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Transcript for 31-03-2014, 1969 lines:

00:00:33 kakobrekla: http://shreyaschand.com/blog/2013/01/03/google-autocomplete-api/

00:00:33 ozbot: Google Autocomplete "API" | Shreyas Chand

00:00:41 kakobrekla: this is not aware of context

00:08:25 mircea_popescu: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/21qvlj/havelock_investments_halts_neo_bee_fund_trading/cgfrvfz

00:08:36 mircea_popescu: funny how nobody has no connections to anything ever.

00:09:00 mircea_popescu: all this forum shit starts with a lot of support that on examination consists of wtf.

00:14:54 nubbins`: ah, to be a fly on the wall

00:17:50 jurov: oooh our next generation emerging scamchange owner dotcoin aka markus weiler got into some mudfights?

00:18:24 nubbins`: yeah, apparently i've been advised to figure out who the guy's lawyer is and present myself to him

00:18:26 jurov: you knew he added securities to bitcoinbourse?

00:18:47 jurov: another "next mpex"

00:22:05 jurov: it's behind registration, so for sake of record i'll list what he trades there:

00:22:21 jurov: Symbol: BBS Bitcoin Bourse System Shares

00:22:28 jurov: Investor Info: https://bitcoinbourse.eu/investor

00:22:42 jurov: Symbol: TBN The Bitcoin News Shares

00:22:48 jurov: Investor Info: http://thebitcoinnews.co.uk/investor-relations/

00:23:01 jurov: Symbol: BCS BitcoinCard® Shares

00:23:08 jurov: Investor Info: http://bitcointocard.com/BCS_IPO.pdf

00:23:37 jurov: Symbol: ___ Announcement 2 April 2014

00:23:43 jurov: Investor Info: http://#

00:25:28 jurov: that's all so far. No public trading data advertised or even graphs shown.

00:29:29 mircea_popescu: bitcoin news shares ?

00:29:35 mircea_popescu: how does bitcoin news generate revenue

00:30:20 mircea_popescu: ;;google site:uspto.gov BitcoinCard

00:30:44 mircea_popescu: i guess nobody told 'em ? is not merely a good looking special glyph

00:31:01 pankkake: time to call the AntiTrust Brigade

00:32:15 pankkake: how does bitcoin news generate revenue => https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTkA9L2J2gY

00:33:11 mircea_popescu: yeah, i think bitbet made a whole btc out of advertising so far

00:33:14 mircea_popescu: over about a year.

00:34:09 pankkake: also bitcoiners === likely to have adblock

00:34:25 pankkake: or lynx

00:35:47 nubbins`: or lawyers on speed dial

00:35:50 nubbins`: wait...

00:35:57 mircea_popescu: ha ha

00:36:01 mircea_popescu: i am behind 7 layers

00:36:03 jurov: judging from http://bitcoinsarl.fr/ , the ___ is gonna be cryptotu.be IPO

00:36:50 mircea_popescu: wait, the entire drama with pankkake and davout in the forums was simply some french dork's idea of how to launch yet another wannabe-mpex thing ?

00:37:03 pankkake: german incorporated in france

00:37:07 jurov: mircea yes

00:37:11 mircea_popescu: pretty sad.

00:38:05 jurov: it's actually meta-wannabe thing, he seems very productive

00:38:15 kakobrekla: well as it turns out to be i havent managed to figure out who suggested to put up the wiki

00:38:31 kakobrekla: but here you go http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/

00:38:39 mircea_popescu: where's that nubbins` quote ? "if their business was doing something pointless they'd be doing it very well"

00:39:05 *: nubbins` gestures towards log

00:39:06 kakobrekla: please pm me to set up an account, must have WOT

00:39:10 nubbins`: ctrl-f, magazine

00:39:15 mircea_popescu: i cant find an "edit" button

00:39:25 mircea_popescu: a, i was gonna vandalize it ;/

00:40:09 nubbins`: not sure what this wiki is for

00:40:22 mircea_popescu: me either.

00:40:37 kakobrekla: http://piratepad.net/or1RSxpueo

00:40:39 ozbot: PiratePad: or1RSxpueo

00:40:45 kakobrekla: this goes there

00:40:49 kakobrekla: +-

00:40:53 mircea_popescu: maybe to give more avenues of haxxorage on b-a.com ?

00:41:08 kakobrekla: its all contained

00:41:45 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla hehe ok. but what's the idea, give me like an usecase for the wiki

00:42:07 kakobrekla: for when the newbies come and ask "can you give me reading material and not the log"

00:42:13 nubbins`: ah

00:42:32 mircea_popescu: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=289730.msg5993394#msg5993394 << see, now that's a paid troll on point and good at what he does. rapid, efficient, a wonder to behold. not like the rest of you bums

00:42:33 ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings

00:42:36 mircea_popescu: what am i even paying you for!

00:42:51 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla a so it's not a bitbet thing

00:42:57 mircea_popescu: for some reason i was thinking that

00:43:00 kakobrekla: O_o

00:43:16 pankkake: maybe a collective fraudsters TL;DR

00:43:22 nubbins`: you're paying me?! :0

00:43:31 mircea_popescu: yeah. TCTTLDR

00:43:54 mircea_popescu: The Collective fraudsters Too Long Didn't Romprehend

00:45:06 mircea_popescu: course... it'd kinda put the various btcnews sites out of business, so i understand now what this is all about. you're all trying to sabotage bitcoinsarl, jarl and etc.

00:46:03 mircea_popescu: anyway, as encouragement, i'll gift either 100k ATC or 0.1 BTC for the best article there.

00:46:08 mircea_popescu: winner's choice.

00:46:18 jurov: hi dotcoin

00:46:46 dotcoin: hi jurov

00:46:49 mircea_popescu: jurov you two know each other ?

00:46:54 dotcoin: why talking so bad about me

00:47:06 jurov: i§m his happy shareholder

00:47:10 dotcoin: yes we know i think

00:47:27 jurov: since before bitcoinbourse launch

00:47:33 dotcoin: yes happy shareholders not accuse the company of scam

00:47:45 mircea_popescu: ;;gettrust dotcoin

00:48:03 mircea_popescu: you seem to be having a bit of a problem there dotcoin.

00:48:32 dotcoin: do you think so

00:48:45 dotcoin: i think there are some other guys have much more problems than me

00:49:48 dotcoin: so tell me guys where is the problem

00:49:50 nubbins`: hey

00:49:50 nubbins`: dotcoin! my friend!

00:49:50 nubbins`: your lawyer got in touch with me

00:49:50 nubbins`: i gave him all the info i had about pankkake

00:50:09 mircea_popescu: dotcoin inasmuch as you're trying to start some sort of exchange with no experience and no web of trust presence...

00:50:11 dotcoin: i am not your friend nubbins nor i want your friend

00:50:50 dotcoin: you think i have no experience? as you all guys runs many exchanges here i see

00:51:05 dotcoin: or any other usefull stuff

00:51:26 mircea_popescu: yes, we run teh bitcoin.

00:51:34 dotcoin: you run the bitcoin

00:51:40 mircea_popescu: how useful it is however... it's kinda debatable.

00:51:57 dotcoin: for one is more and for the other less

00:51:57 nubbins`: dotcoin we are not friends?

00:52:19 dotcoin: but classifieds this me or my company as a scammer

00:52:22 nubbins`: your lawyer was nice. you are not as nice as your lawyer.

00:52:33 mircea_popescu: he has a lawyer ?!

00:52:57 dotcoin: nubbins stop talk to me please you are simple little trol not talking with you

00:53:14 nubbins`: mircea_popescu, https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=344219.msg5990995#msg5990995

00:53:15 mircea_popescu: dotcoin ok but you have a lawyer /

00:53:22 nubbins`: says there he has a lawyer

00:53:35 dotcoin: i have a lawyer you too

00:53:41 mircea_popescu: what's his name ?

00:54:02 dotcoin: you can read when you in problems with me on the letter he will send you

00:54:09 Duffer1: hi dotcoin

00:54:17 nubbins`: how in the world is your lawyer going to send a letter to me :(

00:54:27 dotcoin: but what is now the problems here is there any serious discussion

00:54:31 dotcoin: or what is here on

00:54:54 dotcoin: why you troll companies in forums

00:54:57 nubbins`: dotcoin, what is your native language? (just curious)

00:54:59 jurov: dotcoin, you refused to say anything about what was doen with bitcoins from bourse IPO

00:54:59 mircea_popescu: ... so do you have a lawyer or don't you.

00:55:01 dotcoin: pankkake

00:55:15 bounce: "pankkake" is a language now?

00:55:16 jurov: that's even less than several known scammers

00:55:27 jurov: so for me, your case is clear

00:55:32 nubbins`: pankkake is the language of love

00:55:35 nubbins`: aka body language

00:55:37 dotcoin: so what is the case jurov

00:56:00 kakobrekla: the bourse thingy was german iirc

00:56:21 dotcoin: the case is you are friend of martin and he is not happy to get out of bourse right?

00:56:25 dotcoin: what he told you this man

00:56:39 jurov: martin is irrelevant here

00:56:46 jurov: you raised hunders of BTC

00:56:58 jurov: and they are not heard of since

00:57:08 dotcoin: hundrets

00:57:12 jurov: *hundreds

00:57:12 mircea_popescu: nubbins` linguistix specialist says probably dutch or german.

00:57:19 nubbins`: ah

00:57:20 dotcoin: you even know how much we raised

00:57:40 nubbins`: don't panic, i'm only germanic

00:57:41 kanzure: i think i killed gribble :(

00:57:46 BingoBoingo: dotcoin: Why do you have a lawyer?

00:58:01 nubbins`: i don't think he has a lawyer

00:58:04 dotcoin: and if so what is the problem about a IPO is to raise money or not

00:58:35 jurov: wont gonna look it up, i know i am not getting answer anyway

00:58:38 dotcoin: so jurov tell me please what is your problem now

00:58:47 jurov: you are eliza

00:58:48 jurov: ?

00:58:55 jurov: tell me about your parents?

00:58:57 dotcoin: eliza?

00:58:59 jurov: etc?

00:59:06 dotcoin: are you drunk

00:59:16 mircea_popescu: kanzure what did you do ?

00:59:20 jurov: i explained my problem clearly

00:59:39 jurov: last time: 1. you raised bitcoins

00:59:45 dotcoin: not real you tell me i rais hundrets of bitcoins and ?

00:59:58 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo lawyers are like girlfriends, except better. everyone should have a few.

01:00:11 jurov: 2. built crappy website but never disclosed how many of them were used in the process

01:00:17 mircea_popescu: https://github.com/dotcoin?tab=activity < da hell is this thing anyway ?

01:00:19 jurov: 3. want moar

01:00:20 dotcoin: and you want to know where they are gone?

01:00:31 Juelcf: the new bourse website looks good and works good

01:00:37 dotcoin: what do you think where they are gone?

01:00:51 mircea_popescu: dotcoin how about this : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=361852.0

01:00:58 Duffer1: MP i'm thinking french

01:01:00 dotcoin: do you think you create site like we have and without paying anything

01:01:01 mircea_popescu: apparently you issued stock, then did a forced buyback at a loss.

01:01:02 kakobrekla: spent them for dotcoin mansion

01:01:09 dotcoin: do you het it for free anywhere in the world?

01:01:10 jurov: i have to guess? blow and hookers?

01:01:24 Juelcf: You guys talk so much shit its amazing

01:01:34 nubbins`: dotcoin: WOW, you did a forced buyback at a loss?

01:01:36 dotcoin: whaamazing company yes

01:01:41 dotcoin: show me a better one

01:02:01 nubbins`: Juelcf: hi

01:02:06 mircea_popescu: dotcoin you have this strange comparison to the mean mentality.

01:02:25 mircea_popescu: doesn't really matter what you perceive the average to be. the idea is to stand out at the top not to muddle around the middle.

01:04:31 dotcoin: a so jurov i want to tell you what ever your friend martin lies to you is not the truth, and to accuse me for scam in this case in forums is not the best way to hear the other site of this story between martin and me, you are shareholder you try now to accuse me of scam so what i have think about that? do you think is a productive way for your shares? more than i not scam any

01:04:58 nubbins`_: who's martin?

01:04:58 jurov: i want numbers, not story

01:05:02 dotcoin: i am a real person i not hide behind aliases and be in a forum a super hero member

01:05:09 mircea_popescu: so what is your name ?

01:05:27 nubbins`_: i think his real name is Dot Coin

01:05:39 dotcoin: all of you guys can meet me if you wan and we can discuss

01:05:45 mircea_popescu: isn't that patented by some fatass in new zealand ?

01:05:53 mircea_popescu: dotcoin yes, we can. so what's your name ?

01:06:03 nubbins`_: not exactly but you can still be prosecuted under the Analogue Act

01:06:06 jurov: nubbins`_: martin is our mutual acquaintance that was supposed to be cofounder of bitcoin bourse and helped me to decide to invest there

01:06:07 BingoBoingo: ;;ident dotcoin

01:06:22 jurov: later martin quit

01:06:27 nubbins`_: ah

01:06:33 dotcoin: cofounder of bitcoin bourse hahaha

01:06:35 nubbins`_: sort of like thickasthieves and neobee?

01:06:38 *: nubbins`_ cackles loudly

01:06:41 dotcoin: martin quit hahaha

01:06:42 mircea_popescu: jurov would this be foresnick or some other guy ?

01:06:48 jurov: yes forensick

01:06:50 dotcoin: sorry man you are full wrong informed

01:06:53 Duffer1: Markus Weiler?

01:07:00 dotcoin: yes is the forensick guy

01:07:05 dotcoin: yes Markus Weiler

01:07:10 mike_c_s: this cost money? https://bitcoinbourse.eu/

01:07:11 dotcoin: and you Duffer 1?

01:07:14 jurov: and who are you then?

01:07:18 mircea_popescu: Duffer1 well we don't know. guy has a lawyer he can't name and doesn't hide behind nicks but can't introduce himself.

01:07:23 mircea_popescu: a bit of a conundrum so far.

01:07:34 jurov: forensick is martin belobrat and YOU are markus weiler

01:07:35 nubbins`_: mike_c that website looks like it cost about $5 to make

01:07:35 mircea_popescu: mike_c not everyone has python developers at their beak and call.

01:07:43 mike_c: apparently

01:07:55 nubbins`_: ah

01:07:58 nubbins`_: Markus Weiler!

01:08:00 dotcoin: yes ok now all people can call me Markus Weiler if you are more happy with that

01:08:10 dotcoin: Mr for some of you huys

01:08:18 nubbins`_: heh

01:08:20 dotcoin: specialy for the trolls without name

01:08:20 kakobrekla: ;;google Markus Weiler

01:08:23 mircea_popescu: ok, so you're markus weiler and you try to run bitcoinbourse.

01:08:24 peterl: "i am a real person i not hide behind aliases and be in a forum a super hero member" says a guy named "dotcoin"?

01:08:28 kakobrekla: no gribble :\

01:08:29 jurov: ^ typical communication style. no help there

01:08:34 jurov: goodnight

01:08:35 kakobrekla: a there you are

01:08:53 kakobrekla: dr?

01:08:55 kakobrekla: nah

01:08:56 dotcoin: so what now jurov

01:09:00 kakobrekla: must be wrong guy

01:09:02 nubbins`_: ^

01:09:07 Duffer1: dotcoin I was just reading https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=361852.msg4729286#msg4729286 wasn't sure if that was your name or not. Call me Matt :)

01:09:17 nubbins`_: Call me on my birthday

01:09:34 mircea_popescu: dotcoin so now we get to the part where you issued a stock on cryptostocks and then did a forced buyback for a lower price.

01:09:57 nubbins`_: oh my god, Markus Weiler did a forced buyback of stock?

01:10:02 dotcoin: make a force back i think was for 1 share so can be yes

01:10:29 nubbins`_: at a lower price?!

01:10:42 mircea_popescu: dotcoin it's in the link above. http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=31-03-2014#594053

01:11:10 Duffer1: who was running the pass through?

01:11:23 mircea_popescu: please let it be usagi ?

01:11:26 dotcoin: if this one user have a loss will pay him if contact me, ask now why make a force back buy, tell you martin the friend of jurov told me we must sell shares there, as we not have need, this i stop trading on cryptostocks that was simple and not any to to i rip of a guy of 0.0005 btc

01:11:50 mircea_popescu: can you write that out again but in your native language ?

01:11:59 nubbins`_: en francais svp!

01:12:21 mircea_popescu: it made no sense in english ; i can probably read it in whatever it is you speak.

01:12:35 dotcoin: i am not francais man i am german and i am sure nobody of you guys speak german

01:12:37 nubbins`_: in deutsche bitte!

01:12:46 dotcoin: Fuer dich gerne in deutsch

01:13:09 dotcoin: stell deine frage in deutsch

01:13:13 mircea_popescu: ja, Deutsch wird hier gesprochen

01:13:19 bounce: eutelsat netblock. talk about being out in the boonies.

01:13:22 dotcoin: ja na dann mal los

01:13:22 nubbins`_: danke, ihr englisch ist schwer zu verstehen ;(

01:13:38 dotcoin: genau wie ihr deutsch

01:13:55 benkay: http://i.imgur.com/nAgQ7.jpg

01:14:06 jurov: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=347347.0 here you said you are markus weiler

01:14:08 ozbot: Bitcoin SARL Infoletter 26/11/13

01:14:10 mircea_popescu: benkay fuck, she beats my redheads

01:14:27 dotcoin: yes jurov still i am

01:14:52 nubbins`_: sea salt & black pepper on popcorn? sigh

01:15:05 Duffer1: i'd eat that

01:15:24 mircea_popescu: nubbins`_ and lymph

01:15:35 Duffer1: Ich würde das essen

01:15:40 benkay: i'll let you know when i find the moose sausage popcorn, nubbins`

01:17:29 benkay: let's keep this one in reserve for when the SEC gets you, mircea_popescu http://destroyed-and-abandoned.tumblr.com/image/81101546098

01:18:08 mircea_popescu: so dramatique

01:18:11 Duffer1: has there been any followup to that?

01:18:23 dotcoin: ok jurov i guess if you have any questions about anything, you have my email and i am sure you aware of daily newsletters

01:18:33 kakobrekla: lel

01:19:06 kakobrekla: you didnt give any answers dotcoin

01:19:31 kakobrekla: now im curioal.

01:19:42 dotcoin: i give not answers about what kakobrekla

01:19:51 Juelcf: i would like to know also what the fuck is going on here

01:20:04 dotcoin: i answer and some people want talk with me german so what now

01:20:17 kakobrekla: you were asked to type what you typed in german

01:20:25 kakobrekla: so do it

01:20:45 Duffer1: hi Juelcf

01:20:49 dotcoin: google translate i not want wast more time

01:20:50 Juelcf: Hi

01:21:27 kakobrekla: like talking to a can of worms.

01:21:43 dotcoin: serious people here can join our newsletter than they will informed http://thebictoinnews.co.uk and people with problems or questions can contact me by email contact@bitcoinsarl.fr

01:21:45 Duffer1: are you not entertained

01:22:05 Duffer1: .fr?

01:22:17 Duffer1: nm

01:24:22 dotcoin: n8

01:24:27 kakobrekla: anyway i tried google trasnlate eng -> eng and it doesnt fix your garbage

01:24:42 kakobrekla: also brb

01:27:39 nubbins`_: mircea_popescu: sea salt, black pepper, and lymph on popcorn?!

01:27:48 Juelcf: whats the deal with dotcoin? why was everyone trolling?

