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Transcript for 29-04-2015, 1577 lines:

00:00:32 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1114418 << sorry bout that. was trying to improve things. went about as well as you'd expect.

00:00:32 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 21:09:48; cazalla: qntra/fraudsters down here so can't update :\

00:03:24 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1114480 << recommending shit to me is not necessarily -ev, especially if it works. i have an elephantine memory.

00:03:24 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 21:38:56; mike_c: nginx always works. I have never been disappointed in it. Recommending shit to people is always a -EV process, but..

00:04:04 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1114626 << the thing yarvin was building leaky submarines out of

00:04:04 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 22:12:44; trinque: I have to run, dunno what hoon is but I'll see if I can find info on it

00:12:13 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> i am still awaiting your gentoo canonical << not even objecting to the linux flavour of that box, but to the cpanel idiocy

00:12:22 asciilifeform: it poisons every single config on the box, and assumes php

00:12:29 mircea_popescu: but the python stuff you ran into is pure linux,

00:12:33 mircea_popescu: the misplaced apache is pure linux

00:12:34 mircea_popescu: etc.

00:12:52 asciilifeform: the requiring apache (and not just any, but cpanel's custom) is cpanelism

00:13:12 mircea_popescu: except it doesn't require apache to run a script

00:13:23 mircea_popescu: you can just have your python run off cron, and dump stuff into mysql

00:13:27 mircea_popescu: then fish it out for web display

00:13:35 asciilifeform: mno. need to serve some static pgs

00:13:44 mircea_popescu: so create them as files

00:13:46 asciilifeform: it has to be nginx or a (human) apache

00:13:50 mircea_popescu: apache will serve them if in the right directories

00:15:25 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> you can just have your python run off cron << how both will restart synchronized ?

00:15:34 asciilifeform: this is ludicrous

00:15:34 mircea_popescu: wut ?

00:15:48 asciilifeform: i want the two to restart together

00:15:51 asciilifeform: and i want -one- log

00:15:53 mircea_popescu: the wto who

00:16:03 asciilifeform: static and dynamic content servers

00:16:20 asciilifeform: normally this is achieved by having apache (or nginx) pass through to, e.g., python

00:16:56 mircea_popescu: you want a python script to be executed on page load ?

00:17:03 asciilifeform: it isn't a script

00:17:19 asciilifeform: it's a continuous process

00:17:23 asciilifeform: that serves up http

00:17:35 asciilifeform: read the src if interested (under the user i created)

00:17:40 asciilifeform: simplest possible thing

00:17:42 mircea_popescu: so you have your own web server written in python ?

00:17:47 asciilifeform: not own, l0l

00:17:53 mircea_popescu: move cpanel's apache to a diff port, and allocate 80 to yours.

00:18:00 asciilifeform: the whole thing was written in about a day, if you recall, in a mighty hurry

00:18:12 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: again i don't want python serving up statics

00:18:18 asciilifeform: because it is ludicrous

00:18:48 mircea_popescu: then have python drop the statics in /home/whatever and apache will automagically serve them ?

00:20:05 asciilifeform: would like to run the fucking app without changes

00:20:09 asciilifeform: like normal people.

00:20:13 asciilifeform: on normal computer.

00:20:41 mircea_popescu: cpanel has nothing to do with this.

00:21:04 asciilifeform: normal people can get mod_wsgi if they want it.

00:21:06 asciilifeform: cpanel - no.

00:21:28 asciilifeform: normal people can get -pure- nginx

00:21:31 asciilifeform: cpanel - again, no

00:21:46 mircea_popescu: <mircea_popescu> move cpanel's apache to a diff port, and allocate 80 to yours. <

00:22:20 asciilifeform: and apache still runs, eats cycles for fuck knows what

00:22:32 mircea_popescu: and if python.h fails, you prolly don't have th epaths set up right, it'll fai lthe same with or without some derpy package manager.

00:22:46 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well actually it wouldn't run, especially if you kill that port in firewall.

00:22:57 mircea_popescu: but you can stop the service in any case.

00:23:12 asciilifeform: still end up with cpanelism autogenned crapolade in every single fucking thing in /etc

00:23:28 asciilifeform: hence the traditional 'cpanel is not removable' dictum

00:24:03 *: mircea_popescu shrugs

00:24:14 mircea_popescu: linux doesn't work. any of it. picking some random idiocy to make an example of is futile.

00:24:24 mircea_popescu: gentoo is a piece of shit. debian is a piece of shit. centos is a piece of shit.

00:24:33 mircea_popescu: apache is a piece of shiot. so is nginx. so is everytrhiong else.

00:24:34 *: asciilifeform genuinely wonders if mircea_popescu ever runs any www gadget that isn't a php bloggatron

00:24:40 mircea_popescu: nothing works, everything';s made by idiots.

00:25:18 mircea_popescu: nope. why would i even bother with www except for a blog

00:25:25 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu is almost but not entirely right. we are, for instance, presently speaking through an ancient atlantian tech that sorta works.

00:25:42 mircea_popescu: oh get the fuck out. ircd ? THIS works ?

00:25:48 asciilifeform: i said 'sorta worx'

00:25:54 mircea_popescu: SO DOES EVERYTHING ELSE!!!!

00:25:57 asciilifeform: l0l

00:26:00 mircea_popescu: foss, the wonderful world of 90%

00:26:05 mircea_popescu: "we almost did a job!!1"

00:26:35 mircea_popescu: this, btw, is my constraint. fuck "fits in head", i dun care.

00:26:42 mircea_popescu: DO.THEWHOLE.JOB.

00:26:59 asciilifeform: 'fits in head' is how you actually -know- that x 'did whole job'

00:27:04 asciilifeform: anything else - is conjecture.

00:27:11 mircea_popescu: indeed.

00:27:17 asciilifeform: it is also how you know that x did -nothing but- whole job.

00:27:51 asciilifeform: so 'fits in head' is 'part of a balanced diet' with 'does whole job' (otherwise brick 'fits in head')

00:27:58 mircea_popescu: aham.

00:28:13 mircea_popescu: kinda why i'm discovering all i really like off unix these days is like... curl. grep.

00:28:24 asciilifeform: eh the only good part of unix is |

00:28:31 mircea_popescu: somethinglikethat.

00:28:33 mircea_popescu: and tee.

00:28:44 asciilifeform: and good old tr

00:33:41 mircea_popescu: !up Cromag1

00:33:50 Cromag1: HI!

00:33:57 asciilifeform: meow mix?

00:34:02 Cromag1: YES!

00:34:05 Cromag1: down me!

00:34:13 asciilifeform: !down Cromag1

00:34:18 trinque: asciilifeform's shit detector is impeccable

00:34:19 asciilifeform: yw Cromag1

00:34:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12950 @ 0.00029075 = 3.7652 BTC [-] {2}

00:36:37 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform from the certain corners of the internet department http://www.rooshv.com/how-i-was-backstabbed-by-dr-oz-and-his-female-producers

00:36:39 assbot: How I Was Backstabbed By Dr. Oz And His Female Producers ... ( http://bit.ly/1J7nqbN )

00:37:43 mircea_popescu: is this pickup artist drama ?

00:38:11 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: where does cpanel keep apache's vhost configs, and why is this not documented anywhere ?

00:38:22 asciilifeform: i've tried three claimed locations so far and none work

00:38:31 mircea_popescu: i have nfi

00:38:38 trinque: asciilifeform: there's a question here related to my make the thing a database rant

00:38:51 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: fatshaming drama

00:38:57 Adlai: vhost-: help out the poor asciilifeform

00:39:03 mircea_popescu: o, it's okay to be fat now ?

00:39:23 trinque: asciilifeform: I think I read on your blog something about how source code should be stored as ASTs not text?

00:39:27 trinque: something along those lines

00:39:30 Adlai: fat is the new phat

00:39:34 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: According to Dr. Oz and Gawker media

00:39:57 trinque: imo if the state of the system is represented as structured data a lot of these "munge the config more easily" programs go away

00:40:05 Adlai: trinque: what, you want a table with two columns, CAR and CDR?

00:40:05 mircea_popescu: delusion is always sweet

00:40:08 mircea_popescu: and sweets fatten.

00:40:27 trinque: Adlai: cddditout

00:40:40 Adlai: no u

00:43:31 trinque: Adlai: dear god my sides when http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_car_c.htm

00:43:32 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1OBBEse )

00:43:42 trinque: let it never be said that cl does not go to 11

00:43:48 jurov: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1114937 this is SOP except in chumpatron where mircea lives.

00:43:48 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 00:17:42; mircea_popescu: so you have your own web server written in python ?

00:43:55 danielpbarron: BingoBoingo, that guy is a wimp. that kinda situation doesn't have to end so poorly https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0xoKiH8JJM

00:43:56 assbot: MEN ARE BETTER THAN WOMEN - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1OBBJfj )

00:44:37 Adlai: trinque: arguably, it doesn't: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_firstc.htm

00:44:38 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1OBBQrx )

00:44:50 trinque: hawhawhaw

00:45:43 BingoBoingo: danielpbarron: I'm just astounded at how he suggests he anticipated his appearance on the show could be anything other than a trap and how he failed to prepare accordingly

00:47:22 danielpbarron: yeah i'm waiting for the end of the article where he admits to satire

00:50:41 pete_dushenski: "Orioles will play Wednesday's game vs White Sox with NO audience in the stands." << heh. one for BingoBoingo.

00:51:33 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: At least Ferguson is decently removed from the St Louis city center

00:52:38 pete_dushenski: eh. st louis could use a kick in the pants from what i hear.

00:55:44 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: In which manner?

00:56:02 asciilifeform: how the everliving fuck is cpanel used with anything other than php/static wwwtron

01:02:56 mircea_popescu: jurov what is ?

01:03:36 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo mainly in terms of st louis being known for murders and crimes, and that a proper boiling over of the tensions between police and citizens could bring about positive resolution, whoever 'wins'

01:04:23 mircea_popescu: lol @the prostitution=alimony thing.

01:05:53 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Eh, There's a balance.

01:07:21 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo a balance between what ?

01:07:35 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: I think some hmility was imposed when some of the black kids got too amped up on "kill whitey" and started going after Bosnians. Seems they learned better than to do that within a month or so.

01:07:40 mircea_popescu: "Instantly, I knew I was walking into a trap. I looked around, half hoping for a hug or some assurance that everything was going to be okay"

01:07:42 mircea_popescu: lol this derp

01:07:52 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: crime/not crime in stl

01:08:01 asciilifeform: i can't even config a fucking apache vhost on this thing.

01:08:06 asciilifeform: and apparently neither can anyone else

01:08:18 mircea_popescu: ahhh

01:08:46 mircea_popescu: so basically... cpanel is super-security. even if malware expert gets root... what good is it ? :D

01:09:10 asciilifeform: can't go far with exploded head.

01:09:23 mircea_popescu: "I tried to take the conversation out of feelings and into logic by claiming that" << roosh is a fucktard srsly.

01:09:43 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo bosnians being yugoslavia vets or... ?

01:09:43 asciilifeform: 'proceeding from informal to formal by formal means' (TM)

01:10:12 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo and where's ferguson at these days ? i haven't heard much out of there recently.

01:10:41 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Largely refugees came over in the 1990's colonized south city. The generation of Bosnians being targeted were largely the kids... The older ones seemed very unhappy about that...

01:10:42 pete_dushenski: in terms of street violence, dead cops, local politics.

01:11:00 BingoBoingo: Ferguson's been mostly tamed by Sharptoon and other FBI folk

01:11:35 pete_dushenski: ah ok

01:12:24 BingoBoingo: Back to just the normal shootings, police retreated, longtime businesses closing up and leaving

01:12:44 pete_dushenski: hm rough.

01:12:45 mircea_popescu: they're moving online ?

01:13:20 pete_dushenski: cities like ferguson would be best served by a fleet of amazon delivery drones.

01:13:44 pete_dushenski: dropping packages ordered online and heading back to homebase in the country far, far away

01:13:51 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i wasted many hours and actually moved phuctor to that thing, and it runs. just can't be reached from anywhere outside of box per se, aha.

01:14:26 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform well, is it at least crunching the numbers ?

01:14:34 asciilifeform: would, if there were any

01:14:47 mircea_popescu: i thought we had a million key db at some point ?

01:14:52 asciilifeform: aha

01:15:04 mircea_popescu: what, your scp's broken ?

01:15:05 asciilifeform: i'm not dealing with syncing keys from the old install back into this one

01:15:15 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Mostly moving to retirement

01:15:18 asciilifeform: (which is what i'd have to do if they were to be used simultaneously)

01:15:33 mircea_popescu: so then what does this do ?

01:15:43 asciilifeform: sit there sadly (tm)

01:15:58 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: I think you underestimate the potential drone casualties

01:15:59 asciilifeform: because box lacks normal apache

01:16:18 mircea_popescu: aha. well ok. did you break it in the process ?

01:16:27 asciilifeform: break in what sense

01:16:41 mircea_popescu: in the sense that is it still usable as a cpanel box or will i have to have it reflushed.

01:16:46 asciilifeform: can be used

01:16:48 asciilifeform: login - same

01:16:49 mircea_popescu: aite

01:17:09 *: BingoBoingo starting to believe that Stan's gentoo build is so far from normal "linux" might as well be called Stannix nao

01:17:20 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it is perfectly normal

01:17:21 mircea_popescu: a further three day experiment in the "linux is worthless and broadly unusable" meme. i guess it needed more documentation.

01:17:23 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo not in the slightest. just that drones are cheaper than people. certainly with the us legal system such as it is. see mp's piece on 'how to go out in a blaze of glory'

01:17:56 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Normal in terms of distance from your box to median boxen

01:18:07 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: again, entirely normal

01:18:21 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: phuctor, for instance, presently runs on 'the world's worst hoster', aws

01:18:27 asciilifeform: and did not require any wizardry there

01:18:48 BingoBoingo: When did AWS overtake Godaddy.com for that honor?

01:19:13 asciilifeform: when opened doors ?

01:19:21 asciilifeform: (charges by cpu cycle)

01:19:27 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform apparently not the worst.

01:19:48 mircea_popescu: the only worse alternative to the worlds 2nd most common hoster seems to be... the world's MOST common.

01:19:50 mircea_popescu: ya know ?

01:21:34 decimation: aws does seem to have some degree of ddos protection

01:22:23 williamdunne: Heh? AWS worse than GoDaddy?

01:22:40 mircea_popescu: well, alf worse. "whatever i'm using currently"

01:23:01 trinque: re: the power of unix this was fun -> http://dpaste.com/1J9M2Y0.txt

01:23:02 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HPsiUa )

01:23:42 trinque: probably done like shit; was written on the can after all

01:23:54 decimation: asciilifeform: have you ever actually tried to grok ipsec? it's a nightmare

01:24:06 asciilifeform: decimation: no and can't see why i'd ever even want to

01:24:41 decimation: ipsec is worse than you think

01:24:52 decimation: yet somehow it's the defacto standard for 'vpn'

01:25:00 asciilifeform: 'somehow'

01:25:03 BingoBoingo: Godaddy shoves its own Cpanel in everything

01:26:10 pete_dushenski: alrighty, time for some exercise. later gents!

01:43:00 mike_c: mircea_popescu: you're not crazy. sorting the timestamps works in chrome, not in FF. I'll investigate.

01:43:11 mircea_popescu: weird shit huh.

01:43:14 mike_c: yes..

01:43:33 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22200 @ 0.00028737 = 6.3796 BTC [-] {2}

01:43:47 mircea_popescu: i'm bracing myself for the one day when we discover unequal fives somewhere on the internet.

01:43:59 mircea_popescu: only thing that's missing out of today.

01:45:25 trinque: sounds like javascript math

01:45:46 mircea_popescu: yeah, thinking about it hey mike_c maybe cheaper than investigating is altering the date format to numeric ?

01:46:04 BingoBoingo: Nah, what's missing is me cataloguing all of the plants growning in the front flowerbeds, looking them up, and discovering the bulk of them are cardiotoxic.

01:46:11 mike_c: yes, it would be, but then don't I get into arguments with the europeans?

01:46:22 mircea_popescu: shit.

01:55:45 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8188 @ 0.00030438 = 2.4923 BTC [+] {2}

01:58:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49850 @ 0.0003081 = 15.3588 BTC [+] {3}

02:12:15 mircea_popescu: if anyone's (for purely academic reasons) interested in this shitshow : http://sourceforge.net/p/mod-security/mailman/message/30809326/

02:12:16 assbot: ModSecurity / Mailing Lists ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbyGUe )

02:12:47 mircea_popescu: modsecurity ITSELF is buggy when interacting with mod_remoteip. the devs understand the problem about as well as you'd expect of the php folk.

02:12:57 mircea_popescu: meanwhile, http://osdir.com/ml/dev-httpd/2013-12/msg00139.html

02:12:58 assbot: dev-httpd - Re: Some redundant code and comment typos in mod_remoteip - msg#00139 - Recent Discussion OSDir.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbyMem )

02:13:03 mircea_popescu: ie, mod_remoteip was written by chickens.

