could very easily be a bitcoind-optimized cpu arch.

03:04:20 asciilifeform: (with support for bounds checking and other adaisms)

03:04:29 mircea_popescu: that, sure.

03:04:33 asciilifeform: but this is for after the war.

03:04:35 mircea_popescu: once you got the os, optimize hw for it.

03:04:44 mircea_popescu: no, actually, this will be right in the middle of the war.

03:05:10 asciilifeform: if i make it to the middle - i do it. otherwise, trying to leave enough of a record here for the next fella.

03:05:23 mircea_popescu: in other news, lol! http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu1z67hEqL1r5k682o1_1280.jpg

03:05:25 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoh2H4 )

03:06:02 asciilifeform: wat

03:06:29 asciilifeform: # uname -a

03:06:29 asciilifeform: Linux therealbitcoin 3.18.1-therealbitcoin.org #2 PREEMPT Sat Mar 28 22:09:20 EDT 2015 armv5tel GNU/Linux

03:06:35 asciilifeform: ^ is what you get if built correctly.

03:06:42 asciilifeform: with your date/time

03:07:04 trinque: asciilifeform: chewing through a gcc build atm, looks good so far

03:07:10 decimation: asciilifeform: sigh "../gnu/at-func.c: In function 'setxattrat': xattr-at.c:36:20: error: too few arguments to function 'setxattr' #define AT_FUNC_F1 setxattr" < I'm looking into it

03:07:20 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 200518 @ 0.00026711 = 53.5604 BTC [-] {3}

03:07:25 asciilifeform: decimation: what machine / gcc ?

03:07:33 nubbins`: <+asciilifeform> achtung, panzers! << woo!

03:07:39 asciilifeform: decimation: because this is a buildrootism and has nothing to do with me

03:08:35 nubbins`: <+cazalla> while i await danielpbarron's response, anyone want to suggest why the pogo flashes green after following his guide after a reboot? <<< i fucked up setting some of the fw_setenv parameters. you'll prolly need to serial into it, next time use fw_printenv to double check all your boot cmds before you commit

03:08:55 asciilifeform: you can printenv from uboot console

03:09:03 nubbins`: ^

03:09:03 asciilifeform: if you have serial port (or the netconsole thing set up)

03:09:09 asciilifeform: likewise setenv

03:09:10 asciilifeform: -and-

03:09:12 asciilifeform: saveenv

03:09:15 decimation: asciilifeform: it's gcc-4.6 on redhat

03:09:16 nubbins`: cazalla it was something like fw_setenv "boot_xyz='abc'" vs fw_setenv boot_xyz="abc"

03:09:18 asciilifeform: (yes, flashes changes from in itself)

03:09:47 decimation: shit no nevermind I was in the wrong terminal and accidently built on osx :)

03:09:50 nubbins`: saveenv wat? haha, i booted into debian to fw_setenv ;/

03:10:46 asciilifeform: anyway, the two most urgent items on the agenda for this thing are:

03:10:51 asciilifeform: 1) freezing the sourceballs in time

03:11:07 asciilifeform: (virginal buildroot loads them -from the net- and afaik does not check signatures)

03:11:34 asciilifeform: 2) study the package system. the dependencies of bitcoind would ideally be added as packages

03:11:41 mircea_popescu: well you can have it load form your local machine.

03:11:46 asciilifeform: (source packages. there are no other kinds in this)

03:12:09 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: buildroot builds and uses own toolchain, in a kind of jail. so it is very convenient to have the whole thing build inside it

03:12:30 asciilifeform: and ultimately stronger, because nothing snarfed in from the os

03:12:35 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i mean, you can trivially make -from the net- = localhost

03:12:40 asciilifeform: aha that yes.

03:12:48 asciilifeform: is what i was speaking of.

03:12:49 mircea_popescu: or w/e convenient trusted host

03:13:01 mircea_popescu: if you wish to save the set you used and sign it, i'll host the lot

03:13:06 asciilifeform: the dl directory

03:13:10 asciilifeform: if it has a package, it won't load again

03:13:35 mircea_popescu: actually i suppose the correct thing would be to move the whole shebang on maillist

03:13:44 mircea_popescu: "packages so and so downloaded so and so "

03:13:58 asciilifeform: http://dpaste.com/2K9GBR5.txt

03:13:59 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yohLb8 )

03:13:59 asciilifeform: ^ mine

03:14:32 mircea_popescu: sign and deed it.

03:14:54 mircea_popescu: including full paths would be good too

03:18:25 asciilifeform: deedbot-: http://dpaste.com/2S1W3X0.txt

03:18:26 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoi99B )

03:18:45 asciilifeform: ... ?

03:18:51 mircea_popescu: i think colon got taken out

03:18:56 mircea_popescu: !up deedbot-

03:19:01 asciilifeform: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/2S1W3X0.txt

03:19:02 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoibOJ )

03:19:02 deedbot-: rejected: 1

03:19:06 asciilifeform: wat

03:19:06 mircea_popescu: lawl

03:19:39 mircea_popescu: trinque ^ ?

03:19:57 mircea_popescu: gpg: Good signature from "Stanislav Datskovskiy

03:20:25 asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000075.html

03:20:25 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1yoij0U )

03:20:32 asciilifeform: ^ thrown to mailinglist

03:26:36 mod6: is your key imported into the bot?

03:26:42 asciilifeform: wai wat

03:26:48 asciilifeform: i was supposed to -do- something ?

03:26:52 asciilifeform: beyond being in l1 ?

03:28:03 mircea_popescu: ah yes.

03:28:06 mircea_popescu: gotta import your key.

03:28:12 asciilifeform: syntax?

03:28:20 mircea_popescu: just link it to the bot

03:29:05 mod6: iirc i had to put my pubkey in a dpaste and then do something like `deedbot-: import <dpaste-url>`

03:29:13 asciilifeform: deedbot- http://www.loper-os.org/pgp.asc

03:29:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1G3Taic )

03:29:14 deedbot-: Bad URL or network outage.

03:29:19 asciilifeform: wat.

03:29:25 mircea_popescu: hm

03:29:39 asciilifeform: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/3VDY1C1.txt

03:29:40 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1G3Tduy )

03:29:48 deedbot-: imported: 17215D118B7239507FAFED98B98228A001ABFFC7

03:29:58 asciilifeform: deedbot- http://dpaste.com/2S1W3X0.txt

03:29:59 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1G3TfT8 )

03:29:59 deedbot-: accepted: 1

03:30:02 asciilifeform: there we go.

03:30:05 asciilifeform: it wants .txt

03:30:06 mircea_popescu: oh for crying out loud. yo trinque didntcha say you got rid of the url limiting thing ?

03:30:13 mircea_popescu: o is that what it is ?

03:30:17 asciilifeform: apparently.

03:30:21 mircea_popescu: aha k

03:30:33 trinque: lol

03:30:41 mircea_popescu: someone should write this likbez at some point. yo danielpbarron !

03:30:50 mircea_popescu: did you get wiki editing rights ?

03:30:59 asciilifeform: Mem: 7748K used, 115328K free, 44K shrd, 0K buff, 2768K cached

03:31:24 asciilifeform: ^ some of the 7.7M is the kernel, but most is the ramdisk, which won't exist in the battlefield version

03:31:34 asciilifeform: thus we get almost the entire 128M to play with

03:31:44 asciilifeform: and using small machines becomes thinkable.

03:31:53 mircea_popescu: aha

03:32:13 asciilifeform: incidentally no reason not to do a rom-able x86 build at some point

03:32:28 asciilifeform: (great for eating as part of a balanced diet with linuxbios)

03:32:42 asciilifeform: (small machine, example, http://www.hootoo.com/hootoo-tripmate-nano-ht-tm02-wireless-portable-router.html )

03:32:44 assbot: Hootoo HT-TM02 Tripmate Nano ... ( http://bit.ly/1G3Twpf )

03:32:54 asciilifeform: (and see log.)

03:33:11 mircea_popescu: !s see log

03:33:12 assbot: 58 results for 'see log' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=see+log

03:33:16 mircea_popescu: notbad.