01:28:09 mircea_popescu: Juelcf who exactly was trolling ? and who exactly are you ?

01:28:17 benkay: not really trolling. dotcoin's being evasive and the channel kinda got pissed.

01:28:40 Duffer1: the engrish doesn't help either

01:28:47 Juelcf: mircea_popescu, just asking

01:28:57 Duffer1: no offense

01:29:29 nubbins`_: obv a machine translation job

01:30:19 Duffer1: juelcf it started with pankkake calling foul on a couple of dubious offerings by dotcoin

01:30:37 Duffer1: then came to a head today as dotcoin threatened to sue pankkake

01:31:21 bounce: well, maybe we need a virtual courts of teh intarwebz, where you can sue WoT usernames and such.

01:31:41 bounce: s/ a //

01:33:06 peterl: didnt they have a Rota for that sort of thing?

01:33:11 nubbins`_: heh

01:33:20 BingoBoingo: I suppose a good rule of thumb for any court would be that parties wanting redress from Pankkake are prolly in the wrong

01:33:21 nubbins`_: peterl it got too real too quick

01:33:41 peterl: what is the use of such a thing if it is not real?

01:33:52 nubbins`_: no use

01:35:48 nubbins`_: fun fact, ROTA was an acronym for Rand of the Ayn

01:36:40 bounce: no idea what that is and it already smells like WTMI

01:36:53 nubbins`_: ;;ud wtmi

01:36:55 ozbot: Urban Dictionary: wtmi

01:37:09 BingoBoingo: I thought ROTA was an acronym for Round, Oiled, Tense, Asses

01:37:20 nubbins`_: heh.

01:37:26 nubbins`_: too many commas, otherwise ok

01:39:00 cazalla: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=462370.msg5993297#msg5993297

01:39:34 nubbins`: 1-855-one-bitcoin

01:39:50 nubbins`: or, if you're in a rush, 1-855-one-bitc

01:39:56 nubbins`: lelelel

01:42:19 cazalla: "Lol, wrapped some cardboard boxes in inkjet-printed labels, and took a pic of one HF board? Awesome." top kek

01:42:59 nubbins`: "let's use a cell phone camera for the photos for our big announcement"

01:43:36 mircea_popescu: it's a slow drama day, so let's lol at people. http://fraudsters.com/2014/a-sad-story-illustrated/

01:44:02 nubbins`: fuck-the-cops.biz!

01:44:43 mircea_popescu: bounce we had something like that, as peterl points out. it failed miserably. http://fraudsters.com/rota-post-mortem

01:45:04 mircea_popescu: and it wasn't no acronim

01:45:18 asciilifeform: in other news, my site (should anyone give a damn) is back.

01:45:28 mircea_popescu: ;;google tribunal apostolicum rotae romanae

01:46:34 mircea_popescu: nubbins` ghetto huh.

01:47:13 nubbins`: who knows, maybe they couldn't afford a $99 samsung point-and-shoot because they spent every last dime on legitimate businessy things

01:47:40 peterl: Some cell phones these days have very nice cameras

01:47:57 mircea_popescu: http/hashfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Yoli-Evo-board_FINAL-white-WEB-e1392926017925.png

01:48:03 mircea_popescu: this shit looks quite aesthetically pleasing

01:48:55 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: cut&paste in cad proggy will do that. symmetric.

01:49:22 mircea_popescu: also the central thing.

01:49:43 asciilifeform: that multi-die beast looks like a thermal nightmare though

01:49:48 mircea_popescu: it does yeah

01:49:53 asciilifeform: why cram them in one?

01:50:00 mircea_popescu: imo it's horrid design, you'd have wanted the 4 separated towards corners or something

01:50:02 asciilifeform: is the author here?

01:50:11 mircea_popescu: but forget the sanity. it pleaseth my eye

01:50:23 asciilifeform: ok i think i get it!

01:50:29 asciilifeform: look at the 'octopus'

01:50:36 asciilifeform: it's designed to fit an intel heat sink.

01:50:43 asciilifeform: hence the quad die.

01:50:48 mircea_popescu: like a girl on 7 inchers. you know she's in pain and likely can't run... but damn that ass.

01:50:54 asciilifeform: it wants to have the same mechanicals as a 'xeon'

01:50:58 mircea_popescu: oh

01:51:15 mircea_popescu: who knows, that may work cheaper

01:51:25 asciilifeform: cheaper than having your own heat sinks cast, yes

01:51:31 asciilifeform: esp. if you like hydraulic strange

01:52:00 asciilifeform: the 6-pin molexes are probably intel's 'p4' too.

01:54:42 kakobrekla: these are apparently water cooled as well

01:57:57 pankkake: I can take better pics of my Data Center: https://unsee.cc/beziru/

01:59:17 asciilifeform: whatever happened to those folks who sold a $3k (usd) pc chassis-cum-heatsink of solid copper, weighing as much as a man ?

01:59:20 asciilifeform: 'zalman' i think it was.

02:00:14 pankkake: I'm not sure they actually sold it

02:00:45 nubbins`: seems to me like if you remove the per-case judge payment and stick to the yearly sum, the rota would involve a whole lot less QQing

02:01:24 asciilifeform: shame. i have this ancient crackpot dream of being rid of pc fans.

02:02:03 mircea_popescu: nubbins` wouldn't have had any impact in the matter that sunk it

02:02:05 pankkake: there are some passive heatsinks though

02:02:32 pankkake: huge aluminum stuff - but they tell you to have case fans though

02:02:32 asciilifeform: pankkake: show a 100% passive cooled machine that isn't a toy

02:02:35 nubbins`: mircea_popescu well pretty hard to buy off judges if the judges don't get paid any extra for taking the case

02:02:43 pankkake: I guess you can do it if you underclock

02:02:56 mircea_popescu: nubbins` ...

02:03:32 nubbins`: unless i'm missing something

02:03:46 pankkake: I solved the fan issue by putting the machines in another room than the one I'm in

02:04:09 asciilifeform: pankkake: i'm about to rent a whole building instead of flat, partly so i can do just this

02:04:15 mircea_popescu: well you are. inasmuch the defendant passively receives X btc and is then required to return X+e, the entire thing is an extraction engine

02:04:16 pankkake: though the real annoyance always was the noise of hard drives

02:04:21 asciilifeform: but fans still suck in dirt, fail without warning, etc

02:04:41 pankkake: yeah, my GPU fan died, and those aren't easy to replace :(

02:04:53 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the correct solution to the fan problem is to use fanned tubes

02:04:58 nubbins`: what's "e", effort?

02:04:59 pankkake: back to the slower passive gpu, which at least still works

02:05:01 mircea_popescu: all fans in a tube can't fail at the same time

02:05:03 mircea_popescu: nubbins` epsilon

02:05:28 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: apple is selling, i think, a machine of just this shape. but, as you can probably guess, i'd rather not buy it.

02:05:30 pankkake: my case has filters, the case wasn't that dusty after months of operation

02:06:29 nubbins`: mircea_popescu: in the post mortem example, all i see is: mpex receives 100btc, mpex returns 100btc, mpex pays judges 3btc each

02:06:36 asciilifeform: http://bensbargains.net/thecheckout/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/mac-pro-cigar.jpg

02:06:42 mircea_popescu: i wonder why there doesn't exist some sort of magnetic heat extractor device!

02:07:06 mircea_popescu: nubbins` so what you mean is, make the cases costless ?

02:07:22 mircea_popescu: what prevents someone from suing everyone in sight if there's no cost to it ?

02:07:22 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: magneto-hydrodynamic coolant pump ? one sees them in patents often, but for some reason never in pc.

02:07:30 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i know.

02:07:38 mircea_popescu: yet pc would seem one of the best applications

02:07:59 nubbins`: no cost to it? if you lose, it's a 10btc cost

02:08:15 mircea_popescu: ...

02:08:17 dexX7: rota 2?

02:08:31 mircea_popescu: you gotta make up your mind nubbins`

02:08:32 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: ordinary 'heat pipe' works great, so long as you have a massive sink on the other side. heat pipe can be thought of as a refrigerator without a compressor.

02:09:08 nubbins`: i left out fees for brevity in my example

02:09:13 nubbins`: consider it suitably modified.

02:09:41 mircea_popescu: so then mpex has to pay the fees if it loses ?

02:09:46 mircea_popescu: and it can lose without doing anything ?

02:10:40 nubbins`: it couldn't lose if it declined to participate

02:10:53 nubbins`: how else would you deal with a case you deemed frivolous?

02:11:07 nubbins`: throw 10btc at it and hope ya get it back?!

02:11:30 Duffer1: what's the incentive to defend yourself ever?

02:11:37 nubbins`: THERE ISN'T ONE

02:12:18 mircea_popescu: then problem solved ?

02:12:25 Duffer1: hehe

02:12:54 nubbins`: well, if you look at it that way, the rota was a solution in search of a problem

02:13:02 mircea_popescu: it may be said.

02:13:23 nubbins`: suppose i call chetty a poopyhead and it turns out this damaged her reputation so badly that she lost a 100btc contract. she decides to sue me via rota, i decline.

02:13:27 mircea_popescu: what can i tell you, i'm not mafalda. i figure things out as i go

02:13:28 nubbins`: now what? nothing

02:13:43 mircea_popescu: nubbins` now you're a poopyhead

02:13:59 nubbins`: joke's on you, that doesn't damage my reputation

02:14:13 mircea_popescu: well not like it has to.

02:14:17 mircea_popescu: whats this, taloncoin ?

02:14:26 nubbins`: i can't keep up with them, you tell me :D

02:14:47 nubbins`: anyway.

02:14:53 mircea_popescu: im very surprised nobody made bitround yet

02:14:59 nubbins`: maybe the defendant doesn't have to pay a fee because we're not paying the judges per-case anymore

02:15:12 mircea_popescu: everyone with their head in a box, X-coin Y-coin blergh

02:15:26 nubbins`: bitbar

02:15:29 mircea_popescu: not paying the judges per case has a host of problems

02:15:38 nubbins`: toss a couple at me

02:15:41 mircea_popescu: such as judges no longer actually wish to judge. it becomes morel ike jury duty

02:15:48 nubbins`: workload would be the obvious one

02:16:05 nubbins`: but hey, USA has a thousand magistrate judges for a reason

02:16:28 nubbins`: say a judge has to take 30 cases a year or w/e for his 30btc

02:17:07 nubbins`: he knows the workload involved when he signs up. once all judges are booked up, you have a backlog.

02:18:08 joecool: i had a case some years back that was delayed nearly 2 years because the judge assigned was waiting for his retirement request to finalize

02:18:37 nubbins`: exactly so

02:19:01 MisterE: mornin

02:19:05 nubbins`: anyway, you're arguing that salary doesn't work because pay-by-the-hour makes it seem like less of a chore

02:23:34 mircea_popescu: nubbins` and how do you pay the 30 btc ?

02:24:28 mircea_popescu: and im merely arguing that since every top job out there pays a salary + bonuses, that model is unavoidable.

02:24:43 nubbins`: well, how were you planning to pay the 30btc?

02:24:58 nubbins`: unavoidable pff, bitcoin is here to replace &c &c.

02:25:06 nubbins`: receiving btc IS a bonus.

02:25:47 mircea_popescu: iffy.

02:26:15 nubbins`: anyway, unless that 30btc was supposed to come from the leftover 1btc of the losing party's money (30 cases per judge per year!), i can only imagine that you were privately funding the judges' salaries

02:26:17 mircea_popescu: and if you recall, the 10 btc - 3x3 = 1 leftover.

02:26:23 mircea_popescu: 30 cases a year pay for the 30.

02:26:42 mircea_popescu: i was privately underwriting the risk that judges may not get 30 cases/year

02:26:58 mircea_popescu: that fat tail ended up costing a pretty penny, but hey.

02:28:11 nubbins`: so the plaintiff's 10btc fee is refundable to 9btc if he wins.

02:28:28 nubbins`: all the more reason to avoid frivolous claims, no?

02:28:56 nubbins`: if you buy a can of coke here, you pay eight cents recycling deposit. you bring the empty can back, you get five cents.

02:31:55 nubbins`: i can almost hear the gears turning from here... although it could just be the cat snoring ;(

02:34:09 mircea_popescu: nubbins` no dood. 2parties contribute 10 btc each. the winner gets his 10 btc back

02:34:20 mircea_popescu: the loser's goes to judges and 1 btc left over.

02:34:26 nubbins`: yeah, that didn't work tho

02:35:43 mircea_popescu: sure. but the problem was hardly the incentive structure.

02:35:48 nubbins`: so you remove the defendant's fee, which solves the problem you identified where mpex gets bled dry, and you make 1btc of the plaintiff's fee non-refundable, which solves the payroll problem

02:37:11 mircea_popescu: dude wtf.

02:37:19 mircea_popescu: plaintif wins. gets 10 btc back. who pays the judges ?

02:37:26 nubbins`: no.

02:37:31 nubbins`: plaintiff wins, gets 9btc back.

02:37:34 mircea_popescu: lol. plaintiff never wins ?

02:37:45 bocobit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx1mryKqvT8

02:37:55 nubbins`: you want the rota to solve your problems for you, it costs you 1btc.

02:38:36 mircea_popescu: and who pays the judges ?

02:38:44 mircea_popescu: do they make 3 btc if defendant wins, and 0 if plaintiff wins ?

02:38:57 nubbins`: they don't make shit until their contract is up

02:39:17 mircea_popescu: that'll never work.

02:39:27 nubbins`: sure it will.

02:39:38 nubbins`: if defendant wins, he gets the 9btc.

02:39:58 nubbins`: the 1btc -- and nothing more -- always goes to the judge fund

02:40:00 MisterE: who picks judges and where they come from?

02:40:20 mircea_popescu: MisterE was a self-nomination thing, originally. see the article

02:40:36 MisterE: sorry I came in late in the chat

02:40:38 nubbins`: if some asshole sends 100btc to mpex for no reason and wants to rota it, he pays 10btc, you pay 0btc.

02:40:43 nubbins`: 1btc immediately goes to judges fund

02:40:57 nubbins`: asshole wins: he gets 9btc refund. you win: you get 9btc payout.

02:41:12 nubbins`: now tell me if people would be bringing frivolous claims to a court set up like that.

02:41:13 mircea_popescu: o.o

02:41:30 nubbins`: tell me if people wouldn't be encouraged to solve their own problems rather than whining to btc dad

02:41:44 mircea_popescu: i think perhaps you may be optimising for a differen tproblem.

02:41:53 nubbins`: solving all of them at once, really

02:41:56 MisterE: bitcointalk is there the whiners are

02:42:34 nubbins`: i don't think there are any problems left ;D

02:42:45 mircea_popescu: cool. im off to bed.

02:42:57 nubbins`: nitey

02:44:52 nubbins`: rota was a fine idea but just incorrectly structured from the start. it'd probably still be going if it was set up the way i've outlined ;D

02:45:18 nubbins`: MisterE: http://fraudsters.com/category/rota/

02:45:33 MisterE: thanks

02:45:50 nubbins`: having the defendant pay 10btc creates a strong disincentive to participate

02:46:18 nubbins`: at least if there's no fee to register a defence, he's got nothing to lose by participating

02:49:40 MisterE: fees are always the plantiff's burden

02:49:54 nubbins`: as it should be

02:49:59 MisterE: frivolous suits are weeded out that way

02:50:06 nubbins`: you got it

02:50:07 MisterE: wel many are

02:50:30 the20year1: As far as user trust goes, what's more important btc-otc or bitcointalk?

02:50:36 MisterE: I habent read yet but this is BTC arbitration?

02:50:43 MisterE: the20year1: same

02:50:55 MisterE: we;l not same but very similar

02:50:56 nubbins`: the20year1: if you ask people on irc, -otc. if you ask people on the forums, the forums.

02:51:19 MisterE: users here are the top of the pyramid

02:51:20 the20year1: i'm sure the best answer is 'get both' , but i'm coming to realize that trust is good, it might save me some cash over the next 2 months

02:51:42 nubbins`: both is nice to have

02:51:42 MisterE: trust can save you *a lot*

02:51:51 nubbins`: forum people don't give a fuck about otc ratings, and vice versa

02:51:55 MisterE: if you have to shoose get rated by people here

02:52:05 nubbins`: it depends on who you plan on doing business with

02:52:10 MisterE: right

02:52:45 the20year1: Lucky for me, the bulk of my investors aren't on either, however it'd be good going forward to have good ratings on both

02:52:53 MisterE: can I borrow something so I can pay it back and get rated?

02:53:18 MisterE: get them on wot ASAP

02:54:25 kakobrekla: but that requires reading stuff.

02:54:36 the20year1: Well, in my case i've been 'loaned' something like 800btc

02:54:45 kakobrekla: re borrowing, yeah bitcoinpete just did that a day or three ago iirc

02:54:56 the20year1: and out of that, among the 450ish users, some should be on irc & btct

02:55:12 nubbins`: i don't think borrowing and repaying is a particularly good way of building trust.

02:55:24 kakobrekla: never said that .

02:55:34 nubbins`: no, MisterE hinted at it tho

02:55:42 MisterE: :)

02:56:02 MisterE: I just want to get my rating off the ground

02:56:17 MisterE: kakobrekla: yea thats where I got the idea

02:56:18 nubbins`: so do something that'll make people trust you :P

02:56:25 MisterE: heh

02:56:50 nubbins`: "i got a loan and paid it back" is just another way of saying "i'm not going to pay back the first loan that's big enough"

02:57:06 kakobrekla: suck a dick without biting it off

02:57:31 the20year1: pretty much

02:59:12 MisterE: lolol

02:59:24 the20year1: Did you know there are 3 grades of ketchup?

02:59:38 MisterE: not surprised

02:59:44 MisterE: easy to make

03:00:06 kakobrekla: tomatoes *SPLASH* ketchup

03:00:08 MisterE: I make my own bbq / ketchup / marinara

03:00:18 MisterE: heh nearly

03:00:23 MisterE: vinegar

03:01:14 nubbins`: garlic

03:01:28 nubbins`: i've got pasta sauce from scratch figured out

03:01:37 nubbins`: haven't tried ketchup from scratch yet ;D

03:02:34 the20year1: standard, extra standard and fancy

03:05:55 nubbins`: i wonder which one heinz is

03:06:37 nubbins`: ketchup and plastic film are two products where i always spend extra to get the name-brand stuff

03:06:42 bounce: you know, there's a long history of (non-bitcoin) courts and such, and also a long history of abuse in various forms. question then is why and when doesn't such a system get abused (or at least not too much, and then what is this not too much you speak of)?

03:09:57 kakobrekla: http://www.coindesk.com/mt-gox-used-client-money-operations-extravagances-allege-staff/

03:09:59 kakobrekla: lolwtf

03:12:07 kakobrekla: ona day he has all btc, the next none, the third some, the fourth all again, but on the fifth it seems all is gone.

03:13:17 nubbins`: bounce: generally historic courts did not impose a 10btc fee on the plaintiffs, only 9btc of which will be returned in the event of a win.

03:14:04 nubbins`: seems impossibly foolhardy in retrospect, but they were simpler times

03:22:59 the20year1: There have been courts historically who charge the plaintiff large fees to file a case

03:34:56 nubbins`: http://i.imgur.com/kIoqjQG.jpg

03:35:58 MisterE: in thailand your fee is a percentage of the damages you seek

03:36:05 MisterE: and that can get hefty

03:36:17 MisterE: rather like the concept tho

03:36:58 MisterE: some future costs can be paid from that fee though iirc

03:37:56 nubbins`: interesting

03:38:00 nubbins`: anyway, one more link then bed

03:38:01 nubbins`: http://www.fruitsaladtrees.com/

03:38:02 ozbot: Fruit Salad Tree Company | Home

03:38:56 MisterE: -assets should fund the space elevator!