02:13:45 *: asciilifeform prescribes a dose of 'computer defender' ( http://www.loper-os.org/wp-content/compdef.png )

02:13:47 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbySCZ )

02:14:01 mike_c: mircea_popescu: try now - http://www.btcalpha.com/wot/user/davout/

02:14:02 assbot: davout WoT Overview - Btc Alpha ... ( http://bit.ly/1QEaYp8 )

02:15:04 mircea_popescu: much better.

02:15:16 mircea_popescu: what was it ?

02:15:18 mike_c: k. i also fixed the big wot graph cutting off some names on the sides

02:15:55 mike_c: changing the date format helped. went from AP style "Dec. 12, 2012", "April 12, 2012" to more simple short format "Dec 12, 2012", "Apr 12, 2012"

02:16:07 mike_c: JS date parser was choking on former

02:19:54 asciilifeform: 'What's a manager to do with a heap of stuff that isn't managed and doesn't wish to be?' 'Burn it ?' (from mircea_popescu's site) << pure gold

02:21:02 decimation: http://www.arnoldkling.com/blog/hayek-and-business-management/

02:21:04 assbot: Hayek and Business Management | askblog ... ( http://bit.ly/1bc93qW )

02:22:04 decimation: "Of course, large corporations do exist. That is because as clumsy as they are, they can still be less clumsy than the alternative, which is to break a corporation into a network of contractually related divisions. "

02:23:47 BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> 'What's a manager to do with a heap of stuff that isn't managed and doesn't wish to be?' 'Burn it ?' (from mircea_popescu's site) << pure gold << This is how I've been getting exercise these past couple weeks. Shovel and glyphosate + troclopyr... Actual fire comes later

02:32:04 mircea_popescu: mike_c sounds like secret overflow eh.

02:32:07 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform story of my lyf.

02:32:54 mircea_popescu: decimation that is not why large corporations exist. large corporations exist because it is cheaper for the socialist state to interact with larger items than with smaller items.

02:33:05 BingoBoingo: "burndown" is the only solution to certain problems in horticulture

02:33:08 decimation: he does hypothesize that later

02:33:28 mircea_popescu: that's why 100 employers of 10 employees each need a pile of paperwork from city hall, whereas one employer of 1000 employees gets free money from city hall

02:33:31 decimation: "I do think that government often tilts the scale in favor of large organizations. The high fixed cost of regulatory compliance is one factor. Government has been a key customer in industries like aerospace, information technology, and finance, and the fixed costs of selling to government are very high, because of all of the hoops that you have to jump through."

02:33:48 mircea_popescu: hoops my foot.

02:34:13 mircea_popescu: blackwater "sold to the goverment" by jumpiong through the following hoops : "if you send anyone to investigate us, we'll just kill them"

02:34:22 mircea_popescu: haliburton didn't even bother, just "lost" a trillion.

02:34:36 decimation: yeah, good point, this

02:35:03 mircea_popescu: if you were going to be raped,

02:35:13 decimation: the corruption in selling physical goods to usg is nowhere near the size of the corruption of 'selling services'

02:35:14 mircea_popescu: would you prefer being raped by ten thousand slimy worms

02:35:17 mircea_popescu: or by a bull ?

02:35:41 decimation: 1024 chickens?

02:35:46 mircea_popescu: governments everywhere always prefer the bull in that equation. tho their ideal is a herd of goats.

02:36:10 mircea_popescu: apparently easier to hallucinate "a relationship" with the bull.

02:36:12 decimation: well, the government believes they can make the bull like them

02:36:18 mircea_popescu: eeexactly.

02:36:33 BingoBoingo: What socialism truly deserves is taking it from a duck of extraordinary size

02:36:47 decimation: and of course it is very much in bull's interest to pretend

02:36:56 decimation: as long as the slop keeps rolling

02:39:58 decimation: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-02-2015#1007159 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-02-2015#1007161

02:39:58 assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 01:42:33; decimation: then I heard this podcast: http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2013/02/glenn_reynolds.html << "Guest: It's funny--one of my friends, who has been a long-term, upper level bureaucrat in Washington said to me his favorite phenomenon to see is these people coming through these usually politically-appointed jobs and, he says: They think everybody loves them. And then they leave the job and they realize that eve

02:39:58 assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 01:42:35; decimation: that once they are not in the job any more they realize they don't have nearly as many friends as they thought they did. The smarter ones do know this. And that's why so many[?] hang onto power. "

02:42:11 Pierre_Rochard: !rate davout 1 francais, être raisonnable

02:42:11 assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/d94046976d665329

02:42:26 Pierre_Rochard: !v assbot:Pierre_Rochard.rate.davout.1:400210684ec922303e0cfa010509d4eb36cacd24b5ad98a221944aac7c1aa9c6

02:42:26 assbot: Successfully added a rating of 1 for davout with note: francais, être raisonnable

02:43:13 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform http://www.nginxcp.com/installation-instruction/ << there, random spamsite has nginx-for-cpanel prepackaged.

02:43:14 assbot: Nginx Admin Installation Instruction ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbD5GH )

02:43:24 mircea_popescu: "Tried to install and got this error message: ?access key doesn?t exist create it in WHM? What to do? Thank you."

02:43:37 mircea_popescu: "At root whm go to Main >> Cluster/Remote Access >> Setup Remote Access Key Then click Generate New Key and retry to install"

02:44:08 mircea_popescu: "Thank you very much; this is working very fine now. Great script and glad to get it installed. Success!"

02:47:55 asciilifeform: for the love of god, montrezor! (tm)

02:52:47 decimation: heh linus rejects dbus in kernel with prejudice http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel/1930358/focus=1939166

02:52:48 assbot: Gmane Loom ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbEBZx )

02:53:19 decimation: "IOW, all the people who say that it's about avoiding context switches are probably just full of shit. It's not about context switches, it's about bad user-level code."

02:53:42 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11500 @ 0.00029196 = 3.3575 BTC [-]

03:10:26 mircea_popescu: http://www.gotw.ca/publications/concurrency-ddj.htm << check it out, apparently moore law stopped a decade ago.

03:10:27 assbot: 403 Forbidden ... ( http://bit.ly/1zbHglJ )

03:10:28 mircea_popescu: who knew.

03:11:12 TomServo: +asciilifeform | since quitting bsd ('04) << I'd love to hear more about this. Or why the preference for linux?

03:11:28 asciilifeform: TomServo: devices

03:11:55 TomServo: Is that still true today?

03:12:01 asciilifeform: mostly.

03:12:28 asciilifeform: TomServo: check out the pogoplug netbsd saga for one example.

03:12:43 decimation: mircea_popescu: yeah, moore's law has been pretty dead since 2005

03:12:55 decimation: note, transistor sizes have still shrunk, but clock rates haven't gone up

03:13:02 mircea_popescu: aha.

03:13:05 asciilifeform: decimation: heat

03:13:25 decimation: and it's painfully obvious that intel and friends have no idea how to actually make use of their sea of transistors

03:13:39 decimation: other than "do more of what we have been doing for 30 years"

03:13:49 asciilifeform: considering that the entire point of the industry was to enable microshit bloat...

03:14:08 asciilifeform: (yes, i'd love to live on a planet where moore's law was for something else)

03:14:27 decimation: I predict that in the future this whole era of 'multi-core' manufacturing will be seen as crazy

03:14:34 BingoBoingo: TomServo: asciilifeform was a FreeBSD man, but device drivers pushed him away, if I recall correctly nao CLANG+LLVM keeps him away

03:14:52 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: openbsd is gcc-based

03:14:57 asciilifeform: it's mainly the devices.

03:15:31 asciilifeform: i also have boxes that run closedsource linux crapolade (e.g., xilinx toolchain)

03:15:38 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: Indeed. OpenBSD is GCC based and still weird on devices. Also generally weird.

03:15:44 TomServo: pogoplug and such I understand.. but how does it factor in the cpanel debate?

03:15:53 asciilifeform: TomServo: it doesn't

03:16:09 BingoBoingo: Cpanel is another retardation

03:16:48 asciilifeform: TomServo: mircea_popescu found somewhere a server, graciously offered for use in s.nsa. but it turned out to be running a severely mutilated linux.

03:17:11 decimation: https://www.varnish-cache.org/docs/trunk/phk/ssl_again.html < against 'ssl everywhere' < "With SSL Everywhere, these actors get much more privacy to invade the privacy of every human being with an internet connection, because it takes a lot more skill to look into a SSL connection than a plaintext HTTP connection."

03:17:12 assbot: SSL revisited — Varnish version trunk documentation ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em2hcB )

03:17:13 BingoBoingo: Cpanel's primary design goal seems to be disorienting people when they try unperverted stuff such that they get hooked on the dope

03:17:37 asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: in so far as i can see, it cannot be used for non-php hosting at all.

03:17:48 asciilifeform: at least not without major surgery

03:20:08 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15200 @ 0.00030895 = 4.696 BTC [+]

03:20:52 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: In library school for web projects some of the doctoral students I met had a dependecy on it an phpmyadmin for their web work. They did surgeries, I wondered if they contorted so because they needed to burn hours of their life or if they needed to meet "expectations"

03:20:52 decimation: not only does ssl enable the fucktarded certificate crypto, it enables nefarious 'customized' behavior

03:21:22 BingoBoingo: decimation: Also all kinds of weird packet edge cases

03:21:22 asciilifeform: heartbleed2-everywhere

03:21:31 asciilifeform: as well as 'war on folks who sniff own lan'

03:21:35 BingoBoingo: !up felipelalli

03:21:37 decimation: asciilifeform: exactly

03:21:42 asciilifeform: (just as ipv6 is)

03:21:57 decimation: it exactly enables a 'walled-garden' model

03:22:28 mircea_popescu: decimation politically they're pleasant,

03:22:32 *: BingoBoingo would very much like triclopyr over ip protocol-protocol

03:22:32 mircea_popescu: but technologically inept.

03:22:42 mircea_popescu: to this date i dunno wtf happens that i end up with corrupted ips.

03:23:13 decimation: mircea_popescu: possibly shitty lan hardware?

03:23:19 mircea_popescu: nope.

03:24:31 decimation: in theory it is still possible to sniff ssl traffic, but it's quite complex

03:24:41 decimation: and makes it impossible to have a 'triangular' model of networking

03:25:02 mircea_popescu: either set req.http.X-TVIP = client.ip; in varnish fucks up and sets the wrong thing ; or else, mod_remoteip fucks up the RemoteIPHeader X-TVIP conversion.

03:25:11 mircea_popescu: impossible to debug, and DEFINITELY not worth debugging.

03:26:42 BingoBoingo: !up sccop_test

03:27:12 BingoBoingo: OMG sccop_test is has a Virginm hostmask

03:27:48 mircea_popescu: ;;bc,stats

03:27:53 gribble: Current Blocks: 354171 | Current Difficulty: 4.761056451347126E10 | Next Difficulty At Block: 354815 | Next Difficulty In: 644 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 4 days, 6 hours, 21 minutes, and 27 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 48392476656.4 | Estimated Percent Change: 1.64231

03:28:09 williamdunne: !addfeed somefeedhere

03:28:45 sccop_test: Pings: 1

03:29:17 danielpbarron: https://archive.is/YpSGx#selection-15867.52-15867.123 "Otherkin, pansexual/panromantic, polyamorous, and genderfluid/nonbinary"

03:29:19 assbot: Tumblr dot TXT (TumblrTXT) on Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em4FQI )

03:29:52 BingoBoingo: !addfeed http://oglaf.com/feeds/rss/

03:29:54 assbot: Oglaf! -- Comics. Often dirty. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em4MLX )

03:31:15 BingoBoingo: williamdunne: You might want to use a different control character

03:31:15 williamdunne: BingoBoingo: You're right, I'll make it @ or summin

03:31:20 BingoBoingo: williamdunne: What about ;;;;;

03:31:31 BingoBoingo: ;;;;;addfeed

03:31:32 gribble: Error: ";;;addfeed" is not a valid command.

03:32:49 BingoBoingo: ;!;;;addfeed

03:32:49 BingoBoingo: ^control prefix

03:32:49 williamdunne: * test

03:32:49 williamdunne: He won't say anything about valid commands

03:32:49 williamdunne: so *this won't effect it*

03:39:21 BingoBoingo: williamdunne: Mircea has wanted oglaf on the feed though, would be nice to have it in a way that isn't me doing "/nick oglafbot"

03:39:21 williamdunne: What do you mean?

03:39:21 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: Tumblr dot TXT << wtf even was that

03:39:21 asciilifeform: mega-lulzatr0n

03:39:21 danielpbarron: some guy reposted the funniest SEW quotes from tumblr to twitter

03:39:21 williamdunne: kakobrekla: would it be possible to make http://w.b-a.link/trust/assbot/williamdunne.json work, and be valid json? Not sure what format it currently is

03:39:21 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em6htN )

03:39:21 williamdunne: That way it doesn't break btcalpha.com/wot/

03:39:21 decimation: asciilifeform: apparently every agency in the dc/baltimore area is trying to pacify baltimore

03:39:21 decimation: I'm sure you could hear amusing stuff on your scanners

03:45:05 decimation: lol http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-twitter-earns-20150429-story.html < "The company lost $162.4 million, compared with a loss of $132.4 million in the year-earlier quarter. Revenue jumped to $435.9 million from $250.5 million, but still fell far short of analysts' expectations of $463 million."

03:45:06 assbot: Leak of revenue figures adds to Twitter&apos;s bad day; shares fall 18% - LA Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em7scD )

03:54:15 BingoBoingo: !up yang_

03:54:15 BingoBoingo: !up Asenath_

03:58:11 mircea_popescu: lol wtf is a "mature discussion about harems"

03:58:39 mircea_popescu: williamdunne it just says "No data."

03:58:53 williamdunne: Yeah I know

03:59:00 williamdunne: Without the .json though its invalid json

03:59:26 williamdunne: I'm suggesting that if with .json it returned valid json it could not break btcalpha with the suggested update

03:59:26 BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski Ferguson may be heating up again http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/gunfire-wounds-one-amid-protest-near-brown-shooting-scene-in/article_20958339-2ed0-577d-a80d-ba0959137074.html

03:59:28 assbot: Gunfire wounds one amid protest near Brown shooting scene in Ferguson : News ... ( http://bit.ly/1Em9Yjd )

03:59:28 gribble: The operation succeeded.

04:00:45 mircea_popescu: where does it break btcalpha ?

04:00:45 williamdunne: I'm assuming btcalpha is parsing the API in its current state

04:00:55 williamdunne: So if it were changed so that it uses valid json

04:00:57 williamdunne: It would break

04:01:33 williamdunne: Unless its using the DB files

04:01:33 mircea_popescu: doubt it tbh.

04:01:33 mircea_popescu: exactly.

04:07:09 mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-BxbLyO_ng

04:07:10 assbot: BABA BOSSU DELA MEDIAS 2014 DE MUIE LA FRAIERI - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JzAjPb )

04:07:10 williamdunne: Either way though, could use some valid json

04:07:10 asciilifeform: re: 'Tumblr dot TXT' >> would be interesting to learn how it was censored

04:07:10 asciilifeform: (notice, archive copy, original is long vanished)

04:11:05 BingoBoingo: So who can speak frog an write an qntra piece? https://translate.google.fr/translate?sl=fr&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.legalis.net%2Fspip.php%3Fpage%3Dbreves-article%26id_article%3D4580&edit-text=

04:11:06 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1JzAM3V )

04:11:06 mircea_popescu: can has original url ?

04:11:06 danielpbarron: original is long vanished << today vanished

04:17:33 danielpbarron: would be interesting to learn how it was censored << lots of people all clicking "this account is offensive"

04:17:33 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'm a bit soaked in ETOH trying to protect my liver from cutaneous triclopyr exposure earlier today, not sure how to extract from Google clutches

04:17:33 *: BingoBoingo is kind of aware BingoBoingo is not a broadleaf weed, but still taking post exposure prophylaxis against strange chemicals

04:17:33 danielpbarron: http://www.legalis.net/spip.php?page=breves-article&id_article=4580

04:17:33 assbot: BREVES  |  Prison avec sursis pour la décompilation illicite du code de Skype  | Legalis.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1JzBBtp )

04:17:33 mircea_popescu: some dude in caen got sent to jail for publishing a reverse-engineered version of skype

04:17:33 BingoBoingo: Really?

04:19:17 mircea_popescu: 6 months in prison (suspended) and 3500 euro fine

04:19:17 mircea_popescu: this not really qntra is it ?

04:19:17 mircea_popescu: court even rejected unliquidated damages.

04:20:36 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Because the target was MS-limb Skype and the impact makes a contrast to the "American Approach" could be a qntra

04:20:36 mircea_popescu: well, that

04:21:15 mircea_popescu: 's all that's in there. what the guy actually reversed (of note) was the rc4 compression, and what really got them boiling is that he published it on his blog.

04:22:02 BingoBoingo: Eh, everybody's fucked that RC4 slut.

04:22:02 mircea_popescu: myeah.

04:22:02 mircea_popescu: it's really... marginal in all respects.

04:22:02 BingoBoingo: How many people have been punished for it?

04:22:35 BingoBoingo: A hook is: what really got them boiling is that he published it on his blog.

04:24:39 mircea_popescu: well...punished. his lawyer prolly cost more.