03:33:19 asciilifeform: this is almost linux as it was when it was a joy

03:33:22 asciilifeform: instead of chore

03:34:34 trinque: asciilifeform: http://dpaste.com/23BB942.txt

03:34:35 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1G3TL3B )

03:34:47 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 100 @ 0.0200566 = 2.0057 BTC [-] {6}

03:34:50 trinque: and I'm in via telnet

03:34:52 asciilifeform: (how come almost 8M? u-boot takes gzipped kernels, of course.)

03:35:17 trinque: because I'm a lazy fuck and copied the thing over that filename instead of updating uboot

03:35:19 asciilifeform: trinque: 'turdel' ? or you built with recipe

03:35:36 trinque: built with buildroot, ignore the filename

03:35:46 asciilifeform: congrats trinque !

03:35:46 trinque: I just copied it over what was already in the tftp dir

03:35:51 trinque: congrats to you!

03:35:58 trinque: I merely baked from the recipe

03:35:59 asciilifeform: now who'll be next.

03:36:24 asciilifeform: trinque: and now that you baked, read the patch. it will begin to make sense.

03:37:52 asciilifeform: just thinking,

03:38:00 asciilifeform: there was a time when folks would have -killed- for 128M.

03:38:20 asciilifeform: i remember saving to buy an 8M stick.

03:38:29 asciilifeform: for a year.

03:38:57 asciilifeform: and modern 'brogrammer' wipes his arse with it

03:39:37 decimation: asciilifeform: ok a legit build error "./scripts/Makefile.headersinst:55: *** Missing UAPI file ./include/uapi/linux/netfilter/xt_CONNMARK.h. Stop."

03:39:48 asciilifeform: nope.

03:39:48 decimation: seems like I am missing a kernel header

03:39:57 asciilifeform: or rather,

03:40:00 asciilifeform: what was building ?

03:40:20 asciilifeform: ('nope' as in, i did not patch anything remotely close to there)

03:40:31 decimation: ah, the linux 3.18.1 headers

03:40:39 decimation: yeah I'm not saying it was your fault

03:40:46 decimation: I'm running 2.6.32

03:40:46 asciilifeform: decimation: hash your manifest

03:40:52 asciilifeform: see earlier thread

03:40:57 asciilifeform: make sure it pulled down the same tarballs

03:41:02 decimation: k

03:43:12 trinque: asciilifeform: patch makes sense, and lol @ skull and crossbones around the telnet in inittab

03:43:38 asciilifeform: trinque: i like to mark code that folks can use to kill themselves, with it

03:43:40 asciilifeform: wherever i go

03:44:02 trinque: good practice

03:44:16 *: trinque wanders to hack night with pogoplug in tow

03:44:52 asciilifeform: having meatspace friends who program must be fun

03:45:09 mircea_popescu: he lives in a civilised part of teh country.

03:45:22 decimation: asciilifeform: is your manifest missing 'tar'?

03:45:32 decimation: otherwise everything appears to be there

03:45:43 asciilifeform: decimation: i think local tar ends up untarring things

03:45:50 asciilifeform: how else

03:45:55 asciilifeform: i mean, if you lacked tar,

03:45:59 asciilifeform: how would any of it untar

03:47:34 asciilifeform: ---

03:47:41 asciilifeform: and already found one small mistake

03:47:48 asciilifeform: dhcpd is built. we never use it

03:47:57 asciilifeform: (what we actually use is busybox's udhcpd)

03:48:07 asciilifeform: can be cut from the buildroot conf.

03:48:11 asciilifeform: ---

03:48:56 asciilifeform: i think i also forgot to build any mtd utils

03:48:59 decimation: I mean tar isn't on the manifest

03:49:04 asciilifeform: so can't hack uboot from inside this. yet.

03:49:11 asciilifeform: decimation: of course not. it never gets downloaded

03:49:21 asciilifeform: or, hm, does it

03:49:30 decimation: it's in /dl

03:49:31 asciilifeform: nope.

03:49:43 asciilifeform: i think we end up using busybox tar

03:49:52 asciilifeform: for the armv5 os, that is

03:49:59 asciilifeform: for the build, it uses local machine's tar.

03:50:15 asciilifeform: busybox, to those new to it, is a unix util userland in more or less 1 executable.

03:50:24 asciilifeform: (symlinked to the usual names)

03:50:40 asciilifeform: it is often found on routers, sex toys, miscellaneous embedded machinery

03:50:44 decimation: okay I think my build error is something to do with the shitty vm cross-mount filesystem and case sensitivity

03:51:05 asciilifeform: oh and another missing ingredient

03:51:09 asciilifeform: exercise for my readers!

03:51:13 asciilifeform: add an unprivileged user.

03:51:39 asciilifeform: you can do this with the file system overlay (see patch and readme) or using buildroot's spiffy user generator (can't help here, never tried)

03:51:53 asciilifeform: bitcoind probably ought to run as other than root.

03:52:05 asciilifeform: (see process separation discussion from earlier thread.)

03:54:08 decimation: 35deaa1d5bf822b74ea13928cb9621b03eafcdd5450c176928b4df72bf27ce64c0ed6c87ff46e3c2958313ffe99ff219c6458d8b82311f04fc5e85a01e3054bb dl/tar-1.28.cpio.gz

03:55:28 asciilifeform: decimation: interesting. no such thing on mine.

03:55:45 asciilifeform: decimation: are you sure you are building with the patch ?

03:56:29 decimation: yeah

03:56:33 decimation: I'll recreate

03:56:35 asciilifeform: odd then.

03:56:41 asciilifeform: someone will have to discover why.

03:58:00 decimation: ah I might have skipped the make pogoplug_defconfig setup

03:58:06 asciilifeform: aahahahaha.

03:58:34 decimation: ok I'm not building on crazy vm fs

04:01:26 decimation: apparently Arduino is self-destructing in a trademark lawsuit drama

04:01:40 asciilifeform: i can't help but think of 'aradruin' when i see it

04:01:48 asciilifeform: always.

04:02:15 asciilifeform: well, orodruin

04:02:17 asciilifeform: in the original.

04:02:47 []bot: Bet placed: 5 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 12(Y):88(N) by coin, 14(Y):86(N) by weight. Total bet: 148.6676222 BTC. Current weight: 30,959.

04:03:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63678 @ 0.00026891 = 17.1237 BTC [+]

04:04:12 decimation: hehe yeah it's kind of a dumb name

04:04:17 decimation: http://hackaday.com/2015/03/12/arduino-v-arduino-part-ii/

04:04:19 assbot: Arduino v Arduino: Part II | Hackaday ... ( http://bit.ly/1FY372i )

04:04:21 decimation: "In short, there are two companies calling themselves “Arduino” at the moment. One, Arduino LLC was founded by [Massimo Banzi], [David Cuartielles], [David Mellis], [Tom Igoe] and [Gianluca Martino] in 2009, runs the website arduino.cc, and has been directing and releasing the code that makes it all work. Most of these folks had been working together on what would become the Arduino project since as early as 2005."

04:04:30 asciilifeform: almost as good as apple v apple

04:04:30 decimation: "The other “Arduino” used to be called Smart Projects and was the manufacturing arm of the project founded and run by [Gianluca Martino]. Smart Projects changed their name to Arduino SRL in November 2014. (A “Società a responsabilità limitata” is one form of Italian limited-liability company.) They have been a major producer of Arduino boards from the very beginning and recently registered the domain arduino.org."

04:04:53 decimation: basically a group of 5 italians disagree about who should profit on the whole affair

04:05:26 decimation: the lesson perhaps being: don't use a microcontroller you can't find the vhdl for

04:09:11 decimation: http://opencores.org/project,cpu6502_true_cycle < lol can build "Apple ][+ SoC"

04:09:12 assbot: cpu6502_tc - R6502 Processor Soft Core with accurate timing :: Overview :: OpenCores ... ( http://bit.ly/1yomtpA )

04:10:25 []bot: Bet placed: 3 BTC for No on "Light Sweet Crude Oil (WTI) to drop under $35 before June " http://bitbet.us/bet/1129/ Odds: 14(Y):86(N) by coin, 15(Y):85(N) by weight. Total bet: 9.8656096 BTC. Current weight: 80,118.