03:39:26 MisterE: news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/03/140306-space-elevator-partial-orbit-science/

03:41:22 bitcoinpete: kakobrekla: thanks for the rating! was wondering if you know what to do about some other guy who rated me -1 with comment "Nick squatter using this nick to scam you. Ask in channel to have this scammer authenticate." http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=bitcoinpete&sign=ANY&type=RECV

03:41:54 bitcoinpete: seems this guy is a nicksquatter patrolman of sorts

03:42:12 mike_c: did you email him?

03:45:17 bitcoinpete: not yet, but you're right, that's the first thing to do

03:45:32 novusordo: sounds like someone's using your nick to scam others while unauthenticated

03:46:12 bitcoinpete: i thought people knew better than to work with unauthenticated people

03:46:27 novusordo: only complete noobs don't

03:47:10 bitcoinpete: this Michail1 must be protector and defender of noobs then

03:47:24 bitcoinpete: yeesh

03:47:48 novusordo: you can message nickserv "set enforce on" to automatically kick people off your username after 30 seconds if they haven't authed

03:48:11 bitcoinpete: did not know that, thx

03:50:22 novusordo: i'm sure if you message Michail1 while authed, he'll remove the rating

03:52:32 joecool: ;;events bitcoinpete

03:52:36 ozbot: OTC bitcoinpete

03:53:34 joecool: bitcoinpete: yeah you had a squatter on your nick :P

03:54:12 bitcoinpete: joecool hot damn

03:59:54 bitcoinpete: ;;ident bitcoinpete

04:01:40 bitcoinpete: never a dull moment

04:17:46 jayk_: http://imgur.com/gallery/NgX75

04:17:46 ozbot: Smartass kid test answers - Imgur

04:34:20 MisterE: yea glad I jumped out yesterday despite booking minor loss

04:34:46 MisterE: I'll coin up by getting in lower now

04:51:01 benkay: pankkake: what was dotcoin's operation that did the forced buyback list their 'asset'?

04:51:36 benkay: on what 'exchange' did dotcoin issue the paper he later did the forced buyback on?

04:52:01 pankkake: I don't know much besides https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=361852.0 and him doing an IPO every other week

04:52:20 pankkake: not sure it always cryptostocks, maybe sometimes direct

04:57:39 benkay: ;;gettrust bitcoinpete

04:58:45 bitcoinpete: ;;ident bitcoinpete

05:05:04 MisterE: ;;ident MisterE

05:05:26 MisterE: I should make a join command to ident

05:05:33 benkay: ident party

05:06:00 benkay: join command MisterE ?

05:08:27 MisterE: Server connection commands is a better term... My client can perform functions when connecting to a network like i have it set up to auth with some bots that control channel access so I dont have to mess with it each time I connect.

05:08:57 MisterE: I could do something like that with gribble

05:10:17 kakobrekla: ;;later tell mike_c spam got in your blogs comments

05:10:38 MisterE: /quote PRIVMSG is a great thing

05:11:11 kakobrekla: i want to take the credit :D

05:11:32 MisterE: damn that spam is always triggering please moderate...

05:11:36 MisterE: hate that

05:20:34 benkay: dunno MisterE automating gpg sounds like a recipe for disaster

05:20:55 MisterE: yea just the auth request part

05:21:34 MisterE: I just need a prompt to do it each day really

06:19:30 benkay: ;;ticker

06:30:56 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker --market all

06:31:53 BingoBoingo: ;;more

06:31:58 benkay: helluva power law on the volume

06:32:01 benkay: bitstamp 36k

06:32:20 benkay: o wait this is not sorted by vol

06:32:57 benkay: nanotube: what would be the implications of sorting gribble market output by exchange volume?

06:33:19 benkay: ;;later tell mircea_popescu what would be the implications of sorting gribble market output by exchange volume?

06:33:22 benkay: horrible idea?

06:34:17 BingoBoingo: benkay: Prolly not a bad one

06:34:32 benkay: i've probly had worse

06:34:48 kakobrekla: kraken whole 35btc worth eh.

06:38:32 BingoBoingo: kakobrekla: I'll take one of those wiki logins, plz

06:40:18 kakobrekla: pm

07:11:46 moiety_: kakobrekla: a wiki? :D if you want me to proof it periodically, or anything else, send me a log in too :)

07:16:13 moiety_: lol @ "too honest for a sgady logo"

07:16:25 moiety_: shady*

07:21:35 kakobrekla: sure, pm

08:05:49 Namworld: okay, seriously... I'm not registering, NYtime, to view an article

08:06:36 Namworld: All those news link block reading till you register. It's free, so why even ask for registration.

08:10:27 antephialtic: interesting to see the neo&bee scam finally implode

08:11:04 antephialtic: though I think this will be bad for BTC stocks in general - this was a fairly elaborate scam, and many will probably not trust btc denominated investments for a long time

08:13:32 kakobrekla: just FYI

08:13:36 kakobrekla: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=289730.msg3105046#msg3105046

08:13:38 ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings

08:14:13 kakobrekla: so, first.

08:14:24 antephialtic: I didn't invest, even if it wasn't a scam, it was a pretty bad business plan

08:14:53 antephialtic: since 99% of their accounts were denominated in euros, they were hugely exposed to the price of BTC

08:15:26 antephialtic: investing in neo was basically a highly leveraged bet on the price of BTC itself, with the risks completely outweighing any possible benefits - assuming the business was completely legitimate

08:15:38 antephialtic: which, seemingly is not the case

08:16:18 kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland

08:17:29 antephialtic: lesson: people are stupid

08:18:08 antephialtic: and bitcoin seems to attract people that are exceptionally stupid.

08:18:39 kakobrekla: interestingly enough the conviction 2 years ago was exactly the opposite

08:19:17 antephialtic: yeah, well all those people sold at $1200 to the new batch of morons

08:19:28 kakobrekla: i didnt

08:23:10 Namworld: That's not okay, kakobrekla. You should have sold all at $1200 to rebuy later.

08:23:37 Namworld: "Hindsight and time-machine required"

08:25:17 kakobrekla: too much counter party risk

08:37:00 VanCleef: kakobrekla you blew it

08:37:24 VanCleef: could have easily doubled up by now

08:38:11 kakobrekla: mhm

09:35:06 cazalla: Bitcoin price above $1000 before April - damn, did i get this bet wrong

10:03:33 random_cat: some hours remain :D

10:23:43 moiety: <Namworld> "Hindsight and time-machine required" << lolol where can i get these?!

11:06:38 BingoBoingo: ;;ticker

11:07:31 BingoBoingo: !jd

11:38:29 ThickAsThieves: http://www.coindesk.com/neo-bees-suspends-btc-share-trading-due-abnormal-activity/

11:38:38 ThickAsThieves: While CEO Danny Brewster is out of the country and has not made an official statement on the events, he denied anything untoward about his actions.

11:38:38 ThickAsThieves: “My silence is for a very valid and personal reason, all the rumors that are flying about are false and couldn’t be further from the truth. I haven’t moved from Cyprus or anything of the kind I am TEMPORARILY out of the country resolving some big issues that were made much worse by people stating incorrect facts in a public forum.”

11:40:58 ThickAsThieves: this statement is odd "What’s even stranger is that LMB Holdings’ shares are not traded via Havelock Investments, only Neo & Bee’s."

11:41:31 ThickAsThieves: considering the prospectus says: "LMB Holdings Share Structure

11:41:31 ThickAsThieves: Public investors currently hold 5,042,638 LMB Holdings shares (31.5164875% of the profits), whilst LMB Subsidiaries Limited (UK) shall hold 10,957,362 shares 68.4835125% of the profits), for a total of 16,000,000 LMB Holdings virtual shares, which represent 100% of the global profits of the LMB Subsidiaries Limited (UK)."

11:46:32 ThickAsThieves: kako, it was me that suggested the wiki and categories, thx for making it

11:46:47 ThickAsThieves: cool to see the b-a site growing

11:52:58 ThickAsThieves: http://btctrading.wordpress.com/2014/03/31/long-term-update-at-support/

11:52:59 ozbot: Long Term Update: at support | Bitcoin Trading Signals

12:25:39 dirt_: I thought it was odd too. Mixing personal/business, and blaming a public forum? what, bitcointalk?

12:29:38 dexX7: <Ukyo> Anyone awake with ukyo.loan shares? << related to neo? ;)

12:31:35 the20year2: Could be

12:32:18 the20year2: so this neobee thing has to do with ukto?

12:33:29 dexX7: it's only a very, very wild theory

12:33:40 ThickAsThieves: did Ukyo elaborate?

12:33:58 dexX7: <whitty> me ukyo

12:33:59 dexX7: <Ukyo> whitty: give me a min. jsut doing some testing

12:34:14 dexX7: that's all

12:34:14 ThickAsThieves: oh he's probly just making a claims page

12:34:20 ThickAsThieves: maybe paying divs?]

12:34:52 dexX7: the quote was from yesterday btw

13:01:31 dirt_: Do you think neobee situation will last all week/longer?

13:02:35 artifexd: ;;later tell bitcoinpete If you're going to have "IRC Nicknames" in the title, maybe discuss them in the post proper instead of just the footnotes?

13:04:13 dexX7: dirt_: i think no one knows at this point

13:22:04 andreas_: ;;ticker

13:33:22 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay what do you mean ?

13:35:12 mircea_popescu: nubbins` you're deluding yourself. whether there's a fee for participation or not, the defendant's risking something participating.

13:54:58 mircea_popescu: so what's the neobee announcement ?

13:56:00 mircea_popescu: the20year1 it's all a question of who do you want to deal with. to me, forum trust means exactly zero. to the forum, wel... they don't even know whjat the wot is, they're barely discovering chan logs these days.

13:56:33 mircea_popescu: and before you make the kneejerk decision that you'd rather go where the people are, let me remind you that this is bitcoin, and that nonsense already took you to bf once, and then to havelock.

14:03:15 mike_c: kakobrekla: thanks, spam cleansed.

14:03:54 mircea_popescu: nubbins`: i don't think borrowing and repaying is a particularly good way of building trust. < it's awful really, more likely to diminish the trust of the rater than to improve that of the rate'ed.

14:04:57 ThickAsThieves: agreed

14:05:04 ThickAsThieves: the borrow 1btc for a week thing is silly

14:05:08 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla it's how you manage muppets, a la bitcointalk forum crowd.

14:05:19 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well, it rules out dank.

14:05:35 ThickAsThieves: it opens up those lenders to be targets too

14:06:02 artifexd: What is "dank"?

14:06:27 mircea_popescu: generally the corollary of freedom is that well... you gotta stay vigilant. which explains why freedom is so deeply umpopular.

14:06:44 mircea_popescu: artifexd o you missed a lot of fun.

14:06:56 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=30-03-2014#592703

14:06:59 ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log

14:08:03 mircea_popescu: hm, bitcoinpete's adventure is quite important : everyone with a WoT account : make sure you turn enforce on with nickserv.

14:08:12 mircea_popescu: otherwise you're just contributing tools to scammers.

14:08:27 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo this should actually be in your manual. it's an absolute imperative, you can

14:08:29 wywialm: and what is a good way of building trust then?

14:08:32 mircea_popescu: 't have wot accts w/o enforce.

14:08:50 mircea_popescu: wywialm if you idle here and read, good ways present themselves.

14:09:00 mircea_popescu: often someone needs something done or there's an idea you can help with etc.

14:09:07 mircea_popescu: you know, just like in any society.

14:09:34 artifexd: I was here. Lurking. Watching it live. I just stayed silent because I had nothing useful to add. I did miss the "dank bank" comment.

14:09:52 mircea_popescu: jayk can't believe asshole teacher had the guts to x that answer.

14:10:09 mircea_popescu: artifexd i know about you. i was talking to him tho :p

14:10:46 mircea_popescu: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/31/us-eurozone-inflation-idUSBREA2U0F320140331

14:10:46 ozbot: Euro zone inflation drops to lowest since 2009

14:10:51 mircea_popescu: check out how well europe is doing :D

14:10:55 mircea_popescu: bwahahaha

14:11:04 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: I'll address this deficiency

14:11:18 mircea_popescu: so putin threatens to fuck them up with the energy, quickly the propaganda brigade is out there with preparatory statements

14:11:41 mircea_popescu: "oh, it may be the case everything will be more expensive in the future, perhaps, BUT!! don't worry about it, you read last month all about how low inflation is!"

14:12:28 mircea_popescu: http://i.imgur.com/TRJRSgf.jpg << ahaha this is beyond cute.

14:12:56 VanCleef: speaking of media propaganda the funnest ones i seen was yesterday or the day before, but all american media groups were saying putin called obama about ukraine because putin is weak and looking for an exit

14:13:00 VanCleef: was like wtf?

14:13:36 mircea_popescu: lol

14:13:54 mircea_popescu: terribly weak, i bet. didn't they pretty much take over and end of story ?

14:15:19 ThickAsThieves: how do you enable 'enforce' of nicks? i'm registered in nickserv, is that how?

14:15:41 mircea_popescu: joecool now that's pretty cool! i had forgotten all about ;;events

14:15:44 artifexd: /msg nickserv set enforce on

14:15:56 mircea_popescu: lol he just missed his reg window

14:16:01 ThickAsThieves: thanks!

14:16:10 mircea_popescu: wb.

14:16:14 Mats_cd03: balls

14:16:23 mircea_popescu: ;;ticker

14:16:23 Mats_cd03: i need wot rating to edit the wiki :(

14:16:29 mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 ask kakobrekla

14:16:40 ThickAsThieves: didnt mp rate you?

14:16:45 mircea_popescu: i did ?

14:16:50 Mats_cd03: no

14:16:52 ThickAsThieves: oh it was mattc

14:16:55 ThickAsThieves: mikec

14:16:57 ThickAsThieves: bleh

14:17:45 ThickAsThieves: nickserv enforce does what exactly, forces you to ident with nickserv on login?

14:17:57 mircea_popescu: within 30 seconds

14:18:00 ThickAsThieves: cool

14:18:18 mircea_popescu: NickServ- This nickname is registered. Please choose a different nickname, or identify via /msg NickServ identify <password>.

14:18:20 mircea_popescu: like that.

14:19:24 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell benkay it was btctc if memory serves.

14:19:38 ThickAsThieves: "The euro zone is far from the deflation that Japan suffered from the early 1990s"

14:19:49 ThickAsThieves: deflation is suffering?

14:20:27 ThickAsThieves: i guess it would affect debtors

14:21:01 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell antephialtic the sort of people who take their information from btctalk and etc are better off not investing in btc stocks yet anyway.

14:21:15 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves you recall the minimal theft argument ?

14:21:40 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: theft 'hormesis' ?

14:21:46 ThickAsThieves: i do not

14:21:51 mircea_popescu: aite lemme find it

14:22:47 ThickAsThieves: i can however see how an institutionally inflationary economy going deflationary could be painful

14:23:24 mike_c: well, the biggest debtor in the land is the govt. they aren't going to let things get deflationary.

14:23:58 mircea_popescu: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-03-2014#571177

14:24:02 ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log

14:24:59 ThickAsThieves: ok i remember now

14:25:23 mircea_popescu: so now, a cogent argument can be brought that japan was wrecked by its deflation years.

14:25:33 mircea_popescu: they survived ww2 and hiroshima as a traditional society.

14:25:37 mircea_popescu: all that is gone now. the reason ?

14:25:43 mircea_popescu: well japanese kids didn't start raping their mothers

14:25:48 mircea_popescu: but they did stop having sex altogether.

14:26:11 mircea_popescu: in the end the effect is the same. japan as you know it is about as relevant to world affairs as the hitite empire.

14:26:28 ThickAsThieves: i wonder if their penises will evolve to clits over time if it keeps up

14:26:47 mike_c: japan gets first crack at karpeles, that's gotta be worth something.

14:26:49 mircea_popescu: they won't make it. just be replaced with some sort of short stocky chinese.

14:27:06 mircea_popescu: i really dislike that type, too. and especially their women.

14:27:16 ThickAsThieves: hehe

14:27:32 mircea_popescu: o look, the breakfast pancake is now moving around on two olives!

14:27:34 asciilifeform: they could always grow another yukio mishima, this time with a brain, and go productively geopolitically apeshit

14:27:46 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform mishima had a brain imo.

14:28:03 mircea_popescu: they didn't have teh... i dunno how to call it, the endometrium say.

14:28:45 asciilifeform: now this is probably true. sort of how limonov could not have possibly succeeded

14:28:57 mircea_popescu: right. a man is a zygote,

14:29:12 mircea_popescu: society around him needs to support la revolucion or else... no revolucion.

14:29:20 mircea_popescu: note how well guevara did in chad or w/e

14:29:26 asciilifeform: even the fellow mishima put in charge as 'kaisyaku' failed to do the job (cleanly chop off his head)

14:29:45 mircea_popescu: and i assure you had mishima had a better candidate available, he'd have picked that one.

14:29:47 mircea_popescu: you know ?

14:30:03 asciilifeform: 'can't mold bullet from shit'

14:30:34 mircea_popescu: re limonov : http://russiapedia.rt.com/files/prominent-russians/politics-and-society/eduard-limonov/eduard-limonov_16-t.jpg

14:30:45 VanCleef: what if you freeze it?

14:30:46 mircea_popescu: wouldn't one be worried once his tits are better than the girl's ?

14:31:01 mircea_popescu: VanCleef and you shoot it with a freezefull explosion ?

14:31:17 VanCleef: geez that would be horrible, shitting in a bullet type casing and freezing it and then firing it into someone

14:31:43 asciilifeform: VanCleef: frozen bullet never worked - because 'pv = nrt'

14:31:45 mircea_popescu: friction melts it.

14:31:57 asciilifeform: not the friction. the gas compression in front of it.

14:31:58 VanCleef: let a man dream damn it

14:32:03 asciilifeform: same as for re-entry from orbit

14:32:20 Mats_cd03: id poo in a shell for you

14:32:23 asciilifeform: or your refrigerator

14:32:26 mircea_popescu: also that.

14:32:47 VanCleef: i was at a party and shat in someones bong once

14:32:58 ThickAsThieves: :/

14:33:10 novusordo: cover the shit with a layer of epoxy

14:33:19 mircea_popescu: epoxy in a bong ?!

14:33:35 novusordo: i was still talking about the bullet

14:33:37 ThickAsThieves: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-03-2014#591285

14:33:40 ozbot: #bitcoin-assets log

14:33:57 Mats_cd03: wtf?

14:33:58 asciilifeform: soviet tale - one drunken idiot tells another, 'i was at this party, and this guy must've been a serious contraband hero, he's loaded - i stumbled around, looking for the throne, and found a little bathroom with golden toilet!' - other: 'fucktard, so it was you who took a shit in the saxophone!'

14:34:20 mircea_popescu: kik

14:34:31 VanCleef: lol

14:34:44 mircea_popescu: contraband hero huh ? like guitar hero, except the 80s

14:34:51 asciilifeform: (translation mine)

14:36:17 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland << hardly. mtgox had them, bitcoin foundation had them (before running of to the uk at any rate)

14:37:41 mircea_popescu: dirt_ it's really not weird at all. exactly by the book how these things unfold.