04:24:39 mircea_popescu: but sure, if you wanna go into that

04:24:40 BingoBoingo: I'm afraid to touch translations of the French language, but a certain subset of my WoT seems comfortable enough I'd publish their writeups on a Frog story

04:25:24 BingoBoingo: If this were a derp seemingly so treated in an Arizona court I would be all over this

04:26:25 BingoBoingo: Like Candida on a BBW

04:26:25 mircea_popescu: https://getfedora.org/static/0608B895.txt << check it out, epel signs

04:26:26 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1EmfDpb )

04:37:50 BingoBoingo: Doesn't pretty much every linux Distro try to at least pretend to the PGP signed sherezade?

04:44:17 mircea_popescu: nope

04:44:22 mircea_popescu: first one i've seen today.

04:48:54 BingoBoingo: Nah, I'm not talking the "essential" "accessories" the distros themselves try to put up a PGP front

04:48:59 BingoBoingo: Even if it means actual vitals are missing and unsigned

04:51:18 mircea_popescu: i gues epel counts as a distro

05:00:27 BingoBoingo: The *buttu derps kinda set the bar low on what counts as a "distro"

05:00:59 mircea_popescu: https://bz.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=54651 even more lulz

05:01:01 assbot: Bug 54651 – mod_remoteip ends up trusting IPs that it doesn't check ... ( http://bit.ly/1PVuV9L )

05:01:30 mircea_popescu: note that nothing actually works in a number of different ways

05:03:25 danielpbarron: http://theroguefeminist.tumblr.com/post/73293915224/tho-is-aave-just-to-let-you-know

05:03:26 assbot: The Rogue Feminist • "Tho" is AAVE just to let you know ... ( http://bit.ly/1PVvqR6 )

05:14:51 BingoBoingo: Who could have known that "The Catcher in the Rye" was about computing and JD Salinger was a time machine victim exponsed to Ubuntu

05:27:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3678 @ 0.00028616 = 1.0525 BTC [-]

05:37:55 mircea_popescu: dude... "aave" is NOT a thing. it used to be.

05:38:05 mircea_popescu: and tho is about as common as nosejobs.

05:48:37 danielpbarron: !ud headmate

05:48:43 danielpbarron: ;;ud headmate

05:48:44 gribble: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=HeadMate | Apr 7, 2013 ... Headmate. A term thrown around mostly by people on tumblr. People who haven' t seen the sun in long enough begin to hallucinate vividly, ...

05:55:09 danielpbarron: used in a sentence: "I guess im in a polyamorous relationship since me and lelonia are both dating but I dont really feel like Im dating her&plus shes a headmate"

06:30:15 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8242 @ 0.00030166 = 2.4863 BTC [+]

06:36:53 mircea_popescu: !up mixdio

06:38:54 mircea_popescu: so basically it's alienation driven dissociation ?

06:42:08 Adlai: the second UD definition seems much more accurate:

06:42:16 Adlai: "Some people can claim different ethnicities or sexualities, thus allowing them to join an autonomous caucus (for instance queer or women’s) that they were not otherwise entitled to join"

06:42:35 Adlai: also http://sjwnewspeak.tumblr.com/post/73525605704/headmates

06:42:36 assbot: Social Justice Newspeak Explained, Headmates ... ( http://bit.ly/1HXNBoc )

06:44:14 BingoBoingo: Oh shit, this new Marvel movie is actually smart. Perfect allegory for psot-Silk-Road Bitcoin.

06:49:34 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7150 @ 0.00030895 = 2.209 BTC [+]

06:50:25 BingoBoingo: James Spader plays an evil robot on point, and... Disney spent 4 Josh Hamiltons or 1 Coinbase on a film.

06:51:01 mircea_popescu: disney can afford it

06:53:54 BingoBoingo: Seriously good Bitcoin allegory though. I will have to sober watch and blog up.

06:55:12 trinque: Adlai: I assume you have now slept off your drunkeness; I meanwhile have found my own

06:55:42 *: Adlai sips coffee and blinks

06:56:31 trinque: tell you what; this country is a shitty place, but I have the good fortune to have met a handful of americans worth knowing

06:56:54 mircea_popescu: http://41.media.tumblr.com/42af915a8e33bb34894c48fcada7f1e0/tumblr_n79932CrxD1r2k92so1_1280.jpg and good night!

06:56:57 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1HXQKUT )

07:08:53 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14799 @ 0.00030895 = 4.5722 BTC [+]

07:18:02 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5210 @ 0.00030895 = 1.6096 BTC [+]

07:26:19 Adlai: !up gabriel_laddel

07:26:25 gabriel_laddel: Thank you.

07:26:32 Adlai: no thank YOU

07:26:35 gabriel_laddel: 1. A WoT host has been mentioned a few times in the logs - MP's new hosts (abusehosting.ru) accept bitcoin. It is probably easier to get them into the WoT than to start a new hosting company, which (understandably) no one wants to do. See also: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-03-2014#565389

07:26:35 assbot: Logged on 18-03-2014 14:54:45; nubbins`: "hey guys i'd like to open a sandwich shop, is there any place i can buy deli meats in bulk?"

07:26:35 gabriel_laddel: 2. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=28-04-2015#1114502 << Vocabulary note: code and data reduce to "information".

07:26:35 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 21:47:49; trinque: unix's "everything is a file" is a poor man's "everything is data"

07:26:35 gabriel_laddel: 3. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-04-2015#1105913 << http://youtu.be/fJR1UFX2GVY?t=4m15s2

07:26:35 assbot: Logged on 21-04-2015 19:23:08; mircea_popescu: Pierre_Rochard you know the very notion that someone thinks themselves gay and jewish... it's like... the quadriplegic swimmer or something. the 98 yo beauty queen

07:26:37 assbot: Dana International - Tel Aviv Pride Parade 2014 דנה אינטרנשיונל במצעד הגאווה - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBb )

07:26:37 gabriel_laddel: 4. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=28-04-2015#1114416 << Auotools is 150k LoC. Might as well just require SBCL at that point.

07:26:37 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 20:56:45; ascii_field: i'd be open to a purely gnumake-based thing instead of the sh

07:26:37 gabriel_laddel: 5. <mircea_popescu> kinda why i'm discovering all i really like off unix these days is like... curl. grep. << http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/posts/old-age-and-treachery.html

07:26:38 assbot: The Treacherous Optimization ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBd )

07:26:38 gabriel_laddel: 6. Baltimore, cf https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6tmD0W5r4w

07:26:39 assbot: Armed Korean Merchants Protect Stores - 1992 LA Riots - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1KsIMBj )

07:26:45 gabriel_laddel: 韓流 ftw.

07:26:53 *: Adlai splurts coffee all over irc too

07:27:35 Adlai: gabriel_laddel: at the very least, sending those in with a few-second delay would let assbot annotate the logs in a more readable manner

07:27:50 Adlai: she can't spam faster than the speed of flood

07:27:59 gabriel_laddel: kk, I

07:28:06 gabriel_laddel: ll try harder next time.

07:28:14 gabriel_laddel: 7. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1113989 << When I change the argument list, rename a procedure, use an unnamed reference why are the holes not marked or filled? Why must I manually declare my local variables and functions? Can't the current top level expression be searched for occurrences then factored out on a keystroke? Why must I balance strings, whatever the level of nesting or escaping? Can th

07:28:14 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 17:16:36; mircea_popescu: think about it. why the fuck should the code have to know about this. and if it does have to know about this, why aren't ALL the code references affected by any of such a change cross-indexed somewhere ?

07:28:14 gabriel_laddel: is not be handled automatically? Why isn't there grammer/spellchecking for my comments? If I modify a package or system definition at runtime, shouldn't I be prompted to write that change to the defining expression? Why must I optimize my programs and add type annotations? Can't test data be used to add typing annotations in an automated manner? Can't this information inform modifications of the program's fundamenta

07:28:14 gabriel_laddel: l data structures to those appropriate for the information being pushed through it? If the type information exists, shouldn't it inform auto-completion? Shouldn't I be able to query over the type signature, known return types and lambda list of all procedures?

07:28:14 gabriel_laddel: Why isn't all this information part of the version control toolchain? I can't query over all commits to find those that changed `some-function'..? WHAT THE FUCK IS HTTP? All I want to do is expose a procedure to a network - how is this more difficult than selecting a list of procedures which are then exposed?

07:28:32 *: Adlai isn't sure "harder" is the right dimension

07:28:40 gabriel_laddel: heh

07:29:08 Adlai: Why must I manually declare my local variables << scoping

07:29:38 Adlai: automagic scoping goes wrong once you start messing with eg closures

07:29:47 gabriel_laddel: Nah - say I have this expression: (+ (x 4) k (x 4))

07:30:08 Adlai: contrived example is contrived

07:30:09 gabriel_laddel: I should be able to have a cursor on either one of the (x 4) and hit a keystroke to extract it into a let binding

07:30:13 gabriel_laddel: I know

07:30:19 gabriel_laddel: Just trying to point MP at something

07:30:46 Adlai: you mean turning that into (let ((y (x 4))) (+ y k y)) ?

07:30:52 gabriel_laddel: yep.

07:31:28 gabriel_laddel: ^ anyway, all of the above are simple if you adknowledge that you've got to operate on an AST

07:32:19 gabriel_laddel: if you don't you'll be fucked, because generating syntatically correct code means AST manipulations

07:32:29 gabriel_laddel: in lisp easy peasy pie

07:32:32 gabriel_laddel: in ALGOL

07:32:34 gabriel_laddel: heh

07:32:46 gabriel_laddel: clang's AST crud is >100k LoC

07:33:47 gabriel_laddel: I'll note that I wrote a prototype for the RPC described above - ran into an issue with TCP or the library I was using it from. Messages were disappearing in flight.

07:33:57 gabriel_laddel: 8. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=27-04-2015#1113452 << Masamune is based on funtoo, which is gentoo without SystemD.

07:33:57 assbot: Logged on 27-04-2015 23:07:20; mircea_popescu: i'd settle for a well documented and judiciously defaulted gentoo.

07:34:51 gabriel_laddel: If someone would like to make themselves useful and move us that much closer to a source-only #-assets distribution, a CL interface to portage is desperately needed.

07:35:21 *: Adlai hasn't yet recovered from elisp overdose

07:35:47 gabriel_laddel: Adlai: you're piping data back and forth from CL to elisp or...?

07:35:59 gabriel_laddel: Portage has a USE flag (what is that? Idk, some nonsense abstraction) for docs so you can tell it to build all docs, but it gets caught in cyclic dependencies atm.

07:35:59 Adlai: tried to read masamune code

07:36:04 gabriel_laddel: Oh...

07:36:06 gabriel_laddel: Whoops.

07:36:08 gabriel_laddel: I should commit

07:36:37 gabriel_laddel: Anyways, if someone were to move portage to CLOS detecting cycles is easy, hence we can have all the documentation we ever wanted

07:36:46 gabriel_laddel: I should note that masamune installs

07:37:13 gabriel_laddel: something went wrong with imaxima and gnuplot in portage - it only works on one of my machines now

07:37:43 gabriel_laddel: ^ http://dev.gentoo.org/~zmedico/portage/doc/ this is probably a good place to start for portage -> CL

07:37:45 assbot: Portage Documentation ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI1HfK )

07:38:05 gabriel_laddel: basically all one needs is

07:38:06 gabriel_laddel: emerge -s maxima ;; searches maxima

07:38:06 gabriel_laddel: equery y maxima ;; shows available versions of maxima

07:38:06 gabriel_laddel: emerge info maxima ;; get all information

07:38:58 gabriel_laddel: Another useful thing someone could do is to figure out how we would go about generating a canonical hardware -> driver mapping

07:41:17 gabriel_laddel: https://github.com/gabriel-laddel/masamune/blob/master/util.lisp#L591

07:41:18 assbot: masamune/util.lisp at master · gabriel-laddel/masamune · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI2uNY )

07:41:38 trinque: "I can't query over all commits" << man I yell about wanting to query the state of everything constantly

07:41:57 gabriel_laddel: ^ this contains information about how to get a list of all hardware - the kernel can determine hardware -> driver mappings somehow. Find, document.

07:42:13 gabriel_laddel: trinque: one can trivially query over ASTs

07:42:43 gabriel_laddel: regarding comprehensible computing - an observation, sbcl vs. GCC

07:42:58 gabriel_laddel: ~398k LoC vs. >14 million

07:43:10 gabriel_laddel: SBCL has a %6 C core for GC stuff

07:43:16 trinque: grammar : AST :: schema : rows

07:43:38 gabriel_laddel: trinque: I don't know how to read that.

07:44:28 gabriel_laddel: one could tear out all windows crud from SBCL, and replace the C crud with some clever assembler hacks in a manner similar to what I've been told T did.

07:44:31 gabriel_laddel: anyways...

07:45:00 gabriel_laddel: http://www.paulgraham.com/thist.html

07:45:01 assbot: History of T ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI3tgZ )

07:45:11 Adlai: trinque: make them all equal! tables of cons cells! cdr-coded self-joins!

07:45:30 trinque: Adlai: when does relational algebra get its "cycle"

07:45:44 Adlai: three bushels of hax

07:45:54 gabriel_laddel: Adlai: tables of cons cells?

07:46:08 trinque: fwiw the best relational system is probably yet to be built, and is probably made of lisp

07:46:10 Adlai: gabriel_laddel: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=29-04-2015#1115010

07:46:10 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 00:40:05; Adlai: trinque: what, you want a table with two columns, CAR and CDR?

07:46:17 gabriel_laddel: !s reflections on trusting trust

07:46:18 assbot: 3 results for 'reflections on trusting trust' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=reflections+on+trusting+trust

07:46:23 gabriel_laddel: Adlai: I saw that - but wtf

07:46:30 trinque: it's just lists of lists after all, with something which guards inserts/updates into it

07:46:30 *: Adlai is trollinque

07:46:35 gabriel_laddel: ah

07:47:01 trinque: you lispfolk can rip the relational database from my dead hands

07:47:10 gabriel_laddel: trinque: ummm

07:47:11 trinque: it's fine for pulling levers on my database, but that's it

07:47:26 gabriel_laddel: trinque: one can just query over ASTs

07:47:36 gabriel_laddel: like, say that I want to find all javascript functions with 3 arguments

07:48:05 trinque: you can have an invalid AST in lisp, in terms of your grammar; no one stops you from making any pile of cons cells

07:48:13 gabriel_laddel: correct

07:48:16 trinque: if I represent a grammar in SQL tables you cannot fuck it up

07:48:26 gabriel_laddel: hmmm.

07:48:30 trinque: any atomic alteration of the state of it cannot be wrong

07:48:44 trinque: I can bitch slap your mistakes with constraints and the very structure of my schema

07:48:47 trinque: that is what I love about it

07:49:23 Adlai: this is starting to sound like unfeature #4

07:49:58 Adlai: put more constructively: does your constraint grammer allow for extending itself?

07:50:07 trinque: sure, but specifically how

07:50:10 gabriel_laddel: ^ ding ding ding

07:50:13 trinque: nah hold on

07:50:14 gabriel_laddel: as for the js ast

07:50:16 trinque: what's meant by that

07:50:21 gabriel_laddel: (filter (lambda (l) (and (eq :function (car l)) (= 3 (length (nth 2 l))))) (js-ast #P"~/somejsfile.js"))

07:50:46 trinque: of course one can alter schema at will

07:50:47 Adlai: can you stick some row into some table of constraint specifications, which lets future-you insert previously-invalid rows

07:50:55 trinque: I don't know why people act like relational databases are cast in iron

07:51:34 trinque: Adlai: writable system catalog released by my old employer https://github.com/aquametalabs/pg_meta

07:51:35 assbot: aquametalabs/pg_meta · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1QI56eK )

07:51:43 trinque: so yeah, you can just insert into that and alter the database arbitrarily

07:52:08 trinque: so one of the projects I built with that is a schema generator given some ebnf representation of a grammar

07:52:16 trinque: along with automatic to-string for the ASTs

07:52:25 trinque: so you can metaprogram like a motherfucker in an rdbms

07:52:29 trinque: SQL is just a terrible syntax.

07:53:25 gabriel_laddel: yeah that sounds like a lot of work

07:53:43 trinque: no, not really

07:53:53 trinque: SQL's a highly functional language, easy to think about

07:54:05 trinque: it's just operating on sets

07:54:27 gabriel_laddel: "automatic to-string for the ASTs"

07:54:35 gabriel_laddel: ^ sounds like a bitch - but I'm lazy...

07:54:52 Adlai: sounds like a defmethod print-object

07:55:46 trinque: gabriel_laddel: it's just a join between the tables that represent the grammar and the AST tables

07:56:04 trinque: so you can pull lexer tokens out of the former for example that aren't in the AST itself

07:56:13 gabriel_laddel: holy fuck no

07:56:47 trinque: !up gabriel_laddel

07:56:56 gabriel_laddel: trinque: you're just learning CL, right?

07:57:04 gabriel_laddel: or, like, looking at it now?

07:57:52 trinque: I'm surprised you find the relational model controversial.

07:58:01 trinque: I don't see how it's incompatible at all with lisp.

07:58:05 Adlai: what's wrong with extending code-is-data to another data format?