04:16:42 decimation: asciilifeform: okay it it successfully built on my gcc-4.6 rhel6 box

04:16:59 decimation: I can't test it, but there were no bad-looking warnings

04:17:15 decimation: with that I must retire

04:17:18 decimation: !down decimation

04:30:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12600 @ 0.00026758 = 3.3715 BTC [-] {3}

04:59:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 101004 @ 0.00026648 = 26.9155 BTC [-]

05:08:06 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078620 << i was just reading that

05:08:06 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 04:01:26; decimation: apparently Arduino is self-destructing in a trademark lawsuit drama

05:09:57 mircea_popescu: so here's an idle thought : one could import apple into the pogo, create an autovote application for 20 dollars a device

05:10:19 mircea_popescu: drive the chinese farms out of the business of creating fake "users" and "reviews" and whatnot for the sv bezzleworld.

05:20:02 ben_vulpes: aha

05:20:08 ben_vulpes: variable width text in irc!

05:28:39 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68900 @ 0.0002617 = 18.0311 BTC [-] {2}

05:31:10 Chillum: monospaced for the win!

05:35:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 43840 @ 0.00026124 = 11.4528 BTC [-] {2}

05:52:10 ben_vulpes: for coding, sure

05:52:14 ben_vulpes: not for rapid reading.

05:52:19 ben_vulpes: muh wordshapes

05:54:40 ben_vulpes: Chillum: it bears mentioning that i use the same rendering stack for irc as i do for programming

05:57:05 mircea_popescu: i use monospace

05:59:24 Chillum: monospace for irc and programming

06:04:41 ben_vulpes: i'm experimenting.

06:04:56 ben_vulpes: stay away from me with your old-man-pinions

06:05:12 mircea_popescu: lolk

06:05:25 ben_vulpes: if they're good i'll get there on my own

06:05:32 *: ben_vulpes goes off to piss on fences

06:05:38 ben_vulpes: "is this one electrified?"

06:05:47 nubbins`: i use papyrus for programming and verdana for irc

06:05:49 nubbins`: LEL JK

06:06:08 mircea_popescu: you probably use comic with and comic sans

06:06:17 nubbins`: comic avec

06:06:26 nubbins`: get with the program

06:06:31 ben_vulpes: comic noir?

06:06:44 nubbins`: comic neue

06:07:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 114881 @ 0.00026263 = 30.1712 BTC [+] {2}

06:07:24 nubbins`: actually too hammed to type, congrats alf, your likeness will be cast in bronze some day

06:08:20 mircea_popescu: comic nude and comic black

06:08:23 mircea_popescu: like stockings.

06:08:58 mircea_popescu: "you can make even bullet out of frozen shit - but for alf likeliness must use bronze!"

06:12:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25487 @ 0.00026263 = 6.6937 BTC [+]

06:22:59 Chillum: wing dings'

06:29:32 Naphex: fluffypony: people can be total retards especially on reddit. And btcxchange.ro wasn't hacked! It was closed down by its bussiness owner like a retard.

06:29:59 Naphex: hi o/

06:39:06 ben_vulpes: hi Naphex

07:02:26 []bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "BTC price at or over $777 before Sept 21st 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/1079/ Odds: 23(Y):77(N) by coin, 30(Y):70(N) by weight. Total bet: 2.74861989 BTC. Current weight: 58,858.

07:06:05 fluffypony: Naphex: they're retarded

07:20:11 mircea_popescu: yo Naphex

07:20:16 mircea_popescu: how's the meat trade ?

07:20:42 Naphex: mircea_popescu going good. going into pre-registers while using the amount of time left to polish :D

07:21:10 mircea_popescu: i was gonna send that indian chick your way but then you weren't online

07:21:32 Naphex: no worries. had to switch servers and DC's

07:21:43 mircea_popescu: oh ?

07:22:40 Naphex: i tried out some BTC provider and they had a stupid rule of cutting the upstream when you get more then 65k packets/s

07:22:43 Naphex: lol

07:23:02 Naphex: so i just stopped the contract and moved to a normal DC

07:23:25 mircea_popescu: prolly some reseller.

07:23:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22650 @ 0.00026217 = 5.9382 BTC [-]

07:23:34 mircea_popescu: you really wanna colocate for stuff like that

07:23:52 Naphex: yeah fixed. was a failed attempt to try to get a staging env faster

07:24:20 mircea_popescu: no rush anyway. cunt's not going anywhere.

07:24:32 Naphex: mircea_popescu: http://xotika.tv

07:24:33 assbot: XOtika.TV: Bitcoin adult live streaming community. ... ( http://bit.ly/1NqfXWd )

07:24:49 Naphex: went into pre-registering and some pub. pretty good so far

07:25:03 Naphex: 100+ regs

07:25:12 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell indiancandy1 talk to naphex, he's launching a new site. http://xotika.tv

07:25:13 assbot: XOtika.TV: Bitcoin adult live streaming community. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Nqg1VR )

07:25:13 gribble: The operation succeeded.

07:25:43 Naphex: we'll also have product presentation and some other fun stuff at http://www.awsummit.com/ro/ ;p

07:25:44 assbot: AWSummit - Cel mai mare summit de videochat ... ( http://bit.ly/1Nqg7wJ )

07:26:51 mircea_popescu: uh. what's this, aro rip of aws ?!

07:27:20 mircea_popescu: oddly, no tits.

07:28:09 mircea_popescu: platinum eh ? wd.

07:28:24 Naphex: gotta hit em high :P

07:29:01 mircea_popescu: ahaha "luxuriate yourself"

07:29:02 mircea_popescu: epic.

07:40:21 Naphex: :D

07:40:43 []bot: Bet created: "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1133/

07:44:23 []bot: Bet placed: 1 BTC for Yes on "Bitcoin to drop under $150 before July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1133/ Odds: 94(Y):6(N) by coin, 94(Y):6(N) by weight. Total bet: 1.1 BTC. Current weight: 99,997.

07:44:25 []bot: Bet placed: 9 BTC for No on "BTC to top $500 before 1st May" http://bitbet.us/bet/1120/ Odds: 11(Y):89(N) by coin, 14(Y):86(N) by weight. Total bet: 157.6676222 BTC. Current weight: 30,686.

07:44:28 []bot: Bet placed: 5 BTC for No on "BTC to top $413 before Songkran" http://bitbet.us/bet/1122/ Odds: 10(Y):90(N) by coin, 13(Y):87(N) by weight. Total bet: 33.07364715 BTC. Current weight: 22,066.

07:44:30 []bot: Bet placed: 15 BTC for No on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 11(Y):89(N) by coin, 11(Y):89(N) by weight. Total bet: 128.96264834 BTC. Current weight: 78,425.

07:44:32 []bot: Bet placed: 10 BTC for No on "The Winkdex: BTC $5000 or more in 2015" http://bitbet.us/bet/1104/ Odds: 9(Y):91(N) by coin, 9(Y):91(N) by weight. Total bet: 113.1868 BTC. Current weight: 77,122.

07:49:51 mircea_popescu: !up rotarydialer

08:38:46 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112958 @ 0.00026535 = 29.9734 BTC [+] {2}

08:39:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18342 @ 0.00027119 = 4.9742 BTC [+]

09:31:38 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [CFIG] 387 @ 0.02 = 7.74 BTC [-] {2}

11:05:10 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 68408 @ 0.00026949 = 18.4353 BTC [-] {2}

11:06:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 214925 @ 0.00027336 = 58.7519 BTC [+] {2}

11:21:32 jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078206 yes, that was the joke :)

11:21:32 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 00:34:21; mod6: <+jurov> my mom was using "husqvarna" << they make my favorite chainsaws / best chainsaws imho

12:12:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39360 @ 0.00027718 = 10.9098 BTC [+] {2}

12:13:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70500 @ 0.00027755 = 19.5673 BTC [+]

12:28:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 275040 @ 0.00028098 = 77.2807 BTC [+]

12:50:54 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65200 @ 0.00026672 = 17.3901 BTC [-] {2}

13:13:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62094 @ 0.00027509 = 17.0814 BTC [+]

13:39:30 Adlai: !s ada examples

13:39:31 assbot: 1 results for 'ada examples' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=ada+examples

14:04:35 nubbins`: re: freezing buildroot config in time

14:04:37 nubbins`: "The various tarballs that are downloaded by Buildroot are all stored in BR2_DL_DIR, which by default is the dl directory. If you want to keep a complete version of Buildroot which is known to be working with the associated tarballs, you can make a copy of this directory. This will allow you to regenerate the toolchain and the target filesystem with exactly the same versions."