14:38:19 chetty: http://bigstory.ap.org/article/global-warming-dials-our-risks-un-report-says

14:38:19 ozbot: Global warming dials up our risks, UN report says

14:39:03 mircea_popescu: chetty you know how this global warming soup sounds to me ? like since the 90s govt was hoping for an alien invasion to blame everything on, and by now they've finally decided that's not happening so going with plan b

14:39:14 mircea_popescu: i guess it's better than plan c, "the daisies did it, man!"

14:39:43 chetty: yeah - a bit confusing how they manage that with no warming the last 15 or so years

14:39:58 mircea_popescu: that's why they didn't go ahead and pretend it was the aliens.

14:41:03 mircea_popescu: Temperature : 44 C/ 111 F (Normal) Temperature Sensor Status : Normal

14:41:06 asciilifeform: it won't surprise me to see 'international komyoonity' airstrikes on uppity third-worlders who won't play ball and deindustrialize. 'punishment for pollution'.

14:41:10 mircea_popescu: see ? 44 c is now "normal" :D

14:41:27 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform it's not happening.

14:41:53 mircea_popescu: there's no "international community" any more than the bitcointalk folks are "the bitcoin community"

14:42:04 mircea_popescu: all that bullshit died in syria.

14:42:27 asciilifeform: the arsonist who torched syria has a box full of matches left.

14:43:49 mircea_popescu: not really.

14:43:50 asciilifeform: they might be a little wet. but i'd be surprised if he doesn't try everything potentially flammable to see what can be burned next.

14:44:02 mircea_popescu: the way this game works is you get one new match once you successfully use the previous.

14:44:09 chetty: I'm sure they will keep trying

14:44:17 mircea_popescu: trying doesn't even count in dating

14:44:23 mircea_popescu: what, world politics ? forget it.

14:44:46 asciilifeform: if this were so, it would've ended with vietnam.

14:45:26 mircea_popescu: it had ended with vietnam.

14:45:45 mircea_popescu: but then cccp collapsed and the us figured its ww2 v2.0

14:46:38 asciilifeform: http://academic.evergreen.edu/g/grossmaz/interventions.html

14:46:39 ozbot: History of U.S. Military Interventions since 1890

14:46:45 mircea_popescu: should the recent steps in china's attempts to democratize and capitalize (ie, the opening of bank deposits to risk) explode badly and end china, then the us may figure hey, v3.0!

14:46:51 mircea_popescu: this is possible, but perhaps improbable.

14:47:41 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform note the prominent absence of stuff 75-90

14:52:36 ThickAsThieves: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=462370.msg5993297#msg5993297

14:52:37 ozbot: [ActiveMining] Official Shareholder Discussion Thread [Moderated]

14:53:10 mircea_popescu: did they find the real pankkake yet ?

14:53:38 ThickAsThieves: they cant afford to

14:53:47 pankkake: this is so sad… the few shareholders that still had a brain are all over it

14:53:58 pankkake: not even asking how much it cost

14:54:03 mircea_popescu: whoa check this shit out : Posted from Bitcointa.lk - #wDqzUbLiYxa3zutm

14:54:05 Duffer1: turns out the slaughters are proudly reselling hashfast boards/chips as fast hash mining gear

14:54:11 pankkake: it almost seems like it was paid by the ukyo shares

14:54:46 pankkake: and they will likely forget the claims of lost coins on mtgox

14:55:26 pankkake: there are multiple reports of refunds by check (and only that way) with misspellings and missing signatures

14:55:29 pankkake: seriously…

14:55:44 mircea_popescu: lol

14:56:08 Neil: Geez. I've written the beginnings of a bitcoin network node. It downloads and validates all 293400 block headers in 16.544 seconds.

14:56:18 Neil: Not the block bodies, of course.

14:56:18 mircea_popescu: ;;seen cedivad

14:56:29 mircea_popescu: ;;later tell cedivad is that you with bitcointa.lk ?

14:56:47 mircea_popescu: Neil that's pretty good.

14:56:58 mircea_popescu: afaik benkay never got that far :D

14:57:11 Neil: mircea_popescu: Yeah; was initially connecting to a US node; it took 2 minutes. Looked up a Japan node and it just screams.

14:57:15 Duffer1: they botched their own board dev, scrapped their own 48/55/28nm projects, lost 500 coins on gox, outright stole (and admitted to stealing) shares from at least two shareholders, and lied about everything so far

14:57:34 mircea_popescu: Duffer1 sounds like a solid AAAA+ bitcoin corp

14:57:39 mircea_popescu: not like those fly-by-night ventures.

14:57:42 Duffer1: amazing company!

14:57:50 Neil: It's a little over 23 MB of data I think

14:58:31 mircea_popescu: anyway, mpoe-pr is moving to bitcointa.lk

14:58:41 mircea_popescu: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/03/31/authors-jarring-claim-the-stock-market-is-rigged/

14:58:42 ozbot: Author’s Jarring Claim: The Stock Market Is ‘Rigged’ | Video | TheBlaze.com

15:01:08 VanCleef: why doesn't hshe hang out on irc?

15:01:22 VanCleef: make it less of a sausage party

15:02:04 mircea_popescu: to do what ?

15:03:02 pankkake: .lk lets you "follow" users. cool

15:03:10 pankkake: just need a way to import my watchlist now

15:03:14 VanCleef: a. make it less of a sausage party b. provide some insight on bitcoin securities in real time

15:03:20 mircea_popescu: pankkake i seriously suggest everyone move.

15:03:39 mircea_popescu: thermos & co flea circus needs to end.

15:03:45 VanCleef: agreed

15:03:51 VanCleef: i hate thermos

15:04:04 mircea_popescu: VanCleef she's not better informed than i am you know. she'd just say, "what mp said" all the time.

15:04:10 pankkake: a bunch of mods are scum too (sorry davout!)

15:04:17 VanCleef: fair enough

15:04:32 VanCleef: is she your gf?

15:04:49 pankkake: I'm still thinking of doing a 4chan-for-bitcoin but I have other better things to do!

15:04:53 mircea_popescu: up until yest we had this gentleman agreement of sorts that they don't delete the girl's posts and i look the other way on the endless stupid shit they did.

15:05:04 pankkake: (or other worse things to do I can't avoid)

15:05:12 mircea_popescu: yesterday that line was broken, and with it... there goes.

15:05:24 mircea_popescu: pankkake so do a 4chan, whaty

15:05:32 mircea_popescu: i ran a chan forever, you can have the backup

15:06:00 pankkake: there are some open source projects for that apparently

15:06:08 mircea_popescu: i meant data-wise

15:06:16 mircea_popescu: be nicely seeded with a bunch of good porn, not the shit ozpot spits out

15:06:21 mircea_popescu: maybe even write a proper .bait command.

15:06:31 pankkake: I still wonder how .bait works

15:06:41 mircea_popescu: pulls for tumblr i imagine

15:06:54 pankkake: yes, but I can't guess if it looks for tags or whatever, nor which

15:07:16 mircea_popescu: yea me either.

15:07:30 mircea_popescu: ;;rated cevidad

15:07:33 ThickAsThieves: .bait

15:07:35 ozbot: http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m3zbzufxWF1r91jyuo1_1280.jpg

15:07:43 pankkake: anyway, I just wonder how it would turn out when there are no nicknames. maybe everyone will be accused of being MP

15:07:56 ThickAsThieves: some big brains on that girl

15:08:12 mircea_popescu: pankkake so it'd be different from now how ?

15:08:29 pankkake: eheh :)

15:08:35 pankkake: by the way, romain put up some new pics: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=344219.40 (NSFW)

15:08:37 mircea_popescu: incidentally, here's a fun story : the original pythagoreans all claimed all their discoveries were made by... pythagora.

15:08:45 mircea_popescu: which was kinda funny seeing how the guy had been dead for a while.

15:09:02 mircea_popescu: all through modernity this was recounted as a "look how monastically humble those folks were" sort of tale

15:09:19 pankkake: reminds me of the communist dictators

15:09:23 mircea_popescu: but looking at bitcointalk, im realising it may have been the converse : to your average monkey of 500bc, anyone with a brain probably looked like the sockpuppet of the one guy with a brain

15:09:33 mircea_popescu: so they just accused any greek mathematician of "being pythagora"

15:09:34 mircea_popescu: and it stuck.

15:12:20 ThickAsThieves: heh

15:12:57 ThickAsThieves: anyone happen to know the way to look up a UK business license, ive done it before but now i cant recall how

15:13:18 mircea_popescu: ;;google look up a UK business license

15:13:20 VanCleef: so obamacare website ws a complete fail today

15:13:47 *: mircea_popescu lords it over ThickAsThieves

15:14:00 VanCleef: http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/obamacare-deadline/obamacare-website-fails-deadline-arrives-n67666

15:14:00 ozbot: Obamacare Website Fails as Deadline Arrives - NBC News

15:14:26 ThickAsThieves: ah that's the one

15:14:26 ThickAsThieves: http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk//wcframe?name=accessCompanyInfo

15:14:28 ozbot: Companies House WebCheck

15:14:40 ThickAsThieves: i ignored it at first cuz home page was spammy looking

15:14:57 ThickAsThieves: this one http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk/

15:15:32 ThickAsThieves: "Free" being a red flag i might be too sensitive to

15:22:33 nubbins`: mircea_popescu: what's a defendant risking by participating? his trust rating? that's on the line whether he participates or not!

15:23:09 VanCleef: jesus fucking christ how many threads does active mining need

15:23:28 mircea_popescu: nubbins` the judgement, whatever it may be.

15:23:42 ThickAsThieves: one for each whim of each shareholder VanCleef

15:23:58 ThickAsThieves: probly needs its own forum

15:24:04 VanCleef: lol yeh

15:24:17 VanCleef: activeminingtalk.org

15:24:59 pankkake: http://www.reddit.com/r/neobee/comments/21tp3n/the_following_accounts_are_operated_by_mpex/ oh he deleted it already :(

15:25:00 ozbot: The following accounts are operated by MPEx exchange and affiliates to discredit their competition.

15:25:27 mircea_popescu: derp.

15:25:45 Apocalyptic: "to discredit their competition." // they are already doing a fine job themselves

15:27:04 mircea_popescu: Apocalyptic this is really crop of the season stuff.

15:27:19 mircea_popescu: the EXACT same crap was being peddled by all the people upset that mpoe-pr closed down glbse two years ago.

15:27:42 mircea_popescu: they're still around, grumbling. fortunately, they have no btc to show, so it's mostly a vocal exercise.

15:28:26 asciilifeform: i confess that i wonder when i too will be featured on the 'secret soldier-shills of satanix mpex' lists the lamers are so fond of now.

15:28:58 Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, you would have to post at bitcointroll for that to happen

15:29:51 jayk: hmm

15:31:19 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform the reptillian brain is driven by visual cues. so, once you're visible.

15:31:25 nubbins`: so he's risking a negative judgment, and this is the reason to pull the plug on the whole thing? O_O

15:31:44 nubbins`: Hannibal ante portas!

15:31:45 mircea_popescu: nubbins` if he doesn't trust the court to fairly apportion the fees, he has no reason to trust the court with a farthing.

15:32:15 nubbins`: no, YOU don't trust the court to fairly apportion the fees

15:32:18 mircea_popescu: many things in bitcoin are an all or nothing proposition, which is why it's so important to always pick either and stick to it.

15:32:49 mircea_popescu: i dun see why exactly you imagine this is personal in any sense. the court as it was failed to do so, that's objective not subjective.

15:33:02 jayk: the irs needed to stay out of bitcoin

15:33:04 *: jayk punches them

15:33:05 jayk: :\

15:33:20 nubbins`: sure, but the whole thing i was getting at is that the fee structure was flawed from the start, which is why the experiment failed

15:33:32 mircea_popescu: this would seem to be your pet theory, yes.

15:34:04 nubbins`: i have yet to see anything to the contrary aside from some hand-waving about absolutes and subjectivity

15:34:44 Mats_cd03: luls

15:35:09 mircea_popescu: https://bitcointa.lk/threads/ipvo-multiple-exchanges-neo-bee-lmb-holdings.167762/page-223#post-5722550

15:35:10 ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 223 | Bitcointa.lk

15:35:17 mircea_popescu: "maybe danny is becoming danielle"

15:35:19 mircea_popescu: epic shit.

15:35:30 mircea_popescu: nubbins` you don't have to see "anything to the contrary"

15:35:33 mircea_popescu: that's not how arguments work.

15:35:34 pankkake: ah, she had the list!

15:36:03 nubbins`: man has a round hole, a square peg, and a round peg

15:36:09 nubbins`: square peg doesn't fit, so the hole is flawed

15:36:32 mircea_popescu: you familiar with the fallacy known as false dilemma ?

15:36:52 nubbins`: is it where people dance around addressing an issue? :D

15:36:53 mircea_popescu: (aka fallacy of exhaustive hypotheses)

15:37:21 mircea_popescu: no, it's where someone proposes he knows all the alternatives, which happen to be two, of which one happens to be something that didn't work in the past and the other happens to be his pet theory.

15:37:55 nubbins`: i'm not proposing i know all the alternatives, i'm simply proposing one alternative that avoids the pitfalls of the first failure

15:38:13 mircea_popescu: one alternative you claim avoids the pitfals you identify.

15:38:34 nubbins`: consider the statement suitably modified

15:38:46 mircea_popescu: well, i see not problem with it, but it ain't convincing me.

15:39:09 nubbins`: shame to let such a cute baby starve

15:39:15 mircea_popescu: lol

15:39:25 mircea_popescu: cute babies starve all teh time, it's the way you feed freedom.

15:39:48 asciilifeform: !b 1

15:39:56 bitcoinpete: Although some of you've read my latest blog post, I'm going to leave it here quietly for those who haven't:

15:39:58 nubbins`: ehhh, for someone who goes on about the sham fiat courts so much, i'm more than a bit surprised you gave up on the idea after the first bump in the road

15:40:00 bitcoinpete: http://bitcoinpete.com/2014/biting-into-the-wot-elephant-and-irc-nicknames/

15:40:01 ozbot: Biting Into The WoT Elephant (And IRC Nicknames) | When Bitcoin Met Pete

15:40:05 nubbins`: but hey, it's your dime

15:40:13 mircea_popescu: twasnt a bump in the road, twas a major chasm.

15:40:21 mircea_popescu: i just got better flir vision than you'd expect.

15:40:27 nubbins`: heaven forbid you build a bridge

15:40:36 mircea_popescu: whole thing's rotten.

15:40:37 chetty: the time will come to feed that baby nubbins` , but not yet.

15:40:54 benkay: wd Neil, can you share your source?

15:41:07 nubbins`: chetty: well, we're both sidestepping the issue that nobody in btc space is nearly competent enough to serve as a judge of any sort

15:41:12 mircea_popescu: ^

15:41:18 mircea_popescu: no, i'm not sidestepping it lmao.

15:41:40 mircea_popescu: it's the fucking problem. citizen judgeship works if your citizenry consists of slave owning educated people

15:41:47 mircea_popescu: not web denizens

15:41:53 chetty: there are competent judges, but they can't be bothered

15:42:04 nubbins`: well i mean "open call for judges" certainly isn't the way to find 'em

15:42:12 mircea_popescu: the latter argues against the former. what competence of the lazy is this ?!

15:42:19 mircea_popescu: nubbins` why not ?

15:42:28 chetty: no lazy, busy

15:42:34 mircea_popescu: ahahaha she's buying neobee shares with aurora coins ok ok

15:43:30 nubbins`: mircea_popescu: because you get applications from -assets neckbeards & wizards who want to crawl up your bum

15:43:45 nubbins`: fun fact, this is not the place where the best and brightest hang out

15:43:52 nubbins`: far, far from it

15:43:55 mircea_popescu: nubbins` maybe, but that has nothing to do : if it's not open it's stacked.

15:44:01 Apocalyptic: nubbins`, what's that place ?

15:44:09 asciilifeform: meta-nsa.

15:44:13 mircea_popescu: the solution is to MAKE the best and brightest hang here.

15:44:23 nubbins`: it's certainly worked so far ;p

15:45:25 nubbins`: almost as well as putting up a lonely blog post worked at fetching judges

15:46:15 mircea_popescu: y so bitter nubsy

15:46:31 nubbins`: something stuck in my craw, nothing personal

15:46:47 nubbins`: this isn't the field of dreams -- you have to do more than build it for people to come

15:47:14 mircea_popescu: weren't you starving babies fifty lines up ?

15:47:34 nubbins`: about the same time you were dancing around straight answers, yep ;D

15:48:10 nubbins`: now, i've gotta get to the post office before this 30cm of freezing rain shows up

15:48:12 mircea_popescu: Of the crooked eyes of humanity no straight answer was ever perceived.

15:48:39 nubbins`: have a chew on the fact that rarely in history has "the best thing" ever ended up at the top of the pile purely on its own merits

15:48:49 nubbins`: unfair as it is, c'est ca

15:48:53 chetty: http://www.smh.com.au/world/attempt-to-deposit-fake-bonds-in-vatican-bank-20140330-zqolp.html

15:48:54 ozbot: Attempt to deposit fake bonds in Vatican bank

15:51:06 mircea_popescu: so am i getting this straight, teh forum is accusing me of backhandedly and undergroundedly manipulating everything while petting my cat and rolling my evil mustachios

15:51:18 mircea_popescu: whereas irc is accusing me of daydreamingly waiting for things to just happen ?

15:51:23 mircea_popescu: i want a trophy for this.

15:52:02 asciilifeform: 'why does physicist need a wife and a mistress? so that he can tell one that he is with the other, while he runs off to the lab to get some actual work in.'

15:54:34 ThickAsThieves: to be fair, ive only ever accussed you of being stubborn and having an acceptably deviant sexual disposition

15:54:50 ThickAsThieves: i think

15:55:07 ThickAsThieves: spelling*

15:55:29 mircea_popescu: TROPHY!!!

15:56:15 ThickAsThieves: you havent issued a trophy process

15:56:22 ThickAsThieves: how can we give you a trophy

15:56:24 ThickAsThieves: lazy fuck

15:57:20 ThickAsThieves: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/21tws3/satoshi_donated_to_dorian_fundraiser/

15:57:20 ozbot: Satoshi donated to Dorian fundraiser : Bitcoin

15:57:27 ThickAsThieves: satoshi's a cheap mofo

16:05:52 mircea_popescu: awww sucks

16:06:39 BingoBoingo: http://www.slate.com/blogs/lexicon_valley/2014/03/31/c_word_the_oxford_english_dictionary_adds_several_adjectival_forms_of_cunt.html

16:06:40 ozbot: C-word: The Oxford English Dictionary adds several adjectival forms of cunt, including cunted and cu

16:07:25 mircea_popescu: cunty ?!

16:09:27 BingoBoingo: Well...

16:11:46 mircea_popescu: "cunt-bitten" ? like moonstricken ?

16:12:26 BingoBoingo: Well cunt is the new moon. ATC is headed to the Cunt.

16:12:31 ThickAsThieves: https://coinbase.com/apps/

16:12:32 ozbot: Coinbase Apps

16:12:44 ThickAsThieves: they haz app store now

16:17:21 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves pretty sure that's not actually satoshi

16:18:29 ThickAsThieves: mp, question/advice-seeking: for someone wanting to take an "idea" and turn it into a respectable business plan, or at minimum, some sort of white paper spelling out all the pieces, what would be the best way to approach it? the default would be a stream of conciousness writing process to where you can work from what you make to categorize and sort it all, polishing it over and over

16:18:29 ThickAsThieves: through iteration, but surely you have insight on the matter.