07:58:06 gabriel_laddel: I don't find it controversial at all

07:58:20 gabriel_laddel: I find the parsing to be a gigantic PITA

07:58:22 Adlai: (beyond the hours forever lost turning into weeks you'll never get back)

07:58:38 Adlai: I'm not sure there's any parsing involved

07:58:43 trinque: so give me the enforcement of logical structure in lisp

07:58:48 trinque: that is what I want.

07:58:50 Adlai: this seems to be more "store the AST in a db rather than text"

07:58:56 gabriel_laddel: ;; later tell EllieAsksWhy 'proxies'

07:58:57 gribble: The operation succeeded.

07:59:44 gabriel_laddel: trinque: I understand what you're talking about.

07:59:59 gabriel_laddel: Adlai: he is/was storing lexing and grammer information.

08:00:20 trinque: tool for representing business rules, piles of data, and trying to make money, please.

08:01:08 *: Adlai always found "business logic" reminiscent of "military logic" in the necessity of distinguishing it from plain simple old "logic"

08:01:21 gabriel_laddel: hehe

08:01:40 trinque: I think it's code for "not mine but his"

08:03:05 Adlai: or "who me, write my own code? nah"

08:03:18 Adlai: "fetch me your trainedest monkeys!"

08:03:40 gabriel_laddel: I'd like to clarify that what I'm finding appaling here is the huge amount of effort spent generating syntatically correct strings.

08:03:52 trinque: that's not the purpose of it at all.

08:03:54 gabriel_laddel: Sure, even in sexprs you have a 'grammer' you might want to check

08:04:05 gabriel_laddel: the purpose isn't what I'm horrified by

08:04:14 trinque: how in lips could you take the ast of a view against one table

08:04:20 trinque: consider the ast of an operation to change the table

08:04:26 trinque: and derive the view that will apply to the new table

08:04:31 trinque: even if you pivoted one into two

08:04:44 trinque: being able to reflect and consider things as sets, not the tree, is valuable

08:05:04 trinque: lips, lol

08:05:06 gabriel_laddel: I have to check that I know what these terms mean before I respond. one sec

08:05:29 Adlai: back in the old days, there was no asdf:load-system... everything consisted of passing magic dispatch tokens to asdf:operate

08:06:24 Adlai: people became lazy... everything changed once the bitrot nation attacked

08:06:33 gabriel_laddel: ha

08:06:45 Adlai: ultimately, rdbms magic does NOT fits in heads

08:06:53 trinque: it's not magic at all

08:06:56 trinque: it's set logic

08:07:01 gabriel_laddel: trinque: could you rephrase "take the ast of a view against one table"

08:07:07 trinque: which amounts to an iteration over one or more lists with an if statement

08:07:12 Adlai: you can't "cat fixup >> database.sql"

08:07:15 trinque: other such logic, producing a result

08:07:22 gabriel_laddel: btw, one can trivially deal with sexpr 'ASTs' as sets

08:07:43 trinque: gabriel_laddel: asumming the AST is represented as a set of tables with foreign key relationships, each table representing a production rule in the grammar

08:07:54 gabriel_laddel: hahahahahahahhaa

08:07:57 gabriel_laddel: oh my fucking god

08:08:03 trinque: you have a childish way of speaking

08:08:23 *: gabriel_laddel is a child :/

08:08:31 trinque: well grow the fuck up, and discuss ideas like a man.

08:08:51 gabriel_laddel: kk, I'm not going anywhere

08:09:50 trinque: if I discovered a way to do something lispy in a non-lisp environment, do you think this'd be the first time I've done this?

08:10:12 gabriel_laddel: trinque: done what exactly?

08:10:41 trinque: so like, why do you think we put ASTs in the database?

08:10:43 trinque: no reason?

08:11:14 gabriel_laddel: I've no idea why you did, but am assuming you've got some reason why

08:11:30 trinque: so then from what position do you proclaim lisp?

08:11:47 gabriel_laddel: because it is inescapable

08:11:55 gabriel_laddel: well, s-expressions are at least

08:12:05 trinque: I'm not seeing the incompatibility of the things

08:12:06 gabriel_laddel: "lisp", like "lispy" is an ill-defined idea.

08:12:12 trinque: list of lists

08:12:32 trinque: there you go, now fucking iterate over two of them and filter by respective conditional expressions

08:12:39 trinque: pop the result into one new list

08:12:54 trinque: now worry about schema at appropriate places and you've got relational algebra

08:12:59 trinque: doesn't need a fucking postgresql

08:13:06 gabriel_laddel: agreed

08:13:09 gabriel_laddel: everything is a "list of lists" or a "tree" when you get down to it (in the compiler - though yes, you can go directly stack machine).

08:13:21 trinque: certainly

08:13:34 gabriel_laddel: but sexprs are nice because they're easy to parse.

08:13:53 gabriel_laddel: anyone /can/ add meta-programming to whatever language they want.

08:14:01 gabriel_laddel: but you'll end up like paul phillips

08:14:23 gabriel_laddel: because parsing is a terribly boring (and totally unnecessary) task.

08:14:53 gabriel_laddel: btw, I'm still putting together a model of what exactly it is you've done so that I can discuss this with you using your vocabulary...

08:18:29 gabriel_laddel: "how in lips could you take the ast of a view against one table" << This ends up being just hacking at sexprs with the full language at your disposal.

08:18:44 gabriel_laddel: you might get a "relational algebra"

08:18:55 trinque: and if one of your hacks fucks up the logic of what it is to be a "whatever's in that list" ?

08:19:25 trinque: the idea is that your lisp code is always right, hence the data is right

08:19:30 gabriel_laddel: nope

08:19:40 trinque: whereas I assume everything's hell and hopefully the database will keep it all coherent

08:20:10 trinque: because a printer could fellate itself or linux could grow cancer and fill a disk

08:20:35 trinque: the database if told as much as is known about the data you want to represent, wont let you fuck it up

08:20:56 gabriel_laddel: I can do the same thing if I want.

08:21:28 gabriel_laddel: you just end up writing a predicate to see that the information you're manipulating is (every #'string ...) or whatever

08:21:31 trinque: which amounts to building a database in to your thing, yeah?

08:21:47 gabriel_laddel: Well, the lines get blurry.

08:21:49 gabriel_laddel: But yes.

08:22:26 gabriel_laddel: ;; google symbolics Statice

08:22:26 gribble: Statice (Symbolics) - Symbolics Lisp Machine Museum: http://smbx.org/statice-symbolics/; Symbolics Assets Bought - Symbolics Lisp Machine Museum: http://smbx.org/symbolics-assets-bought/; Statice Flower Meaning & Symbolism | Statice Facts - Teleflora.com: http://www.teleflora.com/about-flowers/statice.asp

08:24:22 gabriel_laddel: So, in your model of computing you get to work with incomplete languages in the "data model" and when generating "views". While this does provide defaults, when hacking lisp you always have the full language at your disposal.

08:24:25 BingoBoingo: Quick question... There's no macguffin the plot can use to out BTC BTC is there...

08:24:55 gabriel_laddel: Also, you don't have to parse anything, or have "generator rules" or whatever, which cuts out a lot of the complexity that you get when doing something like what you've done.

08:26:15 *: BingoBoingo still wonders about the search for a singular #b-a distribution when x86 sucks as much as it does...

08:26:25 gabriel_laddel: it is on the way

08:26:32 gabriel_laddel: I just spent 2 days fucking with mozilla

08:27:22 trinque: !up gabriel_laddel

08:27:40 gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: Making it production ready is going to take some time, but as is, it is better than any other distro I've used.

08:27:52 BingoBoingo: <trinque> if I represent a grammar in SQL tables you cannot fuck it up << You want to throw a stake down on that???

08:28:04 gabriel_laddel: Having the same keybindings for the web browser + editor gets me all hot and bothered.

08:28:16 gabriel_laddel: If I could just get a working shared kill ring...

08:28:22 *: gabriel_laddel *shivers*

08:28:37 trinque: yeah, if you represent anything correctly in relational tables you wont have false statements *according to your system*

08:28:40 trinque: you could totally be wrong

08:28:44 trinque: just not incoherent

08:29:16 trinque: this assurance that the data means anything is why databases were created.

08:30:20 BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Not dissing the project, just questioning the target.

08:30:37 gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: question away.

08:30:44 gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: diss away too.

08:31:38 BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Dunno how useful I can be. Drunk on vodka trying to protect my vital fluids from triclopyr. Watched a Disney movie...

08:32:43 BingoBoingo: trinque: The problem with taking any extant, deployabru RDBMS is that unsanitzed inputs could throw out rm -rf /

08:33:13 BingoBoingo: Hopefully the DB doesn't have the rights for it to run, but...

08:33:16 gabriel_laddel: I'm simply of the opinion that our current platform (irc) is too barbaric and doesn't force enough shared context upon us to do anything interesting. Any sort of shared vision or whatever gets watered down into discussions like the above.

08:33:44 gabriel_laddel: Without a shared language the logs will end up in endless cycles of the above.

08:34:20 BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: What makes you sure we have a shared platform, or that individuals here choose platforms for themselves singularly?

08:34:55 BingoBoingo: I doubt severely shared languages are a thing

08:34:55 gabriel_laddel: perhaps that was phrased poorly.

08:35:27 gabriel_laddel: The preceding discussion was largely myself and trinque learning the others vocabulary.

08:35:33 trinque: I think the guy just means talking in person it is much easier to understand what's meant by the other.

08:35:43 trinque: yeah that

08:35:54 gabriel_laddel: I don't think "in person" has much to do with it.

08:36:12 gabriel_laddel: right now I can't draw you a 3D picture you can just open up, modify and send back to me

08:36:13 gabriel_laddel: why?

08:36:16 trinque: well then that's something true of any attempt to communicate

08:36:20 gabriel_laddel: compiler, dependencies blah blah blah

08:36:38 trinque: sure, big bottleneck there still

08:37:22 trinque: it's going to piss you off when I say we were attaching widgets to the various tables of our ASTs

08:37:27 trinque: this is what you're talking about right?

08:37:35 trinque: you want to send me data directly in some more meaningful structure

08:38:01 BingoBoingo: trinque: Baudot is the penultimate encoding

08:38:32 gabriel_laddel: "I need the ability to publish a unit of research as an interactive program containing all information used to draw my conclusions. It shall be entirely and trivially modifiable, extensible, and if reproducing the research is possible on this machine, running the program shall be a single click or procedure call away. WYSIWYG tools shall be included and fashioned from the precepts of geometry. Thus, if the supplied

08:38:32 gabriel_laddel: graphics routines are inadequate, I can fall back on an 'api' independent of man. Lessons, as a refinement of research, shall offer the same capabilities. Networking (e.g., sharing these programs or crafting interactions between them) shall be trivial. No single authority shall dictate what is an isn't appropriate to publish. This is not to be enforced by social machinery which promises to promote and cherish scient

08:38:32 gabriel_laddel: ific inquiry, but as a consequence of a comprehensible, expressive design that empowers the individual. "

08:38:40 gabriel_laddel: ^ trinque

08:38:59 BingoBoingo: <trinque> sure, big bottleneck there still << Irony of ironies, bottleneck is the part of the bottle that broke such that poison exposure happened

08:39:39 gabriel_laddel: trinque: related - pastebin.com/AdTXnKT6

08:39:51 BingoBoingo: gabriel_laddel: Couldn't a Perl OS do that? Works for make baby?

08:40:08 gabriel_laddel: BingoBoingo: die

08:40:20 BingoBoingo: Or AppleBasic?

08:40:37 BingoBoingo: 6502 emulates on nearly everything...

08:40:59 gabriel_laddel: ^ http://www.douglasadams.com/dna/980707-00-a.html

08:40:59 assbot: DNA/Frank The Vandal ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcsgnS )

08:41:12 gabriel_laddel: ^ many thanks to stas for pointing me to that via his blog

08:41:13 trinque: gabriel_laddel: I'm headed towards bed; I'll read this tomorrow.

08:44:14 trinque: !rate gabriel_laddel 2 ...then I expect an operating system.

08:44:15 assbot: Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/bbb73859c2d2f57f

08:44:24 *: BingoBoingo just watched Disney produced "evil robot fiction" was surprised at the parts that weren't shitty

08:44:49 trinque: !v assbot:trinque.rate.gabriel_laddel.2:ebce74b8458b0e2934062e26da0b155a3b93e00ae745213213525f777b4d25c3

08:44:49 assbot: Successfully added a rating of 2 for gabriel_laddel with note: ...then I expect an operating system.

09:42:24 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5800 @ 0.00029619 = 1.7179 BTC [-]

09:43:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11505 @ 0.0002903 = 3.3399 BTC [-] {2}

09:44:26 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5795 @ 0.00028616 = 1.6583 BTC [-]

09:55:38 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9830 @ 0.00029619 = 2.9115 BTC [+]

10:06:42 davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115283 <<< ugh. this whole story is such a pile of braindamage

10:06:42 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 04:11:05; BingoBoingo: So who can speak frog an write an qntra piece? https://translate.google.fr/translate?sl=fr&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=fr&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.legalis.net%2Fspip.php%3Fpage%3Dbreves-article%26id_article%3D4580&edit-text=

10:07:23 davout: basically the guy is being hung because the reverse-engineering wasn't made with the intent of creating something interoperable with skype, which is permitted under french law

10:10:53 punkman: davout, how did they figure that intent

10:12:35 davout: punkman: because he blogged about it and didn't keep it for himself, because of what he declared to the cops about making stuff to block skype, replicate its functionality without the backdoors

10:13:34 davout: ;;calc 67067452/25000

10:13:34 gribble: 2682.69808

10:14:00 davout: so apparently this neucoin thing sold for 2.7kBTC worth of their, ahem, "coin"

10:17:00 punkman: I had to get some paperwork from the police station today. old lady there looks at my ID, which is old and handwritten, and says "hey, I made this ID back in the day"

10:25:18 punkman: also, cab driver: "check out the hottie over there" *honks* "oh shit that was my cousin. damn she lost a lot of weight"

10:44:25 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9000 @ 0.00028666 = 2.5799 BTC [-]

10:55:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7700 @ 0.00028666 = 2.2073 BTC [-]

11:47:27 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13950 @ 0.00029619 = 4.1319 BTC [+]

12:11:22 jurov: http://lwn.net/SubscriberLink/641244/5d1d6d20aeb0a647/ heh, python scripting/REPL for GRUB.

12:11:23 assbot: Python without an operating system [LWN.net] ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcUdMc )

12:17:57 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16550 @ 0.00028521 = 4.7202 BTC [-] {2}

12:34:28 mircea_popescu: The core problem is that C programmers think they can get away with doing much less than the Common Lisp programmer causes the computer to do. But this is actually wrong. Getting C programmers to understand that they cause the computer to do less than minimum is intractable. They would not /use/ C if they understood this point, so if you actually cause them to understand it in the course of a discussion, you will only

12:34:28 mircea_popescu: make them miserable and hate their lives. People are pretty good at detecting that this is a likely outcome of thinking, and it takes conscious effort to brace yourself and get through such experiences. Most people are not willing even to /listen/ to arguments or information that could threaten their comfortable view of their own existence, much less think about it, so when you cannot answer a C programmer's "arguments

12:34:29 mircea_popescu: " that his way of life is just great the way it is, it is a pretty good sign that you let him set the agenda once he realized that his way of life was under threat. Since you have nothing to defend, your self-preservation instinct will not activate hitherto unused parts of your brain to come up with reasons and rationalizations for what you have done, you will not be aware that you have been taken for a ride before it

12:34:34 mircea_popescu: is over and you "lost".

12:34:38 mircea_popescu: the fucking quotes don't belong there.

12:34:49 mircea_popescu: what you _have_ in point of fact ACTUALLY LOST is the ability to live in a world where things actually work,

12:35:06 mircea_popescu: as opposed to "well it mostly works" "you just have to..." "hey it works on MY system" etc.

12:36:46 mircea_popescu: and yesterday's discussion re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1113989 is a magnificent example of the exact problem.

12:36:46 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 17:16:36; mircea_popescu: think about it. why the fuck should the code have to know about this. and if it does have to know about this, why aren't ALL the code references affected by any of such a change cross-indexed somewhere ?

12:36:57 jurov: that world did never exist

12:38:57 mircea_popescu: !up lolz

12:39:14 mircea_popescu: jurov so is your argument something like "oh look how cute, mp found a socialism HE CAN BELIEVE IN!!1" ?

12:40:27 jurov: it§s easiest to believe in the past that is now lost

12:41:08 mircea_popescu: i was ftr not proposing this was a thing at any point in the past.

12:41:35 jurov: i don't get you then at all

12:41:43 mircea_popescu: the problem here is that we're regressing to the past (srsly, the varnish adventure is so reminiscent of "dos utilities" scene it bleeds) but with much more powerful tools and with much more societal dependency on them.

12:42:10 mircea_popescu: it is, if you wish, like if bitcoin were to take over and everyone depended on it in 2065, but then for some reason people started moving back to 0.5.3 codebase.

12:42:36 mircea_popescu: it might have been ok for 50 years ago, when the most damage that it could do was someone losing his retarded tripod poems

12:42:47 mircea_popescu: it has a decent chance at simply ending the world, now.

12:43:35 jurov: so you want to have progress, after all\

12:43:41 mircea_popescu: hm... i think the ddos might still be on. that lolz dude left exactly 246 s after i voiced him.