14:43:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 100200 @ 0.00027464 = 27.5189 BTC [-] {2}

15:11:12 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11200 @ 0.0002812 = 3.1494 BTC [+]

15:21:22 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 99750 @ 0.00027432 = 27.3634 BTC [-] {2}

15:30:31 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21400 @ 0.00027278 = 5.8375 BTC [-]

15:31:52 Chillum: Good morning

15:32:34 nubbins`: hi

15:32:48 nubbins`: although technically afternoon here

15:33:37 Chillum: well it is technically morning here

15:33:40 Chillum: too early even

15:33:49 *: Chillum goes to make coffee

15:37:23 asciilifeform: nubbins`: all stored in BR2_DL_DIR << we got this last night, yes

15:37:40 asciilifeform: nubbins`: i posted sha512's for my set, also.

15:37:46 asciilifeform: (see log)

15:39:36 nubbins`: beaut

15:39:41 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 400 @ 0.00332811 = 1.3312 BTC [-]

15:39:57 nubbins`: gonna cave and set up a gentoo install on usb stick here later today

15:40:18 asciilifeform: nubbins`: gentoo for what

15:40:30 nubbins`: macbook

15:41:07 nubbins`: bbl!

15:44:48 asciilifeform: found a few other minor omissions in the build

15:45:02 asciilifeform: vgaarb is enabled (there is no vga, naturally) - missed this in the cleanup

15:45:12 asciilifeform: also need to set mac address of the nic

15:45:38 asciilifeform: otherwise all pogos will have the same one (it is not stored in any kind of nonvolatile memory)

15:46:32 asciilifeform: i will suggest that all subsequent patches for buildroot per se, be published as diffs from the one i posted last night

15:46:50 asciilifeform: rather than a mega-turd each, if diffing from a virginal buildroot

15:48:55 asciilifeform: did we ever get anywhere in the ntp-or-not debate ?

15:48:59 asciilifeform: i did not include ntp

15:49:16 asciilifeform: but the result is that the machine time is epoch 0 on boot.

15:49:32 asciilifeform: (clock does run monotonically after boot)

15:58:59 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81850 @ 0.000262 = 21.4447 BTC [-] {3}

15:59:20 asciilifeform: http://cryptome.org/2015/03/merrill-019.pdf << interesting re: 'national security letters'

15:59:25 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1IaezFl )

15:59:56 Chillum: I don't trust pdfs, so many vulnerabilities in the past

16:00:18 Chillum: not on this computer at least ;)

16:00:39 asciilifeform: Chillum: if you own a machine used specifically for executing malware, very convenient for this purpose.

16:02:00 Chillum: I have a live cd and a laptop with no other storage I use for such things

16:02:09 Chillum: read only cd-rom!

16:02:34 Chillum: I also use open wifi near my place so I don't expose my netwrok

16:03:15 Chillum: I have seen sniffing software installed on routers before

16:03:40 Chillum: they can go from your malware friendly computer, root your router and live there between you and the internet

16:16:23 jurov: why so few nerds set up their own linux router?

16:17:23 Chillum: openwrt can be rooted too, particularly from the internal network

16:17:36 Chillum: much harder though

16:18:21 jurov: how?

16:18:42 Chillum: If I told everyone it would get patched

16:18:43 jurov: i can understnd if you have old samba open or so

16:19:07 mats: ...lol

16:19:20 Chillum: hint: look at past reoccurring vulnerabilities that have been fixed and keep coming back

16:19:41 Chillum: regression is a bitch

16:20:00 Chillum: hacking routers is good practice. They don't fight back

16:20:32 *: Chillum designs a router that fights back!

16:21:02 punkman: I looked into something that'd replace my modem/router but it seems I'll have to build a mini-itx or something

16:21:42 jurov: miniitx is dandy

16:21:45 Chillum: Routers are a sad state of affair. Something like 70% of consumer wifi routers in the wild are vulnerable to heartbleed

16:21:52 Chillum: it is the linux box that nobody upgrades!

16:22:01 mats: buy an edgerouter lite and tell your isp to send you a plain ol modem

16:22:20 Chillum: most run arch linux under the hood, often about 10 years old

16:22:46 jurov: that's why nerds should maintain them themselves, and i don't mean reflash openwrt and forget

16:22:49 mats: thats not true at all

16:23:36 Chillum: just based off what I have seen in the wild around here

16:27:10 jurov: czechs took the router problem to their own hands: https://www.turris.cz/en/

16:27:10 assbot: Home :: Project:Turris ... ( http://bit.ly/1IalIpf )

16:28:09 Chillum: I sort of want to make a portable rasp-pi that automatically roots and then secures wifi routers, as a public service

16:28:44 jurov: "secures" how?

16:28:54 Chillum: erase the eprom

16:29:02 jurov: haha

16:29:23 Chillum: gotta fail in a safe mode after all

16:31:39 jurov: will get replaces with just different turd

16:31:44 jurov: *replaced

16:32:03 Chillum: there is always another turd around the corner, it is the circle of life

16:36:11 nubbins`: <+Chillum> If I told everyone it would get patched <<< lel

16:40:32 punkman: "if you see something, say something" :P

16:41:30 Chillum: "snitches get stitches"

16:41:32 Chillum: lol

16:41:45 oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/cyrano/

16:41:46 assbot: Cyrano ... ( http://bit.ly/1IapoHE )

16:47:21 asciilifeform: <Chillum> Routers are a sad state of affair. Something like 70% of consumer wifi routers in the wild are vulnerable to heartbleed << and a fella who knows this, is still fond of ssl ? amazing

16:47:21 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

16:48:20 Chillum: let it go

16:48:28 asciilifeform: no.

16:49:24 Chillum: most protocols have had a vulnerability at some point. Heartbleed was a bug in openssl, not a bug in ssl

16:49:34 mats: lol

16:49:37 Chillum: implementation vs protocol

16:49:51 asciilifeform: Chillum: i'm not certain that any of the #b-a regulars believe it to have been a bug.

16:49:59 asciilifeform: i very much do not.

16:50:02 Chillum: okay, gub'mint backdoor then

16:50:28 Chillum: the math is solid regardless of implementation failures/sabotage

16:50:38 Chillum: until quantum computers are a thing

16:50:48 jurov: ssl spec is too complicated, hence inevitably buggy implementations

16:50:59 asciilifeform: it is rather like pointing to a grain of sand in a turd, and advocating shit as a construction material because 'that grain is solid'

16:51:01 Chillum: okay, ssl sucks

16:51:08 Chillum: sure

16:51:25 mats: !gettrust Chillum

16:51:25 assbot: Trust relationship from user mats to user Chillum: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/mats/Chillum | http://w.b-a.link/user/Chillum

16:52:08 Chillum: what about TLS?

16:52:27 Chillum: if you take out key management and such, how do you feel about the actual crypto?

16:52:56 asciilifeform: the actual crypto is buried at the far bottom of a deep, deep tank of liquid shit.

16:53:30 Chillum: a lot of routers don't even use SSL

16:53:50 asciilifeform: Chillum: if it has a www configurator of any kind, it's consumer garbage

16:54:09 asciilifeform: adult router is configured over a dedicated serial port

16:54:20 Chillum: the whole hierarchy of trust used to issue certs is of course bunk

17:03:51 chetty: <Chillum> the whole hierarchy of trust used to issue certs is of course bunk// for some reason when I read that I wondered if anyone would trust a cert issued by Obama? If not why would you accept one from any 'lesser' authority in the same chain?

17:04:04 asciilifeform: ^

17:04:30 Chillum: I generally sign my own keys based on my own master cert

17:04:58 Chillum: you don't have to put verisign at the top

17:05:34 asciilifeform: Chillum: i take it you are the only one accessing the systems in question ?

17:05:46 asciilifeform: Chillum: if so, why not stick to the considerably less dysfunctional ssh ?

17:06:33 Chillum: it would be a way to go

17:06:48 Chillum: though not with port forwarding

17:15:14 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 126250 @ 0.00025871 = 32.6621 BTC [-] {2}

17:31:30 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 73000 @ 0.00025826 = 18.853 BTC [-]

17:51:33 mircea_popescu: trinque ERROR: unknown (Most likely my bitcoind stopped working or this page is too large/complex.) < ?