16:19:50 ThickAsThieves: maybe you have a fraudsters link that applies?

16:20:34 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well no, a business plan is a commerce thing. you just need to fill in the specified spots.

16:20:53 kow: ThickAsThieves, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposal_(business)

16:21:05 ThickAsThieves: so working from a template is sufficient

16:21:10 mircea_popescu: you familiar with the apostolic five w's ?

16:21:17 ThickAsThieves: no

16:21:25 mircea_popescu: i thought you were in journalism ?

16:21:26 ThickAsThieves: who what when where how?

16:21:35 mircea_popescu: who what yes

16:21:52 mircea_popescu: some pope came up with the rule that all reports must be built on this structure

16:21:54 mircea_popescu: sometime in 600ad

16:22:02 ThickAsThieves: i was a layout guy at the paper, thrown into editing some cuz i was not so dumb

16:22:08 mircea_popescu: ah.

16:22:14 kow: high school newspaper

16:22:19 mircea_popescu: thinking may be an unstructured process, like say dreaming

16:22:24 ThickAsThieves: daily rag actually

16:22:46 mircea_popescu: or it can be a structured process. most industry and a good chunk of science, plus engineering (which includes good reporting and good police investigative work) is structured by this principle.

16:23:21 mircea_popescu: this isn't a template, but a structure

16:23:41 ThickAsThieves: ok

16:23:42 mircea_popescu: (the difference is the same as between the rules of static forces on one hand and the facade of a house on the other)

16:24:28 mircea_popescu: (and before anyone lays into me, i'm not really claiming dreaming is unstructured, lay off)

16:24:35 ThickAsThieves: lol

16:25:06 ThickAsThieves: that wiki link wasnt quite applicable

16:25:10 chetty: ThickAsThieves, helps a lot if you have person to bounce ideas around with

16:25:33 ThickAsThieves: what i'm truly setting out to do, is determine whether two of my ideas can really work

16:25:35 mircea_popescu: indeed. and what the bouncer usually has to say is "sucks because what, or sucks because how" etc

16:26:17 ThickAsThieves: one idea would be much easier to map out, the other less so, but i feel the process would force true determination

16:26:18 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves well you'll never know if an idea can or can not *really* work. you should aim to get them / see if they can be gotten to the point where qualified people want to find out if they can work.

16:26:44 ThickAsThieves: i want to convince myself of such

16:26:45 mircea_popescu: no business plan is a proposition of becoming rich.

16:26:49 ThickAsThieves: before trying to convince others

16:27:00 ThickAsThieves: not even about being rich necessarily

16:27:08 mircea_popescu: all business plans are a delineation of something which may or may not be worth finding out if it woirks.

16:27:20 ThickAsThieves: ok

16:27:20 mircea_popescu: they're no different from grants, really.

16:27:33 ThickAsThieves: maybe i should enlist my wife then

16:27:39 ThickAsThieves: she gets grants all the time

16:27:47 mircea_popescu: she can't hurt anything

16:27:52 ThickAsThieves: well...

16:27:56 mircea_popescu: maybe she'll even end up taking you seriously

16:28:01 mircea_popescu: once she actually groks wtf it is.

16:28:11 ThickAsThieves: that is quite possible

16:29:29 ThickAsThieves: just got an email that RENT SPO is on

16:30:53 ThickAsThieves: they did indeed conduct it as i guessed

16:31:17 ThickAsThieves: halted the normal market, and opened the Buy IPO page to only buy new shares

16:32:19 dexX7: https://blockchain.info/address/1N2f642sbgCMbNtXFajz9XDACDFnFzdXzV "Final Balance -221.60279421 BTC" >_>

16:32:21 ozbot: Bitcoin Address 1N2f642sbgCMbNtXFajz9XDACDFnFzdXzV

16:32:51 Mats_cd03: ThickAsThieves: RS second round?

16:33:47 ThickAsThieves: what's that dexx7?

16:33:57 ThickAsThieves: Mats, 3rd or 4th round by my count

16:34:13 dexX7: bc.i seems to be broken again.. a wallet with negative balance

16:34:46 ThickAsThieves: ah

16:35:38 ThickAsThieves: are you sure it's not just a dumb display method?

16:35:52 ThickAsThieves: like there are doublespends unconfirmed and affecting total

16:35:56 ThickAsThieves: or the like

16:35:59 dexX7: i never saw something like this

16:36:15 ThickAsThieves: seems to be a hevaily used addy

16:36:21 dexX7: true

16:37:10 Apocalyptic: bc.i has been broken for some time

16:41:18 mircea_popescu: lol pretty lulzy.

16:41:29 mircea_popescu: just means the "total available" figure is broken really.

16:43:09 pLambert: anybody want to guess odds that NEOBEE produces a financial statement within the next week?

16:43:32 mircea_popescu: i don't see anything substantially wrong with your 1.4%

16:43:47 pLambert: heh, you saw that?

16:44:05 mircea_popescu: twas in tje digests

16:45:19 pLambert: At least I have my MPEx based investments to offset all the losses from other places :/

16:46:00 mircea_popescu: lmao what have i become ;/

16:46:28 mircea_popescu: https://bitcointa.lk/threads/ipvo-multiple-exchanges-neo-bee-lmb-holdings.167762/page-224#post-5723119

16:46:30 ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 224 | Bitcointa.lk

16:46:33 mircea_popescu: she's really sticking it to them isn't she

16:46:59 mircea_popescu: tho perhaps i should say him. that thread's basically reduced to one guy spazzing out and a bunch of people milking him for lulz.

16:47:04 pLambert: you better be careful or they are going to hire her out from under you ... or not

16:48:18 mircea_popescu: funny, they don't want to splurge 30 on a mpex reg, but they do want to spend 35 on the mpoe-pr.

16:48:38 mircea_popescu: which, from all the reviews i've read so far, is really very bad and useless pr doing me a huge disservice.

16:48:47 pLambert: I think they only offered 3, she said she wouldn't do it for 35

16:49:03 benkay: !t h rent

16:49:14 mircea_popescu: https://bitcointa.lk/threads/ipvo-multiple-exchanges-neo-bee-lmb-holdings.167762/page-224#post-5723297

16:49:16 ozbot: [IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings | Page 224 | Bitcointa.lk

16:49:26 mircea_popescu: looks like there were two people or something.

16:52:40 mircea_popescu: jurov pankkake https://bitcointa.lk/threads/your-shares-on-bitcoin-bourse.290560/#post-5723899

16:54:20 ThickAsThieves: the forum has become beyond useless

16:54:59 novusordo: the only thing I use the forum for nowadays is following updates from friedcat and the trezor fellows

16:55:09 novusordo: and even then I just have automatic alerts to let me know when they post stuff

16:55:11 mircea_popescu: i use it as a sort of daytime sitcom

16:55:34 ThickAsThieves: i cant gather that kind of joy from it

16:56:13 pankkake: well yes it's the "martin" jurov talked about

16:57:20 mircea_popescu: aha

16:57:31 mircea_popescu: the unpaid invoices part seemed novel.

16:58:05 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves and why not ?

16:58:22 benkay: "Modern media exacerbate the challenge of sorting reality from orchestrated perception." http://www.farnamstreetblog.com/2014/03/stanley-mcchrystal-my-share-of-the-task/

16:58:29 ThickAsThieves: for the same reason i cant enjoy Rush Limbaugh i think

16:59:02 mircea_popescu: which one is that

16:59:20 ThickAsThieves: the pill-popping conservative radio sensatinalist

16:59:46 ThickAsThieves: it's just embarassing i the thougth of people taking it seriously compounds that

17:00:27 mircea_popescu: " Limbaugh is among the highest paid people in U.S. media, signing a contract in 2008 for $400 million through 2016.["

17:01:07 ThickAsThieves: yeah the liberals listen to gawk, the idiots listen to fistpump

17:01:14 asciilifeform: wait, the american zhirinovsky ?!

17:01:15 [KS]: novusordo: https://twitter.com/FriedcatSays

17:01:19 mircea_popescu: lol he actually fistpumps ?

17:01:24 ThickAsThieves: no

17:01:38 ThickAsThieves: i just mean they want their ignorance validated

17:01:40 asciilifeform: (or would that be glenn beck)

17:01:41 ThickAsThieves: and nourished

17:01:49 ThickAsThieves: yeah glenn beck is worse probly

17:02:42 ThickAsThieves: when i read the forums i cant help but think some % is accepting these people as reality

17:02:46 mircea_popescu: does he say anything specific other than obama is bad and the country is going to shit ?

17:03:21 ThickAsThieves: whatever gets the pickup-driving racists to feel good (and buy gold), he says

17:03:23 jurov: that's lulzy, martin/forensick uses bitcoin burza avatar too

17:03:27 mircea_popescu: both of these being fairly uncontroversial and apparently the entire bag of tricks of us conservative pundits

17:04:28 ThickAsThieves: trolling itself is something ive never quite been able to fully digest

17:04:41 mircea_popescu: you're probably too old.

17:05:02 ThickAsThieves: i also dislike april fool's day fwiw

17:05:08 ThickAsThieves: get off my lawn!

17:05:11 mircea_popescu: lol

17:05:38 mircea_popescu: i don't recall the last time someone gathered the guts to try and play a trick on me,

17:05:43 mircea_popescu: but i do recall what i did to them.

17:05:53 MisterE: http://www.businessweek.com/news/2014-03-31/edison-invoked-in-rare-u-dot-s-dot-high-court-look-at-software-patents

17:05:53 ozbot: Edison Echoed as U.S. Court Looks at Software Patents - Businessweek

17:06:34 ThickAsThieves: u dot s dot?

17:06:35 ThickAsThieves: lol

17:07:15 mircea_popescu: "Software makers led by Microsoft Corp. (MSFT:US) say overly strict limits would reduce incentives to develop cutting-edge programs that detect when a car airbag should deploy or let people alter photographs."

17:07:22 mircea_popescu: ahahaha so much lol packed in one sentence

17:07:51 ThickAsThieves: ack it hurts

17:08:12 ThickAsThieves: who let the people photochop!?

17:08:27 ThickAsThieves: let my peepho go!

17:08:53 ThickAsThieves: meanwhile MS is the definition of photo-editing jokes

17:08:56 ThickAsThieves: MS Paint

17:09:07 mircea_popescu: i tell you, really good sentence.

17:09:37 ThickAsThieves: parody v reality aint looking so good for reality

17:10:06 mircea_popescu: ?Switch just two people? the battalion commander and command sergeant major?from the best battalion with those of the worst, and within ninety days the relative effectiveness of the battalions will have switched as well,? I?d say. I still believe I was correct.

17:10:12 novusordo: [KS]: i've seen that, I have my own script I wrote before that came around that sends me a text message when he posts

17:10:26 novusordo: it's nice because i can just use it for any forum member

17:10:36 asciilifeform: 'f Edison were alive today, he would be writing his inventions in software.' << multilayer trololol

17:11:09 mircea_popescu: if elvis were alive today, his name'd be fiona and he'd be doing my laundry.

17:12:00 novusordo: are there any good historical sources of mpex data besides @MPEX1 on twitter? i'm not finding much for historical volume

17:12:09 ThickAsThieves: as long as he'll still sing at weddings!

17:12:40 ThickAsThieves: novusordo, i think coinflow.co still works

17:12:53 mircea_popescu: also this chan, and iirc kakobrekla was selling the whole history db

17:12:55 asciilifeform: afaik the man invented exactly two things - phonograph and... patent trolling

17:13:05 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform indeed.

17:13:18 mircea_popescu: so he'd be writing his inventions... in flash.

17:13:20 novusordo: ThickAsThieves: it seems to stop for most assets in october of 2013 for me... not sure why

17:13:59 asciilifeform: although...

17:14:03 asciilifeform: ;;google paleophone

17:14:19 novusordo: i'm looking for historical data that I can crunch

17:14:31 ThickAsThieves: buy it from kako

17:19:27 novusordo: oh, the socket seems to have what i'm looking for

17:19:30 novusordo: didn't see it before

17:19:36 novusordo: herp

17:19:54 mircea_popescu: probably more adequate for high volume processing too.

17:20:10 jurov: novusordo, because live.coinbr started in october 2013. afaik socked uses there data, too

17:20:26 jurov: *these historical data

17:20:38 jurov: for surrent data, it hace dedicated mpex interface

17:21:12 jurov: amazing no one collected them before

17:27:28 asciilifeform: from the loltron:

17:27:30 asciilifeform: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-03-28/as-cash-use-drops-do-crime-rates-follow#r=read

17:27:30 ozbot: As Cash Use Drops, Do Crime Rates Follow? - Businessweek

17:28:46 mircea_popescu: on pravda today : "Does socialism increase the welfare of the worker ?"

17:29:18 asciilifeform: ;;google the cause and cure of earthquakes

17:50:51 thestringpuller: ;;google site:fraudsters.com mpoe march 2014

17:51:32 ThickAsThieves: http://blog.shubh.am/full-disclosure-coinbase-security/

17:51:42 ThickAsThieves: "Within 30 minutes, I was able to gather 400 unique email addresses, distinctively associated with Bitcoins"

17:51:45 ThickAsThieves: http://i.imgur.com/ik2M9Zw.png

17:53:01 mircea_popescu: lol

17:53:22 mircea_popescu: excellent opportunity for coinbase to display some pr.

17:53:31 ThickAsThieves: "Cuomo Gives Tesla (TSLA) A New York Direct-Sell Pass"

17:53:53 novusordo: i'm having a hard time understanding what 'username' and 'pass' I'm supposed to supply the mpex socket with...

17:54:45 ThickAsThieves: the one you purchased

17:56:29 novusordo: oh, that's what you meant by "buy it from kako" i assume

17:56:45 ThickAsThieves: yessir

17:57:02 ThickAsThieves: you contact him, pay, then he creates access account

17:57:06 ThickAsThieves: afaik

17:57:11 ThickAsThieves: "New regulation requires all cars to have rear-view cameras by 2018"

17:57:33 ThickAsThieves: When will eyes be required on the back of my head to walk?

17:57:40 asciilifeform: 'new regulation requires all cars to have arseview cameras by 2028'

17:57:44 kanzure: backwards google glass

17:58:16 novusordo: surely that means all NEW cars, right?

17:58:26 kanzure: someone should run one of the mtgox email address dumps through that coinbase api endpoint

17:58:55 mircea_popescu: kanzure generally s/someone/i/

17:59:03 kanzure: yeah i should do it

17:59:24 mircea_popescu: a generally available index of "idiots involved in Bitcoin" is a good thing.

17:59:28 kanzure: i'm sure it's going to be the same users

17:59:30 kanzure: yes

17:59:35 mircea_popescu: it'd hurt the idiots, but their pain and suffering is required to build greatness.

17:59:48 kanzure: it wont hurt them any more than they've already hurt themselves

18:00:02 mircea_popescu: exactly.

18:00:07 kanzure: remember, they intentionally signed up to coinbase

18:00:09 kanzure: and even mtgox

18:00:21 mircea_popescu: but it's not ok to let them suffer in silence and privacy.,

18:00:35 mircea_popescu: they must be displayed for the general public, so the general public may learn that idiocy has consequences.

18:00:40 mircea_popescu: *painful* consequences.

18:00:51 kanzure: i dunno about that. that's more thought than i'm willing to put into it.

18:01:01 mircea_popescu: there's also that.

18:01:13 asciilifeform: what'd be the punishment here? more load for their spam filters?

18:01:24 mircea_popescu: public ridicule

18:01:26 kanzure: being phished for the rest of eternity

18:01:35 mircea_popescu: "you claim to be a human being, but you are actually subhuman, because look :"

18:01:55 kanzure: basically everyone in that 2011 mtgox dump is target for phishing

18:02:06 kanzure: and if they signed up to coinbase, it's doubly so

18:02:24 mircea_popescu: kanzure how exactly did you form this opinion on coinbase ?

18:02:26 asciilifeform: phish neither picks your pockets nor breaks yer bones, unless one is stupid

18:02:31 kanzure: mircea_popescu: huh?

18:02:38 mircea_popescu: "and if they signed up to coinbase, it's doubly so"

18:02:51 kanzure: mircea_popescu: i mean they are a target for phishing if they also signed up for coinbase

18:03:06 mircea_popescu: a a

18:03:11 asciilifeform: for what it's worth, i had (empty) accounts on both.

18:03:12 kanzure: mircea_popescu: because they have trouble discriminating between good bitcoin ideas and poor bitcoin ideas ("hand over bitcoins to a third-party")

18:03:14 *: asciilifeform oils spam filter

18:03:24 kanzure: asciilifeform: that's worth at least something..

18:03:53 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform amusingly, i had accounts on neither, but that doesn't prevent people from trying to phish and etc

18:04:05 kanzure: oh have you gotten phishing emails targeted to you?

18:04:08 kanzure: that's curious

18:04:12 mircea_popescu: i think there must exist somewhere people doing email spiderin by hgand

18:04:51 Mats_cd03: attacking a form without a rate limit... how has coinbase gone this long with this problem?

18:04:54 mircea_popescu: kanzure i was just writing about one as ThickAsThieves posted that link

18:05:05 ThickAsThieves: probly multi-part teams, with one guy assigned to high-value targets

18:05:08 mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 cuz nobody srsly cares about em ?

18:05:11 ThickAsThieves: he's the one working by hand

18:06:10 asciilifeform: to all spammers: the folks still using btc-related-whatevers on winblows are in dire need of your loving personal attention.

18:06:20 Mats_cd03: the next thing that poster is going to say in a week is, the password reset form doesnt have a rate limit either and oops, a quarter of the accounts have been looted cause an attacker bruteforced the idiots

18:07:13 kanzure: well they have rate limits on amount of bitcoin they can send at a time on coinbase because of how they claim their cold storage system works

18:07:17 Mats_cd03: yc needs better security experts on their staff

18:07:23 kanzure: so at minimum they have to pretend they have limits in order to not reveal that their cold storage sytsem isn't cold

18:08:06 ThickAsThieves: but jesus antonopoulis says it's sufficiently chilly

18:08:14 ThickAsThieves: or was that blockchain?

18:14:27 nanotube: benkay: the implication would be that output would be sorted by volume? :)

18:28:29 Mats_cd03: http://nationalinterest.org/print/commentary/are-aircraft-carriers-the-new-west-berlin-10128

18:28:30 ozbot: Are Aircraft Carriers the New West Berlin?

18:29:14 Mats_cd03: interesting idea, there, about playing chicken with national security

18:33:54 mircea_popescu: http://fraudsters.com/2014/spam-and-malware-lets-be-cool-together/

18:33:55 ozbot: Spam and malware, let’s be cool together. pe fraudsters - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.

18:36:59 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'he either buys a beer for whatever famished kid working in whatever poor quality ?website design shop? to obtain credentials, or perhaps just simply is the famished kid in question' << sadder than that. the creds typically come from an idiot inside a given shop who bit a trojan hook himself.

18:37:14 mircea_popescu: also possible, yes.

18:37:46 mircea_popescu: in this case, i doubt the people working at the ro firm actually have access to the server tho

18:37:49 asciilifeform: spam behaves just like other 'multilevel' crapola, in that the objective is typically... to find more places to send spam from.

18:37:52 mircea_popescu: for reasons of sheer ineptitude

18:38:10 mircea_popescu: ie, managing excel is a demanding intellectual task.

18:38:40 asciilifeform: all one needs is to pwn one machine from which someone at least occasionally logs on to the box

18:38:50 mircea_popescu: but that's what im saying

18:38:54 mircea_popescu: the box was never logged into, ever.