12:44:14 mircea_popescu: jurov i just want shit that works.

12:44:42 mircea_popescu: IF i am going to allow these retarded kids out of their basements and into society, they HAVE TO spiff up their act.

12:45:05 mircea_popescu: i guess this could be progress. it could also be normalization. whatever it is...

12:45:38 jurov: basically, it's like roads were replaced every few years (bevcause we can and it's cheap) so that cars would need constatnt upgrades and modifications

12:45:53 jurov: you come and ask for car that damn works in this situation

12:45:55 jurov: impossible.

12:46:04 mircea_popescu: but the "changes" just stopped. moore law is dead.

12:46:12 mircea_popescu: i am at the forefront of people who noticed, and demand changes.

12:46:32 mircea_popescu: you know, thought leadership.

12:47:16 jurov: moore is not the only game in town. network bandwidth is still going up.

12:47:31 jurov: if that hits the ceiling,too, maybe then.

12:47:41 mircea_popescu: bandwidth alone is not really that type of change tho. and it stopped going up also, esp in the us.

12:47:56 mircea_popescu: actually the forecasts are that 2020 bw will be less than 2015 was.

12:48:38 mats: ouch, TWTR falls 15%

12:48:45 mircea_popescu: wasn't it 19% ?

12:49:16 mats: might be 19% pre market

12:49:51 mats: o nvm it fell below 20% at some point

12:50:09 mircea_popescu: aha.

12:50:29 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4228 @ 0.00029619 = 1.2523 BTC [+]

12:51:12 mircea_popescu: lol i go to bed, gabriel_laddel comes online. avoiding unpleasant convos yo ? :D

12:52:01 mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel: 1. A WoT host has been mentioned a few times in the logs - MP's new hosts << yeah i had sent teh guy an invite. all it takes is for him to actually show up etc.

12:52:24 jurov: i expect at least one round of redoing all the world if the derps succeed enforcing SSL everywhere

12:52:47 mircea_popescu: how would they succeed that ? i'm not doing it.

12:53:02 mircea_popescu: redefining "everywhere" != succeeding at ssl everywhere.

12:53:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10350 @ 0.00028444 = 2.944 BTC [-]

12:53:49 mircea_popescu: currently for instance, cpanel forums require ssl, and so i'm not visiting them. i don't generally visit sites that don't have a http version.

12:53:58 davout: looks like this iOS wifi exploit's being used in the wild http://qz.com/393909/american-airlines-planes-are-grounded-because-their-pilots-ipads-have-crashed/

12:53:59 assbot: An iPad glitch grounded several dozen American Airlines planes – Quartz ... ( http://bit.ly/1DAZhp9 )

12:54:17 mats: lol

12:54:37 mircea_popescu: lmao

12:54:44 mircea_popescu: but what do they need the ipads for ?!

12:55:04 davout: mircea_popescu: it's actually pretty useful to get rid of tons of paper

12:55:16 mircea_popescu: huh ?

12:55:23 mircea_popescu: iirc you can't even save a file on it.

12:55:36 mircea_popescu: unrelatedly : Upupa epops might be the best latin name ever.

12:56:11 jurov: or ipv6, you can ignore it, but it may mean you'll be unable to find working code that does not have the bits you hate

12:56:49 punkman: related, I watched a cab driver fashion a cooling system for his lenovo tablet/gps thing because it'd overheat and shut down

12:57:28 mircea_popescu: jurov that's ok, i'm unable to find working code anyway.

12:57:36 punkman: but airline pilots relying on ipad for flight plan? wtf

12:58:10 mircea_popescu: we're a species of idiots.

12:58:40 punkman: I dun wanna fly anymore

13:00:07 mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJR1UFX2GVY << lmao check out amateur hour.

13:00:09 assbot: Dana International - Tel Aviv Pride Parade 2014 דנה אינטרנשיונל במצעד הגאווה - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1DB0f4J )

13:00:24 mircea_popescu: hey Adlai do you get down on knee ?

13:00:38 mircea_popescu: "i used to be a pop star but then i took a down to the knee"

13:04:46 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115372 << well, the prepared statements in a notepad / pasted later model is no good!

13:04:46 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:28:06; gabriel_laddel: ll try harder next time.

13:06:39 mircea_popescu: I confidently crow to anyone who would listen, those foolish enough to enter my office. And my girlfriend too, who's contractually obligated to pay attention to everything I say. << see, i think i know the kind of contract he's talking/dreaming about. in re http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=28-04-2015#1114812

13:06:39 assbot: Logged on 28-04-2015 23:15:21; *: ben_vulpes rolls eyes

13:07:48 mircea_popescu: "And, as everyone knows, the best way to get amazing results is to set arbitrary goals without any basis for believing they can be reached. So I set out to search faster than grep by thirty percent." << damned straight. it's exactly how i manage. especially those... contractually obligated, shall we say.

13:07:48 assbot: AMAZING COMPANY!

13:08:47 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7739 @ 0.00028444 = 2.2013 BTC [-]

13:14:04 chetty: And my girlfriend too, who's contractually obligated to pay attention to everything I say./// that is so sad

13:14:48 Adlai: mircea_popescu: what?

13:14:59 mircea_popescu: ahhh that great rhoden blog. http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/posts/YahooChatRooms.html

13:14:59 assbot: Yahoo! Chat - A Eulogy ... ( http://bit.ly/1JApwnR )

13:15:20 mircea_popescu: chetty hey, attention is scarce!

13:15:29 mircea_popescu: Adlai random link in log.

13:16:00 *: Adlai doesn't need to watch youtube, that shit goes down all around all year long

13:16:51 mircea_popescu: must suck to live in a rural area.

13:16:58 Adlai: bahaha "may the bits of your hard disk be sorted by value"

13:18:22 mircea_popescu: lol

13:18:41 mircea_popescu: that yahoo thing tho... this is EXACTLY what yahoo was. even had to ban "shit" and "shithead" separately.

13:19:28 mircea_popescu: artifexd http://ridiculousfish.com/blog/posts/go_bloviations.html << maybe somewhat interesting.

13:19:29 assbot: Go Bloviations (Optional Reading) ... ( http://bit.ly/1JAq5Oz )

13:22:15 Adlai: ah yes that terrible swear word, Tangobh

13:24:13 mircea_popescu: that's prolly put i nthere special for shooting down ben_vulpes dating attempts in kindergarten.

13:25:03 mircea_popescu: "Put another way, grep sells out its worst case (lots of partial matches) to make the best case (few partial matches) go faster. How treacherous! As this realization dawns on me, the room seemed to grow dim and slip sideways. I look up at the Ultimate Unix Geek, spinning slowly in his padded chair, and I hear his cackle "old age and treachery...", and in his flickering CRT there is a face reflected, but it's my ex girl

13:25:03 mircea_popescu: friend, and the last thing I see before I black out is a patch of yellow cheese powder inside her long tangled beard."

13:25:09 mircea_popescu: epic. i didn't evne know anyone knew :D

13:33:59 mircea_popescu: anyway, not that any of the retards involved in such considerations have the skill or werewithal to get it, but : this is a fine example of privilege in computing.

13:34:50 mircea_popescu: how did "worst case" interest group get to lose 70% so that "best case" interest group can gain 6% ? clearly this was enforced by an opressive, chauvinistic patriarchy which, to bother an irigarayism, "favours the speed of light over other speeds that are much more important to us".

13:35:29 mircea_popescu: and the case of optimized grep is the first and the last word on the matter of "you can not have democratic computing anymore than democratic anything else in this world. it's either good or democratic, pick one."

13:36:46 mircea_popescu: fact remains that raping the poor raw so that the rich can have it slightly better is not only the traditional way to do things back when things were still being done, but actually ~the correct way~.

13:37:23 mircea_popescu: and here comes the doozy : the correct way ~for everyone~!

13:38:03 mircea_popescu: grep is ~overall~ faster for this optimization, or in other words : the downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. step on their faces!

13:39:41 *: asciilifeform notices that mircea_popescu is approaching own level of 'software must die'

13:40:11 mircea_popescu: no, not software. if i wake up to find that slavegirl shat the bed, i'm not going "shit must die"

13:40:17 mircea_popescu: i'm going "you're on the cross young lady!"

13:40:29 mircea_popescu: and you dun wanna be on the cross.

13:42:01 asciilifeform: does this actually happen ?

13:42:10 mircea_popescu: the shitting ?

13:42:11 mircea_popescu: no.

13:42:24 mircea_popescu: the excruciation however, yes. i think you even saw one of the crosses.

13:42:29 asciilifeform: yeah i couldn't help but wonder if some hobby of slavegirls renders them anally incontinent

13:42:36 asciilifeform: as for the whipping posts, those are sop

13:42:47 mircea_popescu: eh that's a myth. anal sex helps continence, doth not reduce it.

13:45:23 davout: asciilifeform: gross

13:45:33 davout: can't unthink

13:46:01 mircea_popescu: wut ?

13:46:18 davout: "some hobby of slavegirls renders them anally incontinent"

13:46:31 mircea_popescu: actually... some hobby of WIVES doth render them anally incontinent

13:46:42 davout: do elaborate

13:46:43 mircea_popescu: but it's brief and blessfully resolves in the hospital.

13:46:50 davout: ah

13:46:51 davout: ic

13:46:51 mircea_popescu: most kids are born with shit in their eyes.

13:48:09 mircea_popescu: davout is all "wtf this doesn't exist. oh THAT. myeah ok, it exists."

13:48:25 mircea_popescu: apparently you CAN unthink ? :D

13:49:08 davout: heh, already heard about it, although thankfully that's not something i've witnessed

13:49:45 asciilifeform: iirc at one point it was fashionable to give the mothers enemas

13:49:56 mircea_popescu: welcome to beartraps & caltrops day on bitcoin-assets. i'll be your lovely host, with the mostly incontinent Sharon Cohen serving as my co-something or the other.

13:50:05 mircea_popescu: or at least, until hse takes a down to the knee.

13:51:18 mircea_popescu: Adlai btw, is ariel sharon totally a girl's name only to my ear ? or is it kinda lulzy in teh medinat too ?

13:51:46 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> the problem here is that we're regressing to the past (srsly, the varnish adventure is so reminiscent of "dos utilities" scene it bleeds) but with much more powerful tools and with much more societal dependency on them. << lamport's article on brokenness+helplessness leading to return to 'voodoo' methods (electronic homeopathy, sympathetic magic, all the way to prayer healing)

13:52:13 *: mircea_popescu has witnessed prayer healing in student quarters.

13:52:44 asciilifeform: works (as other placebocin) on people much better than on machines.

13:53:14 mircea_popescu: "omaigawd i have to finish this by tomorrow because i had three weeks to do it but i was busy until tonight!!111"

13:53:18 Adlai: more common as a girl's name, but it's found as both

13:53:28 mircea_popescu: Adlai but i mean... is it lulzy ?

13:53:35 mircea_popescu: or notrly observable

13:53:50 Adlai: i'd say it's lulzier that the guy just has two first names

13:53:58 mircea_popescu: lol

13:53:58 Adlai: never trust a man with no last name

13:54:14 mircea_popescu: this, btw, is a sign of being a gypsy in romania

13:54:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8500 @ 0.00029134 = 2.4764 BTC [+]

13:54:36 asciilifeform: <Adlai> never trust a man with no last name << there's a fella in '80s theoretical comp sci, worked on parallel systems iirc, who was known as simply 'arvind'

13:54:53 mircea_popescu: (mostly through historical accident : gypsy women used as whores throughout middle ages, ended up with kids without actual parentage, got "soft" father's name as it were)

13:55:27 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i thought modern gypsy has a euro-style plausible first+last for camouflage

13:55:55 mircea_popescu: i have nfi what modern gypsy even is.

13:55:59 mircea_popescu: like modern homosexual.

13:56:07 asciilifeform: sovietized ?

13:56:35 mircea_popescu: mmm... no, colonized. invaded by the tumbler, twitter etc hordes.

13:56:36 asciilifeform: (or prevented from migrating and living with pigs by some other demented ruler)

13:56:50 mircea_popescu: you know, like computing.

13:57:18 asciilifeform: not that computing wasn't invaded, but this is rather like the popular ru explanation for fall of ussr

13:57:25 asciilifeform: 'cia saboteurs'

13:57:32 Adlai: "Arvind Mithal (usually referred to as just Arvind)" well we solved that mystery

13:57:38 mircea_popescu: win.

13:57:40 asciilifeform: Adlai is a winner

13:57:49 mircea_popescu: i knew there was a reason i liked him

13:58:12 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's not saboteurs, it's kids looking for a special identity.

13:58:19 mircea_popescu: "it's not a bullet, it's fumaric acid"

13:58:25 asciilifeform: i'm fairly convinced that these were and are an opportunistic infection

13:58:30 asciilifeform: computing collapsed under own weight.

13:58:38 mircea_popescu: "can i please have the bullet then ?" "uhhh... but we don't make those anymore ? too expensive."

13:59:06 mircea_popescu: nah, imo it's septicemia not aids.

14:00:23 HeySteve: hola

14:00:36 mircea_popescu: hey

14:00:53 HeySteve: haven't been here for ages, how is everyone?

14:01:26 mircea_popescu: nb.

14:02:32 *: Adlai is busy catching up to http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=14-04-2015#1101202

14:02:32 assbot: Logged on 14-04-2015 14:26:51; *: mats is busy working through "The Misbehavior of Markets"

14:05:49 HeySteve: mircea_popescu, do you have an opinion on Uruguay as a place to live?

14:06:42 mircea_popescu: not terribru

14:10:11 Adlai: "Taaki and his sister once broke into an old hotel, stole the bibles from every room, doused them with cleaning fluid, set them on fire, and threw them down a well to see how deep it went. For that, their father never punished them."

14:10:31 mircea_popescu: mmmmmkay ?

14:10:52 Adlai: this is quite a bizarre level of mischief

14:11:41 HeySteve: the homeless hacker

14:12:25 mircea_popescu: in other news, http://three-way-dreamer.tumblr.com/post/96984757094/babygirlssweetsurrender-three-is-good

14:12:27 assbot: Beauty Of Sex ... ( http://bit.ly/1beha6h )

14:20:58 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6897 @ 0.00029068 = 2.0048 BTC [-] {2}

14:24:12 HeySteve: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/03/magazine/how-bitcoin-is-disrupting-argentinas-economy.html?_r=0

14:24:15 assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1bejYjS )

14:24:52 mircea_popescu: lmao

14:26:01 scoopbot_revived: News! The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! URL: http://fraudsters.com/2015/the-downtrodden-are-downtrodden-for-a-reason-step-on-their-faces/

14:26:01 assbot: The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1bekiPw )

14:26:46 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla might be an idea if assbot ignores scoopbot_revived

14:27:21 kakobrekla: i thought they would be friends but ok

14:29:15 mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "why are the holes not marked or filled?" << ftr this is not what i was contemplating. what I was contemplating is, why the fuck don't defaults pop up. bring back the fucking paperclip, put it the ONE place where it makes fucking sense. "hey john, I see you changed FuckOff() from bool to int. This function is called 82 places in 22 files. Would you like me to a) check all places where it's called and rep

14:29:15 mircea_popescu: ort what I can figure out about the context ? b) iterate you through all locations ? c) change it back ? d) run a trace see what happens ?"

14:30:25 mircea_popescu: the computer's job is NOT to be the fucking master, and make its own decisions a la windows. the computer's job is NOT to be a solipsistic retarded geek and just do its own thing like anal children do.

14:30:53 mircea_popescu: the computer's job is to be a most humbly abject slave, perpetually and consumatedly on its knees following you around, with the dedication and unwavering insistence no dog can summon.

14:31:02 Adlai: aha, the good old C-c C-w C-c

14:31:52 mircea_popescu: Adlai yeah, for that matter emacs does something very close to this, bar one fatal fucking flaw : pull. it should really be push.

14:32:09 mircea_popescu: i don't need to fucking remember to ask it. i can walk away from the terminal if i need some space.

14:32:48 mircea_popescu: i want it to complain to the dev about every.single.problem. EVERY SINGLE PROBLEM. and it must be as a fucking clickbox, in his face.

14:33:08 mircea_popescu: none of this "i'll fix the details later, i'm in the middle of doing sexy work now". fuck you and fuck your "ideas".

14:33:34 mircea_popescu: last time anyone "in computing" had an idea the year prefix was still 1.

14:33:49 davout: mircea_popescu kakobrekla mebbe make scoopbot_revived not mention the title and let assbot handle it?

14:34:06 *: Adlai isn't sure there was a year prefix in those days

14:34:10 mircea_popescu: just dump teh link ?

14:34:25 mircea_popescu: eh, let it be decentralized.

14:34:40 davout: mircea_popescu: sounds like each would do a small and simple job unix philosophy

14:35:02 mircea_popescu: this trivial problem just blew my stack.

14:35:08 mircea_popescu: i confess i have nfi which is the correct approach.

14:35:19 davout: sounds better to remove code from scoopbot rather than add some conditional logic to assbot

14:35:47 *: mircea_popescu steps away slowly and in terror, letting the parties involved decide.