17:52:24 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078726 << til jurov has a favourite... chainsaw ?!

17:52:24 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 11:21:32; jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078206 yes, that was the joke :)

17:52:28 mircea_popescu: scary shit, dude.

17:53:31 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078759 << lol, just randomize it. o... wait...

17:53:31 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 15:45:38; asciilifeform: otherwise all pogos will have the same one (it is not stored in any kind of nonvolatile memory)

17:53:32 mircea_popescu: ahaha

17:53:59 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: many folks use mac addrs in routing tables

17:54:16 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078762 << i dun recall it ever being a debate, vast consensus against it.

17:54:16 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 15:48:55; asciilifeform: did we ever get anywhere in the ntp-or-not debate ?

17:54:28 asciilifeform: incidentally, the upnp demon will need to be thrown in

17:54:29 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no i know, i was just amused at ther possible solutions :D

17:54:34 asciilifeform: at least in the civilian version

17:54:50 asciilifeform: i am very much against allowing it into bitcoind per se

17:54:55 asciilifeform: let it run as own user.

17:55:12 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078769 << check it out ? neither do we. ongoing bitchfest about "pls to convert" scattered in logs.

17:55:12 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 15:59:56; Chillum: I don't trust pdfs, so many vulnerabilities in the past

17:55:26 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform allowing who into bitcoind ?

17:55:34 asciilifeform: upnp buggerer

17:55:46 asciilifeform: you know, that one

17:55:53 asciilifeform: that opens ports on crapsumer routers

17:56:11 mircea_popescu: make a unpnp user ? sorta like apache's, "nobody" ? :D

17:56:16 asciilifeform: aha

17:56:34 mircea_popescu: i dun't see why not. "numbnuts" ?

17:57:02 asciilifeform: thing is, this is a little more complicated than appears

17:57:11 asciilifeform: because it needs to know when it must attempt upnp and when not

17:57:22 Chillum: you can open ports on a lot of routers by using ajax to make a http post that looks like IRC commands

17:57:25 Chillum: its a feature!

17:57:38 mircea_popescu: Chillum hm ?

17:57:45 asciilifeform: the traditional bitcoind (see code) asked a peer to attempt connect-back on 8333

17:58:14 Chillum: some routers automatically open a port when they see a DCC command on sent from an internal computer on an IRC port

17:58:31 asciilifeform: Chillum is speaking of a 'pheature' found on particularly imbecilic consumer routers

17:58:36 Chillum: javascript can induce a browser to send a post that tricks the router into thinking it is that

17:58:40 asciilifeform: circa '00-'05

17:58:49 mircea_popescu: Chillum ah yes, that. but this wouldn't really be a browser anyway.

17:59:27 mircea_popescu: it does speak of the ancient and great power of the irc, tho.

17:59:56 Chillum: auto port-forwarding is almost always a bad idea

18:00:02 mircea_popescu: something the imbecillians (is it ok if i refer to people born in the 80s as the imbecillians, given the poor results discussed yest ? generation y seems improper) all forgot.

18:00:30 *: asciilifeform circa '80s but does not object to this

18:00:51 mircea_popescu: lol

18:01:00 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80200 @ 0.00026049 = 20.8913 BTC [+]

18:02:52 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078784 << this is actually exactly how a living is earned in this space.

18:02:52 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 16:19:20; Chillum: hint: look at past reoccurring vulnerabilities that have been fixed and keep coming back

18:03:03 mircea_popescu: you don't have to be a genius and read machine code to find new holes. that's for alfs.

18:03:21 mircea_popescu: what you do is, you look for zombies. all it takes is a good archive of vulns and a working grep. then you take your chances.

18:03:27 mircea_popescu: it's better yield than spam, that's for sure.

18:11:21 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078811 << ahaha, duuuude...

18:11:21 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 16:41:45; oglafbot: http://oglaf.com/cyrano/

18:11:44 mircea_popescu: it occurs to me... don't these dating speshulists sound very much like the classical shaman ? "you are under a terrible dark curse kind sir" "i will fix it".

18:11:47 asciilifeform: .... aaaaand...

18:11:49 asciilifeform: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-March/000076.html

18:11:49 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ElPEkl )

18:11:56 asciilifeform: Pogotron v2.

18:11:57 mircea_popescu: if placebo works, get paid. if it doesn't... "some DARKER force than my powers..."

18:12:06 mircea_popescu: o hai pogotron!

18:12:11 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 300750 @ 0.0002724 = 81.9243 BTC [+] {6}

18:12:52 jurov: hahaha so the husqvarna joke works well

18:12:59 asciilifeform: this one isn't as neat as it sounds. i thought BR_PACKAGE_UBOOT_TOOLS will add with fw_xxxxx on the target rootfs but seems like no. these will have to be added as packages

18:13:02 jurov: even if i wrote it was *not* one

18:13:14 asciilifeform: what i wanted to do was to build something suitable for reflashing into virginal pogos for dev work

18:13:19 asciilifeform: but this is not -quite- it.

18:13:39 asciilifeform: it -does- contain nandread and nandwrite.

18:13:40 mircea_popescu: hm.

18:13:56 asciilifeform: still built as monolithic kernel with rootfs-in-ram, deliberately

18:14:10 asciilifeform: but anyone who wants to, -can- flash this into nand in place of existing kernel

18:14:11 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078817 << heartbleed was a bug in PKI. outright.

18:14:11 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 16:49:24; Chillum: most protocols have had a vulnerability at some point. Heartbleed was a bug in openssl, not a bug in ssl

18:14:12 asciilifeform: and it'll boot.

18:14:25 asciilifeform: and you can upgrade from inside it

18:14:29 mircea_popescu: the bug in pki is that any system designed or proposed by any party other than us is security poison.

18:14:36 asciilifeform: ^

18:14:46 asciilifeform: 'кто не с нами тот против нас' (TM)

18:14:51 mircea_popescu: a cognate of any claim to authority on any matter not deriving from la serenissima is both fraudulent and actionable.

18:17:11 asciilifeform: b94fb4736e0fa1394784d1139fe8262df450bb945c846e6bd1eda70d2c55679ccf8b7679e08c10d00aaf3dbebf9245875f3001654cf48ce5d1ac4e3c0cffce84 turdel_latest.gz

18:17:34 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/turdel_latest.gz

18:17:50 asciilifeform: ^ what comes out after v2 patch.

18:18:21 asciilifeform: ^ this can replace arch and debian now, which folks have been using

18:18:38 asciilifeform: if you copy the uboot tools to a writable external disk

18:18:48 asciilifeform: nand - can be operated from inside this turdel.

18:18:59 asciilifeform: can safely toss the pieces of shit with systemd, etc. now.

18:19:49 ben_vulpes: ;;ticker

18:19:50 gribble: Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 244.16, Best ask: 244.2, Bid-ask spread: 0.04000, Last trade: 244.16, 24 hour volume: 27528.99649606, 24 hour low: 238.89, 24 hour high: 254.49, 24 hour vwap: None

18:20:32 asciilifeform: incidentally, the uboot fw_xxxx tools are very simple:

18:20:43 mats: ;;market buy 15000

18:20:44 asciilifeform: the config thing lives at a certain offset (forget where) in mtd0

18:20:46 gribble: Bitfinex | A market order to buy 15000 bitcoins right now would take 4130303.4623 USD and would take the last price up to 344.9000 USD, resulting in an average price of 275.3536 USD/BTC. | Data vintage: 0.0044 seconds

18:20:46 asciilifeform: where uboot lives

18:20:56 asciilifeform: the fw_printenv thing simply dumps the text found therein

18:21:19 asciilifeform: fw_setenv reflashes those blocks to hold new text

18:21:20 mats: ;;market buy --market bitstamp 15000

18:21:21 gribble: Bitstamp | This order would exceed the size of the order book. You would buy 10726.054 bitcoins, for a total of 12929272.3986 USD and take the price to 99999.0000. | Data vintage: 0.0557 seconds

18:21:23 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078823 << there's no math behind either ssl or pki, or the usg for that matter. they are political arrangements, "sets of procedures and people" and whatnot.

18:21:23 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 16:50:28; Chillum: the math is solid regardless of implementation failures/sabotage

18:21:35 asciilifeform: ^ so in principle these can be reimplemented with the nand tools i have included.