18:38:58 mircea_popescu: look at that website.

18:39:43 nubbins`: i don't want my airbag to have the power to decide whether i'm allowed to alter photographs :(

18:39:45 mircea_popescu: it was made sometime in 200x, never to be touched again

18:39:57 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'For Science' (tm) post the sha of payload

18:40:07 mircea_popescu: nubbins` it's worse than that. the lolcats have the power to decide if your airbang opens

18:40:18 mircea_popescu: i can forward you the entire thing if you're curious

18:40:23 asciilifeform: lolcats decide if your... throttle opens.

18:40:39 asciilifeform: dollars to doughbuts, sha will suffice.

18:40:52 mircea_popescu: heck, let me send you a list of this shit :D

18:41:32 Mats_cd03: i'll take a copy of the zip if you'd upload it

18:41:52 nubbins`: new regulation requires all cars to have under-the-nuts-view cameras by 2015

18:42:36 mircea_popescu: you can have a fwd, pm an email.

18:55:31 ThickAsThieves: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/21ud3m/looks_like_darkwallet_was_a_scam_xpost_thehub/

18:55:31 ozbot: Looks like Darkwallet was a scam [x-post TheHub] : Bitcoin

18:55:39 the20year2: lies

18:55:43 mircea_popescu: lol

18:57:12 pankkake: http://arstechnica.com/security/2014/03/report-rsa-endowed-crypto-product-with-second-nsa-influenced-code/

18:57:12 ozbot: Report: RSA endowed crypto product with second NSA-influenced code | Ars Technica

18:58:22 asciilifeform: pankkake: seems like just more crap re: EC_DRBG

19:01:12 benkay: ThickAsThieves: software is hard. whocouldanode.

19:01:50 asciilifeform: benkay: software isn't hard. let's not go shopping.

19:01:50 benkay: man this is what i have to say to people who crowdfund software: http://iconicphotos.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/johnny-cash-finger-2.jpg?w=700

19:02:15 benkay: sure, it's never the actual software.

19:02:38 benkay: it's the estimation, constraints, fractal nature of coastline, overreaching ambitions, unmanaged expectations...

19:03:19 asciilifeform: ...and folks who don't even bother, and scamplan from beginning.

19:03:41 benkay: i want to ship a shitload of features! it's going to cost 500B.

19:03:58 asciilifeform: 'i promise to ship a shitload of xxxx. send me xxxB.'

19:04:42 benkay: another thing is, as i said to my colleague recently re a contractor: "ain't nobody motivated by money in the bank."

19:05:35 mircea_popescu: now that's definitely a thing.

19:05:46 mircea_popescu: "There is an empirical problem with the debate over United States military strategy towards China: aircraft carriers are ?dead,? but they can still be seen patrolling the Western Pacific."

19:05:55 benkay: this is very similar to the constant ongoing mining fiasco and how product tends to get delivered (in my extremely limited experience): "you ship a thing. it shows up on my door. if it works, 30 days later i send you a check. otherwise, get out of my face."

19:06:06 mircea_popescu: well obviously. the us can't quite afford to abandon the notion

19:06:20 mircea_popescu: benkay sounds a lot like a mp quote :D

19:06:20 benkay: this in fact is how we run our shop. we sit down, figure out what crazy ideas you have, how to make them into an actual thing, and then work on it at a predetermined rate for a period of time.

19:06:22 benkay: then we bill you.

19:06:31 benkay: "great artists steal"

19:06:52 benkay: fifteen days after the postmark date, we expect to see remuneration.

19:07:06 benkay: that's essentially net 45. think of the float you could be making on our backs!

19:07:22 mircea_popescu: lol myeah.

19:07:39 joecool: that's basically groupon's business model

19:08:12 joecool: except they don't do anything but hold the money for awhile and gamble before paying the merchants

19:10:05 mircea_popescu: more complicated than that. the groupon business model was basically to try and create a scale advantage on both ends.

19:10:28 mircea_popescu: specifically : supermarkets exist to scam consumers, because the supermarket is large, so it can tell any small farmer to stfu and get lost

19:10:39 mircea_popescu: and it can similarly tell any town dweller to stfu and starve.

19:10:50 mircea_popescu: this allows them to buy everything very cheap and sell it as expensive as they want.

19:10:58 mircea_popescu: this is sam walton's business idea, really.

19:11:12 the20year2: The reason they exist is because the consumers demanded year-round goods

19:11:17 mircea_popescu: many lines aren't amenable to the supermarket model, but groupon tried to bring them into the same economics.

19:11:55 mircea_popescu: had it succeeded to make it so "all the buyers are on groupon", it's model of "give us everything for free" would have worked on the merchants.

19:11:58 mircea_popescu: and vice-versa, of course.

19:12:47 joecool: it still works for some merchants that don't have access to their own in-house mailing list

19:12:57 joecool: to gain exposure, it's just not as big as hoped for

19:13:07 mircea_popescu: the20year2 moreover, that's phase 2 material. obviously the supermarket can train the clueless consumer in a number of ways to build a moat around itself.

19:13:24 mircea_popescu: but this recent "can't eat an apple with a spot" neurosis is not naturally occuring in human populations.

19:14:10 the20year2: Certainly is if the population is to continue to grow, if you continue on with less efficient methods of food delivery people starve

19:14:15 mircea_popescu: meanwhile, independent romanian farmers sell 5% milk for 0.5 lei, and 1.5% milk is on sale in the supermarkets for... 6 lei.

19:14:31 mircea_popescu: that's a 95% margin for the supermarket.

19:14:51 the20year2: Median supermarket margins in the US are 15%

19:15:08 mircea_popescu: the20year2 that data is corrupted, and milk is a fine example.

19:15:37 mircea_popescu: try and make a farm selling milk at cost +15% in say california.

19:16:00 mircea_popescu: (they recently had a case about how illegal all this is)

19:18:23 jurov: oh, we have better rackets

19:18:45 jurov: billa moves unsold produce from austria here

19:18:55 jurov: and sells it here for higher price

19:19:34 jurov: every time i'm shopping in austria i must fight rage, everything is really fresher

19:19:39 mircea_popescu: lol

19:21:04 mircea_popescu: i don't think i've ever bouight supermarket-anything

19:21:17 mircea_popescu: but it's fucking ridiculous that i have to maintain a private supply network in fucking 2014

19:21:24 mircea_popescu: you'd think it's 1984 all over again or some shit.

19:22:23 benkay: or 1300

19:22:34 benkay: your castle needs a supply chain

19:22:38 benkay: what's so novel about that?

19:22:44 benkay: the rest of us grub in the dirt for spuds.

19:22:49 benkay: doesn't sound so novel.

19:23:50 mircea_popescu: yes well for crying out loud.

19:25:52 jurov: fortunately, farmers sell over internet now

19:27:18 benkay: vegetables in the mail for bitcoin

19:27:28 benkay: also stop spraying veggies with water

19:27:31 benkay: fucking stupid.

19:27:34 benkay: "fresh!"

19:36:59 mircea_popescu: http://nationalinterest.org/commentary/sequestration-will-hollow-our-military-8776

19:37:00 ozbot: Sequestration Will Hollow Our Military

19:38:17 mircea_popescu: "On alert, this tattered, morally compromised army was to clear post in under an hour, move to its defensive positions on the West German border with the Warsaw Pact, fight outnumbered five to one and win. Such odds were daunting."

19:40:07 the20year2: your point?

19:41:22 mircea_popescu: that the us army at no point past ww2 had a standing chance in europe.

19:41:41 the20year2: Very much correct, it was always assumed to go nuclear within 24hrs of the outbreak of conflict

19:42:28 mircea_popescu: yeah, that's what the planning mostly planned for.

19:42:59 mircea_popescu: anyway, just some retired something or the other harping about how expensive and hard it is.

19:43:15 the20year2: to secure europe from the evil russian bear?

19:43:29 benkay: blackwater will eventually own texas, much like the roman mercs ate the empire.

19:43:40 thestringpuller: no march MPOE statement?

19:43:40 pLambert: "In 1974, one could easily find company-sized organizations in U.S. Army Europe" wth does the US have so many troops in Europe?

19:44:02 the20year2: To prevent steamrolling of western europe from Wpac

19:44:09 mircea_popescu: thestringpuller since the option thing is ended ima report it end of month line normal assets.

19:44:15 jurov: thestringpuller MPOE is suspended

19:44:18 benkay: no options, no statement, thestringpuller. who cares, anyways? it's a scam under investigation by the SEC. doomed, I tell you (to enjoy the new scion TC!)

19:44:24 mircea_popescu: pLambert i suspect it was part of the marshall plan

19:44:50 pLambert: and a corrolary: why do we STILL have so many troops in Europe?

19:44:59 mircea_popescu: because yougotta pay to play.

19:45:29 mircea_popescu: if some guy in my neighbourhood decided to go around telling everyone he's the bestest there is, i'd also expect him to send a nubile young woman around for purposes with some frequency.

19:46:04 the20year2: benkay: what stock?

19:46:11 Mats_cd03: funny enough, some countries wont admit to liking having american troops on their soil

19:46:18 mircea_popescu: course not.

19:46:26 Mats_cd03: but they like having american money flowing into local economies

19:46:34 Mats_cd03: laugh

19:46:37 the20year2: arms exports/imports is a nice money maker

19:47:16 benkay: keybase blowback ramping up: http://blog.lizdenys.com/2014/03/31/refusing-to-verify-myself/

19:47:39 benkay: the20year2: logs, man. gotta read 'em. sometimes just like 20 lines back.

19:47:56 pLambert: this guy bitching about "sequestration", has the US defense budget actually gone down at all? I thought we were still spending more every year?

19:48:19 mircea_popescu: pLambert nop but he has a point. it went down very little overall but it cut very badly.

19:48:28 the20year2: guess i'm just not seeing it

19:48:44 the20year2: pLambert: yes, it's set to diminish by a decent amount due to iraq, afghanistan and drawdowns

19:49:03 benkay: in inflationary regime, static budgets are cuts, pLambert

19:49:11 the20year2: Granted, in my personal opinion (As controversial as it is), it's like every other government program, cutting things that are important, expanding things that buy votes

19:49:20 pLambert: And he thinks we should spend just as much, even though we are not actually fighting anybody?

19:49:47 the20year2: The budget is 600-650b, and they want to decrease it to around 500b

19:49:57 mircea_popescu: benkay wait, that's not your girl, is it ?

19:49:57 pLambert: grr, politics makes me angry

19:50:05 the20year2: By reducing manpower, officer corps, cutting basic programs, ect

19:50:44 mircea_popescu: pLambert his intuition is correct, in that the us has no economy, and no technical ability. cutting the army is like cutting its own throat.

19:50:45 benkay: mircea_popescu: naw man i like 'em effeminate and making dinner not deep in the server room.

19:50:54 the20year2: Which I have a problem with, when programs like LCS and the F35 are front and center taking up significant sums of money for low results

19:50:56 bounce: re minimum crime, how does upping the crime rate increase the incentive not to go into crime?

19:51:35 mircea_popescu: bounce take whores. if there's a whore on every corner and prices are low, is your pretty daughter more likely or less likely to start cutting class for to taking it up the tail ?

19:51:41 pLambert: is F35 the one which was designed to fight against russians and has never been used?

19:51:46 mircea_popescu: yeah.

19:52:04 mircea_popescu: and by the latest reports couldn't fight against the russians even if it wanted to.

19:52:07 the20year2: The airplane that does nothing more than the plane we built in the early 90s for $200m/unit

19:52:36 bounce: dunno. "everyone's doing it, it's fun!" appears to be a powerful motivator.

19:52:54 mircea_popescu: but that's not the real edge. the guy selling it to her is more likely to not bother, is the real edge.

19:53:16 mircea_popescu: thinking the girl acts of her own volition is a little rich.

19:53:18 Mats_cd03: i rather appreciate whats being done with the f35 personally

19:53:27 mircea_popescu: Mats_cd03 how's that go ?

19:53:30 the20year2: compared to the f22/yf23?

19:53:47 mircea_popescu: benkay so maybe tell her about this marvelous wot thing we got ? liz i mean.

19:53:49 Mats_cd03: maybe in 30 years we'll be fielding Transformers models of Starscream

19:54:06 Mats_cd03: (yes i know starscream is an f-15)

19:54:07 bounce: whether it's her girlish friends pulling her in or a pimp looking for more meat to sell is a different mechanism but with the same effect; question then is which'll be stronger

19:54:18 jurov: i heard funny hypothesis that f35 is chinese inside job to bleed usg dry

19:54:33 Mats_cd03: well no i think the project is cool and i dont have a lot of problems with pouring R&D money into potentially useful technology

19:54:42 the20year2: corrupt politicians vying for money to their districts makes alot more sense

19:54:45 bounce: likewise, getting robbed often enough is a strong incentive to no longer run a shop (or at least not here, or maybe not a jeweller but a gunsmith, who knows)

19:54:53 Mats_cd03: even if its basically a laundry list of cool shit we want our super plane to have

19:54:55 the20year2: I'm curious what signfiicant tech the f35 produces that the f22/f35 didn't have

19:54:59 mircea_popescu: bounce and wide availability and a commodified market reduces the pull.

19:55:23 Mats_cd03: well, vtol for one

19:55:32 mircea_popescu: a vtol fighter jet ? srsly ?

19:55:49 Mats_cd03: or for that matter, svtol

19:55:51 mircea_popescu: why not make it submersible ?

19:55:56 bounce: it'll be inferior to the harrier, like as not.

19:55:59 Mats_cd03: that'd be awesome, we should do that next

19:56:07 bounce: thunderbirds are go!

19:56:09 mircea_popescu: how about also making it cockshaped ?

19:56:12 Mats_cd03: balla balla

19:56:18 mircea_popescu: a submersible flying penis with missiles.

19:56:40 jurov: it should be able to to burrow, too

19:57:07 mircea_popescu: i would imagine that's how it lands.

19:57:34 bounce: yeah no, I don't think it's straight up incentive, or at least not as strong as implied as there's strong pull the other way too. eg gangs don't extinguish themselves

19:57:40 Mats_cd03: anyway, not all the f-35 series planes are the same

19:58:01 Mats_cd03: e.g. one (two?) isnt a fighter jet

19:58:23 bounce: f35 is a brilliant scam, actually. getting permission to deliver production planes when the prototype hasn't had its maiden flight

19:58:23 Mats_cd03: f-35 is useful for air to surface, whereas f-22 is designed for air to air

19:58:35 Mats_cd03: it has had its maiden flight... a long time ago

19:58:54 mircea_popescu: bounce it's a balance point. the whole idea is that stable situations are stable, and derivation from that mean is unstable.

19:59:06 mircea_popescu: nothing much harder than that.

19:59:56 Mats_cd03: http://www.military.com/video/aircraft/jet-fighters/first-f-35b-vertical-takeoff-test/2397060192001/ VTOL

19:59:58 ozbot: First F-35B Vertical Takeoff Test | Military.com

20:00:16 bounce: oh I get the point that there'll be some equilibrium or other (pterry's vetinary letting the crime guild regulate the crime) but I don't think the equation is that simple

20:00:28 bounce: s/ary/ari/

20:00:39 Mats_cd03: is so majestic *tear

20:01:13 mircea_popescu: bounce inasmuch as it's not even an equation.

20:01:26 mircea_popescu: but in general, the crime guild does much better a job of regulating crime than any other guild.

20:01:39 mircea_popescu: the usual problem is that there's no capable criminals to make a guild in the first place, nothing else.

20:02:02 bounce: alright, an inequality, and there's an epsilon, but sheesh.

20:02:39 jurov: wait, the VTO is only for short distance move?

20:02:42 bounce: leadership isn't easy to come by, no. random democratic and/or republican countries haven't managed it in a long time for the usual positions either

20:03:05 mircea_popescu: right.

20:03:09 asciilifeform: 'keybase' is still alive!?

20:03:27 jurov: such fail. two heli blades would likely be lighter and more efficient

20:03:33 asciilifeform: what does it need to do, fly the 'full spectrum dominance' squid flag?

20:03:39 ThickAsThieves: MArck Cuban is a finance expert now?

20:03:43 ThickAsThieves: “The risk isn’t so much about the small investor,” Mr. Cuban said. “The risk is all these different high-frequency traders playing a game with their algorithms, trying to trick each other, to get in front of each other to make that trade.

20:03:43 ThickAsThieves: “And because we don’t know all the algorithms, because we don’t know the end factorial and all of the different ways they may interact, there are negative consequences that occur as a result. That introduces a market risk. That market risk has an unquantifiable cost. We saw it in one instance with the flash crash. We see it every day with little mini-flash crashes.”

20:03:49 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform liz is a naive chick.

20:03:50 Mats_cd03: jurov for some relative value of short, it doesnt go very far and i dont think you can carry much of a payload either

20:04:14 asciilifeform: http://b-i.forbesimg.com/kashmirhill/files/2013/12/octopus-rocket-copy.jpg

20:04:28 Mats_cd03: its certainly not as efficient as the chinook

20:04:44 bounce: if I'd wanted to be mean I'd point out that the space shuttle looked spiffy enough but didn't do a very good job of shuttling, n'mind at a suitably low price tag. not that hard to argue it set humanity's progress toward colonising space back a good score years or so.

20:04:58 Mats_cd03: (fastest fixed-wing craft in the army iirc due to two rotors)

20:05:43 bounce: the f35 is made of the same sort of undeliverium

20:06:01 mircea_popescu: bounce do argue.

20:06:07 asciilifeform: shitanium chassis, unobtainium semiconductors...

20:06:33 Mats_cd03: if murica didnt want politicians building airplanes, they shoudnt have elected politicians to build airplanes

20:06:35 bounce: where's that piece reporting on the incoming chief de mission that dug a bit and found fscktons of rot?

20:07:40 kakobrekla: <mircea_popescu> kakobrekla: the brick and mortar trick is still something new in btcland << hardly. mtgox had them, bitcoin foundation had them (before running of to the uk at any rate) < perhaps, but thats is not the reason people fell for them

20:07:51 mircea_popescu: true, true.

20:08:01 mircea_popescu: as a selling point it's perhaps innovative. surely beats ken slaughter's garage.

20:08:07 kakobrekla: yes

20:09:09 bounce: explains it better than I could. if reduced at absurdum it's inevitably too expensive to ever fly well, and it very much looks like lockheed martin deliberately aimed for that because a project that looks it'll succeed Real Soon Now but never really does is the ultimate goose with the golden eggs for the military industrial complex

20:11:27 mircea_popescu: bounce in the end this isn't such a very good argument.

20:14:31 kakobrekla: <ThickAsThieves> kako, it was me that suggested the wiki and categories, thx for making it < get to werk then!

20:15:11 mircea_popescu: Like the US garrison in West Berlin, aircraft carriers are relatively defenseless, but they have a separate function as a highly visible warning about US resolve. Today, a strategy of mobile ?tripwires? is neither credible nor prudent, but it is worth studying because it may actually be implemented.

20:15:12 mircea_popescu: Specifically, our bargaining chip against Beijing is to make things uncomfortably apocalyptic. The point is less what the carrier can do and more what an attack on it promises?full retaliation, and a war that may quickly get out of hand. As ASPI analyst Harry White observed last month [11], ?the idea is that anyone who attacks as valuable an asset as a US carrier should expect a significant response.? Internation

20:15:12 mircea_popescu: ally, a successful strike would deeply wound American prestige, especially if it went unanswered. Domestically, the deaths of six thousand crewmembers would generate almost unbearable political pressures for revenge. Our entries into WWII and the Global War on Terror were sparked by less.