14:35:51 kakobrekla: the thing is that fucking conditional code is already in place as well

14:36:07 kakobrekla: for some other bots

14:36:24 davout: just my two cents

14:36:25 mircea_popescu: i would definitely read the essay discussing the merits of either side. i just realised i actually don't grok this shit.

14:37:05 Adlai: seems parsimonious that in a channel where a bot announces link titles, there's no need to supply them yourself

14:37:11 davout: because then what happens when scoopbot_revived is replaced by scoopbot_x or whatever

14:37:25 kakobrekla: davout you mean again

14:37:27 kakobrekla: :)

14:37:27 mircea_popescu: what happens if assbot dies ? we must lose scoopbot titling too ?

14:37:39 davout: assbot never diez

14:37:46 mircea_popescu: decentralisation contrary to parsimony

14:37:48 mircea_popescu: fancy that.

14:38:35 davout: i'm really too lazy to argue further, i just tend to remove code instead of adding more whenever i can get what i want either of those ways

14:38:44 mircea_popescu: no, i can definitely see your point.

14:39:00 mircea_popescu: what bothers me is that i see no way to either dismiss it, or pick it.

14:39:31 davout: my point?

14:39:36 mircea_popescu: yes,

14:39:51 mircea_popescu: "take it out of scoopbot instead"

14:40:16 davout: I KNOW! LET'S REWRITE SCOOPBOT IN COMMON LISP!

14:40:17 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11100 @ 0.00029619 = 3.2877 BTC [+]

14:41:31 mircea_popescu: gabriel_laddel "Why isn't there grammer/spellchecking for my comments? " << this i can readily answer. because I am what's called "a creator of language", which is to say one of those people who, through his usage, ENACTS the rules all amateur users of language MUST follow, as a mark of their linguistic inferiority. like fucking shakespeare.

14:41:42 mircea_popescu: and consequently the notion of "spellchecker" is undefined for me.

14:42:11 mircea_popescu: it has nothing to check against, i gotta do it by hand.

14:42:28 mircea_popescu: (and yes editors, which fraudsters doth employ, send the corrections with "did you mean to X" half the fucking time)

14:42:35 davout: ;;calc 70138217/25000

14:42:36 gribble: 2805.52868

14:44:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10234 @ 0.00029627 = 3.032 BTC [+] {2}

14:50:16 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115386 << dawg, go make a web server i can use, who's keeping you!!11

14:50:16 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:30:19; gabriel_laddel: Just trying to point MP at something

14:51:16 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115395 << fancy that! and i spent eight hours massaging apache and varnish into wortking together, only to discover that about 10% of the time, IP fields were reliably replaced with random data form the session.

14:51:16 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:33:47; gabriel_laddel: I'll note that I wrote a prototype for the RPC described above - ran into an issue with TCP or the library I was using it from. Messages were disappearing in flight.

14:51:34 mircea_popescu: we're like brothers off the same mother over here. and check out how variant the fathers!

14:51:41 mircea_popescu: i suppose we should go beat her up, stupid fucking whore.

14:52:46 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115401 < bwahahaha

14:52:46 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:35:59; gabriel_laddel: Portage has a USE flag (what is that? Idk, some nonsense abstraction) for docs so you can tell it to build all docs, but it gets caught in cyclic dependencies atm.

14:54:31 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12400 @ 0.00029677 = 3.6799 BTC [+] {2}

15:00:17 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> the computer's job is NOT to be the fucking master, and make its own decisions a la windows. the computer's job is NOT to be a solipsistic retarded geek and just do its own thing like anal children do ... the computer's job is to be a most humbly abject slave, perpetually and consumatedly on its knees following you around, with the dedication and unwavering insistence no dog can summon << obligatory http://ww

15:00:18 asciilifeform: w.loper-os.org/?p=284

15:00:28 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115422 << this, i will point out, is in no way related to any inherent property of either (unless you mean lisp is inherently going to fail), but simply a function of context. had the linux kernel been implemented in sclb, and had the past 20 years been spent with scbl being "the cool language", you'd be having zhe pronouns and assorted idiocy to the tune of > 10 mn lines

15:00:28 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 07:42:58; gabriel_laddel: ~398k LoC vs. >14 million

15:00:28 mircea_popescu: in scbl, and c would be what c was in the 70s. ie, coupla hundred k's.

15:01:45 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> it has nothing to check against, i gotta do it by hand. << you can edit the dict you know

15:02:01 mircea_popescu: except my usage is np

15:02:24 mircea_popescu: there isn't a way to write a program that can import a dict and fix my grammar.

15:02:34 asciilifeform: grammar no

15:02:34 mircea_popescu: and if I write the dict, there isn't a way to write a program that can import it at all.

15:02:39 asciilifeform: orthograph yes

15:02:47 mircea_popescu: nope.

15:03:08 mircea_popescu: fraudsters is filled with examples : i spell this the french way this time for stylistic reasons. what now ?

15:03:30 mircea_popescu: what do you do if i say differance once ?

15:03:41 asciilifeform: limited use case for orthograph checker - pick up turds that are solely from finger slippage

15:03:47 mircea_popescu: this spellchecker underlines it. nevertheless... diff?rance

15:03:57 mircea_popescu: but that does not actually do the job does it.

15:04:08 *: asciilifeform confesses to being largely innocent of auto language checking paraphernalia

15:04:14 *: asciilifeform uses own meat

15:04:21 mircea_popescu: metoo. but i also know why.

15:04:24 mircea_popescu: deliberately innocent.

15:04:31 asciilifeform: well yes deliberately

15:05:32 asciilifeform: <mircea_popescu> ... and had the past 20 years been spent with scbl being "the cool language", you'd be having zhe pronouns and assorted idiocy to the tune of > 10 mn lines << the whole 'k00l d00dz' phenomenon begins from broken systems, though there is a feedback loop

15:05:55 asciilifeform: when there is -nothing- for an idiot kid to do - the damage isn't done.

15:06:12 mircea_popescu: it does not. it drives broken systems, as naggum explains : http://fraudsters.com/2014/what-the-wot-is-for-how-it-works-and-how-to-use-it/#footnote_6_53927

15:06:13 assbot: What the WoT is for, how it works and how to use it. on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ink4TS )

15:06:16 asciilifeform: but when there is plethora of loose ends and misfeatures - plenty

15:06:42 mircea_popescu: the incentives are badly alligned, and the habit of beating children (a subcase of, oppressing the oppressed FOR THE REASON that they're already oppressed) went out

15:07:06 mircea_popescu: but THIS is what the utility of that ancient "horror' and "unexplainable ancient cruelty" was : it kept this very significant problem of badly alligned incentives in check.

15:09:13 asciilifeform: as pictured in, e.g., mircea_popescu's article 'art of punishment' (ro?)

15:09:27 mircea_popescu: i think i translated it.

15:09:44 mircea_popescu: in any case : the mechanism im contemplating is this

15:10:25 mircea_popescu: a) idiot interacts with system ; b) idiot forms malformed internal representation of system ; c) sane person has no incentive to fix b) ; d) system evolves ~always~ to match its representations.

15:10:56 mircea_popescu: this is unresolvable, except if one actually and deliberately enacts the positive feedback loop of "torture those in pain, beat those with welts on their body" etc.

15:11:30 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu forgot e) sane person adds kludge to enable some semblance of civilization to function, creating schizoid split and opening would that bleeds complexity

15:11:36 mircea_popescu: ayup.

15:11:45 asciilifeform: *opening wound

15:11:56 mircea_popescu: if this mechanism is correct, then it follows that yes, the only reason gabriel_laddel thinks much of scbl is that no one else does.

15:12:07 mircea_popescu: much like how this place is readable PRECISELY because it's not facebook or w/e.

15:12:23 mircea_popescu: which has been an early theoretical proposition which we've so far been verifying.

15:14:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6303 @ 0.00029781 = 1.8771 BTC [+]

15:15:14 mircea_popescu: in any case, it is perfectly wrong to imagine scbl has the magical quality of magical quality (and then move on once the horde shows it trivially breaks). for one thing, c was a very intellectually respectable thing, back when i was a kid.

15:15:19 mircea_popescu: of course, that was before C#

15:20:19 jurov: yea, it was respectable when compiler was less clever than programmer

15:20:36 mircea_popescu: i wonder if that's what it was.

15:20:43 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform load average: 0.00, 0.01, 0.01 << what sort of great moment is this!

15:24:00 ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> [13:23] that's prolly put i nthere special for shooting down ben_vulpes dating attempts in kindergarten. << i dun get it

15:24:17 mircea_popescu: tango ? yahoo chat ? 80s ?

15:25:13 ben_vulpes: nope still not computing

15:26:02 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: great moment shall come on me lunch break.

15:26:04 asciilifeform: l0l

15:26:07 mircea_popescu: the string "tango" was for ununderstood reasons banned on a very popular (among the females) chat application of the 80s, at a time you'rew supposed to have been in kindergarten.

15:26:20 *: asciilifeform promises to wake up mircea_popescu for great moment(tm)

15:26:23 mircea_popescu: it is humorously posited that this is the very explanation : they were trying to crimp your style specifically.

15:27:28 mircea_popescu: "you're supposed to have been", jesus who the fuck came up with english grammar. "o i know, we'll save on predicative modes!!1"

15:27:41 ben_vulpes: finding tango partners online is like 1/1000000th as good a use of time as finding bdsm partners

15:27:58 mircea_popescu: everything worked better on yahoo chat

15:27:59 mircea_popescu: :D

15:28:22 mircea_popescu: heck, even md5!

15:31:05 ben_vulpes: <asciilifeform> [00:54] how the everliving fuck is cpanel used with anything other than php/static wwwtron << fwiw asciilifeform i went through a very similar saga on a very similar popescuian box. i just thought that "this was how things were supposed to be" and labored in silence.

15:31:26 mircea_popescu: didja get anywhere ?

15:31:28 ben_vulpes: probably how you derp around the machine shop

15:31:44 ben_vulpes: yeah, the thing ran, and well if you recall.

15:31:54 mircea_popescu: aha. well that puts you ahead of alf :D

15:32:11 mircea_popescu: at any rate, THIS is why i ask people "well, can you do it on a cpanel box" well before.

15:33:16 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115501 << this distinction only exists as a manifestation of the speaker's cluelessness, otherwise military logic is perfectly logical.

15:33:16 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:01:08; *: Adlai always found "business logic" reminiscent of "military logic" in the necessity of distinguishing it from plain simple old "logic"

15:33:19 mircea_popescu: in the c way of logic.

15:34:07 mircea_popescu: ie, "you go design a better army and a better war over there with your wooden horse, toy sword and military costume, while we're gonna beat these assholes over here"

15:35:07 mircea_popescu: paulgraham.com fucking autoreloads itself wtf spammy idiocy is this.

15:40:24 mircea_popescu: "Confirmation can be tricky depending on what you mean by it. It?s trivially true but most people understand it to be interrupting confirmation. Which is egregiously ? reprehensible. Despicable even."

15:40:26 mircea_popescu: ahahaha.

15:40:35 mircea_popescu: fuck you and click the boxen, "creative" boi

15:45:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7500 @ 0.00029923 = 2.2442 BTC [+]

15:47:12 davout: mircea_popescu: s/différance/différence/

15:47:51 mircea_popescu: mno.

15:48:06 mircea_popescu: that being, amusingly enough, exactly the point.

15:49:05 davout: ah that was on purpose frenchified english

15:49:17 mircea_popescu: mno. it works in french too.

15:49:41 mircea_popescu: the reason "diff?rance" exists is (in the context of our discussion) exactly to show that the spellchecker problem is np

15:50:48 davout: from what I find it's a neologism from jacques derrida

15:51:13 mircea_popescu: it's a production of derrida working on husserl, yes.

15:53:24 mircea_popescu: (this may be a polichinelle's secret for which everyone here just happens to be polichinelle, but : the history of discussion, problems and criticism of languages as approached by IT types almost exactly mirrors a very similar effort in teh humanities)

15:54:04 mircea_popescu: that either side is generally ignorant of the equivalencies is nothing short of hysterical, but hey. "specialisation drives performance", i'm told.

16:08:21 mats: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/03/magazine/how-bitcoin-is-disrupting-argentinas-economy.html << lol

16:08:24 assbot: Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/1dsYrWg )

16:08:37 mats: special appearance by brendafdez

16:19:13 BingoBoingo: "The hardest part was often reaching Fern?ndez and Castiglione. ?I had to call Brenda four times today,? she said with a smile." << lol

16:24:38 mod6: asciilifeform: I'm just trying to put together the monthy address; In one to three sentences cna you help me summarize what is going on with glibc/libnss?

16:24:41 mod6: !up asciilifeform

16:24:47 mod6: !up ascii_field

16:24:52 ascii_field: danke mod6

16:24:55 mod6: np

16:26:56 jurov: mod6 i can explain, too. to support different configurations for DNS/users/whatever resolving without glibc recompilation and without interprocess communication

16:27:14 jurov: the libnss was done as binary plugin to glibc

16:27:28 jurov: and whole mechanism is non-optional

16:27:37 mod6: ok maybe that's the part I was missing - how libnss is somehow tied to glibc.

16:27:44 jurov: thus truly statical compilation of glibc is impossbile

16:28:12 mod6: so libnss is dynamically compiled and built/linked to glibc, and can not be avoided?

16:28:15 ascii_field: !s libnss

16:28:16 assbot: 7 results for 'libnss' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=libnss

16:28:16 jurov: (and btw, it's different from mozilla's libnss)

16:28:19 mircea_popescu: ~whether one even uses libnss or not~!

16:28:24 ascii_field: or is log still b0rk3d

16:28:36 ascii_field: and no, nothing to do with the mozilla one

16:28:45 mod6: it's not broke from the web-perspective. i've just read so much stuff that I've confused myself.

16:28:53 jurov: iirc alf avoided it somehow, while throwing out all DNS stuff, too

16:29:09 mod6: is that releated to his patch that removes the dns stuff?

16:29:09 ascii_field: jurov: the dependency vanishes if you remove -all- instances of host lookup

16:29:30 ascii_field: the patch, note, did not remove all (there is a 'what is my ip' thing in there )

16:30:13 mod6: http://thebitcoin.foundation/ml/btc-dev/2015-February/000040.html << this?

16:30:14 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1dt5z5c )

16:30:25 ascii_field: aha

16:30:38 ascii_field: note, written prior to the discovery of the libnss thing

16:30:58 mod6: ok, so that helps us going forward then.

16:31:09 mod6: yup, noted.

16:31:53 mod6: we were on track at that point to try to cut a milestone. but just about that time is when we hit the tx validation problem in 168`000 ; I think your patch just got lost in the shuffle.

16:32:02 mod6: :/

16:32:49 mod6: Anyway, going forward, we've got something to work around this issue. So, thanks for that.

16:33:56 mod6: <+ascii_field> the patch, note, did not remove all (there is a 'what is my ip' thing in there ) << ah, i recall. ok and this is what initiated the conversation about SHA256 addy's as opposd to dotted quads right?

16:37:24 mod6: <+mircea_popescu> ~whether one even uses libnss or not~! << so even if we didn't even call "whatsMyIP()" or w/e it is, this would still be a dingleberry attached to glibc.

16:37:27 mod6: ?

16:38:32 mod6: Anyway, thanks guise. I think that helps me clear a few things up.

16:38:40 ascii_field: mod6: go build 'helloworld' and see if it stays depended

16:38:42 ascii_field: (it doesn't)

16:40:06 mircea_popescu: mod6 what i mean is, for as long as you use any sort of function touched, whether you yourself use any of the libnss "functionality" or not, its gonna be there

16:40:18 ascii_field: mircea_popescu has it

16:40:30 mod6: ok got it.

16:41:14 mircea_popescu: you can't go "oh i don't use libnss anyway". you probably are.

16:53:12 mod6: <+jurov> the libnss was done as binary plugin to glibc << so there is no possible way to just build glibc by hand and not include libnss? or there are basically so many things that use libnss that even if you did, stuff wouldn't work anyway?

16:53:43 jurov: i haven't explored it to that depth

16:54:07 mircea_popescu: mod6 building glibcc "by hand" is not the trivial taks you make it out.

16:54:19 mircea_popescu: piles of crud in there.

16:54:19 scoopbot_revived: News! The Fetlife Meatlist - Volume VII URL: http://fraudsters.com/2015/the-fetlife-meatlist-volume-vii/

16:54:20 assbot: The Fetlife Meatlist - Volume VII on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtdHCF )

16:54:30 mod6: im sure it's not. just was sort of thinking about it in some context of "roll your own environment"

16:55:34 mircea_popescu: yeah but then you end up with something that works for you

16:55:43 mircea_popescu: and then... x person says this doesn't work. what now ?

16:55:52 mod6: and only on your machine.

16:55:54 mod6: ok right.

16:56:03 mircea_popescu: i mean i am all for a cannonical b-a stack

16:56:07 mod6: since this discussion, im gonna go back and re-read these logs.

16:56:15 mircea_popescu: but it can't be started from the glibc i don't think. that's the middle.

16:57:40 mod6: sure.

16:57:51 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115595 << is your complaint the lack of koolaid in this place ?!

16:57:51 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:33:16; gabriel_laddel: I'm simply of the opinion that our current platform (irc) is too barbaric and doesn't force enough shared context upon us to do anything interesting. Any sort of shared vision or whatever gets watered down into discussions like the above.