18:21:39 mircea_popescu: they just happen to be the wrong policies by the wrong people for the wrong purposes is all.

18:21:51 mats: ;;market buy --market btcchina 15000

18:21:52 gribble: BTCChina | This order would exceed the size of the order book. You would buy 9299.7167 bitcoins, for a total of 648197043008.7280 USD and take the price to 16100000000000.0000. | Data vintage: 0.0283 seconds

18:21:56 Chillum: are you arguing with a recording of me?

18:21:57 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i think he was speaking of rsa per se

18:22:04 Chillum: lol

18:22:12 mircea_popescu: Chillum i'm just going through the logs. pretty much everyone here reads the whole shebang.

18:22:21 Chillum: okay

18:22:26 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform rsa per se is not even really involved in all this o.O

18:22:32 mircea_popescu: i thought most certs were ecdsa

18:22:35 asciilifeform: Chillum: we routinely 'argue with recordings' of one another. this is how #b-a folk handle the fact that not everyone lives at his computer

18:22:53 Chillum: fair enough

18:23:22 mircea_popescu: permanent log online + gribble ;;later tell for noobs - > wunderbar system of thought management.

18:23:43 mircea_popescu: which is what the forum oughta be.

18:23:58 *: Adlai is amazed that any channels survive with "no public logs" policies

18:24:14 Chillum: a scrap of permanence in an impermanent universe

18:24:15 mircea_popescu: have you seen the content ?

18:24:21 asciilifeform: Adlai: kindergartens and mental asylums also, afaik, don't keep logs

18:24:23 asciilifeform: yet survive.

18:24:28 mircea_popescu: exactly this.

18:24:45 mircea_popescu: i participated in a bdsm chan for a few days, it was painful.

18:25:16 Adlai: generally the participants of such institutions only attend due to coercion, whether physical or implied

18:25:28 mircea_popescu: 90% of lines were "hello x", 90% of the remainder "so how's it going". maybe 1 in 4 hello-handshakes succeeded, and less than 1 in 100 went past 2nd pass.

18:25:39 mircea_popescu: the general depth of conversation mirrored quite exactly the office.

18:25:53 mircea_popescu: Adlai stupidity is coercitive, wheter obviously so or not.

18:26:38 chetty: <mircea_popescu> 90% of lines were "hello x", 90% of the remainder "so how's it going". maybe 1 in 4 hello-handshakes succeeded, and less than 1 in 100 went past 2nd pass.//roughly matching avg. attention spans

18:26:45 mircea_popescu: quite.

18:27:00 mircea_popescu: leaving us to wonder whether the stupid tools drive the stupidity of the people, or stem from the stupidity of the people involved.

18:27:16 mircea_popescu: "is luser luser because on windoze, or is on windoze because luser ?"

18:27:18 Adlai: symbiotic convergence idiocy

18:27:32 mircea_popescu: this should be a term of art.

18:28:26 mircea_popescu: and i mean... the fact that us young adults score worse than anyone else is not a direct product. they worked to get there : the school's so dumb, why learn ; the kids aren't learning anyway why not make it dumber... 30 years later in this process the fucking mit grads can't make a flashlight

18:28:32 mircea_popescu: they ALL own fleshlights tho.

18:28:53 Adlai: Made in China™

18:29:36 mircea_popescu: well yeah. some patriarchy somewhere.

18:31:00 Adlai: s/i/oniz/

18:31:56 mircea_popescu: umm... patronizarchy ?

18:33:02 Adlai: yeh, rule by the patrons. those who can afford to patronize, as opposed to - serfs

18:33:26 mircea_popescu: if this worked teh us'd be numero uno.

18:33:35 mircea_popescu: rule by dude farmer is not functionable sadly.

18:33:51 Adlai: last i checked, farmer = serf

18:34:03 mircea_popescu: dude farmer is a term of art from back in the day the us mattered.

18:34:15 mircea_popescu: ie, rich guy back east, went west to start a farm, sucked at it.

18:36:51 nubbins`: <+asciilifeform> mircea_popescu: many folks use mac addrs in routing tables <<< this

18:36:58 Adlai: doesn't sound like a Patron of the Arts to me

18:37:33 mircea_popescu: patron-client relationship is what i tought you meant, off the ancient post-imperial and late-imperial model.

18:37:56 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: "is luser luser because on windoze, << the older version of this was, iirc, 'do styes make pigs' ?

18:38:03 mircea_popescu: but anyway, even wioth the arts, the distinction holds : the patron has no particular taste, merely money and friends.

18:38:17 nubbins`: <+Chillum> you can open ports on a lot of routers by using ajax to make a http post that looks like IRC commands <<< this is actually how you root the pogo without attaching a serial cable

18:38:21 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform but there is genetic indication of suinity.

18:41:23 asciilifeform: 30 years later in this process the fucking mit grads can't make a flashlight << aha

18:41:43 asciilifeform: !s flashlight

18:41:44 assbot: 32 results for 'flashlight' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=flashlight

18:42:09 asciilifeform: l0l where did it go

18:42:18 Chillum: nubbins`: neat, I assume you open the telnet port?

18:42:32 asciilifeform: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ve23i5K334

18:42:34 assbot: MIT genuises with lightbulb - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzOqQj )

18:42:34 asciilifeform: ^^^

18:43:04 asciilifeform: Chillum: stock pogo comes with 'dropbear', a miniature sshd

18:43:26 Chillum: so you open the port to ssh, but how do you get root?

18:43:28 mircea_popescu: it really is a great montage that, what with the bovine derping about how "we ARE" etc.

18:44:02 Chillum: same password on each one?

18:44:22 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i can think of an alternate hypothesis about the flashlight thing

18:44:42 mircea_popescu: probably a few, including videofraud . but tell ?

18:44:53 asciilifeform: 'I have had a chance to observe quite a few companies in the U.S. from the inside, and have spotted a certain constancy in the staffing profile. At the top, there is a group of highly compensated senior lunch-eaters. They tend to spend all of their time pleasing each other in various ways, big and small. They often hold advanced degrees in disciplines such as Technical Schmoozing and Relativistic Bean-counting. They are obsess

18:44:53 asciilifeform: ive on the subject of money, and cultivate a posh country set atmosphere, even if they are just one generation out of the coal mines. Ask them to solve a technical problem ? and they will politely demur, often taking the opportunity to flash their wit with a self-deprecating joke or two. ... The natives at the top always try to standardize the job descriptions and lower the pay scale of the immigrants at the bottom, playing

18:44:54 asciilifeform: them against each other, while trying to portray themselves as super-achieving entrepreneurial mavericks who can't be pinned down to a mere set of marketable skills.'

18:45:05 asciilifeform: from orlov's 'lessons' ( http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/062805_soviet_lessons_part2.shtml )

18:45:08 assbot: Post-Soviet Lessons for a Post-American Century Part II ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzOOy9 )

18:45:30 asciilifeform: it is 'declasse' to admit that you can make a flashlight, at a 'sprezzatura' wankfest

18:45:33 mircea_popescu: this works a lot better if you can actually code.

18:46:01 mircea_popescu: dude, you're telling me that first jew boy with the rolling eyes and the slow repeating the task is putting out an act ?

18:46:10 nubbins`: <+Chillum> are you arguing with a recording of me? <<< heh.

18:46:11 mircea_popescu: as in "of course i could but i wonder how this woman is trying to trick me" ?

18:46:21 asciilifeform: can't say for sure. but entirely possible

18:46:24 Chillum: nubbins`: technology!

18:46:28 mircea_popescu: if he could act that well i'd know his name.

18:46:37 nubbins`: :D

18:46:46 mircea_popescu: srsly now. this theory of yours would be perhaps appealing had i not spent any time on a set.

18:46:52 mircea_popescu: but i have, and i tell you... people who can act are RARE.

18:46:55 nubbins`: Chillum: a stock pogo will spread cheeks thusly: curl -k "https://root:ceadmin@[PogoplugIPAddress]/sqdiag/HBPlug?action=command&command=dropbear%20start";

18:47:05 nubbins`: and yes, same root pw on each one :o

18:47:07 mircea_popescu: not, "superhot blonde rare". that's 1 in 100. people who can act are in 1 in 10k

18:47:12 asciilifeform: does sprezzatura really call for top-notch general-purpose acting skill ?