20:15:22 mircea_popescu: this is basically... cruisin' for a bruisin'.

20:20:27 asciilifeform: 'It was he who invented

20:20:27 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_, America's first (and last) nuclear-powered land aircraft carrier.

20:20:27 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ was the most successful commercial defense project ever; it ended

20:20:27 asciilifeform: up costing every man, woman and child in the United States over twenty grand.

20:20:27 asciilifeform: The idea of a land ship of that size may seem ridiculous now, but it was

20:20:27 asciilifeform: then the right project at the right time. Two big aircraft manufacturers were

20:20:29 asciilifeform: enthusiastic (carriers mean planes), so was a large nuclear ship-engine firm.

20:20:31 asciilifeform: The major ship-building and steel companies were behind it, as were several of

20:20:33 asciilifeform: the largest unions, then the senators and congressmen from every state where

20:20:35 asciilifeform: any subcontractors might fall.

20:20:37 asciilifeform: The _USS Leviathan_ would not be anything like an ordinary carrier. It

20:20:39 asciilifeform: would be a monster platform, some fifty miles across and equal in area to the

20:20:41 asciilifeform: state of Delaware. It would launch both missiles and planes of all types, and

20:20:43 asciilifeform: it would be capable of fast movement around the countryside.

20:20:45 asciilifeform: In the first design, _Leviathan_ was to run on wheels, thus promoting

20:20:49 asciilifeform: the interests of a large rubber company. But the number of tires required

20:20:51 asciilifeform: turned out to be 135 million, plus spares (a tire change would be needed every

20:20:53 asciilifeform: hundred yards). Unless a complete rubber factory were taken on board#one of

20:20:55 asciilifeform: the alternative suggestions#the entire ship would have to hover. Grumbling,

20:20:57 asciilifeform: the rubber company settled for a contract to provide the giant hovercraft

20:20:59 asciilifeform: skirt required.

20:21:01 asciilifeform: Both houses of Congress shoved through the necessary legislation. There

20:21:03 asciilifeform: were objections that _Leviathan_ would cost too much, would be a sitting duck,

20:21:05 asciilifeform: would devastate any land over which it happened to hover. But by now the Armywanted it as badly as any of the dozens of states, thousands of companies and

20:21:08 asciilifeform: millions of workers. The combined force of industrial, political, military and

20:21:10 asciilifeform: commercial arguments rolled the project over all opposition as one day

20:21:15 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ itself would crush down anything in its path. One junior Senator

20:21:15 asciilifeform: who continued to oppose it was sent on a factfinding mission to Antarctica

20:21:17 asciilifeform: while the bill was railroaded through.

20:21:21 asciilifeform: From the start, there were problems called "teething troubles". The fans

20:21:23 asciilifeform: which were to lift the craft were at first too weak, then (redesigned) so

20:21:25 asciilifeform: powerful that they blew away the topsoil for miles around the craft, created

20:21:27 asciilifeform: dust storms and buried small towns in soildrifts. A computer company suggested

20:21:29 asciilifeform: expensive monitoring equipment to regulate each fan, but this never seemed to

20:21:31 asciilifeform: solve the topsoil problem. A chemical firm then went to work on a binding

20:21:33 asciilifeform: agent to hold the topsoil in place; _Leviathan_ would spray the stuff out

20:21:35 asciilifeform: before moving. After months of experimentation with expensive agents, they

20:21:37 asciilifeform: found the best to be ordinary water. The _Leviathan_ was now redesigned to

20:21:39 pLambert: ack, wth asciilifeform, use a link

20:21:39 asciilifeform: accommodate huge water tanks holding whole lakefuls of water. Even so, it

20:21:41 asciilifeform: would never be able to stray more than fifty miles from a major water source

20:21:43 asciilifeform: (though thousand-mile flexible pipelines were considered).

20:21:45 asciilifeform: Congress now began noticing how expensive _Leviathan_ was getting. Costs

20:21:47 asciilifeform: had doubled every six months: five more years like the first two, and the

20:21:51 asciilifeform: entire US gross national product would be spent on the land boat. Of course

20:21:53 asciilifeform: the project had too much momentum to cancel, but unless there were visible

20:21:55 asciilifeform: results, trimming would begin. Doddly went before a Congressional committee to

20:21:57 asciilifeform: argue eloquently for his monster. He pointed to valuable spin-offs: the

20:21:59 asciilifeform: Department of Agriculture now knew much more about binding topsoils. But

20:22:01 asciilifeform: secretly he was worried, as his diary showed:

20:22:03 asciilifeform: '

20:22:05 asciilifeform: 'It was he who invented

20:22:07 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_, America's first (and last) nuclear-powered land aircraft carrier.

20:22:09 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ was the most successful commercial defense project ever; it ended

20:22:11 asciilifeform: up costing every man, woman and child in the United States over twenty grand.

20:22:13 asciilifeform: The idea of a land ship of that size may seem ridiculous now, but it was

20:22:15 asciilifeform: then the right project at the right time. Two big aircraft manufacturers were

20:22:17 asciilifeform: enthusiastic (carriers mean planes), so was a large nuclear ship-engine firm.

20:22:21 asciilifeform: The major ship-building and steel companies were behind it, as were several of

20:22:23 asciilifeform: the largest unions, then the senators and congressmen from every state where

20:22:25 pLambert: oh shit, he is repeating the whole thing again

20:22:25 asciilifeform: any subcontractors might fall.

20:22:27 asciilifeform: The _USS Leviathan_ would not be anything like an ordinary carrier. It

20:22:29 jayk: oh dear

20:22:29 asciilifeform: would be a monster platform, some fifty miles across and equal in area to the

20:22:31 asciilifeform: state of Delaware. It would launch both missiles and planes of all types, and

20:22:33 asciilifeform: it would be capable of fast movement around the countryside.

20:22:35 asciilifeform: In the first design, _Leviathan_ was to run on wheels, thus promoting

20:22:37 asciilifeform: the interests of a large rubber company. But the number of tires required

20:22:39 asciilifeform: turned out to be 135 million, plus spares (a tire change would be needed every

20:22:40 jayk: my eyes cannot keep up with this shit

20:22:41 asciilifeform: hundred yards). Unless a complete rubber factory were taken on board#one of

20:22:43 asciilifeform: the alternative suggestions#the entire ship would have to hover. Grumbling,

20:22:45 asciilifeform: the rubber company settled for a contract to provide the giant hovercraft

20:22:47 asciilifeform: skirt required.

20:22:50 *: jayk screams

20:22:51 asciilifeform: Both houses of Congress shoved through the necessary legislation. There

20:22:53 asciilifeform: were objections that _Leviathan_ would cost too much, would be a sitting duck,

20:22:55 asciilifeform: would devastate any land over which it happened to hover. But by now the Armywanted it as badly as any of the dozens of states, thousands of companies and

20:22:58 asciilifeform: millions of workers. The combined force of industrial, political, military and

20:23:00 asciilifeform: commercial arguments rolled the project over all opposition as one day

20:23:02 asciilifeform: _Leviathan_ itself would crush down anything in its path. One junior Senator

20:23:04 asciilifeform: who continued to oppose it was sent on a factfinding mission to Antarctica

20:23:06 asciilifeform: while the bill was railroaded through.

20:23:08 asciilifeform: From the start, there were problems called "teething troubles". The fans

20:23:10 asciilifeform: which were to lift the craft were at first too weak, then (redesigned) so

20:23:12 asciilifeform: powerful that they blew away the topsoil for miles around the craft, created

20:23:14 asciilifeform: dust storms and buried small towns in soildrifts. A computer company suggested

20:23:16 asciilifeform: expensive monitoring equipment to regulate each fan, but this never seemed to

20:23:20 pLambert: guesses as to whether it will repeat a third time?

20:23:20 asciilifeform: solve the topsoil problem. A chemical firm then went to work on a binding

20:23:22 asciilifeform: agent to hold the topsoil in place; _Leviathan_ would spray the stuff out

20:23:24 asciilifeform: before moving. After months of experimentation with expensive agents, they

20:23:26 asciilifeform: found the best to be ordinary water. The _Leviathan_ was now redesigned to

20:23:29 asciilifeform: accommodate huge water tanks holding whole lakefuls of water. Even so, it

20:23:30 asciilifeform: would never be able to stray more than fifty miles from a major water source

20:23:32 asciilifeform: (though thousand-mile flexible pipelines were considered).

20:23:33 benkay: asciilifeform: would you pastebin?

20:23:34 Apocalyptic: asciilifeform, you should /part

20:23:34 asciilifeform: Congress now began noticing how expensive _Leviathan_ was getting. Costs

20:23:36 asciilifeform: had doubled every six months: five more years like the first two, and the

20:23:38 asciilifeform: entire US gross national product would be spent on the land boat. Of course

20:23:48 jayk: good riddance

20:23:52 Apocalyptic: benkay, I assume it wasn't an intentional paste

20:24:10 thestringpuller: benkay: stop being a hippie

20:24:13 jayk: lol

20:24:27 joecool: lawl asciilifeform just ruined some days

20:24:30 benkay: thestringpuller: go back to the ghetto

20:24:55 benkay: wb asciilifeform :)

20:24:57 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform donation... -> 1B6NP9eb4RKy9tRrXYCJnNcenZkrt5Q2gb

20:25:35 asciilifeform: how much

20:25:39 bounce: http://www.alternet.org/fail-400-billion-military-jet-cant-fly-cloudy-weather?paging=off¤t_page=1#bookmark http://www.pogo.org/blog/2013/02/why-the-f-35-lightning-cant-fly-in-lightning-yet.html and perhaps http://www.pogo.org/blog/2014/02/heres-what-60-minutes-didnt-tell-you-about-the-f-35.html

20:25:41 ozbot: Fail The $400 Billion Military Jet That Can't Fly in Cloudy Weather | Alternet

20:26:04 mircea_popescu: afaik it was up to the malfeasant

20:26:08 bounce: a little perspective here, some tidbits there, add it together and the picture isn't pretty

20:26:29 bounce: can't recall if this is what I recalled, but it sounds familiar

20:27:07 asciilifeform: https://blockchain.info/tx/b649dbbd792cd03e6a472e53596877a08e41053a6078595ce712c37935445742

20:27:08 ozbot: Bitcoin Transaction b649dbbd792cd03e6a472e53596877a08e41053a6078595ce712c37935445742

20:27:16 asciilifeform: mea culpa.

20:28:18 asciilifeform: 1btc for the motherland.

20:29:15 mircea_popescu: inb4 we discover haxxors got it.

20:29:35 asciilifeform: lol

20:33:13 asciilifeform: where do these go anyway

20:33:34 mircea_popescu: i would imagine to kako's beer fund

20:34:05 asciilifeform: should be good for a small barrel.

20:34:15 mircea_popescu: prolly pay for the wiki

20:37:38 diametric: asciilifeform: what is that?

20:39:23 artifexd: What is the precedent for asciilifeform's donation? I don't see anything about it in http://fraudsters.com/2013/bitcoin-assets-rules-and-regulations/

20:40:50 mircea_popescu: artifexd i dunno, it's been illo tempore policy that people accidentally spamming or otherwise unintentionally misbehave contribute to the port fund

20:41:25 artifexd: Interesting

20:41:39 asciilifeform: unwritten tradition

20:43:12 bounce: re strangecoin, I get the feeling I can stop reading after this: ``Of course, when I give you a dollar for a burger that's not really a zero sum transaction, because otherwise we wouldn't be motivated to enter into the transaction in the first place.'' -- conflating currency-mediated transactions with barter

20:43:42 asciilifeform: strangecoin?

20:44:03 bounce: http://digitalinterface.blogspot.ca/2014/03/strangecoin-proposal-for-nonlinear.html

20:44:04 ozbot: digital interface: Strangecoin: a nonlinear currency

20:45:16 mircea_popescu: if people's understanding of cuisine are on par with their understanding of basic economy, suddenly food in the us is explained.

20:46:16 bounce: .oO( BurgerCoin )

20:46:18 mircea_popescu: so i wonder if teh numerous sikrit agents dutifully scraping this are also dutifully scraping my in-guild rift convos.

20:46:33 mircea_popescu: memo : teh in-game chat systems are often abused to move sikrits!

20:46:49 mircea_popescu: come one come all, i just kicked inactives and we're down to like 800 members nao. taking all comers.

20:46:55 bounce: so TISAC, then

20:49:06 mircea_popescu: ;;google tisac

20:50:26 bounce: ;;google (TINC)

20:50:40 bounce: nope. no easy google for you.

20:52:21 mircea_popescu: lolk

20:57:36 Duffer1: !t h rent

20:57:56 benkay: now is that the old tranche or the new tranche, the20year1?

20:58:03 benkay: !l h rent

20:58:14 benkay: or are they all the same now?

20:58:23 Mats_cd03: anyway, a final word regarding the f-35 vs f-22 conversation...

20:58:50 Mats_cd03: the two are meant to work together as envisioned by the usaf

20:59:13 mircea_popescu: so wait a damned second.

20:59:15 Mats_cd03: similarly to how the f-15 and -16 worked together in a mix of relative low and high tech

20:59:27 mircea_popescu: "someone" bought 105 btc worth of rent at 0.0075 today,

20:59:37 mircea_popescu: but the same someone didn't buy 30 btc worth of rent all week

20:59:49 mircea_popescu: in spite of it trading around 50ish for the entire interval ?

20:59:53 mircea_popescu: how's this stuff work ?

21:00:03 ThickAsThieves: magic, mostly

21:00:51 ThickAsThieves: same way it worked for btcgarden?

21:00:58 ThickAsThieves: buy your own shit, momentum!

21:01:05 mircea_popescu: nuts.

21:01:44 Duffer1: wasn't rent trading halted during that period?

21:02:29 bounce: too bad for the US' alies then that the f22 is too advanced to be exported even to NATO partners

21:02:29 punkman1: how do you even IPO twice? sounds like an oxymoron

21:04:02 mircea_popescu: punkman1 2po

21:05:12 ThickAsThieves: this is the 3rd or 4th offering i think

21:05:38 bounce: Many PO

21:14:02 mircea_popescu: "Listen porky...

21:14:02 mircea_popescu: If Danny really wanted to scam people, he would have done that right after the IPO but he didn't. He went ahead and invested money in setting up the office, hiring staffers, media campaigns, buying POS devices, sending his hired staffers to conferences and so on.

21:14:02 mircea_popescu: He could have taken off with all the money right after the IPO but he didn't."

21:14:19 mircea_popescu: what IS the word there anyway, any pdfs yet ?

21:15:10 kakobrekla: pdfs? those you have to read. gimme flash.

21:15:26 bounce: can't you stuff flash in pdfs these days?

21:15:57 kakobrekla: dunno, prolly with a powerpoint plugin

21:17:08 bounce: actually acrobat supports way beyond what's decent for a pdf reader

21:17:49 benkay: acrobat a whore

21:24:29 mircea_popescu: http://25.media.tumblr.com/ffbf07618e347c111177a02c2337f684/tumblr_ml8d0boKTx1s0yaxoo1_1280.jpg

21:24:53 benkay: great tits on that one

21:24:58 mircea_popescu: indeed.

21:25:08 benkay: man so i have this pm who'd love nothing more than to get my guys fired

21:25:12 benkay: we're expensive etc

21:25:15 blackwhite: http://corner.squareup.com/2014/03/square-market-accepts-bitcoin.html

21:25:15 ozbot: Square Market Accepts Bitcoin

21:25:23 benkay: sets us up for a deploy this afternoon

21:25:31 benkay: ten minutes before scheduled deploy


21:26:13 benkay: mind you i've already sent the executive team the 'deploy briefing' email i'm in the habit of sending out before deploys...

21:26:37 benkay: in conclusion, i have determined that the PMs incompetence is undermining his malice.

21:26:52 benkay: either that or he's playing some crazy game i don't understand.

21:27:07 benkay: ('executive team')

21:27:21 benkay: *sigh*

21:28:50 mircea_popescu: blackwhite yeah was announced yest no ?

21:29:15 blackwhite: no we announced it today

21:29:31 mircea_popescu: i coulda sworn

21:30:13 Mats_cd03: that was stripe

21:30:18 mircea_popescu: ><

21:30:23 mircea_popescu: it was. my bad.

21:30:38 blackwhite: yeah they are doing it in beta

21:31:04 benkay: for whom has accepting bitcoin been a big business booster?

21:31:06 benkay: ostock?

21:31:16 mircea_popescu: blackwhite so you actually working for square ?

21:31:21 blackwhite: TigerDirect

21:31:36 blackwhite: they claim they saved more than 10K in fees alone

21:33:19 benkay: it's like consumer 'any txn we can get' ------------------------ elite '1 tx of 5m every two or three months'

21:33:31 benkay: nobody making serious bank with it.

21:34:21 pankkake: so what? less fees less fraud, why would you not do it?

21:34:52 mircea_popescu: ^

21:35:10 mircea_popescu: it may not make much sense for brick and mortar small businesses a la meze grill

21:35:18 mircea_popescu: however, for an online retailer ? lifeline.

21:35:37 mircea_popescu: just the fact that nobody can chargeback you and pp can't hold your wallet at ransom and that;s enough for anyone sane.

21:35:55 benkay: gotta have the business first tho. no sense in "its gonna work 'cause bitcoin"

21:36:11 pankkake: I spent a week trying to verify my "identity" with a french paypal-like

21:36:15 mircea_popescu: course gotta have the business first.

21:36:30 mircea_popescu: pankkake since bitcoin my response to any sort of such thing is lol.

21:36:37 mircea_popescu: and perhaps, if i feel in a good mood, "get in the wot"

21:36:39 mircea_popescu: but mostly, lol.

21:36:43 pankkake: since they did not read the text I was sending them, I ended up sending a goatse

21:36:51 Apocalyptic: lol

21:37:11 pankkake: and did the order again, but with another payment method

21:38:08 ThickAsThieves: <blackwhite> no we announced it today /// you work for Square?

21:38:26 ThickAsThieves: if so, props to Square for having you in here

21:38:31 ThickAsThieves: whether incidental or not

21:38:43 joecool: ThickAsThieves: http://www.linkedin.com/in/thompete

21:38:53 mircea_popescu: ThickAsThieves i originally asked him because i was going to give him a 1 if he can prove it, but seems he ignored it for some reason

21:39:11 ThickAsThieves: maybe he wasnt sposed to say so

21:39:16 blackwhite: hey yeah sorry

21:39:20 blackwhite: yes I work for Square

21:39:25 mircea_popescu: can you prove it ?

21:39:33 blackwhite: haha why should I prove it?

21:39:36 blackwhite: I don’t understand

21:39:44 ThickAsThieves: cuz we care

21:39:59 joecool: shoe on head

21:40:08 benkay: you've made a claim, blackwhite.

21:40:10 ThickAsThieves: if you care to say such things, what's wrong with proving it?

21:40:25 benkay: if you hadn't made a claim, that'd be a different story.

21:40:26 blackwhite: Just a curius question

21:40:27 mircea_popescu: yeah, "cuz we care" i guess.

21:40:38 benkay: but this zone is filled with scammers who won't substantiate their claims.

21:40:43 blackwhite: ahh ok

21:40:45 benkay: we're hostile to unsubstantiated claims.

21:40:50 joecool: blackwhite: a picture with shoe on head will suffice

21:40:51 blackwhite: i see

21:40:52 benkay: what is this we nonsense

21:41:00 benkay: I'm hostile to unsubstantiated claims.