16:58:37 mircea_popescu: there's a balance to be had between "shared context" and "mass hysteria". a meeting of autonomous minds is one of the very best ways to achieve that balance.

16:58:44 mircea_popescu: barbaric, perhaps, but kingly for sure, this irc.

16:59:16 mircea_popescu: so love thy cycles, for they are a supreme good.

17:00:07 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115605 << because you don't have a blog. get a blog.

17:00:07 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:36:13; gabriel_laddel: why?

17:00:35 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28411 @ 0.00029941 = 8.5065 BTC [+] {3}

17:02:12 mod6: !up ascii_field

17:02:37 mircea_popescu: http://41.media.tumblr.com/30197ce3b8a2aa706dd3913040a1c838/tumblr_n9lah9zqCj1sfkfqio1_1280.jpg << the best thing in unix is the pipe.

17:02:39 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgNImX )

17:03:06 ascii_field: l0l!

17:04:00 mod6: haha, is that a reverse-stocks of somesort?

17:04:38 mircea_popescu: well... plenty of subjects are actually rather cooperative, which makes the instruments more... ergonomic.

17:05:01 mod6: ah, i see.

17:05:19 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115613 << dude srsly. GET A BLOG ALREADY.

17:05:19 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:38:32; gabriel_laddel: "I need the ability to publish a unit of research as an interactive program containing all information used to draw my conclusions. It shall be entirely and trivially modifiable, extensible, and if reproducing the research is possible on this machine, running the program shall be a single click or procedure call away. WYSIWYG tools shall be included and fashioned from the precepts of geometry. Thus,

17:05:23 mircea_popescu: this is EXACTLY what a blog is.

17:06:03 trinque: I was drunk enough to deal with him at the time :D

17:06:25 trinque: mircea_popescu: yes html does sort of what he's talking about

17:06:34 mircea_popescu: not "html". blogs specifically.

17:06:48 trinque: ah

17:06:51 mircea_popescu: i have the fucking body of research all published, which is why i can always link

17:07:14 trinque: indeed

17:07:14 mircea_popescu: he's sitting over there going "hmm.... i would need something like a tube... but with fins on it... yeah that's right, two large fins..."

17:07:20 mircea_popescu: derp. ITS CALLED A PLANE!

17:07:28 trinque: this is the guy working on a distro?

17:07:36 mircea_popescu: why not ?

17:07:49 trinque: "tits or gtfo" as far as that goes

17:08:43 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9200 @ 0.00029732 = 2.7353 BTC [-] {2}

17:08:54 mircea_popescu: obviously what's blinding him to this is the expectations that machines could process it. this trivially can never be the case.

17:09:57 mircea_popescu: "Attend our Remote coding school for as little as $2,780." omfg wtf.

17:10:30 mats: http://www.eurexchange.com/exchange-en/products/int/fix/government-bonds/Euro-Bund-Futures/14770

17:10:31 assbot: Eurex - Euro-Bund Futures ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgQl8g )

17:10:37 mats: euro debt having a bad day

17:11:03 mats: http://www.eurexchange.com/exchange-en/products/int/fix/government-bonds/Euro-Bobl-Futures/15644

17:11:05 assbot: Eurex - Euro-Bobl Futures ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgQvfG )

17:11:55 mircea_popescu: "The studious will note that this is a completely solved problem that no machine learning algorithm will be able to approximate anytime soon." i'm sorry...what ? solved how ?

17:12:02 mircea_popescu: and why the fuck am i referencing pastebins.

17:12:21 mircea_popescu: mats yeh eurozone is benefiting from "russian sanctions"

17:13:48 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.0016007 = 1.6007 BTC [-]

17:15:43 mats: got ma popcorn ready

17:18:27 mircea_popescu: " When the "people" of earth finally get the message that brainpower is the limiting regent in life they'll soon start to change their tune - or find themselves living in a ~leper colony/africa." << this is not how things work

17:18:40 mircea_popescu: "when water stops being wet it'll suddenly seek dryness". sure. wut ?

17:20:46 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115624 << prolly should go with frank the ditch

17:20:46 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 08:40:59; assbot: DNA/Frank The Vandal ... ( http://bit.ly/1zcsgnS )

17:22:20 vhost-: Adlai: haha

17:28:29 *: mircea_popescu 's dislike of Douglas Adams slowly solidifies.

17:30:05 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6000 @ 0.0002962 = 1.7772 BTC [-]

17:34:31 williamdunne: ;;later tell kakobrekla would it be possible for w.b-a.link/some/parameters to return valid JSON?

17:34:31 gribble: The operation succeeded.

17:36:52 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115645 << lmao

17:36:52 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 10:25:18; punkman: also, cab driver: "check out the hottie over there" *honks* "oh shit that was my cousin. damn she lost a lot of weight"

17:39:51 mircea_popescu: # history | grep -c "reboot"

17:39:51 mircea_popescu: 6

17:39:56 mircea_popescu: check out the windows developer over here.

17:40:40 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

17:40:53 ascii_field: motherfucking rc.local doesn't run on boot in this ver of rathead

17:41:01 mircea_popescu: must be the cpanel.

17:41:10 ascii_field: lsdpanel

17:42:16 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3629 @ 0.00029631 = 1.0753 BTC [+] {2}

17:48:22 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.00169179 = 1.6918 BTC [+] {9}

17:48:49 ascii_field: http://hackingdude.com/2015/04/29/wordpress-zero-day-vulnerability/

17:48:50 assbot: WordPress Zero Day Vulnerability - Hacking Dude Hacking Dude ... ( http://bit.ly/1P76N1H )

17:49:28 jurov: williamdunne: you mean w.b-a.link/trust/some/else/json? yes that could return {} instead of "no data"

17:49:48 williamdunne: jurov: Yeah that'd work perfectly

17:50:00 williamdunne: Basically some way to get json on the trust between two people

17:50:13 trinque: ascii_field: ouch

17:59:15 jurov: williamdunne: but in cases where ther is data, it works

17:59:55 williamdunne: Oh wow

18:00:00 williamdunne: Missed that one

18:00:15 williamdunne: !up scooptest

18:02:27 scoopbot_revived: News! Scoop Test URL: http://thethug.life/scoop-test/

18:02:28 assbot: Scoop Test — Lego Under the Giant's Feet ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtBkLw )

18:04:43 williamdunne: !up scooptest

18:06:02 danielpbarron: !up mhagelstrom

18:06:02 scooptest: The Fetlife Meatlist - Volume VII http://fraudsters.com/feed/rss/

18:06:05 scooptest: The downtrodden are downtrodden for a reason. Step on their faces! http://fraudsters.com/feed/rss/

18:06:27 mircea_popescu: "The vulnerability affects the WordPress versions 3.9.3, 4.1.1, 4.1.2, and the latest WordPress version 4.2."

18:06:27 scooptest: The sad story of me sniffing varnish http://fraudsters.com/feed/rss/

18:06:30 mircea_popescu: 2.x immune.

18:06:30 scooptest: Chtulhu emerges! http://fraudsters.com/feed/rss/

18:06:31 williamdunne: Welp, thats not ideal

18:06:31 scooptest: What amused me today http://fraudsters.com/feed/rss/

18:06:59 mircea_popescu: "Moreover, Pynnonen reported the vulnerability to the WordPress team but they ?refused all communication attempts? he made since November 2014." heh

18:07:00 cazalla: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfxl0-sgJE0

18:07:01 assbot: Fox 10 And Friends - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtCCWD )

18:07:01 mircea_popescu: "no ddos possible

18:09:07 ascii_field: l0l guess who else isn't affected.

18:09:15 ascii_field: (for same reason as mircea_popescu)

18:09:19 mircea_popescu: mmmyeah.

18:09:40 mhagelstrom: I guess I can talk now

18:09:43 mircea_popescu: see, the exact thing happening in bitcoin, where the power rangers fell off the curve, happened long ago to wordpress.

18:10:04 mircea_popescu: the notion that their "latest" is used or relevant is teh lulz.

18:10:10 mircea_popescu: mhagelstrom and who might you be ?

18:11:01 jurov: !up ascii_field

18:11:02 scoopbot_revived: News! Tsinghua University Creates a "Digital Assets Research Initiative" URL: http://qntra.net/2015/04/tsinghua-university-creates-a-digital-assets-research-initiative/

18:11:03 assbot: Tsinghua University Creates a "Digital Assets Research Initiative" | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtDSJk )

18:14:01 mircea_popescu: mhagelstrom PGP: 548A 84F8 60CF E0AB EA11 A2BA 4D34 0126 F402 0636 ?

18:14:16 davout: BingoBoingo: s/heals/heels/

18:14:39 mhagelstrom: mircea_popescu yes that is me

18:14:49 mircea_popescu: aite, go register it with assbot

18:14:49 BingoBoingo: dammit, fxd

18:14:51 mircea_popescu: !h

18:14:51 assbot: http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot

18:15:32 mhagelstrom: mircea_popescu that is my public key

18:15:38 mircea_popescu: right.

18:20:53 mircea_popescu: in the strange news line, http://www.perfil.com/sociedad/El-misterio-de-una-chica-que-estuvo-16-horas-desaparecida-20141107-0053.html

18:20:58 assbot: El misterio de una chica que estuvo 16 horas desaparecida ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtGI0W )

18:26:10 mircea_popescu: ascii_field load average: 0.40, 0.54, 0.30 what speed is that ?

18:26:27 ascii_field: mircea_popescu has nothing better to do ?

18:26:40 ascii_field: srsly

18:26:42 mircea_popescu: shuddup i'm sysadmining :D

18:28:20 *: mircea_popescu is really curious what gcd over rsa keys actually looks like in terms of resource consumption.

18:28:30 ascii_field: mircea_popescu is also invited to read the src

18:28:38 ascii_field: which happens to be sitting there

18:29:05 mircea_popescu: apparently i just got rebooted outta da box!

18:29:15 *: ascii_field presently trying to discover why the fucker runs from anywhere -other- than crontab

18:29:19 mircea_popescu: anyway, off to eat, will flyplow with this more later.

18:29:24 ascii_field: and 'internal server error' otherwise

18:30:26 mircea_popescu: uh

18:30:35 *: ascii_field thinks he discovered reason

18:30:55 ascii_field: when phuctor coldboots it regens the product over the moduli

18:31:01 ascii_field: (which is kept in ram at all times)

18:31:13 ascii_field: this locks db

18:31:34 ascii_field: or hm, apparently not

18:32:08 *: ascii_field discovers that he was not this retarded when having written the thing

18:32:55 mircea_popescu: you know ~why~ it's kinda exciting to watch this, right ?

18:33:01 ascii_field: l0l

18:34:23 ascii_field: found idiocy, will describe later if anyone gives a shit

18:36:13 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4550 @ 0.00030068 = 1.3681 BTC [+]

18:36:14 scoopbot_revived: News! X.EUR July 23rd 2014 statement URL: http://fr.anco.is/2014/x-eur-july-23rd-2014-statement/

18:36:51 davout: scoopbot_revived: totally news yo

18:37:03 mod6: heheh

18:37:15 *: davout doesn't quite get why ascii_field is so deep in cpanhell

18:37:19 mod6: did they hassle you about the meat?

18:37:29 ascii_field: davout: was

18:37:37 davout: mod6: nope, should have brought moar back

18:37:43 mod6: nice

18:37:54 davout: ascii_field: so you're done or you switched to something else?

18:40:25 ascii_field: davout: mircea_popescu had the box decrufted

18:41:01 ascii_field: davout: just now i took a moment to set up on that box, and ran into a few boojums

18:41:25 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

18:42:02 jurov: not so long ago, i have found alf a box, he declined. now he has to take whetever there is.

18:42:11 ascii_field: jurov wanted me to pay money, l0l

18:42:21 mircea_popescu: omfg its a great box what!

18:42:32 jurov: s.nsa is not your money

18:42:50 ascii_field: jurov: i don't deal in monotonic guaranteed trips to penury

18:44:04 mats: lol

18:44:13 mats: such drama

18:44:21 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7409 @ 0.00030068 = 2.2277 BTC [-]

18:44:46 ascii_field: anyway it works...

18:44:50 mircea_popescu: no ?!

18:44:58 jurov: i invested 100BTC into s.nsa.. to see penury mentioned in relation to ordinary business expenses?

18:45:01 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: i haven't moved the domain yet

18:45:21 mircea_popescu: jurov he really doesnt wanna spend moneyz.

18:45:34 jurov: i'm at loss of words.

18:45:34 ascii_field: jurov: i'll refresh memory for ancient thread. mircea_popescu has it - i refuse to add recurring expenses when there is no revenue.

18:45:40 mircea_popescu: ascii_field i meant just the churning, is it going ?

18:45:41 ascii_field: this is what 'monotonic trip to the basement' means

18:45:58 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: it will churn if you submit a new key or req retest of an existing key

18:45:58 scoopbot_revived: News! Scoop Testr URL: http://thethug.life/retrial/

18:45:59 assbot: Scoop Testr — Lego Under the Giant's Feet ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtNC6t )

18:46:00 ascii_field: as specced

18:46:07 mircea_popescu: jurov i can see it, can't go out of business by not spending.

18:46:08 jurov: so shut up and eat cpanel

18:46:21 mircea_popescu: it;s just a plain centos dood.

18:46:23 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8697 @ 0.00029613 = 2.5754 BTC [-]

18:46:31 ascii_field: jurov: l0l that was last night's thing. today we have normal box. which i just finished setting up.

18:46:33 ascii_field: correctly.

18:46:54 mircea_popescu: i'll go through the correct centos and poke fun at engineer later.

18:47:22 ascii_field: anyway it works. time to move the dns

18:49:39 jurov: williamdunne: scoopbot_revived is not cloaked

18:49:48 williamdunne: jurov: Never has been

18:50:43 mircea_popescu: williamdunne yo ugettingflooded ?

18:50:54 williamdunne: Nope, not yet anyway

18:51:48 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: dns switched over, will propagate eventually

18:51:58 ascii_field: happy phuctoring, fellas.

18:52:15 mircea_popescu: so mebbe i dun understand something, but wasn't it going to process the however many gb archive ?

18:52:22 jurov: what was the url?

18:52:23 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: when i pump it in!

18:52:35 mircea_popescu: o you plan todo over http ?

18:52:50 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: yes, as a kind of torture test. anyone should be able to do this

18:52:56 ascii_field: without talking to me

18:52:59 mircea_popescu: ah ok

18:53:17 mircea_popescu: i imagined it's just gonna get done locally for expediency. but hey, tests are great.

18:53:22 ascii_field: i'm about to switch off the old one

18:53:29 mircea_popescu: anyway, THATs why i kept asking.

18:53:35 ascii_field: aaaaahahahaha

18:53:36 ascii_field: l0l

18:53:46 mircea_popescu: well... that and ... other reasons.

18:54:15 ascii_field: woah 535 day uptime.

18:54:27 mircea_popescu: jurov http://nosuchlabs.com/

18:54:27 assbot: Submit a GPG Public Key | Phuctor ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwS1g5 )

18:54:38 ascii_field: except not propagated yet

18:55:05 jurov: i see archive.today (195.211.154.159), that's the old one?

18:55:14 ascii_field: new

18:55:19 mircea_popescu: ;; ANSWER SECTION:

18:55:20 mircea_popescu: nosuchlabs.com. 1800 IN A 195.211.154.159

18:55:20 gribble: Error: "ANSWER" is not a valid command.

18:55:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6676 @ 0.00029616 = 1.9772 BTC [+]

18:55:53 mircea_popescu: welcome to the year not being 2005 anymore, ya know ?

18:55:59 mircea_popescu: dns propagation's a minute nowadays.

18:56:09 ascii_field: l0l wut

18:56:33 *: ascii_field prepares voodoo curse for 'namecheap'

18:56:45 jurov: heh

18:57:08 mircea_popescu: yeah srsly someone should make a decent registrar

18:57:14 mircea_popescu: o wait, we're obsoleting dns huh. nm.

18:57:20 mod6: :]

18:57:26 ascii_field: 'decent registrar' is like 'decent gasenwagen'

18:57:38 ascii_field: existing ones are 'decent' from perspective of usg et al.

18:58:13 jurov: just compile namecoin into libnss.so :DDDD

18:58:15 mircea_popescu: is .fuck taken anyway ? or .cunt ?

18:58:28 mircea_popescu: http://beer.cunt

18:59:29 mircea_popescu: Submissions: 3930 Known Moduli: 6642

19:00:05 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: propagated on your end?

19:00:10 ascii_field: over here - no

19:00:14 mircea_popescu: ascii_field Click here (big!) << could be replaced with Click here (28588 digits) ?

19:00:27 mircea_popescu: ascii_field yes, its what i said above. and you're probably just caching locally.

19:00:33 mircea_popescu: dump the cache it'll respond correctly.

19:02:43 jurov: http://nosuchlabs.com/static/prod.txt would deserve some spiffy visualization...any mathematician with idea?

19:02:46 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1dtQTmm )

19:03:43 mircea_popescu: ya srsly.

19:05:05 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if you're reading the thing, you will notice there are two processes (one which actually does the work, 'werker'.)