18:47:14 mircea_popescu: and THEN they can only act in "certain spaces".

18:47:25 mircea_popescu: yes, to the degree it'd be depicted there, this man is an oscar winner.

18:47:32 Chillum: nubbins`: wow, what a slutty device

18:47:36 nubbins`: inorite.

18:47:37 mircea_popescu: go through webcasts to see how people deal with this normally.

18:47:55 nubbins`: there's also a built-in "request unlock from pogo" thing

18:48:00 nubbins`: think iphone unlock

18:48:04 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform notice : no snicker. for instance.

18:48:07 nubbins`: and then there's serial :D

18:48:34 asciilifeform: nubbins`: notice how nobody here bothered with the 'request unlock' thing or even knows if it ever worked

18:48:41 asciilifeform: because wtf why

18:48:48 Chillum: I think that sometimes companies intentionally make their devices rootable because they know hobbyists will buy boxes of them if they can root it

18:49:08 mircea_popescu: ^ Chillum this makes sense, and it's why this is probably happening here

18:49:12 asciilifeform: Chillum: this particular item is an oddity in this regard, because it is very clearly a loss-leader

18:49:14 nubbins`: asciilifeform i tried it with one of my pogos

18:49:24 mircea_popescu: nevertheless, ironically, this item was bought as a loss leader, and so, it would specifically NOT be wanted to be used this way.

18:49:29 asciilifeform: (priced substantially below cost, in all likelihood)

18:50:05 mircea_popescu: my explanation is that because of the standardization of everything, the makers just made them "as they're made" ie prevailing bs (business standards) and the buyers bought and marketed them "As they're marketed"

18:50:05 nubbins`: asciilifeform you log into website, "activate" pogo, then can enable ssh login via website

18:50:11 mircea_popescu: resulting in a transfer of value from the dudes to us.

18:50:17 nubbins`: it's about as gaping as it sounds

18:51:06 nubbins`: TBH i think they did include rootability as a hobbyist bonus, AND they made way, way too many

18:51:14 asciilifeform: it is interesting that the actual contents of the can has been shrinking continuously over the years

18:51:24 mircea_popescu: nubbins` we can now just capture the packets and "activate" any pogo anywhere on the basis of another pogo can't we.

18:51:25 Chillum: they should just have a physical "root access" switch on the box. Leaving backdoors for people to find is reckless

18:51:27 nubbins`: these were probably dumped to the surplus people en masse 4 years ago

18:51:29 asciilifeform: for instance, there was at one point a pogo entirely like this one but 256M.

18:51:37 asciilifeform: same cost.

18:51:54 mircea_popescu: Chillum amusingly this is what asciilifeform wanted to do.

18:52:03 asciilifeform: and, the successor to this (out of print) machine is quite similar but no sata.

18:52:24 nubbins`: maybe just no sata connector 8)

18:52:32 mircea_popescu: lol

18:52:32 asciilifeform: nubbins`: that one is gone too

18:52:37 asciilifeform: nubbins`: speaking of 'pink pogo' here

18:52:37 nubbins`: ah

18:53:04 *: nubbins` owns a synth that has MIDI in/out capabilities baked into cpu, but mfg didn't waste the extra $2 on MIDI ports

18:53:04 asciilifeform: this is rather reminiscent of how the famous linksys wrt54g hyper-bestseller slowly shrank and shrank, from 16 and then 8 and then 4 (even 2!) MB of ram, linux could no longer be used on it

18:53:09 asciilifeform: and the product faded away

18:53:19 mircea_popescu: i had one of those

18:53:27 asciilifeform: -everyone- has one of those

18:53:28 nubbins`: open the thing up, wire up a couple resistors and DIN5 jacks, and you've got a full-featured midi voice

18:53:29 asciilifeform: in a cellar somewhere

18:53:42 mircea_popescu: sysadmin at the time was "you don't buy "a router". write this down : linksys wrt54g"

18:53:59 asciilifeform: they actually re-issued it a few yrs back

18:54:06 asciilifeform: as a commemorative edition, somethinglikethat

18:54:06 mircea_popescu: this was long long ago

18:54:08 nubbins`: http://midiot.net/mods.JPG

18:54:10 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzPRyc )

18:54:27 nubbins`: ^ a monotribe taking advantage of several interesting patch points

18:55:16 asciilifeform: when i ran across the 2MB linksys, my thought was 'linux is obese if can't fit in 2MB'

18:55:24 asciilifeform: not 'damned linksys cheated us'

18:55:28 nubbins`: https://synablogi.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/monotribe_hacking_6.jpg

18:55:30 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzQ3xl )

18:55:36 nubbins`: ^ look how clearly they marked the pads

18:55:43 nubbins`: modder's dream

19:01:28 mircea_popescu: btw, speaking of guilds : they actually survive to an amazing extent. outfitters in canada for a very good example.

19:01:28 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

19:02:27 nubbins`: here's a hot mess i made from a pocket-size synth, alongside original unit for reference

19:02:28 nubbins`: http://imgur.com/raHz5bm

19:02:29 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzR1d3 )

19:02:36 mircea_popescu: http://log1.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2015#1078838 << amusingly enough, i would.

19:02:36 assbot: Logged on 29-03-2015 17:03:51; chetty: <Chillum> the whole hierarchy of trust used to issue certs is of course bunk// for some reason when I read that I wondered if anyone would trust a cert issued by Obama? If not why would you accept one from any 'lesser' authority in the same chain?

19:02:46 mircea_popescu: which is why the original "get in the wot" discussion with the sec.

19:03:21 mircea_popescu: nubbins` going for that entire asic miner look ?

19:03:33 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: you'd probably end up rating him '-11111 does not have sole control of private key'

19:03:44 mircea_popescu: end up, yes.

19:03:48 mircea_popescu: not likely start up tho.

19:03:56 mircea_popescu: rule of law is a process after all.

19:05:10 nubbins`: mircea_popescu HEH. the first and last time i used test-lead wires for a permanent project.

19:05:12 nubbins`: dat torque

19:05:37 nubbins`: http://imgur.com/I6ZwIV4 << all closed up

19:05:38 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzRBaP )

19:06:01 nubbins`: butchered the poor enclosure, but hey.

19:06:17 nubbins`: call it a v0.1

19:06:25 *: asciilifeform off to meatspace for a spell. wants to hear if anyone tests v2 patch.

19:07:11 nubbins`: http://www.korg-datastorage.jp/Manual/monotron_sch.pdf

19:07:51 nubbins`: THIS is how you make electronic music :o

19:10:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60840 @ 0.0002763 = 16.8101 BTC [+]

19:11:31 nubbins`: can't test patch just yet but new turdel_latest boots a-ok here

19:11:34 nubbins`: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=9brn8y5w

19:11:35 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1CzSNLo )

19:34:14 mod6: is mpexbot still a thing?

19:35:38 mircea_popescu: seems not. fabian's not been answering anything for a while.

19:35:43 mod6: oh its empyex now

19:36:06 mod6: ah, ok.

19:52:50 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67800 @ 0.00025809 = 17.4985 BTC [-] {3}

20:11:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 62200 @ 0.00026179 = 16.2833 BTC [+] {2}

20:18:09 mircea_popescu: incidentally asciilifeform, what would you say is the difference between orlov as quoted and the fiction of the "imperialist burgeois" as classically described (1890s, even) ?

20:18:36 mircea_popescu: are we just replaying the october revolution over here, that's the vision ?

20:19:48 mircea_popescu: amusingly enough, https://defendtrotskyism.wordpress.com/defend-assange-against-imperialist-bourgeois-assault-but-continue-fight-against-sexism/

20:19:49 assbot: Defend Assange against Imperialist Bourgeois assault but continue fight against Sexism! | defendtrotskyism ... ( http://bit.ly/1BIxT90 )

20:21:15 mircea_popescu: ie, every false prophet to date is looking upon the same sky, and will readily interpret whatever happens there in whatever terms they figure would make them look least like an idiot.

20:52:19 jurov: wtf "The following USE changes are necessary to proceed:"

20:52:33 jurov: and 1000 lines adding abi_x86_32 to everything

20:53:57 jurov: wow gentoo. such joy.