21:41:04 pankkake: I didn't understand it that way

21:41:14 ThickAsThieves: we are a hive mind, in early stages

21:41:27 mircea_popescu: joecool lol whats with you and shoes

21:41:29 benkay: nope.jpg

21:42:08 benkay: just a motley collection of individuals, with individual tastes and preferences.

21:42:17 joecool: mircea_popescu: many of the girls you post in here lack shoes, i am trying to solve a shortage of shoes in pictures

21:42:35 mircea_popescu: ic

21:42:42 ThickAsThieves: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o8gzua-K_E

21:42:42 ozbot: The Lost Boys (4/10) Movie CLIP - One of Us (1987) HD - YouTube

21:42:47 mircea_popescu: benkay you know you're my sock, why fight it

21:42:53 benkay: you guys want to hear something stupid?

21:42:55 pankkake: but all shoes aren't equal

21:43:01 benkay: i'd rather be hacking on a bitcoin thing and not getting paid right now.

21:43:01 mircea_popescu: ahaha

21:43:03 benkay: instead

21:43:24 benkay: i'm staring at my email, billing by the quarter hour, waiting for someone to drop the ball hard enough for me to call off a deploy on my own.

21:43:33 pankkake: benkay: why not? unless you don't have enough to pay the bills

21:43:46 mircea_popescu: pankkake the girl won't approve.

21:43:47 benkay: relationships are important

21:43:49 pankkake: getting fired isn't hard either

21:43:55 benkay: not really a good idea to say 'fuck it' mid deploy conversation.

21:44:06 benkay: pankkake: it's also my shop.

21:44:09 pankkake: oh, right. not a thing I'd tell my parents either

21:44:18 benkay: oh ho ho up yours too

21:44:58 benkay: i don't know man. i think relationship with this client calls for a little subtlety

21:45:03 benkay: finesse

21:45:13 ThickAsThieves: deprogramming

21:45:20 ThickAsThieves: manipulation

21:45:23 ThickAsThieves: finesse

21:45:26 benkay: yeah they definitely need less programming that's for sure

21:45:31 benkay: fewer tickets

21:45:33 Mats_cd03: hi this is dog

21:45:33 benkay: better tickets

21:46:04 Mats_cd03: i can verify i am dog with shoe on head

21:46:12 ThickAsThieves: the RENT is too damn high!

21:46:15 Mats_cd03: more data to follow

21:47:13 kakobrekla: lol tat

21:48:09 mod6: haha

21:48:18 artifexd: mircea_popescu "Take a picture with a shoe on your head" is a thing redditors use to prove that you are who you say you are.

21:48:30 benkay: artifexd: started with 419ers

21:48:45 kakobrekla: until bakewell changed it to a sock

21:48:46 artifexd: That doesn't surprise me in the least.

21:48:55 blackwhite: well my blog is http://www.000fff.org (black&White)

21:48:59 benkay: http://i.imgur.com/BfECj.jpg

21:49:15 blackwhite: and my twitter handle is @hello_world

21:49:16 Jason: joecool in rl

21:52:30 mircea_popescu: artifexd much older than reddit. yes.

21:53:02 artifexd: knowyourmeme says it started in 2006. Wow

21:53:06 mircea_popescu: blackwhite send me email from your comp account, for instance.

21:53:23 mircea_popescu: artifexd im pretty sure it's pre dotcom.

21:54:04 Jason: blackwhite: i hear you're the squareup man?

21:54:31 blackwhite: i just work there

21:54:48 Jason: blackwhite: ah

21:56:56 Jason: blackwhite: well, my account was banned in 2013 for being 'high risk'. when I contacted support, they simply didn't respond to me. luckily, all of this happened before I switched my entire business to Square (my account was several months old, though). had I of completely switched to Square before I was banned with no explanation, it would have probably ruined my business.

21:57:22 Jason: blackwhite: as I mentioned, support is ignoring me. do you have any suggestions?

21:57:30 Mats_cd03: lol.

21:57:39 ThickAsThieves: seems you figured it out Jason

21:57:43 ThickAsThieves: dont use Square

21:57:57 ThickAsThieves: btw this Square news, it's only for their online marketplace right?

21:58:01 ThickAsThieves: not the app

21:58:02 blackwhite: yeah

21:58:14 blackwhite: Sorry to hear that Jason

21:58:19 ThickAsThieves: why the half-measure?

21:58:24 Jason: i'd love to use Square. being an internet sales business, it'd benefit me greatly.

21:58:47 Jason: just, being banned with no explanation of what might have caused the ban and being unable to contact support? well... yeah.

21:58:56 Jason: that

21:58:58 blackwhite: Not sure why you can’t get through. Did you try twitter and phone?

21:59:04 Jason: er - that's a little concerning

21:59:12 Jason: blackwhite: as I remember it, in 2013 they didn't have phone support?

21:59:27 Jason: blackwhite: i did try twitter and my tweet (twat? whatever they call it) went ignored, too

22:00:20 blackwhite: I see.

22:00:24 Jason: blackwhite: of course I know i'm just picking on you, but hey - maybe you'd be able to give me some pointers.

22:01:03 blackwhite: did you try this https://squareup.com/help/en-us/contact

22:01:16 blackwhite: yeah of course it

22:01:20 blackwhite: s totally fair you ask me

22:01:36 blackwhite: sorry I can’t be of bigger help.

22:02:03 Jason: i did and never got a response. i'll try again. maybe they changed stuff around

22:02:38 mircea_popescu: twat lol

22:02:56 Jason: blackwhite: can't initiate the email

22:03:08 Jason: blackwhite: Payment card processing permanently deactivated. Click to read Square's Seller Agreement

22:03:30 Jason: won't even let me email them. :p

22:07:50 mircea_popescu: Jason lol what did you exactly do ?

22:08:39 ThickAsThieves: probly SR vendor

22:08:42 Jason: mircea_popescu: not a clue

22:08:45 Jason: ThickAsThieves: nop

22:09:01 Jason: ThickAsThieves: did /nothing/ even questionable. tbh, i mainly used it for quick transfers between my bank accounts :P

22:09:26 ThickAsThieves: monbey laundering

22:09:30 ThickAsThieves: terrorist!

22:09:46 Jason: ThickAsThieves: that's what i'm trying to do. they won't tell me what i did for 'security reasons' :-p.

22:10:03 Jason: ThickAsThieves: oh. not trying to do /that/. it was transfers between my own bank accounts! ;)

22:10:08 ThickAsThieves: if we tell you, you will know how not to get caught next time

22:10:12 ThickAsThieves: terrorist.

22:10:51 Jason: you caught me.

22:10:52 Jason: :(

22:11:12 Jason: A++++++ support

22:11:22 ThickAsThieves: maybe now i can for for Homeland Security

22:11:22 Mats_cd03: hey now, we have enough us agencies watching this channel already

22:11:25 ThickAsThieves: i'm good at this

22:11:40 ThickAsThieves: work*

22:11:42 bounce: you'd like as not turn out overqualified

22:11:44 benkay: what, you're going to rep the DHS now ThickAsThieves ?

22:12:01 Jason: Mats_cd03: probably true

22:12:01 Jason: lol

22:12:07 ThickAsThieves: cant have terrorist like Jason using Square to launder money, now can we?

22:12:20 Jason: ThickAsThieves: guess i'll have to stick to bitcoin

22:12:21 Jason: argh

22:12:23 Jason: darn

22:12:37 bounce: there's too many agencies anyway. whatwasitagain, 1200-odd agencies with some sort of "terrism" link?

22:12:40 mircea_popescu: Jason url btw ?

22:12:44 Jason: mircea_popescu: for?

22:12:44 ThickAsThieves: round bitcoin, Square hole

22:12:47 Mats_cd03: irs, sec, fbi, dhs?

22:12:49 mircea_popescu: this shop of yours ?

22:12:58 Mats_cd03: maybe the cia uses -otc from time to time

22:13:46 bounce: why would they? they're running entire banks dedicated to laundring and everything else they instituted AML/KYC CYA BS elsewhere for.

22:14:01 Jason: mircea_popescu: doesn't work since i'm banned :-P

22:14:25 Mats_cd03: buying things from the paranoid, i imagine

22:14:44 mircea_popescu: Jason uh so you no longer have a shop now ?

22:14:46 Mats_cd03: 0days they cant ask the nsa for, perhaps

22:14:57 bounce: peddling tin foil hats? -- now that might be an interesting niche. tin foil hats for bitcoin.

22:15:03 Mats_cd03: (i'm pretty baked and wildly speculating here)

22:15:21 benkay: Mats_cd03: you druggie

22:15:22 bounce: they'd have their own contract with vupen and whoever else sells these

22:15:44 Mats_cd03: what are drugs

22:16:16 kakobrekla: wasnt this discussed like a day or two ago

22:16:22 kakobrekla: we should add it to wiki.

22:16:23 bounce: "stuff you buy at the drugstore"

22:17:09 kakobrekla: also sausage department for nubbins.

22:17:19 kakobrekla: anyway, carry on.

22:18:11 Jason: mircea_popescu: i do, but i can't take it online yet

22:18:52 Mats_cd03: so you came to bitcoin-assets for square support

22:18:53 mircea_popescu: ahahah forum rules.

22:19:00 mircea_popescu: person 1 : "I personally don't believe that Neo&Bee is a scam, but very well said. Just becuase there is an easier way to steal money that the scammers passed up doesn't mean it's not a scam."

22:19:07 mircea_popescu: person 2 : "Good to head you think Neo is legit."

22:20:35 Namworld: Forum server if it had an AI: "Please, help, oh why!? Stop feeding me this type of data!"

22:20:57 mircea_popescu: we're lucky there's no hard ai.

22:21:55 mircea_popescu: "Even if Neo ends up failing and Cyprus central bankers win this battle, they've managed to change the world forever. The Bitcoin awareness in Cyprus will not go away even if Neo fails and that counts for something. I know I was part of that as an investor and helped build that to some extent. On the other hand MPEx will go down in history as the clown who badmouthed the competition and riding some donkey in Egypt."

22:22:00 mircea_popescu: it must suck to suck.

22:22:17 mircea_popescu: how the fuck is neobee competition o.o

22:22:33 Namworld: No idea

22:22:33 bounce: didn't get big enough before failing

22:22:46 kakobrekla: not a donkey is it.

22:23:07 Namworld: I stopped questioning why people say certain things long ago.

22:23:17 mircea_popescu: Namworld im not that advanced yet.

22:23:55 Namworld: I probably spew nonsense regularly too anyway. I just let it be unless I feel like debating the topic.

22:23:55 mircea_popescu: interesting argument tho, re "the awareness that won't go away".

22:24:02 mircea_popescu: i wonder to what degree things actually work that way.

22:24:05 Jason: Mats_cd03: i came to -assets to share my story of being randomly banned with no explanation and being completely denied support. had my business of been in full swing with square, it would be a rather large problem.

22:24:29 mike_c: it has some validity. marketing is repetition repetition..

22:24:34 mircea_popescu: Jason extremely difficult claims to verify you see.

22:24:45 mike_c: obviously neo&bee was not supposed to simply be an ad campaign for bitcoin.

22:24:50 mircea_popescu: mike_c yeah but what if the awareness they raised is "bitcoin is an undependable scamfest"

22:25:04 bounce: re donkeys: http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Virtudyne_0x3a__The_Digital_Donkey.aspx

22:25:13 mircea_popescu: i guess we'll actually be deriving some benefit from the ineptly handled neobee shareholder piggybank,

22:25:15 mike_c: i don't think they got that far in penetrating the consumer consciousness.

22:25:25 mircea_popescu: in that we'll see if in 2015 or 2020 cypruss is above or below the norm

22:25:30 mike_c: but they have now heard of bitcoin, and next time it will be the second time.

22:26:00 mircea_popescu: there's also many cultural factors at play. for instance, in a culture which is fundamentally defeatist and patently insane, like romania's,

22:26:07 mircea_popescu: having failed is actually much better than having succeeded.

22:26:26 mike_c: i am not defending his retarded veiwpoint though. "it's ok because neo&bee ran ads".

22:26:38 bounce: so, what're you doing, failing by succeeding?

22:26:58 mike_c: mircea_popescu: same as silicon valley :)

22:27:07 mircea_popescu: bounce i have no idea. the entire national pantheon is basically neobee like scammors. ie, various rebels promising independence from x or y or z

22:27:16 mircea_popescu: then failing miserably but having ballads made about how cool they were

22:27:24 mircea_popescu: it's really not at all different from forum mentality.

22:27:33 Mats_cd03: lol

22:28:13 Mats_cd03: a surprising number of national origin stories are basically that

22:28:17 mircea_popescu: i mean... guys like iancu jianu. ex road robber, caught, tried, sentenced to hang, saved by ancient rule that noble virginz may save a convicted felon by marrying him

22:28:24 bounce: well I s'pose that gave you a bit of a headstart "researching" the bitcoin zoo

22:28:25 mircea_popescu: became small time country landed gent.

22:28:28 Jason: mircea_popescu: hey - get me in touch with someone @ square and we'd figure it out! :)

22:28:31 Mats_cd03: except the scrub that barely made it is in fact the hero of old

22:28:35 Mats_cd03: (in the retelling)

22:29:03 bounce: what, there's still a vaguely functioning feudal system going on?

22:29:34 mircea_popescu: where ?

22:30:47 Mats_cd03: i guess you could say afghanistan and somalia were vaguely functioning feudal systems in the last few decade

22:31:03 Mats_cd03: ^decades

22:31:32 bounce: oh, that guy appears to've been dead for a good 150 years. oh well.

22:31:34 mircea_popescu: i suppose all of central asia is feudal

22:31:41 mircea_popescu: probably latin america slowly coming to modernism

22:31:48 mircea_popescu: bounce 1700s yeah

22:32:31 mircea_popescu: anyway. "cyprus central bankers" win this battle god help us.

22:32:38 mircea_popescu: that guy must be some sort of a plant.

22:33:54 mircea_popescu: http://25.media.tumblr.com/ee7769d9609cf8cc7c3a05a45da49821/tumblr_mkv3mdeUC81s0ryyvo1_500.jpg

22:33:59 mircea_popescu: pic relatively related.

22:37:46 mircea_popescu: moiety http://imgur.com/gallery/g6X7e

22:43:56 only: any movie recommendations, folks?

22:44:05 antephialtic: genre?

22:45:02 only: drama?

22:45:21 pankkake: bitcoin: the movie

22:45:34 only: lol

22:45:41 Mats_cd03: inside man, stasiland, attack the block

22:45:48 Mats_cd03: the raid 2

22:46:45 kakobrekla: 'Dead man' is 1/3 drama.

22:47:51 kakobrekla: 'The limits of control' as well

22:52:14 only: kakobrekla: jarmusch fan? :)

22:52:31 kakobrekla: i wouldnt say a fan

22:53:52 only: thanks, 'the limits of control' it is

22:55:31 kakobrekla: imagine you went to a gallery when you watch it :)

22:59:26 tg2: ponzidoge round startign in 1m

22:59:29 tg2: watch the fireworks

22:59:33 tg2: address-wrapper

22:59:38 tg2: ponzidoge.com *

23:05:30 moiety: well hello sane people in here

23:14:12 TestingUnoDosTre: .d

23:14:12 ozbot: 5.007 billion | Next Diff in 862 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.6559% in 5d 2h 33m 34s

23:16:29 moiety: lolol mircea_popescu business cat, Yorkshire version // also http://i.imgur.com/575U3WI.gif

23:17:44 TestingUnoDosTre: wow that mouse was good at acting

23:21:29 nubbins`: what's going on with log.b-a?

23:21:57 nubbins`: the order of the words is all fucked up

23:21:58 mircea_popescu: nubbins` what ?

23:22:13 mircea_popescu: ajhahaha

23:22:14 mike_c: log.b-a is doge now

23:22:19 mircea_popescu: kakobrekla lampelina broke it!!11

23:22:32 kakobrekla: seems fine here

23:22:33 nubbins`: now click a timestamp

23:22:35 mircea_popescu: "mircea_popescu: made cool ballads failing but miserably how then about having they were"

23:22:35 kakobrekla: must be ur browsers

23:22:39 nubbins`: it rearranges 'em, still wrong

23:22:43 mircea_popescu: sounds like someone's googletranslate me

23:22:55 mircea_popescu: "mircea_popescu: but were ballads about made miserably they then having cool how failing"

23:23:28 antephialtic: yeah, is this some kind of silly april fools joke? the log makes it look like this is #bitcoin-yoda

23:23:34 nubbins`: 23:21:29nubbins`:on what's log.b-a? going with

23:23:57 mike_c: obfuscation to prevent spying

23:24:09 nubbins`: 00:08:39asciilifeform:thinking modern of pc bounce: was i

23:24:11 nubbins`: ahahahah.

23:24:21 moiety: bahahahahaha

23:24:27 mike_c: 1 2 3 4 5

23:24:32 moiety: dear oh fuck

23:24:55 nubbins`: mircea_popescu:fifty lines ? you babies up weren't starving

23:25:03 nubbins`: leel

23:25:16 moiety: almost got it there

23:25:46 mircea_popescu: lmao this all started with asciilifeform beerbucket

23:25:48 nubbins`: this is awesome

23:26:10 nubbins`: kakobrekla i much prefer it this way, don't fix it

23:26:25 mircea_popescu: these words of sorted randomly r they perhaps into sense coallesce through of sortage log method ?

23:26:34 moiety: i cant even go back to see that now mircea_popescu lol

23:26:46 mircea_popescu: maybe it's a method to fix my forum quotes.

23:26:56 mircea_popescu: i put stuff from the forum in here, read it destupidified in log

23:27:33 moiety: that forumite speak

23:36:04 mircea_popescu: http://24.media.tumblr.com/a3aedb2f647e9395c5fc9a66e6d6d621/tumblr_mkfz4rxTzm1re7tkoo1_1280.jpg

23:36:17 KRS-One: HAWT!

23:36:28 mircea_popescu: (the teacher is the one without thge baby fat)

23:37:07 nubbins`: https://scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/t31.0-8/1966347_10152341397792174_1401187864_o.png

23:37:11 nubbins`: ^ yay

23:37:19 pankkake: this was deleted by a bitcointalk mod: http://pastebin.com/SvkANZjZ

23:37:41 pankkake: yet stalking people is ok, as another mod told me

23:37:42 tg2: davout is getting jealous

23:37:50 pankkake: scammy as fuck

23:38:17 tg2: pankkake, learn2sock

23:38:29 pankkake: learn2berelevant

23:38:37 tg2: http://sockpuppettheatre.com/video/trolling-101/

23:38:38 ozbot: TROLLING 101 | SockPuppet Theatre

23:41:09 KRS-One: She indeed is ready for some lessons.

23:43:11 mircea_popescu: pankkake odd.

23:43:22 pankkake: what's odd is how old the message is, too

23:43:33 pankkake: is there a list of moderators?

23:44:00 pankkake: I'd like to know who banned crumbs and kakobrekla too

23:44:11 mircea_popescu: not afaik.

23:44:17 mircea_popescu: just use the .lk thing and be done with it

23:44:20 pankkake: yeah, scammers prefer to be hidden

23:44:21 mircea_popescu: it'll autopost to the scampit.

23:44:47 pankkake: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/bitcointalk/ gives me "not found"

23:45:52 mircea_popescu: there was some github

23:58:57 kakobrekla: i doubt anyone who should be reading is reading .lk

23:59:03 kakobrekla: so meh

23:59:48 mircea_popescu: it posts across tho