19:11:42 ascii_field: finally propagated here

19:13:27 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

19:14:51 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15175 @ 0.00029562 = 4.486 BTC [-] {3}

19:15:15 mircea_popescu: well im sitting on top, so.

19:15:26 mircea_popescu: all ready over here :D

19:15:31 ascii_field: aha worx

19:16:06 ascii_field: next when i get a moment i'ma cook up a proper jinxed keypair

19:16:12 mircea_popescu: nono

19:16:18 mircea_popescu: just dump the db in plox

19:16:18 ascii_field: because the 'under construction' thing is disgraceful

19:16:49 ascii_field: and naturally will dump db in

19:17:05 mircea_popescu: i wanna see if this'll actually work practically or not for the purpose.

19:23:40 mircea_popescu: Error: Was that really a GPG public key? Try again.

19:23:41 mircea_popescu: ahem

19:24:04 ascii_field: lol wut

19:24:07 ascii_field: who?

19:24:08 mircea_popescu: ascii_field doesn't seem to work

19:24:14 ascii_field: dpaste plz

19:24:16 mircea_popescu: http://pool.sks-keyservers.net:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x454B0FC0BC07B87E for instance.

19:24:17 assbot: Public Key Server -- Get "0x454b0fc0bc07b87e " ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwWTSj )

19:24:26 mircea_popescu: nor http://pool.sks-keyservers.net:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x59C93F63549036BD

19:24:27 assbot: Public Key Server -- Get "0x59c93f63549036bd " ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwWXkX )

19:25:02 ascii_field: wtf

19:25:21 mircea_popescu: must be teh cpanel

19:25:25 ascii_field: l0l

19:25:42 mircea_popescu: lol

19:25:57 cazalla: anyone know what's going on here - http://dpaste.com/3D4ZXZR.txt

19:25:58 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwXbZu )

19:26:15 trinque: bad disk?

19:26:30 mircea_popescu: cazalla bad index

19:26:47 mircea_popescu: looks like typical bitcoind that was shut down suddenly

19:27:07 cazalla: been running fine for a while but now, same problems i had a few months back :\

19:27:52 mircea_popescu: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/2785 << sometimes it fixes itself :D

19:27:53 assbot: ChainState DB uncorrupted itself · Issue #2785 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwXrHN )

19:28:55 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: some serious strange. those keys work on my local box's phuctor, identical sourceball

19:29:21 mircea_popescu: ascii_field prolly http posting fuckx them up

19:29:27 ascii_field: nono

19:29:33 ascii_field: likewise http

19:29:38 ascii_field: running copy of the thing locally

19:30:14 mircea_popescu: differnet http stacks eh. you running centos locally ?

19:30:22 ascii_field: course not

19:30:31 mircea_popescu: what, you expect things to just work ?

19:30:50 mircea_popescu: the internet's not a truck, where yo ucan just dump stuff you know!

19:31:03 *: ascii_field begins to drool, like the flea-bitten characters in film 'city of lost children'

19:32:01 mircea_popescu: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Series_of_Tubes_-_Senator_Ted_Stevens.ogg

19:32:02 assbot: File:Series of Tubes - Senator Ted Stevens.ogg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwY5oI )

19:34:13 BingoBoingo: http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--WA-gckbI--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/enneopevmant8ohbidxa.gif

19:34:15 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwYlEa )

19:35:15 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: it doesn't eat any key, lol

19:35:21 ascii_field: motherfuckers.

19:35:26 mircea_popescu: yep won't even see mine

19:35:28 mircea_popescu: tho it's in db

19:35:36 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo what is that ?

19:35:50 mircea_popescu: ascii_field maybe if i install varnish ?

19:36:25 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: He's flipping the ball into the stands for the fans... Who aren't there because Baltimore, playing the game with an empty stadium because riots

19:36:32 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: l0l!

19:37:10 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo so this is by now completely insane.

19:38:15 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: It truly is. Guy's probably just flipping the ball into the stands out of habit, but seriously in the middle of the day they can't have spectators because... riots?

19:38:27 BingoBoingo: Not actual riots, but just the fear of riots

19:38:42 mircea_popescu: http://www.dailydot.com/lifestyle/fetlife-bdsm-meat-list-consent/ << how to write about mp without linking fraudsters.

19:38:43 assbot: The BDSM version of Facebook is under attack for ignoring women's safety concerns ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERUR4h )

19:38:51 ascii_field: 'zero length field name in format'

19:38:55 mircea_popescu: !rate Alana Massey -10 stupid whore.

19:38:55 assbot: Alana is not registered in WoT.

19:39:22 ascii_field: pythonism

19:39:36 ascii_field: incompatibility b/w 2.7 and 2.6

19:39:59 mircea_popescu: heh

19:44:17 scoopbot_revived: News! Life isn't Gaussian. URL: http://www.contravex.com/2015/04/29/life-isnt-gaussian/

19:44:18 assbot: Life isn’t Gaussian. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1GwZY4K )

19:45:10 lobbes: !up_ascii_field

19:45:28 lobbes: !up ascii_field

19:51:14 mircea_popescu: in transgender = confused kids without supervision news, http://boards.420chan.org/cd/1.php

19:51:16 assbot: Transgender Discussion - 420chan ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERXEdH )

19:52:47 ascii_field: mircea_popescu et al: fixed.

19:53:48 ascii_field: ty mircea_popescu, for a very palpably faster box.

19:53:54 ascii_field: it is very spiffy.

19:54:33 mircea_popescu: shit this guy's fast

19:54:34 ascii_field: considering that previously, this thing wasn't even on a computer in the usual sense - this is a major step forward.

19:54:46 mircea_popescu: 015-04-29 15:54 (Queued, 2 Moduli Remaining - Refresh page to update.)

19:54:55 mircea_popescu: listen, seeing how it's using about 10% of what it could... throtle it ?

19:55:11 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: if you read 'werker' - there is a polling knob

19:55:25 ascii_field: set, at present time, to 5s

19:57:00 ascii_field: why would we want to throttle the thing, again ?

19:57:02 *: ascii_field confused

20:00:21 mircea_popescu: well, there's no point in it having 2 items in queue while load is under 4 ish

20:01:46 punkman: http://www.reed.com/blog-dpr/?page_id=6

20:01:47 assbot: dpr » udp and me ... ( http://bit.ly/1ERZVWl )

20:02:39 ascii_field: mircea_popescu: the way it works is that when polling interval elapses, it does everything in the queue

20:03:02 mircea_popescu: aha

20:03:24 mircea_popescu: i guess that's spikey no ?

20:03:33 ascii_field: aha

20:04:08 ascii_field: if folks were to put a million keys through this thing each day, every time a new planet with intelligent pgp-using aliens is contacted, i would probably tweak a few things, yes.

20:04:54 jurov: mircea prolly noticed lightbulbs dimming every 5s

20:05:20 ascii_field: i also love how mircea_popescu put this box in a war zone

20:12:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4755 @ 0.00028909 = 1.3746 BTC [-]

20:16:11 asciilifeform: !up ascii_field

20:16:17 ascii_field: BingoBoingo: http://cryptome.org/2015-info/baltimore/baltimore-police.htm

20:16:18 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ES3pZ2 )

20:17:08 ascii_field: gotta love those traditional wooden 'democratizers'

20:17:19 ascii_field: ( http://cryptome.org/2015-info/baltimore/pict4.jpg )

20:17:21 assbot: ... ( http://bit.ly/1ES3Hix )

20:17:25 trinque: what is that, pepper-spray paintball?

20:17:28 trinque: or just paintball

20:17:33 ascii_field: painball

20:17:47 mircea_popescu: dude that police looks just like lego characters foretold.

20:18:03 ascii_field: the revolver-shotgun is finally out, apparently

20:18:11 trinque: ascii_field: rubber rounds in pic #5?

20:18:15 ascii_field: (pic19.jpg)

20:18:20 trinque: I'm not familiar with seeing cops holding those

20:19:00 ascii_field: the obligatory ziptie handcuffs (last photo.)

20:19:14 trinque: revolver shotgun likely fires tear gas canisters

20:20:14 ascii_field: see also http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=22-02-2015#1029076

20:20:14 assbot: Logged on 22-02-2015 19:30:55; asciilifeform: jurov: the zip tie and the effete executioner of the future are a match made in heaven. no need to watch the victim struggle, dance. zip - next.

20:21:30 trinque: stylish leather strap on those beatin'-sticks

20:23:10 *: ascii_field finds these scenes extra-lulzy on account of having walked on those streets

20:33:08 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 1000 @ 0.00180847 = 1.8085 BTC [+] {8}

20:34:09 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.EXCH] 700 @ 0.0016191 = 1.1334 BTC [-]

20:41:44 BingoBoingo: ascii_field: lol at the MRAP

20:52:30 williamdunne: !down

20:55:27 jurov: !left

20:56:31 mircea_popescu: !butt

20:56:38 mircea_popescu: hm... butt should do something

21:00:51 ben_vulpes: !up

21:00:53 ben_vulpes: !down

21:00:55 ben_vulpes: !up

21:00:57 ben_vulpes: !down

21:00:59 ben_vulpes: !left

21:01:01 ben_vulpes: !right

21:01:06 ben_vulpes: !a

21:01:09 ben_vulpes: !b

21:01:09 assbot: Need a number of lines.

21:01:11 ben_vulpes: !a

21:01:13 ben_vulpes: !b

21:01:13 assbot: Need a number of lines.

21:01:36 jurov: !b 1e1000

21:01:36 assbot: Make it a positive integer.

21:02:28 BingoBoingo: !b 31337

21:02:29 assbot: Last 31337 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/1ZP0YCV.txt )

21:10:01 mod6: !butt should just do like: (_8_)

21:11:44 mod6: or select a jpg from a random pool of hotbutts

21:12:28 mircea_popescu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WwjYuywWlA

21:12:30 assbot: 34 3lb Ham Slicer Vs The Wolf - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1IoA2wN )

21:12:35 mircea_popescu: apparently robot fights is a thing

21:13:29 mircea_popescu: anyone into this scene ?

21:15:57 mod6: ham slicer just waxed that thing

21:20:55 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 663 @ 0.0017814 = 1.1811 BTC [+] {8}

21:21:26 *: lobbes vaguely recalls some tv show from ~15 years ago depicting robot fights such as these

21:22:52 mircea_popescu: should be lots of fun now that silly-valley's come up with the police bot.

21:23:01 mircea_popescu: get some $5 dollar wedgers in there lol

21:24:25 pete_dushenski: lobbes was this 'the bots master' ? https://youtu.be/LLKYOSiW7U4

21:24:27 assbot: Bots Master Intro - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTGiLm )

21:27:00 pete_dushenski: ah nm, more like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab2V_tH076A

21:27:01 assbot: RC Fighting Robot Wars - Inertia XL v's Tilley's Revenge - 2013 Combat Robots UK Championships - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTGESc )

21:28:40 lobbes: pete_dushenski: yes! that second one

21:29:20 *: pete_dushenski also remembers this show from childhood, watching it with brother and father.

21:36:06 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115259 << i don't want to say i had anything to do with this, but...

21:36:06 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 03:45:05; decimation: lol http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-twitter-earns-20150429-story.html < "The company lost $162.4 million, compared with a loss of $132.4 million in the year-earlier quarter. Revenue jumped to $435.9 million from $250.5 million, but still fell far short of analysts' expectations of $463 million."

21:36:31 danielpbarron: it was called battle bots i think

21:36:51 pete_dushenski: losing my account and losing 20% of your share price just a month later? hmm, twitter, very hmm.

21:36:59 pete_dushenski: danielpbarron that was totally it.

21:38:28 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115268 << fuck stltoday and their wapo-esque survey paywall.

21:38:28 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 03:59:26; BingoBoingo: ;;later tell pete_dushenski Ferguson may be heating up again http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/gunfire-wounds-one-amid-protest-near-brown-shooting-scene-in/article_20958339-2ed0-577d-a80d-ba0959137074.html

21:38:50 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Stahp using javascript everywhere

21:39:33 pete_dushenski: anyways, ferguson remains on low boil until further notice.

21:40:22 pete_dushenski: and reloading makes the stltoday page magically work.

21:40:29 pete_dushenski: because that makes sense.

21:40:47 pete_dushenski: "if you looks at our ads twice, we'll let you read the page once"

21:41:05 pete_dushenski: "or you can look at them once and fill out our survey"

21:41:42 pete_dushenski: "Police made at least five arrests for charges including burglary and flourishing a weapon." << flourishing! how poetic.

21:42:25 danielpbarron: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvvlhOfxKfs

21:42:26 assbot: Sunny in Philadelphia, Mac and Dennis act British - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1JTIXoh )

21:45:06 pete_dushenski: danielpbarron i do enjoy 'sunny'. the first 5 seasons were pretty fucking hilarious but i haven't kept up with it since then.

21:46:52 danielpbarron: it's one of my favorites to leave on in the background while doing other things

22:00:36 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11066 @ 0.00028881 = 3.196 BTC [-] {2}

22:00:37 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: Anyways the Post Dispatch was the first Pulitzer owned newspaper

22:02:52 pete_dushenski: BingoBoingo pulitzer winning ? how does a prize own a paper.

22:03:18 BingoBoingo: pete_dushenski: No, as in the historical person Pulitzer.

22:03:36 pete_dushenski: lolk

22:03:44 pete_dushenski: also '2015 winner' according to site

22:04:20 pete_dushenski: brb

22:15:49 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19650 @ 0.00028754 = 5.6502 BTC [-] {2}

22:27:41 pete_dushenski: back.

22:57:23 williamdunne: Scoop the fourth is now re-written. Will be moved to a server, rather than my laptop

22:57:55 williamdunne: At the moment doesn't support adding new feeds. That will come soon-ish

22:58:38 pete_dushenski: williamdunne want me to test it on contravex ?

22:59:03 williamdunne: That'd be ideal

22:59:32 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8350 @ 0.00028595 = 2.3877 BTC [-] {2}

23:01:46 scoopbot_revived: scoopbot_revivied test http://www.contravex.com/2015/04/29/scoopbot_revivied-test/

23:01:47 assbot: scoopbot_revivied test | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGJLfV )

23:02:15 pete_dushenski: there we go.

23:02:20 williamdunne: Perfect

23:09:28 pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115874 << seems like the fraudsters editors should scan qntra articles too.

23:09:28 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 14:42:28; mircea_popescu: (and yes editors, which fraudsters doth employ, send the corrections with "did you mean to X" half the fucking time)

23:09:54 pete_dushenski: i mean, a few of us here do it for fun, but surely we miss errors here and there.

23:13:12 williamdunne: w.b-a.link down.. lol

23:15:48 assbot: [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9993 @ 0.00029333 = 2.9312 BTC [+]

23:15:58 pete_dushenski: hm. same here.

23:19:24 cazalla: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-04-2015#1115643 <<< from their website under "Strategic Advisors" Jackson Palmer and Brock Pierce lol

23:19:24 assbot: Logged on 29-04-2015 10:14:00; davout: so apparently this neucoin thing sold for 2.7kBTC worth of their, ahem, "coin"

23:23:25 pete_dushenski: bwahaha

23:23:57 pete_dushenski: on the plus side, they only pulled in 2700 btc, most of which was surely their own

23:24:31 pete_dushenski: this is down markedly from a year ago, when scams could still find 10,000+ btc

23:26:02 cazalla: still, not a bad effort compared to some other launches

23:26:34 cazalla: how much did that gems messaging app raise? BingoBoingo always goes on about it for some reason

23:26:48 cazalla: "hey cazalla, you should get gems yo, you earn gems for messaging"

23:26:51 BingoBoingo: cazalla: No idea

23:26:52 pete_dushenski: !s gems

23:26:54 assbot: 58 results for 'gems' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=gems

23:27:33 cazalla: soz for the elbowing BingoBoingo but i saw more gems news on coinfire earlier :)

23:29:57 pete_dushenski: http://www.blockchainsummit.io << fuckin branson. derp harder, mate.

23:29:59 assbot: Block Chain Summit ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGNWZc )

23:30:16 pete_dushenski: just whatever you do, don't pgp up and wander in here.

23:30:42 pete_dushenski: because hosting nobodies on your private island is more fun!

23:32:46 pete_dushenski: oh look, bitgo dood, garzik, pierce, and silbert are all going.

23:34:53 mircea_popescu: "This post Formule de salut on fraudsters - A blog by Mircea Popescu. concerning SEO provides clear thought for new SEO users that how to do Search engine optimization, therefore keep it up. Nice job

23:34:53 mircea_popescu: Asics sale"

23:35:27 cazalla: yeah, qntra has plenty of those and other variations mircea_popescu

23:38:19 mircea_popescu: you must be good at seo.

23:39:04 mircea_popescu: pete_dushenski errybody wannabe cartman.

23:44:09 pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu and flirt with transgenderism!

23:45:11 pete_dushenski: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3c143UdGxI

23:45:13 assbot: Cartman's transgender toilet - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1GGQxCl )

23:45:43 mircea_popescu: i ha dno idea

23:46:25 pete_dushenski: season 17 or 18

23:46:31 pete_dushenski: newer shit.

23:48:20 assbot: [HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 626 @ 0.00178791 = 1.1192 BTC [+] {8}