21:10:07 trinque: +mircea_popescu | trinque ERROR: unknown (Most likely my bitcoind stopped working or this page is too large/complex.) < ? < what did that come from?

21:11:17 mircea_popescu: https://blockexplorer.com/address/1gtQEh8TVk6Pie2Ba6yYoSokaUvDdKpLT

21:11:19 assbot: blockexplorer.com | 521: Web server is down ... ( http://bit.ly/1D948m1 )

21:12:26 trinque: mircea_popescu: ah that's not my site; have a blockchain viewer site that you like?

21:12:31 mircea_popescu: http://dpaste.com/0JE6B89 <

21:12:32 assbot: dpaste: 0JE6B89 ... ( http://bit.ly/1D94rxi )

21:12:38 mircea_popescu: ugh

21:12:48 mircea_popescu: shit. i was just trying to look at a bundle

21:13:30 mircea_popescu: who is blockexplorer.com anyway, your thing ?

21:14:10 trinque: https://blockchain.info/address/1gtQEh8TVk6Pie2Ba6yYoSokaUvDdKpLT << it went out

21:14:12 assbot: Bitcoin Address 1gtQEh8TVk6Pie2Ba6yYoSokaUvDdKpLT ... ( http://bit.ly/1D94Uj9 )

21:14:25 trinque: mircea_popescu: nah, block explorer is not miine

21:17:07 mircea_popescu: then don't link it

21:17:10 mircea_popescu: for this exact reason.

21:17:18 mircea_popescu: people wanna explore an address or block, let them do it themselves.

21:17:33 trinque: fine by me

21:19:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24874 @ 0.00025784 = 6.4135 BTC [-]

21:22:08 thestringpuller: blockexplorer is Thermos's thing

21:22:19 thestringpuller: unless he sold it recently

21:23:02 jurov: iirc bitstamp bought it?

21:23:34 jurov: nah that was blockr

21:24:35 jurov: http://atc.blockr.io/ lmao still going?

21:24:36 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1IbyFPH )

21:31:35 thestringpuller: LOL

21:45:54 ben_vulpes: afternoon, funkenstein_

21:47:05 funkenstein_: howdy ben_vulpes

21:49:11 funkenstein_: speaking of block explorers, here's an interesting one showing some exploit or another http://blockexperts.com/ilt/height/50894

21:49:13 assbot: Intellect Block #50894 ... ( http://bit.ly/1IbEHQb )

21:56:16 funkenstein_: what is this ATC stuff

21:56:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26126 @ 0.00025856 = 6.7551 BTC [+]

21:59:08 jurov: !s therealaltcoin

21:59:09 assbot: 21 results for 'therealaltcoin' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=therealaltcoin

22:01:12 jurov: was fun till it lasted

22:02:35 nubbins`: heh

22:02:41 Adlai: jurov: doesn't blockr belong to d.cbse?

22:03:17 jurov: d.bstp, d.cbse, i dont see any difference

22:04:03 Adlai: well one of them at least invented its own name

22:04:31 Adlai: coinbase, blockchain, next up they'll just use magic numbers. oh wait

22:06:02 *: jurov 's looking forward to exchange named "turdatron" or "orphanburner"

22:06:41 mircea_popescu: funkenstein_ was the alt coin for a while.

22:08:04 Adlai: what's up with logs, have we built the moon cabin yet?

22:09:02 mircea_popescu: hm ?

22:11:33 Adlai: logs as in arithmic distribution curve

22:11:39 Adlai: !s logs

22:11:40 assbot: 1501 results for 'logs' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=logs

22:11:46 Adlai: hmm i guess this word is overloaded now

22:11:51 funkenstein_: Adlai, nice log cabin on moon

22:12:03 Adlai: :D

22:12:28 funkenstein_: you like harmonic series?

22:12:57 Adlai: !s from:adlai music

22:12:58 assbot: 5 results for 'from:adlai music' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=from%3Aadlai+music

22:14:15 funkenstein_: speaking of music i was thinking of writing an encoding embedding a bitcoin address in audio

22:15:10 *: Adlai was thinking of learning to do EC math in his head, which at least has practical use

22:15:29 funkenstein_: you would definitely win

22:15:37 Adlai: well, it's useless without mental hashing, but together they are unstoppable

22:16:01 Adlai: the first step is obviously relearning all of mathematics in tonal

22:16:17 funkenstein_: why no paper?

22:17:06 Adlai: speciesism, i don't trust cells that have fewer than nine nines of dna in common with me

22:17:54 funkenstein_: even if they are in WOT?

22:18:32 Adlai: all music is folk music, i ain't never seen a horse in the wot

22:19:50 funkenstein_: if your recorded music is playing, my phone will be like "shall we send a millie to Adlai?"

22:20:15 Adlai: ahhh so you're talking about watermarking an address into audio

22:20:24 funkenstein_: yeah

22:20:35 Adlai: tbh it's probably easier to have an artist address registry, and lookup the artist using some shazaam-ish thingy

22:20:43 Adlai: if we're talking about practical ideas :P

22:21:03 jurov: Adlai: how does tonal slleviate the need to do hundreds of thousands of steps computing EC sigs?

22:21:09 jurov: *alleviate

22:21:30 Adlai: jurov: makes it easier to deal with bit/byte-based operations

22:21:42 Adlai: doesn't reduce the total number, but fuck using decimal for sha256

22:22:06 funkenstein_: use hex like what's his name did one round on paper

22:22:11 punkman: http://m.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11424037

22:22:13 assbot: A court case so secret, US Govt says it can't go on ... ( http://bit.ly/1He3xib )

22:22:35 nubbins`: sooo, just went to corner store.

22:22:36 nubbins`: http://imgur.com/tkqh4qn

22:22:36 assbot: Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1He3yTm )

22:22:37 nubbins`: o.O

22:23:30 jurov: care to explain to nonmuricans?

22:23:39 mats: ketchup chips are amazing

22:23:39 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

22:24:01 nubbins`: jurov i'm canadian fwiw

22:24:11 nubbins`: ketchup flavored potato chips are popular here

22:24:32 nubbins`: and apparently now doritos (traditionally cheesy flavored corn chips) has ketchup flavor

22:24:42 nubbins`: they taste very strange, ketchup-flavored corn chips.

22:24:51 jurov: jurov i'm canadian << ha i was waiting for this

22:24:56 nubbins`: 8)

22:25:29 Adlai: does your routine

22:25:33 Adlai: involve some poutine?

22:25:47 jurov: eh?

22:25:47 Adlai: do you set the table

22:25:52 Adlai: with syrup of maple?

22:25:56 jurov: ehh?

22:26:09 *: Adlai imitates dr seuss re: land of the moose

22:28:16 nubbins`: there's a couple living on the other side of the harbour that owns goats and taps maple trees

22:28:20 nubbins`: i'm not a huge fan of maple

22:30:05 jurov: and i don't get why flavored doritos are O.o ... at first glance i was thinking it has something with blood

22:30:22 jurov: now *that* would be something... blood-flavored

22:30:32 nubbins`: heh

22:30:54 nubbins`: jurov this is like coming across mustard-flavored jellybeans

22:35:40 jurov: http://aeon.co/magazine/society/what-roman-slave-owners-knew-about-managing-staff/

22:35:41 assbot: Management theories from Roman slave-owners – Jerry Toner – Aeon ... ( http://bit.ly/1He56g3 )

22:35:46 jurov: "Buying any old slave risked contaminating the morale of the whole household."

22:45:57 mircea_popescu: punkman ozzie govt only needs courts if it needs them.

22:49:26 mircea_popescu: http://m.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11424037 << tellingly, this is not the front page of the nyt, wapo adn every single other usg propaganda leaflet.

22:49:26 assbot: A court case so secret, US Govt says it can't go on ... ( http://bit.ly/1G6leSg )

22:52:00 mircea_popescu: jurov that piece is, roughly speaking, the result of a cat reading a mayan calendar and inputting the result into google translate.

22:53:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39200 @ 0.00025784 = 10.1073 BTC [-]

22:57:52 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34950 @ 0.00025782 = 9.0108 BTC [-] {2}

23:23:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42150 @ 0.00025771 = 10.8625 BTC [-]

23:25:19 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46873 @ 0.00025751 = 12.0703 BTC [-]